Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread

[Ghaleon]

Ghaleon, I may not have

Spoiler:

Sanae

, but have you compared her MND to that of your other mage-like chars, such as Marisa, Patchy and

Spoiler:

Alice

? Also, how is her DEF compared to hybrid-chars like Reimu? Even if she boasts good Defensive stats for a Squishy, how much better are they?

Reimu is like that too, for me right now. Reimu's Defensive stats are good, but her DEF is peanuts when compared to Remi and Meiling, and her MND is similarly peanuts when compared to Marisa and Patchy. Defensive stats can be good/ok, yet still suck compared to anyone meant to take that sort of attack

I'm not comparing her to Reimu. Reimu is like a caster tank. I'm comparing her to characters with worse defensive stats in general like minn-however you spell it, or marisa, or kaguya, the squishier casters...who for some reason, don't seem as squishy.

[AlexX Unlimited]

Yeah, its official: I can't beat bitch on the 10th floor. I brought out characters from storage just to cut her stats and keep her under the influence of poison and paralysis best I could. She responded by promptly one-shotting the ones debuffing her. Youmu still did an amazing zero damage after all those debuffs.

Furthermore, nobody but a decently buffed Meiling can survive her nuking attack. Not even my other tanks are capable of surviving the attack for some reason no matter how much I buff them.

EDIT: I'm starting to think the problem is me more than anything, because I can't beat her OR the storyline boss team despite now being above the reccomended levels for facing them.

[RainfallYoshi]

AlexX: You are now at the same wall I was facing before. The best advice I can give is to keep trying. Keep Yuugi in reserve when you manage to land any def debuffs on the boss, she's rather vulnerable to fire.

[trancehime]

Yeah, its official: I can't beat bitch on the 10th floor. I brought out characters from storage just to cut her stats and keep her under the influence of poison and paralysis best I could. She responded by promptly one-shotting the ones debuffing her. Youmu still did an amazing zero damage after all those debuffs.

Furthermore, nobody but a decently buffed Meiling can survive her nuking attack. Not even my other tanks are capable of surviving the attack for some reason no matter how much I buff them.

EDIT: I'm starting to think the problem is me more than anything, because I can't beat her OR the storyline boss team despite now being above the reccomended levels for facing them.

Did you know? She's weak to Wind.

Use defense ignoring attacks!

[AlexX Unlimited]

Did you know? She's weak to Wind.

All wind attacks I use seem to do a flat-out 0 damage... =/

Use defense ignoring attacks!

I do!

Knockout in Three Steps: 0 damage
God's Karma Blade: 0 damage
Ray Gun: 0 damage
Fantasy Seal: 0 damage
Mountain Breaker: 0 damage
Asteroid Belt: 0 damage
Little Legion: 0 damage
Dragon-bitch's pierce move I forget the name of: 0 damage
Silent Selene: ~500 (not k, normal five hundred or so)
Buffed-up Phoenix Wing Spread: ~5000 for about 3 turns

Note that after State of Enlightenment, those last two attacks cease to do damage and I've effectively lost. Furthermore, attackers specifically there to debuff her (Cirno, etc.) are apparently prioritized by her AI, so even if they're in the very last slot she will one-shot them once she notices what they're trying to do.

[Pesco]

Conc. Spark?

How's the equipment you're going into the fight with?

[AlexX Unlimited]

Conc. Spark?

3 concentrated spark = 0 damage if I can't fire it off before Focus. I.e. it has to be set up and let loose at the right time.

How's the equipment you're going into the fight with?

Everyone has stuff to boost their best stats (so Chen has strength and speed boosters and Meiling has tank boosters). Is there anything I should be focusing on in particular?

EDIT: YE GODS THAT WAS PAINFUL

I lost all my debuffers but (ironically) the one lowering her defense due to being specifically targetted, and she probably only survived the single-target move thanks to golden bitch buffing her defenses. Once again Chen was my main damage-dealer, utilizing her self-buff best as possible while dragonbitch lowered her defenses to try and keep the damage putput best possible. I managed to pull off one 3-concentrated Master Spark at a time when her mind buffs were at their lowest, which was probably key to victory (though Chen was still the one to land the finishing blow).

[Pesco]

I don't really see what you could be doing wrong.

Share the save file so we can take a closer look? I won't be able to help you until I get home though, phoneposting etc...

[AlexX Unlimited]

My big issue was her using that single-target rock throw move, because its capable of one-shotting absolutely anyone (including Meiling). She also loved opening by one-shotting the person in the second slot, which was usually Reimu or drunken-bitch.

I pretty much lucked out this time because she used State of Enlightenment a couple times in a row, which gave me time to have Meiling focus a bit (had to have enough for Colorful Rain at all times with green bitch dead (another victim of that rock drop move, albeit not on turn 1)), prep Marisa's Master Spark, debuff with dragonbitch, and prepare Chen for the next set of phoenix wings. She also didn't choose to spam her rock drop instakill like she did on a couple occasions. I had another 3-concentrated Spark in reserve, so if Chen didn't kill her and she focused again I could most likely have benched Chen and dragonbitch, had Meiling eat the move, then let loose with Marisa once the storm had ended. In short, I got extremely lucky.

Now I just hope this girl can help me against the boss trio I need to face to get on with the story...

[Pesco]

Before she self buffs, you don't have any problem dealing damage, right? I think you'd need to pack as much dps in that time as possible to put her in SoE/Focus lock.

[AlexX Unlimited]

Before she self buffs, you don't have any problem dealing damage, right? I think you'd need to pack as much dps in that time as possible to put her in SoE/Focus lock.

Yeah, but the problem was that when I kept her that way she'd spam World Creation Press (the heavy-hitting rock move) or Sword of Enlightenment, which can instakill like half my team members.

I focused more on physical spells after she began focus spamming (since it doesn't buff her Def unless she uses State of Enlightenment specifically) and debuffing for sake of said physical spells, though I still ended up losing drunken bitch, green bitch, and Cirno a lot earlier than I'd have liked thanks to her rock smashing (an Icicle Fall after Focusing would have made prepping much, much easier).

Anyway, I'm on my way to taking on the trio to see if she helps make the fight any easier. Wish me luck, and lets hope the new girl can stand up to her role of leading the team against the 3-way onlsaught.

EDIT: Yup... Back to grinding. At least I have a new character to grind with, though...

[MysTeariousYukari]

Ok, the 10F-12F ordeal is driving me up the wall D:

Spoiler:

I already have the Green switch ON/whatever lets you pass the green things. How do I get to the others? Also where is that 10-butterfly girl, Tenshi or whatever?

Edit: I have gone everywhere I can currently, that I know of, in

Spoiler:

the 10F-12F ordeal and the paths are all blocked.

Halp?

[trancehime]

Yeah, but the problem was that when I kept her that way she'd spam World Creation Press (the heavy-hitting rock move) or Sword of Enlightenment, which can instakill like half my team members.

You need to twink better, is my guess. Most of her moves, at their most powerful, would 3HKO my characters, and would barely tink against China.

[Krimmydoodle]

Ok, the 10F-12F ordeal is driving me up the wall D:

Spoiler:

I already have the Green switch ON/whatever lets you pass the green things. How do I get to the others? Also where is that 10-butterfly girl, Tenshi or whatever?

Edit: I have gone everywhere I can currently, that I know of, in

Spoiler:

the 10F-12F ordeal and the paths are all blocked.

Halp?

If you've "gone everywhere you can currently", and you haven't reached the boss, you're not thinking hard enough.  If you haven't already been doing so, make sure you take notes on where the various colored gates and switches are.  Here's what I recall to be the general idea for exploring the dungeon.

Spoiler:

Find the red switch and the green switch.  You'll find the red switch if you take the southwest stairs from 10F->11F and search north from there. 

Find the blue switch.  To get to the blue switch, take the northeast stairs from 10F->11F, then find another stairway northwest from there to get to 12F.  You need to hit the blue switch to pass the blue gate that's south of the 10F entrance. 

*Note the inverted blue gate (in other words, a gate that you can only pass if the blue switch is off) that's just past this blue gate.  I'll explain its significance later, but ignore it for now.

Explore enough past that blue gate, and you'll eventually hit a relay point on 12F.  That's right, that's only the halfway point.  From here, there's two paths you can take.  One with all three colors of standard gates, and one with an inverted red gate.  I recommend you first take the path with the standard gates, as you likely have all three switches already on anyway.  Note that, if you don't have all three switches on, there's an "all-on" switch to the left.  It only goes one way though, as it can't turn everything off.

Past the three gates is the worst part of the dungeon.  Note that for each color, there is another switch in this area, which has the same functionality of the three colored switches found previously in the dungeon.  This part has two sections.  There's an inverted green gate to the north, and an absolute mess of gates everywhere else.  Passing the inverted green gate is simple once you find the new green switch in this area of the dungeon.

As for the absolute mess of gates, you need to find the green switch and turn it off.  There's another inverted green gate somewhere that blocks the blue switch, and you need to hit that.  Then you need to backtrack to the green switch and turn it on, and return toward the blue switch, where the red switch will be lying behind a green gate and an inverted blue gate.  Then there's an inverted blue gate and an inverted red gate that block one of the locks on the 12F door.  Remember that this entire thing has to be done in one session, as the three gates at the relay point require you to hit the all-on switch and reset this entire thing.  Make sure everyone in your chosen 12 are leveled up and can stand to fight the trash on this floor, as you'll likely have your best characters running out of TP by the time you're done.

Since, after this entire ordeal, the red switch should be off, you can explore the area beyond the inverted red gate next to the relay point after all that.

Hopefully, if you're diligent enough in your exploration, you'll find all four of the locks on the 12F door, and be able to promptly get your ass kicked by the boss fight just behind that door.

*Remember the inverted blue gate I mentioned?  Beyond this inverted blue gate is an inverted green gate and an inverted red gate, and there lies Tenshi.  To get there, you'll have to have all three switches off, and backtrack to that point from the 12F relay point.

tl;dr: You're not stuck.  Look harder.

[MysTeariousYukari]

Thanks big Krim:D

Now for the remainder of whats left >_> D:

Edit:

Spoiler:

I just defeated Sanae's Foe and got Sanae to join me:D

[AlexX Unlimited]

You need to twink better, is my guess.

I don't like farming bosses for drops and I don't want to have to restart just to get the ones I missed. >.>

[Krimmydoodle]

So, I started looking over my team and am trying to finalize the 12 I want to use for my party.  My five most seriously used characters are currently Remi, Reimu, Marisa, 15F

Spoiler:

Flan

, and 8F

Spoiler:

Sanae

. Also probably keeping their place in my party are Chen, Minoriko, and 10F

Spoiler:

Tenshi

.  The other four spots, and possibly the latter three are pending any suggestions that fellow maidens have to offer.  At this point, character testing is a very tedious process, since I have to allocate 400 levels (which in itself takes a metric assload of time) and invest skill points to get an idea of how certain characters will play out, and I'm sure different players have used different characters and can help by having already researched certain characters that I haven't.  So, if you have any recommendations for characters I've neglected, feel free to make your shout outs.

And yes, I've neglected Patchy.  She's slow as hell and dies if someone so much as sneezes on her, so bleh.

[Ghaleon]

And yes, I've neglected Patchy.  She's slow as hell and dies if someone so much as sneezes on her, so bleh.

I find patchy to be relatively hard to kill compared to your spoiler character personally. Yeah she is virtually useless on enemies that can cast "arrow rain". But... She solo'd the floor 27 boss for me! >=P. I wonder if I can make her survive a master spark from you know who too >=P.

[RainfallYoshi]

Patchy usually can tank magic like nobody else. She never took damage from any of the F12 bosses unless she got debuffed.

Anything physical, however, will probably down her in one hit.

[Suikaismaiwaifu]

Quick question about getting

Spoiler:

Suwako

, I just started and I'm only on floor 5. But I know that in order to get her you have to trigger an event with Cirno on floors 2-8. Is there another prerequisite? Because I've been all over floor 2, 3, 4, and 5 and have yet to trigger any event, the most I did was find 1 frozen frog item but that was before obtaining Cirno. Can someone tell me what I need to do please.

[Laughing Bird]

That's the trigger for the event. Just keep getting those frogs.

What's a good level average for 10-12F and boss? I just came out of 9F at level 30 and I'd like to gauge how much prep I'd need for the next section.

[Serela]

3 of the events are on Floor 8, by the way. So, when you trigger the event on Floor 8 and nothing special happens, thats normal.

As for me, grinding up to get ready for the Final Boss of 20F! Reimu Lv122 at the moment, whee~

[PinocchioFX]

30F is REALLY HARD. 

got 600k - 1.2m EXP per battle 

[MysTeariousYukari]

Quick question about getting

Spoiler:

Suwako

, I just started and I'm only on floor 5. But I know that in order to get her you have to trigger an event with Cirno on floors 2-8

On floors 2-8 their are Frozen Frogs, 8 in total, once to have all 8

Spoiler:

Suwako comes and attacks you, I'd avoid getting #8 until you are level 40~, with Remi and Patchy, not Reimu:P

I hope that helps you out

What's a good level average for 10-12F and boss? I just came out of 9F at level 30 and I'd like to gauge how much prep I'd need for the next section.

Sorry to say, but you should probly aim for 33+ for the start of the floors, preferably 35+, but 30+ is fine as well, and you may need something like 45+ for the boss. when I say 33+, 35+ and 45+, I mean that should be chars like Remi and Patchy, who seem to level up a bit slower then chars like Reimu. I hope that helps you out as well:D

[Ghaleon]

That's the trigger for the event. Just keep getting those frogs.

What's a good level average for 10-12F and boss? I just came out of 9F at level 30 and I'd like to gauge how much prep I'd need for the next section.

I really don't remember, but it takes a really really long time to get to that boss for those floors (compared to previous floors that is). I found that just by doing the floor totally I was already high enough level to do the boss, I didn't use any guides or whatever though, but I didn't get TOO lost.

[trancehime]

30F is REALLY HARD. 

got 600k - 1.2m EXP per battle 

:3 Yes it is really hard. Took me a while to get the hang of it. Fighting

Spoiler:

***The Victor***

for the 7th time!! Level 1000-ish right now

I don't like farming bosses for drops and I don't want to have to restart just to get the ones I missed. >.>

Not equipment. I mean twink your Skill EXP use better.

[AlexX Unlimited]

Not equipment. I mean twink your Skill EXP use better.

All the characters I'm using have at least 30/35 in their most important stats. I'd probably have more, but I also invested in characters I was using short-term because A. I didn't know I would only be using them temporarily, and B. not investing in them would have just made things more difficult compared to giving them a decent boost in their main stats.

[Pesco]

I think your SKP investment might have been spread too thin there. I focused on getting Patchy to level 100 MAG, and she got there by the time I was on 9F. Designated damage dealer has to do her job .

[AlexX Unlimited]

Either way this still means I've got a lot of grinding to do...

Any advice for which floor to go with?

[Pesco]

Where are you again? If you've got 13F open, farm it for Blue Sabers. If not, 10F has the least annoying enemies. Unless you are faster than the tops, I'd ignore 12F. 11F is just all kinds of meh.