Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou discussion thread #2 (Read 222460 times)

Deranged · « **Reply #930 on:** February 11, 2010, 05:03:25 PM »

Quote from: Ghaleon on February 11, 2010, 03:51:40 PM

I'm not at my computer so I can't see but thanks for this, if that has enemy def/mnd values... You might want to file a restraining order against me because my affection might get innapropriate =p.

Yep it does, as well as any unnatural HP/stat changes bosses go through while fighting them. For example...

Quote from: yoshicookiezeus on February 11, 2010, 04:54:00 PM

Does anyone know approximately how much health
Spoiler:
Mokou
has left once she uses
Spoiler:
Resurrection
? I assume that the way to beat her is to Master Spark/Silent Selene/[insert other powerful attack here] her to death before she destroys everyone on the next turn, but when I just fought her I got surprised and only had time to bring out a 240-SP Marisa, whose 30,000-damage Master Spark just wasn't enough to bring her down. I did fine until that point though, with my only casualty being
Spoiler:
Ran
, but that doesn't help when your entire party is wiped out in one single attack...

80k, +12k for each turn she gets after. Master Spark should probably be doing more than 30k (is it 80% MAG up as well?).

It's also entirely possible to get your tanks to survive her killer attack if you load up on FIR affinity equips for them, which can buy you a bit more time to switch in other attackers.

yoshicookiezeus · « **Reply #931 on:** February 11, 2010, 05:11:09 PM »

Quote from: Deranged on February 11, 2010, 05:03:25 PM

Master Spark should probably be doing more than 30k (is it 80% MAG up as well?).

No, it was more like 10% left over from some earlier not-very-buffed attack run. (I usually don't have the patience to keep switching her in and out to build up her MAG very far...) This was the first time I had gotten that far in the battle, so

Spoiler:

kind of took my by surprise. I have fought enough bosses earlier to know that when they do obvious focusing moves like that, it is time to get rid of them or die, so I basically just brought out what I had and found out that it wasn't enough.

In other news, I somehow managed to defeat one of the 14F sigil guardians on my first attempt, even though I forgot to change to my boss-fighting team beforehand.

Ghaleon · « **Reply #932 on:** February 11, 2010, 08:47:28 PM »

Quote from: Deranged on February 11, 2010, 05:03:25 PM

Yep it does, as well as any unnatural HP/stat changes bosses go through while fighting them. For example...

I see, wow this thing is sweeeeet. Only thing missing is their damage formulas for spells. Do you know if a boss or enemy casts a spell with the same name as a the player's version, if it shares the formula? I'm thinking no, because Nitori mk 3's cannon doesn't really hit like a mac truck, Yet Yuugi's attacks do, and Nitori's evil twin sister mk3 has more attack than Yuugi's apparently. But in general, do they? Or you not sure (probably not sure).

nintendonut888 · « **Reply #933 on:** February 11, 2010, 08:51:35 PM »

Quote from: NeoGenesis on February 11, 2010, 03:20:48 PM

Nonono-we don't go by Reimu for being the highest level. We do it because basically everyone uses Reimu in their party (GROUP HEAL AND DEF/MND BUFF INSANELY IMPORTANT), and you have her from the very start. I'm pretty sure the recommended levels on the Japanese wiki are based off of Reimu as well.

Yeah, don't expect to be able to beat the boss until at least Reimu lv90. Basing off Chen/Cirno won't get you anywhere because, like, Chen will likely be 10+ levels higher then Reimu when you're ready for the final boss.

And on a different note, I haven't used Cirno much in the later floors, is she useful for you? Since resistance to debuffs/PAR on average increases as you progress in the game, is she still useful, like, for damaging or something? I'm considering using her for a sub-par party playthrough. Because I have nothing else to do after I beat the Plus-Disk Final on this :V

And no, the trash/bosses after 18F are not completely immune to Cirno's stuff, so you don't need to throw her out if you like her. Even the Final Boss is affected... sometimes

Ah, okay. Reimu is currently at level 91 in that case.

As for Cirno? She can't really be counted on to deal good damage (though she's never been on my team for her offensive capabilities), but she is an excellent support unit. If it weren't for Diamond Blizzard paralyzing enemies at a good rate, I would be a lot worse off. Then lay on some Perfect Freezes and you've got some crippled enemies. I don't know about the last two floors, but as of floor 18 paralyzation is still fairly effective.

Serela · « **Reply #934 on:** February 11, 2010, 08:52:05 PM »

Quote from: Ghaleon on February 11, 2010, 08:47:28 PM

I see, wow this thing is sweeeeet. Only thing missing is their damage formulas for spells. Do you know if a boss or enemy casts a spell with the same name as a the player's version, if it shares the formula? I'm thinking no, because Nitori mk 3's cannon doesn't really hit like a mac truck, Yet Yuugi's attacks do, and Nitori's evil twin sister mk3 has more attack than Yuugi's apparently. But in general, do they? Or you not sure (probably not sure).

Pretty darn sure they don't. Like, some of Mokou's attacks are at least part physical, boss Kaguya's attacks really don't seem to ignore mind (Patch takes 100 damage and other people take over 1000? That isn't just affinity.), Yuyuko's attacks have better DTH when a player character I think.

They couldn't match up.

Ghaleon · « **Reply #935 on:** February 11, 2010, 08:54:44 PM »

Quote from: NeoGenesis on February 11, 2010, 08:52:05 PM

Pretty darn sure they don't. Like, some of Mokou's attacks are at least part physical, boss Kaguya's attacks really don't seem to ignore mind (Patch takes 100 damage and other people take over 1000? That isn't just affinity.), Yuyuko's attacks have better DTH when a player character I think.

They couldn't match up.

Yeah true, forgot about kaggy.

MysTeariousYukari · « **Reply #936 on:** February 11, 2010, 09:21:28 PM »

How many battles did I need for Yuugi? cause I have access to 7F yet the last time I checked, she wasn't their to recruit.

yoshicookiezeus · « **Reply #937 on:** February 11, 2010, 09:54:19 PM »

The second one of the 14F sigil guardians has been defeated, after a rather uneventful battle. I think I am finally getting the hang of the whole "switch damage dealers out to nuke, then exchange them for people who can survive the boss's attacks" thing... And now to see if I can actually find which one of the 15F spell circles I activated.

Also, no more Cirno for the file selection screen D:

And I just realized that I have approximately 330k skill points from recent grinding... Time to get Marisa's Master Spark up to those 80k damage it needs to nuke

Spoiler:

desperation phase.

MysTeariousYukari · « **Reply #938 on:** February 12, 2010, 01:17:17 AM »

I have made it to the 10F-12F portion of my 2nd playthrough

Pesco,

Spoiler:

nintendonut888 · « **Reply #939 on:** February 12, 2010, 02:27:21 AM »

Current grinding efforts: Reimu level 94. Slowly but surely everyone is getting stronger. :S Of course, they'll have to get a ways stronger before

Spoiler:

stops being a big dick (pun intended). I moved up to floor 18 since even the easy enemies and higher encounter rate don't justify half experience.

Serela · « **Reply #940 on:** February 12, 2010, 03:04:08 AM »

Reimu lv175. I've beaten all the ver.2 bosses (who were at this point a bit easy) and with my new star, explored enough of 21F running away constantly to recruit

Spoiler:

. Defensively almost identical to Remi with better attack power, but less HP and no self-buff.

Now back to 20F grinding for those god damn items, of which I've only gotten one. GOD. DAMN. ITEMS. I'll probably try out the Bloodstained Seal bosses again first, as well as go murder Boss Rush.

MysTeariousYukari · « **Reply #941 on:** February 12, 2010, 03:37:13 AM »

Neo, I was grinding on 20F until about 220-ish before I moved on, and I had at least 2 of most drops by then, so don't worry about the the drops. In fact the drop rate on 20F seems to be like this "If you really want the drop, you will never get it, you don't want the drop you will get it" SoYeah. :V

nintendonut888 · « **Reply #942 on:** February 12, 2010, 03:51:00 AM »

Reimu level 96. Last attempt on

Spoiler:

had me destroy two of his forms. Sadly, it was doomed from the start because his pre-form shift form killed all my heavy hitters. That beginning of the fight is so dreadful.

Also, I like how in this game, there's no gradual being able to defeat the enemies faster and faster; you simply cross this threshold at some point that makes the enemies drop like flies against you. Oh well, if it makes grinding faster...

LHCling · « **Reply #943 on:** February 12, 2010, 05:01:39 AM »

20F "Final" Boss consists of:

Spoiler:

EDIT: Now it's all:

Spoiler:

Repeat ad infinitum.

Pesco · « **Reply #944 on:** February 12, 2010, 06:35:53 AM »

Quote from: MystearicaUtsuho on February 12, 2010, 01:17:17 AM

I have made it to the 10F-12F portion of my 2nd playthrough

Pesco,
Spoiler:
could you give me the address for increasing a characters Battle Points? Specifically, Rumia, Yomou, Chen, whoever else needs BP to trigger the Orin events, as well as Utsuho and whoever need BP for Flan-chan. I hope this isn't to much to ask.

Quite a tall order you're asking

. Character specific stats are stored in different addresses for everyone's game.

Quote

Battle points address - char level address = 1C8

Max hp address - char level address = 10

These are hex values. Run a search for a char's hp, you always get at least 2 addresses. The first address will be the max, the second is their current. Use the info above and off you go.

Get your target's max hp address, add 1B8 to the address value and you've got battle points. I'll assume you know the precautions to take.

MysTeariousYukari · « **Reply #945 on:** February 12, 2010, 07:19:03 AM »

Precautions? Like what, back-up saves?

Oh and how do I get Max HP Address? If I need that for the BP then thats 1 more thing to figure out v_v

Pesco · « **Reply #946 on:** February 12, 2010, 07:28:47 AM »

Read the instructions... When you search for an hp value, you get 2 (assuming you don't do it during combat) The first address is the max, the second one is the current value.

MysTeariousYukari · « **Reply #947 on:** February 12, 2010, 07:31:02 AM »

Quote from: Pesco on February 12, 2010, 07:28:47 AM

Read the instructions... When you search for an hp value, you get 2 (assuming you don't do it during combat) The first address is the max, the second one is the current value.

I have no clue how to search for the hp value v_v I tried a scan using the targets current max hp, and 10+ addresses showed up in the results on the left...

Ghaleon · « **Reply #948 on:** February 12, 2010, 07:42:23 AM »

Quote from: MystearicaUtsuho on February 12, 2010, 07:31:02 AM

I have no clue how to search for the hp value v_v I tried a scan using the targets current max hp, and 10+ addresses showed up in the results on the left...

I haven't used this cheat program at all, so I don't know if you can do this, but level up or something and re-search, that should narrow the parameters. Dunno if researching will reset the results completely or not.

MysTeariousYukari · « **Reply #949 on:** February 12, 2010, 08:00:17 AM »

I have 0 clue what I am doing here

help please

Ghaleon · « **Reply #950 on:** February 12, 2010, 08:22:52 AM »

Argh, I'm not getting any more 30F drops wahhhhh! I think I can take on all the trash there now. Except maybe

Spoiler:

been too scared to try knowing she has defense ignoring nukes, I hate those.

edit:
I swear I have superpowers, whenever I complain about something in a game, my problem gets solved. Just nabbed an awakened exoskeleton. All stats including hp and sp +150%, all status resists +15, all elemental resists +60. sweeeeet.

Fishin · « **Reply #951 on:** February 12, 2010, 10:24:28 AM »

Quote from: MystearicaUtsuho on February 12, 2010, 08:00:17 AM

I have 0 clue what I am doing here help please

Finding BP addresses is actually really easy to do manually with Cheat Engine.

- Unknown initial value, click first scan
- Win into a random battle with Chen in your party of 4
- Increased value by, enter "2", click next scan
- Swap the rest of your party out except Chen, do increased value by 2 again
- Put Chen into your reserves, win another battle, "value unchanged", and hit next scan
- The only remaining address should be Chen's BP, rinse and repeat with other characters

You might be able to do it faster by checking BP in the middle of a battle since you get one for being on the front line at the start and one at the end, but it's quick enough normally that I never bothered.

Pesco · « **Reply #952 on:** February 12, 2010, 12:23:42 PM »

Quote from: MystearicaUtsuho on February 12, 2010, 08:00:17 AM

I have 0 clue what I am doing here :( help please

1. Search for target hp and get figures
2. Equip gear that adjusts hp and look at figures again
3. ???
4. Follow instructions from above and profit

nintendonut888 · « **Reply #953 on:** February 12, 2010, 03:11:33 PM »

Goal today when I get home (along with writing THAT) is to get Reimu past level 100. Mr. Man's (my new nickname) Nature form is looking to be his hardest after the original form, for three reasons:

1. POISON LOL
2. That one form-specific attack of his that deals like a million damage to everyone
3. The fact that I have no wind nukes (I assume that's his weakness at least)

The fact that I have no status healers makes the first one very worrying, as even Tenshi is vulnerable to Poison. Is Sanae worth bringing into my team even though she'd be a liability otherwise?

Also, just for the record, let me see if I have the weaknesses down:

Spirit: Mystic
Mystic: Spirit
Cold: Fire
Fire: Cold
Nature: Wind
Wind: Nature

It's also a little hard to distinguish which form I am just from looks sometimes.

I didn't even know I was fighting his cold form until he threw Icicle Coffin at me.

Some miscellaneous questions:

1. Do his forms retain their current health if he form shifts before I destroy one?
2. I just KNOW he has some massive end-nuke once I break all his forms. What do I have to watch out for?

Deranged · « **Reply #954 on:** February 12, 2010, 03:28:51 PM »

Quote from: nintendonut888 on February 12, 2010, 03:11:33 PM

1. Do his forms retain their current health if he form shifts before I destroy one?
2. I just KNOW he has some massive end-nuke once I break all his forms. What do I have to watch out for?

1. Yes.
2. No new omgwtf nuke, but he gets a move that increases ATK, DEF, MAG and MND by 66%, which will basically turn Heavenly Demise into his omgwtf nuke. It's entirely random whether he chooses to use it or not though.

yoshicookiezeus · « **Reply #955 on:** February 12, 2010, 03:30:57 PM »

Wow. Just nuked

Spoiler:

final phase with a 103k Master Spark. No idea it would become that powerful just by adding 20 more skill point levels...

EDIT: And two 120k ones along with some Silent Selene and Spear the Gungnir spam brought down

Spoiler:

without very much trouble. That's two new characters recruited in as many hours... Though the character list tells me I'm missing three between

Spoiler:

and

Spoiler:

?

EDITAGAIN: And 130k against

Spoiler:

... Though that fight seemed like it had been made really easy to compensate for having to fight all those knights beforehand. I mean, her Flowing Hellfire barely even harmed Cirno...

MysTeariousYukari · « **Reply #956 on:** February 12, 2010, 05:26:47 PM »

Quote from: Pesco on February 12, 2010, 12:23:42 PM

1. Search for target hp and get figures
2. Equip gear that adjusts hp and look at figures again
3.
4. Follow instructions from above and profit

Ok... I'll assume that Search for target HP = Scan for target HP... which means something is f***ed up. I input Chens HP, scan and I either get more then 15 addresses with the same value, or I get 0 addresses.

yoshicookiezeus · « **Reply #957 on:** February 12, 2010, 05:32:03 PM »

Oh wow. That

Spoiler:

is just pitiful... Sure, it can KO any one of my characters (including

Spoiler:

with 100% defence boost) in one attack, but what does that matter when you can keep it in a state of constant paralysis from the first attack until the end of the battle?

Jaimers · « **Reply #958 on:** February 12, 2010, 06:14:43 PM »

WHAT!? I WAS RIGHT!?

Spoiler:

So yeah, beat the F12 boss trio.
Patchy pretty much went solo on this one, as buffing her MND makes her a fucking tank in this fight. She takes 0 damage from almost everything and is almost impossible to kill. Combine that with Iku's 100% MAG buffs and the fight was over before you knew it.

Should probably go back and fight

Spoiler:

now.

Serela · « **Reply #959 on:** February 12, 2010, 06:39:13 PM »

Quote from: nintendonut888 on February 12, 2010, 03:11:33 PM

1. POISON LOL
2. That one form-specific attack of his that deals like a million damage to everyone
3. The fact that I have no wind nukes (I assume that's his weakness at least)

It's also a little hard to distinguish which form I am just from looks sometimes. I didn't even know I was fighting his cold form until he threw Icicle Coffin at me.

1.Your big tanks should have equipment on the make them at least mostly protected against all ailments. ESPECIALLY Tenshi, since her self-buff has bad side effects, you want her to have a Ribbon or Shuttle Body on her, no questions asked.

Useful items for buffing resistances are Stars of Elendil (Or the slightly weaker versions, Phial of Galadriel), Ribbon, Shuttle Body. You'll get some more cool stuff for this in 19F chests.

2.At least two tanks with DEF/MND buffs should ALWAYS be out against Rinnosuke. Tenshi and 16F girl should do, and you might want 3 (Tenshi-Ran-16F should work, equip Ran with some DEF/MND/Resistance boosting gear and make sure her buffs stay up).

With 2~3 buffed tanks out you shouldn't have to worry about game-overing at all, just keep up the buffs and bring in Sanae/Reimu for healing when needed.

The 4th character should be whoever is ideal for damaging the current form, and use Fire Form to focus/heal/etc. Don't take out Fire Form until it's the only one left, as it doesn't have dangerous attacks or any kind of status effects. And take out Spirit easily with a Master Spark, it can cause DTH.

As for identifying the forms, the color will correspond with the ones associated to the element of course; Fire will be red, Wind will be yellow, Mystic is purple, etc. Cold and Spirit are the only ones you could mix up, just keep in mind Spirit looks a lot more white and magic-y.