Author Topic: Touhou Smash Bros Project (Development & info thread)  (Read 189177 times)

Prime32

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #120 on: June 12, 2014, 10:50:45 PM »
Quote
Please stop suggesting a switch to MMD models. That's already out of the question and it's just derailing the thread even further. Smash messes with canon as well. As long as the outfits are made with consideration for the character's personality, it's fine. The ONLY design I would mess with is Rumia, assuming she uses her silly "arms outstretched" stance. The reason why we consider that look iconic for Rumia is because it reflects her childish personality. That just doesn't work well with her model's skirt, both because it has a more mature look to it, and because the silhouette would be really different. There are other characters where creative liberties like that can be taken, but big and wide skirt is the way to go for Rumia IMO.
I'm going to agree that Rumia is barely recognisable here - if you swapped the colours I'd have mistaken her for Raiko. Rumia's supposed to be a dimwitted, near harmless child with not a care in the world. The outfit you gave her calls to mind an office worker (implying high intelligence/competence, or at least literacy) and a biker (implying badassery), is unusually complex (implying that she takes great care of her appearance) and is designed to show off her legs (implying sexual awareness).
Rumia really needs the pinafore dress to work. If you want to make her design stand out from the other EoSD characters I guess you could pleat it or something?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 11:04:51 PM by Prime32 »

Colticide

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #121 on: June 13, 2014, 12:45:27 AM »
As long as the outfits are made with consideration for the character's personality, it's fine. The ONLY design I would mess with is Rumia, assuming she uses her silly "arms outstretched" stance. The reason why we consider that look iconic for Rumia is because it reflects her childish personality. That just doesn't work well with her model's skirt, both because it has a more mature look to it, and because the silhouette would be really different. There are other characters where creative liberties like that can be taken, but big and wide skirt is the way to go for Rumia IMO.

Anyways, I really feel that your presentation for WIPs is hindering you here Saijee. The way Tenshi and Sakuya look in the first post is actually pretty good! I understand that a neutral pose and expression might be the best way to show every detail of the model at once, but it also doesn't convey as well to non-artists what the character will look like in-game. The neutral expression in particular is really off-putting at times...

I don't think Touhou characters need unique expressions to the same extent, but when you post expressionless previews, you're drawing attention to that lack of personality. When I visualize how a character should look, I see not just their design, but their expression, and that's probably where half of your criticism is coming from! The models don't need a huge fundamental change, but small tweaks to give the more character would help alongside more expressive previews.

Sorry, if this isn't of any help to you, since I don't work with 3D at all, I just have a lot of interest in character design in general. I hope you can see that I'm not just saying "look at Smash Bros, do that" but rather "look at these elements that made Smash Bros. look good, and see where you are lacking them in your own work". Best of luck, and I might post a moveset or two later when I'm feeling inspired!


I would wholly agree with this. I haven't had much looked at Rumia before but I would say give her a bigger dress. A few reason if I may. I thought about what makes Rumia... well Rumia and see a trend with all of the pictures I found, I also tried to find ones where she wasn't wearing her normal outfit too what made her look like Rumia. A few facts are her color scheme, Did this reel quick with what I see as rumia to show an example of her color scheme.
I hope that looks like rumia for people or else this'll get awkward. The main focus I wanted from this is the main colors she had and in which order, yellow on top with a side of red and black in the main and white where it counts. I'd say your model has that fine but a common things a lot of fanart has is the ribbon in her hair is bigger and more pronounced, The skirt really should be bigger, a few cosplays I've seen where the skirt is flat changes it dramatically, and the most important thing I find is she need to smile... like a big smile! The one you used in an old image shows her as either she or depressed, change that up along with the dress and I'm sure she will look like Rumia more.

Here's an example of a Rumia Fanart with different clothes but a few things stay the same, The colors, the smile, the ribbon and her bowtie.
http://www.zerochan.net/987572 (Might be NSFW... not really sure because of her hip.)

Also as CK Crash said, lets see the characters with more posing and emotions. (that fit their style anyway) Also quick question, why did you go with a full red color scheme for Koakuma?

I hope this can help, not really sure what else I can do.
Touhou Fugyouseki ~ Nightmare of Sleeping Girl English Patch
I run a crappy YouTube channel, check it out if you wish~

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #122 on: June 13, 2014, 01:17:08 AM »
Not exactly facial style detail stuff, but this will give me something to do.

But if you guys want poses, updates will be much less frequent.

Colticide

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #123 on: June 13, 2014, 01:21:50 AM »
It'll give a much better understanding on the over effect of the character and their body shape. A good example I once seen was where a 3d fighter was making the models for the game and tried out the moves and took notes on how the body works with the move and made changes based on the moves or the body of the character.
Touhou Fugyouseki ~ Nightmare of Sleeping Girl English Patch
I run a crappy YouTube channel, check it out if you wish~

Maiden Synnae ミ☆

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #124 on: June 13, 2014, 04:24:29 AM »
You know, I think putting the whole cast of EoSD in the game isn't a good idea at all. It'd be fine if the roster were pretty big, but you said there will be a max of 20 characters on the final version, and if you put all of EoSD cast, it'll be a total of NINE characters from a single game taking away the spot of characters from other games.

There are many other interesting characters that deserves to be in the game more than boring, barely developed characters such as Daiyousei or Koakuma. I could name Udonge, Komachi, Eiki, Suwako, Yuugi, Orin, Murasa, Yoshika, Kagerou... and list goes on.

So I'd suggest taking out at least Rumia, Daiyousei and Koakuma from the roster. There are just too many EoSD chars.

Sweetness and love~ ♥

CK Crash

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #125 on: June 13, 2014, 04:44:36 AM »
But if you guys want poses, updates will be much less frequent.
Less frequent updates is probably better than having updates that misrepresent how the models look.

Also quick question, why did you go with a full red color scheme for Koakuma?
Red scheme for Koakuma works IMO, maybe makes her a bit more distinct from Rumia too. I'm curious about the origin of the idea though.

Anywho, long rambly moveset for Reisen:

General style - A character that relies on a lot of misleading attacks, but has risky KO moves. Most comparable to Falco. She's also unusual among Touhou Smash characters in that only one of her smash attacks is a real projectile, but she makes up for it with deceptive melee range.

Quirks - Her ground roll is slower than average, but goes far (Mewtwo-ish range) and creates an illusionary clone that rolls in the opposite direction. Her grounded jump is actually really high compared to her double jump, and she falls faster than normal.

Neutral Attack  - Three part chain that starts with two open-handed strikes and ends with a red spark that has a bit higher knockback. (2% 3% 4%)

Forward Strong - A swipe that creates a red spark in front of Reisen, with a nice disjointed hitbox for combos. (11%)

Down Strong - Shoots narrow eye beams at the floor. Very weak damage and knockback, but the duration can be extended for a brief time by holding the button. More for disrupting the enemy than for comboing. (5%)

Up Strong - Bunny hop headbutt. Kinda tall hitbox, but cruddy against grounded foes outside of comboing. (10%)



Forward Smash - Windup punch similar to Soku. She goes far forward if fully charged, but has awkward recovery on whiff or shield. Pretty meaty KO move that gets weaker towards the end. Actually plays a big role in mind games, as you will see later... (16-22%)

Down Smash - Shoots wide eye beams at the floor in a single flash, with Reisen's feet lifting off the ground from the recoil. Very fast on both startup and recovery, hitting multiple times before launching the enemy up. Only hits in front of her, unlike most Down Smashes, and is a bad KO move. (3x4% - 5x4%)

Up Smash - Fires a bullet upwards that makes a lingering explosion. Long charge time that controls how far the bullet goes before it explodes. Initial bullet can KO, lingering explosion just kind of juggles. (15-20%, 10%)



Grab - Reisen's eyes flash, "grabbing" the enemy by making them dizzy. Running dash has Reisen lunge awkwardly forward while her eyes flash. Both have relatively short range even for grabs, and average recovery on whiff.

Pummel - The enemy flashes with red sparks, seemingly damaged by the illusion. Slow with higher that average damage. (3%)

Forward Throw - Quickly tosses the enemy up at a 45 degree angle, and shoots 3 bullets quickly at them, similar to Fox's throws. Knockback doesn't really scale with damage. (4% + 3x2%)

Backward Throw - Grabs the enemy while a clone comes from behind and delivers a punch. Good knockback and damage for a throw, but Reisen is actually knocked backwards by the clone's hit, so it has some recovery that makes it dangerous if there are other enemies around or if the enemy bounces off a wall and recovers quickly. (12%)

Down Throw - Slams the enemy down with a red shattering effect a la Weak Heart "Demotivation". Good for setting up tech chase, but never KOs. (6%)

Up Throw - Like Forward Throw, but straight up. (4% + 3x2%)



Neutral Air - Generic kick that stays out a while. (12%)

Forward Air - Swipes in front with a red spark that causes her to recoil backwards during the recovery. Can KO weakened foes while they're recovering. (13%)

Backward Air - Horizontal dropkick that puts her in a sideways superman pose. Can be a good edgeguard, but hard to use more than once per jump. (12%)

Down Air - Her infamous somersault kick, minus the illusion. Slow startup and recovery, but has a meaty meteor smash hitbox, and enemies onstage will bounce up a bit. (13%)

Up Air - Upwards swing similar to Up Smash but less range and more for juggling than KO. (11%)



Neutral Special - "Illusion Round" - Fires 4 bullets from her fingers in quick succession that travel a little further than PK Fire range before disappearing. It must be reloaded before another use. Both the firing and the reloading are pretty quick, making this a good move for racking up damage. (4x3%)

Forward Special - "Disbelief Aspect" - A clone fakes the animation charging the forward smash while the real Reisen appears in the air a little ahead of where she started (similar to Wolf's trajectory with his Forward Special?). In the air, the clone fakes a double jump forward instead. Just for movement and mindgames. Can't be used twice without landing.

Down Special -  "Wavelength Resonance" - A red ring originating from Reisen expands as long as the button is held, with a maximum size the same as a Smart Bomb's radius. When the button is released, everyone touching the ring takes damage and knockback proportional to the size of the ring making it ineffective to use in close quarters, but a potential KO move at max distance. If the button is held too long, the ring starts shrinking until it becomes a single point, creating a small but devastating explosion that almost certainly KOs foes at the cost of stunning Reisen as well. If used in the air, this move stalls Reisen's downwards momentum a bit, but she tumbles helplessly after releasing the attack. (5-25%)

Up Special - "Moon Rabbit Parade" - A whole bunch of bunnies spawn and carry Reisen up like Squirtle's waterfall. Does multiple hits and cruddy damage and knockback, but unlike similar moves, it sends enemies tumbling down rather carrying them up. Not quite a meteor smash, and risky above the stage, but can surprise recovering enemies. (4-6%)

Final Smash - "Lunatic Red Eyes" - After a windup, sends out waves that do big damage. Enemies hit by this remain stunned and in place, even if they're hit in midair. After a delay, the enemies are suddenly hit by powerful upwards knockback. Reisen has a brief opportunity to land extra hits on enemies while they're stunned but before they're blasted away, increasing the chance of a KO. A hidden advantage is that this final smash is hard to punish even if it misses. (30%)

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #126 on: June 13, 2014, 06:31:47 AM »
@ ☆ Synnae ☆ I'm not going to have all of EoSD as playable, but they will all appear in some shape or form in the game. These models were all actually made sometime near the end of 2013 for another project that I was going to do, but got too busy with.

But since I have the models I figure it's a good starting point for modeling characters. By the way, Utsuho is also going to appear in this game. But don't get your hopes up too high yet, I haven't yet decided if she is going to be in the roster of playable characters.

All red Little Devil? Hmmmm- If I remember correctly there was a fan art of this coloration and I thought it looked cool, so I used it too.

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #127 on: June 13, 2014, 08:40:04 AM »
@Searinox, out of curiosity, you are basing your suggestions off of accuracy to the original designs, right?

Here are some other designs that other people have made for Cirno that follow a lot of the same artistic licenses for the design I do.
http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2012/099/b/8/touhou___cirno_by_paperjoey-d4vl4oi.png
http://hqwallbase.com/images/big/rei_cirno-1521663.jpg
1) First picture is more in line with what I said - Cirno looks like a child, her ribbon is pretty good and her icicles are much closer to her back (sure, they aren't attached to her back, but at least they aren't floating far far away). Second one doesn't exactly looks like Cirno - I'm sure you can pass the person depicted here as a Final Fantasy mage by changing colors and removing icicles.
2) Somewhat, but those three were my personal suggestions. I'm willing to drop the details from the original designs if your variant works (such as, for example, hair color). And yes, I know you are basing your models off of fan interpretations (I'm already expecting Cho-Marisa and Mannosuke to show in the game, because they worked were appreciated by fans). Still, the only things distinguishing Cirno from others are (currently) colors and icicles.  Change that - and you can probably pass her as somebody else.
If, when this game is finished, and you still don't like the final art style bu didn't make suggestions, don't blame me, I gave you a chance to adjust it to your liking right here and now.
Seeing as you repel all most suggestions by "Somebody had done the same thing I'm doing to my models now", this "chance" you provide is almost nonexistent.
Who is the one depicted on this picture, anyway?

Colticide

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #128 on: June 13, 2014, 09:44:40 AM »
But since I have the models I figure it's a good starting point for modeling characters. By the way, Utsuho is also going to appear in this game. But don't get your hopes up too high yet, I haven't yet decided if she is going to be in the roster of playable characters.

All red Little Devil? Hmmmm- If I remember correctly there was a fan art of this coloration and I thought it looked cool, so I used it too.


I could totally see Utsuho as a Samus like character!

Do you have a link to it or know how I could find it? I'd like to compare the two.
Touhou Fugyouseki ~ Nightmare of Sleeping Girl English Patch
I run a crappy YouTube channel, check it out if you wish~

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #129 on: June 13, 2014, 09:51:53 AM »
I don't know.

Hey what do you know, I actually Favorited it on DA, though in retrospect, it does look a bit different then I remember:

http://saijeehiguchi.deviantart.com/art/Librarian-217149498

If I remember correctly, I was searching for an image of Koakuma where she only had wings on her head, it also needed to have an otherwise, different look to it then the original look.

Now that I think about it, I think that Rumia's design was actually also made that way, though I don't have the image for where that came from.

Colticide

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #130 on: June 13, 2014, 10:08:24 AM »
OK I see it now, it looked odd at first but now that we have the reference it makes much more sense. Maybe down the ling when refining the models more you could make her skirt more "poofy"  like in the art.
Touhou Fugyouseki ~ Nightmare of Sleeping Girl English Patch
I run a crappy YouTube channel, check it out if you wish~

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #131 on: June 15, 2014, 09:31:45 PM »
This is the last day that anyone here has the chance to make suggestions for the graphics.

After getting my wisdom teeth removed, I remapped and re textured Sakuya's model:


I'll get around to rigging it this week later.

Colticide

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #132 on: June 15, 2014, 11:40:58 PM »
Look better at first (The face has improved by a lot.) but when I went to really look at it it seems there is just a gradient on everything.

Here is a image comparing the old and new.

I say keep the old hair and change the ribbon back, the new ones look like lasers. What are you using to make the textures? Is it a image that can be edited? (I'd like to try something if I may?)
Touhou Fugyouseki ~ Nightmare of Sleeping Girl English Patch
I run a crappy YouTube channel, check it out if you wish~

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #133 on: June 15, 2014, 11:56:59 PM »
It's made on gimp.

Which ribbon by the way? The green one or the white one?
« Last Edit: June 15, 2014, 11:58:43 PM by Saijee »

Colticide

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #134 on: June 16, 2014, 12:59:08 AM »
Oh man, looks complicated for someone who hasn't worked with this stuff before. Thank you btw, I'd like to work on this just to get a better idea what you have to go through and I can explain things better. How did you know what parts to shade and lighten?
« Last Edit: June 16, 2014, 01:25:37 AM by Colticide »
Touhou Fugyouseki ~ Nightmare of Sleeping Girl English Patch
I run a crappy YouTube channel, check it out if you wish~

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #135 on: June 16, 2014, 04:46:54 AM »
Quote
How did you know what parts to shade and lighten?
I have a map of Sakuya's body.

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #136 on: June 16, 2014, 09:37:42 PM »
Hello! First I want to say I'm a 3d modeler and have 8 years of experience. I didn't came here to say "I work with it, then I'm better", I
just wanted to let you know that I know what I'm saying. I'll make a decent post about it, I don't have much time now.

I'll try to summarize everything that I think it can be changed.

1 - The models:
Please do not repeat the faces of the characters, each character has a different face as well as the expressions, which does not exist on these models

2 - The textures:
I think it is "ok" depending on the distance from the camera, BUT, remake ALL the UVW mapping, make textures with power of 2 (2x2, 128x128, 1024x1024, ...)

3 - You:
If you are making a game and asking for public opinions, you are asking for critique. Do not show your work if you do not want opinions on it, and if you show, learn to accept what they are talking about it and do not say "I'm happy with my skills" or "make a better game than my and we'll talk later".

Do not take it personally like you usually do. Everyone here is interested in the game and trying to help.

Like I said earlier, I'll make a post with better examples of what to do (and how).

Colticide

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #137 on: June 17, 2014, 03:22:15 AM »
Sorry it took a bit to get back, just moved into my new place. The green ribbon does look better in the first one. But starting to feel like I ought to just let ya work on it and then see what needs fixed and refined.
Touhou Fugyouseki ~ Nightmare of Sleeping Girl English Patch
I run a crappy YouTube channel, check it out if you wish~

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #138 on: June 17, 2014, 08:27:28 AM »
@ Kevinhag, Thanks but I'd like to inform you, like I've been repeating myself a number of times with every new person to respond on this topic:
I do not take offense in any remark toward anything that I do, nor I do not take any thing personally. It is true that there are things that are non negotiable, like not using MMDs, and not going anime style, and I decide how tall everybody is. But I have been changing things to the best of my understanding of what people were asking me to do. You see, there in lies the center of this all.

I am not asking for peoples' help, I am simply changing things according to how I am asked to. On my posts that I reply that you incorrectly read that I am "taking offense" I am not in-fact being defensive, but rather, bringing up the point that I do not comprehend a way to utilize the response that a lot of people give me to an effect that I can do to make the models better suit their personal outlook. I press for more information because there is a lack of it.

To further clarify things though, regarding this:
Quote
If you are making a game and asking for public opinions, you are asking for critique. Do not show your work if you do not want opinions on it, and if you show, learn to accept what they are talking about it 
I feel like you are fundamentally looking at things backwards. There was no point where I was "asking" for public opinions or "asking" for critique. The story goes that one "Kyouma" hinted that he wanted me to use MMD models, to which I responded by showing that I am going to use my own models. From there people had between neutral and negative opinions of the look of things. My reaction was something simply like: "I'll be flexible to a point, but if you want me to change something, be specific on the details that bother you." And from there I think I've been quite consistent in doing things that people explain when they explain them in ways that are direct and useful when it comes to determining adjustments to the art style of this game.

Quote
and do not say "I'm happy with my skills"
I understand your outlook in this, but it simply is incongruent to mine. From my perspective: Why would anybody choose to NOT be happy with their own abilities, skills, and/or talents? Being able to appreciate your own output does not necessitate an inability to grow/learn further.

Like I said earlier though: I am happy with my skills and my output, I have a rather narcissist outlook on my work that allows me to be very optimistic about it. I do not seek improvement, I only invite it.

Quote
or "make a better game than my and we'll talk later".
That was more of a sarcastic joke regarding the usage of MMD models to make Touhou Fan games. Yes I admit it was mean spirited, but three things:
1) I had already explained to him in detail why MMD models were out of the question.
2) To this very post, Kyouma has yet to post information that legitimately contributes to the discussion of this topic.
3) It was in response to his smart-alec remark: "pretty nice quality, too bad theire MMD models which 'cant be used' on this, its a shame, this seemed like an interesting project"

Quote
1 - The models
I'd be interested in hearing the unsummerized version as I think it'd be much more useful.

Quote
2 - The textures
I think I already stated that that was part of the plan. And yea, I know about the powers of 2 rule, I've been making games for 9 years now.

Mahou Shoujo Nel!

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #139 on: June 17, 2014, 01:48:05 PM »
I would love it if the faces are more anime-like.  They look kind of creepy, especially the eyes...
Sorry, but i have to agree.
Sakuya's face just looks like Link's.
I think the should be a bit less realistic. :derp:

Savory

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #140 on: June 17, 2014, 06:04:09 PM »
Each character has a different face as well as the expressions, which does not exist on these models.

I agree. Remember what I told you concerning making each character look unique from the other, Saijee. I suggest referring to the links I sent to those Skyward Sword models to see how each character is different while still keeping a set tone. I'll give some various base personalities and the characters that could fit them as an example.

Serious: A bold unwavering expression of a person ready for battle!
-Reimu, Alice, Youmu, Meiling, Reisen

Calm: A neutral expression; this person goes with the flow.
-Sakuya, Ran

Conceited: A haughty expression, classified by slightly drooping eyes and a smirk of pride, of someone who is confident in their abilities.
-Remilia, Yukari, Nue

Cheerful: A simple joyful expression; this person always has a smile, no matter what the day may bring.
-Sanae, Suwako, Mystia

Boisterous: The usual tomboyish expression with a large smile and bright eyes to boot.
-Marisa, Cirno, Nitori, Yuugi

Hostile: An intimidating expression. Is this person upset? You don't want to mess with them.
-Mokou

Confident: A tamer version of conceited, but there is still a little hint of arrogance.
-Aya, Tenshi, Miko, Futo

Blithe: The carefree expression of an individual with little to no worries in life.
-Yuyuko, Utusho, Suika, Mamizou, Komachi

Deadpan: Somewhat expressionless. Are they depressed, or...?
-Patchouli, Satori, Kokoro

Mischievous: A playful expression, but what is this person up to?
-Orin, Tewi

Hope this helps, if even a little.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2014, 07:34:11 PM by Savory »

PhantomSong

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #141 on: June 19, 2014, 12:10:45 AM »
I suggest really reducing the bridge of the nose and get rid of the flared up nostrils, and as the others mentioned, you have to make sure their faces show their personality.  Look at Hisoutensoku's sprites, MMD sprites, even fan artwork, usually depict a character's general personality. It may not seem necessary, but it will definitely affect how much the average gamer, who does not know how hard it is to make this stuff, appreciate ten-fold.




Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #142 on: June 19, 2014, 07:27:58 PM »
Modeling characters with a neutral facial expression is a convention used to optimize the potential for getting their faces to be used for various expressions during animation.

UnendingEmpire

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #143 on: June 19, 2014, 10:12:28 PM »
I for one like the model style.  Feels very...I dunno, crisp?  A good kinda crisp though, like in a potato chip.

Just putting in a little positive feedback is all :)

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #144 on: June 20, 2014, 03:31:29 AM »
Modeling characters with a neutral facial expression is a convention used to optimize the potential for getting their faces to be used for various expressions during animation.

Modeling characters with different starting expressions doesn't mean they're supposed to carry that expression through all of the animations. They can still change into something else. Putting poker face everywhere is just not a good idea.

I can see you're flipping off pretty much everyone that are giving you suggestions to improve the game. If you're going to keep such a defensive stance instead of being flexible, then what's the point of asking for public opinions? not trying to say that you're solid as rock, but from what I noticed so far, your flexibility is slight to non-existent, which is very restrictive and gives people few chances to work with you.

Maybe the best thing you can do is forget about this thread and work on your project by yourself.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 03:38:45 AM by ☆ Synnae ☆ »

Sweetness and love~ ♥

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #145 on: June 20, 2014, 03:38:44 AM »
To be honest, I have no problems with the models, sure, maybe the faces look strange compared to some others models (MMD models, for example), but I find it more... I dunno, "unique" ? Which is good, in fact, I find it more interesting to make a game with resources from scratch instead of reusing resources from somewhere else...

As for characters, I think it would be rather interesting to see the Prismriver sisters, not the 3 at the same times, it would probably be hard to code the AI, but maybe with a "switch", kinda like the Pokemon Trainer in Brawl, in this case, they could have moves based on their instruments and different stats depending of the character (one being based on speed, one being based one powerful attacks and knock back and the last one being balanced)

I don't have any particular idea for the moveset, but I could probably think of some (and their Final Smash could be all of them performing their theme while shooting notes on the stage, Yellow for Lunasa, Purple for Merlin and red for Lyrica, the notes could have different effect on others players, Stun / Poison / Fire damage)

PhantomSong

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #146 on: June 20, 2014, 04:32:02 AM »
I can see you're flipping off pretty much everyone that are giving you suggestions to improve the game. If you're going to keep such a defensive stance instead of being flexible, then what's the point of asking for public opinions? not trying to say that you're solid as rock, but from what I noticed so far, your flexibility is slight to non-existent, which is very restrictive and gives people few chances to work with you.

Maybe the best thing you can do is forget about this thread and work on your project by yourself.
^This
What's the point of making this public if you won't take any form of suggestion on something, sure you are on moves and such, but when we're trying to help improve your game's quality, you're just giving us a "fuck you." It's a general consensus here that your models are in need of improvement, but you're blowing it all off.  Most of us here want to help our fellow coders/game designers, but only if they're willing to communicate and take suggestions and criticism into consideration. If you can't do that, you might as well abandon this thread and ask a moderator to lock it.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 04:34:49 AM by PhantomSong »

Helepolis

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #147 on: June 20, 2014, 05:47:06 AM »
I think everybody need to cool down their heads for a moment and take a few steps back. Have some tea, eat some cake and consider whether your actions are in check with RikaNitori's board rules.

I'm going to actually approach from a different side and ask a very curious question which everybody seems to have forgotten: Is there anything actually created for this game aside from the models/textures and 5 pages of posts?

Curious, as majority of the fan games somehow take a reverse route of development, eventually ending up nowhere.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 06:48:39 AM by Helepolis »

PhantomSong

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Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #148 on: June 20, 2014, 07:23:27 AM »
I'm going to actually approach from a different side and ask a very curious question which everybody seems to have forgotten: Is there anything actually created for this game aside from the models/textures and 5 pages of posts?
Good point, I'll admit I've omitted that fact. The gameplay itself should definitely come first. I can't believe ,being a danmakufu programmer where gameplay is much more important than the shiny stuff, I forgot about that.

I think everybody need to cool down their heads for a moment and take a few steps back. Have some tea, eat some cake and consider whether your actions are in check with RikaNitori's board rules.
I did not intend to break any rules with my post in any form of matter, it's just Saijee shows a lack of caring with suggestions that everyone has clearly stated involving models. The issue is apparent with most people here, the models need improving.

Re: Touhou Smash Bros Project
« Reply #149 on: June 20, 2014, 07:51:04 AM »
@Synnae, I'm pretty much flipping everybody off? Really now: what makes you say that?

Explaining the underlying factors is not a "defensive stance" as you'd put it. Now I could be wrong, but I'm assuming at least one of the things you are talking about is that I said:
"Modeling characters with a neutral facial expression is a convention used to optimize the potential for getting their faces to be used for various expressions during animation. "
in response to:
"make sure their faces show their personality. "

And here is the thing, that's not being defensive. It's being explanatory: That is to say- a remark that puts into notice that there is a lack of expressions on the faces as is isn't being discounted because in the game the characters will have facial expressions, however, like I said in my explanation, the use of conventional methods will allow for better results.

Quote
They can still change into something else.

I've been trying to tell you that it really doesn't work like that.

@ Phantomsong, I'm not giving you a "fuck you"

This:
Quote
Modeling characters with a neutral facial expression is a convention used to optimize the potential for getting their faces to be used for various expressions during animation.

Is in no way, shape or form a "fuck you." Your suggestion was that they should have expressions in their faces, and I clearly said that they will once they are animated.  How, prey-tell, is that not what accounting for what you suggested?

@ Helepolis, I started development on some of the animations as well as programming, I've also been collecting sound effects and I starting the music production.  This isn't going to be one of those fangames that doesn't get completed. I've carefully planned out the development (week for week) so that a playable build with between 5-8 characters will be available at the end of this year.