Moriya Shrine Revolution Mafia - Game Over!

[Suwako Moriya]

Shannon has been prodded for inactivity.

For the record, if you want to keep that limitless time count, this level of activity on the whole is not the best idea.

[Ryuki]

So, uh, how's that Mafier going for you guys?

[Decade]

Shannon here with a very late post!

plus she said she just got out of the ER, and... well, I'd like to think people wouldn't lie about things like that. Even if you did lie about not being able to play, you could do something less extreme.

I didn't get to address this yesterday, but I want to now.  Suwako was nice enough to let me form a hydra with someone.  Asking for something like that when there was nothing wrong (and then using such an extreme problem on top of that) would be incredibly lame.  I promise that I would never be that lame.

Shannon/Kanon: I'd like to know what happened between this post and this post. Specifically, what happened between those two posts to turn Sailor Moon from someone you were wary about to "likely to be town"? I realize that i'm talking to two heads of a hydra here, but still.

To make things clear: I thought Sailor Moon was town since D1.  Kanon was unsure because of her waffliness.  I shared my thoughts with him and he read over things again.  So far, he thinks that waffliness is her only "real" scumtell, but being second on the Gamzee wagon and attacking Sandor at the same time makes her more town.  Those things were enough to make him change his mind.

Also, Miss McDowell, who did you target last night?

@StuffMan I would like to hold off on claiming until I get an answer to that question.  I hope you understand.

[Ryuki]

Also, Miss McDowell, who did you target last night?

I targeted Stone Mason. I don't think sharing the results will help much, and unless it's information that has a good chance of helping town I'd rather honor anonyminity in an anonymous game.  (He's not a regular player here as far as I can tell, and his real account doesn't reveal any discrepancies with lurking periods supposedly because he was busy or anything like that FYI).

[W]

That won't even work as a test though, since you already had a vote on you from Shoe. :/

He can vote someone else first to show that there's nothing against him being the first vote and then come vote me.

[Kiva-la]

Stuffman, I'm not going to vote you just yet because I want to come to a conclusion with everyone else on who to vote for. Otherwise, I could toss a vote on you, and find out you're Town and scum somehow has 3 votes on their side, and boom, we've (potentially) lost. This is potential lylo during role madness. You do not take chances. As for what you want me to do? I refuse. I don't see the point behind it. If you can give me a legitimate reason for me to do it, I'll gladly do so. But otherwise, "he might or might not have a role restriction saying he can't be the first vote on someone" is not anything past WIFOM that will lead to a nulltell either way. Pointless, pointless, pointless. You are smokescreening and avoiding the questions being asked. Not only that, but you are acting inherently anti-town by yelling at me and being rude and trying to force people into voting. Also, you've been blundering all day. you ask for me to place my vote down on you, claiming it should be an obvious choice if I'm so sure of you being scummy, and then when you're told by someone else it's a bad idea, you change your story to wanting me to do it to test if my role has some bizarre and obscure restriction that would almost never come up, asking me to place it on you. And then, when it's pointed out you already had a vote placed on you, you ask me to put it on someone else. You've been sloppy all game and, frankly, I'm surprised you've made it this far into the game. (Oh, right. You've only made it this far because you've been... less than active. Something I'm guilty of, too, and I do apologize for it, but I barely get any time to hop online for RL reasons. Only time I did was all of N4, which annoys me because I found out that right after I got busy again it became D5) If this wasn't lylo I'd have a vote on you so hard it wouldn't be possible to change my mind. As it is, I can't afford to be that stubborn. And you (as well as the other scum left alive, if there is one, though there probably is) need to be less desperate to lynch Town. Only leaves you being sloppier than usual. 

Also, leading the charge on someone means being the first vote on the train. A person isn't a train, so just because I'm not the first name, period, doesn't mean I didn't lead the train. Like yesterday, when Saki voted/unvoted before I placed my vote. Well before, in fact. I lead the charge.

@Evangeline: "I did my research" means I checked his posts and what he was saying. Triple-checked it all to make sure I wasn't just seeing things or whatever. As for the Stone Mason bit, it's because of... not as much as I had thought. And it's been pretty consistent, so I think it's just playstyle, actually. Kinda like the ShKanon thing, come to think of it, though more that it's just been that consistent and less because my previous concerns have been addressed. (Still upset with the "You are right, I'm Town!" bit on D1)

Spent a couple hours on this post, so attention is starting to waver. Will be around for a bit today, though, so if there are any more concerns I'll be off and on today to respond to them. Other than that, will get back to scumhunting when my batteries recharge.

[Kiva-la]

EBWOP: Back to scumhunting because today can still be used to find more scum than just Stuffman, since it seems like there are 4, so there will be another day tomorrow.

[W]

The fact that you still aren't doing it and refuse to vote the person you call the scummiest makes you very confirmed as scum by my read.

A reread of your previous post showed a mention of third party. Now why in the world would Town entertain the thought of any third party when there has been no evidence to even hint that one exists? That is fearmongering and scummy as heck.

[Kiva-la]

And that is you trying to paint me as scum. I also mentioned that the Saki/Sandor scuffle could have been a massive scum gambit. Just because I mention it doesn't mean I'm actually entertaining the idea. I ramble and post in stream-of-consciousness. I have mentioned this before. Besides, Third Party is actually perfectly valid for potential lylo. Third party wins by surviving, after all. If there's 2 scum left alive, and 4 town, then say we lynch town today, town dies tonight, that's 2 scum and 2 town left alive, with Shoe able to tiebreak. That would put tomorrow as definite lylo in a worse-case scenario, but there is a tomorrow. There would have to be some sort of killing role out there that could end things one way or another, but we haven't seen evidence of that. As for a Third Party, well, 3 Town, 1 TP, 2 scum. lynch town, kill town, that leaves 2 scum, 1 TP, 1 town. that's the end, since that's 3 votes against the last town left alive, killing him, and I doubt the mod would drag things on, since TP wins by going "I'm TP, let's lynch Town, scumbuddies!" and voila.

And still you insist on me voting during p.lylo? How does that make me scum? Please, I'd love to hear your explanation of this. How does not voting during a time where votes are potentially more helpful to scum than they are to town, scummy? Also, you have more questions to answer, Stuffman. I'd recommend you answer them. Now.

[Ryuki]

@Evangeline: "I did my research" means I checked his posts and what he was saying. Triple-checked it all to make sure I wasn't just seeing things or whatever.

No, I mean I'd like to know the actual things that turned him from mistake-laden to scummy, not just that you triple-checked it or anything like that. Anything in particular that sealed the deal in your eyes?

A reread of your previous post showed a mention of third party. Now why in the world would Town entertain the thought of any third party when there has been no evidence to even hint that one exists? That is fearmongering and scummy as heck.

Accusations of fearmongering, coming from the person who accused Roddy of potentially hiding a vote or using role related shenanigans D1? Hell, you said it yourself that "the game is role-madness bastard mod from what I recall of the game info. If someone makes a strange move, I take in the possibility that it does something." I sense a contradiction here, between your accusations of fearmongering and eagerness to rush into voting in this stage, and your own caution and paranoia in the past about the 'role-madness bastard mod' aspect of the game. I find the possibility of a third party way more likely then Roddy hiding a vote like you accuse him of at the end of this post.

I'd go more into it, but I want to hear from Razeluxe first. Also hearing from Stone Mason would be nice, along with a followup from Sailor Moon as well. You should be back by that wedding you mentioned, shouldn't you?

[W]

You are scum because you've supported wagons that have lynched town and gave passes to Stone Mason on more than one occasion to secure those town wagons as I've linked in my vote post. Sure, scum would want to hold back on voting to quickhammer and that's why you are scum because you are not voting the person you claim should be lynched.

Put that vote down on someone who hasn't been voted today. It's not going to kill you. I complied with the request to not be the hammer vote yesterday, you can do the same and show that you're not hiding anything.

@Evangeline: What I did about Roddy is far less of an issue compared to puffing smoke about 3rd parties. Speculations about role powers can be worked around. Either you forbid the person from activating their power or they demonstrate it. Razeluxe's fearmongering requires a lynch to prove. Wasting a day like that is scummy.

[Ryuki]

You are scum because you've supported wagons that have lynched town and gave passes to Stone Mason on more than one occasion to secure those town wagons as I've linked in my vote post. Sure, scum would want to hold back on voting to quickhammer and that's why you are scum because you are not voting the person you claim should be lynched.

I can't tell if this is just lazy scumhunting or if you're actually trying to pull the wool over our eyes. I look back at the stuff "as you linked in your vote post" and i'm not quite seeing all these 'passes to secure those town wagons' that you're referring to. Maybe when he voted McClane, but are you saying his vote on Shannon securing a town wagon too?

And the logic of "scum would want to hold back on voting to quickhammer and that's why you are scum" is stupid. Since Town ALSO wants to hold back on voting so scum can't quickhammer.


@Razeluxe: If you can, just do what he's saying and #Vote/Unvote, unless you have a good reason not to.


@Stone Mason: Stop lurking. I had your last active pegged a little more than twelve hours ago, then again about two hours ago, and your most recent is from an hour ago. You have questions posed to you, so I suggest you get to answering.

[Skull]

After doing a thorough reread of everyone stil in play, I have arrived at a few conclusions. Stuffman has a playstyle that has a common theme with the other confirmed scum, namely a theme of undermining and trying to interpret other's actions as scum on his terms. It is a little hard to describe, it would be best to read that goober's posts in isolation and see how you feel. Essentially, he doesn't really try to ask for clarification, he more asserts people are scum based on his interpretations, which in my opinion are usually a little weak. I don't know if this is merely playstyle differences, but I feel this playstyle is not helpful for town. Therefore, at this point I am comfortable with voting the Goober.

Others:

I targeted Stone Mason.

Stone Mason tips his hat.

The reason I went for McClane rather than school girl was based on D3 and D4 differences, namely, she was a lot more coherent and consistent on those days than McClane was. Furthremore, at the time of D4 I saw you had the Silver Medal, I had a sudden gut reaction: this seems like a mislynch. Now after another read I can see you remain internally consistent through the other days as well.

I actually don't want Missy maid to role claim, however, I would like her to clarify if becoming a monster was mandated.

The Moon Cult Feminist remains a waffle on a reread. An unsure player would seem to be town; hmm. She has been suspicious of both confirmed scum at early points in play, which is good, but has already been stated.

I think the Raze the kook has been okay, and his freakouts are reading like his nerves are getting to him.

That being said, I have no significant suspicion on who a second scum would be.

And finally for a fun pet theory, Stuffman says he gets a second vote by hammering, but I' hypothesizing he already got a second vote: the Silver Medal.
Don't put weight into this though, I just want to see if I've successfully matched wits after the game.

And School Girl's ninja: True. I was doing the a full read on the players left. Stopped halfway. Didn't want to post when I wasn't done. This was last night. And for an hour ago, (probably longer now) I was still in the middle of posting this. I've actually already answered Stuffman's regarding D3 before; I clarify you over John above, and the information flip would be due to you talking more and people talking about you more (gives more relationship correlation). I was also thinking in terms of how your flip would put Steven in a new light, but lynching Steven was a more direct route that honestly I was not wholly confident in.

Just to add. I think I may be free for about seven hours or so.

[Ryuki]

@Mason: Aside from Stuffman then, who else would you consider the next most scummy? And you said you did a full reread of the remaining players, so what are your thoughts on Shannon then?

[Ryuki]

Derp, RTFT Evangeline. " I have no significant suspicion on who a second scum would be." Still, like your thoughts on Shannon if possible.

[Skull]

Mmmm. It is a little hard to say regarding miss maid, she was consistent with her suspicions on Sandor since D1. The "late/irrelevant" vote D1 suspicion against her was stupid. She had a falling out with Miyako over playstyle, which she remained steadfast in. She has been a little wordy, but it could be she is just trying to elucidate herself, and considering she didn't post often and there was a lot to consider in between, it makes sense. Don't see anything too bad with it.

[Ryuki]

Alright, that's a reasonable explanation, and we came to pretty much the same conclusion about Shannon. I still have my reservations about you, but at least you're decloaked for the time being.

@Shannon: One thing that i'm kinda curious about though.. why did you want to know who I targeted last night before you roleclaimed? Why is this relevant?

[DiEnd]

And finally for a fun pet theory, Stuffman says he gets a second vote by hammering, but I' hypothesizing he already got a second vote: the Silver Medal.
Don't put weight into this though, I just want to see if I've successfully matched wits after the game.

I think the Silver Medal is passable as Miyako said and as Suwako has told me. It's just that Shannon is untargetable by it from her role, apparently, so Miyako had some problems passing.

There is the OTHER anonyvote, though.

Okay, I've reread stuff and condensed my opinions.

Stone Mason is very low-content and low activity, (although his most recent post is quite nice) and while I don't like that, I don't find anything actually scummy about him. I wouldn't be surprised if he's some third party but lets not even get into this argument again.

Evangeline is... well, like McClane, all the analysis on her wagon activity is scum-beneficial. I think I worded that really badly, so I hope you understand what I mean. However, the logic itself behind the votes are solid, which helps her not look as bad, plus she also seems to be the one person who's really putting in effort for this game, something I noticed heavily starting on D4 and on, so I'm starting to lean towards her being town.

Shannon, I still feel the same as yesterday; I could see why scum would be doing her actions, but I don't see anything that actually makes me think she's more likely scum then town.

Razeluxe. I... don't really have anything to say about him, I guess. My brain isn't functioning, maybe. Not feeling scumminess about him is implied, by the way. I realize this isn't a good kind of opinion to have (Aka none), and if you've got any kind of question for me about him, feel free to ask! Or anything else, for that matter.

I don't have a lot of experience with Stuffman's player's playstyle, so I dunno if it's always this anti-town (I hear it is), but it rubs me the wrong way, ESPECIALLY today. Before I was willing to give him a meta-pass unless I saw something particularly bad, at least until LyLo, but A.Now it's LyLo and B.Now I think he's looking particularly bad today! Comprehensive reread on him coming... at some point... probably sometime tomorrow when I get home, where I'll explain specifically why I don't like him. My brain can't analyze more mafia at the moment.

[Kiva-la]

@Evangeline: I do have a reason not to. I said specifically in my first post I was going to vote/unvote Stone Mason, and so unless he believes I was lying out of my ass (something you should never assume people are doing, because that's not pro-town) I have the ability to be the first to vote someone, as Stone Mason has yet to be voted. His insistence to make me do it has me believing that there's something to it, too. Also, I was roleblocked last night (have been intentionally avoiding leaving any traces of anything associated with my role), and I'm worried there's some sort of correlation, or some other weird effect that'll kick in when I do it. As for what my research left me with, well, for one he never comes out strong before today, wherein it's lylo and his personality changes immensely. For another, the sheer number of things wrong with his post here accusing me of being scum. I honestly find it difficult to find much right with that post, which I didn't realize when I had originally just done a very basic, shallow read of it. I'd give a more in-depth analysis, but my internet shuts off in a few minutes, so I don't really have the time.

As for something that stood out, well, the role fishing caught my eye, which is what brought my attention to re-reading it thoroughly, and that's when I noticed just how much he had wrong.

Not sure of who I believe to be second scum, since paranoia is starting to kick in when I think about it. Sorry, but my nerves are getting to me, IRL and online. Should be fine when I get a day or two to recharge.

@Stuffman: ...too much to go over. Just... too much. What you say makes no sense, and is just as much fearmongering as anything I've done. If you're so sure I'm scum, and you're not, though, then please give us your ideas on who the second scum is.

Getting this out while I still can.

[Ryuki]

Alright. So we've finally heard from everyone (dear god, like pulling teeth!). Though it seems like pretty much everyone has the same person in mind for voting, still like to see voting held off on voting for another 24 hours or so to give some people a chance to respond and to get more discussion out there.

Is our chicago voter Shoe still with us here? Can you give us a ##Vote/Unvote of who you think is the most scummy now?

[Skull]

Moon Cult Feminist: I can understand you don't have a strong opinion about Raze the Kook being scum, but would you mind going the other direction why you think he might be town?

Stuffman/Goober: Playstyle differences? Would you mind giving a brief on the way you mafia? You had a here

[Punch Hopper]

##Vote: StuffMan
##Unvote

[Skull]

Edit: You had a blurb here.

[Ryuki]

plus she also seems to be the one person who's really putting in effort for this game, something I noticed heavily starting on D4 and on

To be fair, i'm just trying to follow Saki's lead here. If someone didn't step into the void created by her absence, Town seems like it'd be pretty much boned by now. Even with how shitty my scumhunting record has been, even I can prod, ask questions, and be present.


Also, putting it out there now that I won't be able to get to things as quickly as I've been for the next 16-24 hours. I'll still be poping in here from time to time to comment on things and throw a vote down, so i'll be around.

[Suwako Moriya]

Vote Chart

Sailor Moon (1): Silver Medal
Shannon (1): Seth MacFarlane
Stuff Man (0): Shoe, Shoe
Razeluxe Meitzen (1): Stuff Man

With 7 votes in play, it takes 4 votes to lynch. There is no time limit.

[W]

Razeluxe as scum 1 and Stone mason as scum 2 going by todays posts.

As for explaining playstyle, allow me to use Razeluxe's excuse which you guys have been perfectly fine with.

Just because I mention it doesn't mean I'm actually entertaining the idea. I ramble and post in stream-of-consciousness.

Cut the bullshit and take responsibility for what you post.

Don't give a shit anymore so start voting. Let's have Razeluxe and then Stone Mason in that order with the votes on me. If the game ends, that's just how it is. If not, it should be blindingly obvious that Razeluxe is scum.

[Ryuki]

With that sort of attitude I can't say it'd be much of a loss even if you did flip Town. :/ You don't defend yourself, you don't quite explain yourself, and you just attack everyone around you instead. Saying "These people are scum based on today's posts" is like IIoA without even the information.

[Kiva-la]

Okay, turns out I wasn't roleblocked last night. Just got a confusing message from the mod. My bad, it's all been cleared up now.

Gragh, computer is making me angry. Simply will. Not. Respond. Going to come back tonight with what I have to say, since I'd much rather be in a pleasant mood than a poor one. Everything that I felt absolutely needed saying now has been said. (Please don't end it until I get back)

[W]

Too bad I'll still be around being same as I've been all game if you guys don't want to vote me. And Razeluxe shouldn't worry about it ending before he gets back because he's going to be the first vote on me.

[Ryuki]

Pah, now all this dancing around has gotten me paranoid about roles.

With things as they are, I can guarantee that you'll be getting my vote Stuffman. With Shoe that's two confirmed, and from what I see from the others is that there no one else sticking out in anyone's mind more than you. At this point you should consider yourself as good as lynched, so If you are indeed Town like you say, then why not give us something to go off of, some parting words, something that actually -helps- the team you're supposedly on? Instead of saying "Don't give a shit anymore just lynch me already". This isn't any better than the disappearing act that Gamzee and Sandor pulled.

I'd still like to get a response from Shannon before the end of the day however.