So, what exactly is the Touhou Fan-dumb, touhoufags, etc.

[ebarrett]

[Ayuka]

Okay, so I realize that a lot of this has already been stated in various different ways by various different people, but I figured I'd throw my own take in.

From the outside looking in EVERYONE in the Touhou fanbase is the fandumb, because Touhou tends to be linked in many people's minds with pedophilia and blind arrogance. But then again, the same can be said for people's opinions of all kinds of series, just replace the word 'pedophilia' with something else derogatory.
From inside the fanbase itself, the fandumb can't really be nailed down to one specific archetype because it really tends to come down to taste. If there's a meme you don't like then people who use it are part of the fandumb. If there's a band you don't like then people who listen to them are part of the fandumb. If there's a character you don't like then people who like that character are part of the fandumb. Therefore, by being a part of the fanbase you are part of the fandumb, QED. Like Tengukami said, there will always be someone who thinks YOU are what's wrong with Touhou. I don't like the fact that that's how it tends to be, but you'd be hard pressed to find any fandom where it isn't. This is the internet.

However, Tengukami also makes another excellent point that we should focus more on what we like rather than what we don't.  I can't stand the Aya is a slut meme, or the Ran is an exhibitionist meme, or the insert a Touhou character on a muscle bound man meme either, but it takes a lot less effort to roll your eyes and stop reading/watching than it does to yell at the people involved for doing something they enjoy that you don't agree with. I do, however, find memes like Cirno's strongest, caramelldansen, and cheeen! to be hilarious and I don't like being considered an idiot for using them, just like people who like memes I don't wouldn't appreciate me coming into their threads/videos/whatever and flaming them for liking what they like.. After all, rage can only beget more rage. When you yell at someone you put them on the defensive and it's almost guaranteed they will yell back at you. Repeat into infinity.

The only thing that really bugs me is a see a lot of posts saying 'why can't fanon and canon coexist' but also complaining about how fanon isn't canon enough. Tolerance isn't a one-way street. Personally I enjoy both fanon and canon and I think it wouldn't be any fun if both were the same. They're two completely different worlds to explore in the same series and I think that's part of what makes Touhou so great.

Although, who knows, maybe I'm just blowing hot air. It's always possible that I'm the fandumb.

[Drake]

Eh, I think it's more of "people act as though fanon can substitute canon entirely in a given situation, repeatedly argue using fanon as basis while ignoring canon elements, argue fanon as though it were a canonical concept, etc" rather than "fanon isn't canon enough" or whatever, if that's what you mean. But yes to everything else.

[Firestorm29]

I've been reading through this, and well, most of the whole meme thing hasn't bothered me as much. The only thing that really bugged me was that whole Alice anal seepage thing. Never understood that.

[Bias Bus]

I've been reading through this, and well, most of the whole meme thing hasn't bothered me as much. The only thing that really bugged me was that whole Alice anal seepage thing. Never understood that.

Oh yeah, I completely forgot about that one. It seems that it's one of those memes you (thankfully) don't hear about anymore and/or fell out of style.

So, so many more to go, though...

[Drake]

comic edit, forced meme, caught on to new people thinking it was truly a meme like every other forced meme out there

Not many people even talk about that nowadays.

[Iryan]

I do not know and I do not want to know.

[Cadmas]

comic edit, forced meme, caught on to new people thinking it was truly a meme like every other forced meme out there

Not many people even talk about that nowadays.

Isn't everything said to be a forced meme know?

[Drake]

People do tend to say any meme they don't like is forced. Whether they are or not is something else. Aya having pointy ears was unforced, but that died quickly. Sanae being a good girl wasn't forced, but gave way to her being a slut, which was forced. Youmu being soft, Yuyuko being a ravenous eating machine, Marisa having a harem, ⑨, Koishi liking phallic objects, Pads, were never forced.

What is forced and not forced in my opinion just tends to be how easily the fandom accepts the idea.

[Tengukami]

All memes are forced. It's the very nature of memes for people to deliberately and repeatedly use them. That's how they spread.

Memes happen. No point in raging about them.

[?q]

I mentioned Touhou outside this forum, so I may as well resign myself to being labeled a part of the fandumb.
As far as most people are concerned that's as much as matters.

That was easy.

Generally speaking the people who comprise the "bad segment" of the Touhoummunity are the same sorts of people I wouldn't speak to for more than ten seconds if they were fans of anything else anyway.  Dregs are dregs; it's just the subject that changes.

[trancehime]

Eh, I think it's more of "people act as though fanon can substitute canon entirely in a given situation, repeatedly argue using fanon as basis while ignoring canon elements, argue fanon as though it were a canonical concept, etc" rather than "fanon isn't canon enough" or whatever, if that's what you mean. But yes to everything else.

This is entirely what I was trying to say with why I find people who worship fanon to be completely ridiculous.

Because they're basically taking as true a fan's interpretation of a certain thing or character as true while completely dismissing the source material. It makes no sense :/

[Alice★f]

Seems like most Touhou fans list Touhou fans as their #1 hate for Touhou. They say 90% of the fans are morons or whatever. I'm just curious, where exactly do they see this raging retardation? Is it in the fan-art? The awful porn? The fanfiction writers?

I generally stick to just playing the fangames, and chatting on this board (though I pop in DS and poosh occasionally, I use this one more than those two combined X4 though..or something). Either way, I don't really see a whole bunch of idiocy regarding the fans in Touhou (Except I found those awful masturbate signatures on DS to be really dumb, but whatever).

What/where is the fan-dumb? What are they guilty of? Why the Hatate, err hate?

The horrible memes. I know, already been mentioned, but I'm just adding my spit to the jar, err adding my two cents...

Also, the "war" between "real" Touhou fan and "casual" Touhou fans.

Or better known as, people who actually play the series versus those who just watch the PV's and read the Doujins. =/

People who consider themselves more of a "fan" than others, I guess.

A while back, there was a thread in MoTK where the OP asked "What is a Touhou fan" and this sort of ties in with that.

Honestly, I don't believe a lot of Touhou fans are dumb. If anything, Touhou really doesn't have so many fans as compared to other series. And I do get the vibe that a lot of prejudice is towards American English-speaking fans, not all fans (Excluding Japanese)

So you might ask "why?"

Well, I've heard a lot of "because they're shitting the fandom"

My response is: "Why do you even care? Zun sure as hell doesn't."

The point is, okay, so you might hate Touhou fans. Why, though? There's no reason. There's idiots in every fandom, so?

[Lord Phantasm Satori]

yeah... about what I said back there... I can be kind of an ass when I post at around 2 am :V

all I really meant was that it would be a great twist if we see a shota in a game for once instead. it would be all like

reimu: um... why are you dressed like that, that's a boys outfit.

shota character: *anger face* that's because I AM a boy!

reimu: *shock*

*insert rest of the dialogue here*

or something. and it would be cool. what would be funny is if one of the characters said to themselves "aw I can't fight a boy, its unethical. oh well, looks like I have no choice". it would be hillariously ironic.

[orinrin]

I don't see fanon overriding canon in other fandoms.  Maybe this is just my opinion alone, but I think the fanon vs. canon thing is one of the aspects that makes Touhou what it is.

[Lord Phantasm Satori]

you know, as long as the fanon isn't too farfetched. I just think of it as 'a day in the life'. when it comes to comic edits. if its funny, lol. if not, oh well hey, that rhymes!

[Ayuka]

Fanon never really OVERRIDES canon, even if it seems like it's more popular sometimes. I think the reason it seems to be so much more prevalent in the Touhou series is because there are so many characters that have only shown up once or twice so fans of those characters make stuff up. I've seen it happen with other series where a popular character stops showing up in the games. But I do agree, the fanon and canon are both vital parts of the series.

[trancehime]

Fanon never really OVERRIDES canon, even if it seems like it's more popular sometimes. I think the reason it seems to be so much more prevalent in the Touhou series is because there are so many characters that have only shown up once or twice so fans of those characters make stuff up. I've seen it happen with other series where a popular character stops showing up in the games. But I do agree, the fanon and canon are both vital parts of the series.

It doesn't and it should never override canon.

But there are people who treat it as such ANYWAY, and that's what makes me angry.

[Tengukami]

Why? It doesn't change what's true about Touhou for you. They can't make you change your mind, and most of them probably aren't even trying to. We each enjoy the series differently. If you think they're too loud about their POV, well, I'd suggest either not engaging or just ignore it altogether. Actively ignore it long enough, it becomes background noise that barely registers.

[Alice★f]

I do have to admit that during the CNN incident, I felt like getting a frying pan and smacking some posters across the face. =/

But we have to acknowledge that they're less than 0.1% of the entire fandom...

[trancehime]

Actively ignore it long enough, it becomes background noise that barely registers.

this is why i don't hang around TARC or I'd explode even more than this

[Firestorm29]

When I read the last few posts, I can't help but to wonder if it's similar to what one of my friends had to deal with once. Basically, he and someone else were discussing a subject, but random person C kept in interrupting and butting in saying how he felt and was forcing friend and other person to believe to answer was was random person C though and wouldn't drop it. Friend and other person just dropped the subject altogether since they couldn't get a word in without random person C being an asshole. Kinda gettin' that vibe here for some reason, although you can't really speak louder in a forum to override someone like you can IRL.

I'm the only person in my nieghborhood that knows about much about Touhou.

yeah... about what I said back there... I can be kind of an ass when I post at around 2 am :V

all I really meant was that it would be a great twist if we see a shota in a game for once instead. it would be all like

reimu: um... why are you dressed like that, that's a boys outfit.

shota character: *anger face* that's because I AM a boy!

reimu: *shock*

*insert rest of the dialogue here*

or something. and it would be cool. what would be funny is if one of the characters said to themselves "aw I can't fight a boy, its unethical. oh well, looks like I have no choice". it would be hillariously ironic.

Why don't you give that a spin in damakufu?

[Lord Phantasm Satori]

I plan to eventually. It would just be much cooler to see it in a canon game.

[Ghaleon]

Since this kind of morphed into a topic about meme's somewhat.. What memes do people LIKE?
I personally like ones involving Reimu's armpits. I never really had an armpit fetish, but <3...I'm not even sure if that can be considered a meme though. I also think the whole 'haters gonna Hatate" thing is cute (funny isn't really the case though). Though I don't know how much I would use it personally.

[Alice★f]

Minoriko Pees Wine

That's the only meme I like because it makes sense =/

[VIVItheFujoshi]

 some of that people who are the "fandump" are the people who like the thing a season, but forget soon. Another ones stay more and turn into permanent fandump. or research about their object of adoration and turn into a fan normal...and after a true fan.
The bad thing of the memes is who turn all so bored and no offer originallity...not are you bored of, for example,the thing about psycho Flandre, pimp Marisa, Tsundere-Yandere Alice, the MANNOSUKE (XD) etc? i think who the meme is a kind of point of understanding, but an abuse of that can be bad...specially for ones who do doujins. Some of them simply are all the same...and no offer a new twist. But the memes have a short time of life; when the generation of fans who created that idea changed to other things, the next one, when see the meme, no understand nothing about that, and lost the meaning.

My fab meme? "all in Gensokyo is gay" (apart to my personal fujoshi preferences...(and im not a rabid fangirl)) because have lot of implicances, first lot of fanboys begin to fantasy about that...but forget the males.And then remember Rinnosuke. Then say who he is too, But who is sad for be the only male. The yuri fans NO WANT EVEN IMAGINE who Rinnosuke can have a male lover in this "paradise" full of lesbi girls, even if they no will appear in the hipotetical doujin. the funny thing? even the potencial here, yaoi fangirls no touch Touhou. that make me laught, make me think,make me draw, and make me sad.

(thinking no take so serious only a reflection) more correct is say "in Gensokyo, probably more people is gay than the real world" (Youkai are spirits and then no have an especial gender preference (bisexual we can say, but probably pansexual, same with the yousei, who are so free too) humans are (for biology) hetero, but for origin fluctuates sometimes in the homo or bi; Ghosts no can have sex because are only spirit, but can feel atracted for another soul; demons are bi (hermaprodites? succubus- incubbus are more especific in their genders...but this race trick human desires) half ones are "more bi" than a normal human (if youkai are bi, and human is neutral...a hanyou, a half ghost, a half hakutaku is in the middle, more open in their preferences) etc.

im almost tempted to put some of my you-know-about draws in pixiv(i have an account who i use only for lurk) but after think who i can awake an horrid monster...some fangirls are things to fear (the 801 monster is for something! im afraid)

Sorry for be like this. i like Touhou for the music and the world where all happen. Give you moments of dream a magical world for a time and forget your daily problems...the charas are lovable too.

[Vicks]

I don't mind when a person treats fanon as canon, after all, it's their intepretation. But don't expect to come out on top when you force your "facts" upon other people. Also, telling people that Touhou is a game, not an anime is fine. Yelling/swearing/selling your soul for revenge at the person who ask "What anime is this song from." is overreacting and idiotic. Swearing profusely at someone doesn't exactly make them understand better than just talking calmly. maybe it does...

I'll see what else I can add later.

[?q]

Since this kind of morphed into a topic about meme's somewhat.. What memes do people LIKE?
I personally like ones involving Reimu's armpits. I never really had an armpit fetish, but <3...I'm not even sure if that can be considered a meme though. I also think the whole 'haters gonna Hatate" thing is cute (funny isn't really the case though). Though I don't know how much I would use it personally.

Memes usually only take off if they're clever or scandalous.  (or just meaningless but repeated so often that other people start doing it too)

I personally don't mind memes of any type as long as they STAY clever; i.e. they're not causelessly spouted by idiots.

Actually, I like creating my own memes.  *credits self with helping start Koishi+Embers of Love, for better or worse*

[Ayuka]

I like pretty much all Touhou memes as long as they somewhat make sense. The only memes I don't like are sexually based ones (Ran is an exhibitionist, Aya is a slut, etc although I don't mind the Sakuya pad meme) and the ones involving putting Touhou characters on top of muscley men (Be they the girls or even Rinnosuke).

[Phlegeth]

I like Guncannon Kanako and CAPTAIN MINAMITSU MOTHERFUCKING MURASA!  Also China's JAAAAAAOOOOOOO, which is weird since it's spouted off as much as PAD *KNIFE'D* and others, but I'm tired of it.