Things you Hate/Like about Touhou

[J.O.B]

I am surprised there isn't something like this here already.

Anyway, this thread is for talking about stuff you hate/like about touhou.

I really hate it when you get an itch and your concentrating on dodging bullets and then you quickly go to scratch it and then you die.

But I really like the music though.

I also hate curvy lazors.

[8lue Wizard]

I like the varied cast of characters.
I hate all stage 2 bosses not named Chen.
I like bashing my head against a challenge repeatedly until I finally incur brain damage prevail.
I hate StB/DS.
I like wading through slow, dense masses of bullets.
I hate fast bullets that make me use my walrusy reflexes.

[Solais]

I like every aspect of Touhou, but the games should be a little longer.

[Treasurance]

Music, characters...most games, especially the photography games (yes I am crazy)... Pretty much everything in the series EXCEPT SoEW (too much BS, and where's my deathbomb) and Phantasmagorias (cheater AI). Also, Yukkuris are a bit too scary.

[Bananamatic]

what I hate:
1) bad controls
2) boring stages with inconsistent difficulty
3) EoSD's hitboxes
4) seriously uneven shottypes
5) MoF and SA's bomb system, UFO's power system
6) pixel streaming

what I like about touhou:
1) It's still a shmup
2) It isn't X-Multiply

[Reddyne]

Oh, I'll keep it simple. Things I like:
1. The characters
2. The ridiculous, hyperactive fanbase.
3. The music.
4. Easy to pick up and play.
5. It's such a dramatic escape from my normal diet of RPG's and generic action games.

Things that tick me off:
1. My lack of skill.
2. Certain degree of repetitiveness between the games
3. StB and DS can bite my ass.

[Gandalph]

Like:
-Music
-Huge cast of varied and somewhat silly characters
-Fanbase is very active and mostly friendly

Dislike:
-Shmups aren't my thing. I find the actual gameplay frustrating and boring.

[Tengukami]

The shorter list would be things I don't like. And that would be the fighting games. Namely because I don't like the genre. For all I know, IaMP, SWR and UNL might be awesome games for their genre.

[Formless God]

The shorter list would be things I don't like. And that would be the fighting games. Namely because I don't like the genre. For all I know, IaMP, SWR and UNL might be awesome games for their genre.

This.

Things I don't like ? Haven't thought of a list yet, meanwhile these are the two that pissed me off the most.
Anyone who goes here screaming "LOL THIS GAME IS IISI GO PLAY IMPIRISHABLE NIGHTS EXTRA NOOBS"
Those who can't pronounce refuse to pronounce "Touhou" correctly for fuck's sake.

[Silent Harmony]

Spoiler:

God I hope this thread doesn't dissolve into a stupid flame war.

LIKE:
-The music
-The characters
-The fanbase's creativity with both
-The gameplay (like another said it's different from what I usually play)
-The quick nature of the game (stage practice; full game about 30-40 minutes)

DISLIKE:
-The fanbase's immaturity
-The massive amount of porn fanart [don't dislike porn out of principal, it's just annoying to look for pictures for certain characters (i.e. Komachi) and find nothing but boobs everywhere]
-The inconsistent difficulty

[Chainsaw Guitar]

+ The greatest gallery of fan art I've ever seen. (Just so long as you search Danbooru with -rating:_s blacklisted)
+ Easy to pick up and play, but incredibly hard to master.
+ Fan games are interesting and fun to play as well.

- Gimmicks. Just about every game ZUN has ever made has them.
- The best Touhou game in the series is almost completely ignored due to people not willing to punch in any time into training.

[Formless God]

- The best Touhou game in the series is almost completely ignored due to people not willing to punch in any time into training.

Undefined Fantastica :*

[Tengukami]

DISLIKE:
-The fanbase's immaturity
-The massive amount of porn fanart [don't dislike porn out of principal, it's just annoying to look for pictures for certain characters (i.e. Komachi) and find nothing but boobs everywhere]

This brings up a point I was thinking of earlier. Would fan-related matters fall under things we like/dislike about Touhou? It's not as thoough ZUN started some of the stupider memes about the Gensokyans.

In the area of fandom, there are few memes that really bug me. What I do dislike is fan elitism.

The Double Spoiler thread was a great example of this. Here we had a bunch of people all excited for the release of the game, chatting, speculating, having a good time, and one or two guys dropped in to basically shit in the thread and talk about how much they hated StB and don't care about the sequel.

Another example of this would be something that came up in IRC the other day, where a discussion of EoSD was taking place. Someone basically got on their elitist high horse and started calling anyone using the hitbox patch a "kindergartener" who is "ruining the integrity of the game".

I mean please. Games are supposed to be FUN. What games others find enjoyable - or what they do to make the games more enjoyable for them - is of no concern to anyone. The kind of sneering elitism that some fans show blows my mind. Just chill already. 狂えよ其は幻想郷!

[Gpop]

What I like:
1) Koishi
2) The cast
3) The fun yet challenging game.
4) Awesome music from every game but EoSD
5) Beautiful patterns
6) Really fun fighting games

What I hate:
1) EoSD
2) Eirin
3) SDM crew (well only Sakuya and Remi really)
4) Clip-deaths

[Azinth]

Like:
-The gameplay (for the most part)
-The music
-Pretty fanart
-A few of the characters

Indifferent towards:
-Doujins
-Most of the characters

Hate:
-Just about everything else. >_>

[Formless God]

^ It's pretty much the same for me too >_>
God, how the fanbase irritated me ...

[ふねん1]

Things I like:
- Characters
- Awesome music
- Difficulty, provided it's not for the wrong reasons (ex. VoWG is a great dodging test)
- The fact that there's so much fanwork devoted to it (whether or not I care about a particular piece is another story)

Things I hate:
- Attacks that are hard for the wrong reasons (i.e. general programming/attack design errors, extreme randomness, etc.)
- The immaturity of some of the fanbase

[Bananamatic]

these "touhou games are well known for being ridiculously difficult" people. that's why I hate the goddamn fanbase.

2D games always required some practice to clear. Mario, Gradius, Battletoads, whatever. Today's games aren't hard at all, and when something which goes back to the old days appears, it's immediately called "extremely hard".

And then one game makes it to the mainstream and everyone shits bricks everywhere. THIS GAME IS NOTHING, PLAY TOUHOU IT'S MUCH HARDER

I want to tie these people to a chair and force them to play Gunbird 2 for 10 hours straight.

And the overprotective fans. Look at the CNN video.
"I didn't know Idiots existed as far as within CNN. Please Fire Them, For the sake of Touhou and ART!!!"

"honestly 'm glad that CNN didn't get the whole thing because then everyone and there mother would be checking out touhou and then touhou would be the next naruto"

unfortunately, that's most of the comments

tl;dr: MY GAME IS EXTREMELY HARD AND EXTREMELY OBSCURE WHICH MAKES ME THE BEST PERSON EVER

[Chaotic Phoenixma]

Like:

Music
Difficulty(most of the time)
Gameplay
Characters

Dislike:

fanbase
Difficulty(some of the time)
most fangames
All the gimmicks


As for examples of difficulty that I like:(PC98 not included in any of these, but there's plenty of them for each of them)

Virtue of Wind God(when it's not throwing solid walls), Kappa's Pororoca/Illusionary Waterfall, Illusionary Dominance(MoF and DS), Agni Shine High Level, Rage Trilithon High Level, Water Elf, Mercury Poison, Scarlet Gensokyo(Hard), Everything from Kaguya on IN, Orin in general, Most of UFO on Normal and Extra, Murasa last normal spellcard, Grudge Bow, QED, Descent of Izuna Gongen, Boundary of Life and Death, Mishaguji-sama(although this one is easy)

Examples on difficulty I don't mind too much either way: Patchouli books(these seem fairer each time I go against them, but I still can't capture them. The BS is in clipdeath, not actual reading). Demon of Purification(I'm just terrible at these ones though, but they're still fair), Illusion Dream Vine, Colorful Chaos Dance

Examples of Difficulty I hate: Peerless Wind God, Sylphae Horn High Level, Agni Radiance, Scarlet Meister, Remilia Opener, Eternal Meek, Young Demon Lord, Scarlet Gensokyo(Lunatic), Princess Undine/Bury in Lake, Killing Doll, Ichirin on Hard/Lunatic, Shou first nonspell, Shou third nonspell, Byakuren on higher difficulties, VoWG(when throwing solid walls), Almost everything in PCB, Eirin on IN, Marisa's nonspells in IN,  Kogasa(Hard/Lunatic), UFO Hard/Lunatic in general, Yamame's opener, Heart danmaku, Stuff that's impossible unless you memorize it, StB/DS puzzle gimmick cards that are impossible to clear with pure dodging, Vampire Illusion, Momizi, PostMomizi BS Walls, Kanako opener, Stage 5 midboss Orin.

[Drake]

Chentlemen, I like Touhou.

[Silent Harmony]

Ah yes, a few actual Zun-based Touhou things. Sorry.

LIKE
- Stage 2 boss characters (for some reason I tend to like them  *shrug*)
- Item-based lives (Point and fragment)
- Short stages
- Somewhat forgiving gameplay
         - Death Bombs

HATE
- Stage 3 boss fights (for some reason I tend to suck at them)
- Score-based lives (suck at spellcards? LOL good luck)
- Long stages (PCB S4 oh god)
- Gimmicky shot-types (holds SA back from true greatness IMO)
- Inconsistent difficulty (needs to be said again!)

[Grand Octopus]

The Good

- Games
- Characters on balance
- Music (GSTs + remixes)
- Fanwork on balance

The Bad

- Unpolished aspects of games (e.g. misplaced difficulty, bugs, lack of options)
- 98.45% of memes
- Majority of fanbase needs to have their breathing permits revoked

The Ugly

- Any character drawn too young or with unwarranted cat ears
- Sanae

[Bananamatic]

- 98.45% of memes

Forgot this. Except that it's 100%. And 90% of them are less meme than Milhouse.

[Ghaleon]

The list of likes could go on for some time, but I'll try to keep it simple.

Likes:
Music,
cast,
lack of seriousness,
pretty kaleidoscope-like bullet patterns,
fanbase (I'll get to that in a minute),
promotion of fanon,
the fact that most are shmups (dying genre),
high difficulty combined with generous extends

Dislike:
Fighting games (I dislike the entire genre, and haven't given Touhou's a try, so put my opinion with tengu here),
fanbase,
shot-type imbalance (ban has a good point here). I mean some of them are seriously garbage,
UFO ufos,
MoF/SA Bomb-system,
stages are rather boring compared to bosses...We need more enemy variety plox.

summary:
The fans are obviously a mixed bag. I think it does them great injustice to say you dislike them because of all the immaturity found on certain areas or sites. I think people need to think just how much touhou they enjoy that is fanmade. All those music remixes, the english patches, the fan-games, even the community websites like this place and the fan-maintained replay archives.

The fact that Touhou is more fanon than canon is IMO what really makes it shine, not that the canon is bad by any means. But I like to think of it like with what happened between IBM and Macintosh in the early days. IBM allowed people to make their own systems and sell them, Macintosh didn't. In the end, the PC market dominated the mac market because of that decision (many other reasons were heavily influenced by that decision, such as the price difference)

As for difficulty rants. I really like Touhou's difficulty, it is IMO one of the best-made games in that area. I've played other shmups that are regarded as harder. And the thing is when you get down to sheer dodging difficulty, Touhou is *NOT* easier. It's just easier to think of it as easier because of the generous lifecount/extend and deathbomb mechanic. Voluntarily end your game after 4-5 deaths on lunatic (and suicide after a deathbomb) in Touhou if you want it to be the same difficulty as a cave shooter if you like. Of course it doesn't have a TLB, but I think there is only 1... maybe 2 (shadowbringer the only one I think) who can actually legitimately reach a TLB in most cave games. So I don't see why that should really matter to us >=)

It's like IWBTG. People know it's a hard game, but if you counted the generous saves and unlimited lifecounts, it'd be even easier than normal-mode Touhou in that regard. Life counts and whatnot don't really count towards how hard a game FEELS IMO.

/rant off.

[Bananamatic]

uhh...what exactly is "legitimately reach a TLB"? 1ccing both loops or just looping the game once, then creditfeeding to the TLB?

Another thing - Touhou is too slow with too dense patterns, which forces micromemorization and makes you go asleep.

ZUN could learn a thing or two from the team which made Blue Wish Resurrection.
But he probably wants to make different shmups.

And the importance of score - the scoring mechanics are usually way too hardcore - unless you play for score, your score will suck. You have to sacrifice lives in UFO to score high, switch between youkai and human in IN, bombgraze in SA - nothing which is normal in survival play.
Just as POCing. It's a bad scoring mechanic.

In the later touhous, score does nothing - no extends, nothing. No point in caring about score. Hell, you could take it out and nothing would change.

In an arcade shmup, the extends are set much higher, which makes the person want to score well so he can get further and high scores are achievable through perfectly normal play - pick up the items which drop and don't let any escape, chain the enemies, use that item to get this other item, eat bullets, etc.

Just getting further usually improves your personal record. Touhou requires completely changing your playing style. Scoring is 50% of shmup fun.

[Naut]

Likes:
Games, music, characters

Hates:
Bananamatic's trolling

[Formless God]

Scoring is 50% of shmup fun.

Maybe it's because I started with Touhou and never cared about score in any games), but dodging is 100% fun (sure, cool if I get a nice score at the end, but I've never actively played for it). BoWaP, VoWG, Scarlet Gensokyo, Total Purification, Vajra (one of the few fast-paced spell cards out there, cannot really complain), Superhuman, Grudge Bow, Larsa, Hibachi, all sort of awesome :*

Another thing - Touhou is too slow with too dense patterns, which forces micromemorization and makes you go asleep.

Mushihime :V

[Bananamatic]

Hates:
Bananamatic's trolling

You need to give it more time, I also didn't like it at first.

Mushihime :V

Streaming is fun if it isn't pixel perfect and if there is re-streaming involved.

Touhou :V

[Tengukami]

Another thing - Touhou is too slow with too dense patterns, which forces micromemorization and makes you go asleep.

You really enjoy beating this tired, tired drum.

[Formless God]

Streaming all the time isn't fun either.

PCB Stage 6, UFO Stage 4 :V
For re-streaming see SA Stage 4 and Stage 6.

And what is pixel-perfect streaming ?