Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou 4F (Read 241638 times)

Inactive person · « **Reply #600 on:** July 17, 2010, 04:34:45 AM »

-finally gets Special Disk-
-Edits Nazrin and Kana's image-
-Replaces Reimu and Marisa with Nazrin and Kana-
-Switches Yuyuko and

Spoiler:

-
Yessss :3

Krimmydoodle · « **Reply #601 on:** July 17, 2010, 04:21:14 PM »

Been replaying this and trying to get through with minimal grinding. Had yet to do any grinding outside of simple floor exploration until attempting Eientei at Reimu 45, at which point I started getting stomped. Ground out another 5 levels and tried again.

Hey, this is going pretty well!
*Magic Drain Minoriko
*Magic Drain Patchy
... yeah, that was bound to happen.

Esoterica · « **Reply #602 on:** July 17, 2010, 04:23:18 PM »

Quote from: Krim on July 17, 2010, 04:21:14 PM

Been replaying this and trying to get through with minimal grinding. Had yet to do any grinding outside of simple floor exploration until attempting Eientei at Reimu 45, at which point I started getting stomped. Ground out another 5 levels and tried again.

Hey, this is going pretty well!
*Magic Drain Minoriko
*Magic Drain Patchy
... yeah, that was bound to happen.

I don't recall having to grind for a single boss sans 16F (and currently 18F, though to be fair I haven't gotten to the boss myself yet)

...well, I did have to grind going into 14F because I skipped 13F.

Krimmydoodle · « **Reply #603 on:** July 17, 2010, 05:44:36 PM »

I explored all of the floors, but I've used maps to at least explore them out as efficiently as possible. I'd probably be about where I am now if I'd done 7F-12F without knowing where to go (and it seemed like a fair level to be at until Magic Drain neutered my strategy), but screw doing those teleporter puzzles and switch management by hand again.

And besides that, Eientei is a retarded fight anyway. Even if I "can" beat them at an uncomfortable level, I'd rather be at a slightly more comfortable level so I can more calmly control the delicate balance of Kaguya/Eirin's HP so I don't get lolnuked. I'm not about to completely struggle through a fight where one wrong move means instant unstoppable party wipe.

Ghaleon · « **Reply #604 on:** July 17, 2010, 06:44:20 PM »

I juuust beat Entei in my new playthru, Reimu is 51 (probably 50 before the fight).How do you get there at 45? Did you skip a floor? I haven't done any grinding yet, I cheated on floor 7 by using the wiki to ignore all the useless teleporters, (though I still wanted to map the whole floor), and I never got lost on 10-12.

Maybe I gained some levels more than you by waiting for Nitori to spawn (she was hiding!)... But 5 levels worth, did you get Nitori without any effort whatsoever? Did you do Tenshi yet? (I did her before Entei).

I honestly never have much trouble with Eirin/kaggy. I mean I don't even really bother worrying about counting their hp. I think people will find it's easier than they think if they just take it easy and just try and keep their damage even casually rather than super anal calculator-style.

Krimmydoodle · « **Reply #605 on:** July 17, 2010, 07:07:40 PM »

I think the thing that pisses me off most about this fight is that I feel like I'm the only one who actually has trouble with it (though maybe I do blow it out of proportion, but really, instakill party nuke, assuming you aren't overlevelled, just isn't fair, blah). Whatever, I'm really not in a position to be complaining about that anyway, seeing as I'm still having trouble knocking Reisen out, much less the other two (though I still have 100000 skill points I haven't decided where to invest).

As for getting there at 45, I don't know. I've mapped every bit of reachable floor so far. I didn't have trouble finding Nitori, and I haven't bothered with Nitori 9F/Sanae's Foe/Tenshi (though I killed her butterflies), but yeah, that doesn't account for 5 levels. I don't know.

Ghaleon · « **Reply #606 on:** July 17, 2010, 07:10:23 PM »

Quote from: Krim on July 17, 2010, 07:07:40 PM

I think the thing that pisses me off most about this fight is that I feel like I'm the only one who actually has trouble with it (though maybe I do blow it out of proportion, but really, instakill party nuke, assuming you aren't overlevelled, just isn't fair, blah). Whatever, I'm really not in a position to be complaining about that anyway, seeing as I'm still having trouble knocking Reisen out, much less the other two (though I still have 100000 skill points I haven't decided where to invest).

As for getting there at 45, I don't know. I've mapped every bit of reachable floor so far. I didn't have trouble finding Nitori, and I haven't bothered with Nitori 9F/Sanae's Foe/Tenshi (though I killed her butterflies), but yeah, that doesn't account for 5 levels. I don't know.

I guess getting Nitori to spawn was even more time-consuming than I complained about, I must complain more next time!.

I really DID spend more time in F7 after completing it getting her to @#%#@%ing spawn than I did mapping the whole floor >=(.
I never got a forbidden tablet outta the deal though..doh.

Krimmydoodle · « **Reply #607 on:** July 17, 2010, 07:31:37 PM »

Tried it with a full no calculator no holds barred all out offensive attempt and "holy crap this is going so much bett-ASTRONOMICAL ENTOMBING FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK"

I hate this fight. I really do.

Dumping 100K skillpoints into my dps characters' offenses. If this doesn't work, fuck it, I'm grinding to a level where I don't have to try when I fight these lunatics.

Edit: Haha that backfired, ended up killing Kaguya first by accident and with Eirin's next turn only a tick away (ENTOMBING!). I probably have been approaching this battle wrong as actually going for it seems to be the way to go rather than toeing the line fearfully trying not to overstep your boundaries. lolnukes are still fucking lame, but at least I'm wasting a lot less time per failed attempt like this. I think I can do this with Reimu 50 rather than giving in to the urge to grind.

Bananamatic · « **Reply #608 on:** July 17, 2010, 07:39:04 PM »

took me 2 attempts just by spamming royal flare
guess you can use the iku buff to make it even better

Krimmydoodle · « **Reply #609 on:** July 17, 2010, 07:57:36 PM »

Yeah, I've been approaching this the wrong way the whole time. Aya/Reimu/Iku/Patchy walk in, Aya and Iku buff Patchy, switch Aya with Meiling to cure Patchy's paralysis, switch Iku with Marisa, spam Asteroid Belt and Royal Flare while stunlocking with Sealing Circles. 0 casualties and no healing spells or defense buffs.

Wow. Seriously, wow. I'm such an idiot for never trying that more than once.

Pesco · « **Reply #610 on:** July 17, 2010, 08:08:12 PM »

Do the floors aggressively and the bosses defensively. Guaranteed win.

Esoterica · « **Reply #611 on:** July 17, 2010, 08:39:07 PM »

Quote from: Pesco on July 17, 2010, 08:08:12 PM

Do the floors aggressively and the bosses defensively. Guaranteed win.

I've just been doing everything aggressively with some strategy. I'm still proud of myself for my Flandre strategy. :V

Also, you very much don't want to do 16F defensively; ending the phases ASAP should be top priority.

Garlyle · « **Reply #612 on:** July 18, 2010, 02:49:43 AM »

Quote from: Krim on July 17, 2010, 07:57:36 PM

Yeah, I've been approaching this the wrong way the whole time. Aya/Reimu/Iku/Patchy walk in, Aya and Iku buff Patchy, switch Aya with Meiling to cure Patchy's paralysis, switch Iku with Marisa, spam Asteroid Belt and Royal Flare while stunlocking with Sealing Circles. 0 casualties and no healing spells or defense buffs.

Wow. Seriously, wow. I'm such an idiot for never trying that more than once.

I wasn't aware this was possible originally, until I saw it done a few days ago.

And yeah, it works really well with a little bit of luck. Also, Entombing/Barrage aren't instant kills - they're really tough, but a well-buffed Meiling - or anyone else sporting good MND and SPI - will be able to survive it. There's lots of ways of getting through that fight, and I've found that being overly cautious isn't very condusive to victory.

Tip for the future: Boost PAR resistances (You should get a Ribbon on the next floor, which is +24 to all ailment resistances) and Iku's boost side-effect won't hit, or at least, won't hit nearly as hard.

Esoterica · « **Reply #613 on:** July 18, 2010, 03:18:44 AM »

Quote from: Garlyle on July 18, 2010, 02:49:43 AM

Tip for the future: Boost PAR resistances (You should get a Ribbon on the next floor, which is +24 to all ailment resistances) and Iku's boost side-effect won't hit, or at least, won't hit nearly as hard.

I can't recommend this enough. Thundercloud Stickleback's a terrifying offensive buff; when applied to a character like Flandre, you'll wonder why you even need a party.

Esoterica · « **Reply #614 on:** July 18, 2010, 05:38:39 AM »

Finally getting back into this. On 18F with my characters in the 70s-80s.

Rumia kicks as much ass as I remember; she's doing 36k to the giants on 18F with Moonlight Ray when Kaguya's doing 40k with Hourai Barrage. Demarcation's doing the same 1.2k healing I remembered from before, which just saved my ass from the maxed out speed debuff some of those Shigurrath things just threw on me with Black Hole spam.

Thus, I think I can safely say Rumia's always been good and I'm the only one that knew it. :V

gakpakeerror · « **Reply #615 on:** July 18, 2010, 08:09:08 AM »

is fighting Kedamagration (or whatever its name is) with this strategy:
*Reimu is 250ish, btw

Quote from: Bananamatic on July 06, 2010, 01:33:27 AM

18F+Reimu+Patchy/12F+26F

and got toasted by a SPR Rankain for 50k to all party member.

on next battle, I tried to boost SPR resistance boost to ~600 to main characters..
but still got toasted.

what.
how do I beat that kedamawhatever?

Bananamatic · « **Reply #616 on:** July 18, 2010, 08:19:06 AM »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ezuJTUZAPc
if you want some...reference

basically, he can start using Rankain on ANY turn and from there he uses nothing else until he actually uses the damaging one

using it on round 1 or 2 is a almost guarranteed death and so is Djinn Storm
use 18F buff, then just hope to god he dies before he pulls anything.

Keep trying. You don't win, the boss lets you win.

Ghaleon · « **Reply #617 on:** July 18, 2010, 08:26:09 AM »

Quote from: gakpakeerror on July 18, 2010, 08:09:08 AM

is fighting Kedamagration (or whatever its name is) with this strategy:
*Reimu is 250ish, btwand got toasted by a SPR Rankain for 50k to all party member.

on next battle, I tried to boost SPR resistance boost to ~600 to main characters..
but still got toasted.

what.
how do I beat that kedamawhatever?

Equip all your best mnd-resist items on patchy, hopefully you got a necronomicon from the sigil guardian on one of the previous floors. Watch as patchy takes 0 from everything, solo with silent selene.

Quote

Thus, I think I can safely say Rumia's always been good and I'm the only one that knew it. :V

I see alot of people say that they are the only ones who said blah blah. Fact is it's never true. While I don't think Rumia was awsome, I never ever thought she was the pile of dung that people seemed to think. I always thought moonlight ray was powerful for its sp cost/delay, and demarcation comes in handy sometimes. I didn't use her for the 30f boss, but it'd REALLY come in handy for its nasty debuff you even though you got 33+ debuff resistance debuff everything spell. gah.

RainfallYoshi · « **Reply #618 on:** July 18, 2010, 08:35:36 AM »

Progress! :V

I'm trekking through 4F now and going along rather smoothly. I have to say that I'm really impressed with Sakuya. I never remembered her being quite so useful. He damage output is decent and she can tank pretty decently as well. Excellent.

Due to some recent videos Garlyle has linked me, I'm also looking forward to getting some use out of Wriggle and Reisen. The bunny can really deck bosses a new one when used right and I think we've all underestimated Wriggle's poisoning power.

Bananamatic · « **Reply #619 on:** July 18, 2010, 08:36:01 AM »

Quote from: Ghaleon on July 18, 2010, 08:26:09 AM

Equip all your best mnd-resist items on patchy, hopefully you got a necronomicon from the sigil guardian on one of the previous floors. Watch as patchy takes 0 from everything, solo with silent selene.

Out of all plus disk bosses, none of them gave me their drop :V

gakpakeerror · « **Reply #620 on:** July 18, 2010, 09:42:30 AM »

Quote from: Ghaleon on July 18, 2010, 08:26:09 AM

Equip all your best mnd-resist items on patchy, hopefully you got a necronomicon from the sigil guardian on one of the previous floors. Watch as patchy takes 0 from everything, solo with silent selene.

will try this.
sadly, I don't get Necronomicon; but for everything else, ~~there's Master Spark~~ I got them.
Fought Baal Avatar 3 times for Gurthang, the Shiny Shiny whatever 4 times, Shiki 4 times...
well.. too much spare time can drive me bored :V

and Kedamawhatever is down.
Saves, walks to 28f, encountered three Victorious Tengu, Game Over.
:V

Garlyle · « **Reply #621 on:** July 18, 2010, 01:55:31 PM »

Quote from: Esoterica on July 18, 2010, 05:38:39 AM

Thus, I think I can safely say Rumia's always been good and I'm the only one that knew it. :V

Lots of NND videos of this game use Rumia... so yeah.

In a similar way, Wriggle's turned out to be way the hell stronger than anyone thought. There's a few reasons:
1. Any attempt to calculate damage (Read as: Mine in the past) was limited to "until she next attacks", which makes her damage look mediocre. If she only applies it once every rare while however, the damage adds up in much the same way of an 'in, out, rest' type nuker. She actually does better landing some poison, and then being swapped out for a while before coming back in to reapply it.
2. Her damage potential has been shown to be pretty high on bosses. A 440k boss was calculated to have taken ~40k damage from a single use of Comet on Earth over the course of the whole battle - and that was a boss with good PSN resistance!
3. And speaking of PSN resistance, almost no bosses in the game have it (I think the only one completely immune is

Spoiler:

). Even the final boss has only a tiny bit of poison resistance. Hell, even the 30F superbosses don't have PSN resistance.

Finally, funny how a +3 multiplier to Nitori's damage formula on one attack turned her into a godly attacker.

Extra Finally: You're now aware that Grand Patriot's Elixir has a ridiculous small delay for the amount of buffing it does to Reisen.

Esoterica · « **Reply #622 on:** July 18, 2010, 03:04:49 PM »

Quote from: Garlyle on July 18, 2010, 01:55:31 PM

Extra Finally: You're now aware that Grand Patriot's Elixir has a ridiculous small delay for the amount of buffing it does to Reisen.

Well now I'm going to have to check.

I still don't see Reisen as anything but useless though. :V

Bananamatic · « **Reply #623 on:** July 18, 2010, 03:06:04 PM »

Quote from: Esoterica on July 18, 2010, 03:04:49 PM

Well now I'm going to have to check.

I still don't see Reisen as anything but useless though. :V

If this game only had a "sex appeal" option

one half of me wants to grind for 30F, the other tells me to delete the game from the HD

Earthsiege · « **Reply #624 on:** July 18, 2010, 04:39:24 PM »

Someone on THWiki made a note that hitting the M key inside the dungeon sets your encounter rate to 200% - in other words, instant battles. Yes, it works.

Doesn't make grinding easier, but it sure as hell makes it faster. :getdown:

Esoterica · « **Reply #625 on:** July 18, 2010, 05:39:14 PM »

Quote from: Earthsiege on July 18, 2010, 04:39:24 PM

Someone on THWiki made a note that hitting the M key inside the dungeon sets your encounter rate to 200% - in other words, instant battles. Yes, it works.

Doesn't make grinding easier, but it sure as hell makes it faster. :getdown:

What.

Why the hell didn't I know this before.

Pesco · « **Reply #626 on:** July 18, 2010, 05:45:31 PM »

Because hacking the address for encounters is cooler.

RainfallYoshi · « **Reply #627 on:** July 18, 2010, 06:18:28 PM »

Wheees.

Alice is just as much of a bitch as I remember. I just was able to take her and Healing Light down then got worn down to death by the other two. Horrible I say! I think I need more grind.

And by the way, poisoning Healing Light is a fabulous thing to do. I can take that thing down just by poisoning it and having Patchy spam Silent Selene a few times.

trancehime · « **Reply #628 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:53:12 PM »

Quote from: Esoterica on July 18, 2010, 05:39:14 PM

What.

Why the hell didn't I know this before.

because i kept the sekkrit to myself

ALSO:

Quote from: Pesco on July 18, 2010, 05:45:31 PM

Because hacking the address for encounters is cooler.

Bananamatic · « **Reply #629 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:58:35 PM »

Quote from: Trance the Harlot on July 18, 2010, 11:53:12 PM

stuff

so how long is the grind to be able to beat winner from lv290
3 weeks?