Labyrinth of Touhou discussion thread #2

[yoshicookiezeus]

Go for the other one, in the lower half  :V

It would seem like my suspicions were correct. It will be a while before my characters can take 17,000 damage each and surviving.

Also, I just realized that I can bring up a map of the entire floor. That should help my exploring a bit...

[Kanako Yasaka]

Pesco: I told Ruro to change Donut's avatar. It wasn't Donut.

[Pesco]

You still fail for using a screenshot instead of the image rips.

And 18F's art is WAAAYYY better than Yukari's

[Jaimers]

Over 1600 posts of discussion made me want to see what all the fuss is about, so I got this game.

I'm not the biggest fan of RPG's and booooooring grinding, so I'm not sure where I'll go with this. 

[Serela]

Over 1600 posts of discussion made me want to see what all the fuss is about, so I got this game.

I'm not the biggest fan of RPG's and booooooring grinding, so I'm not sure where I'll go with this. 

As far as RPGs go, this game doesn't really have much grinding. Just some fairly minor parts, up until 16/18/20F, which are basically the end of the game (Not counting the Plus-Disk additions). It's still wonderfully challenging though~<3

Something feels so satisfying about all the awesome Touhou pros coming and getting this game  :V

Anyway, lemme go back and find my tips I gave Donut when he started.

Okay, http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=4614.msg230949#msg230949
That, and the rest of that page. :3

[yoshicookiezeus]

Youmu evidently does not like me very much. I can take down her ghost half without problem, but then she just starts ripping through my party with Karma Slash... Is level 13 too low for trying to beat her?

[scherzo]

Thanks a ton, BTW, what education level of math is that in your opinion btw. Not using the formula, but whatever you did to figure it out, or did you just find it somewhere. I guessed math 12 but I'm not sure.

I'm not sure what math 12 would be, but I just used the following summation formulae:
1+2+...+n=n(n+1)/2
1+4+...+n^2=n(n+1)(2n+1)/6

See also Faulhaber's formula.

[Ghaleon]

Youmu evidently does not like me very much. I can take down her ghost half without problem, but then she just starts ripping through my party with Karma Slash... Is level 13 too low for trying to beat her?

13 is enough, youmu is a luck fight somewhat IMO. She is the first and only boss to beat me on my first(second too actually so far, heh) playthru until lily guardian/flan/yukari...I don't remember what came first.

Oops, and the foes...that was more of a 1shot before my first turn thing though.

1+2+...+n=n(n+1)/2

*facepalm*. I should have figured that one out. derrrrp. I've used the very same formula to figure out similar crap in the past too. zomg.

As for your link, too early in the morning for me atm. (I goto bed at like 4am).

[Jaimers]

Well, that was fun. Beat floor 1 and explored a bit of floor 2.
The beginning was a bit rough though, seeing as you have so little SP and all.

I can see myself liking this game.

[nintendonut888]

Now I'm curious to see what floor 18 looks like...though I'm still a long ways off from that. :x

Yay Jaimers! \o/ All the cool people are playing this game. FYI, you actually only need to grind for a few bosses here and there. As long as you explore everywhere and don't run from battles, you'll get all the expeience you need most of the time.

Also yeah, if I get a Yukari avatar, there's thousands of better choices than this one. X(

[Milkyway64]

I just realized the one thing that would make this game better. Individual path graphics.

As in, rather than every single floor's map looking like cardboard, have them reflect the floor's theme more.

[Bananamatic]

Which CAVE bosses are there.
I want a list :V

[yoshicookiezeus]

And Youmu goes down! Turns out that all I needed was use some of all those skill points I just had sitting there...

Also, a question: What stat determines how effective a healing spell is?

[Ghaleon]

And Youmu goes down! Turns out that all I needed was use some of all those skill points I just had sitting there...

Also, a question: What stat determines how effective a healing spell is?

Depends on the healer.
Hong: attack
Reimu: mag
...I think it's mag for all the other healers come to think of it.

Which CAVE bosses are there.
I want a list :V

The game's cool factor is way beyond cave bosses, play the game or else nub...

But if you insist

Spoiler:

Some weird butterfly thing with a name that is actually longer than this description I'm using to describe it right now,
Some robot with a propellor head apparently from the game pink sweets,
Hibachi,
Bloody papa (that's his name right? I forget, the boss from death smiles

I THINK that's it

edit: Ninja font change, eek.

[Serela]

Depends on the healer.
Hong: attack
Reimu: mag

Meiling actually uses equal Atk+Mag, so both are important. Atk is higher though, and easiest to raise via skillpoints for her.

Also, that "name that is insanely long" one, thats the one called Evaccania Doom or however you spell it. But yes, they even mention the incredible length in-game  :V

I just realized the one thing that would make this game better. Individual path graphics.

As in, rather than every single floor's map looking like cardboard, have them reflect the floor's theme more.

This would be pretty awesome. I'd also love if they buffed the more useless characters; for example, Cirno is total crap after SPD down stops working on all the bosses, Rumia isn't much useful at all, and I can definitely keep going on.

Oooh, and if the floor music started where it left off after battles, because the game has some pretty cool music (Esp. 20F!) but it takes awhile to start.

Mmm... and if they had some floor-specific backrounds to go in the character's heads for in-battle instead of just whiteness.

edit: Ninja font change, eek.

And if the ingame font suddenly changed, you started/stopped using Japanese locales, because when you use Jap locales then the game starts using a really pretty looking font.

[Ghaleon]

Meiling actually uses equal Atk+Mag, so both are important. Atk is higher though, and easiest to raise via skillpoints for her.

Also, that "name that is insanely long" one, thats the one called Evaccania Doom or however you spell it. But yes, they even mention the incredible length in-game  :V

...Ahh so she does, doh
As for the name, it's longer than that, or is your version just the first two words or something. I thought "light wings" was somewhere in the visible part of the name.

And if the ingame font suddenly changed, you started/stopped using Japanese locales, because when you use Jap locales then the game starts using a really pretty looking font.

As for the font, I'm talking about the forums, not the game, though it might have just been size.

This would be pretty awesome. I'd also love if they buffed the more useless characters; for example, Cirno is total crap after SPD down stops working on all the bosses, Rumia isn't much useful at all, and I can definitely keep going on.

I haven't used Rumia much yet (she's in my 2nd playthru's group though), but I still don't think she's useless. Moonlight ray's formula is quite possibly one of the best in the game for its delay (and sp cost but who cares about that), it certainly more than makes up for her bad mag stat. Assuming your target isn't strong against mystic, she's almost like patchy spamming silent selene.

Oooh, and if the floor music started where it left off after battles, because the game has some pretty cool music (Esp. 20F!) but it takes awhile to start.

YES, I think I mentioned that a few pages back, asking if the new patch did that. I'm not sure if I got around to it, but that was definately #1 on my wish list.. I just LOVE the F9 music...Kinda unrelated, but F5 music totally makes me think I'm playing ogre battle, that song just SCREAMS ogre battle...

Mmm... and if they had some floor-specific backrounds to go in the character's heads for in-battle instead of just whiteness.

Meh..

One thing I think every traditional RPG should have, and they almost never do: Difficulty settings. I mean seriously, how hard would it be to stick a multiplier in front of enemy stats for this. Probably not their attack stats so much since that just forces you to grind more. But making them have more health, possibly defense/mnd, maybe a smaller extent for speed.. (or less for easier settings)..

Being able to play as the whole cast starting from floor 1 is a given too (going to have to start a 3rd game for that reason).

Plus disk is really stingy on the characters added. I mean I was kinda dissapointed that you never could get some of the characters missing from MoF and SA...Also kinda dissapointed you don't get Kanako until so late ='(. WTF can you get cooty-bag but not satori/koishi.. WHYYYY

[Serela]

I haven't used Rumia much yet (she's in my 2nd playthru's group though), but I still don't think she's useless. Moonlight ray's formula is quite possibly one of the best in the game for its delay (and sp cost but who cares about that), it certainly more than makes up for her bad mag stat. Assuming your target isn't strong against mystic, she's almost like patchy spamming silent selene.

I really like Rumia after playing this game. It's just made me love her. But... she really does suck. She's frail, slow, her MND-ignoring attack does terrible damage so its only good against really low-HP stuff that takes 0 damage or for cleaning up weak stuff. Demarcation is useful... if fighting a boss with debuffing, which unfortunately isn't many.

And as for Moonlight Ray... it's nearly as strong as Silent Selene when you first get her, but it soon downgrades to only decent damage, at the level of most good attacker's multi-hit attacks that you spam on the floor trash. In other words... not that great. And I even had her MAG buffed up even higher then my other characters, gear and skill level-wise.

I REALLY like Rumia now, so I want to use her but... she just sucks. Her party debuff+PAR curing is really the only good thing about her, and it isn't useful often.

[Ghaleon]

I really like Rumia after playing this game. It's just made me love her. But... she really does suck. She's frail, slow, her MND-ignoring attack does terrible damage so its only good against really low-HP stuff that takes 0 damage or for cleaning up weak stuff. Demarcation is useful... if fighting a boss with debuffing, which unfortunately isn't many.

And as for Moonlight Ray... it's nearly as strong as Silent Selene when you first get her, but it soon downgrades to only decent damage, at the level of most good attacker's multi-hit attacks that you spam on the floor trash. In other words... not that great. And I even had her MAG buffed up even higher then my other characters, gear and skill level-wise.

I REALLY like Rumia now, so I want to use her but... she just sucks. Her party debuff+PAR curing is really the only good thing about her, and it isn't useful often.

Personally I dislike rumia as a character, but I still dunno in game (for bosses, she really is garbage against trash). I don't see how it can lose effectiveness later on. she levels up WAY faster than patchy. Are you sure you aren't just..you know.. spoiling the other casters with better gear in comparison or something? while her  low mnd hurts her compared to patchy, she can't tank spells like a champ. But her def and hp are noticeably higher (along with her level) so that a single arrow rain wont WTFPWN her like they always do patchy.

AHH you made me forget what else I wish the game had...

The battle music is also good (non boss battles I mean, boss battles are good too normally but that's not the point), but you rarely hear that as well. So the game needs a semi-rare encounter (more common than Nitori on floor 7 and 8, but prob not by much) that takes awhile to kill for every floor. It shouldn't be the source of some extra good piece of gear that drops only 1% of the time from an already rare encounter. But it should give you much greater exp and sexp to compensate you for your time spent beating it up... Plus maybe a better chance of a good item that you can get from ordinary enemies as well.

[Serela]

I had been giving Rumia my best MAG gear and slightly more points in her MAG then I gave my other casters. At the boss fight with Alice, Moonlight Ray was like a nuke. But, as time passed... in comparison to my other attacks, the damage growth just didn't keep up at all.

Around the point of 9F, Moonlight Ray only did the damage all my other characters did on their multi-hits used for floor trash (maybe less), despite still giving Rumia special treatment. I really wanted to keep using her, but she just sucked ass.

[Pesco]

Nothing less than 500 levels of mag and 200 levels of spd to make Rumia badass!

[Serela]

Nothing less than 500 levels of mag and 200 levels of spd to make Rumia badass!

MOONLIGHT RAY FOR MEGA BOSS OVERKILL
DSotM FOR WIPING FLOOR TRASH OFF THE FACE OF THE EARTH
DEMARCATION IS PARTY HP MAXED OUT AND PAR/DEBUFFS REMOVED

You are already dead.

[Fishin]

FYI, you actually only need to grind for a few bosses here and there. As long as you explore everywhere and don't run from battles, you'll get all the expeience you need most of the time.

On the other hand, if you use a guide and don't explore the entire maps (on the early floors it's no big deal, but some of the later ones get huge), be prepared to grind at most boss fights.  It's also pretty easy to cheat via Cheat Engine and avoid the grind but still keep the game challenging.

[Jaimers]

So I take it I'm not supposed to fight

Spoiler:

Wriggle's bug thing

on F2 yet?

It killed me in two shots.  :V

[nintendonut888]

You'll be seeing them as late as floor 4, and by then they'll be barely harder than a normal enemy. Then IIRC in floor 6,

Spoiler:

they become normal enemies

.

[AlexX Unlimited]

You still fail for using a screenshot instead of the image rips.

Know where I can get some? I'm thinking of swapping up to Aquabitch or The Green One for my avatar subject. Possibly sig too if I can get anything good... Know of any good quotes to sig-ify?

[nintendonut888]

Is it just me, or did the enemies suddenly get ridiculously strong on floor 14? D: Those bronze golems can one shot anyone but my tanks and have so much health and obviously resistant to paralysis and AAAAAAH! D:

[Serela]

Is it just me, or did the enemies suddenly get ridiculously strong on floor 14? D: Those bronze golems can one shot anyone but my tanks and have so much health and obviously resistant to paralysis and AAAAAAH! D:

From that point on, the stuff on the floor will rape you at first and then be fairly easy after leveling up. Anyway, the golems should be attacked with heavy hitting stuff to take them out quickly; they shouldn't usually get to hurt you.

Also, the Knowledge ones, or whatever they're called, those recolors from 7F... those things have the dreaded "Destroy Magic", and I think Ether Flare too. Former drains the SP of your 4 active people to 0, latter deals mass damage to the entire party (and can definitely lead to Game Over in some cases!)

[nintendonut888]

I see. However, I'm so inefficient at killing these guys it'd almost be faster to grind on floor 13. :\

Accidentally ran into a sigil boss, but thankfully beat it without any preparation.

[Serela]

I see. However, I'm so inefficient at killing these guys it'd almost be faster to grind on floor 13. :\

Accidentally ran into a sigil boss, but thankfully beat it without any preparation.

15F is only a LOT worse, so if you really can't handle this floor, you really might consider going back.

By the way, check on Kaguya sometimes. :V

[Ghaleon]

I see. However, I'm so inefficient at killing these guys it'd almost be faster to grind on floor 13. :\

I've said it a few times, but pretty much as soon as you're done the 10-12F grind, every floor has trash that makes you crap your pants at first. The worst of the worst are probably beldamyrs or whatever they are called.. guhh.