Author Topic: Danmaku Science Fair!  (Read 11032 times)

CK Crash

  • boozer
Danmaku Science Fair!
« on: December 12, 2009, 04:17:05 PM »
So my science fair project is on how the speed, size, and frequency of a bullet pattern affects difficulty. Reason is that no one in my school does anything computer science related for science fair, so it's a guaranteed first place in that category. Anyways, it would be totally awesome if I had some people play through this script while recording how many times they die on each of the 16 patterns (they're all 20 second survivals, you can save a replay to count them if you're forgetful). Then, fill out this form so that I can collect the data. It takes about 6 minutes, and the patterns are really bland and loleasy, but it would be great to have some results from people who actually have played a danmaku game .

EDIT:
Handy reference for the pattern identifying impaired.

« Last Edit: December 12, 2009, 06:15:56 PM by Onthenet »

Helepolis

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2009, 04:32:57 PM »
I'll see what I can do. Hopefully get to pull it off tonight.

Lawence Codye

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2009, 04:59:53 PM »
yeah, I'll get to helping with that now...
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Drake

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2009, 06:15:32 PM »
I died once on both the second last and last.

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KomeijiKoishi

Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2009, 06:17:23 PM »
Barely 1cced it.

CK Crash

  • boozer
Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2009, 06:19:06 PM »
The fact that no one is dying on the really slow ones is kinda disproving the "hyperspeed theory" that some people have.

Iryan

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2009, 06:34:53 PM »
The fact that no one is dying on the really slow ones is kinda disproving the "hyperspeed theory" that some people have.
Not quite.

The problem with this experiment is that the only data you have for evaluating is the number of deaths. Deaths always occur at extreme values of playing pressure. The last two (or four) scripts will have by far the highest death count because the variable bullet speed means the pattern switches between easier and more difficult phases. As the difficulty peaks on the difficult phases, you are more likely to pass the difficulty resulting in death as if the pattern was more constant.

Now, this "Hyperspeed Theory" (stupid name, imho) is all about other extreme values. The reason why your slow attacks seem easier is because they were not slow enough. If you set the bullet speed to 0.1, for example, the bullets would be so slow that you'd get a face full of wall. Slower bullets mean the space between the bullets of different firing moments is reduced. If you have a pattern that requires you to move through this space, lowering the bullet speed will increase the difficulty once approaching towards extreme vaules. That is why VoWG easy is more difficult than un normal: You have to maneuver through much smaller gaps.

On the other hand, increasing the speed of bullets reduces the time you have for reaction and thus will peak the playing pressure (and thus the death count) if it surpasses the border of usual human reaction times. This, however, depends on how good the player is in this kind of thing. For example, easy mode players will probably get overwhelmed by the sheer speed of the last four patterns, while lunatic players wouldn't have a problem because of their trained lower reaction time. If you increased the speed even further, to, say, 20, the cards would become entirely luck based and would yield a high death count.
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CK Crash

  • boozer
Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2009, 06:48:39 PM »
True, but I can't reduce the speed much without most of the timer being wasted just waiting for the wall of bullets, and I don't want to force people to play a 10-15 minute boss just for gathering extra data on that. I tried to find a middle difficulty that would keep the results from being 0 across the board, but obviously that's fairly difficult in itself. These results are being combined with those of people who barely play Touhou, so keep that in mind.

Also, IMO the early patterns were slow enough for the gap between bullets to be noticeably smaller, although maybe not to the extent where it would be harder for most Touhou players.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2009, 06:56:15 PM by Onthenet »

Drake

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2009, 06:50:37 PM »
I wonder if you could possibly get people into danmaku with this lol

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Snaka

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2009, 07:08:14 PM »
The greens
They killed me
Everything else was perfect
Damn, the greens

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puremrz

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2009, 07:22:04 PM »
#15 only.
It wasn't the speed that got me, it was because of the random unlucky wall that came at me. ;(
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Nimono

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2009, 07:36:08 PM »
I had quite a few deaths, most of them me accidentally moving into a bullet when trying to get away from another. Oddly enough, I didn't have much problem with the greens. I didn't die at all on the first two. o_O I find this weird, because I generally have trouble with fast bullet patterns, and yet with these, they were like second nature to me. Yay. Variable was the most fun to me, though.

Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2009, 09:07:58 PM »
Wait...

You can load player scripts that aren't in the player dir? Interesting...

CK Crash

  • boozer
Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2009, 09:12:14 PM »
Wait...

You can load player scripts that aren't in the player dir? Interesting...

And today I just learned that functions can return a value instead of just being subs with parameters. I learn new things everyday. AND IT PISSES ME OFF

Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2009, 09:17:11 PM »
And today I just learned that functions can return a value instead of just being subs with parameters. I learn new things everyday. AND IT PISSES ME OFF
Really? Like add return x at the end and it works!?


Also pattern 15 is RAGE. Lost my 1cc to it by dying twice, but then when I continued I dodged it perfectly aodfiafoashdfoiane

Knuckx117

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2009, 09:22:36 PM »
Green and Yellow are what gave me the most difficulty. Died at least once on each of the greens, and died twice on the first and third yellow patterns.

Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2009, 10:01:35 PM »
I tried to find a middle difficulty that would keep the results from being 0 across the board

Sorry...

Really? Like add return x at the end and it works!?

Yup. Only works with functions.

You can load player scripts that aren't in the player dir? Interesting...

You can load anything from anywhere (inside /th_dnh/), but if it's not in the right directory Danmakufu just wont automatically load it.

Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2009, 10:03:19 PM »

Nimble

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2009, 11:30:10 PM »
I feel like gambling.

Red01 : (~=w=)~
Red02 : ~(=w=~)
Red03 : =w= be careful
Red04 : =w= big hole and little passage
Blue01 : ~(=w=~) (~=w=)~
Blue02 : =w=~
Blue03 : =w= I need some concentrate
Blue04 : =w= not bad as red04... ouch!
Green01 : \=A=\   /=A=/
Green02 : =w= I got some brake
Green03 : =A=!! wait wait wait!! ouch!!
Green04 : =A=" I don't like this~~~~ OUCH!!!
Yellow01 : =w=" I see some moving hole here
Yellow02 : =w= can I have some tea?
Yellow03 : =A=!! Tewi!! I need your help!
Yellow04 : =A=!!! Tewi!!!!

At least, I got some luck to survive all yellow.
For me,
very slow bullet = I'll hit the bullet myself while dodging.
very fast bullet = the bullet'll hit me before I move my finger.
then medium speed = stupid death welcome here.

Blargel

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #19 on: December 13, 2009, 12:38:12 AM »
And my guess on which would be hardest is confirmed. I always hated walls of slow bullets and variable speeds with the chance of generating almost-solid walls when they reach the bottom of the screen. However, the bullets weren't slow enough in the slow ones, and not random enough in the variable speed ones I didn't encounter many difficult walls in the variable speed ones.

Also, why the hell are people surprised that you can return values in a function? Sheesh how the hell do you people script while missing such important concepts? Especially you, Onthenet, you're making a full game! ???
« Last Edit: December 13, 2009, 12:39:45 AM by Blargel »
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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #20 on: December 13, 2009, 12:43:23 AM »
And my guess on which would be hardest is confirmed. I always hated walls of slow bullets and variable speeds with the chance of generating almost-solid walls when they reach the bottom of the screen. However, the bullets weren't slow enough in the slow ones, and not random enough in the variable speed ones I didn't encounter many difficult walls in the variable speed ones.

Also, why the hell are people surprised that you can return values in a function? Sheesh how the hell do you people script while missing such important concepts? Especially you, Onthenet, you're making a full game! ???
AND IT PISSES ME OFF

Lawence Codye

  • The Nine Tails of Subconscious...
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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #21 on: December 13, 2009, 04:32:14 PM »
finally got around to doing it...finally...

fun fact...while the high speed green circle patterns did take most of my lives,
it was the variable yellow patterns in general that almost clipped a life a piece from me(in one pattern's case you could say I was saved by the bell...sorry)...

doubt this info was of any use to you but just in case I felt like I should mention it anyway...
I'm done talking now...
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Helepolis

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #22 on: December 13, 2009, 05:32:30 PM »
Sorry for the late post: Results --> Died on 7 and 14 only once.

EXCUSE -->  died on 7 because my finger was on the wrong button due to pause to fill in the form. Died on 14 due to miscalculating the bullets.

Replay, see attachment

Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #23 on: December 13, 2009, 09:57:50 PM »
I would help you net, but I just DLED Danmaku and even with apploc it won't work when I load a script.

Nonnie Grey

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #24 on: December 14, 2009, 09:08:07 AM »
Large bullets got me every time except on the slow run. I never could figure out the hitboxes on bigger bullets. They're always so deceptive... That and I think they really walled me on all three of my deaths to #15.

I misjudged the speed of the bullets in #6 and wound up eating one at the last possible second when preparing to pause to record my results. That'll teach me to drop my guard. XD

AweStriker Nova

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Re: Danmaku Science Fair!
« Reply #25 on: December 16, 2009, 02:50:51 AM »
Sorry I've been out, I had finals.

I had to use two continues, but then again, I'm out of practice  :P

I died four times on pattern 11. All other patterns were cleared with 0 or 1 deaths.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2009, 03:39:01 AM by AweStriker Nova »