Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F  (Read 226661 times)

Mr. Sacchi

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #960 on: April 18, 2011, 05:42:38 AM »
Oh, yeah. Little question:

Anybody knows what dark a liar is an arrange of? Or was it created specifically for this game? It's been gnawing on me for a while.

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #961 on: April 18, 2011, 07:26:17 AM »
AFAIK, Dark A Liar is a unique song. 

Shame they didn't use it more.  But at the same time, it's a great song for the final boss.  The Special Disk theme while good, is a bit generic. 

I also move to banish Eirin to Can't Help Me Eirin tier, considering practically every other character can do something better than her, and her niche is stolen by Minoriko and MAG-based Sanae, outside of Overhealing, which I never really found a use for 

Ghaleon

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #962 on: April 18, 2011, 07:27:35 AM »
Eh, I dropped Eiki for Flan. I found her to be squishier then I thought she would be, and her nuke's damage, while good, not way high. I mean it was certainly on the high end, but it was significantly weaker then, say, Nitori or Aya's damage. Eiki was pretty useful while I had her, though, but for a squishy cannon, I picked Flan. Besides, Eiki would have run out of SP in the SoC fight... I'm rather amused you berate Yuyuko for SP after a Djinn Storm when Eiki is pretty guilty too!

Also Aya's damage seems to scale VERY well in Plus. On the Bloody Seal V2 fights her damage wass maybe half what Nitori does per hit, dished out at a billion times the speed.

Uhh.. I'm one of like.. 1 person who actually thinks aya is a good potential dpser (ok exageration, but yeah, check back to thread #1, I  was like the only guy back then), but doing more damage than eiki is ridiculous. try taking off 3 gurthangs off aya, and try putting on flying squirrels on Eiki (at least).

Also, Eiki is faster than yuyu, levels faster, and her main nuke costs only about 2/3's as much sp, there is absolutely no way that she shouldn't be noticeably significantly faster at recovering from a djinn storm than yuyu. Infact, yuyu is pretty much the absolute worst character in the game at recovering from a storm, nobody is slower than her but patchy, whose best nuke costs very little in comparison, and nobody has a main nuke nuke which costs more sp that I can think of, the two combined (along with a relatively bad sp recovery rate, and a very slow leveling curve) result in the absolute worst get enough sp to cast something recovery rate in the game. Only thing worse I could imagine would be yukari using spiriting away exclusively, which shouldn't be the case since her barrier spell is much cheaper and also extremely valuable.

Quote
Oh, yeah. Little question:

Anybody knows what dark a liar is an arrange of? Or was it created specifically for this game? It's been gnawing on me for a while.

Everything in the original soundtrack (version 1 in the akyu menu, aka, the not default) is original for Labyrinth of Touhou. Version 2 is the one with nothing but Touhou and Etrian odyssey remixes (maybe others? I don't think so)..Yeah, it's a great song, and as I've said before, the dude makes really fucking good music, and he's actually pretty bad at Touhou remixing (in comparison), should stick to making original stuff imo.

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #963 on: April 18, 2011, 06:27:44 PM »
I'm loving my Alice's stats.  48k HP, 18k Defense, 74k Magic, 35k Mind, 880 Speed.  I wish she had better physical bulk and better affinities, though (affinities sitting around 230-240ish), and I'm obviously not willing to switch gear around or she definitely would have better affinities. 

Compare my Mystia's 55k HP, 68k Attack, 22k Defense, 22k Mind, 1400 Speed.   Similar affinities.  I'm pretty sure that if I traded Shiva's Leather Boots and Flower Blade Kikiryusei for something else her stats could probably be better.

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #964 on: April 18, 2011, 07:52:02 PM »
Yeah Alice's stats are amazing. But her attack formulas are pretty meh IMO, especially for the delay on them. Mystia has better status resistances as well, and has some pretty op formulas, and whose speed makes her excellent at trash as well as bosses.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #965 on: April 18, 2011, 08:11:30 PM »
My Alice is pretty much if Meiling's DEF and MND were switched, with less HP. It's pretty cool. Buffed she deals a little more then unbuffed Nitori, so it's not great dps, but her tankiness definitely makes up for it. Same reason I took Yuyuko; her damage is high, even if not the best, and I definitely value her ability to take hits great more then an extra few hundred thousand damage per hit from, say, Eiki or Yuugi.

My Alice's stats are currently a little more then double NEETori's Alice's. I gave her an Ultimate ZUN Hat to give a huge and well-needed boost to affinities, along with her defensive stats.

Quote
Uhh.. I'm one of like.. 1 person who actually thinks aya is a good potential dpser (ok exageration, but yeah, check back to thread #1, I  was like the only guy back then), but doing more damage than eiki is ridiculous. try taking off 3 gurthangs off aya, and try putting on flying squirrels on Eiki (at least).
Nitori (who I compared her to) is much stronger then Eiki against anything with non-ridiculous DEF, and I've got both equipped with two Gurthangs and a Longsword 'Ringil'. And two more Gurthangs on Flan, and I still have spares :V Gotta love my luck. But yeah, Aya buffed does 1/3~1/2 the damage Nitori does buffed per hit when I fought the Bloody Seals, and Aya gets to have constant 100% SPD buff ontop of 2.5k+ speed and low delays, allowing her to A.Switchwhore my party like mad, B.Switch herself out before the boss attacks, and C.Get way more hits then anyone else ever (Chen has less delay but no doubled speed). Against a boss that never moved, Aya staying out would do far more damage then a godly ideal setup switching Nitori in/out and BhuddaBowl/Spiriting-Awaying her. It's how using Chen used to be in the later half of the normal game; she hits the boss 3~5 times before it moves and then gets out of there.

Having Aya buffed is incredibly important though since her attacks don't pierce DEF very well. It triples her damage output, wheras Nitori's damage boost is pretty linear (60% atk buff will increase damage by like 50%, where Aya receives a much greater %age of damage increase)
« Last Edit: April 18, 2011, 08:20:35 PM by NeoSerela »
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tempest590

  • What I say is fiction.
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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #966 on: April 18, 2011, 08:42:27 PM »
Hi guys, I'm new here! And I just finished this game, too. Yikes is was hard. x.x I'll admit, pressed for time, I cheat-engined the final boss in to oblivion. I have to say my favorite character was Chen. She was my main nuker, to be honest. She dealt more damage to bosses than other heavy hitters like Wriggle poison or even Eiki in the end thanks to that incredible speed.

Well, I have new game +, and I want to use it for some fun and make a let's play of it, seeing parallaxal did it. I want to make a catch and only use the first 12 characters I start out with, 10 of which are voted by the audience. Unfortunately, I'm new to youtube and my video won't get many views for a while, if at all. Any suggestions?

this is the intro to the let's play if anyone wants to see.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2011, 08:48:35 PM by tempest590 »

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #967 on: April 19, 2011, 12:45:36 AM »
Oooh...

I'd vote for Yuka, since she's cool and I've never really used her.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

tempest590

  • What I say is fiction.
  • If it doesn't make sense, it's a fact.
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #968 on: April 19, 2011, 01:24:55 AM »
Thanks.  :]

Also, does anyone know how to hack attributes like level-up difficulty, or how proficient a character is in an attribute overall? Like, I want to make Tenshi stronger in attacking for my non "let's play" file. I can't scream ROAD ROLLER for her attack if it only bonks them on the head slightly.

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #969 on: April 19, 2011, 01:29:21 AM »
Tenshi's attack decent enough to the point where you can build her as an attacker and get small mileage against nature weak things.  She'll be absolutely useless the rest of the time, but that's one option...

IMO, Yuuka would be great, if Marisa's Master Spark didn't outclass her's, and if Suwako didn't exist.  She's a great character, but just outclassed.  She does play a nice support attacker with her two multi-target nature spells though.

I vote for Meiling.  Like Parallaxal says - "It doesn't matter who the rest of the team is, you can probably beat the game as long as China's in slot 1".
And also a vote for Komachi if you plan to take on Shikieiki, cuz HP Meiling is inefficient.  Also - obvious Alice and Nitori votes.

J.O.B

  • YOU CAN'T MAKE ME CHANGE
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #970 on: April 19, 2011, 02:34:47 AM »
I vote for Iku without using Thundercloud Stickleback :D

What should I do first now?
Mokou, Yuyuko, Great Stamp, Flandre or grinding on 16F till I'm able to beat the enemies quite easily?

RegalStar

  • Envoy of Balance
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #971 on: April 19, 2011, 04:22:17 AM »
If you can make it to 16F, you should be more than ready for Mokou, Yuyu, (Orin) and Great Stamp. You should be ready for Flandre too, but since I dislike luck-based damage races I tend to fight her right before Yukari (by which point I completely own her with no strings involved).

J.O.B

  • YOU CAN'T MAKE ME CHANGE
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #972 on: April 19, 2011, 04:28:48 AM »
Mokou absolutely murders me with Fujiyama but by the time i even get to that phase most of my nukers are already dead.
Yuyu is a Whore.
Great Stamp has too powerful physical attacks at the moment.
And Flandre I'm not even gonna attempt anytime soon.

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #973 on: April 19, 2011, 04:44:52 AM »
Mokou absolutely murders me with Fujiyama but by the time i even get to that phase most of my nukers are already dead.
Yuyu is a Whore.
Great Stamp has too powerful physical attacks at the moment.
And Flandre I'm not even gonna attempt anytime soon.

Great Stamp is actually a wuss with the right team.  Have two physically durable characters ready, Meiling is probably the best for this, as well, crank their Nature resists, and smash Great Stamp's attack and speed stats.  Then, when it's safe (AKA after every great earthquake, use one slot to send in a switch in/out character for healing or support, and the other slot for Reisen, who maintains the debuffs and deals passable damage at the same time.  When he's about to attack again, switch out any non-tanks.  Be sure to bring two sacrificial girls to grab open slots.

RegalStar

  • Envoy of Balance
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #974 on: April 19, 2011, 05:24:42 AM »
Well, i don't know about your team composition, but both Mokou and Great Stamp has 0 debuff resistance (in Mokou's case, only before resurrection). If you have Alice, Eirin or Reisen, lower their offensive stats help out a lot. For Mokou's Fujiyama Volcano, just stuff a couple of LOVE machine 3322s on someone with good HP and send her in before Volcano hits, which will empty Mokou's action gauge, so you can just Spark her afterwards or just send in a couple of good nukes and take down that 92000 HP she's got left.

As for Yuyu, I don't even know what's so hard about her. She only really tries to kill you once every three turns, and with SPI affinity and DTH resists those attacks are weak too, and she has easily exploited weaknesses to boot. If you don't have many Rings of Hades or something (Forbidden Tablets and especially Tellina Shell Necklaces are just as good substitutes), go kill stuff on 7F for a while.

Pesco

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #975 on: April 19, 2011, 08:05:50 AM »
Thanks.  :]

Also, does anyone know how to hack attributes like level-up difficulty, or how proficient a character is in an attribute overall? Like, I want to make Tenshi stronger in attacking for my non "let's play" file. I can't scream ROAD ROLLER for her attack if it only bonks them on the head slightly.

Most of the data on the characters is available on the wiki.

There's 2 ways to hack the characters. First is to use Cheat Engine and edit their stats in-game. I have a list with the order their stats and proficiencies come in. I'll post that when I get home. The other way is to use a hex editor to modify the save file. I don't do it that way because I simply don't know how.

The Greatest Dog

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #976 on: April 19, 2011, 08:37:08 AM »
Haha, wow, just got into this again.

And NG+ go~
Picking a team, I wanna go with (and what I'mma pump with some skill points)...
DEF Remilia (with some sp into ATK)
DEF Wriggle (with some sp into SPD)
ATK Komachi (into HP, naturally)
ATK Aya (into SPD)
ATK Nitori (into more ATK~)
MND Minoriko (into MAG)
MND Iku (into SPD)
MND Kaguya (with MAG)
MAG Rumia (into more MAG~)
MAG Reisen (into some SPD)
MAG Mokou (into MND/DEF)
MAG Reimu (into MND)

I want to believe it could work, but... I dunno how well it'll do when I reach OMGKILLITNOW phases like Mokou's Resurrection...
A buffed Aya and Nitori could probably finish the job, but it doesn't have the same effect as Master Spark.
Minoriko, Iku, and Kaguya could probably more than effectively handle any MAG attack.
Rumia, Minoriko, and Reimu can all function as healers, buffers.
Rumia, Reisen, Kaguya, and hopefully Mokou can be effective mages.
Defensive Wriggle for tanking, poisoning, and switching out. Defensive Remilia can toss out Gungnirs every so often as well, and Komachi can serve as an offtank.
Iku for obvious reasons.

J.O.B

  • YOU CAN'T MAKE ME CHANGE
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #977 on: April 19, 2011, 08:37:55 AM »
I finally beat Mokou, and with only 2 or 3 casualities :D
The problem with Yuyuko is that I take alot of damage, especially when she uses her spear card.
I could probably do with upping my SPI affinity though...
I tried her again just then and I was down to Patchy my last char and she kept taking zero damage until she finally used her spear card(Patchy was at 1hp too).

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #978 on: April 19, 2011, 05:59:04 PM »
Swallowtail Lance has great mind piercing, so.. yeah.  Even with buffs Patchy's going to take a bit of damage from it unless someone is in front of her eating hits.

Alice and Yuugi are godlike for this battle.  Alice especially since with some DTH-resist and Spirit Affinity gear, once she's buffed up, she can just sit in front and spam Return Inanimateness for some pretty godly damage.  Yuugi does more damage per hit of KOi3S, but can't take Yuyuko's spells at all.

tempest590

  • What I say is fiction.
  • If it doesn't make sense, it's a fact.
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #979 on: April 19, 2011, 06:22:36 PM »
I had Komachi tank yuyuko with Alice and patchouli in the back. Meiling was wearing nothing but death resistance gear, in the second slot, healing when needed. I switched out characters every now and then to have Reimu or Ran buff everyone. I'd sneak Yuugi or Nitori in every now and then, and I beat her by the skin of my teeth. It was a fun fight.

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #980 on: April 19, 2011, 06:33:22 PM »
Haha, wow, just got into this again.

And NG+ go~
Picking a team, I wanna go with (and what I'mma pump with some skill points)...
DEF Remilia (with some sp into ATK)
DEF Wriggle (with some sp into SPD)
ATK Komachi (into HP, naturally)
ATK Aya (into SPD)
ATK Nitori (into more ATK~)
MND Minoriko (into MAG)
MND Iku (into SPD)
MND Kaguya (with MAG)
MAG Rumia (into more MAG~)
MAG Reisen (into some SPD)
MAG Mokou (into MND/DEF)
MAG Reimu (into MND)

I want to believe it could work, but... I dunno how well it'll do when I reach OMGKILLITNOW phases like Mokou's Resurrection...
A buffed Aya and Nitori could probably finish the job, but it doesn't have the same effect as Master Spark.
Minoriko, Iku, and Kaguya could probably more than effectively handle any MAG attack.
Rumia, Minoriko, and Reimu can all function as healers, buffers.
Rumia, Reisen, Kaguya, and hopefully Mokou can be effective mages.
Defensive Wriggle for tanking, poisoning, and switching out. Defensive Remilia can toss out Gungnirs every so often as well, and Komachi can serve as an offtank.
Iku for obvious reasons.

Mokou's pretty freaking bulky for an offensive character, and since you have Iku, she'll be fine, for the most part.  Kaguya, I'm not quite as sure about, but she'll be guaranteed to deal acceptable damage due to mind ignoring magic.

I also think you're underestimating Nitori, since Master Spark isn't really much stronger unless it's full-charged or the boss is weak to it.   Maybe a different physical wall than Wriggle might help your team more, but I realized it's pretty defensive, so Wriggle is probably one of the better ones anyways.

tempest590

  • What I say is fiction.
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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #981 on: April 19, 2011, 08:59:01 PM »
You all had to mention mokou, didn't you? My fight with her lasted so long I felt I needed my own hourai elixir just to finish it. Surprisingly, I couldn't outdamage her before she used her volcano, but was able to kill her with China in desperation. The fight with her doesn't take as much strategy as it does patience. I dislike that fight.

And only 2 more votes until I can start my let's play, yay~! I'm wondering how I'll do with my current lineup, though.

Rinnousuke, Patchouli, Komachi, Yuyuko, Yuuka, Meiling, Iku, and Renko... then I'll have 2 more voted by users, and 2 more by me. I'm definately going to need another nuke and healer/buffer, hopefully. But, since I already have China and Iku both, that will make using Iku easie-
Quote from: J.O.B.
I vote for Iku without using Thundercloud Stickleback :D

....DARNED YOU J.O.B.! ...But then again, it would definitely make for an interesting playthrough, I seriously wonder if I should do that. If anything, my team is full of debuffers. It'll make the fight with eientei a lot harder than I anticipated, unless I can keep them pinned down long enough with renko and Komachi. I'm really looking forward to this!
« Last Edit: April 19, 2011, 09:08:25 PM by tempest590 »

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #982 on: April 19, 2011, 09:08:13 PM »
If you try to debuff her, she starts spamming Tsuki no Iwakasa's Curse, which causes the fight to drag on for a really long time.  If you don't debuff her stats though, it's a relatively fast fight.

Parallaxal

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #983 on: April 19, 2011, 09:19:13 PM »
If you try to debuff her, she starts spamming Tsuki no Iwakasa's Curse, which causes the fight to drag on for a really long time.  If you don't debuff her stats though, it's a relatively fast fight.

I believe that only happens if you debuff her SPD. It's perfectly fine to debuff her ATK and MAG and still escape Tsuki no Iwakasa's Curse. And if you set up your team to heavily resist WND and debuffs, even the Curse isn't that much of a threat.

Keep in mind that Boss Mokou is totally different from playable Mokou in terms of her damage formulas. Nearly everything she has is actually physical and ATK-based, rather than MAG-based. Only the Curse (composite) and Flame Wind (MAG) are not purely physical. Yes, even Fujiyama Volcano is considered physical, for some reason. That makes debuffing ATK a very useful thing to do, which is why I actually managed to get a lot of mileage out of Eirin on the runs where I was using her. Mercury Sea is both CLD-elemental (so it does double damage to Mokou) and can debuff her ATK.

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #984 on: April 19, 2011, 09:19:47 PM »
You can, however, take Tsuki no Iwakasa's Curse as a blessing, if you provide debuff/wind sponges, as she will do nothing but spam it after you debuff most of her stats.  Then, just bring attackers whenever it's safe and buff them when it's safe, and blast her away.

....DARNED YOU J.O.B.! ...But then again, it would definitely make for an interesting playthrough, I seriously wonder if I should do that. If anything, my team is full of debuffers. It'll make the fight with eientei a lot harder than I anticipated, unless I can keep them pinned down long enough with renko and Komachi. I'm really looking forward to this!

Iku is definitely usable as an offensive mage.  She is like Mokou, but with better durability, better secondary effects, but is limited by having only Wind to use the entire game and not having a spell as strong as Fujiyama Volcano.   

If I'm allowed to vote again, I vote for Minoriko as your healer.  Mind-tanking Harvest Goddess for the win!

Pesco

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #985 on: April 19, 2011, 09:21:20 PM »
Rumia as your healer because I'm a jerk :V

NEETori

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #986 on: April 19, 2011, 09:31:19 PM »
Rumia as your healer because I'm a jerk :V

Hey, Rumia is an excellent healer with Iku sup-
Oh right.   :V

RegalStar

  • Envoy of Balance
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #987 on: April 19, 2011, 10:26:46 PM »
Use Sanae.

I've always wondered what good is Sanae for (compared to Minoriko at least), so show me  :D

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #988 on: April 19, 2011, 11:42:48 PM »
Pfft. Use Yuuka for healing. Period.

tempest590

  • What I say is fiction.
  • If it doesn't make sense, it's a fact.
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 6F
« Reply #989 on: April 19, 2011, 11:56:33 PM »
and with that, I have enough suggestions to start my run!

final team: Rinnousuke, Patchouli, Komachi, Yuyuko, Yuuka, Meiling, Iku, Renko, Rumia, and Sanae from audience votes. :) I only used the first people selected to prevent bias on my part.

The two I'll add in are Aya and Utsuho. Our loveable ditzy hellraven will be like youmu early on, only having one nuke or so per fight, but as things progress she'll be able to add fire coverage where needed. I have better choices, but these two birdies will make things more interesting. Preferably, I'd rather use Chen and Nitori. Both of which can act as reliable nukes. But, I want this playthrough to be as fun as possible for the viewers as well, rather than a simple playthrough that they've already done themselves.

This will give me coverage in Spi, Mys, Fire, Earth, water, wind, piercing, debuffs, and healing. I lack reliable nukes or party buffs, but the massive amount of solo buffs and debuffs I have at my disposal will work well.

As special challenges, I will avoid thundercloud stickleback at all costs, but I may break this promise later on when things get more hairy. Rumia will most definitely play a good healer role when buffed. As an added bonus, made by myself, I will reduce the amount of characters I use when I start out, only introducing more as I progress. This way, the game will be just as difficult to me, at least for the most part, as it would normally be for most other players starting out. Once I introduce a character to my team, I may not replace them with another character.

Quote from: RegalStar
Sanae vs Minoriko
Sanae is more of a trash-cleaner on some floors, and can buff all stats as well as heal. Minoriko has a very inexpensive and fast heal, can buff defenses by 50% on a single character, but only has very weak attacks against foes. She's a dedicated white mage, whereas Sanae is more versatile.

Quote from: Dr.Strafe
Yuuka healer
I'm loaded with healers. Yuuka will likely be a situational healer, focusing more on nature spam.


wish me luck guys, the runthrough will begin tomorrow!