Darker than Black Mafia (Game Over Scum win)

[Shadoweh]

Strange, you demand me to show where you defended Bardiche, I do it in #313. You come up with lousy excuse. Then I explained clearly the case of Rdj's strange behaviour for that excuse.

So that part where your accusation is outright wrong is a poor excuse? Lovely. If there's one thing I regret from today it's ever moving off of your wagon.

capt.h, if it's not condusive to your scumhunting just consider it nulltells and ignore it. Voting out of frustration will not find us the scum.

[Pesco]

Voting
capt h(7): Schezo, rdj, NeoSerela, Yonowaaru, UncertainKitten, Bard, Shadoweh (L-1)
Zakeri(3): Serp, Conqueror, Dormio(L-3)
Helepolis(1): Hanged Hourai
Bardiche(2): Helepolis, capt H

Not voting
Zakeri

capt H is at L-1
14 alive, 8 votes required for a lynch
~5 hours remain. Once the hammer vote is down, no more voting or unvoting will be counted.

[Helepolis]

Lovely. If there's one thing I regret from today it's ever moving off of your wagon.

My life will be most likely taken by kill by the scums. Mainly, for giving them this much trouble. So scums don't need to bandwagon me. You had the chance to bandwagon me.

@ Miss UncertainKitten, this might be perhaps unusual but:

What do you think of my story and theory. What do you think of Bardiche's obvious move to hop again from me to Zakeri, then to Capt h as Shadoweh indirectly asked it? Explain your own view on the Double Bandwagon of Zakeri + Capt h, becoming a single wagon now.

I haven't heard you about it yet. So I guess that is a question to you now.

[UncertainJakutten]

Hele: Well, the wagons moving is something you can generally expect. You eventually need to find a lynch. After we have flips, it's going to be VERY good for VCA because of how close and how long the wagons ran. There's a lot of motivation to mine once you figure out where a couple people stand.

To be honest, I'm pretty sure Bard and Shadoweh are Shenanigans town, and that while VCA is a good idea, you can't pull anything from it without flips. You don't know how the wagons will flip, or how the people on the wagon are flipping. Basically, it's threatening to scum, but only when it can be used effectively. I probably shouldn't have encouraged it, though I thought I was clear in my initial post that VCA is good later in the game. Anyway, the "vote hopping" seems to be the normal end day scramble to get a lynch.

[capt. h]

So that part where your accusation is outright wrong is a poor excuse? Lovely. If there's one thing I regret from today it's ever moving off of your wagon.

capt.h, if it's not condusive to your scumhunting just consider it nulltells and ignore it. Voting out of frustration will not find us the scum.

Bard and your outbursts have become a bit of a berzerk button for me. Sorry about that.

Here's my "not me" vote.

##Unvote
##Vote Zakeri

[Helepolis]

Vote hopping is normal at the end of the day you say, but not with the reasons I gave. Bardiche did not vote-hop in randomness. He was ordered to vote-hop as well.

Shenanigans towns, Bardiche and Shadoweh? No way, not after the double failure they both put up. And I am not really satisfied with your answer. While you answered the wagoning, you did not answer my theory/story on Bardiche and Rdj's case and how Shadoweh is being pushy.

Don't tell me time is slim, people make such obvious moves. Have you seen me making such move? No, because I am being crystal clear. And not like Rdj being ordered to vote on something and "stick" with that.

The thing here is, I am suspecting all four scums are in vote already. It is just a matter of who is going to believe the scums to vote for Capt h. Or are they going to vote for Bardiche.


So tell me Miss UncertainKitten, What do you think of my case?

[UncertainJakutten]

I think it's wrong. I've said that. rdj did make a post that improved upon prior posts. Bard responded to it. Shadoweh and Bard might have a connection that's not scum motivated. Those do exist you know, Hele. Once I see some flips I'll re examine the situation. But most of your case is dependent on people flipping town, far as I can tell.

[Helepolis]

I see Capt H. has removed his vote and put on Zakeri. Even if Hourai, me voted for Zakeri, it would be only 6. Meaning 2 need to switch from Capt h to Zakeri. Scum is trying so hard atm to finish Capt h. But they could simply get 2 kills in their favour as well.

Wrong? Miss UncertainKitten, You and me both know there won't be any flips from now on. Re examining will be too late.

Only way to prevent Scum from having their favour, is getting rid of Bardiche. His silence is being awesome now. He isn't even trying to convince me any more, because he can't. He doesn't have the skills to do that. That is why he is dependant on people like Shadoweh, and maybe even you.

[UncertainJakutten]

There...won't be any flips from now on? What are you talking about? I'm talking cardflips. As in alignment reveals. When someone dies. I think this might explain our issue.

[Shadoweh]

Regardless of Bard's alignment I seriously doubt the scum team will roll over and die without him..
*looks over the last two games*
Well maybe you're right but that's still a silly statement. There are enough of us here to swing the wagon back to Zak if people are on board with that. Not you of course. You'd rather make posts that sound like we should jump back onto Zak from capt.h instead of voting either way.

[capt. h]

@Helepolis

Bard and Shadoweh clearly have a connection. They're playing lovers. According to the wiki, the lover is a role with private communication powers where if one of them dies, the other one will as well.

I don't think that's the way they're linked like that though, because Pesco would have to be really cruel to place posting restrictions on top of a 3rd party role.

[UncertainJakutten]

You know, you were almost cool capt. h! But then you went back to the rolllllleeeeeeeeeee fishing.

[capt. h]

You know, you were almost cool capt. h! But then you went back to the rolllllleeeeeeeeeee fishing.

Role fishing is when I ask. No. I'm telling you what I think.

[Shadoweh]

Right, so anyways.
Hele, for the love of all that is town, stop pretending holding out for a lynch that will never come is town and secure our lynch for today before scum are the only ones who get to do anything tonight.

[capt. h]

Right, so anyways.
Hele, for the love of all that is town, stop pretending holding out for a lynch that will never come is town and secure our lynch for today before scum are the only ones who get to do anything tonight.

You know, I would honestly rather die than stomache another day of Shadoweh x Bard, so I'm just going to tell scum that I think Shadoweh has a vig in the hope that she dies tonight and ask that any scum not yet voting just vote for me so that we have some voting data to analyze.

[Helepolis]

@ UK >> Well connection or not. UK and Shadoweh are trying hard to protect Rdj and Bardiche.

@ Capt h >> you do realise that there is a still a majority on your head. 8th Lynch basically means it is going to end immediately. 7 votes on your head means Scums just have to delay it.

@ Shadoweh, hold off what? For the love of that is Town? I am more and more convinced all 4 scums are voting for Capt h's head. The scums have the upper hand of either end it now with one Townie making a mistake, or simply wait. Almost like a win-win for the scums.

And I really hope the Townies wake up from this trap. The problem is, Yonowaaru is still doing nothing. Not talking, not clarifying nothing. I like how I was being burned extremely by majority of the players for being useless but yea, obviously it is in favour of the people. Easy lynch for them. NeoSerela and Shezo are also like doing nothing.

Well, I am still waiting for Serp Shezo, Mokou and Serela's posts. I am curious.


Cut by 3 people, Shadoweh, UK and Capt, but is not affecting my initial post.

[UncertainJakutten]

Eh, not too hard. Bard and rdj are big boys that can defend themselves. You asked my opinion and I gave it. They're posting fine.

[Shadoweh]

@ Capt h >> you do realise that there is a still a majority on your head. 8th Lynch basically means it is going to end immediately. 7 votes on your head means Scums just have to delay it.

Do you not understand that YOU currently look like the scum trying to delay the lynch? If we as a group do not lynch someone, no one who might be scum will get lynched, and scum will kill someone who is definitely town. The people you are waiting for aren't here, and by their posting times are not likely to BE here until the day is over. So please stop waiting for people who will show up to post "Wait why wasn't there a lynch yesterday?!"

[Helepolis]

Well then if I am scum why don't you mass vote on me? Technically you can do it with your scum team. Your precious Bardiche will do it as well. So far mokou has his vote on me, you just need 4 buddies to lynch me at the end of the day. With 5 votes, I will most likely be lynched.

And then with that excuse, even if you fail to lynch me in D1, you will use this "stalling excuse" as suspicion, and try to Lynch me day 2. But UK said she wanted to fall hard on the lurkers and such on Day 2 but was burning me as well for being "lurker/active lurker/possible scum" during day 1.

Go ahead. 

[Shadoweh]

Helepolis. 5 votes will not lynch anyone. We need 8 votes to lynch. If there are not 8 votes there is NO LYNCH. Even if I commanded a scum team of 5 people I could not mass lynch you right now.

[capt. h]

Do you not understand that YOU currently look like the scum trying to delay the lynch? If we as a group do not lynch someone, no one who might be scum will get lynched, and scum will kill someone who is definitely town. The people you are waiting for aren't here, and by their posting times are not likely to BE here until the day is over. So please stop waiting for people who will show up to post "Wait why wasn't there a lynch yesterday?!"

Do you not understand that YOU currently look like the scum trying to delay the lynch? If we as a group do not lynch someone, no one who might be scum will get lynched, and scum will kill someone who is definitely town. The people you are waiting for aren't here, and by their posting times are not likely to BE here until the day is over. So please stop waiting for people who will show up to post "Wait why wasn't there a lynch yesterday?!"

@Helepolis - Shadoweh's probably right.

The advantage to lynching Zak is that he's defeated town, and won't likely make much contributions for the rest of the game. I could see why scum would switch from a defeated townie.

The advantage to lynching me is that I think Shadoweh x Bard is unbelievably anti-town, if not scum, and I'm fairly desperate to get away from it because it disturbs me.

But as a general rule of thumb a bad lynch is better than no lynch. It at least gets rid of the bad looking townies even if it doesn't find scum.

[Serp]

Maybe my memory is off? It still remains that I can't remember one solid stance he's made until one page ago. And he spent a LOT of time rolefishing/dithering on Shadoweh/Bard for no purpose.

Your reason for voting him seems to be changing.  If you're town, you should probably step back, look at capt. h's actions, and decide which ones you don't think he'd decide to do as a townie.

Helepolis:  Did you miss my posts #323 and #328?  Also, stop basing your scum picks on conspiracy theories.  When people act in groups, it's generally because they're looking at the same game and are likely to reach the same reasonable conclusions.  If you decide for sure that one or two people are scum, you can spend all day putting together scenarios for their interactions and their scumbuddies, but without seeing their alignments flipped first, you could quite easily be wrong and all that work could be wasted.  The game is balanced under the assumption that a townie's pick of scum will be correct only about half the time, after all.  Your scum picks this early in the game should be the people who make the most sense as scum individually.

[UncertainJakutten]

Actually less than half the time.

That said, I think that might not be a bad idea. I'll ISO capt. h. after DnD and see where I stand.

[Helepolis]

I stand correct than on the must-be-8-Lynch-requirement. That clarifies my mistakes.

@ Capt H. I am not disagreeing with you. Zakeri seems indeed defeated. Or he makes a surprise call on you. We cannot know. And I know about "A lynch is better than no lynch." It has been dropped so many times now, it is no longer funny.

I am not going to be the 8th guy on you. I don't believe you are Scum. It is a shame you are currently in the same state as Zakeri. You both sound defeated Town to me. If you get lynched now, Zakeri will be probably next. Or me even. How is that even going to make the Townies fight back? 3 easy potential targets and the scums are laughing at it already.

If you want to get away , no matter what,  at least fight for it. Zakeri did not stated he wishes to die. His non-vote isn't pleasing me. That is why I am asking you, Zakeri and remaining to consider the situation.


Cut by Serp, important information in it but can be split into 2nd part of my post

Serp, yes, they do come over conspiracy theories don't they. And the alignment flip is indeed another thing. Have you read also my case posts (not the silly exchange of words later) on on Bardiche? ( I hope you did ). And I didn't pick my vote on conspiracy theory, I picked Bardiche with exactly the reasons I given. The conspiracy is 2nd part of it and does not necessary,  because he is being heavily protected. His actions gives me a sense of he is scum.

Rdj giving me scum vibes also because he did also a single choice and sticking hard to it. Not explaining, not talking not helping Townies.


So Serp, then what is your stance close to end game? What do you think of Yano, Schezo, Serela and Mokou's posts until now. We know Dormio is in bed. He won't be able to reply anything atm unless the game drags on and he decides login to check.

Cut again by Miss UK, but not affecting my post.

[Shadoweh]

+=====+=====+=====++=====+=====+=====++=====+=====+=====+
Shadoweh happily proceeded down the game board after rolling a 6. Finally! She was going to reach Minoriko, buy a large plot and get back into the game! One space, two.. three.. four..
"STOP! HELEPOLIS!"
Oh no, not him. Frantically Shadoweh tried to run past the SDM, but it was too late. A charismatic moment later, she was sitting down having tea and listening to this fanboy prattle on about his ojousama and how glorious her campaign to liven the Gensokyo skies was. One of the fairy maids stopped to remove a sizable part of Shadoweh's fortune from her wallet. Sighing, she followed Helepolis into the mansion and made preparations to spend the night.
+=====+=====+=====++=====+=====+=====++=====+=====+=====+

[Pesco]

Voting
capt h(7): Schezo, rdj, NeoSerela, Yonowaaru, UncertainKitten, Bard, Shadoweh (L-1)
Zakeri(4): Serp, Conqueror, Dormio, capt H(L-4)
Helepolis(1): Hanged Hourai
Bardiche(1): Helepolis

Not voting
Zakeri

capt H is at L-1
14 alive, 8 votes required for a lynch
3 hours remain. Once the hammer vote is down, no more voting or unvoting will be counted.

[Serp]

Serp, yes, they do come over conspiracy theories don't they. And the alignment flip is indeed another thing. Have you read also my case posts (not the silly exchange of words later) on on Bardiche? ( I hope you did ). And I didn't pick my vote on conspiracy theory, I picked Bardiche with exactly the reasons I given. The conspiracy is 2nd part of it and does not necessary,  because he is being heavily protected. His actions gives me a sense of he is scum.

Your case on Bardiche is mainly that he was reacting too defensively to the possibility of a case on him, and that other people are playing as though he were their scumbuddy, right?  The first point could be a valid foundation for a case, but the second is what I'd call a "conspiracy theory."  It more or less says, "If Bardiche is scum, then the actions of these people imply that Bardiche is scum."  When one player defends another without good reasoning, that's a scumtell against the player doing the defending - either he's defending a scumbuddy, or else he's scum who knows that the other player is going to flip town, so he wants to earn towncred by looking like he's doing a good job of figuring out who's scum and who's not.  But that means that it's a nulltell with regard to the player being defended.  Even if the player doing the defending is scum, it doesn't say anything about the defended player's alignment.

So Serp, then what is your stance close to end game? What do you think of Yano, Schezo, Serela and Mokou's posts until now. We know Dormio is in bed. He won't be able to reply anything atm unless the game drags on and he decides login to check.

None of them look very townie.  None of them are getting lynched today.  If I'm still alive tomorrow, I'll figure out which one of them is scummiest in the context of Zakeri's or capt. h's flip.  Until then, I don't think there's much value in evaluating their scumminess.

"STOP! HELEPOLIS!"

Drat.  I was hoping I'd be the one to pull out that reference first.

[Shadoweh]

Okay. I have to go for a couple hours, so town is on it's own for the rest of this short, short day. I am not moving my vote. For everyone else who wants to hold off until the last minutes of today to hammer I will remind you to look at the beginning of the topic and note twilight time for night actions comes out of our remaining day time. Hammer SOMEONE. SOON.

[capt. h]

Okay. I have to go for a couple hours, so town is on it's own for the rest of this short, short day. I am not moving my vote. For everyone else who wants to hold off until the last minutes of today to hammer I will remind you to look at the beginning of the topic and note twilight time for night actions comes out of our remaining day time. Hammer SOMEONE. SOON.

Wait, does that mean that if we hammer at the last second, scum won't have time to submit a night/twilight kill and organize their night/twilight actions?

[Shadoweh]

That is an idealistic theory that I'm surprised you haven't proposed yet. Past attempts to outsmart Pesco's setups have only ended in tears and dead townies.