Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ～ Double Dealing Character released!

[BT]

Because the arrows make you think they're small and then make you think they're big and really they're not that big at all. You could make some crazy squeezes in Nue's arrow rain spell in TD Extra.

Just a comparison, I got a timeout of the backwards arrow spell in like three tries while a timeout of the jellybeans spell took me ~250 tries.

e: link

[GuppyForce]

Funny enough, I find Seija's first spellcard much harder to deal with than when she flips things. It reminds me of Reimu's "Danmaku Barrier" spellcard from Imperishable Night - another clearly easy spellcard that I always have trouble with. The arrows that rise from below, though, not much of a problem. No idea why.

I actually find the opposite to be true for me. I don't have that much trouble with the midboss card unless I accidentally smash into Seija but the arrow card is quite a challenge for me (though it is a fun one). I'm playing on normal mode though so it might be different

[Black Mage]

Funny enough, I find Seija's first spellcard much harder to deal with than when she flips things. It reminds me of Reimu's "Danmaku Barrier" spellcard from Imperishable Night - another clearly easy spellcard that I always have trouble with. The arrows that rise from below, though, not much of a problem. No idea why.

The worst part of this one is that you can't dodge everything by just going left or right on higher difficulties, from what I've seen on replays. The one where she completely flips the screen you can pretty much always employ the same strategy and succeed, as there's not much reaction involved, at least on normal.

[Serela]

Marisa go home you're drunk

[Black Mage]

Marisa go home you're drunk

Now imagine if the center laser adjusted itself on enemies and locked on then if you focused. That'd make a pretty cool shot type. And it'd pierce stuff, obviously.

I miss Marisa piercing stuff.

Anyway, what's up with Marisa always bugging something with her shots? I had misdirect lasers on TH13 sometimes, too.

[ToyoRai]

We Non-Directonal Laser now

[Aba Matindesu!]

Anyway, what's up with Marisa always bugging something with her shots? I had misdirect lasers on TH13 sometimes, too.

I got a laser to bug out in UFO while I was playing with Cheat Engine :V

[Nyyl]

I noticed, Sukuna seems to lack the immunity to bombs on her final spellcard :v

She gets armor during bombs, much like Utsuho during her final card

[wailofthebanshee]

Ok, so I'm really rusty at STGs and I can't even beat stage 5 normal right now, but I have this to say about the game:
Best touhou since Mountain of Faith.
Best music since Subterranean Animism.

[Mach131]

I'm not sure if it's just me, but I think I found a bug on Seija's first two flipping spells. If you pause, Alt+enter to windowed mode, and resume, the controls go back to normal.

[BT]

I'm not sure if it's just me, but I think I found a bug on Seija's first two flipping spells. If you pause, Alt+enter to windowed mode, and resume, the controls go back to normal.

Oh dear lord this sounds horrible.

[nintendonut888]

I just did some testing, and lo and behold he/she is right. However, it will still be an obvious cheat in replays, since doing this would extend the "actual time" by about 13 seconds longer than the "in-game time" clock. Still, this will be interesting for practice purposes.

[EthanSilver]

I'm not sure if it's just me, but I think I found a bug on Seija's first two flipping spells. If you pause, Alt+enter to windowed mode, and resume, the controls go back to normal.

I think her last spellcard has a small issue as well. It doesn't always flip the screen again once you clear it. I've been doing it non-stop (loving this spellcard) and eventually she exploded, ran off, and didn't bother to clean up after herself >:o . Even the stage clear screen was upside-down. Unfortunately it was only in practice mode and the game fixed itself after the game ended so I don't know if it would've stuck through stage 6 had it been a full run.

...Inverted DDC. Hmm. >_>

[Sage Ω (Ultima)]

Oh my, this changes everything.

EDIT: It works on all of her spells.

[Zengeku]

Well, nothing like that is technically cheating. You are just taking advantage of a flaw in the system. I'm not sure what to think of it but then again, the gimmick itself is pretty bad so I wouldn't hold it against anyone to take whatever measures available to circumvent the issue.

[Sage Ω (Ultima)]

Actually it is cheating. Taking advantage of flaws is the basis of cheating(that's how TASs are done).

[Zil]

No, TAS's uses external tools to cheat at the game. Exploiting flaws in the game itself has been fair game since forever.

[Ginko]

I've been fooling around with stage 4 lunatic and I found that even for a relatively unskilled player, the stage portion is quite easy.

Here's a video of the path I take (No bomb, 1 derp miss). It's not specific to any shot type. Actually, most of it can be done without shooting at all.

Of course perfecting Yatsuhashi is a completely different story, and I don't have the skills for that, but if usual lunatic players can deal with her last spell, I think it can be reasonably pacifist-perfect'd.

[commandercool]

I kind of think this is different, although I can't really articulate why. Seems like something that involves alt-tabbing goes beyond flaws in the game and into manipulating things outside of the game itself. Not that I have a stake in this or really care, but intuitively it doesn't seem as fair game as something like Malice Cannon.

[nintendonut888]

I kind of think this is different, although I can't really articulate why. Seems like something that involves alt-tabbing goes beyond flaws in the game and into manipulating things outside of the game itself. Not that I have a stake in this or really care, but intuitively it doesn't seem as fair game as something like Malice Cannon.

I agree. I have nothing against using bugs or oversights in-game which break an attack, even if I don't like using them myself. But this isn't something that is based on skill or cleverness, or even exploiting a flaw in the attack; you are doing something that can not possibly be done on accident or when playing as you do the rest of the series, using a programming oversight to override an attack. You could call it legitimate all you like, but this seems to be on a different level altogether.

Well, thankfully the replays will show who uses what, so we can use our own judgement.

[Mordon]

If there was a "flaw" that you could exploit to beat the game without doing nothing, that would not be cheating? I disagree completely, the game was clearly not made to be that way. In a way exploits are still cheating.
In my opinion ANYTHING that makes you easier to control during Seija's attacks are cheating, like changing your monitor settings, rotating your monitor, rotating your head, changing your controls, Alt-tabbing to fix the screen, even pausing for no reason is unfair (and ZUN seems to agree, "please do not pause the game for any other reason than to stop playing"). Abusing MarisaB's power 3 in MoF is cheating as well.

[Sage Ω (Ultima)]

No, TAS's uses external tools to cheat at the game. Exploiting flaws in the game itself has been fair game since forever.

Exploiting flaws instead of doing it the way it was intended is considered cheating. I guess the Konami code is fair game in your eyes?

Regardless, no one would be able to tell.

[Raikaria]

Well, I've never seen those completion stats before, never found em.

Anyway, I've been seeing a lot of hate towards the Stage5 boss for 'relying on a gimmick'. But that used to be the norm for Stage 5 bosses, if I recall. Sakuya's time-stop. Youmu's slow-mo, Reisen's whole thing. Although it kind of stopped in MoF->TD, the 'Religion Arc' is over with anyway, so maybe the Gimmick-Stage 5 Bosses are back?

[Zengeku]

That gimmick is not too bad anymore. Stage 6 boss is a hundred times more idiotic.

[TheTeff007]

Well, I've never seen those completion stats before, never found em.

Anyway, I've been seeing a lot of hate towards the Stage5 boss for 'relying on a gimmick'. But that used to be the norm for Stage 5 bosses, if I recall. Sakuya's time-stop. Youmu's slow-mo, Reisen's whole thing. Although it kind of stopped in MoF->TD, the 'Religion Arc' is over with anyway, so maybe the Gimmick-Stage 5 Bosses are back?

Zombie Fairies on SA? Curvy Lasers on UFO? Those count as gimmick, more or less.

[Zengeku]

Yeah sure and next game, the gimmick will be bosses firing bullets at you.

[Formless God]

you don't need to cheat to do any of Seija's stuff holy shit pls git gud

[Zengeku]

I would support a hack that shrinks Marisa and Sakuya's hitboxes on that one spell though lol

[Necrotek]

No, TAS's uses external tools to cheat at the game. Exploiting flaws in the game itself has been fair game since forever.

Actually, TAS doesn't produce any changes in game mechanics and it doesn't violate game memory (though it can be read), it uses only those game flaws which already exist in the game. Almost everything you see in TAS videos is technically possible to be reproduced by a mere human without any external tools.

[Serela]

Actually, TAS doesn't produce any changes in game mechanics and it doesn't violate game memory (though it can be read), it uses only those game flaws which already exist in the game. Almost everything you see in TAS videos is technically possible to be reproduced by a mere human without any external tools.

Slowing the game to a crawl and possibly even rewinding it to get better results is very definitely "cheating".

Legit slowdown is also totally cheating if it's a really significant amount, same thing.

Yes, TAS isn't hacking the game and can be a totally cool category by itself, but it's definitely a form of cheating. If someone TAS'd in a competition would you allow it to count?