Maidens of the Kaleidoscope
~Beyond the Border~ => Rumia's Party Games => Mystia's Stored Games => Topic started by: capt. h on June 19, 2012, 04:05:54 PM
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Once upon a time. I went to the movies. And I saw a movie. And I decided: This should be a mafia game.
But what's a movie without popcorn?
RULES:
The Setup
Nightless; 7 townies, 3 mafia
The mafia pick a townie to be the first gunbearer.
The town discuss amongst themselves, and the gunbearer picks someone to target by posting ##shoot Elmo or similar.
If their target is mafia, the target dies and the gunbearer keeps the gun.
If their target is town, the gunbearer dies and the target becomes the new gunbearer.
Repeat until all mafia are dead, or the mafia's numbers equal the non-gunbearing townies.
- Days will last 72 hours (3 days). There are no nights. The day ends when the gunbearer shoots.
- Play to win.
- Don't be lame.
- Don't quote any private communications (role PMs, questions you asked the mod etc.). Paraphrasing is fine. If you're unsure if your paraphrase comes to close to quoting ask a mod.
- You cannot talk about the game outside the thread.
- Twilight is the phase between when a someone is targetted and flips are announced. Town may continue to converse during this time.
- The gunbearer will shoot itself if time runs out, and mafia will be allowed to choose a new gunbearer.
You are a Vanilla Townie.
You win when all the mafia members are dead.
Please immediately reply "confirm" or similar if you're ready, or PM me any questions you may have. The game thread is here.
You are a Mafia Goon.
Your partners are ___, ___, and ___. You may communicate at any time; I have created a quicktopic for you here.
You win when the number of living mafia members equal or exceed the number of living townies, minus the gunbearer.
Please immediately reply "confirm" or similar if you're ready, or PM me any questions you may have. The game thread is here.
Alright, sending out PMs.
All PMs sent.
Still Alive:
1. NekoNekoRex
2. Omba
4. No Name
6. LLD
8. Action Dan
Pushing up daisies:
5. Bardiche died day 1.
7. Conqueror died day 2.
9. Serela died day 3.
10. Affinity died day 4.
3. Dr. Rawr died day 5.
Previous iteration of game. (http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?t=12760)
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confirming as here.
2 minutes after receiving my role PM.
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confirm
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Excellent timing, my internet connection just got restored moments ago.
Confirm, btw
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/confirm
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im here
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Q: Pseudo-Votes y/n?
We'll most likely have to do vote counts ourselves, but I think it's nevertheless a good idea to do this. Not that the gun dude has to follow through on the votes, but yeah.
##Vote Serela
For screwing me over last game.
RP after cofirmation phase ry(
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confirm.
I Don't really care about pseudo-votes or not. we can just like. talk.
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talk talk talk
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dot
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Present.
Personally, I think psuedo-votes will be useful for accountability and pseudo-VCAs, but vigs shouldn't sheep the general consensus as that pretty much ruins the advantage of being a confirmed town vig etc.
@mod, I assume all gunbearers including the first are publically revealed?
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light. ~Dylan Thomas
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@mod, I assume all gunbearers including the first are publically revealed?
Yes.
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/confirm.
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also serela is town just look into his eyes and you can see
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Sure, those eyes were "town" last time
*Shoots Serela first without mecry
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I'm so town, that I'm town even when I'm scum.
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Tao doesn't know what a "confirm" is, but it looks tasty!
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10/10 Confirms
Day 1 will begin in 13.5 hours.
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The wild players have all gathered, seemingly as part of a ritual. It is a rare event among the species, having few recorded instances in the wild, and this documentary will serve to capture footage of this ritual in great detail.
The players await for the right time to begin their seemingly self-destructive ritual. What is the purpose of this event? For mating? For players to establish dominance? for regulating the size of the pack? This documentary shall serve to find the answers, and unlock the secrets of "The Mafia Game".
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Aha! Fools!
We are lucky the empire is incompetent, freely giving away their most powerful weapon. Let the pawns go first. They will make room for the heavy pieces.
Victory shall be ours this day. Japan shall be liberated!
I have a message for scum: DIE!
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What's a "scum"? It sounds yucky.
I'mmmmmm sooooooooooooo hungryyyyyyyyyy~
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Day 1 has begun.
Bardiche is the first gunbearer. He has 72 hours to shoot someone.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=23&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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Oh god. Justice.
Serela, give me a very, very good reason not to shoot you in the face right away.
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Oh god. Justice.
Serela, give me a very, very good reason not to shoot you in the face right away.
Maybe because she won't actually die if she's town?
And then you're giving the gun to someone who I wouldn't WANT to have it as town.
In my opinion, you should shoot someone who you feel is both competent as town and dangerous as scum, and you have a scum read on them.
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I want everyone to do this: Give me a reason not to shoot Serela, dood. Then tell me how you think we had best approach this, dood. You can ##Vote to make clear who your preferred target is, but like a vigilante I make no promises to follow the will of the majority, dood.
But I do think we should discuss, unless you'd like me to make an uneducated guess, dood. So. Why should I not shoot Serela and what is the best way to approach this setup.
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Also:
Don't be a derptard and set yourself up for a shooting target just so you can get the gun. The purpose of the game isn't to get the gun, it's to eliminate scum. Don't forget that.
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Also:
Don't be a derptard and set yourself up for a shooting target just so you can get the gun. The purpose of the game isn't to get the gun, it's to eliminate scum. Don't forget that.
This. So much this.
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Also, I wouldn't mind you shooting Conq, Affinity or Omba Bard. All of these are great opening shots.
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You shouldn't shoot Serela because he hasn't done anything scummy as of yet.
Additionally, the endgame of SYWTBTT came down to Serela's pick-and he picked wrong.
Don't be a derptard and set yourself up for a shooting target just so you can get the gun. The purpose of the game isn't to get the gun, it's to eliminate scum. Don't forget that.
I read the linked mafia game. This was one of the opening posts.
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Serela, give me a very, very good reason not to shoot you in the face right away.
Because
A.I haven't done anything yet ;_;
B.Turboshooting probably isn't the best plan! How much info do you have d2 if d1 is instantly ended by a vig? (Granted, all our days are going to be ended by vigs, but still)
C.Do you really want to give me the gun if you end up dying when you try to shoot me
Also Bob was totes scummy :c I may have picked wrong, but he did some stuff that looked pretty bad to me! (Even after admitting that a decent amount of what I thought was bad was me reading into it too hard, still)
As for how to approach this, I'm not entirely sure how to begin with trying to figure out who's scum in this kind of setup, but I figure if we keep going in the direction we are now we'll get somewhere eventually! :o
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@mod, please put the link to the previous iteration in the opening post of this thread.
I think it'll be useful to look at the game if you haven't already to see the strategies that worked/didn't work in that game.
Anyway, re: vigging. This setup looks like a pretty bad setup for policy vigs, given that if the target is town, it's the shooter that dies instead, and then the would-be-policy-vigged gets the gun. So looks like the best way to play it is to go straight and just shoot people you think are scum. :L Input of other people should be taken into account but ultimately the gunbearer should make the final decision.
In my opinion, you should shoot someone who you feel is both competent as town and dangerous as scum, and you have a scum read on them.
I started out with this opinion, but I'll expand on it. Remember that initially town only gets to misvig three times (however, they get an extra misvig for each successful scum hit). From looking at the previous game, they did a good job of not descending into paranoia and vigging Xyl/Yos for the hell of it, which led to an easier PoEing of the scum. All in all, I'd rather keep a competent player around so they can direct vigs and provide discussion, given said player is not a scumread.
That said, if you're choosing a deadline vig between a "competent" player and a "lurker," utility-wise it might be better to shoot the first just so you don't get a Bogre-like situation with a lawl no-vig, but given scum have an incentive to lurk if you follow that logic...just shoot who you think is scum. :V
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy. ~James Howell
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You are a Mafia Goon.
Your partners are Dr Rawr, Dr Rawr, and Dr Rawr. You may communicate at any time; I have created a quicktopic for you here (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=video&cd=2&ved=0CD8QtwIwAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DFdFuhXgfZn8&ei=7HziT5DYIOK_0AHBy9jqAw&usg=AFQjCNEIR2FLfSB56jkIoZ_xeiJsckOxkQ&sig2=oAh47Z0xOfN_6nH4YY5MhQ).
You win when the number of living mafia members equal or exceed the number of living townies, minus the gunbearer.
Please immediately reply "confirm" or similar if you're ready, or PM me any questions you may have. The game thread is here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.0.html).
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This is War. And I am the master of the art of War.
The correct scum play is to hand the gun to a strong player, because eventually, they will misfire and die.
THEREFORE, We should first think which of us as scum would hand Bard the gun.
would the pawns pick bard. Conceivably, but the choice might have been more random.
Bard is strong. More Likely, a more powerful piece was involved. But who. Affinity Omba LLD Conq.
Now who thinks you're the best? and who would give the gun to who?
LLD would not give it to Zero, that's for sure! She might think I'd shoot her face. But would she give it to Bard? Maybe. She'd give it to Bard, Conq, Affinity most likely.
Omba ... Same thing, wouldn't give it to me. Probably give it to LLD Conq Bard, not quite sure if Omba'd give it to affinity.
Affinity, Hmm, He'd give it too Bard or Conq, most likely. He would fear them
Conq. I think he'd give it to Me, LLD, Bard, or Affinity. He might fear Bard or Affinity, Less because he fears me or LLD, more because he'd think of us to shoot wrongly on the first Day.
So, who is the best shot. one of Conq Affinity. Frankly I think Conq would be the scariest opponent for scum if he isn't scum himself. However, I would not shoot him first. He's a valuable asset for town if he is town, and he can work better later after some people die first. I honestly wonder about Affinity's effectiveness, so I'd shoot Affinity earlier than later. otherwise we should go with one of the other group. Not Serela, she'll make herself Obvious town/scum eventually. Rawr might do in a pinch though. IHNN is fairly easy to read so not him.
Conq's last post sounds ok, but I'd shoot the lurker.
The words of Zero!
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Also
A.I haven't done anything yet ;_;
B.Turboshooting probably isn't the best plan! How much info do you have d2 if d1 is instantly ended by a vig? (Granted, all our days are going to be ended by vigs, but still)
C.Do you really want to give me the gun if you end up dying when you try to shoot me
##Vote: Serela
Didn't put "because I'm town" as a reason obvscum wagon to lynch etc.
מנא ,מנא, תקל, ופרסין
~Daniel 5:25
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@mod, please put the link to the previous iteration in the opening post of this thread.
Done.
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IHNN is fairly easy to read so not him.
:S
MC Mafia was my first game, Shadoweh's game was first scum game (I mean, really, with that setup it was not ideal for noobscum) and last game hardly counts with its setup shenanigans.
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At least this game is standard-ish enough to get some experience.
I'll be somewhat sporadically active-right now there's far from enough info to get any solid reads.
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eventually
That's the part that makes it a good but not necessarily the best strategy.
As for your speculation on who might have given the gun to whom. Bad idea to base the shot on.
DrRawr, make another post.
Preferring to shoot stronger players because of the if-town-then-he-gets-the-gun-next thing has one major flaw: If most or all of the scum aren't in that category, we'd end up with most of the good players dead and a lot of scum left. So, just shoot who you think is scum.
Slight scum vibes from ActionDan and Serela; more from ActionDan hence
##Vote ActionDan
--cut
IHNN: Don't do the whole "yo dude reads are hard to get so I'm not givin' you any, yo" thing again. Given what you did last game as "scum" that'd make you a perfect policy shot and policy shots are shit in this setup, so... yeah.
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As a faint, slightly sweetish scent tickles my nose, I turn around and catch a fleeting glimpse of long white hair vanishing into a street corner.
After a moments hesitation I swiftly move to find the source of that deliciously inviting scent...
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Taokaka isn't feeling well ;_;
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:S
MC Mafia was my first game, Shadoweh's game was first scum game (I mean, really, with that setup it was not ideal for noobscum) and last game hardly counts with its setup shenanigans.
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At least this game is standard-ish enough to get some experience.
I'll be somewhat sporadically active-right now there's far from enough info to get any solid reads.
You were still easy to read, in all of them. I mean I thought you were 100% scum from your first few posts in the last game, irregardless of the mechanics.
Omba - "That's the part that makes it a good but not necessarily the best strategy.
As for your speculation on who might have given the gun to whom. Bad idea to base the shot on."
What is a "better" strategy for scum? Why is it a bad idea to speculate on who might have given the gun to whom?
##Vote IHNN
Subtle pull in the post for trying to keep alive.
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The game has begun. One of the wild players, whom we will call "Bard", has been given the gun, signalling the ritualistic beginning.
Paranoia appears to set in among the group quickly. They appear to be fighting over who "Bard" should shoot, whilst "Bard" asserts his dominance over the rest of the pack.
A player, who will be named "ActionDan", is the first to make a wholy disagreeable point. He believes that the "Bard" should only shoot strong players, whilst others have indicated he should just shoot whomever he thinks is scummy.
Researchers also cannot indicate whether the suggestions to shoot "policy lynches" are jokes or not, further drawing suspicion to those who suggested them.
Researchers, however, are still baffled whether the decision to to shoot who the rest of the players agree should be shot should take priority over who the gunbearer thinks is scum.
Will the pack descend into disorder so quickly? Observations continue.
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A player, who will be named "ActionDan", is the first to make a wholy disagreeable point. He believes that the "Bard" should only shoot strong players, whilst others have indicated he should just shoot whomever he thinks is scummy.
Researchers also cannot indicate whether the suggestions to shoot "policy lynches" are jokes or not, further drawing suspicion to those who suggested them.
Only Zero is an absolute! He will be the people's hope eternally! Why do you speak something so brazenly untruthful when your own stance seems to be founded only in a tautology, or is there more too it than that?
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Subtle pull in the post for trying to keep alive.
In this game staying alive helps your win condition regardless of alignment. A townie being shot costs another townie, and a scum player being shot is a scum death. Ergo this 'subtle pull' (I made one there? really?) would be null. As it is I feel I get misunderstood a lot-I need to try to work on that both IRL and in games.
IHNN: Don't do the whole "yo dude reads are hard to get so I'm not givin' you any, yo" thing again.
Well, I don't dislike anyone who has actual content yet, does that count for reads :V
Given what you did last game as "scum" that'd make you a perfect policy shot and policy shots are shit in this setup, so... yeah.
last game =/= this game. You're right about policy shots-but I disagree about last game making me a good one since I was completely clueless the entire time.
Bard, asking about Serela is a fine starting point, but more questions means more answers meaning more discussion points/content. As it is I don't have anything else to add right now, so be back tomorrow...hopefully.
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Without a counter-balance in trying to discuss how to shoot scum, trying to stay alive becomes scummy. However, I like your response. suspicions retracted.
GEASS POWER: Rawr! Answer me now! Are you scum?
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possibly
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I am a lamer.
But I'm not as lame as I have no name, who has failed to play the game, I guess. He is lamer than I am. By a bit. Serela and rawr could be lumped with these emo kids too.
Everyone regardless of how lame they are is likely to hand the gun to a cool player, and Bard is probably the coolest cat around now. Dan is lame for selectively speculating on people like that, but he gets enough points for being hipster. I raised my eyebrow but that's it.
There are pros to shooting cool players and pros to shooting uncool players. I'm for the earlier, at least for D1.
I'm for shooting Omba. Don't remember Dan saying that we should be lynching cool players all the way, and using the slippery slope thing (that only bad players will be left at the end) only for Dan rather than LLD (who said the same thing) feels odd.
##Vote: Omba
Word.
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I take back that back im not scum.
@nekonekorex
We dont need updates on what people are talking about i think most of us can read
@omba
Surprisingly i have been told this is a "team game", it would be more beneficial for town to decide on who to gundown altogether.
@actiondan
wouldnt be bothered by this if you didnt use meta
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also are we keeping our own vote counts or ???
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I take that back again i am scum
but so is nekonekorex possibly.
##vote:neko
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Rawr is probably town.
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If I claim scum repeatedly can I be town too? :C
I'M TOTALLY SCUM GUISE. RAWR IS MY SCUMBUDDY. We're having pizza in our QT right now! It sure washes down that cheeta-BEDTIME.
It's really late and I'll make a more serious post tomorrow
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The player... we will call him "Omba"... has discovered the documentary campsite!
This observationalist would like to note that his opinions are not intended to sound like regurgitations of earlier posts, but merely do due to the third-person view of the posts.
Researchers, however, are still baffled whether the decision to to shoot who the rest of the players agree should be shot should take priority over who the gunbearer thinks is scum.
Also this is actually a question towards the wild players of "The Mafia Game"
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The player... we will call him "Dr Rawr"... has discovered the documentary campsite!
EBWOP
Also, what is the player "Taokaka"'s opinions towards the matter of whether or not we should go after policy lynches?
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Well, Neko, what do you think?
I'll just repeat what I said before: whereas in other games directing the vig might be a decent strategy (or not, depending on the situation), since the gunbearer is confirmed town in this game, their decision should take priority over the collective will, especially given the above average density of scum (3/10 players as specified in the OP). That said, it's probably beneficial for the gunbearer to listen to the general discussion or pick out some personal town reads and take their opinions into account or something; no one is going to have 100% correct scumreads unless they have the luck of the gods.
In this game staying alive helps your win condition regardless of alignment. A townie being shot costs another townie, and a scum player being shot is a scum death. Ergo this 'subtle pull' (I made one there? really?) would be null. As it is I feel I get misunderstood a lot-I need to try to work on that both IRL and in games.
If you're town, just drop the general survivalist attitude. Good content will keep you alive better than pleading.
Well, I don't dislike anyone who has actual content yet, does that count for reads :V
What/who are you referring to with this statement?
What is a "better" strategy for scum? Why is it a bad idea to speculate on who might have given the gun to whom?
Actually, I'm kind of interested in how you got from Bard is strong, so anyone would pick him, to LLD/Omba/Affinity/Conq and then from that to Affinity/Conq. Just want to hear your thought process here because it feels like you decided to come to that conclusion independently of the logic you showed in your post.
"Do you believe in miracles?" ~Al Michaels
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What/who are you referring to with this statement?
As of right now I'm leaning varying degrees of town on everyone except rawr and Affinity.
rawr because I honestly don't know what to think of that playstyle and Affinity because...something strikes me as off in that post of his.
I am a lamer.
But I'm not as lame as I have no name, who has failed to play the game, I guess. He is lamer than I am. By a bit. Serela and rawr could be lumped with these emo kids too.
What is this I don't even. (read: can I have a translation into normal english please?)
ActionDan and Conq feel the most town at the moment.
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Zero will speak now.
Conq, pretty much I reached Affinity/Conq independant of the speculation above that, even though there is a logical tie I didn't care to mention between the concluding paragraph and the speculation above it, namely, that your name and Affinity's appear more often then any others . In the end I didn't conclude much and was thinking that you and affinity are the only two players who would be considered stronger than or at least equal to Bard and therefore had a better chance of being scum than the rest.
As of now I wouldn't want to shoot either of you.
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Nameless finding me scum for calling him lame is lame. That makes him like super lame or something. Luckily I am a somewhat cool enough guy to tell the difference between lameness and scumminess, but boy do the distinctions blur at times. Make no mistake, however, for I am still sadly a lamer at heart.
@Neko: Who is scum and why? Why is X lamer than Y, whom other people have chosen? Sacred questions from long times past which reveal much about the alignment. The voting mechanism was in vogue back in the 80s and has remained cool ever since, and I think a vig choice along these X and Ys can filter the cool from the pretenders.
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Nameless finding me scum for calling him lame is lame.
My post suffered from bad formatting-what I found off is likely just the RP.
(read: can I have a translation into normal english please?)
still requesting this on what I quoted.
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Taokaka isn't feeling well ;_;
Try drinking some blood, it helps. :V
What is a "better" strategy for scum? Why is it a bad idea to speculate on who might have given the gun to whom?
Well fuck. Initially I thought choosing an average player would be best because of the chance of a good player steamrolling the scum team, but mulling it over some more the best strategy really is choosing the best player and hoping he offs himself on the first shot.
It's a bad idea because a) That strategy is not actually so hard to think of that it would need a good mafia player. Just a little brain is sufficient for that. But b) Even assuming that only a good player can come up with that strategy, one of them on the scum team is enough. You named four players that you think might come up with the idea; if one of them is scum, that's a 1/4 chance of hitting the right one. We've got 3 scum in 10 players, so the chance of hitting the right one going by that alone would be lower in the case of only one of those players being scum. And lastly c) If none of the better players are scum, then it's quite possible the choice was made more or less randomly.
And even discarding all of the above, I don't think the way you concluded who of the 4 players would be most likely to have chosen Bard is sound.
Without a counter-balance in trying to discuss how to shoot scum, trying to stay alive becomes scummy. However, I like your response. suspicions retracted.
What did you like about his response?
I'm for shooting Omba. Don't remember Dan saying that we should be lynching cool players all the way, and using the slippery slope thing (that only bad players will be left at the end) only for Dan rather than LLD (who said the same thing) feels odd.
Considering I didn't give any reason for suspecting Serela, how did you come to the conclusion that what I wrote above in that post was my reason for suspecting ActionDan?
Surprisingly i have been told this is a "team game", it would be more beneficial for town to decide on who to gundown altogether.
Nope. Well, Conq already said what needs to be said about that.
As of now I wouldn't want to shoot either of you.
So essentially that post was fluff, then?
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As I reach the place where the white hair vanished, I press myself against the wall and peek around the corner. Some distance away, I spot a tall figure clad in dark, wide clothing, the back mostly concealed by her long, beautiful hair. She appears to be talking on the phone. After a few moments, I catch a glimpse of her face as she turns her head slightly to the side. Ohh, she looks so elegant, so refined. My heart starts pounding as if to drive all thoughts out of my head, save for one. I want her...
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Considering I didn't give any reason for suspecting Serela, how did you come to the conclusion that what I wrote above in that post was my reason for suspecting ActionDan?
what is your reason for suspecting dan then?
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Still presiding over the discussion, dood. Can't I just chuck down some beer and shoot whoever? Sounds like it'd solve all our problems, dood.
Dr Rawr, why do you claim scum, dood? Affinity, if lamers are scum, why are you claiming scum as well, dood?
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Chug down beer even. (Reminds me, where's Shadomeh? Did she depart for MafiaScum to hold hands with scum everywhere, dood?)
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im actually a cultist :blush:
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:blush: I'd forgotten MotK has such huge amounts of derp.
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Also, DrRawr: if you are actually Town, then at the end game I will petition you be penalised for going directly against your wincon by attempting to persuade me to shoot you by claiming an anti-Town entity.
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fine ill stop the PR =/
jerk
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This isn't post restriction Mafia, dood. It's fine if you are set on using it, but warn us beforehand what you're doing because yes, claiming Scum in a game where there is no obligation to do so is anti-Town behaviour at best.
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:colonveeplusalpha:
DrRawr: :gut:, specifically in the way he went about choosing who should be shot. Reads pretty weird (and not just in the usual ActionDan-weird sense).
Bard: You can. Though before you do, it might be useful if you made some statements what you think about whom for what reason. In case you shoot the wrong guy, some thoughts from a confirmed town player would be nice to have ry(
Also, I'm pretty sure Rawr has a posting restriction along the lines of "claim town/scum in every other post". Like Affinity probably has the one that requires you to state that you're lamer in each post.
(Keeping the RP seperated like I do makes stuff a lot easier to read, though, yes).
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She finishes her call, puts her phone away and starts walking again. My eyes are drawn to her slightly swaying hips. Saliva is filling my mouth and a little drool runs down my chin as I lightly lick my lips. After waiting for a bit, I start following her, keeping a good distance between us so she won't notice me... yet.
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^
Or rather, who you think is scum, specifically.
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what ever im here i guess may as well make a post or something, expecting to get cut by bard.
@IHNN less excuses on everything, i dont have a particular care on why you suspect people but please quit making excuses and justifying them. Its like that other game you were scum in
@Neko Pretty sure you could have given us the courtesy of answering that question also and yea reads
@Actiondan Im really glad you threw out the speculation and paranoia, but with your scum reads now less scum, who?
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:( Omba that makes me feel bad.... because that previous post also made me think you were voting dan for that reason. Now im gonna be leaning scum on you :(
Also would shoot LLD right now
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I some how pressed the button to disable smileys
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@IHNN less excuses on everything, i dont have a particular care on why you suspect people but please quit making excuses and justifying them. Its like that other game you were scum in
and like that other game I was scum in, and also like that game I was town in... (all my games basically)
definitely leaning scum on rawr from drawing only on the meta that furthers his read while ignoring the meta that defies it.
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What did you like about his response?
These two paragraphs:
In this game staying alive helps your win condition regardless of alignment. A townie being shot costs another townie, and a scum player being shot is a scum death. Ergo this 'subtle pull' (I made one there? really?) would be null. As it is I feel I get misunderstood a lot-I need to try to work on that both IRL and in games.
last game =/= this game. You're right about policy shots-but I disagree about last game making me a good one since I was completely clueless the entire time.
Bold and Righteous, not like that pussy suzaku, and so much different from IHNN the Newbie scum suck-up extraordinaire. I've pretty much convinced myself he's town. Told ya he's easy to read.
Btw, Omba, more than one good player can be scum, which you kinda left out, but it's no biggie honestly.
And that post was made to give Conq the explanation he asked for, not fluff.
so Rawr is still probably town.
I'm pretty sure Serela is going to be PoE'd as scum soon. Good shot definitely.
Reads so far:
IHNN: 1st golden town
Rawr: 2nd town
Affinity: above null, leans more town
Conq: Null, leans a little town
LLD: Null
Omba: Null, can't read you,
NekoNeko: Null, leans scum
Serela: Null, leans more scum
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and like that other game I was scum in, and also like that game I was town in... (all my games basically)
definitely leaning scum on rawr from drawing only on the meta that furthers his read while ignoring the meta that defies it.
so youre just gonna sit and wait for someone to mention you in a post and only respond to that =/
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so youre just gonna sit and wait for someone to mention you in a post and only respond to that =/
Yeah pretty much since I don't have anything else to add yet. If I see something that needs addressing I'll address it if I'm around, else I'll just respond to questions addressed at me.
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because that previous post also made me think you were voting dan for that reason. Now im gonna be leaning scum on you :(
Why?
IHNN: Do something. "I have nothing to add" is no excuse. Find something. Ask something. Anything.
Bold and Righteous, not like that pussy suzaku, and so much different from IHNN the Newbie scum suck-up extraordinaire. I've pretty much convinced myself he's town. Told ya he's easy to read.
I have serious problems with that way of reading it. Not seeing what you're seeing there.
Btw, Omba, more than one good player can be scum, which you kinda left out, but it's no biggie honestly.
That possibility of course exists, but given the other ones, it's happy coin flipping.
And that post was made to give Conq the explanation he asked for, not fluff.
The post i called fluff is your #32 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg845636.html#msg845636).
PoE'd as scum
FFFF-
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Suddenly, she stops and anxiously looks around. I quickly hide in the shadows of a small side street. After a few moments, I carefully peek around the corner. She's still standing there, watching her surroundings, now and then taking a look at her watch. Is she... waiting for someone? I feel a wave of jealousy rising in my chest. But, that can't be. She's mine. Yes, she probably just has something she needs to do. I'll believe in her.
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Would be kinda groovy if Serela and Lady Taokaka could get their asses in here. I'll even promise to fondle them a little if they post something.
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Bard, I implore you to shoot Dr. Rawr.
I know I said to shoot competent players, but I want to direct you to the post where he tries to claim that this is a team game and that everyone should lead the vig.
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Is it scummy of Rawr to suggest that town should come to a consensus on who to vig? (I'm pretty sure Rawr is including Bard here)
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idk is it?
people seem to enjoy doing VCA and such in a normal games. If bard were to go off and shoot someone who was under everyones radar that wouldnt particularly help and would only offer another confirmed townoe(which isnt what we want we want scum killed).
i have know idea lld
I know I said to shoot competent players
are you saying you agree with actiondans plan on killing conq and affinity(possibly you or omba) based only on speculation? I hardly find this protown seeing as its lazy and is a lame excuse for scumhunting
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oh right omba because
gut i find it particularly odd for you for several posts to not mention your reasoning for wanting him shot. Also the way you worded the post sounds like you were just teasing affinity or something.
how did you come to the conclusion that what I wrote above in that post was my reason for suspecting ActionDan?
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well actiondan that would be nice but bardiche already said hes going to do w/e so :colbert:
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because i can make as many posts as i want
shooting prioritys:
Serela
LLD
Neko
i dont know anything about these people, never posted reads or anything(lld doesnt count because he hasnt said much or done anything).
At least IHNN provided reads though im not happy with him only posting when hes mentioned.
actiondan is leaning townm bothers me how he easily clears people of his suspicions.
conq is town i guess i havent seen anything wrong.
bardiche is obv town.
affinity i guess is either town or null(more null).
still leaning abit scum on omba but not scummy enough to shoot(its just me being really bothered possibly)
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also if people mention "Easy targets" or anything like that you should jump out a window. If lurking and not providing any content isnt scummy then :ohdear:
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Oh hey looks like I was mentioned again.
Affinity: what do you think of rawr right now? What about Omba?
Bard: ask more questions here. You're confirmed town, you can do no wrong. Push for information, and try to get as much out of this D1 as possible.
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The Vig should consider all options presented to them, but in the end THEY ARE A CONFIRMED TOWN VIG and should shoot on their OWN MERIT.
Anyone who suggests we should all choose democratically who the vig should shoot is looking to manipulate who the vig kills. There is a difference between suggesting and manipulating. The later is for scum etc.
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is it manipulation if there is agreed majority, like with a regular mafia game?
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also lol at manipulation with democracy -> tells people we should only kill competent people
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Bard: ask more questions here. You're confirmed town, you can do no wrong. Push for information, and try to get as much out of this D1 as possible.
EBWOP: This way not only can you make your shot count, but it'll aid whoever the gunbearer is D2. We don't need a lurky gunbearer (for an example of why, see D2 of the prior iteration)
-cut-
Everything here is entirely correct. BARD MUST DECIDE FOR HIMSELF but that's not an excuse to be lazy about scumhunting for the rest of us [/hypocritical]
-double rawr cut-
Yes, the scum is being manipulative in that case.
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Rawr is scum, Bard.
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best reasoning
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>32 new messages
At some point this marathon sleep session is going to end and I'm going to make an actual post
By which I mean I'll work on one right now and probably won't get much else done
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I gave my reasoning already, Rawr. Your reactions are simply confirming it for me.
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Ignoring the PR right now, I would shoot Taokaka right now, she seems awfully rushed to get Rawr shot, her reasoning isn't exactly good.
This is, by the way, why I asked the question I asked. IS it scummy to want to influence Bard's shot? I want you to all think long and hard about it.
Bard may be a confirmed townie, but nobody is perfect, Bard's gut could be completely wrong, and a crowd works better then an individual, even if that crowd does have some seeds of dissent.
I think the best action is to analyze posts and try to see who is being the most manipulative here - that's who the scum is going to be.
-----
The Taokaka stalks her prey, Dr Rawr. getting ready to pounce and rip apart her posts with bad reasoning and panicked posts. Meanwhile, the leader of the pack, Bard, watches the townies from his high perch, not commenting or contributing, but waiting, waiting for the right time to strike
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As for reads I haven't seen alot of standoutish players aside from Taokaka. I guess Omba might be town, I liked her last big post.
I'd need to go back and read individual posts from each player instead of scrolling through the page in one go to get more out there. Which I will work on.
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Toot Toot post train time
Yeah, I really dislike Taokaka.
I know I said to shoot competent players, but I want to direct you to the post where he tries to claim that this is a team game and that everyone should lead the vig.
Vig or not, this IS a team game, and town should be working together to flush out the scum so that the vig's shot will be sure as... I'm out of good metaphors today. The vig is only an end to a means, but the vigilante should be taking the town's input on who to kill into account when deciding his shot.
Rawr is scum, Bard.
Cool story bro. Care to tell us why?
I gave my reasoning already, Rawr. Your reactions are simply confirming it for me.
This is awfully haughty and not very constructive, you sound like a jackass with these kinds of posts.
Personally, I have no problem with outspoken players who act as if they are absolutely dead sure someone is scum, some players can steamroll entire games this way and if they're really persistent at it (and right) then it shouldn't be a problem convincing town.
But Taokaka goes about it all the wrong ways, relying on vauge reasonings and gotcha games to get her dirty work done. Not exemplary behavior from a townie for sure.
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Is it scummy of Rawr to suggest that town should come to a consensus on who to vig? (I'm pretty sure Rawr is including Bard here)
The big difference is between coming to a non-binding consesus and lynching like it would normally work.
If the vig thinks the decision the town's votes lead to is bullshit, he should throw it out the window and shoot who he thinks is the most likely to be scum.
Unlike town, who has 3 scum in it that can lead the town on the wrong trail, the vig is definitely town. That alone is reason enough for the vig not to be bound by town's decision.
a crowd works better then an individual
Ouch. Mafia aside, politics would like to have a word with you. A king with a brain and competent advisors works better about 10 times out of 10.
oh right omba because gut i find it particularly odd for you for several posts to not mention your reasoning for wanting him shot. Also the way you worded the post sounds like you were just teasing affinity or something.
:reasons: :V
Affinity: what do you think of rawr right now? What about Omba?
What do you think about Affinity? What about me?
Neko: I suggest reading a few of LLD's games. After you have done that, tell me if it changes your read in any way and why.
Eh, I'm not quite as sold on Rawr being scum based on the push for normal lynching alone, since that by itself might come from someone who somehow believes it would work better (a believe that, although wrong, is possible to get as a town player). The way he reacted to LLD's push reads like scum, though.
##Unvote
##Vote DrRawr
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RP coming to a post near you soon.
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45.75 hours remaining.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=23&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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Considering I didn't give any reason for suspecting Serela, how did you come to the conclusion that what I wrote above in that post was my reason for suspecting ActionDan?
In #36 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg845649.html#msg845649), you said you suspected Dan more that Serela. Obviously, I linked what you wrote to your conclusion. Saying otherwise is... pretty uncool, you know.
Not sure why you think Dan's idea to shoot me and Conq scummy? Hasn't his opinion already been superceded by his preference for Rawr or something?
In the end I still don't know why you want Dan lynched. Yeah, token questions were asked, objections were raised, but in the end you haven't moved an inch. You and I, we are such lamers.
===
Ninja'ed by Omba proceeding to hop, skip and jump.
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Not sure why you think Dan's idea to shoot me and Conq scummy? Hasn't his opinion already been superceded by his preference for Rawr or something?
The way he came to the conclusion to specifically shoot one of you two read mighty strange.
Dan seemed to think Rawr is town last time (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846025.html#msg846025) he posted reads.
Anyone apart from me you find worthy mentioning for one reason or another?
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RP's release date has been pushed back yet again. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
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Ouch. Mafia aside, politics would like to have a word with you. A king with a brain and competent advisors works better about 10 times out of 10.
The TAS identification experiment I ran a while ago had the group get each replay correct on all except for one. Only one person got everything right, so from that I'd say 90% of the time the consensus is correct.
What do you think about Affinity? What about me?
I think you're leaning town, Affinity is leaning town as well, but only barely.
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The TAS identification experiment I ran a while ago had the group get each replay correct on all except for one. Only one person got everything right, so from that I'd say 90% of the time the consensus is correct.
Only bothering to look at the first post of that, my guess is that
a) The conclusions can be reached by more less entirely objective criteria
b) Only people that have a lot experience with that stuff even bothered to participate
whereas mafia
a) is inherently subjective
b) levels of expertise vary widely
c) there's a minority that has a vested interest in misleading the majority
(very similar to politics, really :V)
Also, how does the conclusion you reached there fit together with your #87 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846109.html#msg846109)?
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I'm increasingly comfortable with Serela as scum. Leaving aside the semi-joke reason I gave earlier, I'm more worried about Serela saying this.
As for how to approach this, I'm not entirely sure how to begin with trying to figure out who's scum in this kind of setup, but I figure if we keep going in the direction we are now we'll get somewhere eventually! :o
Which is bullshit waffle in the style of Omba pretending not to know what to do with the box vig in Shadoweh's Secret Vanilla, especially since I don't think anyone else has suggested against "hunt scum normally" or similar. Also, from past experience, town!Serela gets excited and theorycrafts in weird setups instead of just sitting back and asking people "what do?"
If I claim scum repeatedly can I be town too? :C
I'M TOTALLY SCUM GUISE. RAWR IS MY SCUMBUDDY. We're having pizza in our QT right now! It sure washes down that cheeta-BEDTIME.
It's really late and I'll make a more serious post tomorrow
Psuedo-apologizing for not having a "serious post" three hours after the game start. Guilt? Cream on the top is that he didn't make that post anyway. GET YOUR LURKING ASS IN HERE.
"Something is rotten in the state of Denmark." ~Macbeth
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Okay so I never slept last night and was, as such, in a horrible state for most of the day, but I'm okay again now! So let's see here.
##Vote IHNN
Subtle pull in the post for trying to keep alive.
My head sees this and tells me to ##Vote Dan. He plays the logic and then goes "LOOK IT'S AtE KILL IT". Okay, he didn't react that seriously, but it's the basic gist of the feeling :o I think it's, like, well, you know, uhhh lets move on since I don't know how to word this
Oh jeez how did I forget I was making this post for the past two hours, restarting the reread I had going >_<
I don't have a town read on Omba, but he's not scum with Dan at the least. But that would be getting into flips we don't have already so whatever.
I'm pretty sure Serela is going to be PoE'd as scum soon. Good shot definitely.
"Let's pick on the person who doesn't exist!" ...okay nevermind maybe that's a legitimate reason to do it in itself. But, i'unno, wouldn't someone who hasn't done anything at all yet -not- be a good d1 shot? This doesn't look good to me, but it's clouded by the fact that, well, it's me, so it looks like I'm OMGUS'ing if I don't like it :/ Oh whatever.
Taokaka LLD is weird in a way I don't particularly like, but LLD is weird in a way I don't particularly like to me in general from what I've seen, so, I'm not entirely sure what to do with that. I think Neko is town.
Oh hi conq! Yeah I'm sort of looking like my scum meta up 'til now, bad timing with the not sleeping >.> <.< But was that seriously 3 hours after the game started? I thought it was more like... 15 hours. I guess I could be wrong though. I'm pretty out of it right now.
instead of just sitting back and asking people "what do?"
I'm around and not doing it now ;_; And I never asked people stuff like that D: I thought where the game was going at first was perfectly fine, that's all I meant by what I had said there :3 But yeah there was guilt, because I'm town, so not posting actual things is Not Good! If I was scum at least I'd have somewhat of an excuse for not caring as much.
IHNN:The problem with consensus is the amount of control people who want to rig the system (in this case, the scum faction) have in that sort of system. In real life it's more like lobbyists or big companies or whatever (US government is messed up as hell), but, anyway, I need to go to bed. It's past midnight and I already didn't sleep last night.
But I'd totally shoot the heck out of Dan :]
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^Would sheep Conq 5/5, Zero's seal of approval.
Skimmed most of the new stuff. Whole lotta blah. Nothing caught my eye except Neko targetting LLD, which I'll look into later.
Edit:
Shoot Serela for profit whenever. She used the wrong emoticon at the end.
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This is, by the way, why I asked the question I asked. IS it scummy to want to influence Bard's shot? I want you to all think long and hard about it.
Bard may be a confirmed townie, but nobody is perfect, Bard's gut could be completely wrong, and a crowd works better then an individual, even if that crowd does have some seeds of dissent.
I think the best action is to analyze posts and try to see who is being the most manipulative here - that's who the scum is going to be.
Alright, I'm going to need some clarification here. First off, what's your personal opinion on this? You keep asking us but you never give an answer yourself. Judging from the next paragraph, I'd assume the answer is no, but then you say the scum is going to be "most manipulative." What does that even mean? Feels like you're contradicting yourself, saying that it's not that scummy to influence Bard's shot, but the people who are manipulating most are going to be the scum? Unless I'm misunderstanding your point here; clarify please?
Cut by Serela: Hmm, okay. What are you trying to say here though?
I thought where the game was going at first was perfectly fine, that's all I meant by what I had said there :3
Where did you think the game was going then?
"I prefer the whore that is your sister." ~Marco Materazzi
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"I prefer the whore that is my sister."
<3
Serela's latest post is pretty horrible. Not quite sold on that not just being him on amphetamine + lack of sleep, though.
If his next post is in a similar vein, riddle him with bullets.
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Cut by Serela: Hmm, okay. What are you trying to say here though?Where did you think the game was going then?
Erm... lovely discussion somewhat resembling a normal mafia game? Other then the parts where the gunbearer lynches instead of people coming to a consensus.
The question was how we should handle the game, I thought what was going on was fine, and it developed into what we have now, which is also fine! :3
Anyway, I'm -actually- going to bed now, despite how HORRIBLE I am with not procrastinating. *Shifts eyes*
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Alright, now I'm pretty sure I can't read rawr. That said, I'm also pretty sure he's not the best theorist, so I don't find him pushing "group consensus" scummy. His reactions are null to me because this is pretty much what he does every game. >_>
rawr, explain your point on omba, because I don't get it. Also explain why you would shoot LLD especially since:
are you saying you agree with actiondans plan on killing conq and affinity(possibly you or omba) based only on speculation? I hardly find this protown seeing as its lazy and is a lame excuse for scumhunting
I'm pretty sure you're misunderstanding her point as she said only to shoot the strong players if they are scumreads iirc.
I don't want a repeat of Shadoweh/rawr from PoR.
LLD, could you expand on why this is scum!rawr and not town!rawr?
"Peace for our time" ~Neville Chamberlain
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Serela, did you take a post restriction and if so, what is it?
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Eh, I guess I want to see more from IHNN (did anyone ever tell you you're a lazy git? :V It's your job to move past passive scumhunting if you want to improve as a player) and Affinity (maybe ease up on the post restriction because it sounds like you're calling everyone lame and I'm confused about what you're trying to say).
Frankly, Omba's posts here are pretty different from the blatant bullshit (sorry, no offense) he posted the times I've seen him as scum so I'm leaning town on him.
Dan is townish too I guess. Would still like to see more from him as I'm biased towards reading him as town. :V
"Shall I part my hair behind? Do I dare to eat a peach?
I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each.
I do not think that they will sing to me."
~T.S. Eliot
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Given that I and maybe Neko pretty much advocated the same thing as rawr did back here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg845842.html#msg845842), LLD's attack (and by extension, Nameless') strikes me as rather selective. It's like that lame attack on the evils of democracy all over again, but America shall live forever so it's alright. Would like Nameless to answer to this, since he seems to be following LLD's lead; his lame, passive scumhunting is gradually getting to me.
I wonder why rawr specifically answered Omba's question directed at me just to find him 'leaning scum'; that bothers me, along with him assigning all the lurkers and LLD as scumreads and his more interesting observations as 'not scummy enough to shoot' here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846093.html#msg846093). The fluffiness reminiscient of active lurking is certainly there.
Not that I can pin anything on LLD either since that's just the cool, enigmatic manner in which she plays. She is indeed the Dudette of MoTK, at least on D1.
I also like Serela's cute jab on Dan enough to think him town; what a one-two punch it is. I'm such a lamer for that.
Words!
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I take back what I said about Affinity's PR; it's kinda cute in the weirdest way. (http://s19.postimage.org/sbhlv8jrj/icon_shifty.gif)
(Not that I have any idea what it is).
I also think you're amazing... ~Haqua du Lot Herminium
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I gave my reasoning already, Rawr. Your reactions are simply confirming it for me.
But it needs to be confirmed for me. Even if YOU're sure Rawr is Scum and needs to be elegantly shot, it's me who needs to be convinced, dood.
Serela hasn't contributed much and has chosen to be absolutely worthless in a way unprecedented by Serela. Taokaka is LLD? In any case, their tersity makes it hard to agree to their standpoints. A request for more questions is one I can honour, I suppose, though I had intended and intend to let you squabble among yourself before meting out justice.
(noting that not all players have responded to my previous question of which I am quite aware)
If you had the gun and there were five minutes on the clock, who'd you shoot, based on information you have right now?
I don't think I've had everyone state their top target rather plainly. I don't need a "why", I just need a "who". Moreover, what would you consider optimal scum play in this setup? It's a setup question, yes, but I find it a genuinely interesting question to assist in deciding who to shoot.
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Eh, based on info right now, if I had to make a last minute shot I'd shoot Serela. In the case he turns out to be town, it's not too much of a wash either since my impression is that he usually has decent gut reads but is just horrible at explaining stuff.
I think optimal scum play is pretty much playing normally, but without the lynch aspect, they have to try to direct vigs towards townies and away from scumbuddies. Or they could suggest vigs on their scumbuddies to "bus." I'm not sure what the question is tbh, since aside from the rotating vig mechanic this is pretty much a normal nightless setup.
If you're talking about initial vig choice, I could honestly see scum either choosing a vocal/strong player hoping that they'll off themselves, or choosing a relatively weak/stubborn player in the hope that they'll run through the town's allowed misvigs through a chain of bad vigs. I suppose if I were scum, I'd personally choose the former, since in the latter case weaker players can still sheep town leaders to the right shot.
Ave, Imperator, morituri te salutant.
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Ouch. Mafia aside, politics would like to have a word with you. A king with a brain and competent advisors works better about 10 times out of 10.
It only takes one bit of corruption to make a monarchy a terrible thing. Just look at dictatorships. More brains means better chances.
Neko: I suggest reading a few of LLD's games. After you have done that, tell me if it changes your read in any way and why.
>Implying that I should clear some blatantly bad play because meta
Calling bullshit on this, I refuse to play the meta game.
If you had the gun and there were five minutes on the clock, who'd you shoot, based on information you have right now?
Taokaka (LLD)
what would you consider optimal scum play in this setup?
Being subtle, trying to manipulate opinions. "We should" or "You should" are scum phrases in this situation.
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I'll think up some PR related stuff later. No wonder I never do PRs.
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Serela needs a big fat bullet in each orifice, eyes and ears included.
Calling bullshit on this, I refuse to play the meta game.
The point is that what might be scummy for some or general players may just be style of play for a specific player. Which is the case here.
Mind, I don't think her play here is specifically scummy anyway, but the meta thing makes your suspicion pretty, well, shit.
As for the optimal play. Conq already stated pretty much what I think. Give the gun to the best player and hope they die quickly seems best to me. Giving it to a bad player is the second choice, but since that has a good chance of weeding out a lot of the derp players and leaving the better ones, it's not as good a choice (when I'm scum, I tend to favor shooting good players so they don't catch me; the second strategy runs counter to this).
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For the better players, I'd either shoot Affinity because :gut: or LLD because complete null-read + usually good at finding scum. Not quite sure which.
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Also, how does the conclusion you reached there fit together with your #87 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846109.html#msg846109)?
As you pointed out the comparison doesn't really work.
Eh, I guess I want to see more from IHNN (did anyone ever tell you you're a lazy git? :V It's your job to move past passive scumhunting if you want to improve as a player)
I went to sleep. As it is I coughed myself awake at 5 in the morning and I'm really tired still. I take offense to being called lazy, it's that I don't know where to start. But the answer is definitely not now because 5 hours of sleep.
LLD's attack (and by extension, Nameless') strikes me as rather selective. It's like that lame attack on the evils of democracy all over again, but America shall live forever so it's alright. Would like Nameless to answer to this, since he seems to be following LLD's lead; his lame, passive scumhunting is gradually getting to me.
I was asking a question to one of the people who hadn't posted very much. I don't entirely see how that's passive.
If you had the gun and there were five minutes on the clock, who'd you shoot, based on information you have right now?
Probably rawr.
I don't think I've had everyone state their top target rather plainly. I don't need a "why", I just need a "who". Moreover, what would you consider optimal scum play in this setup? It's a setup question, yes, but I find it a genuinely interesting question to assist in deciding who to shoot.
I'll answer this when I didn't just cough myself awake after 5 hours of sleep. I think I'd try pushing LaL because a lurker would be less likely to submit the kill in time. D1 hand the gun to a strong player, hopefully get then to shoot a lurker, lurker doesn't kill (like Bogre in the prior game), hand the gun to a weak player, guide them to misshot, win. It's pretty flimsy but without a lynch I think it'd be a good starting point for scum play.
This post was brought to you by sleep deprivation. If any thoughts contained within seem incoherent, that's why.
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As scum I think I'd either endorse shooting myself as a gambit, to appear like I wanted to gun
OR
Try and get the gunbearer to shoot people who think I'm town, so I won't get shot.
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As scum I'd either Bus Early or spread out my suscipions
Still definitely think Serela is the best shot.
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26 hours remaining.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=23&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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Taokaka. Would you currently shoot Serela?
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Tao doesn't know what a Serela is, but she certainly wouldn't shoot one!
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I'm for shooting Omba for being lame, wobbly, and downright jello. Seems to be adept at supporting every viable target (e.g rawr, dan, serela) and more, and his decisions keep changing with little sense of who over who over what. While I may be lame, I am at least sure and steadfast in being lame.
If I was scum I would lie as low as possible, bus all my scumbuddies, and try to win by numbers.
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I'll also endorse an Affinity shot.
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Seems to be adept at supporting every viable target (e.g rawr, dan, serela) and more
In your view, were the players I named as good shots actually such at the time I did?
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Taokaka should not be shot btw. Most likely saw the same thing I did and reacted like this.
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In your view, were the players I named as good shots actually such at the time I did?
Not sure what you mean here?
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Dr. Rawr has received a prod.
22.5 hours remaining.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=23&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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Not sure what you mean here?
At the time I voted Dan, did you think he was reasonably likely to be scum (completely regardless of the reasoning I (didn't) give). Same for the rest.
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Serela, did you take a post restriction and if so, what is it?
Since the requirement was cut out I ended up not being able to be bothered to do one, despite having been excited about it beforehand.
what would you consider optimal scum play in this setup?
This depends too much on what's going on :S But for one thing, the fact that you don't have to vote makes it a lot easier to passively (or perhaps even somewhat actively, especially if the shooter isn't supportive) bus scumbuddies (Or well, safer) , not to mention recently MotK has a reputation for ridiculous amounts of bussing anyway.
Still definitely want to shoot Dan. Can't really come to a clear conclusion on anyone else except for slight town reads on a couple (like Neko)
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the prodding has been received.... reading
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zzz guys I ain't asking these questions for show. ::)
(http://s19.postimage.org/vb7ckp3pr/haqua.gif)Aren't you even a tiny bit interested in me?
@Neko: I'll rephrase to make myself more clear.
First off, there's a difference between clearing bad play with ~*meta*~ and realizing that such and such is someone's playstyle, and I feel like you're misrepping Omba's statement by boiling it down to >implying. And in the end it sounds like you're attacking LLD because you think she sounds a jackass.
This is, by the way, why I asked the question I asked. IS it scummy to want to influence Bard's shot? I want you to all think long and hard about it.
Bard may be a confirmed townie, but nobody is perfect, Bard's gut could be completely wrong, and a crowd works better then an individual, even if that crowd does have some seeds of dissent.
I think the best action is to analyze posts and try to see who is being the most manipulative here - that's who the scum is going to be.
Being subtle, trying to manipulate opinions. "We should" or "You should" are scum phrases in this situation.
These are empty words without a conclusion. You're asking us questions without providing any of your own thoughts on them. So share with us: what's your opinion on the first questions you asked? Who is being most manipulative and how? I don't like it when people offer observations that aren't really related to the game events because it's a soft way of not getting involved.
Serela, why Dan over everyone else? Half of the reasons you provided for scum!Dan you talk yourself out of immediately afterwards.
Affinity, why is Omba scum for being one of the more open-minded people around? I don't get the impression that he's supporting all these so-called viable targets simultaneously, so your position feels a bit slippery. The fact that he's actively making conversation is townier than not imo, especially given the lurkfest that is this game. What do you think about the targets you mention?
The half of the game that hasn't said anything of worth recently (which is...most of the playerlist rofl) should get in here with the deadline so close. At this point I wouldn't really mind Bardiche shooting any of them, although I guess I still prefer Serela.
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Eh, I should probably rephrase that since I don't actually want Bard firing blindly into a sea of nulls. :V
Still think Serela has a good chance of being scum from what he's put out. NekoNekoRex, Rawr, IHNN could all be lurkscum but ultimately just haven't provided enough content to tell. Seriously guys, wtf. You're not all scum.
Happy Birthday, Mr. President
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I'd just like to say I have made my decision and will be shooting Affinity unless revelations abound.
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EDIT: I will also be willing to shoot Serela if someone else will shoot Affinity at a later point given Affinity isn't a bad player and his strength, as Town, may be beneficial.
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I guess... I really am a lamer after all.
At the time I voted Dan, did you think he was reasonably likely to be scum (completely regardless of the reasoning I (didn't) give). Same for the rest.
Reasonable as in marginally higher than one-third? As I said before, I do find rawr suspicious for his lurker scumreads, which got outdated very fast. For the others, Dan's evolution from Nameless to Serela (especially compared to your sudden switches) and Serela's original stuff on Dan (however invalid) feel town.
That's not the main point though, and your question feels like a strangely lame deflection. I'm not getting how you layer your suspicions one atop another with none of them receding. It feels like you're covering all bases, touch-and-go style.
Affinity, why is Omba scum for being one of the more open-minded people around? I don't get the impression that he's supporting all these so-called viable targets simultaneously, so your position feels a bit slippery.
It's easy to be open-minded when you are agreeing with possibilities with one-liner reasons without evaluation. Not seeing these 'conversations' either, the ones I took note of are either on sociological applications to mafia here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846195.html#msg846195), or on Dan's 'Affinity and Conq' thing here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846050.html#msg846050), which was as passe as flower power in the 90s.
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Reading up and considering the questions I've been asked. It'll take awhile.
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I've been generally answering my own questions quite fine, first of all. When it comes to influencing opinions on the gun bearer, I don't see much of a problem with it, so long as it isn't subtle.
Being outspoken and clear is the way to go. Opinions on who should be shot and shouldn't should be concise. Being on the fence about people or hinting that someone is scummy without being clear about it is what I define as "being manipulative".
The reason I don't like Taokaka's posts were for the above reason; saying "Rawr is scum bard" and "Your reactions are simply confirming [you're scum] for me." is, while pretty clear on opinion, not clear at all on reason. Explain how the reactions are scummy, don't just say they are scummy. Was Rawr being over-reactive? Unclear? Too defensive or offensive? It also felt like gotcha games to me, Taokaka used one bad (opinion) post to attack rawr ceaselessly.
Also screw PRs, I always use a PR and then drop it pretty quickly, it gets in the way of trying to make a decent post and it takes long enough to type these up as-is, unless it's a pretty simple one.
I'm still endorsing a Taokaka shot, although the Affinity opinion seems pretty popular and I also disagree on sentiments about shooting Omba and the reasoning, Omba's play is pretty good so far, despite disagreements about my opinions (and therefore I don't like Affinity for calling Omba out on it)
Might have more to say, might not. On the subject of who's being manipulative, I haven't really seen too much, although I'm probably not analyzing posts enough to catch it if it's there.
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Apparently nobody posts during the morning =V
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I am not lurking for going to sleep and then having something to do in the morning :S Either way I'm here now and here's a post.
The reason I don't like Taokaka's posts were for the above reason; saying "Rawr is scum bard" and "Your reactions are simply confirming [you're scum] for me." is, while pretty clear on opinion, not clear at all on reason. Explain how the reactions are scummy, don't just say they are scummy. Was Rawr being over-reactive? Unclear? Too defensive or offensive? It also felt like gotcha games to me, Taokaka used one bad (opinion) post to attack rawr ceaselessly.
Taokaka is playing exactly like Bogre from the previous iteration. Exactly.
Bard is confirmed town.
ActionDan is very likely town. Has posted reads, good thought processes, and was active ED1.
Conq is very likely town. Has very good thought processes, is asking questions and generating content.
Serela reads as pretty town to me right now, I like his thought processes right now, although he's not really pushing opinions (though the same can be said of most of us at this point). If someone could explain to me why Serela is scum that would help, I don't remember seeing that earlier.
Neko also feels town to me. He's active and the posts reach logical conclusions. Would not shoot at the moment.
Omba also feels town to me. He's active and asks questions that need to be asked. Would not shoot at the moment.
Affinity is 'lame'. This is a shot I'm ok with, because I don't like his stance on Omba. It comes across as "oh crap I've been caught better get someone else shot instead eeny meeny miny Omba".
I don't like rawr. Something about his posts feels forced to me, and they feel rather disjointed. Is that how he usually plays? IIRC he didn't play like that D1 of MC Mafia.
LLD has done almost nothing. Do some stuff that isn't playing like Bogre/calling rawr scum. I agree that rawr is scummy, but we have no idea what else you're thinking.
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8.75 hours remaining.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=23&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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It comes across as "oh crap I've been caught better get someone else shot instead eeny meeny miny Omba".
First post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg845678.html#msg845678) by Affinity, he votes me. No name goes up on my scum list.
Regardless of that, shooting Affinity is good. Case sometime soon.
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First post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg845678.html#msg845678) by Affinity, he votes me.
I missed that. In that case, the reason is not "random choice" but "let's push my first target even farther so if I go down they go down with me"
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I missed that. In that case, the reason is not "random choice" but "let's push my first target even farther so if I go down they go down with me"
Alternatively bussing, but speculating as to which is pointless until we get at least 1 flip.
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I will be pretty much unable to post for today + tomorrow.
Affinity is not scum with Serela, one of his posts said that he found serela's jab at me town minded when Serela is a serious contender to be shot. I doubt scum would do that. However if serela town, that same line could come from a scum perspective.
I am going to agree with Conq about Omba (that he's more likely town), metametameta
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Sleepy time
Hopefully will be back before deadline.
IHNN: I have no idea who Bogre is. How does that factor into Taokaka's play?
I think reliance on meta for reads is a bad thing, I want to point out. People can use meta to make their playstyle seem more town then it actually could be, and I don't think it should be used to rule people out for reads.
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IHNN: I have no idea who Bogre is. How does that factor into Taokaka's play?
I noted that she's playing exactly like one of the players from the previous iteration of popcorn mafia. Just read the first day and you'll see the similarity (both tunneled immensely on 1 player)
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IHNN, are you actually accusing me of doing nothing?
That's funny.
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Nameless feels rather lackluster at the moment? Didn't he find me town right when I was in the process of attacking Omba, only to suddenly think it scum now or something? I also thought he agreed with LLD's reason for going after rawr?
I don't get the feeling that people are addressing my points directly (Nameless being a direct example) as to why I think it touch-and-go rather than 'open-mindedness'. Anyone can say that Dan is suspicious for setup speculating, that rawr is suspicious for being brash at LLD's brash attack, that Serela's waffling is scummy-looking; it is the choice between viable targets and the reasoning behind it which counts, and Omba has none of that. I would think my line of questioning is valid in that sense.
Promising a case with 7 hours left in the day (while I'm asleep) is also pretty jerkass, but whatever. If I had to choose someone other than Omba, Nameless and rawr would come to mind for the standard reasons, though I doubt shooting them would be very beneficial. I am a lamer and will always be one due to my inauspicious history.
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IHNN, are you actually accusing me of doing nothing?
That's funny.
I'm not accusing anyone of anything. I merely made an observation that you haven't done very much this game.
I don't see what's so funny about it.
Nameless feels rather lackluster at the moment? Didn't he find me town right when I was in the process of attacking Omba, only to suddenly think it scum now or something? I also thought he agreed with LLD's reason for going after rawr?
(Nameless being a direct example)
Promising a case with 7 hours left in the day (while I'm asleep) is also pretty jerkass, but whatever. If I had to choose someone other than Omba, Nameless and rawr would come to mind for the standard reasons, though I doubt shooting them would be very beneficial. I am a lamer and will always be one due to my inauspicious history.
Nope. Never said I found you town this game. I do agree with LLD's reasoning for rawr, but she has 0 stances on anyone else at the moment (if I missed something feel free to point it out).
An example of what? I'm addressing your points directly.
So basically rawr and I come to mind as shots for 'standard reasons'. What are these? Why do you think shooting us wouldn't be beneficial?
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Oh gee, I called Affinity scum and Serela town.
You aren't reading.
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Oh gee, I called Affinity scum and Serela town.
Tao doesn't know what a Serela is, but she certainly wouldn't shoot one!
I'll also endorse an Affinity shot.
You aren't reading.
Oh aren't I? But that's still only a stance on 3 of the 8 non-confirmed players (not including yourself).
I'm not accusing anyone of anything. I merely made an observation that you haven't done very much this game.
This still holds.
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I'm starting to lean towards IHNN being scum at this point. I dunno... he looks weird :/
I'm going to be so happy when we got some kind of flip to work with.
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Eww. Well I think Affinity is town (why the fuck would he attack Omba of all people as scum) but I wouldn't mind him being shot just so the rest of you stop getting distracted.
Also, I'm going to pull back on Serela a little because I could actually conceive him being this bad as town. I'm going to suggest a rawr vig over Serela because the dearth of content from him is pretty uncharacteristic of rawr!town, especially since I can see last active times B|.
?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ?Gol! ~Andr?s Escobar's killer.
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Anyone can say that Dan is suspicious for setup speculating, that rawr is suspicious for being brash at LLD's brash attack, that Serela's waffling is scummy-looking; it is the choice between viable targets and the reasoning behind it which counts, and Omba has none of that. I would think my line of questioning is valid in that sense.
Shit case. According to this, I'm scum because I did not explain why X is more scummy than Y. Apart from the fact that it's plain unnecessary because Bard can think that far himself, it's pretty obvious how "made some weird speculation leading to a pretty unjustified result" is less scummy than "pushed something that borders on then scummy, then reacted in a way that reads scummy" is less scummy than ":giant lurk: followed by downright horrible reaction". Nevermind that if lack of reasoning given is his way of choosing who should be shot here, he should be advocating a Taokaka shot because she's been even more concise (and gave zero reasoning for suspecting Affinity; if he's able to read the reasoning without her giving it, he should similarly be able to do the same in my case).
In short: Pushes a bullshit case, proceeds to name as other viable shots... well, the same sort of generally viable shots he accused me of advocating.
Result: Needs a bullet.
No name continues climbing up the list by pointing out, but completely holding off on giving a read to accompany what he pointed out. Apart from the whole "where's the problem in only giving reads on specific players" thing.
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(why the fuck would he attack Omba of all people as scum)
Why not?
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No name continues climbing up the list by pointing out, but completely holding off on giving a read to accompany what he pointed out.
I thought I gave a read in my reads post (#140 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846824.html#msg846824)) but apparently not. Right now LLD is leaning scum, it sort of feels like she's picking apart my words to find things I missed, and before you accuse me of doing the same thing; I was a little bit to counter her doing the same thing. I feel that there's a better way to phrase the previous sentence but I don't know what it is.
Apart from the whole "where's the problem in only giving reads on specific players" thing.
Normally it's not a problem, but when you only have stances on 3 people (which are common stances on those people) it comes across as trying to play it safe.
LLD, can we get some idea of what you're thinking about players that are not named Affinity, Serela or rawr?
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^
I'm not accusing anyone of anything. I merely made an observation that you haven't done very much this game.
This is what I'm referring to.
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Why not?
I guess scum!Affinity could have a hard on for hard targets that fight back when there are so many other potential targets, it's true. But I'm pretty sure he suspected me for similar tautological reasons in Shadoweh's Vanilla, where we were both town.
That said, if it were someone like you presenting the same sort of argument, I'd pretty much want you dead immediately (see that same game). So I'm not convinced Affinity's argument makes him scum, but I wouldn't mind him getting shot so we stop going down this road. If Affinity is town I trust he'll be able to make a better choice of shot after 3 more days of discussion anyway.
Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ an-niẓām
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Interesting.
Has your No name read changed in any way?
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I'm not going to attempt to read IHNN without flips, and I'm pretty sure all of you who claim he's easy to read are lying bastards.
"They think it's all over. It is now!" ~Kenneth Wolstenholme
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I thought I gave a read in my reads post (#140 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846824.html#msg846824)) but apparently not. Right now LLD is leaning scum, it sort of feels like she's picking apart my words to find things I missed, and before you accuse me of doing the same thing; I was a little bit to counter her doing the same thing. I feel that there's a better way to phrase the previous sentence but I don't know what it is.
Normally it's not a problem, but when you only have stances on 3 people (which are common stances on those people) it comes across as trying to play it safe.
LLD, can we get some idea of what you're thinking about players that are not named Affinity, Serela or rawr?
Nope! ^-^/
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Interesting.
What's interesting about it? You know what I'm talking about, yes?
Let's put a smile on that face!
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Gonna sleep, won't be awake for deadline.
Shoot
Affinity, if you aren't Scum, then uh. Well, good luck herding this Town.
I kinda want to change that target to Serela.
Like, right now. Since he's a useless jackarse.
Goddamn I want to.
I really want to.
Every fibre of my being is saying SHOOT SERELA.
Fuck it.
##SHOOT: Serela
I'm shooting my gut.
I don't think shooting LLD is profitable until later on. She's just as unhelpful as ever. I don't think shooting Dr Rawr is a good idea at all since I'm pretty sure he's Town. Conq is trying too hard to get me confused by suddenly switching stances. :V
If I am still in the game by tomorrow I swear to Shadimeh I'll shoot someone.
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Bard is dead, serela gunbearer, flavor and stuff later.
75~ hours to shoot.
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Shoot Dan Instantly or Don't Shoot Dan Instantly... choices, choices.
I'm too lazy to reread him right now (I'm of course going to do this) so it'll be later if I don't change my mind and shoot IHNN or someone instead.
Off to dinner! /poof
(...I'm not REALLY going to shoot someone right away, that'd be silly. I have to admit that unless people really want to I probably won't be waiting 3 days, though. Maybe two.)
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And Bardiche held the gun to Serela's head and declared "Every fibre of my being is telling me to shoot you."
"But I'm not scum!"
"I'm shooting my gut. Now DIE SCUM!"
***
Bardiche was found with a shot in the gut. Serela found a gun next to the body. Yay guns! Now Serela has the gun.
He has 74.5 hours to shoot someone!
Timer (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=26&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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Serela found a gun next to the body. Yay guns!
Hooray :D
I SWEAR I DIDN'T SHOOT K4U GUYS I JUST HAPPENED TO HAVE A GUN AT THE TIME BUT IT'S TOTALLY IRRELEVANT.
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Congratulations to Bardiche for being the worst townie in this game, despite being confirmed as town.
You shot Serela. SERIOUSLY. SERELA.
Next time you try and call someone "unhelpful" get your own shit in order first.
Serela, you should not shoot Dan. Shooting Affinity or Rawr is tech.
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What's interesting about it? You know what I'm talking about, yes?
One point I found interesting is that I'd have thought it a potentially viable scum strategy for a different reason (i.e., hanging onto a target that is unlikely to get lynched/shot anytime soon allows you to do a number of things, not being on a wagon / among the supporters of someone that dies and gets confirmed town by his flip / getting the gun being one of those things).
Yeah, I get what you're talking about. It makes sense.
Serela, don't explain why you played like that. Don't.
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Serela, don't explain why you played like that. Don't.
If you think it's because I wanted to get the gun or something, no, that'd be lame. I usually lurk out D1 because I generally can't figure much out until around mid-D2. (Early D1 went a lot worse then it should have me-wise though due to the not sleeping thing messing me up for a long time)
From what I can remember I might could go for a Rawr shoot, and Dan/IHNN are the other probables. That being said I'm going to be rereading all of them sometime soon so I can get all those thoughts in order. It's highly unlikely I'd shoot Omba/Affinity/Conq/Neko unless I had some sort of epiphany; it's not that I have big town reads on all of them, it's just that I don't see anything I particularly dislike and/or things I think are more likely from town, so there's much higher priorities on my shooting list then them.
And then ??? on Taokaka LLD.
I need to take a nap. I'll probably get the rereads done early tomorrow.
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So much rage
At Taokaka.
Seriously, people ho don't PLAY2WIN tick me off a real storm.
Anwser questions when asked, especially if you're being asked to put out some reads.
Also you guys need to stop metaing EVERYTHING. The whole argument that "this player is clear because (s)he's not blatantly scum metaing" is a terrible way to do things and assumptions just get town killed.
People in the graveyard for Bunny Must Die were all over Shadoweh being scum for meta reasons
Guess what? He was town.
We have three days worth of posts, you can afford to put the meta down away and use some real posts to make cases and reads.
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Also Affinity kind of needs to take a dirt nap as well, making bullshit cases like that are what I'm defining as "manipulative".
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Nope! ^-^/
Now I want you shot.
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She's roleplaying a catgirl, and I still want her burned at the stake
This is how mad I am
(I'm not actually IRL mad)
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LLD is just intentionally acting like that for the gun, so w/e
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LLD is just intentionally acting like that for the gun, so w/e
Also:
Don't be a derptard and set yourself up for a shooting target just so you can get the gun. The purpose of the game isn't to get the gun, it's to eliminate scum. Don't forget that.
This. So much this.
If so, it's inconsistent and she needs to be shot. If not, she's playing anti-town anyway. So, not whatever.
Scumpicks right now are LLD rawr and Affinity.
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You seriously don't think I don't have a good protown reason for not answering that question?
Let's examine the evidence:
This is how Town reacts:
So much rage
At Taokaka.
Seriously, people ho don't PLAY2WIN tick me off a real storm.
Anwser questions when asked, especially if you're being asked to put out some reads.
Also you guys need to stop metaing EVERYTHING. The whole argument that "this player is clear because (s)he's not blatantly scum metaing" is a terrible way to do things and assumptions just get town killed.
People in the graveyard for Bunny Must Die were all over Shadoweh being scum for meta reasons
Guess what? He was town.
We have three days worth of posts, you can afford to put the meta down away and use some real posts to make cases and reads.
This is how scum reacts:
LLD is just intentionally acting like that for the gun, so w/e
Have we learned anything today kiddies?
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(Also, Omba is town, Neko is town, Conq is leaning town but still up in the air for me. IHNN needs to die badly, and Dan is town for the moment <but I am waiting on something to confirm something etc etc etc>)
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If so, it's inconsistent and she needs to be shot. If not, she's playing anti-town anyway. So, not whatever.
Scumpicks right now are LLD rawr and Affinity.
Also, this is why IHNN needs to be shot soon.
But let's play "WIN A TOWNIE COOKIE". Anyone who can tell me why this post is a Shoot on Sight post, gets a townie cookie.
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I seriously have to agree that my trigger finger is itching to go for IHNN, right now.
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Serela providing comprehensive opinions only after he's been misvigged is policy lynch worthy in future games. Just saying.
IHNN is delusional but not sure if scum.
rawr can eat a bullet if he's just going to pop in and post one-liners once every 24 hours (prod received and reading my ass).
Lurkers make this game unfun.
"Anyway, I keep picturing all these little kids playing some game in this big field of rye and all. Thousands of little kids, and nobody's around ? nobody big, I mean ? except me. And I'm standing on the edge of some crazy cliff. What I have to do, I have to catch everybody if they start to go over the cliff ? I mean if they're running and they don't look where they're going I have to come out from somewhere and catch them. That's all I'd do all day. I'd just be the catcher in the rye and all. I know it's crazy, but that's the only thing I'd really like to be. I know it's crazy."
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I never called you town..
Really? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846188.html#msg846188) You should go be a Lopunny and wear a flame orb or something.
According to this, I'm scum because I did not explain why X is more scummy than Y. Apart from the fact that it's plain unnecessary because Bard can think that far himself, it's pretty obvious how "made some weird speculation leading to a pretty unjustified result" is less scummy than "pushed something that borders on then scummy, then reacted in a way that reads scummy" is less scummy than ":giant lurk: followed by downright horrible reaction".
It was not so much for Bard as it is for you. Feigning solidity and being on the ball on a wide range of possible shots to look town 'reads' scummiest to me, which is why I asked for such clarifications. As far as I remember LLD has no similar pretensions, especially with her pressing of rawr.
Long overdue reasoning is lame. I don't think Serela's reaction was horrible (one word); I can certainly tell why Conq and Bard thought so, but not you. You are the only one to say that rawr's reaction is 'horrible (one word)', which no one agrees with. Really, it's non-ambulatory for you of all people to say A < B < C is obvious when B and C aren't even clearly explained.
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Really? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846188.html#msg846188) You should go be a Lopunny and wear a flame orb or something.
'barely leaning town'=/=town. I probably should have said null there but what's done is done.
Also, this is why IHNN needs to be shot soon.
I seriously have to agree that my trigger finger is itching to go for IHNN, right now.
Huh? I don't even know what I did?
IHNN is delusional but not sure if scum.
How am I delusional for posting who I think is scum, considering I've been consistent about that all game? I don't expect all 3 to be, but I'd be very surprised if none of them were-and slightly surprised if only 1 was.
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How am I delusional for posting who I think is scum, considering I've been consistent about that all game? I don't expect all 3 to be, but I'd be very surprised if none of them were-and slightly surprised if only 1 was.
You were sheeping rawr's logic in order to postulate a LLD/rawr/Affinity scumteam. If you think rawr is scum why are you springboarding an argument off a point he made?
Affinity, why are you so fixated on scum!Omba? As far as I can tell, your entire case is tautological and I haven't seen anyone who's bought into it. What do you think about other people?
I'm not too sure old Phoebe knew what the hell I was talking about. I mean she's only a little child and all. But she was listening, at least. If somebody at least listens, it's not too bad.
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You were sheeping rawr's logic in order to postulate a LLD/rawr/Affinity scumteam. If you think rawr is scum why are you springboarding an argument off a point he made?
2 reasons.
I was coming to the same conclusion.
and scum can make valid points.
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Well, there's also the part where you go well, LLD's inconsistent and should be shot, and if not, whatever she's anti-town anyway so shoot her.
But whatever.
You do realize we have 2 vigs left and that the vig replaces our lynch for the game? We're trying to vig scum, not fulfill whatever personal vendettas you may have.
Put some more effort in the game.
People never think anything is anything really. I'm getting goddam sick of it.
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whatever she's anti-town anyway so shoot her.
But whatever.
You do realize we have 2 vigs left and that the vig replaces our lynch for the game? We're trying to vig scum, not fulfill whatever personal vendettas you may have.
I never actually said to shoot her in the later case.
Yes, I do realize we only have 2 shots left unless we hit scum. I wouldn't push for her to be shot unless I'm more sure of her being scum than a random shot.
Put some more effort in the game.
I'm at least playing, which is more than can be said for rawr right now. Additionally I have to go for the night now, and probably won't be back for another 15-16 hours as well.
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For more moderate opinions, I suppose I can say that rawr's last piece of content 48 hours ago was that lurkers were scum and needed to die. Well, by his own reasoning, he should be shot.
I think Neko is running his ground on his 'manipulative' thing, good advice, LLD being the pink power ranger that needs to be killed with fire, and his opinion that my case on Omba is bad. It's pretty one-dimensional, and he doesn't have a very good range, especially with regards to people like rawr and nameless. Worth looking into if this keeps up.
Nameless is a thing with all the slips and stuff. He's still scummy for sheeping people left and right, but the above instance seems to be so haphazard (e.g If so, LLD is scum) that it actually seems null. I don't believe he actually needed to quote rawr, for example, and I don't think he thought that it would make him seem more town. Due to this, I'm not really seeing him as a good shot now.
Conq looks town, though I would like to ask him what happened to hi line of questioning on Neko, and what prompted his change in stance on Serela.
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I never actually said to shoot her in the later case.
If so, it's inconsistent and she needs to be shot. If not, she's playing anti-town anyway. So, not whatever.
Scumpicks right now are LLD rawr and Affinity.
>_>
If that's what you really meant, you use really messed up phrasing. Feels like one of those things you point back to that could go either way.
I would like to ask him what happened to hi line of questioning on Neko, and what prompted his change in stance on Serela.
rawr started out with a good effort and disappeared into nothingness, making a promise to catch up and instead giving us the bare minimum. Serela at least stayed consistently bad throughout the day and admitted to it. I'm a big fan of Lynch All Liars. :toot:
I do want to see more from Neko because his posting has too many platitudes/truisms for my liking, but he's not exactly at the forefront of my mind right now. I'll get to him later today when he's put some other stuff out.
Here's Johnny!
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jeez conq i dont need you breathing all over my butt :blush:
Anyways currently looking at dan, ever since his "shoot competent players" was shot down his presence in the game has been small.
Skimmed most of the new stuff. Whole lotta blah. Nothing caught my eye except Neko targetting LLD, which I'll look into later.
would like to see whats up with that and an explanation on why serela earlier. Possibly reads to go along with it since after ed1 he hasnt made any
i dont understand why affinity thinks omba is scum, cant tell if thats desperate scum or weirdtown. will need to reread posts
lld is town though hes just attempting to get the gun
conq and omba are town i guess no reason to think otherwise
neko there quit a few words in your posts, but i feel as though im not getting much from it. your 138 was only about lld and 172 were just complaints
would pretty much shoot ihnn and actiondan currently
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Dr. Rawr is still scum for trying to suggest all I'm doing is going for the gun, when clearly I am scumhunting.
This is where the bullets should be heading, thank you.
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I seriously have to agree that my trigger finger is itching to go for IHNN, right now.
Don't say things like this until the time to shoot comes. Ask neutral questions if needed.
Skimming,
Agreeing with LLD that the post LLD quoted of Neko's looked like genuine town. It was the kind of thing I didn't see from Serela D1.
Paranoia about Conq is setting in, but even If he were scum I'd feel it's more productive to try for the other two.
On Rawr: the statement about LLD is wtf. That should be clarified. Otherwise the rest of the post is pretty general and null to me.
Still don't want to shoot IHNN. I would say I get why LLD thinks he's scummy for the thing she quoted. (i.e "LLD inconsistant scum, or else anti-town, but let me put her on my scum-reads") but honestly it's not scummy. he gave a read => he made a choice => he believed more strongly in LLD scum than LLD town.
At the moment, I really don't know who I'd shoot. Gonna look more in depth at Affinity/Omba. Everything fit so much more nicely if Serela was scum.
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>_>
If that's what you really meant, you use really messed up phrasing. Feels like one of those things you point back to that could go either way.
Yeah, in hindsight I did. +1 thing I need to work on; re-phrasing things to be more clear.
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I'm pretty sure Affinity is town. I think Conq is too. Also still Neko.
Omba and Rawr are so-so in a ":/" way for me (Not trying to say that Omba's level of play is like rawr's!), the rest are varying levels of I Want To Shoot. Taokaka is the most ??? out of them though.
This is still just a list of reads without any reasoning though, which would be pretty crappy if I wasn't confirmed town, and isn't very useful even as I am. Trying to actually organize my thoughts on everyone so that I can leave behind pearls of wisdom in the case that I don't vig a scum. I have made up my mind on who I want to shoot right now, but it's very possible I'll end up changing it before that actually happens, so :shrug:
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I need to say more things
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While we're naming our town reads, I think LLD is town and Conq is somewhat town. Neko is slightly town.
Also Serela. I think it's a good idea if you hold off on telling us more about your thoughts until close to the point where you want to shoot (just write them up in a text editor or something and post them all at once).
The holding off doesn't apply to asking questions and the like.
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I kind of have a gut read on Conq. I've been reading his posts and they kind of bother me a bit, his posts have seemed a bit too crafty for my tastes.
I admit I have been pretty much skimming most of Day 2 though I need to get on it but I've been goofing around way too much today, it doesn't hel in an hour I'll be busy the rest of the day with some RPG stuff.
Conversely I think IHNN might be a poor vig choice right now, he doesn't look as bad as I think people are making him out to be, I'd focus on some other more blatantly bad players like Affinity and possibly LLD. LLD might have possibly improved?
*looks at LLD's more recent posts*
Nope, still screams "kill it with fire" to me.
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Serela, I had a dream last night about how you shot Dan and he flipped town and I was sad and the fate of the game rested in Dan's hands and :(.
Don't make Tao a sad cat. Shoot IHNN or Affinity or Rawr.
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Well, there's also the part where you go well, LLD's inconsistent and should be shot, and if not, whatever she's anti-town anyway so shoot her.
I'm a big fan of Lynch All Liars.
To clarify more on the first point, it's little things like this that bother me quite a bit. Little implications that make someone look worse then they actually are, trying to manipulate how people read to other players.
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To clarify more on the first point, it's little things like this that bother me quite a bit. Little implications that make someone look worse then they actually are, trying to manipulate how people read to other players.
Actually, I think these thoughts are pretty legitimate. As in, Conq's thoughts.
It's basically what IHNN actually said, and Lynch All Liars (when used intelligently, of course) is also pretty legitimate. People promising they'll post and then not getting around to it is something I see from scum a lot, for one >.> Whether they actually intended to post or not. But, as said; when used intelligently.
But yeah, I'm growing more happy with my vigging choice. Don't think I'll be changing it.
Omba:I would ask questions, but overall, I'm not much of the question-asking type in mafia :c Like, sometimes I see questions I'd like to ask. Most of the time, they aren't towards people I actually think are scum :derp: I haven't really figured out a good way to fit them into my method of scumhunting yet. I need to work on figuring out a good way to pressure too; sometimes it'd be useful, but my scumhunting mostly doesn't use any intentional interaction with the person from me as of 'til the present.
Anyway. Don't mind me >.> I'll try to sort my things out so I can shoot without just being "herp derp this is why I shot X now let's hope it goes well"
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"Basically what he said" is different from "he actually said that" though
It bugs me when it looks like you could twist words so easily like that.
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47.75 hours remaining.
Timer (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=26&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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his posts have seemed a bit too crafty for my tastes.
... It's the Kirigiri avatar isn't it. :ohdear:
Not sure what you mean when you say I'm trying to manipulate how people read to other players to make them look worse than they actually are, unless you're referring to the way I parse through what's publically available in the thread to arrive at a decision? It's like casemaking on MotK has died. You're free to disagree with my stance, but stuff like this:
"Basically what he said" is different from "he actually said that" though
...is bollocks because even IHNN admitted he used fucked up wording (I assume you're talking about that from the quotes). I'm not twisting anything here.
Conversely I think IHNN might be a poor vig choice right now, he doesn't look as bad as I think people are making him out to be, I'd focus on some other more blatantly bad players like Affinity and possibly LLD. LLD might have possibly improved?
For what it's worth, I could easily revert to this style of casemaking, throwing out blanket statements without justification, but they don't mean anything to me unless I have backing for them. Why are Affinity and LLD blatantly bad, while IHNN is a bad vig choice? Just interested in hearing your reasoning.
I feel like Pirlo has seduced more men tonight than Monroe in her whole life. ~Anonymous
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This (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846598.html#msg846598) is (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846617.html#msg846617) the (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846858.html#msg846858) scum (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846896.html#msg846896) hunting (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846949.html#msg846949) in (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846978.html#msg846978) the (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846981.html#msg846981) universe (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=4680)
totally wouldnt shoot this guy ^
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Omba seems really outdated so far in D2 compared to his D1. Everyone else has posted and developed their stances but all he does is to give us lame, useless town reads (without justification) again? Fits my image of scum coasting on cred, and now there's very little idea of what his scumreads are either than on me, or whether his other scumreads have held up or not. Still advocating his shot. Lynch all Lamers (except me).
rawr is still pretty lame for more average reasons; e.g he wants to vig Dan and Nameless but strangely he doesn't elaborate on the latter? He also elaborates on why Neko is weird but strangely he doesn't want to vig him. Strikes me as lazy case making to me, especially compared to his D1 posts.
Will comment on others later, but most people seem rather tentative on their stances as of now. Would prefer that Omba be shot due to what I see as pretentious scumhunting. Still don't think Nameless is a good shot due to what I said above.
I am a lamer. Lame lame lame lame lame.
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It's basically what IHNN actually said, and Lynch All Liars (when used intelligently, of course) is also pretty legitimate. People promising they'll post and then not getting around to it is something I see from scum a lot, for one >.> Whether they actually intended to post or not. But, as said; when used intelligently.
I suppose I didn't think of it this way, I tend to think more along the lines of "fakeclaims" when it comes to LaL. You make a good point.
... It's the Kirigiri avatar isn't it. :ohdear:
Not sure what you mean when you say I'm trying to manipulate how people read to other players to make them look worse than they actually are, unless you're referring to the way I parse through what's publically available in the thread to arrive at a decision? It's like casemaking on MotK has died. You're free to disagree with my stance, but stuff like this:...is bollocks because even IHNN admitted he used fucked up wording (I assume you're talking about that from the quotes). I'm not twisting anything here.
For what it's worth, I could easily revert to this style of casemaking, throwing out blanket statements without justification, but they don't mean anything to me unless I have backing for them. Why are Affinity and LLD blatantly bad, while IHNN is a bad vig choice? Just interested in hearing your reasoning.
*flails about*
I wasn't really aiming to make a big case on you in the first place, so forgive me if my post is pretty terrible overall. As I said, it's mostly gut, but I didn't want for people to ask me what I meant by saying he's "being crafty"
But you're doing it again with the things that bother me. Let me pull out a select quote from that post:
It's like casemaking on MotK has died.
Thinly veiled insults like that aren't going to help anyone catch scum, it only throws people off and presses their buttons (the ones who you're insulting).
LLD and Affinity have more solid bad play then IHNN, I think it'd be safer to shoot the players who are actually playing bad then players who people are jumping on for a few "gotcha" posts.
IHNN also seems like he's putting actual effort into scumhunting, for another reason, which is better then what I can say for the former players.
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It's like I'm the only person who thinks Affinity is town and that his opinions are good. ;_;
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Ah, well it wasn't meant to be an insult; it was half me being frustrated at my computer and half me being melodramatic about the current meta, since cases are pretty much my bread and butter even if I sometimes get too lazy to produce them. That aside, what I was trying to convey is that your blurb felt more like an attack on my playstyle than anything, which is kind of a pet peeve for me because of ~*reasons*~. (But I'll try to tone down on the snarkiness).
rawr has devolved into trolling. If you're not going to play the game, ffs don't sign up.
But I make a profit of three and a quarter cents an egg by selling them for four and a quarter cents an egg to the people in Malta I buy them from for seven cents an egg. Of course, I don't make the profit. The syndicate makes the profit. And everybody has a share.
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now there's very little idea of what his scumreads are either than on me, or whether his other scumreads have held up or not.
Well. You're still likely scum, No name and rawr are still scum. Dan has climbed the ladder and is now a solid null-read.
If I were to shoot, I'd probably put the bullet into rawr right now. I have the least doubts about him being scum.
But then I'm rather sure I know who Serela is going to shoot anyway, so eh.
Thinly veiled insults like that aren't going to help anyone catch scum, it only throws people off and presses their buttons (the ones who you're insulting).
Shut it, moron. :V
LLD and Affinity have more solid bad play then IHNN, I think it'd be safer to shoot the players who are actually playing bad then players who people are jumping on for a few "gotcha" posts.
IHNN also seems like he's putting actual effort into scumhunting, for another reason, which is better then what I can say for the former players.
Are we playing the same game? I have no idea how you can evaluate either as playing worse / putting in less effort than No name.
Nevermind that playing worse is pretty irrelevant anyway. For No name, he practically oozes the inability to make meaningful cases on anyone from his pores, in a way that is heavily indicative of him being scum. For Affinity... I already said what I think about Affinity, so.
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Incoming pseudo-wall response
Are we playing the same game? I have no idea how you can evaluate either as playing worse / putting in less effort than No name.
Are we playing the same game? I have no idea how you can evaluate play quality / effort put in right now.
For No name, he practically oozes the inability to make meaningful cases on anyone from his pores
Going a bit far there? The phrasing there is honestly rather insulting and doesn't get you anywhere. Why did you phrase it that way instead of "IHNN hasn't made any cases yet and his actions towards cases are indictive of him being scum". Equally wrong, but no longer insulting (and also not as convincing. Funny how attacking a persons character makes them look worse) I'll concede I haven't made any major wall of text cases, but who's to say the littler things aren't meaningful?
For No name, he practically oozes the inability to make meaningful cases on anyone from his pores, in a way that is heavily indicative of him being scum.
in a way that is heavily indicative of him being scum.
BS. BS BS BS.
I would very much appreciate it if you would stop using insults in your attacks on my playstyle.
You've only played games with scum!me, so how do you know what my town play is, unless you've read Midnight Crew Mafia? In that case, you'd know I couldn't make a case there to save myself on D4, in which case, your point is invalid anyway.
Despite this, I think Omba is still town; albeit very misguided town.
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Finished rereading and hm. Suddenly everyone looks as if they are coasting on by.
The only two things interesting about Neko is his original complaint against Conq and his guarding against vigging Nameless. While I praise the latter, the earlier comes across as nitpicking on word choice, which is rather lame especially given that other people were already on Nameless independently for similar reasons. He still comes across as one-dimensional with easy LLD hate, a vague accusation that I'm not putting much effort into my scumhunting (without commenting in depth into my other views), and a baffling fixation on the concept of 'manipulativeness' which seems increasingly out of context.
On Conq, while his D1 seems solid, his D2 raises some questions. I've noticed that while he had seemingly fruitful exchanges with various people, he doesn't seem to have much to show for them. In the end, all I can garner from his current reads (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846987.html#msg846987) is that he hates rawr for the average reasons? There's no evidence as to how his exchange with Nameless or me affected his reads, and he comes off as seeming tentative, an attitude befitting scum.
Feel more confident regarding LLD (who seems to have a very clear idea of who is scum+pressure etc.) and Nameless as town, with Dan as a wildcard, compared to all the shady characters. Not sure of how to order them though, but I still prefer vigging Omba.
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Has anyone seen the mod? I have no idea how much time is left on the clock
I think I need to reevaluate some of my stances a bit via rereading the entire thread and focusing on one player's posts at a time
Are we playing the same game? I have no idea how you can evaluate either as playing worse / putting in less effort than No name.
I'm not sure if you know what I meant by "latter". By "latter" I meant LLD and Affinity although I suppose the latter might be subject to change after a reread? I'm still adamant that LLD needs shot.
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That reminds me, I never have once commented on Dan because I was only vaguely aware he exists in this game. This i actually not a good thing. Why doesn't he post more?
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Has anyone seen the mod? I have no idea how much time is left on the clock
I was wondering that as well so I checked, and there are 29 hours to go in the day.
That reminds me, I never have once commented on Dan because I was only vaguely aware he exists in this game. This i actually not a good thing. Why doesn't he post more?
I hadn't noticed he wasn't posting, although I do remember him saying he had IRL stuff for a couple days. IMO he had a strong start though.
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Action Dan has been prodded.
29.5 hours remaining.
Timer (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=26&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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LLD has been prodded.
27.75 hours remaining.
Timer (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=26&year=2012&hour=21&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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i'm back. Rereading.
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I don't have anything new to say >.>
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It's like I'm the only person who thinks Affinity is town and that his opinions are good. ;_;
Oh wait I do have something to say.
@Serela: This should be a gigantic hint to you.
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I don't have anything new to say >.>
Do something. "I have nothing to add" is no excuse. Find something. Ask something. Anything.
-cut by LLD adding something-
Can I add an addendum to Omba's post-anything useful (either that or I'm being an idiot and missing the point)
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Average reasons yadda yadda. I don't believe he's trying at this point. I believe he's capable of better play than this if he's town, especially given the reaction to his obstinate play in Kilga's game. I refuse to believe he's being contrary for the hell of it. There's being stubborn and then there's this. Bad play is scummy, folks. What would be an "above average" reason for you?
If I seem tentative it's because my motivation for this game is quickly being sapped out with all the apathy and the inactivity. I'm not going to lay out everything on the table because my opinions are kind of fluid right now and I'm rethinking some stuff. :dwi:
My opinion on IHNN? Well, I always seem to read him as scum, despite his actual alignment. His most recent post only reinforces my feelings on him:
-cut by LLD adding something-
Can I add an addendum to Omba's post-anything useful (either that or I'm being an idiot and missing the point)
Which is hypocritical at best and scummy mud-slinging at worst. He gives me the impression of a more active rawr; picking on little things that aren't really important.
Dan's posts are lacking the passion for scumhunting that I see from him as town, so he could conceivably be scum.
Actually here you can have a rough version of where I am right now
Scum Dr. Rawr < No Name < Action Dan < {NekoNekoRex, Affinity} < LLD < Omba Town
What General Lee?s feelings were I do not know. As he was a man of much dignity, with an impassible face, it was impossible to say whether he felt inwardly glad that the end had finally come, or felt sad over the result, and was too manly to show it. Whatever his feelings, they were entirely concealed from my observation; but my own feelings, which had been quite jubilant on the receipt of his letter, were sad and depressed. I felt like anything rather than rejoicing at the downfall of a foe who had fought so long and valiantly, and had suffered so much for a cause, though that cause was, I believe, one of the worst for which a people ever fought, and one for which there was the least excuse. I do not question, however, the sincerity of the great mass of those who were opposed to us.
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Something I am sure of: Affinity is town. Because he made sense in dialogue between him and Omba. Specifically.
I don't get the feeling that people are addressing my points directly (Nameless being a direct example) as to why I think it touch-and-go rather than 'open-mindedness'. Anyone can say that Dan is suspicious for setup speculating, that rawr is suspicious for being brash at LLD's brash attack, that Serela's waffling is scummy-looking; it is the choice between viable targets and the reasoning behind it which counts, and Omba has none of that. I would think my line of questioning is valid in that sense.
I was looking at Omba D1 and noticed the same thing. I do not trust Omba's counter-argument enough to Excuse him. I will again cite Affinity.
Long overdue reasoning is lame. I don't think Serela's reaction was horrible (one word); I can certainly tell why Conq and Bard thought so, but not you. You are the only one to say that rawr's reaction is 'horrible (one word)', which no one agrees with. Really, it's non-ambulatory for you of all people to say A < B < C is obvious when B and C aren't even clearly explained.
not liking these from Omba and LLD respectively: But then I'm rather sure I know who Serela is going to shoot anyway, so eh
Serela, I had a dream last night about how you shot Dan and he flipped town and I was sad and the fate of the game rested in Dan's hands and :(.
Don't make Tao a sad cat. Shoot IHNN or Affinity or Rawr.
Especially Omba's. Literally reads to me as "shoot away". (I mean I'm sure you'll both come in and like rebuke me strongly)
I think IHNN and Rawr are town mostly based on pages 1-3 still, their later play not withstanding. I think deducing that the 3 scum lie within LLD, OMBA, Conq, and Neko, but Neko's later posts (starting from around his anger at LLD) all read as townie, and Conq I have read as townie as well. As for LLD, I liked that she called Neko town, but Neko is not really on anyone's kill-list so it's not a concession.
I think Omba is the best shot, followed by LLD. I'd rather Serela shoot me over IHNN or Rawr since Rawr would shoot me/IHNN right now losing the game, and IHNN would shoot Rawr losing the game.
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I think a problem I seem to have with these Mafia games is I've been a bit too weak-willed. When I make opinions that go against the norm people lash out and I try to retract them, I'm too bendy. Direct example is in Early D2 of Bunny Must Die/7 Devils Mafia, I took back my gut on CORRECT!scum calls because angry townies. I should make an effort to be more assertive in the future.
I'm still rereading although I haven't had much time to do it today. Right now I'm exhausted for some odd reason (probably the heat) so I'm going to bed early.
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what i can post to ya know
LLD is my top scum read as of right now...
1. He consistently post as little as possible and offer near to no content besides "x is scum" or witty remarks to post
2. Post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846896.html#msg846896) like (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847035.html#msg847035) these (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847658.html#msg847658) prove hes just activily lurking the game and getting a easy pass for it
3. In bardiche (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846242.html#msg846242) post he was fucking right, anyone can make baseless accusations and say "im right youre wrong" but fuck you really are dense
4. honestly lld is probably some cool hipster townie who wants the gun. If we dont hit scum today i would probably shoot lld tommorow just for the obvious. fucking obtuse
Actiondan is a man of action and also another scum read. I pretty much had a town read on him for ed1 but then all of a sudden he dropped all his reads, made false promises on posts, and wtf his recent post seems like hes trying to direct the gun away from certain people or aim it at others. people were using the word manipulative earlier this is that. scumbuddies with lld?
fuck affinities #189 #206 and #212 just reads off as town to me not null my definite town read to me
omba and conq still read off as town to me
neko and ihnn are pretty much nullscum to me either one of them could flip town or scum to me
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above post is a town post.
Serela should shoot me instead of you/IHNN (although if for some reason serela picks one of these, shoot IHNN). Unless she wants to shoot Omba/LLD. Because I can promise you that I'm going to shoot one of them should I get the chance. Very very likely I'll shoot Omba. Depending if Conq still wants to advocate a Rawr shot. I would like Conq to reevaluate his Rawr read.
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Not going to be back until ~18 hours from now. That's around 2 hours before deadline. Since Serela has a good chance of shooting, here are my final words to her
I am going to blatantly try to manipulate you right now. I claim Mafia. Shoot me. do it.
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Seriously: Create this mental block right now:
"I want to shoot IHNN/Rawr: Wait! I should shoot ActionDan instead"
Any other thoughts you have I need not interfere with. Similarly if you somehow get the idea that you have the leeway to shoot someone else because you feel certain that should they flip town, you'll be confident that they will shoot me and I'll flip scum, you don't have that leeway. If you think I'll flip scum unconditionally, shoot me now.
-
ಠ_ಠ
-
Serela:
If you think of shooting ActionDan, shoot me instead. He seems at least somewhat town now and he seems hellbent on shooting me, so. Do me in first.
Or shoot that certain player you wanted to shoot. I think he'll flip town, but at least he's likely to hit scum afterwards.
Don't really care either way. I'd prefer it if you shot scum, but I have some serious doubts you'll do that ry(
In any case, shooting ActionDan has a rather high chance of loosing us the game, so I'd rather you don't do that.
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I think my lips should be sealed until Serela makes the shot. I would ofc encourage the other players to say something before that happens.
-
4. honestly lld is probably some cool hipster townie who wants the gun. If we dont hit scum today i would probably shoot lld tommorow just for the obvious.
"LLD is my top scumread" before that?
Besides, if LLD is 'some cool hipster townie', and if we hit town today shooting LLD immediately results in a loss.
Of course that's only desirable if you're scum, so either you don't get it rawr, or you're scum. I'm still leaning on the latter although a lot less so than before.
ಠ_ಠ
O.O
-cut-
WHAT IS IT WITH PEOPLE ASKING FOR THE GUN
Right now, if I had the gun I'd shoot LLD. I feel pretty confident about her being scum and she's done nothing to change that. The only downside I can see to that shot is if she's town...we have an incredibly lurky gunbearer in LYLO who wants to shoot me. In which case, gg, scum win.
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I don't like the way my power comes back on, and then all the new posts make me waffle on everything I had firmly believed in.
This is like, the worst time to waffle, unless I magically shot scum anyway.
Compounding on that, some of the people I want to shoot, if they're actually town, would probably shoot someone I think is town as well... and tomorrow is LyLo if I shoot a town, so that'd be really bad.
Plus I think at least one of the people practically begging me to shoot them is actually scum trying to mindgame me.
Blargleflargle.
Oh well, I usually have a much better time of things after I wake up. Off to sleep!
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@IHNN
In some of lld games iirc constantly tunnels and makes posts in a very provocative way. I would have to say with flips we would only tell if lld is truly town or scum. I dont know actually how other people read lld but i think with flips would be the best way to tell. only my second game with lld so w/e. It would be pretty much a crapshoot like with you and neko atm
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Serela:
I see. Sure, I'm trying to mindgame you. Does that make your decision easier?
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ಠ_ಠ
-
obviously all a scum conspiracy in hopes serela wont shoot any of the people asking for a gun :V
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Wtf mindhax. :V
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Or... I can ignore the temptations of delicious waffles, and shoot the target I had chosen from the start, before I lose my resolve and fall into disarray.
##Shoot: Lady Lambdelta fakeedit:REDACTED
Somehow, I don't think that's who Omba thought I was planning on shooting.
Cut:Omba I am this close to changing my mind and shooting you.
If you're town, will you shoot LLD for me? Seriously. :c
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wtf serela we shoot scum not town. I would rather that you only shoot omba/actiondan if it really came down to it(possibly one of them scum?). but fuck we still have 20 hours left so quit making waffles
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?p=1978961#p1978961
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For that matter, LLD, would you shoot Omba in exchange for me shooting you?
And IHNN.
Would you rather be paired with LLD or Omba? This is relevant.
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Rawr:Would you be okay with me shooting Omba if Omba had scanned a signed contract saying (s)he would shoot LLD for me in the event of them being town?
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Serela what in the actual fuck are you doing
THAT IS NOT HOW VIGS WORK AND WE ARE NOT CHAINING VIGS
"History will judge us kindly because I shall write the history" ~ Winston Churchill
-
I'm so glad you made this easy for me, Conq.
For I have finally seen the light. Or well, the darklight. It's been oozing all over now that I look at you with sleep deprivation in my eyes.
(http://puu.sh/DHCN)
##Shoot:Conq
-
facepalm.jpg
Fantastic birthday present. Literally terrible. Now I have to make a LYLO decision with my limited time schedule rofl.
So passed my eighteenth year. The sun rose and set, the flag went up and down. And on Sundays I went on a date with my dead friend?s girlfriend. What the hell do you think you?re doing? I asked myself. And what comes next? I hadn?t the slightest idea. At school I read Claudel?s plays, and Racine?s, and Eisenstein. I liked their style, but that was it. I made hardly any friends at school, or at the dorm. I was always reading, so people thought I wanted to be a writer. But I didn?t. I didn?t want to be anything.
-
"I'm so glad you made this easy for me, Conq." Serela declares, looking up from his book. "For I have finally seen the light. Or well, the darklight. It's been oozing all over now that I look at you with sleep deprivation in my eyes."
"What are you talking about?" Conq asks.
*BANG*
"Oh. What a fantastic birthday present."
With a thud, Conq's lifeless body hits the floor, scum for all to see.
Serela still has the gun. Conq died. Serela has 71 hours to pick his next target.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=6&day=29&year=2012&hour=00&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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:colonveeplusalpha:
I have no idea what made you shoot Conq there, but I guess the result is all that counts. :V
I was pretty damn certain you'd shoot LLD (and btw, no, I in all likelihood wouldn't shoot her if you shot me).
Eh, I guess I'll look at interactions now that we have a scumflip.
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I was pretty damn certain you'd shoot LLD (and btw, no, I in all likelihood wouldn't shoot her if you shot me).
...wait you were?
Anyway, I highly doubted you'd say yes, but all the weird questions I asked were intended for some sleep-deprivation inspired scumhunt that probably would barely have made sense to even me by the time I woke up. I don't always think straight past midnight. For that matter though, I did have ~*~serious reasons~*~ for shooting Conq, and oh god it's 2:27am. Maybe I'll elaborate in the morning instead >.>;
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Rawr still needs to be shot. Conq was bussing
Serela providing comprehensive opinions only after he's been misvigged is policy lynch worthy in future games. Just saying.
IHNN is delusional but not sure if scum.
rawr can eat a bullet if he's just going to pop in and post one-liners once every 24 hours (prod received and reading my ass).
Lurkers make this game unfun.
"Anyway, I keep picturing all these little kids playing some game in this big field of rye and all. Thousands of little kids, and nobody's around ? nobody big, I mean ? except me. And I'm standing on the edge of some crazy cliff. What I have to do, I have to catch everybody if they start to go over the cliff ? I mean if they're running and they don't look where they're going I have to come out from somewhere and catch them. That's all I'd do all day. I'd just be the catcher in the rye and all. I know it's crazy, but that's the only thing I'd really like to be. I know it's crazy."
Posts like this make me certain Rawr is scum. but I'm changing my IHNN read for the moment. I think IHNN is town, since Conq was pushing for that shot pretty hard.
Where as with Rawr, he says he wants Rawr shot, but where's the flare? Where is the "oomph"?
and I need to read Conq again, but I don't know if he even MENTIONS Affinity. Anywhere.
I'm going with Affinity/Rawr still, but I don't think anyway IHNN is scum.
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>Get on
>Expect to do rereads
>Conq was scum
>Gut was right
(http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z177/King_Yoshi42/Avatars/OriginalDejiko/f156dc9d.png)
>mfw
-
We should shoot LLD next
-
"A fine shot" - treebread
Ok so Omba is obvtown because I'm town. No scum would ever come out with that so fast.
I highly doubt Rawr is scum. I still think IHNN is town. I'll have to double-check affinity. That leaves Neko and LLD. And LLD is by far the better shot.
-
I'm so glad you made this easy for me, Conq.
My first thought: *facepalm*
My second thought: at least Conq is likely to hit scum
*sees flip
Uhhh....didn't see that coming. Nice shot Serela.
We should shoot LLD next
Either her or Affinity.
I don't think Conq being scum really changes any of my reads-if anything it makes me more unsure on rawr's alignment, but it doesn't change anything else. I'll probably re-read with that in mind by the end of the day.
-cut-
Any other reasons for Omba being town that don't involve knowing you're town?
-
"A fine shot" - treebread
Ok so Omba is obvtown because I'm town. No scum would ever come out with that so fast.
I highly doubt Rawr is scum. I still think IHNN is town. I'll have to double-check affinity. That leaves Neko and LLD. And LLD is by far the better shot.
>Using process of elimination to imply I'm scum for no given reason
-
Treatment by Conq + the stuff I mentioned earlier means Affinity is scum.
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And IHNN.
Would you rather be paired with LLD or Omba? This is relevant.
Didn't notice this until now-I'm not sure I understand the question.
After re-reading, I still think LLD and Affinity are scummy, rawr not so much although his posting style *really* makes me want to shoot him. I know shooting him over that isn't a good idea though, but if either LLD or Affinity turn up town for some reason, rawr is still 3rd.
Everyone else is most likely town, I couldn't find anything I disagree with but then again I said the same for Conq so take the latter half of this post with a grain shaker of salt.
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Treatment by Conq + the stuff I mentioned earlier means Affinity is scum.
you mean this magical post? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846888.html#msg846888)
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you mean this magical post? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846888.html#msg846888)
For example. Or this one (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846878.html#msg846878).
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Finally doing individual player analysis
Doing one per post because I'm extremely lazy and I'll undoubtedly quit in the middle of this (or right after post)
Anyways I started with Action Dan.
Now, ignoring the fact that Dan didn't exist on D2, he's been basically all over the place most of the game, with the exception of his suspicion of Conq.
Since I love talking about myself, I'll give an example with his opinions on me.
This Post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846025.html#msg846025) on Mid D1 shows he thinks I'm scum
In this post he even says he'll look into me for my targeting LLD (which he never does) (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846202.html#msg846202)
He doesn't really say anything else until his post on D2 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847043.html#msg847043) in which he thinks I'm suddenly genuine town.
Then he doesn't say anything again until now, which suddenly I'm the poorman's scum choice now due to PoE.
Looks pretty inconsistent to me.
Anyways, he's been mostly really consistent on his suspicion on Conq the entire game, which with my tinfoil hat on screams that he's been riding the bus to Conq's house the whole game in case Conq ever got any suspicion put on him.
The verdict is that he leans scum to me.
-
Not going to bother eith the whole "lol ton of quotes and explanations" with Omba
Omba leans heavily town to me, although if Affinity somehow flipped town then I'd probably reverse that opinion entirely. Affinity vs Omba is pretty obviously scum vs town, I'd be damned if one of the two isn't scum somehow.
I believe I've been pretty clear on my stance on LLD so I'm not going to bother with that one either. Playstyle or not LLD's playing recklessly, and is therefore scummy to me.
I'd consider retracting this because I said the same thing with Rawr in the last Anonymafia but overall people who play like that should get lynched regardless of alignment, it doesn't help town when you're obtuse and uncooperative.
I will admit though LLD's been improving bit by bit though, town!LLD is growing on me ever so slightly.
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Neko, That PoE post wasn't "you guys are definitely scum by defalut" It was more me thinking about my town reads and checking to see who was left. I still think you are pretty townie D2 onwards (and even end of D1 after I skimmed)
Still busy for another hour and a bit but..
As of page 5:
Rawr and Affinity are not scum together
IHNN and LLD are not scum together
IHNN and Affinity are not scum together
I'll quote where I got these from later. They aren't absolutes, but I have strong reason to believe them true. There are as many ties to LLD being scum with Conq as Affinity being scum with Conq.
-
Uhh... Serela's CMoA? I think that's the coolest thing I've ever seen this year on MoTK so far. I think Nameless is pretty much likely town now due to Conq's press on him. Neko also looks slightly better for going after Conq, though the reasoning behind that was... lame and not convincing at all. His interactions with Conq (e.g 'manipulativeness') also seem too organic for it to be scum-scum, and so I'm not as focused on Neko now.
Not sure why I'm getting all the flak for *connections* when, if I remember correctly, Conq has not talked much about Omba or LLD either. I believe such stuff should be two-way, and I doubt Omba or LLD have talked much about Conq either and are therefore suspicious. Still think LLD has a strong D1 and D2, however.
Don't think Conq's flip impacts my suspicion on rawr anyway; he was probably lurking hard enough to require his scumpartners to mention him in some way. Has a scumread on Dan (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847752.html#msg847752) but proceeds to tell Serela not to shoot him? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847786.html#msg847786) What? His LLD case is also too little too lame and not valuable at all. Omba's sudden townread on Dan despite his D1 suspicion makes me think better of him, but I still don't like the passiveness he showed on D1 and D2 and the outdatedness of his cases. Really urgh.
Yeah everyone is still being annoying with their non-case suspicions (esp Omba who continues to think I'm scum for my case on him despite Dan agreeing that it was legitimate). Things I said in this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847527.html#msg847527) still stand, if you guys had bothered reading it. Still believe that Omba and rawr should be shot. Will leave Dan for later.
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50.5 hours to deadline.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=6&day=29&year=2012&hour=00&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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Don't think Conq's flip impacts my suspicion on rawr anyway; he was probably lurking hard enough to require his scumpartners to mention him in some way. Has a scumread on Dan but proceeds to tell Serela not to shoot him? What? His LLD case is also too little too lame and not valuable at all.
obviously not what i meant about actiondan. that whole lurking thing sounds as far fetched as llds conq link to me(lol oomph)
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oh god why am I awake at 2:21 am again
(This is literally a prod avoid post, since it seems that consensus is the gunbearer should be quiet when he's narrowed down his shot choice, for obvious reasons, so... I don't really have much to say right now.)
I should probably at least come up with more questions to ask, but I'm spent in that category after my... uh, episode. And, IHNN, don't worry about that one >.>;
For that matter, what does CMoA stand for in this situation, Affinity? :V I have a feeling it's not Choose My Own Adventure, for I somehow doubt there was a sudden unburying of Berkeley's Phantasmagoria, not to mention that it'd be a loose interpretation of the meaning in the first place.
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ITT Serela's gut powers only activate at night.
... that is slightly disturbing on a few levels. And by disturbing I mean awesome.
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Crowning Moment of Awesome. Everyone is lame in comparison. Including me.
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Serela the were-town scumkiller.
(This is literally a prod avoid post... I don't really have much to say right now and I'm leaving for most of the day.)
Any question that anyone wants to me should be asked within the next hour or so.
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Pro-dodge
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:I
I do it once and suddenly everyone treats it like the latest thing in fashion.
At this rate I'm just going to shoot someone after I wake up all the way.
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Ask some questions then? For sure that's not a bad idea. Forcing more discussion only helps town. I'll probably ISO everyone tonight, try and put together reasons why I think they're the alignment I think they are. Not until tonight though, as I won't be around. I'm kind of curious as to who you're thinking of shooting. Totally not going to ask though-I'll find out after the shot. You are going to hit some scum, right?
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NekoNekoRex has been prodded.
LLD has been prodded.
27 hours to deadline.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=6&day=29&year=2012&hour=00&min=00&sec=00&p0=179)
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:I
Yeah I'm gonna reread for awhile and then shoot.
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I'm sketchy on whether or not I should shoot LLD :/
Other then that I'd probably bullet Omba.
One of those two.
Hrm. I really think at least ONE of them is scum. Omba's today in particular I think looks pretty bleh.
Very tempted to shoot Omba right now, which I'm fine with saying because it may be followed up with the actual action within the next ten minutes. If you want to say something, make a post telling me to wait so I don't shoot before you make it.
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Aaah
Between going out to eat and my sleep schedule ruining me I've been putting this off 3=
Let me see if I can garner anything new from the recent posts
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.... no wonder, nothing has happened since yesterday.
I still think there's a scum between Affinity and Omba
Dan is off the hook I guess since he's clarified a bit better on stuff. He still never looked into the thing with me vs LLD, though, I want to know what he thinks about that.
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Go ahead.
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I have an incoming wall I've been working on for a while now, give me a couple minutes to finish it.
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Affinity ISO: wall incoming
Nameless finding me scum for calling him lame is lame. That makes him like super lame or something. Luckily I am a somewhat cool enough guy to tell the difference between lameness and scumminess, but boy do the distinctions blur at times. Make no mistake, however, for I am still sadly a lamer at heart.
"lame" seems to be Affinity-speak for scum-except there's a difference? Posts like this are annoying because I don't understand the terminology. Additionally I said, ED1:
As of right now I'm leaning varying degrees of town on everyone except rawr and Affinity.
I get that scum would be the opposite of town, but it was really only null. Begins an attack on me that has been pretty stable through the game so far.
Given that I and maybe Neko pretty much advocated the same thing as rawr did back here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg845842.html#msg845842), LLD's attack (and by extension, Nameless') strikes me as rather selective. It's like that lame attack on the evils of democracy all over again, but America shall live forever so it's alright. Would like Nameless to answer to this, since he seems to be following LLD's lead; his lame, passive scumhunting is gradually getting to me.
I wonder why rawr specifically answered Omba's question directed at me just to find him 'leaning scum'; that bothers me, along with him assigning all the lurkers and LLD as scumreads and his more interesting observations as 'not scummy enough to shoot' here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846093.html#msg846093). The fluffiness reminiscient of active lurking is certainly there.
Not that I can pin anything on LLD either since that's just the cool, enigmatic manner in which she plays. She is indeed the Dudette of MoTK, at least on D1.
I also like Serela's cute jab on Dan enough to think him town; what a one-two punch it is. I'm such a lamer for that.
Gives some other reads, Serela as town, LLD as null I think and rawr as scummy.
If I was scum I would lie as low as possible, bus all my scumbuddies, and try to win by numbers.
This is the interesting post-if Affinity is scum I'd think Omba would suddenly be a decent shot-since we wouldn't be in LYLO if Omba is town.
Promising a case with 7 hours left in the day (while I'm asleep) is also pretty jerkass, but whatever. If I had to choose someone other than Omba, Nameless and rawr would come to mind for the standard reasons, though I doubt shooting them would be very beneficial. I am a lamer and will always be one due to my inauspicious history.
Bold for emphasis. I know it was still D1, but "for the standard reasons" feels sort of like a cop-out for actual reasons to shoot people.
The only two things interesting about Neko is his original complaint against Conq and his guarding against vigging Nameless. While I praise the latter, the earlier comes across as nitpicking on word choice, which is rather lame especially given that other people were already on Nameless independently for similar reasons. He still comes across as one-dimensional with easy LLD hate, a vague accusation that I'm not putting much effort into my scumhunting (without commenting in depth into my other views), and a baffling fixation on the concept of 'manipulativeness' which seems increasingly out of context.
On Conq, while his D1 seems solid, his D2 raises some questions. I've noticed that while he had seemingly fruitful exchanges with various people, he doesn't seem to have much to show for them. In the end, all I can garner from his current reads (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg846987.html#msg846987) is that he hates rawr for the average reasons? There's no evidence as to how his exchange with Nameless or me affected his reads, and he comes off as seeming tentative, an attitude befitting scum.
I still prefer vigging Omba.
Bold part-somewhere between those 2 posts he went from wanting he vigged to praising a scumread (?) for defending against it? Also starts suspecting Conq right before the shot, while still pushing for Omba's shot as he has been the entire game. Is it tunneling or bussing?
Uhh... Serela's CMoA? I think that's the coolest thing I've ever seen this year on MoTK so far. I think Nameless is pretty much likely town now due to Conq's press on him. Neko also looks slightly better for going after Conq, though the reasoning behind that was... lame and not convincing at all. His interactions with Conq (e.g 'manipulativeness') also seem too organic for it to be scum-scum, and so I'm not as focused on Neko now.
Don't think Conq's flip impacts my suspicion on rawr anyway; he was probably lurking hard enough to require his scumpartners to mention him in some way. Has a scumread on Dan (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847752.html#msg847752) but proceeds to tell Serela not to shoot him? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847786.html#msg847786) What? His LLD case is also too little too lame and not valuable at all.
Still believe that Omba and rawr should be shot. Will leave Dan for later.
Did Affinity have...4 scumreads at the same time at one point? (Omba, rawr, Neko, myself, though suspicions on me were being dropped since D2 and Neko may have been added to replace me on that list) The Dan thing hasn't come up yet-and Affinity hasn't posted since then, 25 hours ago.
Overall, the biggest thing is he said he'd bus his buddies as scum then try to coast on cred, and he's been targetting Omba the whole game. If Affinity turns up scum I'd definitely re-read Omba. [post-cut edit: re-reading now, posting thoughts at the bottom]
Final verdict: consistent, going after easy targets with the exception of Omba (and Conq right before Serela shot him; question for Serela: is Affinity's suspicion why you shot Conq, or did it contribute in any way?) Probably scum, would shoot second after rawr.
-cut cut cut cut cut cut-
Omba would be a decent shot (slipping since D1, and a strong player as well if the suspicions are misplaced), but I do think there are better shots. If you're dead set on shooting Omba then go ahead, I don't disagree with such a shot.
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I have said my piece regarding most of the playerbase except for Dan (due to lack of content); when you say that I'm consistently (?) going for easy targets other than Omba and Conq you are merely saying that everyone is an easy target other than those two. It's a lamely looping objection that could apply to anyone in the game currently, including you.
As for the tentative townread on you, I explained it a bit here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg847004.html#msg847004). Quoting your scumread as reasoning to go against LLD was an incredibly cute action that won me over. I praised Neko for not going for an easy target, which is probably all that he was worth praising for anyways.
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Oh I forgot that I was about to shoot someone.
I'm trying to psychoanalyze Affinity from what I know of his meta, but my knowledge isn't complete enough, so I'm sticking with my original thinking that he's town.
##Shoot Omba
hf picking the next shot if you're town, hopefully in that case you can motivate the playerbase to talk, unlike Serela the isolationist!
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I'm scum btw.
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Pretty early shot, but I won't question it.
-
"Very tempted to shoot Omba right now."
"Hm? Oh, whatever, go ahead."
"Yeah, well, have fun picking the next shot if you're town, hopefully in that case you can motivate the playerbase to talk, unlike Serela the isolationist!"
Serela raises his gun to Omba's head, pulls the trigger, and commits suicide. Omba takes the gun right out of Serela's cold, dead hands. Horray graverobbing! Giving poor people guns since 1752.
Omba has the gun. Serela is dead. Omba has 72 hours to pick the next target.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=30&year=2012&hour=22&min=30&sec=00&p0=179)
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Well then.
I suppose that makes Affinity the scum after all
-
So.
Affinity, No name, Taokaka. Reasons I shouldn't shoot you.
Everyone else. Reasons I should / shouldn't shoot them.
Answers that don't contain more than variations of "I / He is town/scum" are not acceptable.
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awkward rereading when that happened.
Also the death flavor for Serela needs to be more like this:
The dwindling survivors gathered around NeoSerela, just as they had done around huh what the day before. And just as yesterday's victim, NeoSerela was getting desperate. As his doom approached, he took action. Imitating huh what's antics yesterday, he reached up, grabbed his jaw, and dislocated it! His mouth flopped around, trying to make its way to his brain to devour it.
Yet for some reason, it didn't work. NeoSerela flopped around a bit, bleeding heavily, before falling to the floor. In his last moments, his eyes widened in horror and he tried to say something... But alas, his dislocated jaw meant that it came out garbled and unintelligible.
Please rectify!
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.... no wonder, nothing has happened since yesterday.
I still think there's a scum between Affinity and Omba
Dan is off the hook I guess since he's clarified a bit better on stuff. He still never looked into the thing with me vs LLD, though, I want to know what he thinks about that.
LLD quoted it herself earlier, and I mentioned I agreed that it made you look townie. Omba shot was bad, and I'm surprised that actually happened. I'm going to look for the quotes. brb.
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I have said my piece regarding most of the playerbase except for Dan (due to lack of content); when you say that I'm consistently (?) going for easy targets other than Omba and Conq you are merely saying that everyone is an easy target other than those two. It's a lamely looping objection that could apply to anyone in the game currently, including you.
I don't remember you going after ActionDan, and everyone else I guess was somewhat an easy target (including myself-I'm still relatively new at this)
Oh, forgot about it but I'm going camping on Saturday meaning no internet access until the 4th of July, if the game is still going on then (likely at the rate it's going) I'll need a replacement effective on the morning of the 30th.
-Omba cut-
You shouldn't shoot me because I'm being active, I've been clear on my stances since LD1/ED2, and I'm going through trying to make cases on my scumreads.
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I've been parading Affinity and LLD shots since D2.
I think it's pretty obvious one of Affinity and Omba are scum, and since Omba is town that only leaves Affinity to be scum. The case between the two screams "scum vs town". You of all people should be aware of this.
My stance on LLD as been pretty clear too, bad play, refusal to cooperate, impossible to read well, tunnely and hyperagressive using gotcha games to make cases instead of properly scumhunting.
I'd definitely condone Affinity over anyone else right now, though.
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So.
Affinity, No name, Taokaka. Reasons I shouldn't shoot you.
Everyone else. Reasons I should / shouldn't shoot them.
Answers that don't contain more than variations of "I / He is town/scum" are not acceptable.
Because I am not scum, DrRawr he is town
Also shoot affinity
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Or actiondan, i hav no preference for any order
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Or actiondan, i hav no preference for any order
Literally Crazytalk.
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Uh, rawr. You kind of forgot the reasons part. :V
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ugh i already liked it more when serela had the gun.... fine ill make a post with actual reasoning tomorrow.
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bleh decided just make a quickie
LLD, would not shoot today, why?
1. got his second prod
2. probably has been posting like he has just to obtain the gun(too fucking obvious)
3. wutscumhunting
4. With the lurking/tunneling/Oneliners id have to say it would be a pretty useless shot for today and could possibly a waste(it would be like shooting px)
Affininty,
1. Honestly conq switching his stances d1 probably threw bardiche off from him originally shooting affininty
2. his #262 reads flailing scum too me, tries to discredit everyone because of conqsflip not actually revealing everything. He cleared IHNN as town for the same reason hes still thinking im scum
Actiondan
i think i already made a post on this except i think hes posted more crazy speculation on scum partners which doesnt seem to useful for some reason
IHNN
I didnt read his affinity thing, i guess it would depend on affinitys flip for me
Neko, Me, you, IHNN(probably) are town and wouldnt shoot.
I would say shoot actiondan or affinity today
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Zero is the harbinger of nothing.
Post #70 doesn't look like bussing. IHNN and Rawr Prob not scum together
Post #109 first paragraph. Conq mentions IHNN and Affinity in a similar context. You just don't do that as scum to your only scum-buddies, it's very non-survivalist. IHNN and Affinity Very likely not scum together. (there's more evidence of this everywhere in the thread btw, if you look hard enough)
IHNN + LLD I doubt are a pair. The slapfight they had was too intense for IHNN + LLD scum. (I don't think IHNN is capable of that with regards to a scum-bud).
I thought I had something with Affinity + Rawr != scum together but after a reread I didn't find it. It's probably a weaker interaction than I thought at first.
I think It is legit crazy to ever shoot IHNN. He's town.
Also.
All of Neko/Conq looks like Conq was just playing with Neko. in the way scum likes to talk about Newb-town. "why'd ya do that? How about this? and why this?" stuff that Conq was comfortable to talk about. So yeah, I'm going Neko town forever too.
That leaves LLD Affinity Rawr.
Shoot em all. Start with LLD.
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I'm worried about the effects not hitting both scum in succession may impart on the perception of my virtual hairy balls.
Scum, please claim. Don't make me go through that.
I'm also getting a transient feeling rawr could actually be town.
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BT is clearly scum.
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Because no one bothers to read my posts, other than (I can't believe I'm saying this) rawr, Dan and Nameless.
Rawr's latest post shows some shred of competence, but
4. With the lurking/tunneling/Oneliners id have to say it would be a pretty useless shot for today and could possibly a waste(it would be like shooting px)
as the only reason not to go after LLD, in comparison to yesterday, is shot-worthy.
His backtracking on my posts without anything to prompt it is pretty lame too, when he said my #262 was town beforehand. Nameless' actions and interactions with Conq are pretty different. Adapting scumreads to fit the situation is definitely a hallmark of scum play, and shooting him is the best shot today.
I guess Neko had something legitimate on Dan, which relieves the monotony of his Affinity is bad and LLD is adjective descriptor whatever watching paint dry tv dorama, but it was rather egocentric and ineffectual (why is he inconsistent on ME. No I wasn't. Oh okay)? Whatever, he's still boring, and he's back on form. Honestly, his whole Conq thing wasn't aimed at convincing anyone and was therefore null, and he has been incubating his suspicions the entire game. If this isn't scum coasting I do not know what is. He's just so... passe. Would be my second shot for the day.
While I have often disliked Dan's connection-making, he seems rather on the ball and reasonable this game, though I disagree with that facet about Neko. The way his suspicions grew and receded on Omba seem rather organic, for example, changing with flips and situations, and thus I think him town.
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Someone tell me why the above post makes me think Affinity might be town.
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General heated discussion is a good thing if I you want to avoid
Keine Alcohol-tan making the shot, btw.
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Because no one bothers to read my posts, other than (I can't believe I'm saying this) rawr, Dan and Nameless.
Rawr's latest post shows some shred of competence, but
as the only reason not to go after LLD, in comparison to yesterday, is shot-worthy.
His backtracking on my posts without anything to prompt it is pretty lame too, when he said my #262 was town beforehand. Nameless' actions and interactions with Conq are pretty different. Adapting scumreads to fit the situation is definitely a hallmark of scum play, and shooting him is the best shot today.
I guess Neko had something legitimate on Dan, which relieves the monotony of his Affinity is bad and LLD is adjective descriptor whatever watching paint dry tv dorama, but it was rather egocentric and ineffectual (why is he inconsistent on ME. No I wasn't. Oh okay)? Whatever, he's still boring, and he's back on form. Honestly, his whole Conq thing wasn't aimed at convincing anyone and was therefore null, and he has been incubating his suspicions the entire game. If this isn't scum coasting I do not know what is. He's just so... passe. Would be my second shot for the day.
Dan's consistency on having vauge suspicion on Conq still screams "bus", but aside from that I think he clarified pretty reasonably on his waffly post on me. I still find him a tad scummy, but it's not really enough to make me want to shoot.
I don't like you because you'd been nitpicking on Omba for quite a large amount of the game, and the case always seemed very weak despite how consistently you've been sitting on it. Your connections with Conq have also made you look pretty terrible as a read.
I've read your posts, I just don't feel a need to bring up a tired case when it's pretty much become "standard reasons".
The thing with Conq and me backing down is a result of my weak will, which I am currently trying to improve upon. I should have been more on the ball with defending my suspicions and gut then I was, but I didn't and I ended up flailing.
I'll admit I've not once bothered to look at Rawr, so I don't have any actual opinion on him.
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I don't like you because you'd been nitpicking on Omba for quite a large amount of the game, and the case always seemed very weak despite how consistently you've been sitting on it
So a weak case = scummy? My case was certainly reasonable enough for Serela and Dan to agree with it at one point in time, and Omba hadn't done anything close to a dialogue to dissuade me from it D2 onwards. It warranted more than a single adjective as explanation on your part as to how it connects to me being scum.
Even if you delve into semantics and say that 'it was the 'manipulative' way I was pushing it' or some such, it was something you should have explained. Being tired does not cut it. There's the fact that my D1-3 is also certainly not defined by my suspicion on Omba alone, which you have failed to pass judgement on. What you are doing is really the same lazy scumhunting you are accusing LLD of, albeit consistently so unlike rawr. Really icky.
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So a weak case = scummy? My case was certainly reasonable enough for Serela and Dan to agree with it at one point in time, and Omba hadn't done anything close to a dialogue to dissuade me from it D2 onwards. It warranted more than a single adjective as explanation on your part as to how it connects to me being scum.
Even if you delve into semantics and say that 'it was the 'manipulative' way I was pushing it' or some such, it was something you should have explained. Being tired does not cut it. There's the fact that my D1-3 is also certainly not defined by my suspicion on Omba alone, which you have failed to pass judgement on. What you are doing is really the same lazy scumhunting you are accusing LLD of, albeit consistently so unlike rawr. Really icky.
That doesn't defend the point that there's an obvious connection between you and Conq, how can it not be obvious you're both scumbuddies? It's like everyone suddenly forgot.
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That doesn't defend the point that there's an obvious connection between you and Conq, how can it not be obvious you're both scumbuddies? It's like everyone suddenly forgot.
I hate you
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That doesn't defend the point that there's an obvious connection between you and Conq, how can it not be obvious you're both scumbuddies? It's like everyone suddenly forgot.
There is a more blatant connection between Conq and LLD in all honesty. I don't think he never made a direct determination of her alignment, yet was able to use her to prod other players, like yourself and Rawr and IHNN iirc.
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LLD has been prodded
55.75 hours remaining.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?msg=&month=06&day=30&year=2012&hour=22&min=30&sec=00&p0=179)
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I bet the graveyard is having fun times right about now.
Still needs more Serela trying to suicide by dislocating her mouth to try to eat BRAINNS.
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I'm somewhat drunk. People are not posting.
This is a dangerous combination.
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I'm somewhat drunk. People are not posting.
This is a dangerous combination.
Then shoot the person with the goddess of the harvest in their avatar.
Then there will be less grapes/grain/whatever.
Meaning less wine/beer/whatever.
Meaning you'll be better equipped to make the shot tomorrow.
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I need more alcohol so there's only thing to do.
(That's a ##shoot Affinity, Mod)
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best reasoning
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> "I need more alcohol so there's only thing to do. Kill all the barley." Omba raises his gun to Minoriko's head.
> "Um, but, wait, no, listen to me!" the goddess stutters. "That's not how you make beer!"
> Omba, in his drunken stupor, blows the harvest goddess' brains out. Now the evil harvest goddess and all the alcohol is dead. Horray for temperance!
Affinity was shot! He flipped scum. Omba has 75 hours to pick his next target.
Timer. (http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20120701T21&p0=179)
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Cool.
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Yay my mega-post was actually right in terms of the conclusion I drew.
Now you have to burn the rope shoot the last scum, which is most likely one of rawr/LLD. If I have some time tomorrow I'll do what I'll re-read both.
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I need to figure out a NSFW way to get alcohol out of Minoriko's remains.
Afterwards, I'll shoot someone. People might want to do the discussing stuff thing before that.
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I guess that leaves LLD for my suspicions.
Does this clear Rawr?
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I guess that leaves LLD for my suspicions.
Does this clear Rawr?
Affinity busses a lot, so I'd say it wouldn't clear rawr.
It's kind of hard to compare 2 people who've both done relatively little and had a bunch of posts which accomplished nothing.
ActionDan needs to say more stuff :V You can't coast on D1 forever.
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This is War. And I am the master of the art of War.
The correct scum play is to hand the gun to a strong player, because eventually, they will misfire and die.
THEREFORE, We should first think which of us as scum would hand Bard the gun.
would the pawns pick bard. Conceivably, but the choice might have been more random.
Bard is strong. More Likely, a more powerful piece was involved. But who. Affinity Omba LLD Conq.
Now who thinks you're the best? and who would give the gun to who?
LLD would not give it to Zero, that's for sure! She might think I'd shoot her face. But would she give it to Bard? Maybe. She'd give it to Bard, Conq, Affinity most likely.
Omba ... Same thing, wouldn't give it to me. Probably give it to LLD Conq Bard, not quite sure if Omba'd give it to affinity.
Affinity, Hmm, He'd give it too Bard or Conq, most likely. He would fear them
Conq. I think he'd give it to Me, LLD, Bard, or Affinity. He might fear Bard or Affinity, Less because he fears me or LLD, more because he'd think of us to shoot wrongly on the first Day.
So, who is the best shot. one of Conq Affinity. Frankly I think Conq would be the scariest opponent for scum if he isn't scum himself. However, I would not shoot him first. He's a valuable asset for town if he is town, and he can work better later after some people die first. I honestly wonder about Affinity's effectiveness, so I'd shoot Affinity earlier than later. otherwise we should go with one of the other group. Not Serela, she'll make herself Obvious town/scum eventually. Rawr might do in a pinch though. IHNN is fairly easy to read so not him.
Conq's last post sounds ok, but I'd shoot the lurker.
The words of Zero!
This post also gives me the case of the guts now that Affinity is dead
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This post also gives me the case of the guts now that Affinity is dead
So, who is the best shot. one of Conq Affinity.
Ummm...either ActionDan got lucky or scumslipped. If both LLD and rawr are town somehow then ActionDan suddenly jumped to the forefront.
Actually naming the other 2 scum in his first post before either of the scum posts looks weird, but I'm willing to chalk it up to successfully understanding who would pick Bard as first gunbearer. For now. It sure does look a bit suspicious though...
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lol.
Well that was funny. Maybe I shouldn't have had a boner for LLD's blood. uh. I'm going to reread again. I wonder. Did I have the luck of the gods?
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Also, I feel as used as a Japanese male prostitute in the 16th century.
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Thank you for the affinity shot.
Now shoot Rawr.
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1. NekoNekoRex Town on reactions.
2. Omba lol Obv town
4. No Name Town based on Conq flip.
6. LLD lol I'm town.
8. Action Dan I have a gut town read on Dan.
PoE baby. PoE. Rawr is scum. Shooting him should be easy peasy. Get drunk and do it for me again Omba.
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lol.
Well that was funny. Maybe I shouldn't have had a boner for LLD's blood. uh. I'm going to reread again. I wonder. Did I have the luck of the gods?
ALSO, THIS POST AIN'T COMING FROM SCUM.
NO SCUMBAG DAN AS THE LAST MAN STANDING WOULD EVER GIVE UP ON MY LYNCH DEATH.
CON-FUCKIN-FIRMED.
Shoot the last scum.
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with 1 scum left and 5 town we have 2 mis-shots.
Neko and ActionDan are almost definitely town, leaving LLD and rawr.
LLD would shoot rawr, rawr would shoot ??? so to hit both possible scum I'd shoot LLD. Even if we're wrong her ensuing shot will most likely win the game.
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with 1 scum left and 5 town we have 2 mis-shots.
Neko and ActionDan are almost definitely town, leaving LLD and rawr.
LLD would shoot rawr, rawr would shoot ??? so to hit both possible scum I'd shoot LLD. Even if we're wrong her ensuing shot will most likely win the game.
Do it the other way around.
Shoot Rawr, and if he's town he should insta shoot me.
(Simply because if he ends up being town, I want the lylo shot. I trust myself to make the shot more than Rawr.)
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Also, we have 3 misvigs.
We have 6 people alive. If Omba shoots wrong, 5 alive.
If the next person shoots wrong, 4 alive.
If the next person shoots wrong, 3 alive.
If the next person shoots wrong, GG no RE.
So we have 3 misshots.
And I think the shots should go as such.
Omba>Rawr (Game over.)
But just for the funzies.
Omba>Rawr>LLD>???>Dan
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(Oh and the ??? is a secret for a VEWY VEWY GOOD REASON)
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Also, we have 3 misvigs.
From the first post, scum win-con: You win when the number of living mafia members equal or exceed the number of living townies, minus the gunbearer.
First mis-shot: 3 town, 1 gunbearer, 1 scum
Second mis-shot: 2 town, 1 gunbearer, 1 scum
Third mis-shot: 1 town, 1 gunbearer, 1 scum [scum wincon met]
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From the first post, scum win-con: You win when the number of living mafia members equal or exceed the number of living townies, minus the gunbearer.
First mis-shot: 3 town, 1 gunbearer, 1 scum
Second mis-shot: 2 town, 1 gunbearer, 1 scum
Third mis-shot: 1 town, 1 gunbearer, 1 scum [scum wincon met]
Oh, I actually missed that. Thanks for the heads up.
Then yes, only 2 misvigs.
Then I want the following:
Omba>Rawr>LLD>???
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Get drunk and do it for me again Omba.
##Shoot (http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/1134812/1girl-blush-bow-chain-cup-drunk-fang-hair_bow-hat-) rawr (http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/952624/3girls-alcohol-bare_shoulders-barefoot-blonde_hair)
(Links NSFW because Danbooru)
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(http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z177/King_Yoshi42/panelchenhonk.png)
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(http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z177/King_Yoshi42/panelchenhonk.png)
I underestimated how awesome you are. Thank you for this.
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##Shoot (http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/1134812/1girl-blush-bow-chain-cup-drunk-fang-hair_bow-hat-) rawr (http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/952624/3girls-alcohol-bare_shoulders-barefoot-blonde_hair)
(Links NSFW because Danbooru)
I underestimated how awesome you are. Thank you for this.
-
So I re-read and I have no idea why I even thought Rawr was town.
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"I figured out a NSFW way to get alcohol out of Minoriko's remains. Anyway, time to shoot someone." Omba declared, tottering back and forth. "Eenie, Meanie, Minie, Rawr!" Omba lifted his gun, and blew out Rawr's heart.
Rawr's last words were "I hate you."
Rawr is dead. Town wins!
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OH GEE, RAWR AND AFFINITY WERE SCUM.
OH GEE.
(To those people who said I was playing to lose, I give you scum flips.)
(Also, Serela had a nice Conq shot).
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O/ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PPqAVhtYg8)
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So I re-read and I have no idea why I even thought Rawr was town.
You came around just in time. <3
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man I was tunneling on Dan all game as spectator because why the fuck would you use PoE halfway into day 1????
LLD was pretty spot-on, I no longer regret not replacing in because I probably would've fucked things up
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GOOD NEWS GUYS I'M FREE TO REPLACE IN!
....
;_;
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OH GEE, RAWR AND AFFINITY WERE SCUM.
OH GEE.
(To those people who said I was playing to lose, I give you scum flips.)
(Also, Serela had a nice Conq shot).
me :smug:
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man I was tunneling on Dan all game as spectator because why the fuck would you use PoE halfway into day 1????
LLD was pretty spot-on, I no longer regret not replacing in because I probably would've fucked things up
Oh God, I knew I was playing Scummy as fuck. It was giving people town reads on me somehow ???
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rofl.
http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/ZK9yKjLAmQJ7G Here's the reaaaaally tiny graveyard.
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man I was tunneling on Dan all game as spectator because why the fuck would you use PoE halfway into day 1????
LLD was pretty spot-on, I no longer regret not replacing in because I probably would've fucked things up
As it stands, I while I DID have Conq as a town read, I wanted him to die right before Lylo.
Basically, he was pretty townie, but I had my doubts about him? As a townie, if he was town I trusted him to make the right shot in lylo. If he was scum, he'd be dead.
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i'm sorry dan i just don't understand why a townie would use PoE that early when day 1 town reads tend to be susceptible to major change halfway through the game
given that i felt serela was pretty townie (and he later confirmed this to me), you trying to get him shot on PoE just felt like a scum move to me
later on you got a lot better but when i'm spectating i don't put too much effort into revising my tunnel-opinions
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I lament the fact that I could not open my first gun-bearing day with some variation of "Conq, I think you may be scum because I got the slight feeling you've been trying to verbally crawl into my ass".
Otherwise, hey, we did it. Time to get drunk, revive Minoriko and gang rape her. :V
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Yay now BT replacing me isn't required!
Also when I named LLD/Affinity/rawr as scumpicks I fully expected to be wrong on at least one. 2 out of 3 right ain't bad!
Also, from my #53 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,12897.msg845812.html#msg845812)
Quote from: Conqueror on June 21, 2012, 06:18:18 am
What/who are you referring to with this statement?
As of right now I'm leaning varying degrees of town on everyone except rawr and Affinity.
ED1 pegging of 2/3 of the scumteam, while being horribly off on the last one :V
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Also while Neko Miko Reimu's drunken frenzy captures what happened perfectly, I feel Club Ibuki (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8IJLjfiR4w) is more overall correct.
PS Omba I asked capt.h to remove your action when we were talking, I don't think the remarks are quite so funny once the alcohol goes away.
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Also, bard was the most useless confirmed townie to exist ever.
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Things went better then expected.jpeg
At least I was 2/3 on gut
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Also, bard was the most useless confirmed townie to exist ever.
This. So much this. Despite prompting on at least 2 occasions to GET THE TOWN MOVING.
Good first pick, scumteam.
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Affinity is officially my worst read ever. I've gotten his alignment wrong for the past several games in a row >.>; It's like HW, except that I -know- I can't read HW worth a damn. With Affinity I actually think I can get a read. And then it's just wrong.
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Dead QT: http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/ZK9yKjLAmQJ7G
Scum QT: http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/PYUDB2mv6gbg
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He just wanted to kill Serela. Don't hate on the man for living his dream. (I don't think he did a bad job of forcing out questions.)
I do want to point and laugh at Conq though.
Eh, based on info right now, if I had to make a last minute shot I'd shoot Serela. In the case he turns out to be town, it's not too much of a wash either since my impression is that he usually has decent gut reads but is just horrible at explaining stuff.
BAHAHAHAHAHA
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BAHAHAHAHAHA
<Serela> Ultimately
<Serela> Conq's list of reads made me go
<Serela> "what the fuck is this"
<Mizuki_Dormoto> well
<Serela> and then I read him and went "what"
<Lambda> it was a good shot Serela
<ActionDan> me too serela
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PS Omba I asked capt.h to remove your action when we were talking, I don't think the remarks are quite so funny once the alcohol goes away.
I'm not always drunk when I write on IRC, so. :V
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Now for my "response to the scum QT/graveyard" post-game post.
We could also scrap all my previous paragraphs and make someone like I have no name the vig, since he seems likelier to listen to consensus imo.
Going in I half-expected this :V I would have taken input from everyone but I would have lead the town, so I think I would have been a worse pick for you guys than Bard. That and I would have shot rawr D1 if I had the gun so :V
How did you two manage to get on the bad side of the tunneliest person on the playerlist? :L
Is this me? ::)
Even the touhou rage thread on extra lives feels more mafia than this game.
That's what I was thinking as it was going on.
guess ill wait for bt post, shouldnt take long with the amount of content in this game
Except it never happened because Omba didn't stall which didn't force me to replace out :V
That's a short graveyard.
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[20:06:03] <Conqueror> oh, also, I'll post about this in the thread, but this setup is even more punishing for scum than normal nightless setups because 1) confirmed town vig you can't control 2) the vig rotates 3) you can't lynch people who have scumreads on you because then they just get the gun :v
Town generally played well regardless. IHNN, as a general tip you don't need to play so defensively (you did better wrt that at the end).
Is this me? ::)
I was referring to LLD.
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Props to Serela, once again. Awesome town this game.
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Yay now BT replacing me isn't required!
Good thing, because I was going to yell at Neko and Dan scum.
Yes, my tells are terrible, apparently.
Also, I was 99% sure Conq would NOT leave such a crystal-clear path to scumbuddy Affinity. It was waaay more likely to be a trap in my eyes. *_*
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As soon as Conq flipped scum I suspected that Neko was scum too and that his pivotal post that made him town read was fabricated.
I can't read Rawr worth crap :V
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I stand by my choice. :V Serela or Affinity.