Author Topic: The Great Chain of Screwing up  (Read 10173 times)

Helion

  • I am the very model of a scientist salarian
The Great Chain of Screwing up
« on: January 03, 2010, 11:41:45 PM »
This is the name I have given to the "director" behind my failure of countless runs. Very often, after one screw up, usually a death, I start a long chain of completely unjustified and undefendable mistakes (running randomly into bullets, failing doable, easy spell cards, etc.). This means that usually, one mistake is enough to send my self-confidence, and with it my run, to hell. Does anyone else have a similar problem, or any hints on stopping the Chain?

On an unrelated note, I tend to screw up just after thinking how well the run was going  :V
« Last Edit: January 03, 2010, 11:47:27 PM by Helion »

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2010, 02:00:02 AM »
Well not sure if I empathize since deaths in this game usually cause me to try and do better. I know I can rarely get past stage 3 in most of the games. TOuhou is one of the hardest games I've played, it is unlikely that I'll ever beat another one of them any time soon. Self confidence? I usually jsut try a couple more times, and then stop.  I remember that I beat MoF on 10 continues. 8 of which on the final boss. I had left my comp on overnight and after about 4 more tries at noon the next day I had beaten that game.

Don't dwell on it, just load up a continue. If I'm stuck on something I tend to just stop playing for a day and try again the next day.

Nyyl

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Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2010, 02:17:09 AM »
I hate that :c
Especially when you're on stage four with 10 lives and you haven't died yet. Stage four is always so cruel~

Quote
On an unrelated note, I tend to screw up just after thinking how well the run was going
This happens to me every time near the end of stage 2 on SoEW
"oh yes I made it through that mess of electric orb thingies now to just go through this last line o-- oh woops I ran into the last line of enemies"

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2010, 02:21:10 AM »
MY most annoying deaths are when back up right into an enemy.

One time even backed up right into nitori and it wasn't even at the midboss fight yet. I rammed during the dialogue.

What I was trying to POC at the time.


Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2010, 02:47:34 AM »
I just had this happen to me. Not with Touhou but with eXceed. Got to "true" final boss' final spellcard, had 3 bombs left and 3 lifes, just like as if I just started the game. Pretty good. Oh but wait, I'm going to stupidly kill myself before the boss even shoots her aimed bullets! (Imagine dying to the lasers during Remilia's demon lord king or whatever it's called.. Before you even have to dodge the spam of bullets). Not only that, but I was so dumbfounded by my stupidity that I couldn't deathbomb in time (game has a pretty generous deathbomb timer). Then. I DO IT AGAIN (yes, before she shoots aimed bullets again). AGHAHG.

Last life, 3 bombs, boss still at full health. I say screw this, my great run just turned stupid bomb,bomb,bomb..

Most hollow feeling first 1cc in a game EVER.

Helion

  • I am the very model of a scientist salarian
Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2010, 10:30:47 AM »
MY most annoying deaths are when back up right into an enemy.
When trying to get to the PoC? I empathize, I believe half my deaths in MoF are caused by the PoC.
Also, I argue that if I learn to do everything with continues, I'm never going to learn to do 1ccs. It's really hard to break habits after they've been made.

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2010, 10:33:48 AM »
Which is why ReimuB is my second most often used shot type in SA.

allows me to avoid POC deaths.

I use marisaC more often now because it allows me to get by deathbomb timing.

One time I almost got hit and deathbombed then a few seconds later I got hit again and successfully deathbombed very quickly after that I ran right into a stream of oncoming bullets and game overed.

I don't think I'll ever 1cc any of the games.


ふねん1

  • Scientific editor
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Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2010, 05:56:18 PM »
I see this effect more often in long sections that focus on streaming among clusters of other bullets. Think SA Stage 4, the green amulet portion just before the second set of lasers. I have a particular way of streaming during that part, and if I mess it up, I usually won't be able to return to it without fault.

Which is why ReimuB is my second most often used shot type in SA.
ReimuB's a bad type. Her shot isn't that strong, and her wisps are easily misdirected. I could argue that she's not good for survival (unlike what the Wiki says), since she will be forced to face many more bullets than other characters.

allows me to avoid POC deaths.
Why would you even try to use the regular POC in SA (unless the screen is clear)? Grazing does the job for you.

I use marisaC more often now because it allows me to get by deathbomb timing.

One time I almost got hit and deathbombed then a few seconds later I got hit again and successfully deathbombed very quickly after that I ran right into a stream of oncoming bullets and game overed.
Streaming in SA tends to call for very slight movements. Don't run around wildly unless you just used a bomb, and even then you're better off repositioning yourself for what's to come once the invincibility ends.

I don't think I'll ever 1cc any of the games.
Don't be like that. You'll get better with time - everyone does.
Responses in bold.
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Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2010, 08:45:03 PM »
TOuhou is one of the hardest games I've played, it is unlikely that I'll ever beat another one of them any time soon.

You most certainly will if you just keep at it. Easy mode is definitely clearable no matter who you are. Unless you are blind or have lost both your hands of course.

Its just a matter of time. Some people learn really fast and others take time. I guess it depends on your skills at memorization, your reflexes and your patience and persistance.

I'm pretty poor at all of it but i'm still an able player. So don't hit yourself just cause' you can't do it yet. As long as you don't give up, you will learn. Don't worry.


Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2010, 09:30:10 PM »
Sometimes the opposite happens

You mean, where you fuck it all up but suddenly get all amazing?

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2010, 09:39:16 PM »
You mean, where you fuck it all up but suddenly get all amazing?
What else :V

Helion

  • I am the very model of a scientist salarian
Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2010, 10:28:27 PM »
Levateinn was comedy gold.

CK Crash

  • boozer
Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2010, 11:37:57 PM »
This happens to me, but in a different way.

Run 1: Oh, I died to Ichirin, it's still early enough for me to restart and try again.
Run 2: I thought I could perfect Kogasa's final. Let's try again.
Run 3: Wow, did I really just ram that fairy?
Run 4: How did I die to midboss Nazrin? Oh screw this, *keeps playing stage and probably game over to stage 3 or something*
Run 5: Game over on midboss Nazrin AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Run 6: FUCK EVEN ON EASY MODE AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2010, 12:19:56 AM »
Happened to me recently when I was trying for an EoSD normal clear with ReimuA to unlock her for Extra. I died on Star of David, Remilia's first (and easiest) card, and kept dying stupid deaths. I didn't even get to her last spellcard, which really sucked. :<

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2010, 04:40:03 AM »
Responses to your responses underlined
Quote
Which is why ReimuB is my second most often used shot type in SA.
ReimuB's a bad type. Her shot isn't that strong, and her wisps are easily misdirected. I could argue that she's not good for survival (unlike what the Wiki says), since she will be forced to face many more bullets than other characters.
Note I say secondary, marisaC is my current main.

allows me to avoid POC deaths.
Why would you even try to use the regular POC in SA (unless the screen is clear)? Grazing does the job for you.I don't conciously graze
I figured that out after using MarisaC

I use marisaC more often now because it allows me to get by deathbomb timing
One time I almost got hit and deathbombed then a few seconds later I got hit again and successfully deathbombed very quickly after that I ran right into a stream of oncoming bullets and game overed.
Streaming in SA tends to call for very slight movements. Don't run around wildly unless you just used a bomb, and even then you're better off repositioning yourself for what's to come once the invincibility ends.

I recall the above scenario ocurred in MoF. Ah, I tend to jsut get the heck away for streaming..that or misdirection (moving so the enemies shoot in a direction I'm not at for a while.)


I don't think I'll ever 1cc any of the games.
Don't be like that. You'll get better with time - everyone does.[/

I have gotten better than when I first played, but not to that level yet.

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2010, 04:47:00 AM »
Well, there's one problem. MarisaC is useless in SA. The only 3 characters that are worth playing in SA are

ReimuA- decent bomb, great power
ReimuC- best bomb in the game, a little more screen coverage
MarisaB- for the shot options, decent bomb if used by the enemy.

MarisaA isn't too bad either and 8 bombs can be useful as long as you make sure to use them by the enemy for more damage.

I find ReimuB and MarisaC to be completely useless. They're just too weak or are overshadowed by a better character.

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2010, 04:52:30 AM »
Frankly I suck at deathbomb timing. WHenever i deathbomb it's almost always luck. MarisaC however weak the rest of the character type is, fixes that weakness.

MarisaB is too frustrating. I never know what options to use, and the second or so it takes for me to swap through the option types is enough to ram into something.

I guess I'll try Reimu A

is there a real use for the teleport function?


Krimmydoodle

  • We must apply more SCIENCE!
Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2010, 04:58:32 AM »
Gapping is useful if you have problems turning around some of the streamfests that occur (entirety of Stage 1, end of Stage 2, second half of Stage 5, first half of Stage 6).  If you get pushed into a corner, you can use ReimuA's ability to put yourself on the other side with relative safety.  Don't bother with any spellcards, the one spellcard I can think of where it -might- be helpful is Parsee's first boss card, otherwise you'll likely get yourself killed.

That said, the real reason you use ReimuA is because she doesn't fire marshmallows for bullets.
Whether you're on Easy or you're a Lunatic, be damn proud of your accomplishments.  Don't let anyone convince you otherwise, for it's when you lose faith in your own achievements that those victories become defeats.

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2010, 05:00:40 AM »
I see...helps stop stream walls...useful...
Gets me killed is half the time on parsee...
not as good.

but lets me stall her midboss nonspell so that's good.



Only ReimuB shoots marshmellows.

And what's wrong with marisaC?

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2010, 06:14:12 AM »
And what's wrong with marisaC?
Narrow range like ReimuA and yet damage is not even close to ReimuA. Shot moves slow so if the boss moves a lot you end up dealing even less damage. Bomb deals no damage. Bomb is completely useless in general because all it does is clear the screen. Even if you use it as a safety net, you still lose 0.5 power for nothing, else you waste 1 power for a crappy screen clear and practically no invincibility frames.

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2010, 06:16:40 AM »
I'll be expirimenting on other shot types then...

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2010, 02:40:58 AM »
ReimuB's autocollect thingy is pretty handy if you aren't too good at grazing/safely poc'ing, and MarisaC's bomb certainly helps if you don't know when you need to bomb. However they do pay a considerable price for the extra bit of security with their lower damage.

Ultimately, you're going to need to learn how to graze/poc safely/deathbomb anyway, and unfortunately without practice you won't improve at those aspects.

I'm kind of speaking from experience too, my first two 1ccs of SA were with ReimuB & MarisaC. I had to switch to a better shot type when it became apparent that the aforementioned two just weren't cutting it for Extra - and when I was trying to 1cc with ReimuA I was forced to learn all the other stuff I should really have been getting up to speed with from the start.

ReimuB's bomb can be handy at times for particularly dense areas of bullets, but it generally takes prior knowledge/planning to take full advantage of (example: S5 midboss Orin's first 2 patterns. Replay just for the hell of it, don't try this on a real attempt unless you really want to be stuck with 2 power for Cat Walk. Have fun watching me try to remember how most of this stage goes as I haven't played it in months).

tl;dr: Your best bet would probably be switching to ReimuA now rather than later.

--------

On topic: Yeah, downward spirals are quite a pain. I sometimes find that just leaving it and coming back a little later, even if it's only 30-45 minutes, can sometimes break the cycle of doom. Other days just don't get better no matter what I do.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2010, 02:45:51 AM by arcs »

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2010, 06:33:43 AM »
I got to stage 4 with reimuA!!

switching now...


Menreiki

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Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2010, 08:36:17 AM »
I usually pause the game and try to think what am I going to do next. It also helps to calm down.

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2010, 08:48:32 AM »
That can cause me to lose focus.

There are now a few spell cards that I cannot deal with.


MysTeariousYukari

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Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #26 on: January 09, 2010, 05:27:40 AM »
I had something like a great chain of screw ups, involving EoSD, Cirno, and every difficulty cept Easy Mode, me doing worse and worse as I drop the difficulty >.<

Helion

  • I am the very model of a scientist salarian
Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #27 on: January 09, 2010, 05:52:08 PM »
Ok, today is fail-day. I can do well on IN Extra, but 5 continues are not enough to get me through UFO Stage 4 on NORMAL. Self-confidence has taken residence underground.

SupahVee1234

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Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #28 on: January 09, 2010, 06:00:28 PM »
You know what I really hate?

That damn auto-collection border.



I died on Alice's opener (first time Alice shows up in PCB) because I was getting power-ups in the collection border and she decided to spawn a bullet inside my hitbox. >:C

Re: The Great Chain of Screwing up
« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2010, 10:52:23 AM »
That's why you are suppoed to PoC rush! Go up there fast and go down fast. Then that stuff won't happen. In fact, the only time i have seen stuff like happen is watching noobs play as they apparently think its safe to be up there and take for ever to get down again. How hard can it be just to hold down the down key?