Topic: Welcome to PSL: Hatate's Writer's Lounge ~ Rules, info and general discussion!  (Read 36278 times)

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Alfred F. Jones

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I'm trying to remember the name of a story on here that catalogued Parsee's descent from normal human to incredibly bitter youkai and I cannot remember the name of it for my life.

Help a brother out here?
This? It's short, so I don't know if that's what you're looking for.

Also, in honour of Forbidden Scrollery's new character, KGB has been taken over and renamed accordingly. All hail your new book-lending overlady.

BT

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  • Nickname: Dan
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Or this. Although it's probably what I just got cut by.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2012, 09:05:09 pm by BT »

Joveus Molai

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Also, in honour of Forbidden Scrollery's new character, KGB has been taken over and renamed accordingly. All hail your new book-lending overlady.




We'll miss you, Koa.  :qq:

  • Guest

It was neither of those two stories. It was a three-parter I think and involved a house catching on fire, as well as Paru being shocked at someone exhibiting infidelity.

Wondering if I'm hallucinating now. :V

Iced Fairy

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It was neither of those two stories. It was a three-parter I think and involved a house catching on fire, as well as Paru being shocked at someone exhibiting infidelity.

Wondering if I'm hallucinating now. :V
This is what you're looking for.

Ruro, Rou, how could you two forget The Girl in the Cave?  :P

Alfred F. Jones

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  • y de la lucha que hizo por Madrid
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I thought it was so easily identifiable as "long Parsee fic" that it had to be something shorter if he couldn't remember it. :ohdear:

  • Guest

Ahhhhhh, yessss, that's it.

Thanks, Iced!

( ╯°д°)╯

  • Neophyte
  • Nickname: Dedic545
I happened to be  reading Reborn in Gensokyo, but i've finished the content on the forums and the link for usuallydead website doesn't work :ohdear:.  I have also searched around the usuallydead website itself but couldn't find anything ???. Can anyone tell me why or give and links to it?

Tengukami

  • Breaking news. Any season.
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I happened to be  reading Reborn in Gensokyo, but i've finished the content on the forums and the link for usuallydead website doesn't work :ohdear:.  I have also searched around the usuallydead website itself but couldn't find anything ???. Can anyone tell me why or give and links to it?

That's a website run and maintained by one guy, who really isn't around. If the site is down, it's likely his issue. I'd suggest using the contact information on his site, if there is any, to reach him.

Fan Fiction
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"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."

Alfred F. Jones

  • Estamos orgullosos del Batallón Lincoln
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  • y de la lucha que hizo por Madrid
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  • Nickname: Sakura Rurouni
Thanks to some nice person I contacted via Fuck Yeah Character Development (which is itself a great resource, you should all check it out), I got my hands on a lovely little emotions thesaurus which lists the kinds of actions/internal feelings/thinking people have in relation to certain emotions. It's certainly not an exhaustive list of all emotions, but it certainly covers a lot of the major ones. Instead of just telling the reader "she felt uncomfortable", you can now call attention to how she is turning slowly, has stilted dialogue, is consciously forcing her limbs to relax, and so on! Really useful, especially if you're having troubles with showing and not telling, or if you just want to learn how to use more descriptive actions to reflect a character's feelings at the time. (Of course, age, maturity, and personality type all influence these expressions, as several of these entries state.) And if you want to purchase the whole book, either in printed or PDF form, it's fairly inexpensive for such a useful resource. But the sample entries are themselves hella useful, so check it out!

http://thebookshelfmuse.blogspot.com/p/the-emotion-thesaurus.html

hungrybookworm

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Hi, I have a question! When posting fanfic on here, could I just paste a link to the fic (eg AO3 or ff.net) rather than the whole chapter? Or is that frowned upon?

TwilightsCall

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I would say whatever floats your boat.

It is certainly more convenient for readers if you post the actual story in-thread, but if that's problematic for some reason (formatting issues, laziness issues, etc) it's better to post a link then post nothing at all.

That being said, if its something thats not allowed on the site (NSFW, etc) then you have to link to it as per forum rules.  Otherwise, its up to you.

Iced Fairy

  • So like if you try to hurt alkaza
  • *
  • I will set you on fire k'?
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Hi, I have a question! When posting fanfic on here, could I just paste a link to the fic (eg AO3 or ff.net) rather than the whole chapter? Or is that frowned upon?
While allowed, you'll get more readers and better response if it's right here.  In addition if you just toss up a general fanfiction link it won't be summarized as deeply as fics actually on site.

hungrybookworm

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Great, thanks for the responses! Guess I'd better go write some fic then.

WBL Studios

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I have some non-Touhou fan fiction to share with the world.  The problem is... well, it's based on old-school wrestling.  Essentially it's the best women from the anime universe in a hardcore wrestling environment.  Tables, ladders, chairs, what have you, but it's a whole weekly show.  A full 26 episodes, plus a 6 episode Gaiden, for the main show, Extreme Bishoujo Wrestling.  The problem with posting it here, of course, would be the violence, as well as some of the profanity... although the b-word is as strong as it gets.

So my question is... instead of posting the work here, can I post a preview of each story arc here, and then at the end of the preview, post a link to my Deviantart page where the work is, so long as there's a Parential Advisory-type warning?

Joveus Molai

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Something I've found to be helpful:

Consulting visual media, in particular comics/manga, can be a useful tool for figuring out how to convey a scene via showing rather than telling--at least in my experience. Since comics can only use a minimal amount of dialogue (i.e. text) outside of exposition to convey information, and since comics are a visual medium, they have to use a great deal of showing rather than telling, and imagining a given scene in a textual medium in comic form is an handy way to figure out what to show (elements of the scene to describe), what to say (the dialogue), and what to tell (abstract information that is less descriptive and more explanatory or expository).

For example, let's say you have a scene where Alice is yelling at Marisa about something. You're trying to convey the idea that Alice is primarily angry, but also flustered and embarrassed, while Marisa is in a trolling mood rather than feeling guilty or remorseful. If you're having trouble figuring out what to show, what to say, and what to tell, imagine the scene as in a comic, which might look like this:

Overall scene: Alice and Marisa at a table in Alice's house.

Panel 1:
Alice is...
-Bolting up out of her chair
-Facial expression = scowl, but also holds a deep red blush
-Gritting her teeth
-Right hand is jabbing towards Marisa
-Left is balled up and trembling
-Maybe Shanghai is floating around Alice's shoulder, also looking rather cross
-Tense body language
Dialogue: "Damn it Marisa! You promised you wouldn't tell anyone!"

Panel 2:
Marisa is...
-Lounging on a chair
-Doesn't meet Alice's gaze, is looking at something else
-Casually munching on a snack, or sipping tea
-Shit-eating grin and/or giant troll face
-Relaxed body language
Dialogue: "Oh, did I? I can't seem to remember..."

Once you've visualized the scene in comic form as above, pick some, or perhaps all, of the above elements and write some prose around it. For example...

She bolted out of her chair, scowling yet also blushing. "Damn it Marisa!" said Alice, jabbing an accusing finger at the black-white witch, "You promised you wouldn't tell anyone!" Her other hand trembled as she gripped it tight.

Marisa casually inspected some dolls sitting on a shelf. "Oh did I? I can't seem to remember..." She shot Alice a grin as she sat back in her chair, chewing noisily on a pastry all the while.


Granted, comics/manga have certain visual tricks that would be pointless to replicate in pure text, but nonetheless, if you're trying to show a scene, trying to imagine how a comic would do it then going from there might help. If nothing else, it can serve as a useful visualizing tool.

Iced Fairy

  • So like if you try to hurt alkaza
  • *
  • I will set you on fire k'?
  • LOOK AT ME
That can be a useful trick Joveus.  The big thing to remember is that writing isn't a script.  One of the big early mistakes a lot of people make is writing a very long four koma script instead of a story.  Use visualization to get sentences, but never forget flow.

Joveus Molai

  • Bear the Word, and the Word will bear you.
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That can be a useful trick Joveus.  The big thing to remember is that writing isn't a script.  One of the big early mistakes a lot of people make is writing a very long four koma script instead of a story.  Use visualization to get sentences, but never forget flow.

Ah yes, Iced is correct: while the above trick is handy for trying to visualize a given moment in a scene, you shouldn't use that trick for every sentence. Apply the trick (if you must) only when actually describing the visual aspects of a scene is necessary.

Nicktendonick

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Hey there everyone.

I wasn't sure where to ask this, and I'd figure this is the best place to start that conversation.

How many people here have editors or beta/prereaders? How does one find such people (Because I'm looking for one) and how's your interactions/how effective is this?

TwilightsCall

  • 名探偵ヱリカ参上!
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^ Over a month late, but I don't have any beta readers, so I don't really have much to add :x  It's definitely something I'm considering for my next work, but I haven't decided for sure.


On another topic, while looking up stuff for NaNoWriMo the other day, I came across this website:

http://www.writingexcuses.com/

It consists of 15 minute podcasts done by some rather successful (at least, the ones who participate that I know are rather successful) authors who talk about a variety of story-building tips, as well as general writing advice.  I've listened to a good number of their clips over the past couple days (probably too many, to be honest, as I should really be writing instead :x), and I find their talks incredibly insightful and definitely useful.  If you were looking for something to get you in the mood for writing, or are lucky enough to have a problem they've discussed already (they've had 8 seasons, so its not that unlikely), I would definitely recommend checking it out!

(PS More brackets because rereading this post I've decided I haven't used enough of them)

Joveus Molai

  • Bear the Word, and the Word will bear you.
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(Apologies in advance if the following is something everyone already knows.)

There is a well-known saying in fiction writing: "Write what you know". Taken literally, this statement is misleading--as Stephen King once pointed out in an autobiography/how-to-write-stuff book, this would seem to indicate that one cannot write things like science fiction or fantasy, since, obviously, none of us have directly experienced such a thing. Rather, I prefer to interpret the saying in a different way: when writing a given story, make sure you know at least as much about the setting details as your target audience. This is important because most people find it distracting when their knowledge of how a given thing works conflicts with how that thing works in the story.

For example, let's say you're trying to write a teen drama set in a contemporary, American economically middle-class high school. If your target audience is ~18-40 year old middle-class Americans, the vast majority of that audience will have gone through high school. Not every high school experience will be the exact same, but nonetheless most of that audience will remember little details from high school, like that hot girl/guy in X class, the school bully, the nerdy/jerkass/nice teachers, the straight-laced school principal, the rowdy lunch room, the school gossip about who's dating who, etc. Because of the nature of these details, f you yourself are not intimately familiar with American high schools (i.e. went through it yourself, or at least studied it very extensively), then replicating the general high school experience from scratch will be extremely difficult. And if you fail to properly replicate the general high school experience in your teen drama, your target audience of 18-40 year olds will be too distracted going, "Wait, this is supposed to be a high school? My high school wasn't like this at all!" to pay attention to the rest of your story.

But keep in mind that you only have to know at least as much about the setting elements in your story as your target audience does. This is why Hollywood movies are able to get away with blatant historical inaccuracies--aside from the very broad strokes, most people don't know enough about history to be distracted when the inaccuracies come up. You might not be able to get away with the Nazis winning WWII in a historical movie, for example (unless it's very clearly stated to be a "what-if" story or something similar), but you could easily get away with generic German soldiers running around with MP44s (even if these were comparatively rare), the Wehrmacht using the wrong types of tanks at the wrong time, bizarre military strategies and tactics, etc. since most people don't know enough about WWII military hardware and such to really notice. Likewise, no one really gets into action movie-style gunfights against hordes of faceless gun-wielding mooks, so most people don't notice that the hero has very bad trigger discipline, or is making literally impossible shots all the time, or somehow survives that giant explosion behind him just be leaping dramatically at the right moment.

The implication of this is that speculative fiction--namely Science Fiction and Fantasy--are doubly able to get away with what would otherwise be oddities in the setting. In your generic Fantasy setting, for example, mages are often in service to non-mage kings. Depending on how magic works in the setting, however, it may make much more sense for mages to be kings instead. Nonetheless, few audience members will be distracted by something like this because, obviously, none of them have lived in such a world. No one has a real frame of reference to compare that Fantasy setting to, since no one has lived in a world with mages in it.

So...yeah. It's not so much "write what you know" as much as "make sure you know at least as much as your audience knows about the things you're writing", I think.

Joveus Molai

  • Bear the Word, and the Word will bear you.
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Speaking of the above...

I have plans to write a romance story at some point, but romantic relationships don't fall under my purview of "stuff that I know at least as much as my audience". Does anyone have any tips on how to write a good romance that feels like a real romantic relationship between 2 people? Not just the build up to where the guy/girl gets the guy/girl, but also the stuff that comes afterwards--the fights, the adjustments you have to make to let a person into your life at such an intimate level, etc.

hungrybookworm

  • Shipper On Board
  • Gender: Female
Speaking of the above...

I have plans to write a romance story at some point, but romantic relationships don't fall under my purview of "stuff that I know at least as much as my audience". Does anyone have any tips on how to write a good romance that feels like a real romantic relationship between 2 people? Not just the build up to where the guy/girl gets the guy/girl, but also the stuff that comes afterwards--the fights, the adjustments you have to make to let a person into your life at such an intimate level, etc.
Romance stories are heavily character driven, so to get a really involving, memorable romance story you'll want to think about your leads' personalities, desires, and backstories and use those as the main sources of plot and conflict. If you can nail those down, then use them to create some great chemistry between your two main characters, then that's half the battle right there. Often bad romance stories have iffy characterisation (ie Jane is a tsundere who hates men, but no explanation is given as to why she hates men, and beyond her tsundere character there's nothing particularly unique or unusual about her, so the reader isn't sure why Bob would like her, let alone put up with her borderline abusive behaviour) or forces the characters to do things because plot says so, rather than let the character's own feelings and desires drive it (ie Harry runs out the room due to a misunderstanding and decides to go start a new life in New Zealand rather than talk about the misunderstanding with his girlfriend, all because the author couldn't think of a good way to create some new conflict.) Don't worry, if you keep thinking things like 'How would my main character react to this?' and 'Why would she react like that?', then you should avoid most pitfalls. I also recommend finding one of those character questionnaires, and filling it in 'in character'. It can help fill gaps and bring up ideas you wouldn't otherwise have, plus give you a more solid understanding of your characters' thought processes. (I have a really good one handy, just say if you want it.)

Personally I think up the main scenes I want in the story, then work backwards from that. Let's use a Touhou example. Let's say I want to write a romance fic starring Sakuya and Meiling, and I think up a shocking scene where Sakuya slaps Meiling around the face, tears in her eyes. Sakuya, as we all know, would not normally do something like this, so what spurred her to suddenly strike out? Maybe she's been under more stress recently? Why? Perhaps Reimilia's been asking her to do something particularly crazy, and Sakuya's feelings for Meiling are interfering with it, so when Meiling says or does something that upsets her, Sakuya feels far more angry than she normally would. Maybe she feels that Meiling doesn't appreciate or understand her enough? And what about Meiling? Did she mean to say something so nasty? While it would be perfectly in character for her to say it by accident, wouldn't it be more interesting if she knew what she was saying would upset Sakuya? Maybe she's been trying to find the right time to tell her for days, but Sakuya's work schedule means they rarely get alone time together. Maybe if she didn't tell her soon, something really bad would happen, so Meiling has to tell her right this instant. And perhaps on top of that, Meiling worries that Sakuya doesn't always take what she says seriously, so she isn't sure how her girlfriend will react.

All that before we even start dealing with the aftermath. See how much believable conflict we can get just through that? (And we don't even know what Meiling said!) Also while it's good to give the characters (and readers) a break every now and then, it's important to keep up the tension to keep your readers interested (especially if you're going for something long). Also if you have time, head down the library and grab a few romance books, or even suspense books, or any kind of novel that has characterisation as its driving force, and see how those authors handle it.

Woah this ended up really long. Hope it helped! Also what works for one writer might not work for others, so hopefully some others will chip in with their own way of doing things. Good luck :P

Sixten

  • Legendary Creature - Frog
  • 6/10
  • Nickname: House of Sixten
So I just finished making a 42-page comic (a Toho doujinshi, of course). In the past, I stuck links to my works on the art forum, where I received helpful feedback regarding the art. If I wanted feedback on the story, would it be proper to create a new thread in this section of the forums?
  • House of Sixten

Iced Fairy

  • So like if you try to hurt alkaza
  • *
  • I will set you on fire k'?
  • LOOK AT ME
Quote
So I just finished making a 42-page comic (a Toho doujinshi, of course). In the past, I stuck links to my works on the art forum, where I received helpful feedback regarding the art. If I wanted feedback on the story, would it be proper to create a new thread in this section of the forums?

Hm...  I think Aya's writing workshop would be a better choice for a one off like this.  You might throw up a request on the IRC as well, though I can't guarantee any response there.  It's kinda hit or miss depending on who has free time I'm afraid.

I did a quick runthrough myself, though I'm at work and kinda just skimming, and a couple things stuck out in my mind.  First, your sentence flow is weak.  I'd write all your scenes down as text and have an editor go through them to make the words flow better.  In addition setting up your dialogue like that will help you develop unique accents for your characters.  Your characters have a uniform accent, which keeps the reader from full immersion.

The other thing that came to my mind is your expressions don't always match the severity of the text.  You seem to be aiming for a comedy (in the archaic sense) so you should cut loose with the exaggerated expressions a little more I think.  That will put your humor and overstated situations in better context I think.

Your setup was pretty well designed, especially since you aren't using standard Gensoukyo.  You managed to setup the needed explanations without dumping too much text.  The idea was cute as well, though it could probably be tweaked here and there to keep the proper feel from multiple critical viewpoints.

Sixten

  • Legendary Creature - Frog
  • 6/10
  • Nickname: House of Sixten
@Iced Fairy: Thanks a lot for your feedback. Just like with the art feedback, it's too late to fix the book because it's been sent to the publisher, but your advice is definitely something to keep in mind for my future works. When I finish the script for my next book, I'll be sure to link to it on the workshop thread before I start any drawing. Hopefully I can achieve the proper level of expression and the differentiation of character voice that my new book is missing.

I'm aiming for a much shorter book (~20 pages instead of 40) so hopefully that will give me time to make both the art and writing much better.

On a side note, the modern setting of "Use Your Illusion" (and the use of the Youmu/Reisen/Sanae trio) have led to the doujin creator Gensoukoumuten (of the "Days Woven With Illusion" series) to follow me on pixiv. (My friend from Osaka has translated my books for Japanese audiences.) While this is obviously an honor, I'm embarrassed to think what an expert writer like Gensoukoumuten would think of my unrefined works.
  • House of Sixten

Dead Princess Sakana

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So I just wanna point out that today is officially the 4th anniversary of Patchouli's Scarlet Library.

 :toot: :flowerpower: :dragonforce: :* 8) :toot:

It was on February 1st 2010 that the Great Library Catalogue got started, the project that marked the beginning of a fanfiction board as a result of the old Community Fanworks being split.

Lookin at how big PSL has grown since that time makes me proud. It assures me that all the work was worth it. We started out as a small group, but we've grown considerably. People have come and gone, there's just as many seasoned writing veterans as there's newcomers wanting to bring in their works and ideas.

Sure, there's still work to be done, there's always something. We don't have as much reader-feedback as we'd like, the comment sections of many a fic are quite barren despite many people reading and enjoying it. Maybe this will change someday, maybe it won't. For now, I look forward to seeing how this community, and the rest of MotK, will develop during yet another year.

Oh and while we won't know for certain what the future will hold, we do know *one* thing: The Library Catalogue is kind of outdated right now, many new fics are lying around unsummarized and a good few have been finished but not yet been moved into Kosuzu's care.
So Iced has offered to take care of starting a new LIBRARY CLEANUP! Make sure to post if you wanna help out!

Iced Fairy

  • So like if you try to hurt alkaza
  • *
  • I will set you on fire k'?
  • LOOK AT ME
So, in writing my latest story on gods I ran into a few things which might be useful for those working on the more mythological side of the Touhou fandom.

When I was looking up Aztec myths I ran into a lot of stories that were straight up contradictory.  There are at least two versions of the sun myth for example.  Similarly, when looking up rituals I blundered into one or two versions of many of the major ones.  This as you can imagine made setting up a "correct" story or ritual somewhat difficult.

It clicked when I started looking into Aztec poetry to try to get an idea of the language's flow.  One of the biggest collections of poetry still existing is from a noble from a vassal city who was trying to reform the religion, which he believed had been corrupted by the expanding influence of the warriors.  There wasn't a 'true' version of the myths even when it was active.  Everyone picked the one they liked best and worked around the rest of the stories to make sense of things.  (Kinda like Touhou fanfiction...)

So yeah, it's important to remember that myths and legends were (and in many cases are) often changing.  Even religious truths shift constantly, though today's changes are harder to see under the many flavors of the dominant religions.  So while it might make research more painful, it's important to remember that older sources are necessarily "the true legend," though it might reflect an archaic culture better.  And variant sources might be equally valid as a resource, though again, a modern American retelling will carry modern American values to some degree.

Teewee

  • In the forest, lazing around...
  • ...building nothing but clay castles.
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I've been wondering, what would writing that is "dark for the sake of dark" be like? The mere description "for the sake of" isn't really descriptive enough for me.

Joveus Molai

  • Bear the Word, and the Word will bear you.
  • *
  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: Blood Spider
I've been wondering, what would writing that is "dark for the sake of dark" be like? The mere description "for the sake of" isn't really descriptive enough for me.

"Dark for the sake of dark" is when character personalities, plot events, tone, etc. are dark not because the creator seems to write things that way for no other reason save he/she likes it, or wants to seem cool and edgy, etc. Rather than dark for a purpose.

Examples:

Bob murders Alice in cold blood. The creator did this because...

Dark for a purpose: the creator wishes to convey the idea that human beings, when pressed, can become truly monstrous

Dark for for being dark: because it's not a cool story if someone doesn't get murdered for no reason.

Dark for.being dark often happens when the creator mistakes being dark as inherently being "cool".
 

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