Injustice in Gensokyo: Spell Card Rules

[Tiamat]

I'm still waiting for a game where the big bad just says "Fuck your rules" and fights you for real.

I meant more along the lines of characters actually using their unique ability to kill. Like Suika making the air density around the character increase, crushing them to a bloody pulp. Or Yukari gapping their internal organs out of their body. Or Flandre going 'kyu'

Assuming I'm reading it right (there's a 3% margin of error for misinterpretation), spell card rules are written as a devil's contract.  A devil's contract is unbreakable.  Which means super powered characters like Suika, Yukari, or Flandre couldn't break them even if they wanted to (well, maybe Yukari could.  MAYBE.  I suppose she could do something like destroy the boundary between legit contract and illegit contract if she really felt like it.  Not that I know why she'd ever want to because there's rudimentary evidence that she's the one that wrote the rules in the first place)

Sources:  Foot note #2 here states devil contracts are unbreakable

http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Perfect_Memento:_Encyclopedia:_Vampire

The spell card rules are stated to be a devil (vampire) contract here (3% chance of misinterpretation.  But it does appear that it's merely a revision to the devil contract already in place that was made after the Vampire incident was finally put down):

http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Perfect_Memento:_Reimu_Hakurei


Note:  Apparently just because a devil's contract is unbreakable doesn't mean that characters can't bend the rules a little.  ...or a lot in Suika's case (Marisa gets annoyed when analyzing Suika's spell cards in Grimoire of Marisa, complaining that Suika turning huge should be against the rules because it isn't danmaku at all).  Course, given that Reimu approves most of the spell cards (somehow.  How this process works for characters Reimu never met before like Suika or Byakuren is beyond me), it's possible that Suika simply got Reimu really drunk when she approved that one.

Who indeed? A human drafted the spell card rules. The same humans who regularly defy the "do not attack without reason" clause to virtually no consequence. They're rewarded instead. This is an injustice against youkai. A neutral third party is needed to put things right.

Er... actually, Akyu was saying that it appears that a YOUKAI drafted the spell card rules.   The original draft of the spellcard rules was written on the same type of paper as the youkai contract, which is something a youkai would write on.  Akyu then went on to basically ask who the person proposing these rules to the shrine maiden (Reimu) actually was.  This is why the draft is located in the "unsolved mysteries" section of Perfect Memento.  Because the writer of the original rules is an unsolved mystery.

Off-topic:  The original writer is either a character ZUN hasn't introduced to us yet and probably a devil, or Yukari.  From Reimu's profile, we know that the writer is female and loves beautiful things, which is why Danmaku was chosen and other methods were rejected.  We also know that it's a devil's contract, although I'm sure it's possible for another youkai to use a devil as a liason to make the contract.  Logic implies the rules were written up by a youkai considered to be a leader amongst Youkai.  Yukari pretty much fits all these traits besides the vampire thing, as Perfect Memento states in Yukari's profile that she always is wearing extravagant clothes (loves beauty) and Yukari being a leader of Youkai is all over the place.  We also know that Yukari tries to balance out her own power to account for weaker foes just like the spell card system does in  a way (from Yukari's Perfect Memento profile), so she'd be the type to come up with this sort of thing.

http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Perfect_Memento:_Reimu_Hakurei

If the spell card rules were written by a vampire, it is 99% chance that it is NOT Remilia who wrote it.  The spell card rules were written by someone who chose danmaku because they were preferred among women and youkai, but Remilia has been shown on several occassions that she prefers brute force, not Danmaku (ZUN's comments about her last word card in Imperishable Night, and she opts to switch to brute force against the Watsuki sister in Silent Sinner in Blue)

Oh, and if the spell card drafter really was Yukari, she probably just teleported the memo to Reimu without actually meeting her face-to-face, since Perfect Cherry Blossom was apparently the first time Reimu saw Yukari in person, judging by the dialogue (but not the first time Yukari saw Reimu)

[Esifex]

Analysis

Very well done.

....pics or it never happ- *shot*

[Dizzy H. "Muffin" Muffin]

My theory is that the vampire in question is Dracula. Given the "must have been female" thing, maybe one of his "Brides of Dracula" actually wrote it up.

[Tengukami]

I'd lean towards Yukari in that 1. there's an emphasis on beauty but also thought and reason (still wanna know if the Japanese is saying 'reason' as in 'purpose' or 'logic') and 2. Yukari loves creating chaos, and there are loopholes in the Spell Card Rules you could drive a train through.

[OkashiiKisei]

My theory is that the vampire in question is Dracula. Given the "must have been female" thing, maybe one of his "Brides of Dracula" actually wrote it up.

Too bad the Belmonts never got the memo. It would have saved Dracula quite some decapitations if the Belmonts used Danmaku too.

[Tiamat]

Oh, I forgot to mention.  There's further proof that Yukari is the one that wrote the spell card rules in Perfect Memento.  In the credits of Perfect Memento, one of the references mentioned is a work called "Vampire Pact" that was written by Yukari Yakumo.

...so yea, we know the spell card rules were written as a vampire contract (pact)we know they were written by someone who designed them to appeal to "females and youkai", we know they were probably written by a youkai, and that youkai logically had to be someone the other youkai looked up to as a leader.  We know they were written by someone who loves beauty and thought, and we know that they were written by someone who was interested in a system of duels which allowed even weak people to win.  These are all canon and offical, and more or less spelled out in the Spell Card rules or in Reimu's profile in Perfect Memento. Logic implies the rules were also written by someone of great intellect who cares a lot about Gensokyo (since the spell card rules ushered in a new golden age for Gensokyo)

Yukari fits ALL of the above traits to a T, really.  She wrote a book on vampire pacts, she's a female youkai, she's known as the "sage" of youkai (leader) as stated by Akyu in Perfect Memento's comic book and in Subtreraineon Animalism (Suika and Yukari's dialogues with Yuugi), she's loves beauty (extravagant clothes) and thought (Perfect Memento points out her deep knowledge and intellectualism), and she cares a lot about Gensokyo (her official profile in IaMP states that she's unmatched in caring about Gensokyo).

This is the same Youkai that engineered the great border for Gensokyo in the first place, as well as the same youkai that struck the deal which allowed the Oni to find their own paradise as well (Subteranean Animalism).  So it'd make sense that she'd do something like come up with the spell card system for the good of Gensokyo as well.

As if to hammer this point home, her final spell card in PCB (Danmaku Bounded Field) is practically a celebration of the dawn of the spellcard system (Grimoire of Marisa points out that it's a theatrical spell card which combines danmaku for play with danmaku for battle).

[Tengukami]

That still doesn't make the rules fair to youkai. She seems to relish torturing them. The examples are endless.

[Tiamat]

That still doesn't make the rules fair to youkai. She seems to relish torturing them. The examples are endless.

Well yes, this is the same girl who might have led a Youkai invasion to the moon specifically so Youkai could learn humility by getting their butts kicked, after all.  For what it's worth, she seems to relish "torturing" humans too ("teasing" is probably the more accurate term though.  ...really REALLY annoying teasing)

EDIT:  I'd like to point out that Yukari always works with a greater picture in mind that many don't always agree with, but tends to work out for the best for everyone in the end.  The Barrier incident mentioned in Perfect Memento is a good example.  When Yukari first went about it, it implies many Youkai were opposed.  But very few are opposed to it today because it ended up being for the best.  The spell card system is probably the same way for a lot of youkai.

There's a reason no one likes Yukari.  Perfect Memento makes it very clear that Youkai and Human alike try to stay away from her (something which is impossible to do because she's Yukari).  But as pointed out by Rinnosuke, in the end you might as well listen to her because her plans usually work out in the end.

...at any rate, it's pretty obvious that regardless of what you think of the spell card system, canonically the current age really is supposed to be a golden age for Youkai and human alike now.  Although there are still probably a few who disagree.  Kogasa being one of them, interestingly enough.  She actually states she misses the good old days where youkai were the masters of fear.  Zun makes it pretty clear though that Kogasa is someone who simply can't move on.  Heck, even her theme song is meant to represent that, according to that music personality analysis thread.  That said, without Gensokyo, youkai probably would have just died out in the first place anyways.  Which leads back to the whole point of Yukari coming up with plans that people might not like, but often end up being necessary or for the greater good.

[Shizzo]

I'm still waiting for a game where the big bad just says "Fuck your rules" and fights you for real.

Reisen gets pissed at you and doesn't care anymore for Eirin punishing her; then she uses her spellcards from IN with no bullets vanishing~

[Recon 5]

I'd like to see a justification for why people who appear on the scene only after the spellcard rules were instituted don't violate them out of simple ignorance.- Byakuren, for example.

[Silent Harmony]

For that matter, who taught Flandre? I was under the impression the SDM crew didn't interact with her more than absolutely necessary (I may be wrong).

[Helepolis]

Nobody. Youkais live longer than humans. Do you people really think the Spell card rules are made when Reimu was born or something? As PMiSS states it is designed to give the Youkais a feeling of winning over the Hakurei miko without having consequences. I think you are all over analysing the spell card thing. Roughly, perhaps a bad example, you can compare it to boxing. Allowed to punch only upper body until opponent is knocked out. The end.

Don't think Flandre is kept eternal in her room and knows nothing about the outside world.

[Sen]

Don't think Flandre is kept eternal in her room and knows nothing about the outside world.

And Byakuren was sealed away by herself in Makai for a millennium. How did she get spellcards? :V

[Dead Princess Sakana]

And Byakuren was sealed away by herself in Makai for a millennium. How did she get spellcards? :V

Mail-order  :V

[Naut]

Do you people really think the Spell card rules are made when Reimu was born or something?

I was under the impression they were made between TH5 and TH6, given the latter used them but the former didn't....

[E-Nazrin]

I was under the impression they were made between TH5 and TH6, given the latter used them but the former didn't....

... explicitly, at least.

[Tengukami]

I see nothing wrong with 'overanalyzing' the spell card rules. Speculation and analysis of all things Gensokyo is part of what this board is for.

[Helepolis]

And Byakuren was sealed away by herself in Makai for a millennium. How did she get spellcards? :V

And Kanako & co moved from another world.

I was under the impression they were made between TH5 and TH6, given the latter used them but the former didn't....

ZUN states that in IN's afterword. I don't know why he does not clarify anything in eosd or pcb afterword. Reimu's PMiSS part about that "vampire"  kind of confused me. I could swear last time I read Reimu's profile that part was not in there (perhaps not translated). So I don't even know how many things are still unknown to us.

I see nothing wrong with 'overanalyzing' the spell card rules. Speculation and analysis of all things Gensokyo is part of what this board is for.

The spell card rules them selves are pretty clear as they are. You fight till you are out of them or knocked out. It is basically a game of honour and mental victory. I don't see what needs to be analyzed about them. And I don't see how it is also unfair. As in many PMiSS profiles (like Yuka) it is reported you are instantly erased if you bother them. So basically the Youkai can choose to kill you normally or if you challange them you can have a fight without dying. Excluding the Hakurei mikos, which spell card rules standard apply. There is no other way known.

The only ones so far confirmed that have no idea of the spell card rule were the Lunarians in SSiB.

[Tengukami]

Maybe you don't see what needs to be analyzed about the rules, and that's fine. You don't need to. This thread is for people who do want to.

To me, the rules are pretty vague, poetic even, and leave a lot open to interprettation. Some people find speculation and analysis fun. Others don't. Fortunately, we're not all the same. When I read the words of the spell card rules, I find there's quite a bit that could go either way. I've stated as much already in this thread, and hope others will chime in with their own ideas.

[Helepolis]

To me, the rules are pretty vague, poetic even, and leave a lot open to interprettation. Some people find speculation and analysis fun. Others don't. Fortunately, we're not all the same. When I read the words of the spell card rules, I find there's quite a bit that could go either way. I've stated as much already in this thread, and hope others will chime in with their own ideas.

Oh so my different approach of analysis is not appreciated? That is interesting. Even though my posts might sound as if they are bashing, my idea is not to shut down threads or make people shut up. If such vibes are sensed, my apologies because that is not my style.

I tend to approach these kind of mysteries from different angles with more written proof by ZUN or stuff being lead by ZUN. Of course that is possible till a certain extend. You find the rules vague and poetic and open for interpretation. I agree with the latter of the tree as the first two are written and explained pretty crystal clear. Hence I mentioned that most stuff can be simply read on.

But yea, I guess that is not appreciated.

[Tengukami]

Oh so my different approach of analysis is not appreciated? That is interesting. Even though my posts might sound as if they are bashing, my idea is not to shut down threads or make people shut up. If such vibes are sensed, my apologies because that is not my style.

I did kind of seem as bashing as you came in twice to say "you are all overanalyzing" and "I don't see what needs to be analyzed about [the spell card rules]", pretty much dismissing the entire purpose for this thread. It would be like me coming into a thread about IaMP to say that I think fighting games are a waste of time.

If your intention was rather to just state that you find the spell card rules all wrapped up with no loose ends, then fair enough. No harm done.

[Helepolis]

I already explained my posting style and apologised for it. If that is not even accepted then I am wondering if you are actually reading the entire post or just reading what you want to read? I'll try to pay attention to my post content to prevent future offending or rude lines.

And about the spell card rules: Now I am curious what your opinion is about the poetic side of a spell card.

[Tengukami]

No, it's all good. Your straightforward style is one of the things I like about you. Clearly, I simply misread you.

[Tiamat]

The only thing I can think of regarding people like Byakuron is the devil contract thing.  IE, because spell cards were written in a devil's contract for Gensoyko, any Gensokyo dispute automatically applies them, even if you never heard of them before.  The lunarians were exempt from having to follow the rules because the Moon was not a part of Gensokyo.  But for Byakuren and other cases (like Kanako and the Youkai of the Underground), even though they weren't a part of mainstream Gensokyo society, the devil contract automatically forced everything into a spell card format because it was Gensokyo-related (hilariously enough, Suika still botched it up and accidentally got/made/used a spell card which didn't have any danmaku at all, which Marisa points out in Grimoire of Marsia, but whatever).

This is just theory and speculation of mine.  I'm not even sure if it fits completely because I'm not sure if Makai counts as part of Gensokyo.  But possibly because the dispute was somewhat Gensokyo-related, it applied?  (the dispute with Yorihime on the moon was NOT Gensokyo-related at all in any way, which is why Yorihime was given the option to voluntarily opt into the spell card rules)

Honestly, I'm not even sure ZUN himself knows fully how it works (which is really saying something, because contrary to what some people might believe, ZUN usually thinks of an explanation for EVERYTHING.  Sure, the explanation might be far-fetched sometimes, but it's usually there).  Then again, maybe ZUN is going by the same theory I stated above.  Dunno.


Back on topic:  I think this line from Aya in Bohemian Archive summarizes how most Youkai of today feel about Gensokyo after the spell card rules were implemented.

"The youkai who visit the shrine now enjoy the colorful shrine, but at the same time, they might miss the good old days. "

[DracoOmega]

(still wanna know if the Japanese is saying 'reason' as in 'purpose' or 'logic')

意味 (imi) is often translated as 'meaning'. In this case 'a meaningless attack', so it's more about a specific purpose here than 'reason' as a general principle.