Hardest Version?

[Iryan]

Obviously, I'm just saying it irritates me to no end when I'm trying to get a green UFO when I'm down to my last bomb, only to have to bomb and end up destroying it before it's full. :V

And this is why MarisaB doesn't suck.  :V

[Esoterica]

And this is why MarisaB doesn't suck.  :V

This is also why I use her. :V

Well, that and I love spread types.

[c l e a r]

I think people who argue that UFO is overrated is forgetting that the way you lose a shit load of power is worst, if not equal to SA.

In SA, you either die, or bomb and be weaker.
In UFO, you either die and be weaker, or bomb and need to chain a Green to get that bomb back.

I prefer the latter, at least after your power drops to 1.00 or lower, when you die, you can go back to 3.00 Power.  With UFO, it pretty just says fuck that, you are at 1.00 power and you are going to like it on your last life.

[AlexX Unlimited]

What makes SA acceptable is [...] and a completely pathetic final boss.

Er... If that's the case could you please explain to me why I can barely even *REACH* normal mode Utsuho, and have trouble capturing anything not her first noncard and not called Ten Evil Stars (yes, including Hell's Artificial Sun), while I can capture roughly half of Normal mode Byakuren?

I know you say UFO isn't harder until hard/lunatic, but you (and apparently everyone but me) seems to think that that Utsuho is pathetic regardless of difficulty. Am I really so terrible that an 'effortless' boss is nearly impossible for me? T.T

[Chaotic Phoenixma]

I also find Utsuho difficult, even moreso than Orin, at least on Normal.

[AlexX Unlimited]

I also find Utsuho difficult, even moreso than Orin, at least on Normal.

Orin's Thousand Needle Mountain and noncards are what give me most trouble. She is usually what ends my Normal mode 1CC's, but when using continues I've found Utsuho to be an even tougher wall to break through, so even if I got past her without continues there's no way I could beat Utsuho before my resources run out.

[Sodium]

Utsuho:
Opener: lol
First card: The suns are aimed. At Normal, there's only 1 sun fired at you every volley. This should be relatively easy to misdirect, and then dodge.
Second AP: On normal, this shouldn't be too bad. Still a bit tricky
Second card: Just dodge. =V
Third AP: lol
Third card: lolsafeheight
Fourth AP: Second AP but easier! wow
Fourth card: Hard version is easier, so yeah. Still, not too bad
Last card: LOL. Just don't panic, and you shouldn't stay that close to the bottom.

[Chaotic Phoenixma]

Final card, time it out if you have a lot of lives, it's safer than beating it normally.

I've 1cc'd Normal with ReimuA, but Utsuho ends my ReimuB attempts. I at least have the stage unlocked for practice due to cheaping out and timing it out unlike my ReimuA 1cc where I went into the final card with several lives and still nearly messed up. MarisaA, I can't even get to Utsuho. And I do much worse with ReimuC, MarisaB. Haven't really tried MarisaC much.

[AlexX Unlimited]

First card: The suns are aimed. At Normal, there's only 1 sun fired at you every volley. This should be relatively easy to misdirect, and then dodge.

Its not the suns that's the issue, those are easy. Its the blue balls that get me.

Second AP: On normal, this shouldn't be too bad. Still a bit tricky

Its so tricky it garuntees death for me. >.>

Second card: Just dodge. =V

*garunteed death and loss of bombs until end*

Fourth AP: Second AP but easier! wow

Easier until the bubbles force you against a white puff bullet. >.>

Fourth card: Hard version is easier, so yeah. Still, not too bad

It is for me. >.>

Last card: LOL. Just don't panic, and you shouldn't stay that close to the bottom.

I've been doing that. Its the sudden shifts in gravity that keep throwing me off and sending me into bullets.

Final card, time it out if you have a lot of lives, it's safer than beating it normally.

If I had spare lives I could probably beat it, but I always arrive with 1... 2 if I'm lucky. T.T

[Krimmydoodle]

Final card, time it out if you have a lot of lives, it's safer than beating it normally.

I disagree with that.  I find the easiest phase to be the second to last one (Utsuho has less than 25% HP and the timer is above 30 seconds), because it has the best balance of having a lower bullet density (for fewer random clipdeath screwups) and not being too ridiculously fast (like the final phase).  The two hardest phases are the first one, due to bullet density, and the last one (Utsuho has 0 HP, or the timer is below 30 seconds), due to speed.  That said, I would advocate shooting her constantly to get her HP down to the 25% required to trigger the "easy" phase, and once you've gone that far, there's no point in timing it out because you're going to have to a) last longer, b) face the hyperspeed phase.

Edit: bah, I just remembered that Subterranean Sun's firstfirst phase has no snowballs.  Still, not a fan of the high red bullet density for the firstfirst phase, or intentionally facing the hyperspeed phase.



In fact, the only final card I would recommend timing out (other than Resurrection Butterfly ) is Hourai Jewel, since it's the only card that doesn't take an extra 90 seconds to time out as opposed to capturing, and its the only card whose survival strategy (left/right streaming, which I prefer) is vastly different from its efficient capture strategy (up/down streaming).

[Affinity]

I've been doing that. Its the sudden shifts in gravity that keep throwing me off and sending me into bullets.

If you didn't already know, one thing you should note is that by not moving at all, you automatically avoid the red bullets.  So you shouldn't move unecessarily unless you are being pulled beyond 1/5 of the screen or avoiding the white bullets.

[AlexX Unlimited]

If you didn't already know, one thing you should note is that by not moving at all, you automatically avoid the red bullets.  So you shouldn't move unecessarily unless you are being pulled beyond 1/5 of the screen or avoiding the white bullets.

I know that. The spell still gives me problems. >.<

Rest assured I already researched all the fine details to the card, from what I can figure the only issue is in the execution.

[The Greatest Dog]

Without having played EoSD or MoF (Lol bomb) and only 1ccing PCB once, I will say that for a Normal player that SA should be the hardest.

But now that I've 1cc'd Subterranean Animism with all shot types on Normal, I'm willing to say that you just have to know when to bomb.

[Alice Fact]

In SA, you either die, or bomb and be weaker.
In UFO, you either die and be weaker, or bomb and need to chain a Green to get that bomb back.

in UFO you shouldn't die in the first place

[Ai-chann]

In all honesty, even if you can only play on Easy, do not play IN on Easy. IN Easy has almost nothing onscreen the entire time.

It's very simple to 1cc the game, but you won't get any better. Even though it's difficult, try playing on Normal. You'll improve through IN Normal much faster than you would IN Easy. Easy Mode is meant to warm you up to the rest of the series, and IN's does not do that. The others do! By all means, play Easy on the others, but don't bother with IN Easy.

Thanks for the advice!  I'll start trying Normal mode, then.  I really, really like IN at the moment, and want to try mastering that version before doing any others. 

[?q]

In fact, the only final card I would recommend timing out (other than Resurrection Butterfly ) is Hourai Jewel, since it's the only one you will likely time out while trying to beat it anyway

Fixed.

UFO is harder than SA, but SA gives you weaker bombs and shot types to compensate.
On the plus side, Shou is much more entertaining than Orin.

@IN Easy being too easy:  Play it to unlock the appropriate spell cards, then try EoSD Easy.

[Zengeku]

On the plus side, Shou is much more entertaining than Orin.

I am so offended by that!

[c l e a r]

in UFO you shouldn't die in the first place

Oh, now it's on.

You think just because I am ambitious and conservative in my bomb supply is why I get my -1.00 power?  You think because I got clipped on some spell dissolve bullshit on last card, is the reason why I enter Stage 6 with 1.00 Power?

Fuck you.  The Power System is flawed and you know it.

[Matsuri]

Oh, now it's on.

You think just because I am ambitious and conservative in my bomb supply is why I get my -1.00 power?  You think because I got clipped on some spell dissolve bullshit on last card, is the reason why I enter Stage 6 with 1.00 Power?

Fuck you.  The Power System is flawed and you know it.

Well, that doesn't appear to be working for you. The Power System is flawed. That's why you need to bomb more. They're meant to be used. It's not like UFO penalizes you for it like the other games do.

As for hardest, I'd have to say SA Lunatic or PoDD Lunatic.

[Jaimers]

I'd say the hardest is SA, mainly because the bombs suck so much.
There are no free "skip spellcard" tickets, you have to face them whether you like it or not.
The patterns as a whole are pretty difficult as well.

UFO is easier though, assload of resources to get you through, just remember a UFO chaining link through the stages.
I agree that doing a no-bomb run of UFO would be insanely difficult though.
Definitely harder than SA.

SoEW is easy as long as you use up all your bombs before you die.
Doing this I managed to completely bombspam through Marisa and Mima and still have resources left in the end.

As for the hardest, I'd have to say PoDD Lunatic.

Not if your using Reimu.  :V

[Matsuri]

That's like saying PoFV Lunatic is easy using Aya or Medicine.

Then again, I still count it as a Lunatic clear~

[Zengeku]

Well, that doesn't appear to be working for you. The Power System is flawed. That's why you need to bomb more. They're meant to be used. It's not like UFO penalizes you for it like the other games do.

Yep, Clear. That's exactly how it is. Its the type of games that doesn't worry about being fair play but just give you a lot of resources...

I agree that doing a no-bomb run of UFO would be insanely difficult though.
Definitely harder than SA.

Oh yeah, that's right.

Baity! If you wanna be the next Kefit, you suck it up and get moving!!! He did SA in two weeks!!!

Hmm... considering that a lot of time has passed since release i suppose it shouldn't be too farfethecd to expect a no-bombs run as impressive as Kefits MoF no-bombs. Caught everything but two cards... 

If that's not possible, the game is broken! XD

[AlexX Unlimited]

Should we really be taking special condition runs into consideration for this?

If we do we might as well throw insane stuff like IN 0-power runs into the mix.

[Tsym]

I'm a Normal mode player, so my opinions don't apply to Hard-Lunatic players.

I'll vote that SA is hardest.  I'm one of those guys that has this insane complex to perfect everything...  You can see where that is going.  With SA, it's hard making the sacrifice of 1 power to bomb because bosses become exponentially harder and the stages become just as ridiculous if you actually need to kill something.  With UFO, it's not as bad, especially since you get literally infinite resources there (almost like MoF).

[LHCling]

Baity! If you wanna be the next Kefit, you suck it up and get moving!!! He did SA in two weeks!!!

There's a huge difference in our skills. The only way I'm able to even compare is if I practice even more than usual.

That being said, I reckon I could pull "it" off if I wasn't piled under a crapload of stress / anger at certain people at the moment.

[Zengeku]

Should we really be taking special condition runs into consideration for this?

If we do we might as well throw insane stuff like IN 0-power runs into the mix.

Now, that's not necessary. But a no-bombs run would sure exemplify a games difficulty wouldn't it? Bombs are useful for skipping past the difficult stuff and getting through sticky situations with your skin intact... you could say that the easiest game would be the game that is easiest to clear without bombing.

But if the question is which one is easiest to beat with all your resources bombs included, wouldn't it be easier to just ask: Which one can most easily be abused?

Then i'd say either PCB is easiest. Not only does it give you a lot of lives too but it also have the cherry system which if handled right can be a big advantage. IN also have quite a hefty sum of lives and it have a long time for death-bombing on spellcards. MoF doens't have that many lives but there is bomb spam.

The question here is which is the hardest. That would probably be Mystic Square. Very scarce resources and difficult bosses as well.

There's a huge difference in our skills. The only way I'm able to even compare is if I practice even more than usual.

That being said, I reckon I could pull "it" off if I wasn't piled under a crapload of stress / anger at certain people at the moment.

You are mad at me aren't you?

[LHCling]

You are mad at me aren't you?

Nnnnnope.

[Zengeku]

Nnnnnope.

Phew...

EDIT:

'Certain person'... guessing game!!! Is it the nut? Or ZUN?

[AlexX Unlimited]

Now, that's not necessary. But a no-bombs run would sure exemplify a games difficulty wouldn't it? Bombs are useful for skipping past the difficult stuff and getting through sticky situations with your skin intact... you could say that the easiest game would be the game that is easiest to clear without bombing.

Bombs are legitimate resources just like power. My point is that no-bomb/death/etc. runs shouldn't be taken into consideration because those are special challenges for the best of players.

IN also have quite a hefty sum of lives and it have a long time for death-bombing on spellcards.

If you're talking about the highest amount of starting lives... Should we really be counting those? If you give yourself the max you're pretty much giving yourself a full continue's worth of lives compared to the standard starting set.

The question here is which is the hardest. That would probably be Mystic Square. Very scarce resources and difficult bosses as well.

I could 1CC Mystic Square with Yuka (which the shot type topic seems to consider the worst in the game) within my first few tries. Granted, I couldn't do it with anyone else for some reason, but its better than I do with stuff like SA.

[theshirn]

The question here is which is the hardest. That would probably be Mystic Square. Very scarce resources and difficult bosses as well.

Nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnno.

I can almost 1cc MS Lunatic.  I cannot 1cc SA or UFO Hard.  I cannot even get past Stage 5, on the rare occasion that I reach it.  MS does give you the fewest lives (aside from SoEW), but it is nowhere near as BS as either of those two.