Mafia Rule Mafia - Postgame, Town Win

[Schezo]

It says something about being a bus driver but not like I would think.  Hold on a sec for a full response.

[Hanged Hourai]

Hanged Helper: Oh, okay, I guess you're the only role that doesn't have two effects then.
No wait. That's stupid. So who do you think is the scum team if it's not you?

...
...
...
You guys are aware of your two effects? I thought the death effect was a surprise to everyone. I don't have any effect that occurs when I die, or at least wasn't told.

As for scum, urgh, Dormio. Conqueror second. I feel that at least 1 of them is scum.

If you were convinced someone was scum, why try to hide your opinion? 

And I would like you restate everything about your doctor role right now please.

Like I said, more cred. And I knew that I didn't mention Pesco, so openly wanting a lynch on him at the end of the day, tying up the wagons, would be very suspect. Like this is any better. :V

I'm a rechargeable doc. If I successfully protect, I need to charge the next night.
D1, protected Edible.
Notified that protect went over someone and Pesco.
Told that it did protect something, which is why I needed to recharge.

[Hanged Hourai]

*Night 1
:P

[Schezo]

Ok the results are in!  Schezo enlightenment time:

Bard was allowed to nightpost (duh)

He had the twist virus which he was obligated to pass onto others.  It says it's a bus driver thing where people who targeted the player who sent the virus got the receiver of the virus and people who targeted the receiver targeted Bard.  Players who got the virus are required to spread it and it took priority over every power they had but killing roles. 

It is said to give a negative redirecting effect after the virus is received but they wouldn't be told of it's effects.

Once he passed it the virus was on it's own by whoever got it.  I'm reading it (I got his full role PM) as they got a PM with Virus and some stipulations and were told the fact that one can still nightkill and pass the virus, perhaps Edible can share all he got with the Virus?

Once Bard dies the virus stops

Mod guaranteed the most crazy and bastardized role in the game.

If you all need some clarification on a part, ask, I'll try to say it without quoting the PM.


So, in short Hourai's a liar and needs to be lynched.  He should have prevented this because it clearly states in the role PM it's a negative effect and would be flavored as such.  It's very easy to reverse engineer a statement when the virus is your partner that you can talk to.

[Hanged Hourai]

So either the mod messed up, or my protect went up after the twist. Because I know I'm town.

If, but more likely, when I die and flip town. Kill Schezo.

[Hanged Hourai]

Reiterating for emphasis.

When I die and flip town, kill Schezo.


Reiterating for emphasis.

When I die and flip town, kill Schezo.


Reiterating for emphasis.

When I die and flip town, kill Schezo.

[Iced Fairy]

Honestly I'm not quite sure why we're treading over this ground again.  Even if Hourai is telling the truth about targeting or even power suite it doesn't clear him, because scum would know the power would swap, and blocking everything targeting Pesco and Bard would be great as well.  Extra great if it blocks info gathering because of the number of people targeting Pesco.

Perhaps there's some other role that can be brought forth to shed light on the matter?  Shadoweh? Schezo? I've got nothing.

Hourai, that was a terrible play if you were town.  And if you are town you need to find who the real scum is, with good evidence.

Edible, I dislike how you keep claiming that Bardiche's plan hurt you in any way.  It, in fact, protected you from everything that was going down on Pesco.  On reviewing, I also dislike how you completely shrugged off the idea that Bardiche might have been the source of your twist early day 2, and instead gave him a pass.

As a side note I've Pesco Messaged as I said I would.

[Shadoweh]

You'd think since he knew what the power did that Hanged Helper would come up with a roleclaim that worked. It doesn't matter if he's telling the truth. It's more important that he's lying and we've proved it. I think the only people that ever believed the claim are you and.. who was the other..

On matters related to what happened tonight, let me get this straight.

Pesco targeted Edible, but his ability wound up hitting me.
Hourai targeted Edible, but his ability wound up hitting me.
Shadoweh targeted Pesco, and his ability also wound up hitting me.

This is all consistent with Pesco's claim that whatever will occur to him will also occur to me, and so far everyone's claims check out. Including Hourai's.

Also pretty sure you mean Schezo not Edible.

About powers, if you look really closely you can see Hourai used one just now.

[Hanged Hourai]

About powers, if you look really closely you can see Hourai used one just now.

?
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Do we have any dayvigs? Can't have role madness without some vigs.
Getting my flip end of D4 is not soon enough for me.

[Iced Fairy]

No, I meant Edible.  Schezo I'm almost certain is being honest.  Let me quickly review then give my thoughts.

[Shadoweh]

The best thing about you being lynched Hourai is if flipping town is a part of your role we'll get to see it.
Also I know the count hasn't changed but just so they still feel useful..
@Mod Can I get a votecount?

[Hanged Hourai]

Shadoweh-

About powers, if you look really closely you can see Hourai used one just now.

Don't just drag my name through the mud. What do you mean by that?

[Edible]

Edible, I dislike how you keep claiming that Bardiche's plan hurt you in any way.  It, in fact, protected you from everything that was going down on Pesco.

"Everything that was going down on pesco" meaning... what, exactly?  Do I need to point out again where night-Bard told any theoretical investigative roles to target me, and then used his twist on me?  Knowing what we do about the role, that would have given a scum result.  How in the world is that beneficial?  It's a coincidence that something worse didn't happen.

On reviewing, I also dislike how you completely shrugged off the idea that Bardiche might have been the source of your twist early day 2, and instead gave him a pass.

Er, got a source for the shrugging off thing?  I don't remember considering who might have caused the twist yesterday.  Also, I'm aware my opinion on Bard wasn't the right one, but if I recall correctly only you and Zak had negative opinions on him, and only Zak bothered to vote him at all.

[Thata no Guykoro]

Votecount On Demand

Edible (0): Dormio
Hanged Hourai (1): Iced Fairy, Schezo
Conquerer (2): Edible, Dormio
Dormio (1): Conquerer

Not Voting: Hanged Hourai, Iced Fairy, Shadoweh, Doll.S

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. 30 1/4 hours are left.

[Iced Fairy]

Okay, here we go.  I admit it's shaky as all hell, but I can't get it out of my mind, and I promised I'd post it, so I'm going to run with it until someone breaks my bad logic.

We walk into day 3.  Hourai has just put into action a plan that even HE admits is scummy, and unsurprisingly he gets two people on the lynch train.  Edible has posted, but it's all filler.

So now with the Hourai train reasonably moving along Edible wander in again.  He clears Hourai with a pat on the head and walks away to pursue other scum (with little evidence and or supporting statements).  Why? 

It's as if he already knows Hourai will flip town, and is going to be happy racking up 'scumhunting' points while the rest of town flails around taking the path they have to take, because letting someone who screws town that badly go free (barring cop intervention or a miracle) is bad play.

And once again looking at it, it seems so flimsy I hesitate to post it.  But if Hourai does flip town day 4 Morning, with a full doc suite, well....  Yeah.

Cut: I pressed Bardiche about the matter (too lightly in retrospect).  He denied all involvement.  As I had nothing other then "Bardiche is playing kinda soft this game" I didn't have anywhere to go.  You chimed in to restate the twist matter, making it seem unrelated to either beyond the night effects.

[Hanged Hourai]

Iced, lemme get this straight. Are you sorta handing me a pass? Clearing me as town?

[Iced Fairy]

Here's the thing.

Your actions are 100% scumlike.  Meanwhile Edible's actions are just kinda funny.

However yesterday Pesco's actions were 100% scumlike, and Bardiche's were just kinda funny.  Until Shadoweh caught him in super scum gambit.

And my mind can't escape the pattern.

But until you put something on the table scumhunt wise I'm not going to even consider giving you a pass.  If this was lylow maybe I'd be stupid here, but right now all you've proven is you're willing to take scum actions.  That can't be brushed off.

You think Schezo is one of the scum?  Go add something other then his claim on Bardiches role.  You think Conqueor's the scum, point out the links.  You think Dormio's the scum, say why.  If you believe my strange theory or think that I'm scum for them, put something down.

Bring something to the table to prove you should even be considered town.

[Shadoweh]

I'm mostly posting so Iced Fairy doesn't think everyone abandoned him to hang out with Hanged Helper. Zakeri was smarter then us all yesterday, that's why he got killed last night. Don't worry about how crazy your theories sound but if day 4 rolls around like that I will eat Conqueror's hat.

[Edible]

After failing to find anything absurdly incriminatory in Conqueror's posts, I wrote up a post-mortem analysis of Bardiche for myself, hoping to reverse-engineer some clues about scum teammates that may exist.  Hopefully it'll be of some use.

Early D1, picks on Shadoweh.  Don't think it means anything.

A little later, D1.  Another pick at Shadoweh.  A prod on Conq for opinions, coupled with a vote for same.

Calls PX for blatant bandwagon hopping; blatantly hops on PX's bandwagon.  I wish I had picked up on this earlier. D:  Also removes his prod on Conq.

This begins a series of hardcore prods on Doll.  Don't think it has any real meaning either, just a player being frustrated with a non-player.

More discussion with PX and little else.  Sigh.

Night post.  I've already made my opinions known about this, given this is the same night he twists me.

First post of D2.  Acknowledgement of link to pesco.  Idle speculation on Shadoweh's restriction.  Vote on Schezo.  Pass on Hourai.  Also uses same "bandwagon hop" logic on Dormio that he used the previous day on PX.  Hmm.

Seems like most everything else is fluff and his explosion at the end of the game.  There's a decent link to Conq in there (the weak prod/unprod early in D1), but it's nothing extremely damning.  Nevertheless, combined with the other "decent link but nothing extremely damning" Conq provided me with earlier, I'm still thinking he's the best lead on scum I have.  I also find Bard doing similar things to PX and Dorm somewhat suspicious.

If anyone wants to know why I get townie feelings from Iced Fairy, it's stuff like this.  Actually using logic and really thinking his way through things is a pretty pro-town thing to do.  That said, I have to frown at this Edible/Hourai "link" of sorts you've proposed.  It's a DIID situation, where if I continue to not support a Hourai lynch and he's town, I'm pulling a "just as planned" by your scenario; if I continue to not support a Hourai lynch and he's scum, I'm clearing scum (again).

More in a moment.  In the meantime, can someone summarize the case against Hourai for me?  Preferably from someone like Shadoweh, miss "still-townie-obvtown."  What are the chances that Hourai has a fake alignment flip or something, with that not-even-remotely-subtle insinuation to kill Schezo?

[Shadoweh]

Edible: It's hard to summarize the Hanged Helper case in anything besides 'because he is bad' but I can add some more points.
1:  Pesco didn't believe his roleclaim and Helper tried to mob him without telling anyone.
2:  I pointed out about four times on day 2 why his claim was impossible and Schezo's sorting of Bardiche's role confirms it.
3: He went out of his way to translate my rant against Schezo and never translated anything else I said.
4: He took 36 hours to defend himself.
5: He's just not that bad at Mafia.
6: Super-Subliminal Advertising.

I don't know if there is one but the day effects could make a town flip for scum possible and Schezo's role would have given town a chance to catch it after the fact. I wish I didn't have to convince you of my case but you're still the tastiest of tasty mans to me.

[Iced Fairy]

Your last two links are broken Edible, they lead to posting in the thread.

And mainly my confusion towards you is over how quickly you dismissed the cases on Hourai, as well as your light touch towards proceedings. 

However I think I see something of your thoughts here which would change my opinion.  Would you like me to restate my personal case on Hourai, or are you waiting on Schezo to speak?

[Edible]

However I think I see something of your thoughts here which would change my opinion.  Would you like me to restate my personal case on Hourai, or are you waiting on Schezo to speak?

Anyone with an opinion one way or the other will do, and Schezo supposedly caught Hourai in a lie and as such needs no further elaboration.  It seems like Hourai is a major point of contention for the day, so I think everyone should get their ideas out in the open.

[Hanged Hourai]

5: He's just not that bad at Mafia.
6: Super-Subliminal Advertising.

5. Thanks I guess
6. What are you talking about?

You still haven't answered me on this thing either.

About powers, if you look really closely you can see Hourai used one just now.

What do you mean? I have nothing except for my doctoring.

[Shadoweh]

Way to not answer any of the points you can't argue against. Frankly I can't hear you over the sound of the train anyway. I'd like to hear more from Schezo too and Dormio even if I think he's the likely partner.

[Iced Fairy]

Very well.  Most of my reasoning is available in my first post on Day 3, but I'll expand a little.

Hourai was the deciding vote before Bardiche got caught red handed.  It was his support that made the consensus Lynch Schezo instead of lynch Pesco.  With your move onto Dolls that the sets were tied, with Hourai's waffle being the deciding factor.

In short, if he wanted to lynch Pesco, thinking Pesco was scum, he could have just out and out lynched Pesco.  He'd have caught scum and looked good.

Instead he pulled that gambit, which would have left town wondering who was the anon vote/ power user who swapped the vote at the last second.  Town spends day three pointing fingers, while probably in lylow.

Reviewing his earlier posts, they've been content starved as well.  D1 is his fight with PX, preceeded by a weak post on Shadoweh and some easy Dolls bashing.  D2 he got a lot of attention because of the power swap madness which allowed him to say little to nothing of merit, while keeping post counts up.  Not much good scumhunting.

[Hanged Hourai]

Way to dodge my questions Shadoweh.

1:  Pesco didn't believe his roleclaim and Helper tried to mob him without telling anyone.
2:  I pointed out about four times on day 2 why his claim was impossible and Schezo's sorting of Bardiche's role confirms it.
3: He went out of his way to translate my rant against Schezo and never translated anything else I said.
4: He took 36 hours to defend himself.

1. And he was scummy.
2. When I flip town, kill Schezo.
3. That's because it was your longest and most headache-inducing post. For everyone's benefit.
4. What can I say? :V Fashionably late.

Also, can I get a list of all the supposed night actions N1? I wanna see something.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

Thoughts on Hourai, eh?

I'm really not liking the looks of this.

Why Schezo?
Are you really just going to use OMGUS reasoning in Day 3?


Also, Schezo: I thought your ability was to start a riot. How are you finding out role information?




DotS now, will say more later.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

Bah, messed up quote tag.

[Shadoweh]

I understood what you were trying to say. I can answer about Schezo though, he claimed when he thought he was dead yesterday.

God dammit Hourai, if I die to the waffle... I want you all to follow up on him and rectify my death, I mean I got you all in the craziest frenzy since the storming of the Bastille.  :V

I'm serious about that first part though.

Sigh, I have 1 more ability to find out completely and fully anyone who was lynched abilities.  But since we pretty much know all about PX's powers me using it would be moot.  And if I die today, fuck it.

@huh what: then stop giving people crazy powers then. :V

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

I suppose that fits in with him being king of the lynch.
I dunno, I'm just sceptical about all these roleclaims because mine is so... crappy.


Anyway, yeah, Hourai.
Is it just me, or has Hourai been fairly selective about what questions he's been answering this game?
Hourai's only response to Schezo pointing out flaws in his roleclaim was "the mod screwed up".
And then he basically tries to fish for any people with vig shots.