Vanilla Mafia II (Game over, town wins!)

[BT]

Meant to say HW.

[Hero999]

..Wait my story is wrong...holy shit I suck D:

@BT: So you have reread the pages a bit more, any new opinions?

[BT]

I wanted to do a bigger reread once more posts show up. If it's urgent, I can do one now.

(you're interfering with my slacking off...)

[Hero999]

@Bardiche: Inb4 you eat your words like Kitten did.

@BT: I just looked over that part, and I feel like your trying to say that you want them to do something wrong.

....

@Huh What: please clarify where I had an opinion purely due to meta? Just because I use the word does not mean that I'm using it to clear people.

(Its weekends, I want words and I want them now)

[Hero999]

... God I need to actually got to start compiling things again.

@Huh What: Why would I help town if they are trying to kill two people I believed to be town? That would be anti-town for me, and the fact that the information we actually got from Shadoweh's lynch was NILL. Please tell what kind of information we got at all from Shadoweh's lynch?

The reason I voted for you over Serela, also had part to due with the fact that OMBA was the only one aside from me to have expressed suspicion of you.

[BT]

Well, obviously, if someone does something wrong, your read on them changes. I want people to post so my read on them changes. Was this even worth explaining?

I'll get to rereading soon...

[Bardiche]

Pesco, the day is growing short. Mind sharing your opinions on who are scum, since the sheep seem to be unwilling to decide so hastily?

[Pesco]

In brief words:

I have a neutral read on HW and Dormio, which is not a good sign. I still don't like BT for not making a vote yet. I doubt he's as noob as he's claiming to be. Increasing dissatisfaction with PX. Using a meta clear on him isn't going to cut it anymore since even given the opportunity he hasn't produced.

##Vote PX

I don't have the words for a case. Deal with it.

[Kitten4u]

Dormio (0):
huh what (1): Hero999
BT (0):
Bardiche (0):
Pesco (0):
Serela (2): Dormio, PX
PX (3): Serela, JOB, Pesco
Hero999 (1): huh what
JOB (0):

Not Voting: Bardiche, BT

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.  D3 ends in ~32 hours (watch countdown).

PX is at L-2

[PX]

I'm gonna be at a wedding all day today, so I'm notngonna be able to post until the end of the day.

[BT]

The reason I haven't voted is not because I don't have choices, but because I couldn't find the best choice. Oh, and I'm not claiming to be noob, I'm claiming to lack scumhunting experience.

Let's see. We have Dormio the tunneler who won't post anything but a few posts outside of said tunneling, in which he shows that he indeed has one main suspect, before proceeding to focus only on him. Do you suspect anyone other than Serela? What do you think about me, Pesco or HW right now? Why do you feel that way?

We have PX, who has shown signs of following the thread without actually contributing anything (and by that I mean 0 content). His "cases" so far were either bandwagoning or... well, his case on Serela, which to me looks like a big "what if", seeing as most if not all of his accusations have some sort of logical explanation to them. To me it looks like making a quick case, with help from Dormio's earlier case (which may or may not have been coincidental, seeing as a Dormio-PX scumteam possibly exists), in order to create a wagon, delaying his own wagon.

And we have Hero, whose only original cases have been against HW, which I see as OMGUS (his accusations were bad regardless). Oh, and he had something against Serela here, which, like PX's case, looks pretty bad. Yeah, I'm under the impression scum are gunning for Serela as an "easy lynch" now. He didn't vote in the D2 vote "because Pesco is town and I'm giving Shadoweh the benefit of the doubt", despite not saying anything earlier (we're talking about 2-3 hours before deadline). Yeah, try convincing me this isn't avoiding the vote as a whole, you won't succeed. I still don't like the whole "lots of 'scum pointers' but no big contribution" thing. At least he's giving a bigger picture when he does that, though.

I'm leaning towards PX here. Like I pointed out earlier, he seems too defensive at times, and his "contributions" are either bad or don't exist, and this is despite actually being active. Besides, I already don't like what he's doing today. If you want to save yourself from a wagon, trying to build another one definitely isn't the town way.

##Vote PX (L-1 !!)



..oh, what a fantastic post to have cut mine. v_v

[Pesco]

And that is sheeping.

##Unvote
##Vote BT

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

I think these new meds are doing something weird to me. It's 5AM, I haven't been able to sleep and I don't feel tired at all. I guess that gives me more time for mafia!

The last one is still incredibly wrong because PX does not equal All Of My Targets and the "Whoever is Popular" applied way more to Pesco and Shadoweh then PX anyway.

>Implying that you adding words like "probably" and similar ones didn't mean that you could switch onto them whenever you wanted anyway. Especially when you used definitive terms for other people that you proclaimed as town.

The third point is still pretty wrong.

What contribution did you give outside of "Hero and PX are scum"?

And the second is wrong because I did not waffle and fence sit on them. Waffling is going back and forth between my feelings about them. I picked a solid stance and kept it. My stance on Pesco could be considered a fence sit, I guess.

Oh like I give a fuck about what the proper word is. Waffle, say nothing of any real significance. Same thing. And "probably" to you is solid when you have said things like "definitely" in regards to other people? And you admit that you did so about Pesco.

So your case sucked. Now lets get to stuff you said AFTER I called you out!
you didn't even quote or refer to my hero case anyway

>Implying that there was a hero case worth responding to.
It was, what? "Made a bad huh what case and not much else." On top of that you never explained what you thought was bad about it, just that it was bad and you wanted him lynched so hard for it. Best case amirite? :V

And Serela's activity today has been spectacular, right?
>"lol PX is scum"
>forget about Hero
>"lol OMGUS Dormio is scum"
>Secret Barrage 「And Then Will There Be None?」

Lemme tell yah a story, of how a guy had to choose or randomly kill 2 people. He loved both of them, so he decided to random kill.
The end.

The hell does this even mean?

Cut by confusion!

Oh, and BT is still the only unconfirmed.

[BT]

You didn't even "have words for a case" and you call what I'm doing sheeping? Hell, even if I was sheeping, that's not going to warrant you complete change in scumpick.

You're not even doing this subtly anymore-- you're waiting for me around the corner. And that is not town-like at all.

[Bardiche]

OK, Huh Whatty, I've read over Hero, and I can't make heads nor tails of it. It may be due to his diction or it may just be because I'm me. Why is Hero case superior to lynching Dormio or PX?

[Bardiche]

##Vote: PX
##Unvote: PX
That's where my vote is, just for clarity sake, but not putting to L-1.

[Pesco]

You didn't even "have words for a case" and you call what I'm doing sheeping? Hell, even if I was sheeping, that's not going to warrant you complete change in scumpick.

You're not even doing this subtly anymore-- you're waiting for me around the corner. And that is not town-like at all.

It does because it's proven that you make no effort to scumhunt on your own.

[BT]

So I reckon my last post just appeared out of nowhere? Or maybe I copied it from some unknown source?

Saying something like that is dumb. Claiming that it's "proven" is even dumber.

[Pesco]

If your post didn't come from nowhere, then why wait until over half the day had gone and PX was at L-2 already to vote? Your post and vote could have happened way earlier. I find it scummy that you do this every day.

[BT]

I voiced who I thought was a suspect, without deciding on which one I wanted to vote. I was not certain who I'd be voting for then, so this couldn't have happened way earlier. Not casting a vote at all would be worse, so I voted the moment I was more sure of my choice. In fact, you're the one who promped me to vote, here:

I still don't like BT for not making a vote yet.

[Bardiche]

Pesco, do you find BT scummier than PX?

[Bardiche]

Also I like how Dormio doesn't deign to respond to anything I charge him with. :V

[Pesco]

So if I didn't post at all, you weren't going to vote. Because that's textbook sheeping.

@Bard: I want BT to die first.

[BT]

No, that's not what I said. Now you're just putting words in my mouth.

I'm not going to let you polarize this day. If you keep throwing baseless accusations at me I'm just going to start ignoring them.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

I don't think so. If Hero believed both were town, then it IS right to try push another lynch into viability.

I got the impression that he was trying to avoid getting caught in the scuffle instead of trying to push his prefered lynch over the town's prefered lynches. If he wanted to push his prefered lynch into viability, he could have been tried to rally up support for Serela's death. Waiting until the last minute to say "I want a randomlynch" instead looks lazy, given that it's the inferior option and could easily result in one of Hero's two town reads or even Hero himself dying. The way he handled his defense of Pesco/Shadoweh looks more like he was trying to advantage of it than stopping it, IMO.

Pesco, how do you feel about JOB, particularly given what I said about him at the end of my post?

@Huh What: please clarify where I had an opinion purely due to meta? Just because I use the word does not mean that I'm using it to clear people.

Rescinding that attack because now I'm realizing I misread your post. <_< I thought "consistently using" said "consistent using" and that you were using meta and theory to make your decision.

OK, Huh Whatty, I've read over Hero, and I can't make heads nor tails of it. It may be due to his diction or it may just be because I'm me. Why is Hero case superior to lynching Dormio or PX?

Hero is scummier than PX because Hero's low content during D2 looks like an attempt to skirt around getting too involved with the Pesco/Shadoweh wagons, which is what I believe scum would want to do in that situation (flying under the radar and all that). See above reponse to Pesco for explanation on this. PX actually tied himself to a wagon when it was necessary and had talked about his opinions on Shadoweh and Pesco before he really "had to", while Hero did not do this until the very last moment and it'd look odd if he didn't. Hero's actions are scummier because he was giving town less to work with and avoiding tying himself to flips.

I think I'll need to re-read Dormio before commenting on that part. PX is a town read for me at the moment, but Dormio has just been kind of there and I recall disliking him until Pesco/Shadoweh became distracting.

[Pesco]

JOB is sheep too, but he isn't as blatantly bad in that he could decide to make a vote without being told to.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Results of Dormio ISO!

...actually, this is pretty bad. You know how I dislike Hero avoiding giving town sufficient enough content to work with after flips? Dormio is scummy in that regard as well for basically only talking about his preferred lynch targets for most of the game and giving vague hints at most when forced to talk about other people (stances on Pesco and me). Furthermore, Dormio typically hasn't been engaging in discussion with players other than the ones he's targeting, and that makes it feel like he's not really interested in socializing and helping us come to a proper decision for our lynch. It gives off the impression that he isn't actually a part of the town, and this makes sense for scum play. I don't have much else to say that wasn't already covered by Bard.

...fuck, in all honesty, even though I don't think Dormio is scummier than Hero, I can't really think of a major reason to lynch Hero over Dormio that isn't most likely rooted in sheer tunneling. The only "real" thing I have is that I think Dormio's cases are more logical, but that seems like it could be attributed to gaps in playstyle. I'm fine lynching either at this point.

My earlier stances had Pesco and JOB as my secondary suspects, so I suppose I should talk about them. Pesco is trying, and I really do think that scum was most likely trying to take advantage of Pesco/Shadoweh, which implies town!Pesco. Not placing him as a high priority right now. I hate the way JOB handled Pesco vs Shadoweh but I don't see the weasel-y scum intent in him that I see in Hero and Dormio, because JOB at least seems to want to be involved in the game. There's also Serela. I'm not really feeling the case on him, but I find his posts unsettling on gut and could probably be convinced to go for him if somebody posted a good Serela case that didn't look like it was intended to convince Serela himself instead of the rest of the town.

PX is a town read for me, I've already said this. Bard too, I think I already implied that as well (though the fact that he lampshaded himself still being alive doesn't settle well with me). BT has recently read more like a townie who needs to have more self-confidence, but is the weakest of my town reads, so I guess I could maybe be convinced to put him into the neutral bin.

tl;dr
Would lynch: Hero, Dormio
Could be convinced to lynch: JOB, Pesco, Serela
Will not lynch: PX, Bardiche, BT

JOB is sheep too, but he isn't as blatantly bad in that he could decide to make a vote without being told to.

Given that he seemed to vote on D2 just so that I wouldn't attack him for not voting, I'm not entirely sure if this is true. <_<

[Pesco]

JOB sheepvoted D1 and D2. BT sheepvoted D1, D2, D3. Which one is worse?

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

If you phrase it like that, then yeah obviously BT is going to look bad, but I still think that JOB is worse because he sheepvoted twice on D2 while waffling over what could have been a critical moment with little explanation.

Regardless of that, I will say that I find it curious that on D2, BT thought that the PX lynch was not ideal and perhaps even a waste of time if it looked like there were better options. Why does he think that the PX lynch is ideal today?

[J.O.B]

Hey, Bard.

How have you come to the conclusion that there is no way I can be scum?