Author Topic: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread  (Read 295361 times)

Serela

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #300 on: December 13, 2009, 09:05:15 PM »
10~12F puzzle... I've gotten to the relay point on 12F. The new battle music for this part is totally awesome, and its perfectly placed too; DAMN these random battles just got a lot harder. High-HP stuff, and physical attackers that move before everyone other then Chen, STOP KILLING MY SQUISHY PEOPLE IN THE BACK RAAAGE

Okay, this is testing my patience on exploring every nook and cranny. But I will survive~...!  :'(
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Anima Zero

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #301 on: December 13, 2009, 09:39:26 PM »
Phew, beat the 12F triple boss finally.

All it took was gaining a few levels and about 83k-ish skill points to spend on boosting a few key characters' MND stats.

Took out the rightmost boss first.  Things are only going to be harder on myself the longer that boss stays alive.  Buffing defenses is critical too.  Good thing with enough defense buffs my 10F girl gets damaged by very very few attacks, if any, and Meiling can basically cancel out any damage to herself with her self heal.

I had about 3-4 attackers for the fight, but only two were really attacking almost all the time.  The others I brought in when had to swap out one of those two to let their SPs recharge.

Everyone else?  Either buffing or being switched in to let others regen up.

Once the rightmost girl kicks it, I break out the ol' caluculator and keep track of leftmost boss's HP.  After knocking off close to 200k, focus put on middle boss.

Once I have Marisa and Patchy 100% buffed on MAG and at least one other person at high buffed ATK/MAG, I swap them all in after both bosses have recently taken an action, have Patchy fire off Royal Flare, Marisa Master Sparks middle boss, and whatever else I can fit in before a super attack comes from a solo boss and wipes me.

Of course, I never got to use Marisa's Master Spark because Royal Flare wiped them both out at once.

Saved afterwards, went to 13F...oh god this looks promising.  Enemies are promising too.  Oh god Swordfish that can knock off half my 10F girl's HP with their WEAKEST attack and are god awfully fast.

I'll start braving it tomorrow.
"I never cared about justice, and I don't recall ever calling myself a hero..." Zero, Mega Man Zero 4

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #302 on: December 14, 2009, 12:10:11 AM »
10~12F puzzle... I've gotten to the relay point on 12F. The new battle music for this part is totally awesome, and its perfectly placed too; DAMN these random battles just got a lot harder. High-HP stuff, and physical attackers that move before everyone other then Chen, STOP KILLING MY SQUISHY PEOPLE IN THE BACK RAAAGE

Okay, this is testing my patience on exploring every nook and cranny. But I will survive~...!  :'(

Yeah, I think everyone gets sick of those 3 floors long before they are done with them. You should try and get every last bit of the map though, there are 2 event chains starting on those floors that result in optional boss/characters that join later on. In addition a chain that starts and ends on the 10th floor (which is accessable by the relay point mentioned, backtrack and go right from the bottom of the map where there are 3 opposite-polarity blue orb door thingies, bear in mind though, that you need to have all 3 colors turned off to make the trip worthwhile, the "all switches on" doesn't turn them off if you use it twice, you have to manually turn them all off the slow way from the ordinary start of the dungeon, then teleport up to the relay point. It's a pain in the ass, but the character you get is useful IMO.

If it wasn't for the music change and the enemy change midway thru, those 3 floors would be intolerable imo >=P.

Quote
Phew, beat the 12F triple boss finally.

All it took was gaining a few levels and about 83k-ish skill points to spend on boosting a few key characters' MND stats.

Took out the rightmost boss first.  Things are only going to be harder on myself the longer that boss stays alive.  Buffing defenses is critical too.  Good thing with enough defense buffs my 10F girl gets damaged by very very few attacks, if any, and Meiling can basically cancel out any damage to herself with her self heal.

I had about 3-4 attackers for the fight, but only two were really attacking almost all the time.  The others I brought in when had to swap out one of those two to let their SPs recharge.

Everyone else?  Either buffing or being switched in to let others regen up.

Once the rightmost girl kicks it, I break out the ol' caluculator and keep track of leftmost boss's HP.  After knocking off close to 200k, focus put on middle boss.

Once I have Marisa and Patchy 100% buffed on MAG and at least one other person at high buffed ATK/MAG, I swap them all in after both bosses have recently taken an action, have Patchy fire off Royal Flare, Marisa Master Sparks middle boss, and whatever else I can fit in before a super attack comes from a solo boss and wipes me.

Of course, I never got to use Marisa's Master Spark because Royal Flare wiped them both out at once.

Saved afterwards, went to 13F...oh god this looks promising.  Enemies are promising too.  Oh god Swordfish that can knock off half my 10F girl's HP with their WEAKEST attack and are god awfully fast.

I'll start braving it tomorrow.

Did you get the 8th floor optional character yet? It should be doable now if you haven't done so yet. Also, make a habit of spending some points in MND, it's a much more useful stat than mag or attack imo for tough bosses (though not as much for trash).

Floor 14 swordfish are BS >=P. Once you get high enough a level (assuming you aren't already) that they can't 1shot your squishies, or 2shot your tanks, it's not so bad, but until then. siighhh. The knights on that floor also have a chance of dropping a blue saber (name is slightly diff if you have the older translation patch still), which is basically a cuisenart blade on steroids, very nice for its time.

Speaking of which, does anybody know what solar demon kings drop? I'm getting oodles of drops from floor 19, lots of +40% attack items (I forget the name), glaives of pain, etc. Useless crap, but I never got a drop from a solar demon king, it has to be good since those baddies are basically random minibosses.

Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #303 on: December 14, 2009, 01:17:51 AM »
Speaking of which, does anybody know what solar demon kings drop? I'm getting oodles of drops from floor 19, lots of +40% attack items (I forget the name), glaives of pain, etc. Useless crap, but I never got a drop from a solar demon king, it has to be good since those baddies are basically random minibosses.

They drop Lion King's Souls iirc.

Graph

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #304 on: December 14, 2009, 02:38:56 AM »
For people having trouble with Lily Guardian on F15, I think it spams Huge Earthquake if you try a debuff move on it like Discarder or Avici... which is why it's one of the few bosses recently who's so readily affected by debuff.  I still haven't beat it yet though, the other attacks in its repetoire are still quite a handful.  Most of my party can't survive that stuff even with a Green Dream equipped.

I'm probably not too far off though, maybe after I explore F16 for a bit.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2009, 02:42:21 AM by Graph »

Ghaleon

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #305 on: December 14, 2009, 02:53:34 AM »
Nah, I had no debuffers, and it used that move alot. Seems like I'm the only lucky chap who got to see it use "thousand fist khanon" though. Just beat another boss with that very move, nailed +60% def china for 16,000. If that's not bad, another boss just owned me by casting a 100% mag buff, I sword of raptured it right away, apparently it didn't work (does this move ever work? wtf is the point if it doesn't work?) because it ether flared my entire party for 20,000 afterwards. Really fair.

Graph

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #306 on: December 14, 2009, 03:03:52 AM »
Nah, I had no debuffers, and it used that move alot. Seems like I'm the only lucky chap who got to see it use "thousand fist khanon" though.

You sure it wasn't "Huge Tremor" you saw instead?  It's a smaller version of Huge Earthquake that does something like half the damage of Huge Earthquake.  I did see a Thousand Fist thing in there somewhere, but I was less concerned with it because I've only seen it once, and in the multi-target case my tank survives with a around half HP left and the rest just bite it.

Ghaleon

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #307 on: December 14, 2009, 03:18:04 AM »
You sure it wasn't "Huge Tremor" you saw instead?  It's a smaller version of Huge Earthquake that does something like half the damage of Huge Earthquake.  I did see a Thousand Fist thing in there somewhere, but I was less concerned with it because I've only seen it once, and in the multi-target case my tank survives with a around half HP left and the rest just bite it.

Yup. Huge tremor whatever looks like an earthquake, nails the whole party
There is a single target physical move called something like rhyajitsu or whatever. It nails 1 person, with a chance of paralizing.
Then there's thousand fist khanon, which kills one lucky guy (was my tank), unless you're way overlevel. It makes nitori's laser gun look like a peashooter.

Sigh, palm sigil guardian on floor 19 is dumb. Pretty much a luck fight. After it casts whatever jitsu (mag +100%), you simply have to hope to god it doesn't cast ether flare, or dual-laser whatever it's called the next, or the turn after, or you lose.  Speaking of floor 19 though, I still have yet to meet these Diamond knights. You sure they aren't floor 20 or 21 trash? Biggest mob on floor 19 were those demon lord kings (which actually aren't that bad, it's just sometimes you get 2 spawned in the exact same location, and it appears to be 1).
« Last Edit: December 14, 2009, 03:26:32 AM by Ghaleon »

Chaore

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #308 on: December 14, 2009, 04:01:25 AM »
They are floor 20, I'm just saying, If you think that is good, Wait until you see them. :V

Graph

  • Let's go, Trombe!
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #309 on: December 14, 2009, 05:59:02 AM »
Checking the Japanese wiki, I deduced that Lily Guardian only uses Huge Earthquake when you use SPD down on it.  I tested it out and it seems to be the case.  Alice can pull off ATK down on the boss and get away with it.

You still have to give big Nature resistance if someone like Marisa is to survive Huge Tremor Strike.  It might help a bit to lower ATK though because I feel as if some of this guy's attacks aren't affected by defense much.

Ghaleon

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #310 on: December 14, 2009, 08:10:25 AM »
This stupid cosmic guardian miniboss is seriously pissing me off. WTF element is ether flare, I tried maxing out my mys defense, it's over 400, and it STILL hits my entire party for over 12k. The kicker is I KNOW the boss isn't supposed to be t his hard, I just have absolutely terrible luck, and it just so happens to do the 100% magic buff right before the damn biggest nuke every time (bad luck meaning I know it's not supposed to every time, I HAVE seen it do 2 weeny spells in a row instead after the buff, but I had no luck when it buffed itself the 2nd time that fight). I've even tried lowering its magic using alice after the buff, but she just can't lower it fast enough to matter. If only @#%ing sword of rapture worked, sigh.

Pesco

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #311 on: December 14, 2009, 08:44:48 AM »
Okay. So I've got the relay point on 12F, flipped the ALL ON switch. Now I can't seem to get anywhere.

WTF did I do wrong? I've been following the wiki directions.

Ghaleon

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #312 on: December 14, 2009, 09:10:46 AM »
I tried to help Pesco with some giant picture tutorial here, but I figured out I just don't know how the @#%#% I'd draw it... Sorry, but idea scrapped >=P.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2009, 09:31:24 AM by Ghaleon »

Pesco

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #313 on: December 14, 2009, 09:20:40 AM »
I found myself again. Didn't check the minimap properly.

Ghaleon

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #314 on: December 14, 2009, 09:30:12 AM »
I found myself again. Didn't check the minimap properly.

Good, cuz now that I took pictures of the maps, and started drawing. I realize I didn't have a @#%#@%ing clue how I was going to explain it lol. I'll scrap that idea for now.

But just know that you need all switches off to get the optional character before the 12F relay point (though you use the relay point to get there, it's the area with 2 blue orbs right next to each other, the one on the left needing on, the one on the right off).

To get to the "end" area, you have to have the switches on, use the relay point, go north past the 3 orbs, turn off one switch (I think it was green, but I really don't remember, it's the one in the mid west area of the 12th floor), work your way southeast, take the stairs to the south, pass the orb of the color you just turned off, turn another color off. Then I believe you have to backtrack all the way to the last switch you switched off, turn it back off, then find hte last color switch (I forget where it is at the moment, I think it was south of the area near the 1st switch), backtrack to that first switch again, turn it back off, then go back to the area near the 2nd switch, and go east instead of north starting from those stairs... I THINK that was it. I know for certain though that no matter what, you ended up having to turn off all 3 switches from after the triple on orb part, and you had to backtrack to that very first switch a few times doing it.

trancehime

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #315 on: December 14, 2009, 09:32:38 AM »
Entire post is spoiler. Read at your own risk:

Spoiler:
Going to take on "Serpent of Chaos". Recommended level is 400+

Opening Skirmish:
Rinnosuke (Tank)
Marisa (Spell Offensive)
Renko (Buffs/use Randomizer, swap out)
Sanae (Buffs/healer)

Damagers:
Flandre (low defenses, supplemented by Sanae's Miracle Fruits)
Yuka (double Master Sparkings)
Utsuho (nuker)
Suika (physical boss killer, Missing Power's debuff can be resisted/restored by Sanae's buff)

Others:
Keine (emergency buffer)
Minoriko (emergency healer)
Iku Nagae (busts DEF)
Kaenbyou Rin (assists in killing mobs before getting to the boss)

I plan first of all to get buffed up and have Marisa go on full out assault before her imminent demise, and of course switch out Renko for another attacker. Sanae shall be a dedicated support unit, while Rinnosuke will be the one to tank, and on occasion provide additional offensive support of needed. He also has a panic button if the battle isn't going too well. Everyone will be around level 450 by the time I take this on.

Good plan?

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Pesco

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #316 on: December 14, 2009, 09:37:50 AM »
I'm still kinda confused by the wiki's directions, but getting lost equals grinding time and that means item farming :D

Milkyway64

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #317 on: December 14, 2009, 09:41:20 AM »
Floor 18 boss suddenly got hard after a break. My first two attempts had me breezing my into the form shifts effortlessly, and it merely outlasted me. Now my party is getting rolled in seconds before I can even make it change. Even my Tenshi, with full buffs, got 1-shotted by that infamous fist move. X_x

trancehime

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #318 on: December 14, 2009, 09:50:29 AM »
Floor 18 boss suddenly got hard after a break. My first two attempts had me breezing my into the form shifts effortlessly, and it merely outlasted me. Now my party is getting rolled in seconds before I can even make it change. Even my Tenshi, with full buffs, got 1-shotted by that infamous fist move. X_x

The fist attack is strong because it ignores defense, so no matter how many DEF buffs you do, you aren't going to minimize its damage any time soon.

If in any case the boss buffs himself (well no, that's only in his final phase), you are going to want to dispel it immediately using Tenshi's Hisou sword attack. It helps to have magical tanks, most of his skills are magical though he has some scary physicals too.

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Milkyway64

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #319 on: December 14, 2009, 10:20:51 AM »
The fist attack is strong because it ignores defense, so no matter how many DEF buffs you do, you aren't going to minimize its damage any time soon.

If in any case the boss buffs himself (well no, that's only in his final phase), you are going to want to dispel it immediately using Tenshi's Hisou sword attack. It helps to have magical tanks, most of his skills are magical though he has some scary physicals too.

Yep. Patchy is all but useless here. I figured she'd be good  with the tanking of various elements, but BAM, arty wide physical attack in the FACE. Patchy fainted!

And just HOW much HP does this boss have?! I just nailed 'im twice with a concentrated, elemental-complimented Master Spark, and he still lived despite taking 300,000k or so from that ALONE. I had Remilia and a few other damage dealers wailing on him for a while beforehand, too, including a couple Alice dolls on the Nature and Cold forms for 50,000k each. And he has a final phase, now? Meaning, I was nowhere close to winning? Augh.

Garlyle

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #320 on: December 14, 2009, 11:18:59 AM »
Yay I took it in the face from That F12 Boss 8D

Because I rushed at them right after I was able to reach em.  Probably it would be that fighting them as is now would be suicide - afterall, three group attacks and almost everyone dies.

...Except Patchy.  Patchy can tank this fight 8D

EDIT: Reona, good luck.  I don't think anyone's nearly close enough to that to give you any advice though D:
« Last Edit: December 14, 2009, 11:22:31 AM by Garlyle »

Anima Zero

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #321 on: December 14, 2009, 12:44:33 PM »
Did you get the 8th floor optional character yet? It should be doable now if you haven't done so yet. Also, make a habit of spending some points in MND, it's a much more useful stat than mag or attack imo for tough bosses (though not as much for trash).

Floor 14 swordfish are BS >=P. Once you get high enough a level (assuming you aren't already) that they can't 1shot your squishies, or 2shot your tanks, it's not so bad, but until then. siighhh. The knights on that floor also have a chance of dropping a blue saber (name is slightly diff if you have the older translation patch still), which is basically a cuisenart blade on steroids, very nice for its time.

Heh, keep forgetting to mention I got that 8th floor optional before I started to do my grinding for the 12F triple boss.  Once I outfitted Meiling, my 10F girl, and Remilia to take the opener (And to have one character be a sacrifice), killing this boss was not that hard.  So long as my three tanks had the HP for the party attack every 4 turns I believe and I got my other character out before it fired off, I wasn't going to have much chance to fail.  I even brought in Wriggle to poison the boss after the opener because I kinda felt like it.

And I'll have to keep an eye out for those blue sabers.  Was only mapping out the first part of 13F before doing any kind of warping whatsoever just to see what I'm in store for level-wise (And yeah...the gimmick here seems to be another lovely mind wrecker for me).
"I never cared about justice, and I don't recall ever calling myself a hero..." Zero, Mega Man Zero 4

trancehime

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #322 on: December 14, 2009, 01:44:04 PM »
Yep. Patchy is all but useless here. I figured she'd be good  with the tanking of various elements, but BAM, arty wide physical attack in the FACE. Patchy fainted!

And just HOW much HP does this boss have?! I just nailed 'im twice with a concentrated, elemental-complimented Master Spark, and he still lived despite taking 300,000k or so from that ALONE. I had Remilia and a few other damage dealers wailing on him for a while beforehand, too, including a couple Alice dolls on the Nature and Cold forms for 50,000k each. And he has a final phase, now? Meaning, I was nowhere close to winning? Augh.

Patchouli is definitely someone you do not want tanking the boss. Tenshi would be much better suited for that role.

I'm not entirely sure, but he has approximately 2,080,000 HP.


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Pesco

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #323 on: December 14, 2009, 02:31:04 PM »
Why oh why does 10F bitch not give me her drop? I can beat you into submission before you can even deal me damage and yet you still give me nothing.

Garlyle

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #324 on: December 14, 2009, 08:45:46 PM »
I TOOK DOWN THE TRIO ON F12 WITHOUT GRINDING 8D

How?

Front line of F10's secret character, F9's mandatory character, Reimu, and Patchy.  First character is just there to be a goddamn wall and/or use Switch later on because nothing will hurt her once she's MND buffed (Put StatDown resistance on her to help further so the right boss doesn't drop it).  The second and third characters spam defensive spells, and even stay out using Focus to recharge SP.  If you're at a decent level, this party will actually be immune to all damage but one of the left boss' attacks, really, which can be cursed with Reimu's Exorcism, more or less.  Finally, Patchy's Royal Flare is the damage source.

The end result was that, after a while of spamming party-wide moves, between Royal Flare and Firefly Phenomenon (And given the apparent total HP of the characters I count PSN for having done a few thousand damage at least in this battle!), the left character went down first.  I proceeded to get raped by a super attack from the middle boss, but much to my surprise, she went down a mere couple of attacks later... and so did the right one!  I was mostly lucky, but yeah, if you can kill the left and right in quick succession...

Ghaleon

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #325 on: December 14, 2009, 09:00:42 PM »
Yep. Patchy is all but useless here. I figured she'd be good  with the tanking of various elements, but BAM, arty wide physical attack in the FACE. Patchy fainted!

And just HOW much HP does this boss have?! I just nailed 'im twice with a concentrated, elemental-complimented Master Spark, and he still lived despite taking 300,000k or so from that ALONE. I had Remilia and a few other damage dealers wailing on him for a while beforehand, too, including a couple Alice dolls on the Nature and Cold forms for 50,000k each. And he has a final phase, now? Meaning, I was nowhere close to winning? Augh.

Dunno how  many hp. The one thing that actually translates with some clarity on the japanese wiki is hp, unfortunately it's always grossly wrong. For example the floor 8 boss supposedly has 20 million...Right.

Anyway the boss does have a final phase yes...But it's basically just the first phase over again, and it doesn't seem to have any more hp it did the first time. And yes, the first phase is the hardest IMO because that's where the boss can use all those heavy hitting physical moves, after that, you go to elemental moves. If you can have patchy live thru that first phase, she's very much worth having around IMO.Maybe you can just have her in the back until then I guess (or maybe master spark it without bothering to concentrate? I dunno if the boss is resistant on the first phase though, kinda looks like it MIGHT be).

I had no trouble with the boss on my first time. I lost 3 people or so on the first phase do to cheap physical attacks, but after that...Nothing too bad.

I'm seriously worried that the final boss (without plus disk I mean) is going to be stupid easy for me after the needless grinding I did just to get the sigil guardian in an effort to not be 1shot by its stupid combo, which you're basically supposed to not have happen at all by not having terrible luck >=p.

Graph

  • Let's go, Trombe!
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #326 on: December 14, 2009, 09:16:08 PM »
Translators usually mistranslate "man" because there's no equivalent for it in english.  For our big numbers we have a new name every 3 digits... thousand, million, billion, etc.  For Japanese the first big number is "man", which is 10,000.

If it says "20 man" that means 200,000 HP.  Does that sound about right?

If we go by that, then Reona is right about F18 boss having 2 million.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2009, 09:19:20 PM by Graph »

Milkyway64

  • I AM A MAD SCIENTIST. KIND OF.
Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #327 on: December 14, 2009, 09:18:30 PM »
Dunno how  many hp. The one thing that actually translates with some clarity on the japanese wiki is hp, unfortunately it's always grossly wrong. For example the floor 8 boss supposedly has 20 million...Right.

Anyway the boss does have a final phase yes...But it's basically just the first phase over again, and it doesn't seem to have any more hp it did the first time. And yes, the first phase is the hardest IMO because that's where the boss can use all those heavy hitting physical moves, after that, you go to elemental moves. If you can have patchy live thru that first phase, she's very much worth having around IMO.Maybe you can just have her in the back until then I guess (or maybe master spark it without bothering to concentrate? I dunno if the boss is resistant on the first phase though, kinda looks like it MIGHT be).

I had no trouble with the boss on my first time. I lost 3 people or so on the first phase do to cheap physical attacks, but after that...Nothing too bad.

I'm seriously worried that the final boss (without plus disk I mean) is going to be stupid easy for me after the needless grinding I did just to get the sigil guardian in an effort to not be 1shot by its stupid combo, which you're basically supposed to not have happen at all by not having terrible luck >=p.

The problem is the multi-target physical attack that happens on any phase. Anyone with fewer than 5000 HP at the time is boned. It loves using it when I bring out a squishy in the back. Minoriko, Patchy, even Marisa when I pull her out for a spark. X_x

Oh yes, and Reimu has this awful habit of getting the fist just after, assuming it's the first phase.

Ghaleon

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #328 on: December 14, 2009, 09:38:59 PM »
Oh yes, and Reimu has this awful habit of getting the fist just after, assuming it's the first phase.

Hehe, on floor 20 are these blue robot trash mobs that move very fast, hit ridiculously hard, but don't have many hp (compared to other floor 20 trash that is). They ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS 1shot reimu first t hing, like 20 out of 20 times, they pick reimu out and *gibs*. argh.

Pesco

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Re: Touhou Labyrinth discussion thread
« Reply #329 on: December 14, 2009, 10:37:21 PM »
Just like the shmups. Once you know the tricks to the bosses, they're piss easy. My eyes have been opened to the importance of HP meatshields and defenses. 12F combo bosses weren't too difficult with Patchy having enough SP to Royal Flare middle and left to death. Didn't get any drops, but I don't feel like redoing that fight either.