Author Topic: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)  (Read 174294 times)

AnonymousPondScum

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #870 on: September 09, 2012, 02:12:07 AM »
Man, there's too much implying and speculation in Touhou canon.

But that's half the fun, dude!

Drake

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #871 on: September 09, 2012, 04:32:46 AM »
If ZUN just went out and explained everything like a shounen manga Touhou canon would be much less interesting.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #872 on: September 09, 2012, 05:13:52 AM »
If ZUN just went out and explained everything like a shounen manga Touhou canon would be much less interesting.

But we'll get less headache-inducing canon debates that way.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #873 on: September 09, 2012, 06:37:13 AM »
They're only headache-inducing if you insist that you have the right theory (and man, do we have way too much of that), or won't be satisfied until there's a clear answer instead of just accepting how things are in Gensokyo. Often there is an answer in canon, but I think you'll find in just about any fandom there are loads of unanswered, unexplained questions. Just something you have to deal with.

"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #874 on: September 09, 2012, 07:01:05 AM »
Yeah, I just can't stand being wrong and when people give out a different interpretation than the one I believe in, I'll start questioning myself whether mine is the right one or theirs.

Tengukami

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #875 on: September 09, 2012, 07:10:05 AM »
Yeah, I just can't stand being wrong and when people give out a different interpretation than the one I believe in, I'll start questioning myself whether mine is the right one or theirs.

Oh, that's an easy trap to fall into when it comes to Touhou fan theory. Some of the more extensive theories - e.g. Yukari v. Maribel - are loaded with "evidence" both for and against, such that neither side can really nail things down to say what's right and wrong.

All you can really do is start with what we know, canonically, about a given subject, and accept that anything beyond that is inference and speculation. Any interpretation that wanders into speculation territory isn't going to be more right than yours or any other.

"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."

AnonymousPondScum

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #876 on: September 09, 2012, 07:21:02 AM »
Yeah, I just can't stand being wrong and when people give out a different interpretation than the one I believe in, I'll start questioning myself whether mine is the right one or theirs.

The best solution to this is to stop giving a fuck and embrace the insanity in all of its forms. :D

Sungho

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #877 on: September 10, 2012, 10:48:23 AM »
What's the original song of the BGM in stage 2 of suwapyon2?

EDIT :
Sorry, got the answer. 妖怪宇宙旅行 from the Extra CD of 東方儚月抄 ~ Silent Sinner in Blue .
If the name of Kogasa's second spellcard was any sort of hint.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 08:36:31 AM by Sungho »
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Delfigamer

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #878 on: September 13, 2012, 10:13:12 AM »
Quote
...To come to think about that, person, powerful enough for being an extra boss, has no chance to revenge; while weaker ones could beat them in stories where they aren't main characters (e. g. one about Tenshi playing with weather).
Delfigamer1 in reply to Koishi Komeiji 1 second ago
Maybe she really deserves a pity? (Let's remember why she'd sealed her 3rd eye.) :3

The Jealous Witch did nothing wrong.

game2011

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #879 on: September 16, 2012, 04:24:06 PM »
Are vampires being weak to beans made up by Touhou or what?  I never heard of them being weak to beans...

Thanks in advance!

Assuming that it is indeed made up by Touhou, I believe it has to do with the Japanese writing for vampires: 吸血鬼.

吸血鬼 is also Chinese for vampire.  That term literally means "blood-sucking ghost".  However, in Chinese, 鬼 can also mean "oni", so you can also say it means "blood-sucking oni".  Even so, I think it's supposed to mean the former , because when Chinese and Taiwanese use the term 鬼, you can be 99.9% of the time sure that they are referring to ghosts in general, and vampires are generally considered to be in the same league as ghosts.

cuc

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #880 on: September 16, 2012, 08:01:02 PM »
(EDIT: never mind, please read the following posts.)

To answer your question: in short, I think this is a slightly subtle joke the fandom have missed.

The source of this is PMiSS:
Quote
They can't approach a sardine head or a broken holly branch.
Their skin will be burnt if someone throws roasted soybeans at them (*4).

*4: However, they seem to like natto.

Sardine head, holly branch and beans, all 3 are traditional oni weaknesses. Sardine head is confirmed to do damage to Suika in IaMP Marisa ending - in this ending, Marisa caught one miniature Suika, and performed experiments on her.

In Patchouli's ending, Patchouli had finally read up about oni, and asked Sakuya to prepare roasted beans so she can defeat Suika properly (she would, in SWR). Their dialogue makes it obvious that they don't view roasted beans as anything special. If vampires have the same weakness as oni, their reaction would be very different. (The ending concluded with a passage saying that powerful creatures have weird weaknesses, and vampires "also" have weird weaknesses like oni. The idea is that both are the same in being strong and having weaknesses, not that their weaknesses are the same.)

I think the intention of PMiSS's vampire entry is this: its ridiculousness is overt enough that we are supposed to look at it, say "you're kidding me, no way vampires have exactly the same weaknesses as oni", and then realize it's Akyu being a sloppy scholar again. As you have pointed out, vampires are 吸血鬼 in Japanese, so Akyu thoughtlessly concluded that they must have the same weaknesses as oni and called it a day, dismissing the clear evidence that "they seem to like natto" just because natto are not roasted beans.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2012, 08:46:37 PM by cuc »
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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #881 on: September 16, 2012, 08:15:30 PM »
Actually, vampires are indeed weak to roasted beans.

I would say ZUN simply decided to make a connection between vampires and oni.

cuc

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #882 on: September 16, 2012, 08:24:50 PM »
Well, then it's a simpler joke. I recall there being a SDM bean throwing article, but forgot the details - I'm the one who's sloppy. In that case, game2011's speculation is entirely correct.

To interpret it through lens of the current canon's metaphysics, I think because Gensokyo is a land in whose language vampires are connected to oni, and unlike the outside world, without TV and movies, Gensokyoans are not very familiar with the concept of Western vampires (it's plausible that they did have heard of this concept through books and such), they would intrisically and subconsciously believe there is a connection between them, and this belief would force some oni traits onto vampires.

It's very likely vampires would not have those oni weaknesses outside of Gensokyo. In that very article, Patchouli gave us an explanation to this roasted beans weakness, connecting it to Touhou oni's backstory. If what she said is true, it would make no sense for vampires to share oni's weakness, as they have nothing to do with this backstory - unless the weakness is somehow passed from oni onto vampires.

Judging from the article and IaMP Patchouli ending, SDM probably had never made any roasted beans before, so they wouldn't even know whether roasted beans hurt vampires.

EDIT:
I've been reminded that the real life explanation for roasting beans' power is that the word for beans is pronounced "mame", same as 魔滅 "destroy demons" (of course that's just an explanation; the actual belief that beans can ward off evil originated in China, long before the  Japanese invented the youkai "oni"). So in a Japanese context, throwing beans are supposed to drive away not only oni, but all evil - or you can say here oni is a stand-in for all evil. ( Japanese Wikipedia: here.) It's quite reasonable that in Gensokyo, beans can also harm demons (in Touhou vampires are demons). Patchouli being a Westerner, cannot see this connection, and invented a convoluted explanation. The writing technique employed here is similar to CoLA, where Rinnosuke's pseudo-intellectual ramblings often conceal the truth of the story.

That leaves us with sardine head and holly branch... Their explanations will probably be something very similar.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2012, 12:05:31 AM by cuc »
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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #883 on: September 18, 2012, 04:37:24 AM »
I think that's the case. Remilia did make a comment on naming when fighting Suika. Of course, that could just be a play on words.

game2011

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #884 on: September 18, 2012, 03:52:32 PM »
It's not easy trying to explain onis to Chinese and Taiwanese who have little to no knowledge about Japanese culture.  Because ghosts and onis share the same word, they will think you are talking about the former when you mention the word 鬼 to them.  Even if you tell them that you're talking about Japanese 鬼, they'll think you're talking about Japanese ghosts in general.  Showing them pictures may not work too, as they may think that it's a picture of a devil, monster, demon, ogre, etc.  Well, onis are supposed to be the Japanese variation of ogres...

According to Wikipedia, onis were originally portrayed as spiritual beings, so the word 鬼 is fitting for them.  When their portrayal changed into what we know today, that word remained stuck.

Before you ask, there is a different term for spiritual ghosts in Chinese.  It's either 幽靈 or 鬼魂, but people nowadays simply use the word 鬼 instead.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2012, 03:55:15 PM by game2011 »

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #885 on: September 20, 2012, 11:41:07 AM »
I've been wondering about the typical fanon portryals of some characters. Tenshi and Sanae are derpy, Iku is the perfect nanny, etc. But, what about Kasen? Maybe I haven't read enough fancomics, but how do fans typically portray her, as opposed to the harsh kind of person she seems to be in canon? Also, its been a while since I read Wild and Horned Hermit, so I'd also like to know of her personality there, as well.

I'd appreciate answers :)

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #886 on: September 20, 2012, 11:44:48 AM »
I've been wondering about the typical fanon portryals of some characters. Tenshi and Sanae are derpy, Iku is the perfect nanny, etc. But, what about Kasen? Maybe I haven't read enough fancomics, but how do fans typically portray her, as opposed to the harsh kind of person she seems to be in canon? Also, its been a while since I read Wild and Horned Hermit, so I'd also like to know of her personality there, as well.

I'd appreciate answers :)

I only know of one Kasen x Reimu doujin.

And the porn ones. But we don't talk about those.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2012, 11:46:26 AM by lightdreamer »

Drake

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #887 on: September 20, 2012, 10:50:32 PM »
Generally, she's portrayed as strict as she is canonically, but more absurdly so. One main concept played with is that she gets easily embarrassed/flustered and is always being broken down from her strict position, so she's usually paired with other characters. Seiga, of course, is a primary example. The other would be the kind and gentle portrayal, which is usually accompanied by her being shown as naturally oblivious as well.

Or really lewd. But that's just ero doujinshi.

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Sungho

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #888 on: September 23, 2012, 01:36:28 PM »
Why do most of the translators keep the Last Name First Name order of Hong Meiling's name?
Is it because Meiling's name has a Chinese origin?
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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #889 on: September 23, 2012, 04:39:29 PM »
Why do most of the translators keep the Last Name First Name order of Hong Meiling's name?
Is it because Meiling's name has a Chinese origin?
Well, Chinese names do seem to be the exception to the style guideline of converting to Western name order when used in English.  You can see this even in translations of other series that have characters with Chinese names, or even in news broadcasts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_names#Chinese_names_in_English
Quote
Western publications usually preserve the Chinese naming order, with the family name first, followed by the given name.
...
The usual presentation of Chinese names in English differs from the usual presentations of modern Japanese names, since modern Japanese names are usually reversed to fit the western order in English.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #890 on: September 24, 2012, 02:07:08 AM »
What caused Hina face? I know it came from MoF but, why did it become popular?

Drake

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #891 on: September 24, 2012, 02:13:34 AM »
Probably just because it looks really dumb. I can't see it being anything else in particular.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #892 on: September 24, 2012, 02:19:47 AM »
Forgot to ask this but, were the PC-98 games well known in Japan?

game2011

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #893 on: September 25, 2012, 12:19:14 PM »
Well, Chinese names do seem to be the exception to the style guideline of converting to Western name order when used in English.  You can see this even in translations of other series that have characters with Chinese names, or even in news broadcasts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_names#Chinese_names_in_English
Which reminds me that sometimes in fan fictions, you see people referring to Meiling as simply Hong.

fondue

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #894 on: September 25, 2012, 12:23:22 PM »
Okay, in EoSD, because Sakuya can manipulate time why didn't she just stop time, stabbed the heroine's heart and brain, unfreeze time, thus killing them?

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #895 on: September 25, 2012, 12:37:51 PM »
Spellcard laws, that's why. That, and she probably thinks it's too inelegant.
I mean really, wouldn't you want to give your opponents a sporting chance if you had a mindset like hers?


On a more fangame-related note, has anyone heard about a translation effort for First Disaster?
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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #896 on: September 26, 2012, 05:37:32 AM »
Quote
Okay, in EoSD, because Sakuya can manipulate time why didn't she just stop time, stabbed the heroine's heart and brain, unfreeze time, thus killing them?

Depends on how you view time stop. During a time stop, there is no acceleration relative to the victim, so stabbing someone in the heart will have no effect, as there is no force applied. Or you can view time as 0 and the force applied is unsolvable. The best you can do is get close to them and try to get a sneak attack. That is assuming you take physics into account.
If not, then sure, you can theorize that Sakuya can stop time and stab the heroine. But EoSD is when they start following spell card rules, so no murder here.

TouHou Soundfont
« Reply #897 on: September 27, 2012, 01:11:26 AM »
Anyone know where I can find TouHou soundfont?  Seriously, it's really epic!

Drake

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #898 on: September 27, 2012, 02:22:27 AM »
THFont has been discontinued (and mass-taken down) due to various reasons so I can't provide any additional information out of respect.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #899 on: September 28, 2012, 08:26:26 AM »
Imperishable Night Time related question, the other night playing on Normal I finished Wriggles final spell card with 2499/2500 time but the Last Spell still activated so I was just wondering if anyone has any idea of how large/small the "eh, close enough" range is and if it might vary from boss to boss and through the difficulties?

It's not really something I can test >_>