Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou 8F (Read 264797 times)

Ghaleon · « **Reply #360 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:07:42 AM »

Quote from: Zil on April 15, 2012, 10:00:02 PM

I would think that Remilia's a good enough tank that you don't need another one out, unless you mean you have Remilia built for damage instead of durability.

Problem is China is pretty much the unopposed best tank. She can tank anything tankable in the game and tank it well. The only exception would be eiki's final judgement, which nobody can tank except komachi. But I don't think you're really SUPPOSED to tank that so much as just kill her before she kills you...kinda like yuugi at half health. But slot 2 still needs a fairly tanky character because they still take 80% of the damage slot one takes from physical row attacks, and they're still very likely to eat strong single target attacks like steel slasher, triple slash, etc on a regular basis against enemies who have such moves. Half-tanky characters like mnd-reimu, kanako, eirin, etc are still very susceptible of getting 1-shot by such moves, not to mention they cannot eat more than one strong row attack without a dedicated healer all the time. China doesn't need a dedicated healer ALL the time, she's quite capable of surviving on her own for awhile, but many people on a strong physical boss can't make the same claim, not even in slot 2.

Remi IMO is however since curse also buffs her defenses (And they're both good at default, as is her hp). Tenshi is too but tenshi is so useless at anything other than tanking it's really a wasted slot if she's not in the front. Basically, you can make do with other people sure, but it's just so much more safe to have a party with only 2 squishies instead of 3. A Defense build youmu/yuugi can do the job but they're both way too squishy mnd-wise to be there unless the boss is pure physical only like baal avatar (that dark spell doesn't count, it's super feeble). IMO the number of characters who can take multiple frequent physical AND magical hits like a champ AND provide something not-situationally useful other than switching is really low, and I don't think anybody does it as well as remi.

Pesco · « **Reply #361 on:** April 16, 2012, 05:35:23 AM »

Slot 2 Wriggle :smug:

I have no name · « **Reply #362 on:** April 16, 2012, 09:12:54 PM »

The Hibachi's are annoying.

My strategy basically falls apart if I lose Marisa until she deals 800k-ish to Hibachi #1. I could have won last time except I mis-timed a switch and lost Ran+Kanako, removing the last of my magic damage dealers. I can take out either one, but never both since after taking out one results in Dual Funeral Washing Machine TPK.

Is there any way to beat these guys without relying on ungodly amounts of luck in who gets targeted? and which one is the better choice to take out first?

Serela · « **Reply #363 on:** April 17, 2012, 02:13:06 AM »

As long as you're preparing for it in advance (Pumping Meiling's hp skp more then you otherwise would, start to give her some levelup bonuses in HP) and then drop your boost HP bonus gear on her, you can actually get Meiling up high enough to take hits from Last Judgment without overgrinding, without too much trouble :V

I have no name · « **Reply #364 on:** April 17, 2012, 06:33:00 PM »

Quote from: I have no name on April 16, 2012, 09:12:54 PM

Is there any way to beat these guys without relying on ungodly amounts of luck in who gets targeted? and which one is the better choice to take out first?

ok, I beat them.
My opening party was Remilia Rinnosuke Ran Kaguya, with Rinnosuke going 3rd after the Hibachis. On the 20% of attempts where everyone actually got to move, I had Remilia switch herself for Flandre and Ran for Marisa before using World Shaking Miilitary Rule. I then switched out Flandre for Meiling using Kaguya and usually Marisa swapped for Reimu to heal, but I didn't need to this fight, so I used Master Spark. From this point the fight went pretty much as planned, I took out the physical one, fired off another Master Spark...for only 350k as opposed to 650k. I had Kaguya use Hourai barrage for 250k but it didn't die. At this point I was in a panicked frenzy trying to have either Kanako (sniped), Kaguya (low health) or Marisa (no SP to start) get a turn in edgewise to kill it (I didn't know the second one got faster after the death of one until this fight), and I did using Yukari. Magic Missile ended the fight.

This was so luck based it lost most of the fun. Then again I was 5 levels under recommended.

Zil · « **Reply #365 on:** April 17, 2012, 07:08:39 PM »

I thought the point of World Shaking Military Rule was to use it at the end of the fight? Otherwise it just wears off doesn't it?

I have no name · « **Reply #366 on:** April 17, 2012, 07:10:00 PM »

Quote from: Zil on April 17, 2012, 07:08:39 PM

I though the point of World Shaking Military Rule was to use it at the end of the fight?

I thought you were supposed to open with it? Except for multi-phase bosses, then you use it before SP drain/start of final phase.

SuccinctAndPunchy · « **Reply #367 on:** April 17, 2012, 08:06:57 PM »

I always thought that you opened with World Shaking Military Rule to immediately get yourself set up against tough bosses or save it for multi-phase bosses and use it at the phase that gives you issues.

Zil · « **Reply #368 on:** April 17, 2012, 09:52:19 PM »

I would imagine it's supposed to be saved for the boss's crazy phase just before they die, otherwise it's just going to wear off and you've got Rinnosuke stuck in the front with no TP left. (I'm guessing the idea is to just let him die after that?) It's nothing that Reimu and Yukari can't give you defense-wise, and since you presumably start with nukes in the back while your support characters get everything set up I feel like the offense boost is kind of arbitrary at the start of the battle like that. Of course, I guess you could start with nukes in the field if you're insta-buffing with him, but it still feels like you're just wasting it.

Personally I think of him as a pretty wimpy character, all things considered.

Tangrelle · « **Reply #369 on:** April 17, 2012, 11:17:09 PM »

On the whole I believe Military Rule in boss battles is usually paired with Spirited Away and two nuke characters.

If the sequence is done right two fully buffed nukes get two turns really very quickly, but Parallaxal and others know how it go better than me.

Serela · « **Reply #370 on:** April 18, 2012, 03:52:07 AM »

He's a somewhat tanky character with somewhat okay damage.

If you want a defensive attacker at the point in the game you get Rinno, pick Remi or Alice or Ran or someone instead. (Alice being more back-row choice, but this is a niche role well-needed in Plus bosses) They do it better then him. Remi has no multitargets for randoms, though. Ran is -totally awesome- for that with spamming her composite (Granted that she has high offense buffs on, it's very high tier damage on a very durable character, as opposed to "decent" damage off the other two) but people seem to like using her for buffing, so.

His buff is only notably useful for grinding 20F/30F earlier/faster/easier (And you don't really need it for those, it makes you have to go back after each battle as well... but it does help for awhile), since if you use it in a boss, then you cannot switch him out ever again unless he dies.

If you'd really like to use him he's okay. But he's not exciting, trust me. I was rather underwhelmed when I used him. He was neither as durable as I hoped nor was his damage output all that great.

Ghaleon · « **Reply #371 on:** April 18, 2012, 03:15:14 PM »

Quote from: Serela on April 17, 2012, 02:13:06 AM

As long as you're preparing for it in advance (Pumping Meiling's hp skp more then you otherwise would, start to give her some levelup bonuses in HP) and then drop your boost HP bonus gear on her, you can actually get Meiling up high enough to take hits from Last Judgment without overgrinding, without too much trouble :V

That did t quite work in my last playthru. I had hp for china costing 3x more than anything else on my other characters (via spending sp on absolutely nothing but her hp for the last 2-3 floors or something) and even with the best hp gear i could get (i think it was just those 160% bodybulding ethos things) , she didnt have enough to survive most of the time (due to 22% damage deviation... Like she could take the bottom 4% or something).

Maybe you put some levelup bonuses into her hp too? Im soing that in my current playthru (about 1/5 hp, 4/5 def). Im hoping thatll make a noticeable diff.

Serela · « **Reply #372 on:** April 18, 2012, 08:32:01 PM »

Arthur's Gem or Gem of Arthorous or whatever gives more HP bonus plus big affinity boosts to help keep her health up there. And yes, I did say some levelups to HP (I basically started putting them all in HP after I started 21F; but she was pure DEF before, so.)

And yeah, it did involve a lot of HP gorging via SKP, but it's not as if the result isn't useful for the entire game. Meiling staying alive is soooo important for a boss. I didn't regret it, basically.

I have no name · « **Reply #373 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:49:38 PM »

so I'm grinding on the 25th floor (blitzed through 21-24 just seeing how high I could get and if there was a more efficient floor than 20) and I got the following drop: [attach=1]

Kaguya now hits the SPI-weak things for 7 digit damage =D

At what level should I think about fighting the Plus Disc bosses/Maribel ver 2?

EDIT: Celestial Bright Demon down. That was annoying, I ended up having to use mostly chip damage for the last 2/3 of the fight because Kaguya got Magic Drained and Marisa got KOed early. Thankfully Komachi's "nuke" is SPI element, thankfully I buffed Youmu's attack to absurd levels and thankfully I had the good sense to keep Kaguya off the field until she had enough SP for 2 Hourai Barrages.

NamelessFool · « **Reply #374 on:** April 20, 2012, 03:26:39 AM »

I'm trying to use Cheat engine to mitigate grind time by boosting exp/SP/Item droprates, but I am absolutely :] at using Cheat Engine, even after going through the tutorial and downloading the Cheat Table. I have the 3.01 ver with the Special Disk and I have the respective table for it.

Pesco · « **Reply #375 on:** April 20, 2012, 07:11:14 AM »

Droprates can't be changed. Just edit the item into your inventory.

Exp and Skp per battle can be found right after a battle. Don't press anything and search for the values while they're still there. Accept your exp/skp and the address that drops to 0 is the one you want to keep to hack the exp/skp rate.

Eilaris · « **Reply #376 on:** April 20, 2012, 02:16:02 PM »

Quote from: GamingAwesome1 on April 01, 2012, 07:31:19 PM

Throwing my own hat in the ring with regards to portrait packs.

UPDATED LINK (Now with 99% less shit Marisa and Aya images!) http://www.filefactory.com/file/17fdugvz8mxp/n/CharaGraph_Sengoku_Gensokyo_zip

A portrait pack for those who want the pretty Sengoku Gensokyo art in Labyrinth of Touhou.

The pack's a bit rough around the edges IMO (I despise Marisa's and Aya's _Stand images but I'm a complete noob with image editors and wouldn't know how to go about fixing them to make them look less...screwy).
Marisa in general is kind of annoying, her Stand images in Sengoku are wide as fuck and don't translate well in the resizing and she also has the only face picture to not have a transparent background, MARISA Y U NO CONSISTENT.

Also, a fair few characters don't have pictures by virtue of not being in the game, fill in the blanks with other packs or something.

Also, Sanae, Minoriko, Kanako, Nitori and Suwako lack X_Stand images because I couldn't find them and I'm not even sure if they exist.

Man the link went dead already

SuccinctAndPunchy · « **Reply #377 on:** April 20, 2012, 03:00:56 PM »

Quote from: Reiska on April 20, 2012, 02:16:02 PM

Man the link went dead already

OH FOR FUCK'S SAKE.

GIVE ME A MOMENT.

I will fix this shit.

EDIT: http://www.mediafire.com/?ssx7tma7o7m7bnb

AND SO I DID.

Humph. Bloody dead download links.

Eilaris · « **Reply #378 on:** April 21, 2012, 12:49:12 AM »

Awesome, thanks.

I might just have to do a third playthrough of this now. Maybe I should try and challenge myself by not using Meiling or something.

I have no name · « **Reply #379 on:** April 21, 2012, 03:17:23 AM »

Uhhh...
What kind of boss requires you to get lucky over 11 million HP that it doesn't buff its magic and then spam target alls?

Oh right, Agastobrauma on 25F.
What am I supposed to do, level grind further???

Zil · « **Reply #380 on:** April 21, 2012, 03:21:48 AM »

Am I the only one who thought he was the easiest of the plus disk bosses? I remember him being weak to deduffs or paralysis or something. He barely got any moves in.

I have no name · « **Reply #381 on:** April 21, 2012, 03:24:18 AM »

Quote from: Zil on April 21, 2012, 03:21:48 AM

Am I the only one who thought he was the easiest of the plus disk bosses? I remember him being weak to deduffs or paralysis or something. He barely got any moves in.

Flame Tyrant was PAR-locked.
This guy is vulnerable to debuffs, but when he does go he destroys my party while buffed with not a thing I can do about it. I've tried keeping his speed debuffed, I've tried nuking him, but "Strengthen Jutsu" means "you lose 4+ characters depending on what I do"

Zil · « **Reply #382 on:** April 21, 2012, 03:27:27 AM »

I don't know then. I remember keeping his speed at rock bottom and keeping him paralyzed for most of the fight. Maybe I got really lucky. :V

I have no name · « **Reply #383 on:** April 21, 2012, 03:32:10 AM »

PAR has a 10% chance to hit him. Of 20 or so chances I saw it land once last time.

Zil · « **Reply #384 on:** April 21, 2012, 04:08:56 AM »

No doubt I was spamming Diamond Blizzard, and maybe Suwako's Ring thing if I still had her then, since that's what I did to anything that wasn't immune to PAR. I don't know what to say otherwise, aside from just level up more.

Ghaleon · « **Reply #385 on:** April 21, 2012, 03:09:47 PM »

I dont recall it being that hard myself (though i know i never relied on a par strategy) I had a mnd evey level patchy for most of my games though so magic based bosses were less threatening for me.

Parallaxal · « **Reply #386 on:** April 21, 2012, 04:44:58 PM »

When I was using Meiling to tank Shikieiki's Last Judgment, I prepped in advance by pumping maybe 80 level's worth of level up bonuses into her HP, on top of all the HP skill points and HP items. In fact, I believe I started putting level bonuses into HP as soon as I decided I was going to challenge the Plus Disk with my team. I don't think you can reasonably take it if you only use skill points and items, at least not without extra level grinding.

As for Agastrobrauma, I had fun just tanking him with Iku in slot 1. Super-high MND, near invulnerability to PAR, and naturally good WND affinity? It's almost like she's tailor-made to tank that boss.

If you can fight Agastrobrauma, you should already be able to unlock Renko. Just use Renko's Debilitate to counter Strengthen Jutsu each time (or, hey, just keep applying it regularly). The great thing about Renko is that she doesn't scale with stats at all, so you don't even need to invest any skill points in her, and she'll still perform her job well enough. She just needs to be fast enough to switch in, cast Debilitate/Galaxy Stop, then switch out again. I just put her level bonuses into SPD and give her some random SPD-boosting items.

I have no name · « **Reply #387 on:** April 21, 2012, 04:48:41 PM »

I was trying that, except I can't figure out how to damage the 3rd summon from Mairbel V2.
Throwing Atlas, 0 damage, Master Spark, 0 damage...the only way I could hurt it was Kaguya-and she got sniped.

Parallaxal · « **Reply #388 on:** April 21, 2012, 04:51:09 PM »

The 3rd Summon has extremely high DEF/MND at first, but you need to wait for it to start using Rankain, which is a charging attack that takes several turns. After it uses Rankain the first time, its DEF and MND will drop to pathetic levels, giving you time to kill it ASAP before it finishes charging Rankain.

I have no name · « **Reply #389 on:** April 21, 2012, 05:58:27 PM »

Quote from: Parallaxal on April 21, 2012, 04:51:09 PM

The 3rd Summon has extremely high DEF/MND at first, but you need to wait for it to start using Rankain

Ah. Last time it used some party-all move that did 30k to everyone after heaven's Lightning x3.
This time it went straight for Rankain, I killed it before it could move again, and won with the only casualty being Remilia, to a Scourge.

EDIT:
FIVE
MINUTES
spent waiting for Meiling to get a turn against 2 Rainbow Insects. Posion immunity+0 damage from everything=very annoying when you can't die and have to wait for the 15% chance for paralysis to hit (per move) can't happen for 14 moves. This is a 9.7% chance that the string of moves will occur, assuming equal chance of every attack. The problem is that each "try" takes forever. I'm convinced Rainbow Insect's sole purpose is to be annoying.

double edit:
Shikieiki down...and I got her drop. I've gotten every drop from a plus disc boss first try so far, except for Celestial Bright Demon.