Author Topic: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread  (Read 319342 times)

Milkyway64

  • I AM A MAD SCIENTIST. KIND OF.
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #180 on: December 09, 2009, 10:55:16 PM »
Still can't beat floor 14 bitch, though I lasted quite a bit longer than usual. Found another boss on floor 15 that also is a brickwall.

Moar leveling is required.

Pesco

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #181 on: December 09, 2009, 11:18:10 PM »
Who's up for a challenge run of not getting ANY of the optional characters? Don't collect them and bench, I mean completely skip them.

Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #182 on: December 09, 2009, 11:28:06 PM »
AAAGHGHAGHHGAHHGH

Third try against Alice I nearly beat her (I think...). First I took out the Left Magic Doll, then the Center Healing Doll, and then I did nearly/at least 20k damage to Alice before I lost. Lv16~18 team (with Lv20 Chen lolwat), I have a feeling I might be underleveled for this fight, although if Meiling/Rumia/Patchy hadn't kept being Silenced...
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Anima Zero

  • Captain of the Spear
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #183 on: December 09, 2009, 11:38:26 PM »
Heh, well I somehow managed to find the right path on 7F to unlock the way to 8F.

After saving, tried fighting the boss guarding the stairs.  Somehow managed to beat it on my first try despite its opener wiping Reimu and Patchy in one hit and doing a large chunk of damage to Meiling and Remilia.

Managed to get into a pattern of swapping in my healer to patch up those two and anybody else capable of doing damage, then swapping the healer out before the next party attack.  Process repeated until it went poof.

8F awaits after I finish mapping 7F.  Party levels range from 26-33 at the moment.  Should be more like 26-31 because Chen levels so quickly.
"I never cared about justice, and I don't recall ever calling myself a hero..." Zero, Mega Man Zero 4

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #184 on: December 09, 2009, 11:53:25 PM »
Blah, so I went back to floor 12 in hopes of getting that last person in the triple boss fight, only to get someone else instead, whose stats aren't bad, but spells are pretty generic. I've checked the wiki quite a bit but I still can't figure out the area that tells you how to get bonus characters. which link is that exactly?

Also, if you beat the optional boss on floor 14, it leads to another optional boss who joins you on the same floor, with like 4 minibosses before the real fight. Don't expect the real fight to be easy either despite the pre-fight tactic she uses. Her damage output isn't grand, but she likes to spam this physical attack twice for every normal attack, and it has a habit of killing off your back row squishies. Eventually you'll be out of fragile people, I made the fight with only 4 people left >=(.

RainfallYoshi

  • Yoshi of Skies & Rains
  • Who is it that calls for me?
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #185 on: December 10, 2009, 12:45:03 AM »
Oh gawd. THE PAIN.

F9 Optional Bitch can go die in a fire. A big horrible fire. Seriously, screw you in the eye.

Milkyway64

  • I AM A MAD SCIENTIST. KIND OF.
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #186 on: December 10, 2009, 05:37:43 AM »
Also, if you beat the optional boss on floor 14, it leads to another optional boss who joins you on the same floor, with like 4 minibosses before the real fight. Don't expect the real fight to be easy either despite the pre-fight tactic she uses. Her damage output isn't grand, but she likes to spam this physical attack twice for every normal attack, and it has a habit of killing off your back row squishies. Eventually you'll be out of fragile people, I made the fight with only 4 people left >=(.

Said boss just crashed my game by aiming an attack at an empty slot.

By the way, run from gold sorceresses. Just, don't even try. I've suffered three of my four game overs to normal enemies because I thought I could handle them.

Chaore

  • Kai Ni Recipient Many Years Late
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  • You Finally Did It, Kadokawa.
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #187 on: December 10, 2009, 05:43:18 AM »
I'm now begining to really hate Lightning Dwarves, All of the damn 'Norns', and robots.

F20 Normals are a pain, short and simple.

Final Boss is just awesome fun and hard though.

Garlyle

  • I can't brain today
  • I have the dumb
    • Tormod Plays Games
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #188 on: December 10, 2009, 05:53:30 AM »
For those who haven't caught on:

Final Patch Release: http://www.mediafire.com/?ntwvtm2wzzu

Yes, this is the official one.  You'll need to be running this from an unmodified copy of the game though.  But yes, save files WILL transfer over.

(Also I'm writing a wiki page)
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 07:20:49 AM by Garlyle »

Milkyway64

  • I AM A MAD SCIENTIST. KIND OF.
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #189 on: December 10, 2009, 07:25:44 AM »
Garlyle = win

Also, anyone have any level recomendation for up to floor 16? At 70-80ish I still find myself stuck between a number of boss choices to go after, but can't seem to win. Worst so far appears to be the floor 16 boss.

I do think a lot of my difficulties are coming from affinity neglect. Until just a little bit ago, I was at level 1 for all characters' affinities. Would it be a good move to hoard skillpoints to pour into those? I think I'm doing okay offense wise for now, I just am sick of having my entire party get 1shotted by all of these bosses at the beginning or nearing the end.

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #190 on: December 10, 2009, 07:35:13 AM »
Garlyle = win

Also, anyone have any level recomendation for up to floor 16? At 70-80ish I still find myself stuck between a number of boss choices to go after, but can't seem to win. Worst so far appears to be the floor 16 boss.

I do think a lot of my difficulties are coming from affinity neglect. Until just a little bit ago, I was at level 1 for all characters' affinities. Would it be a good move to hoard skillpoints to pour into those? I think I'm doing okay offense wise for now, I just am sick of having my entire party get 1shotted by all of these bosses at the beginning or nearing the end.

No reason to have any stat at skill level 1 still, the amount of skill points to go from 1 to just 15 is pretty negligable, it will help alot more than just pumping 5 more into your attack stat which is at 30 or whatever.

But yeah, I'm having bosses 1shot me too, even when I got lots of defensive stats, bleh. Even hong got 1-shot by a physical attack by the mini boss on floor 16, not even a real boss for me, at full health, nailed me for 6.5k ='(. Then there's the real (though optional) boss who wtfpwns me kinda like the 8th floor optional boss does when you first face it >=P. Apparently the Japanese wiki reccomends level 75-80 for that boss though, While my Reimu is 74 I think, most of my other important characters (sans china) are still in their 60s.

Still though it's a blast, they don't make rpgs that are difficult anymore >=p. And while leveling and doing it at a higher level isn't difficult per say, you can do it so that you're just barely able to, and make it hard. Most rpgs these days just hand you the game without even trying to level IMO.

Quote
For those who haven't caught on:

Final Patch Release: http://www.mediafire.com/?ntwvtm2wzzu

Yes, this is the official one.  You'll need to be running this from an unmodified copy of the game though.  But yes, save files WILL transfer over.

(Also I'm writing a wiki page)

That's the translation patch I tried to link earlier but the link didn't copy >=P. But anyway, to re-iterate, don't use this on your game until you can do a fresh-install (save your saves folder though). Unless you never translate patched it that is.

As for the wiki page, cool, If I finish this game and get all the characters, I'll try to help by saying how you do so. But to be frank, I don't have a damn clue how to know stuff like "you need to battle with _____ 250 times before ____ offers to join",

OH, btw, I noticed something about Remilia. I could have SWORN that her curse skellcard only increased her atk and def. But now it increases atk,mag,def,and mnd. Am I smoking stuff? or did it get buffed somehow? Anybody remember how it was earlier on?

Glah, Am I missing something about getting ms heated orange chowing lady on floor 12? I mean do I need to find some event on some floor to get her? Or do I just have to do more battles with related characters?
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 07:55:42 AM by Ghaleon »

Garlyle

  • I can't brain today
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    • Tormod Plays Games
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #191 on: December 10, 2009, 08:23:24 AM »
Affinities are good to level up - especially weak ones.  Each level is a +3, which, if you're at less than 100 anyway, is more than a 5% decrease in damage from those elements.  It's said that in the Plus Disk, to take on the uber final boss, you want to max out Affinities on everyone by skill points alone @_@

The F12 character... there's an event on F16 you need to see... and you need a total of 1000 BP between the F8 optional, or any of the three related characters.

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #192 on: December 10, 2009, 08:35:34 AM »
Affinities are good to level up - especially weak ones.  Each level is a +3, which, if you're at less than 100 anyway, is more than a 5% decrease in damage from those elements.  It's said that in the Plus Disk, to take on the uber final boss, you want to max out Affinities on everyone by skill points alone @_@

The F12 character... there's an event on F16 you need to see... and you need a total of 1000 BP between the F8 optional, or any of the three related characters.

Thanks!, I don't suppose there's any way to see BP eh? I can't seem to find such a counter.

Milkyway64

  • I AM A MAD SCIENTIST. KIND OF.
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #193 on: December 10, 2009, 08:38:58 AM »
Affinities are good to level up - especially weak ones.  Each level is a +3, which, if you're at less than 100 anyway, is more than a 5% decrease in damage from those elements.  It's said that in the Plus Disk, to take on the uber final boss, you want to max out Affinities on everyone by skill points alone @_@

And my completionist side says I will. Beat. That. Boss.

*pumps affinities like a mofo, particularly FIR and MYS since those will help with the immediate bosses*

EDIT: By the way, am I the only one who feels like Remilia is losing effectiveness? I have many characters who can out-damage her, as much a three times...
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 08:52:31 AM by Milkyway64 »

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #194 on: December 10, 2009, 09:11:55 AM »
And my completionist side says I will. Beat. That. Boss.

*pumps affinities like a mofo, particularly FIR and MYS since those will help with the immediate bosses*

EDIT: By the way, am I the only one who feels like Remilia is losing effectiveness? I have many characters who can out-damage her, as much a three times...

Remilia is my best character IMO. She's really fast, not chen/aya fast, but closer to their speed than everyone elses. Her attackpower is second only to yuugi. and her defense and mind stats are only bested by Tenshi.. She's like second best at everything except magic power.. Which is pretty pointless(for her that is). Oh, but she's the very best at focusing, she gets an assload of sp back from 1 focus.

Anyway, I'm spearing bosses for 20k with her... Anybody else who does compareable damage often has 1/3 of the defense or mnd, and less hp to boot.

Good lord, helbelmares suck. Just about everything I do does 0 damage, and the things that don't (which I can count on 1 hand)... take like 10 hits to kill em, not some 1-shot thing
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 09:16:24 AM by Ghaleon »

Milkyway64

  • I AM A MAD SCIENTIST. KIND OF.
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #195 on: December 10, 2009, 09:34:31 AM »
Good lord, helbelmares suck. Just about everything I do does 0 damage, and the things that don't (which I can count on 1 hand)... take like 10 hits to kill em, not some 1-shot thing

Phoenix Spread Wings + buff works nicely, as does death attacks. Silent Selene also seems decent.

And strange, my Remilia is doing 20,000 only when cursed despite having 5000 6000 attack. Her HP is high, but people are catching up. Her mind is only decent, though the defense is pretty good.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 09:39:14 AM by Milkyway64 »

Krimmydoodle

  • We must apply more SCIENCE!
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #196 on: December 10, 2009, 01:53:28 PM »
Fuck Healing Light.  It's one thing when a boss feels like outright blowing the crap out of me.  It's another thing entirely for them to nullify all of my attacks useless with healing spells and buffs, then stand there and laugh at me as I futilely pound away to no effect.  I'm going to bed.

Edit: Actually, I still haven't befriended [3rd Floor Bitch].  I'm doing that, then going to bed.

Edit More: Never mind, that's walking away from someone who abuses buffs and saying hello to someone who abuses debuffs.  I'm done for now.  Bed.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 02:17:56 PM by Krim »
Whether you're on Easy or you're a Lunatic, be damn proud of your accomplishments.  Don't let anyone convince you otherwise, for it's when you lose faith in your own achievements that those victories become defeats.

Pesco

  • Trickster Rabbit Tewi
  • *
  • Make a yukkuri and take it easy with me
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #197 on: December 10, 2009, 03:14:20 PM »
Here's a list of the rare boss drops to get, names omitted.
Quote
1F    不屈の心    
5F     奇跡の炎
6F    奇跡の炎    
8F    聖霧の法衣    
9F    LOVEマシン3322    
9F     ビンダッチーV
12F    ビンダッチーV
10F    第六天魔王の鎧    
12F    火神防御輪
12F    火神防御輪
14F    デュアルハーロゥ    
14F    宵闇のローブ    
14F    ホーリーウィン
15F    風の紡いだ鎧    
16F    グラン・グリモア

The wiki also says bosses have a chance to drop of 25%.

RainfallYoshi

  • Yoshi of Skies & Rains
  • Who is it that calls for me?
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #198 on: December 10, 2009, 03:24:59 PM »
F9 Bitch was pathetically easy. Spam party wide attacks and she barely ever gets to attack you. Success! Still got some of F9 to explore though, also gotta get more BP with Rumia for her event. Anyone know how much BP I'm looking at to get it?

Garlyle

  • I can't brain today
  • I have the dumb
    • Tormod Plays Games
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #199 on: December 10, 2009, 04:01:58 PM »
So I've been sitting there working on the Touhou Labyrinth page on the Wiki.

I Have Way Too Much Time On My Hands

Please tell me what you think of this.  I plan to do up all of the character data like this.  It'll be arranged into basically six sections.
Page 1: Characters at the start of the game
Page 2: Characters that can join in 1F-5F
Page 3: 6F-10F
Page 4: 11F-15F
Page 5: 16F-20F
Page 6: Plus Disk charactersj


...And yes, I seriously went through and looked at EVERY CHARACTER'S STAT and listed them all down in order and got rankings based on how the character stats were divided up and dear lord where did the last like eight hours of my life go.

Krimmydoodle

  • We must apply more SCIENCE!
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #200 on: December 10, 2009, 04:06:27 PM »
I lied.  Finally moving on to 5F.  Timestamps between the "before" save and the "after" save for the boss fight are different by 53 minutes.  Everything slows to a fucking halt when all of the important members of your team are paralyzed/silenced/-50% debuffed and up against something that can heal 2 turns worth of a super-buffed party's damage.  It took forever to line up the turn timing to have a Cursed Remi and a 100% Concentrated Marisa, store them in the back to refill their SP while keeping their buffs, Lunar Clock them, and have Remi/Marisa/Youmu all not paralyzed or silenced so they could all contribute to the asskicking before healing kicked in.  *sigh, worst boss fight ever.

Now I'm really going to bed.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 04:46:54 AM by Krim »
Whether you're on Easy or you're a Lunatic, be damn proud of your accomplishments.  Don't let anyone convince you otherwise, for it's when you lose faith in your own achievements that those victories become defeats.

Pesco

  • Trickster Rabbit Tewi
  • *
  • Make a yukkuri and take it easy with me
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #201 on: December 10, 2009, 04:49:05 PM »
So I've been sitting there working on the Touhou Labyrinth page on the Wiki.

I Have Way Too Much Time On My Hands

Nice!

Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #202 on: December 10, 2009, 09:50:03 PM »
So I've been sitting there working on the Touhou Labyrinth page on the Wiki.

I Have Way Too Much Time On My Hands
Awesome

So does this mean Healing spells aren't based off of your stats? Ahh, maybe I shouldn't concentrated on Minoriko's magic stat instead of defensive ones. At least Falling Leaves of Madness is fairly nice this way.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Anima Zero

  • Captain of the Spear
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #203 on: December 10, 2009, 09:56:55 PM »
Floor 8...oh floor 8, how annoying your level design is.  I'd rather have another floor like 7 again than that.

At the very least mapping out everything resulted in gaining a pair of new characters.

First one was on 7F that required killing mini-bosses on 8F (Yay instant death attacks!  Not fun to be on the end of one of those skills I must say).

As for the char on 8F...had to fight her.  Was victorious on my first attempt.  Aside from a few attacks she wasn't exactly a huge threat.

One more character appears to be on 8F, but won't join just yet.  For now, 9F will start getting explored tomorrow.
"I never cared about justice, and I don't recall ever calling myself a hero..." Zero, Mega Man Zero 4

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #204 on: December 10, 2009, 10:09:38 PM »
So I've been sitting there working on the Touhou Labyrinth page on the Wiki.

I Have Way Too Much Time On My Hands

Please tell me what you think of this.  I plan to do up all of the character data like this.  It'll be arranged into basically six sections.

Dude, it's absolutely awsome. I especially like this:
Yin-Yang Orb     20     Enemy (Single)     SPI     1.75 x ((ATK + MAG) - (T.DEF + T.MND / 2))     --     Decent damaging for a single-target spell
Evil Sealing Circle    40    Enemy (Row)    SPI    2 x (((ATK + MAG) x 1.5) - (T.DEF + T.MND / 2))    Possible PAR    Better damage + PAR makes it more useful for bosses than Yin-Yang Orb
Fantasy Seal    60    Enemy (All)    SPI    2 x (((ATK + MAG) x 2) - (T.DEF + T.MND / 2))    --    Startlingly strong against anything not weak to SPI due to composite nature

*droools*.

also what someone said about healing not being affected by magic. I'll test that out on some trash later on I guess, but man will I be bummed out if that's true.

Does anybody know if the developers of this game are still working on it? I mean, might there be an additional plus disk, or maybe just a patch that might include changes such as evasion actually making a difference (I'm not sure if I'd want that though since I'm so used to working without it at this point, not to mention I find missing in RPGS to be pretty frusterating sometimes).

Seriously though, it's full of awsome so far.

RainfallYoshi

  • Yoshi of Skies & Rains
  • Who is it that calls for me?
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #205 on: December 10, 2009, 10:47:01 PM »
Kill me! Just shoot me dead!

Floors 10-12 are hell. Pure hell. This is just insanity. Not only is it s 3-floor maze, it has SWITCHES.

Shoot me dead.

Pesco

  • Trickster Rabbit Tewi
  • *
  • Make a yukkuri and take it easy with me
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #206 on: December 10, 2009, 10:54:30 PM »
Oh hi. I'm still not there yet. Fluffing around 3-4F. I'll try catch back up to 7F. It might take a while though since I'm keen to farm items.

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #207 on: December 10, 2009, 10:57:57 PM »
Kill me! Just shoot me dead!

Floors 10-12 are hell. Pure hell. This is just insanity. Not only is it s 3-floor maze, it has SWITCHES.

Shoot me dead.

Yeah you spend along time there. It does have some redeeming qualities though.

1: It has multiple sets of enemies...though it is 3 floors so that's kind of a given. They aren't seperated via floors though, but something else.

2: 2 sets of battle music, yay.
3: Great exp per battle. I mean, this is a given for every floor you'd think, but after these 3, battle increases in difficulty at a MUCH faster pace, making it so you can probably do 2 battles on these floors (and get more exp overall) in the same amount of time you could do one in a future one.
4: One of the most fun boss fights yet IMO
5: Hidden on these floors, you can get a new tank. One of the most interesting and potentially best IMO (extremely good defense AND mind...but not very tanky hp. and a self defense buff that raises both mnd and def by 100%, yes 100% in one cast). This tank often takes 0 damage from moves that OHKO the rest of my party after that buff. She has a great bossfight utility move too, which unfortunately doesn't seem to get much use after you get her (but boy would it have been great on some of the earlier bosses, including the floor 12 one).

Graph

  • Let's go, Trombe!
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #208 on: December 10, 2009, 11:31:05 PM »
So does this mean Healing spells aren't based off of your stats?

Nope, I'm pretty sure healing is based off magic.  I just tested out Reimu's heal at ~2100 magic, and my party was healed for 1200 - 1500 HP.

Went back to base, pumped Reimu full of skill points to get her ~2800 magic... and after that healed my party for 1700 - 2100 HP, or something like that.

Not sure what the formula is though.

Garlyle

  • I can't brain today
  • I have the dumb
    • Tormod Plays Games
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #209 on: December 11, 2009, 01:08:20 AM »
I'm not entirely sure how healing formulas work.

The wiki's got, like, 0 information on the subject, so I can't help there (Or maybe I just haven't found it yet D: ), but I doubt it's even the same for each character.  Why?  If it was based off magic, why is Colorful Rain so effective?  @_@

But yeah.  Damage formula is pretty much simple enough.  [Spell Magnification * ((attack stat * multiplier) - (target's defense stat * multiplier))], with a surprisingly large number of attacks actually counting the target's defenses at lower levels.