Final Fantasy 9 Mafia (GAME OVER: SCUM WIN)

[ActionDan]

Anata ga hontou baka jyanaika?

Quoting for Posterity.

[BT]

Eh, Dan, you're still around. Help me with this NNR vote.

[BT]

I give Dormio 24 hours till he drops that PR on his own accord.

[Serela]

Serela also sucks for pulling "wait till more people get here" when it was obvious I wanted to get an early read on him.

If you seriously think you and me poking eachother repeatedly before anyone else posted can do -anything- helpful, I don't know what to say. :T That'd just be a waste of time and energy.

I'm not really a big fan of "these two guys are scum. I'm not going to tell you why yet, though", but as long as you actually tell us in the near future it's fine? o: On the other hand though, I do, however, think it's really weird that you're all hyper and posting a whole bunch and telling people to post more so you can talk to them, yet you apparently would rather not use all this energy to tell us about, you know, your actual scumreads >_>;;

Dormio is being difficult to understand but apart from that he looks really town. AD's shenanigans are making me lean town enough that I'd rather not lynch him today, but I'm not passing him a clear; I'd rather wait to see how he acts in the future with non-gambity stuff that could forseeably go either way. All the same I can't exactly blame the people voting him either (Especially considering it's ED1 and there's not much else to go on)

And BT is too bold for scum calling Conq scum after Conq's wall post.

But but but last game D:

Actually, really, I think BT is the only person I'm feeling as scum in any kind of notable manner right now. Reasoning on this=first two paragraphs in this post (More the second one, though, really)
##unvote ##Vote BT

cut:With the possible growing interest in NNR votes I think I may as well give my opinion on him, which is a large resounding null. His current posts are reasonable although nothing interesting/insightful/effortful enough to be particularly townie, while still having nothing much that looks scummy when you consider it's ed1

[ActionDan]

I understand your vote BT but I think NNR is leaning town, I don't believe his posts carry any weight however (which is where I'm assuming you are getting your scum-read from).

as is shadoweh, no joke.

Serela that was a terrible terrible post, but I'm not sure that that is scum-you.  BT is clearly clearly town this game. 

[BT]

I'm not really a big fan of "these two guys are scum. I'm not going to tell you why yet, though", but as long as you actually tell us in the near future it's fine? o: On the other hand though, I do, however, think it's really weird that you're all hyper and posting a whole bunch and telling people to post more so you can talk to them, yet you apparently would rather not use all this energy to tell us about, you know, your actual scumreads >_>;;

I'm giving this some time. There's a good chance my reasons won't make sense if I share them now, so that's my rationale here.

I don't believe his posts carry any weight however (which is where I'm assuming you are getting your scum-read from).

This isn't it.

[BT]

Uhh change "won't make sense" to "lose their effectiveness" I guess.

[Amraphenson]

##Unvote

dormio lives to see another day.
I'm new to this so I can't make reads all that well but hey.

##Vote BT

if there's anyone that's looking suspicious it's BT for not sharing his reasoning.

[ActionDan]

##Unvote

dormio lives to see another day.
I'm new to this so I can't make reads all that well but hey.

##Vote BT

if there's anyone that's looking suspicious it's BT for not sharing his reasoning.

Please parse the following:

Darkoda, Me, Conq

Give me your thoughts.

[Amraphenson]

See, I'm not even sure what parse means within context. But Darkoda hasn't really done anything, you've just been calling people as town, and afai can tell conq is just having a slapfight with you.

from what little mafia experience I have, scum tend to accuse others of scum to divert suspicion, not confirm others as innocent. Of course, that puts suspicion on me as well, but I'm reasonably sure you're town Dan.

[Serela]

^IMO townpost

[WHMZakeri]

Zak what was with that vote?

It was a votepark, mostly.
##Unvote: Darkoda

despite obviously being a murderer that wants to kill all of us, I can't really see lies or misintentions in Conqueror's vote towards Dan.

Serela that was a terrible terrible post, but I'm not sure that that is scum-you.  BT is clearly clearly town this game. 

I actually found Serela's post agreeable. Can you tell me what was wrong with it besides disagreeing with the conclusion?

I'm giving this some time. There's a good chance my reasons won't make sense if I share them now, so that's my rationale here.

That's a blatant lie and y-

Uhh change "won't make sense" to "lose their effectiveness" I guess.

Oh, that makes sense. As far as reasons to not share reasoning goes, this is the only one that could potentially be town-sourced.

##Vote: ActionDan since his attack on Serela seems too disjointed to me.
Null read on BT right now, but I'm more inclined to agree with Serela's read than anything.


Edit: Actually, my experience as mafia tells me that calling random townies town is just as likely a scum move to get more allies while at the same time not pushing wagons that you can be held accountable for, and also manage to appear like you're actually being analytical when you aren't. It's mostly forgivable on Day one when all of anybody's reads are mostly bullshit anyways, but I don't agree that it's a call for a town read on that person.

[WHMZakeri]

The "edit" refers to Sam's post.

[NekoNekoRex]

Did I walk into a setup where Dan can only make town reads and BT can only make scum reads? Almost feels like BT and Dan read as masonbuddies.

Gut and Logic are clashing on Dan. Gut wants to say Dan's posts read town, Logic makes me wonder what the hell he's doing with all those town reads and not trying to get someone lynched. Dan seems to be giving everyone too much credit for their posts. Eh, I'm just going to follow SasA's reasoning for this.

BT reminds me, surprisingly, of Scum!Serela. He's pointing scum in all directions while his current vote is probably the dumbest one of all the choices he has. He Town!Dan read is contradictory, defending him for having a bunch of town reads before everyone is post-RVS, and not criticizing him after plenty of people have posted. Other irks are that BT calls Affinity uptight while also being a prude about Dormio's (now readable) posting quirk.

Waiting patiently on that Shadoweh post.

Serela is fine today, like her BT vote

Still not happy with Zak. For :reasons and gut:. Might vote him later if I still don't like him later and I got nothing else.

Oh, and here's a long overdue ##Unvote. I'd vote BT, but with the masons suspicion and his incredibly mysterious Caseless Vote on me, I think I'll wait warmly without a vote.

[NekoNekoRex]

Personal note:
If BT's held off reasoning is a gambit that relies on me noticing how stupid his vote is for not having a reason, then I guess good job, you succeeded?

[NekoNekoRex]

Conspiracy Theory:
Action Dan and BT look like masonbuddies because they are actually the same person, as evidenced by the fact both their nicknames combine to form into "ActionDan"

[Amraphenson]

I'm trying to avoid that level of metathought on day one, simply to keep myself sane, but that thought did cross my mind.

[Serela]

...if you're talking about the crack theory of ActionDan and BT being the same person I'm going to facedesk :C

I'm liking NNR's latest posts, after taking out the multiple conspiracy theories, at least.

[ActionDan]

##Vote Zakeri

Vote park on a noob I was calling confirmed scum pushing the wagon to L-2.

*Doesn't say anything about reaction test or it's results produced*
*Attempt to spurt out a few lines going 'actually in my experience scum call people town to get them on their side'*

And frankly Serela's reasonings were bad ones to lay down a vote on BT.
I'll quote the parts which are bad.

If you seriously think you and me poking eachother repeatedly before anyone else posted can do -anything- helpful, I don't know what to say. :T That'd just be a waste of time and energy.

no

On the other hand though, I do, however, think it's really weird that you're all hyper and posting a whole bunch and telling people to post more so you can talk to them, yet you apparently would rather not use all this energy to tell us about, you know, your actual scumreads >_>;;

ok but that isn't scummy

All the same I can't exactly blame the people voting him either (Especially considering it's ED1 and there's not much else to go on)

unrelated but bad

Actually, really, I think BT is the only person I'm feeling as scum in any kind of notable manner right now. Reasoning on this=first two paragraphs in this post (More the second one, though, really)
##unvote ##Vote BT

for bad logic

[Serela]

actually when I read NNR's posts again he

A.Isn't voting at all right now
B.Apparently actually was being serious about the mason crack theory

Uhhhhhhhhh

[BT]

Yeah this isn't going to work out. I wanted to give this some time but it's not worth it if this is going to happen.

I disliked NNR for behavioral reasons -- he seemed timid and cautious which is a big slap to the face when you consider Town!NNR. Slightly less now, though there's still one big thing that didn't change -- he won't commit to a vote.

I'll just quote from the post I wrote up but didn't publish:

Scumjerk at NNR's #89. And his #91, in fact. Why are you so friendly?
No seriously, #95 "please explain" does not sound like "in your face" Town!NNR at all.
I'd have expected him to vote Shadoweh instead of whining about no definitive scumreads. Your vote is still a RVS vote you scumderp.

It's pretty obvious now that I didn't go through with this because I thought seeing how he'd continue without me pointing this out is worthwhile but it clearly isn't.

I was actually planning to vote Conq, but changed to NNR pre-publish because I thought I'd get some reactions out of him at this early hour. I was originally going to push Conq for his Dan vote:

Don't particularly care for the Darkoda discussion, but he's voting Dan in #77 for not thinking it through. My Town!Conq isn't an illogical conspirator.

##Unvote Darkoda
##Vote Conqueror

Which meas Dan (bad vote) and Darkoda ("nop, not town") get the compulsory townwave. Dan reads town anyway.

I got the impression Conq was being intentionally dense with "you're trying to force through a townread", aside from the fact that it was a stretch.

And wouldn't a scum player in the same position also vote for the person voting them with the worst reasoning? After all, bad reasoning is easiest to attack. But even after that he switched so easily to Dormio for Dormio's RP. He showed absolutely no reaction to your confession. No anger, no confusion, no nothing. I'm not seeing how you deduce super town from what's in the thread, when it's not at all. To me, it's pretty null.

The last part reads like he accepts the fact that he deduced it that way (disagreement), but he voted Dan for faking the deduction. It's inconsistent.

Conq made some good points... that were irrelevant to his vote on Dan. The vote is the problem. I doubt he'd have stuck his vote there as town.

That sentiment was a lot stronger in the morning, though. He might be town with a rocky start (comparable to Angel Beats! D1, if he really was trying to scumhunt then). I think I like the NNR vote more, or Dorian. I seem to be the only one to comment on his mediocre entrance.

Dan: Not sure about Zak. Didn't give me any scummy vibes. Do you still think NNR is town?

[BT]

One more thing about Zak / Serela: I agree that Serela's vote was pretty bad but in this case not alignment-indicative. Same goes for Zak for sheeping it. I didn't think I'd get maimed while I wait for scum reactions. (wouldn't be worthwhile for the town if I'd get all the attention for it)

[PX]

Wake up prod dodge, just saying screw you Dormio

[BT]

Other irks are that BT calls Affinity uptight while also being a prude about Dormio's (now readable) posting quirk.

I think I might still be using the wrong word here. Anyway, that last part never happened, so I don't know where this came from.

[Serela]

...okay. Well, in that case. BT doesn't look like scum at all. :T (Would like Zak update on BT as well after the reasoning reveal)

##Unvote

NNR what is with the mason suspicion. Like, seriously. I thought you were joking until you said later that you weren't voting BT because you thought he might be a mason, which boggles my mind. Also waiting reaction to BT reasoning etc

Rawr/PX need to exist. Come play with us guys :c Shadoweh/Darkoda need to get into the real game too now that we're getting somewhere instead of RVS but Shadoweh's been posting so I imagine when she has the time she'll pop up.

And I'd like a votecount :D

[Dorian White]

Seriously now?

Honestly Dorian your response is probably the worst. Commenting on nothing else & that "have you considered this?" line.

Patience, all in good time. I would like to see you making a better case after a full night shift, and getting frustrated that Conq had already addressed everything I could have said about it. Actually would I like to see you making a better case than ?hey this guy has just null reads so far?. Oh look, I voting someone who has just town reads so far and I'm already ?overjoyed? by the prospect that he'll use this to PoE his way through the game.

@ActionDan: I know what you said but it doesn't matter if I think that you would be ?the buddy? helping him, cause that's what my ?flimsy sentences? implicates.

Now quick cause I'm running out of time:
I'm still not sure if I understand Dormio but I think that I like his PX case. PX first post made me hope that he finally gave up on his ?jump on the biggest wagon for progress? approach but it seems that I was mistaken.

I think BT is town, even when think that his Tryhard / Uptight point fits him better than anyone else at the moment but that's just annoying not scummy.

PS: I see that Zak posted and Dan has a vote now but that has to wait cause I'm already late.

[BT]

I'm surprised this clarification is needed, but: my response to Affinity wasn't an accusation. Like, at all. <_< It means I felt his vote was for the wrong reasons, regardless to alignment.

Dorian, it's more the fact that your post was underwhemling overall. Can you restate your reasons for voting Dan and apply his recent posts?

Also: Explain what's wrong with PX's vote. Refer to these posts:

##Vote Darkoda
I would vote Shadoweh a second for always doing this stuff every game but she has no votes

Also, no he's [Darkoda] not scum. But for now, neither are you.

##Unvote
##Vote Shadoweh

Begone, foul knave.

I do agree about rawr, though! I saw him on the forums earlier.

[NekoNekoRex]

I guess I could see how BT would be suspicious . At that point [#89] I didn't have any definitive scumreads, which is what I usually go for in a vote. I was going to / may still vote Shadoweh if I didn't like his response however..
On the case of "not voting BT right away" I guess I decided to give him the benefit of the doubt his reasoning would be actually worthwhile.

Also enjoy Dormio and his mafia quirks (they amuse me) even though I constantly want to lynch him for trying to lynch me. It's not like my posts have any clear reads on him. That a problem?

Anyway I guess BT's gambit paid off because I certainly think his suspicions look a bit better (although I'm still concerned with his weird buddying with Dan)
BT where are your voting priorities right now? You said I look better and then you went to write a post on Conq but your vote hasn't changed.

Anyways Dan put my suspicions on Zak into words better then I ever could have had I actually decided to write them out, so I think I'm going to sheep his reasoning and ##Vote: Zakeri

@Serela: It's not really a crack theory, I'm genuinely irked by how buddy-buddy they publicly are.

[ActionDan]

Ok Dorian, your reasoning for implicating me stems from your belief that I am Dark's buddy and was coaching him to react appropriately to the reaction test. 

If that were the case why didn't he just call me a liar straight off the bat? (That would have been the towniest response and one I would have advised him to adopt)

btw I am thinking Amra town.  That was too genuine imo not to be.

@BT I'm still leaning town on NNR.

[PX]

You are ignoring this user. Show me the post.

Ah, beautiful bliss. Someone tell me when Dormio finally stops doing that, it's seriously fucking annoying. It's either ignore Dormio or just stop playing because I don't want to if he keeps doing that.

BT is town.

##Unvote
##Vote: NNR

He's throwing out reads, and clear "I don't like" reads, but he's not voting because of bullshit conspiracy theory reasons. This is a complete scum stance as this allows him to jump his vote wherever he wants.

Darkoda and Amra read townish enough for now, since their posts seem sincere enough. Note this may be subject to change later on.

Serela: Anything else you'd like to share on? After you giving up on BT all I see are a bunch of nullreads.

Affinity's vote and reasoning I don't like at all. Would like another post.

Dorian's vote onto ActionDan is pretty damn bad as well, your reasoning does not stand at all. I don't see how you're suspecting Dan to be his buddy. It's a completely baseless suspicion and I need some clarification.

3 cuts

NNR:
1)Throw baseless suspicion
2)Someone else post reasons
3)Sheep so people can't complain about lack of vote

##Vote NNR Harder