Author Topic: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure  (Read 99410 times)

Hello Purvis

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #480 on: September 03, 2010, 02:56:25 AM »
> "Well, given what I've seen today, we could get by on odd jobs for people, at the very least. The university is still an option, too, when it gets built. Not teaching science, of course, but...a course in the culture of the outside world could work. I talked to Nitori about it, and she thought it would be possible. She thinks some of what goes on outside might be 'hard to swallow', but...I think that just makes it all the more interesting to teach, you know?"

>"Huh." says Renko. "Do you know how to teach?"

>_

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #481 on: September 03, 2010, 03:00:48 AM »
> "I'm sure it couldn't be too hard for us to pick up. I mean, it'll be a university, right? We could probably just apply a lot of what we've experienced as students. I'm sure there will be more than that, but...we could probably ask Keine for some pointers."
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #482 on: September 03, 2010, 03:01:43 AM »
It's probably a reasonable guess that fairies subsist on the random shit they find around the countryside.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Hello Purvis

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #483 on: September 03, 2010, 03:03:41 AM »
> "I'm sure it couldn't be too hard for us to pick up. I mean, it'll be a university, right? We could probably just apply a lot of what we've experienced as students. I'm sure there will be more than that, but...we could probably ask Keine for some pointers."

>"Could work," says Renko, "As long as it doesn't get in the way of treasure hunting."

>_

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #484 on: September 03, 2010, 03:09:44 AM »
> "I don't think that will be too much of a problem. We'd just need to be sure we don't schedule office hours on days we want available to ourselves. It's a good bet we'd get at least a few visitors, if Gensokyo really doesn't know a whole lot about where we're from. And who knows? This could add to your legacy."
> "Anyway, that wasn't the only thing I was thinking about. You know how I've mentioned the opportunities Byakuren has offered me? Well, I'd like to be sure I'm ready for tomorrow, just in case of worst-case scenario, which means I'll need to make a decision tonight. Assuming they haven't already closed up shop."
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Hello Purvis

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  • Hello Jerry
Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #485 on: September 03, 2010, 03:16:55 AM »
> "I don't think that will be too much of a problem. We'd just need to be sure we don't schedule office hours on days we want available to ourselves. It's a good bet we'd get at least a few visitors, if Gensokyo really doesn't know a whole lot about where we're from. And who knows? This could add to your legacy."
> "Anyway, that wasn't the only thing I was thinking about. You know how I've mentioned the opportunities Byakuren has offered me? Well, I'd like to be sure I'm ready for tomorrow, just in case of worst-case scenario, which means I'll need to make a decision tonight. Assuming they haven't already closed up shop."

>"Well, I'll admit, teaching doesn't catch my eye at the moment. I'm more into exploring, you know? Finding things. But, I'll at least help you out."
>"Huh? Oh, right. Well...I'm glad you came to me, first." She squeeze you a bit tighter for a moment.

>_

communist unity (comm-unity)

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #486 on: September 03, 2010, 03:31:15 AM »
> "I'll... probably end up going through with it. I want to be prepared for the worst; I don't think Alice would just let us off the hook that easily. I can't help but be a bit curious of the experience as well."

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #487 on: September 03, 2010, 03:31:22 AM »
> Return the favor.
> "Of course. You're the reason I'm doing this at all. How could I not?"
> "The thing is, these two enhancements won't stack. It's going to be one or the other. The first is fairly simple, it just brings out what we already have and amplifies it. The second one is the complicated one. Turning into a youkai, physical growth, all that jazz. Apparently the growth isn't controllable or reversible, so you'd end up stuck at whatever size the spell decides you should be. There's also an issue of a major karmic penalty for willingly changing from human to youkai, but I've heard conflicting reports on the magnitude of it. And odds are, however reluctant Byakuren would be to give the first one to you, she'd probably be even more reluctant to bestow the second."
> "All that being said...I'm still not sure which one I want to do. Each has benefits, each has drawbacks. The one thing I am sure of...is that I'd like both of us to do the same thing. We can both say everything we want about not caring regardless, and I trust it would all be true, but we have the easy opportunity to forgo that issue entirely by remaining equals, and I don't see why we shouldn't take it."
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Hello Purvis

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  • Hello Jerry
Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #488 on: September 03, 2010, 03:40:47 AM »
> "I'll... probably end up going through with it. I want to be prepared for the worst; I don't think Alice would just let us off the hook that easily. I can't help but be a bit curious of the experience as well."

>She nods. "I know."

> Return the favor.
> "Of course. You're the reason I'm doing this at all. How could I not?"
> "The thing is, these two enhancements won't stack. It's going to be one or the other. The first is fairly simple, it just brings out what we already have and amplifies it. The second one is the complicated one. Turning into a youkai, physical growth, all that jazz. Apparently the growth isn't controllable or reversible, so you'd end up stuck at whatever size the spell decides you should be. There's also an issue of a major karmic penalty for willingly changing from human to youkai, but I've heard conflicting reports on the magnitude of it. And odds are, however reluctant Byakuren would be to give the first one to you, she'd probably be even more reluctant to bestow the second."
> "All that being said...I'm still not sure which one I want to do. Each has benefits, each has drawbacks. The one thing I am sure of...is that I'd like both of us to do the same thing. We can both say everything we want about not caring regardless, and I trust it would all be true, but we have the easy opportunity to forgo that issue entirely by remaining equals, and I don't see why we shouldn't take it."

>You squeeze her back. Mmm, soft.
>"You know my thoughts on it. Whatever you choose to do, I'll be happy with. I think, with everything we've been through, we could adapt if you end up a bit bigger."
>You tell her you want her to undergo it, too. "Well," says Renko. "I will, if you can convince her to do it with me. I'll admit, I'm personally not all that concerned about it, myself. But, I'm also not against it, either. If you want me to join you, though, I'll do it. I guess that sounds kind of wishy washy, but it's how I feel."

>_

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #489 on: September 03, 2010, 03:44:31 AM »
> "I think it would be useful, if only in the interest of self-defense. I'll admit I don't particularly want to go romping around the countryside beating people up either, but there's probably still a whole lot we don't know about here, so it would be nice to be able to hold our own as needed. I do understand your feelings on the matter, though."
> Do we have all the components for the second enhancement spell?
> Do we know if it will knock us out for some amount of time like the first one will?
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Hello Purvis

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  • Hello Jerry
Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #490 on: September 03, 2010, 03:48:40 AM »
> "I think it would be useful, if only in the interest of self-defense. I'll admit I don't particularly want to go romping around the countryside beating people up either, but there's probably still a whole lot we don't know about here, so it would be nice to be able to hold our own as needed. I do understand your feelings on the matter, though."
> Do we have all the components for the second enhancement spell?
> Do we know if it will knock us out for some amount of time like the first one will?

>She nods. "Alright then. Whichever you go with, I'll follow as soon as I can."
>You do. Or at least all the ones you need to pick up; Byakuren volunteered one herself.
>You aren't sure, but Byakuren didn't say it would take longer, and she was frank about the sound effects.

>_

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #491 on: September 03, 2010, 03:55:07 AM »
> "Okay then. I'll do my best to convince Byakuren to prepare one for you as well. Do you mind if I tell her about tomorrow's planned events? I don't think she'll interfere, and it will be important to the process that you're doing it. If you still want to keep it on the down-low, though, I would understand perfectly."
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

UncertainJakutten

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #492 on: September 03, 2010, 03:55:54 AM »
Before I head to bed, I want to state I favor the more powerful enhancement, so if it comes to a vote, there's mine.


communist unity (comm-unity)

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #493 on: September 03, 2010, 04:00:18 AM »
> How late is it now?

and yeah, if it comes to a vote. count mine towards the more powerful enhancement.

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #494 on: September 03, 2010, 04:07:39 AM »
Well, that puts me in a very awkward position, but I am fully prepared to argue all night if necessary. If I'm gonna go down, I'm gonna go down swinging.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Hello Purvis

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #495 on: September 03, 2010, 04:16:54 AM »
> "Okay then. I'll do my best to convince Byakuren to prepare one for you as well. Do you mind if I tell her about tomorrow's planned events? I don't think she'll interfere, and it will be important to the process that you're doing it. If you still want to keep it on the down-low, though, I would understand perfectly."

>"I guess...if I'm not going to steal anything, there's not...that much to hide, except from the mansion itself." says Renko. "If she keeps it to herself, then I guess it's okay. She seemed like a good person."

E-Nazrin

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #496 on: September 03, 2010, 04:19:45 AM »
Do elaborate, Kilga. I'm normally wary of power grabs, but I'm inclined to believe that Byakuren would be able to keep us in line, and I'm not much of one to care about species changes. I don't like making suboptimal decisions when there's something better both known and immediately available - at least, if it's irreversible. If they were stackable or removable I wouldn't care, but... eh.

For what it's worth - to me, the correct answer to Byakuren's 'working off karma' concern is "Where do I start?"

EDIT: It might be best to see what Byakuren thinks about Renko's worthiness in light of full and complete information about what she's been doing since arriving in Gensokyo - I'll agree being the same as her is probably important, even if Renko (beautifully) says otherwise, but that hinges on what Byakuren thinks about Renko's been up to and what it would mean for her character. If she doesn't want to give it to Renko now, but believes that Mary could help shape her up over time... well, something like that.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2010, 04:22:50 AM by YukarE-mouse »
There was something here once. Wonder what...

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #497 on: September 03, 2010, 04:21:07 AM »
> "I imagine she will. Given all she's been willing to do for me, she doesn't seem the type to betray such secrets."
> "Anyway...the one final thing about these two enhancements is that the first one will basically knock me out for a while. The later I take it, the later I'll be awake tomorrow morning, and you know I don't want to miss what's going to happen. I don't know if the second one has any similar effects, but...I hate to say this because I really don't want to go anywhere right now, but the sooner I leave, the better for both of us."

Mouse: Writing up my side of things, will be posted soon.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Hello Purvis

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #498 on: September 03, 2010, 04:29:48 AM »
> "I imagine she will. Given all she's been willing to do for me, she doesn't seem the type to betray such secrets."
> "Anyway...the one final thing about these two enhancements is that the first one will basically knock me out for a while. The later I take it, the later I'll be awake tomorrow morning, and you know I don't want to miss what's going to happen. I don't know if the second one has any similar effects, but...I hate to say this because I really don't want to go anywhere right now, but the sooner I leave, the better for both of us."

>Renko nods. "Okay. If you have to, do so. But make her promise to keep it to herself. Afterward, she can read about it in the paper and talk with her friends." Renko chuckles.
>"Aww, okay," says Renko. "Normally I'd be a little upset, but I understand." She kisses your forehead. "Do what you must. I'll follow you down the road when I can. Youkai or not, you're my Mary either way. And I don't have any big plans you're gonna ruin with it, so whatever you choose and I'll follow along. Being the same's important for you, so it's important for me."

>_

Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #499 on: September 03, 2010, 04:39:27 AM »
For what it's worth, I feel that I should also state for the record that I'm in favor of the stronger enchantment as well.

From a pragmatic perspective, I agree with Patchouli's sentiment. There's a very good chance of us becoming a youkai no matter what we do. Patchouli considered it inevitable without even the weaker enchantment, and Reimu took it for granted. If we're going to end up as one anyway, we may as well make sure we get the most we can out of the deal. The size is nearly the only potential drawback, but Byakuren said it would be more mild than her own, and Renko is clearly not bothered by this possibility at all. (There's also a crazy wild theory reason I have for not minding this, but I'm not going to elaborate because it's too speculative)

From a narrative perspective, I feel it's also fitting. Maribel, after searching her whole life for magic and the supernatural gets to embody the very things she'd always wanted to find. If anything, that feels like a nice conclusion to me.

Also, there are reasons to suspect that greater power will give us greater flexibility in resolving some 'unexpected' issues that may arise during the SDM attack. Even if we could resolve them somehow without this power, greater power will make us better able to resolve them in a manner of our choosing.

For what it's worth - to me, the correct answer to Byakuren's 'working off karma' concern is "Where do I start?"

I agree entirely with this. We've already proven ourself to be an enterprising do-gooder, and I doubt that's going to change too much. If anything, more power gives us more ways we can help. Remember, this isn't just about offensive magic. There's many constructive non-combat uses that could help people in a variety of ways. (And frankly, Gensokyo could probably use another voice of a reason that can hold their own in the inevitable fights that break out)

Maribel wants to explore all that Gensokyo has to offer, and magic is a large part of that. It has been explicitly stated that these enchantment do not just boost us along the path we could gain through training, but change the ceiling of the maximum we can achieve. This means that if we get the weaker enchantment, Maribel will NEVER be capable of being as strong, no matter how long she works, or how hard she practices. From that perspective, we're effectively handicapping her magical abilities for the rest of her life if we take the weaker option. That doesn't sit well with me, either.

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #500 on: September 03, 2010, 04:52:51 AM »
Okay.

It's no big secret at this point that I want the first enhancement and loathe the idea of the second. Since we're now on our way to finally go up to Byakuren and make our decision, now is the best time for me to at least try to explain where I'm coming from.

Why do I want the first enhancement? Because I want to remain human. I think retaining humanity makes for the better story. (Draco disagrees and I'm sure he'll be posting his stance at some point but for the purposes of this post that's neither here nor there.) Remember what Sanae said about her dream of flying a jet. Sure, Gensokyo natives can zip around in the air all the way without one, but she described the feeling of zipping around through the air, unsupported by magic, as romantic. This is exactly how I feel about the prospect of living in Gensokyo as a human as opposed to a youkai. It's like flying with the jet vs. flying with an ounce of willpower. I can try to elaborate further, but hopefully people will be able to see the comparison.

Why don't I want the second enhancement? Couple of reasons, most obvious at this point in this post being that, if I think remaining human makes for the better story, I must think going youkai makes for the worse one. It really feels soulless to go for youkai status. It's the easy way out to living in Gensokyo. We'll be just another face and name, whereas staying human is actually likely to garner us more notoriety while simultaneously allowing us to live the more peaceful life. Also, with humanity, we have a short amount of time with each other, and we'll be more inspired to make the most of it. Becoming a youkai seems like it would just result in a "okay, now what?" situation, which would be boring at best.

Second reason is that Renko's clearly uncomfortable on some level with the potential change the second enhancement brings about, as much as she tries to hide it. Remember that when it was initially brought up, she came up with the idea of trying to reverse the growth process, or simply going through with it as well if it was necessary. Upon being told that the growth is both uncontrollable and irreversable, her response is that "we could adapt if [Mari ends] up a bit bigger". There's obviously a problem going on there, simply because there would be no need to adapt to anything if there wasn't something forcing it to begin with. The response I'd expect from a Renko that really has no problems with it is something along the lines of "So what?" which "we could adapt" is very much not.

The last reason involves a bit of a set-up, as it's important to note a few things.

- Maribel has gone the entire game so far looking to help people and avoid fights as much as possible. Her current clearest career path is the teaching gig, and given the subject matter, there wouldn't be a whole lot of magic required.

- Renko is now on record as not really being concerned with boosting herself. Clearly she thinks she could live out her life and be happy without any enhancement at all, and that may very well be true, given her career plans also don't seem to involve direct combat outside of the SDM fight.

- Byakuren warned us of the karmic penalty willingly changing from human to youkai would incur. We have conflicting reports on the severity of this, yes, but the person that has gone through it herself and would be administering it to us is the one telling us that we'll be eating it for a long time. (I think it is safe to assume that, if the change is gradual and inevitable, the karmic hit would be a lot less, or possibly not happen at all.)

- In talking to Purvis about this whole situation, he told me that we could have actually completed this quest without learning a single drop of magic. It is, has been and will be very helpful, but it was never required. One of the things Draco asked me in private was whether or not I believed we could take Alice without the second enhancement: suffice to say that I would not be arguing this position if I didn't think it possible to confront Alice with just the first enhancement. And I had been thinking this long before I talked to Purvis.

Sum up all those parts, and what do we get? An inability to find a good in-character reason to take the second enhancement, and the cold reality that we would only be doing it as a powergrab. Why do we need this? We don't need it to love Renko, we don't need it to explore, we don't need it to teach, and we don't need it to beat Alice. Grabbing for power would go against pretty much everything our Maribel has done so far and provide benefits only in the areas she hasn't been concerned with. However much stock you put into Byakuren's karma warnings regarding this enhancement, there is no way in hell powergrabbing is going to help our karmic situation at all, and it is, in fact, quite likely to make it a lot worse.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Kilgamayan

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #501 on: September 03, 2010, 05:07:25 AM »
Hmm.

> What are we looking at for time of day? Sun still setting, or is it full-blown night time?
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Hello Purvis

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Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #502 on: September 03, 2010, 05:11:09 AM »
> What are we looking at for time of day? Sun still setting, or is it full-blown night time?

>It's early evening. You think it's about eight or nine oclock. Maybe a bit later.

>_

Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #503 on: September 03, 2010, 05:11:36 AM »
- Byakuren warned us of the karmic penalty willingly changing from human to youkai would incur. We have conflicting reports on the severity of this, yes, but the person that has gone through it herself and would be administering it to us is the one telling us that we'll be eating it for a long time. (I think it is safe to assume that, if the change is gradual and inevitable, the karmic hit would be a lot less, or possibly not happen at all.)

She said directly that if it happened gradually, the penalty would still be severe, if slightly less.

Second reason is that Renko's clearly uncomfortable on some level with the potential change the second enhancement brings about, as much as she tries to hide it. Remember that when it was initially brought up, she came up with the idea of trying to reverse the growth process, or simply going through with it as well if it was necessary. Upon being told that the growth is both uncontrollable and irreversable, her response is that "we could adapt if [Mari ends] up a bit bigger". There's obviously a problem going on there, simply because there would be no need to adapt to anything if there wasn't something forcing it to begin with. The response I'd expect from a Renko that really has no problems with it is something along the lines of "So what?" which "we could adapt" is very much not.

I think someone saying it would take adjusting to is an inevitable reaction, whether it bothered them or not. It's a visible change, and of course that takes adjusting to. Maribel would need to adjust herself (this is even assuming the size difference ends up being enough to matter. Byakuren did say it would be smaller than her own). For that matter, people need to take time to adjust to most changes. Things are neither positive or negative because they require adjustment. A new job requires adjustment.

Sum up all those parts, and what do we get? An inability to find a good in-character reason to take the second enhancement, and the cold reality that we would only be doing it as a powergrab. Why do we need this? We don't need it to love Renko, we don't need it to explore, we don't need it to teach, and we don't need it to beat Alice. Grabbing for power would go against pretty much everything our Maribel has done so far and provide benefits only in the areas she hasn't been concerned with. However much stock you put into Byakuren's karma warnings regarding this enhancement, there is no way in hell powergrabbing is going to help our karmic situation at all, and it is, in fact, quite likely to make it a lot worse.

I consider it a perfectly in-character reason to want to be able to work magic. She's spent ages looking for this stuff. Wouldn't she want to learn how to use it as well as she can? I mean, that's a pretty incredible experience, really. We don't need it to live out a life in Gensokyo, sure, but there are many things a person doesn't need that would nevertheless assist with their life in some way.

As for this being a powergrab, I don't believe that taking power is inherently negative, if the power is neither acquired in a way that harms others, or used in a way that harms others. If anything, this power is likely to be used in a way that helps others. Certainly, if this counts as an empty powergrab, Byakuren is far more guilty of this than we would be, having taking an even greater version for herself in the past. Yet, this doesn't seem to have stopped her from being essentially the opposite of power-hungry in a conventional sense; a kind, charitable person who gives to others freely.

Kilgamayan

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  • The Real Treasure Is You
    • Let's Play Super Marisa World
Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #504 on: September 03, 2010, 05:15:55 AM »
- We can already "work magic" with the first enhancement. What is so different about this second one? To do some nebulous "more"? What is this "more"? I'm not seeing it.

- Byakuren may very well have become what she is due to the karmic hit. I'm pretty sure she talks about the karmic hit the way she does because she speaks from experience. We've talked to others and received conflicting reports on the hit, but how many of them went through the same process? We know Patchy didn't, because she admitted as much, and we haven't talked to anyone  else that's made the jump about making the jump.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Kilgamayan

  • True
  • *
  • The Real Treasure Is You
    • Let's Play Super Marisa World
Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #505 on: September 03, 2010, 05:17:52 AM »
Speaking of which, I now think we could really benefit for talking to other people that have made the jump about making the jump. Keine is the readily obvious subject, but we might (might) be able to wrangle something out of Alice.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #506 on: September 03, 2010, 05:20:48 AM »
I get the impression 'karma' is a nebulous thing. It's not something you can feel, or measure through most means (outside of maybe the Yama, etc.) Byakuren said that becoming a youkai through any means at all incurs such a hit. Patchouli seemed to think that was nonsense entirely. I think that probably has more to do with Byakuren's religious beliefs than a necessary objective truth about how the world works.

I honestly considered asking Komachi if she has any idea how that works. I mean, she's not the one who calls the shots, but she works for the one who does.

Kilgamayan

  • True
  • *
  • The Real Treasure Is You
    • Let's Play Super Marisa World
Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #507 on: September 03, 2010, 05:26:36 AM »
Actually, wait, who gave us conflicting reports on the karmic hit specifically? I've been taking other people's word for it but I can't remember it ever coming up in conversation elsewhere.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #508 on: September 03, 2010, 05:28:44 AM »
I kind of thought that Patchy though the whole karma business was nonsense, but I don't have a specific quote.
But even Byakuren admits that different people believe that it damages your karma in different ways, and aren't even in agreement on which things are a step up and which are a step down (such as animals turning into youkai). And that's even among people who believe in karma in the same way she does.

Kilgamayan

  • True
  • *
  • The Real Treasure Is You
    • Let's Play Super Marisa World
Re: Maribel Quest More - A Z-Machine Adventure
« Reply #509 on: September 03, 2010, 05:30:45 AM »
But if that were the case, why would she flat-out tell us we'd take a major hit? I can't imagine she would say such a thing lightly.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"