Author Topic: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors  (Read 12817 times)

commandercool

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Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« on: July 20, 2016, 03:15:14 AM »
This is a silly idea for a thread, but it's something I got to thinking about earlier when I was trying to explain Alice's personality to someone. Hopefully someone else finds it interesting enough to spark a bit of discussion.

For those who don't know, Magic: The Gathering is a venerable trading card game about fantasy shit, and it organizes its gameplay and universe into five colors: white, blue, black, red, and green. Each color stands for a certain set of philosophies (very roughly white is order, blue is knowledge, black is ruthlessness, red is chaos, and green is instinct, although there's much more nuance than that) and theoretically anything that exists should be able to be defined by a color or combination of colors. It's a common nerd pastime to try to figure out what color things are, just like trying to figure out what Dungeons and Dragons alignment characters or people are.

If you don't know much about Magic's color system, this article is a decent enough distillation of it and the official Wizards of the Coast articles about the individual colors it links are even better, if a lot wordier. There are definitions behind what every combination of colors up to three represents as well (beyond three colors and definitions get too muddy to be useful), but most of that can be intuited if you understand the individual colors.

Anyway, I was thinking earlier about how it's fairly tricky to categorize a lot of Touhou characters into Magic's color system because they're so nuanced. I was specifically trying to figure out Alice, and was wondering what other people's take on it is, but I'm kind of curious about other characters as well.

So the way I see it Alice is blue above all else, being dedicated to the quiet and mostly solitary pursuit of her craft. That doesn't fully explain her weird cruel streak though. Her casual willingness to blow up and otherwise mutilate her dolls doesn't really seem blue. At first I was thinking it may be red, since it does usually take the form of a fiery explosion, but red's self-destruction is more a matter of recklessness and Alice seems more calculated than that to me, and not at all reckless. So I guess that makes it a black willingness to use any means to justify her ends or possibly even a deliberate act of cruelty. I think Alice Margatroid is blue/black. There may be shades of white in there too, with her dolls possibly being some kind of attempt to bring control and order into her world, but I don't think it's enough to make her white/blue/black.

Does that seem right to anyone else, or does anyone see it a different way? And does anyone have any other characters that might be tricky or fun to define using Magic's color system?
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2016, 04:02:56 AM »
I've always pegged Alice as being red/blue combined, since that's sort of typically been associated with innovation, inventors, and crafters, although her being a shard of white-blue-black also fits.

Reimu I've tended to associate as white-green since white is typically about social order while green is about natural order, and with how Gensokyo works the two tend to greatly overlap. Marisa I see as being blue-black or blue-black-red since she's seeking self-centered goals such as immortality.

commandercool

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2016, 04:35:34 AM »
Reimu is definitely white, but I'm not sure if she's white/green or white/red. I think she is reckless and careless enough to feel pretty red, but I think that impression might be slanted by the way the games work since she's always throwing herself into incidents. Manga Reimu seems more white/green. I guess a case could be made for mono-white too.

I think Marisa is probably blue/red. She's into self-improvement through study, but she's seemingly not always the most meticulous, careful, or dedicated. I can't think of many examples of Marisa being outright ruthless though, she seems too solitary for that. Again I might be skewing red because I'm used to the way the video game plots are laid out, with the heroines leaping into battle with seemingly not much thought, but I think that's fairly applicable to her text representations too. I could see her being mono-blue or blue-red, but she's definitely not green or white and I don't think she's black either.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2016, 07:34:28 AM »
How about a Sultai (blue-black-green) Yukari, favoring blue?  Black represents her goals to enforce terror, and her ruthless schemes.  Green is for her guardianship over both the physical and metaphysical nature of Gensokyo, and her known use of its powerful creatures.  But Yukari's greatest strengths are her incredible psychological mind and her boundary abilities, both of which are solidly under the blue umbrella.  As Mary she was probably pure blue, but time and Igniting have changed her.

And then there's Tenshi, who I see as Orzhov (black-white).  Her selfish personality and use of souls through her sword point towards Black, but at the same time her divine nature and arrogance show the White side of her.  There is definitely an argument for her having Red, due to the spontaneity of her incident and her use of Earthquakes, but I don't see her as reckless as many do.  After all, she had a backup plan, with the whole "become defacto god of shrine" thing.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2016, 02:07:27 PM »
I see Yukari as more of a White-Blue, with a tint of black (Actually, isn't she could be Gray-Blue?). She is the guardian of Gensokyo after all, wicked or not. Although she's in control, it's not like she actively seeking it (Though it's more like she known everything is in her hand). Guess she could be Black-Blue in the beginning, but turn gray as she aged. I don't see how she could fit into green though, as conventional nature and her do not match.

« Last Edit: July 20, 2016, 02:25:55 PM by andykhang »

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2016, 02:20:06 PM »
I don't see much green in Yukari. Green is about instinct and natural talent as much as it is about nature, and I don't think Yukari probably indulges her instinct all that much. It's hard to say though. She might be able to fit green with her stewardship of Gensokyo paralleling green's mechanical connection to land, but white has a similar aspect. I think she's definitely blue, probably white, could very well have some black in her, but I don't see much green or any red.

Tenshi being white/black never would have occurred to me, but it does make some sense. Once again I probably would have skewed red, but that may just be the superficial connection to stone and earthquakes.

What about the major races of Gensokyo? It seems like humans are white, kappa and magicians are blue, a lot of various youkai (although surprisingly few of the ones we know by name) are black, oni are overwhelmingly red, and tengu are probably green.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2016, 02:26:03 PM »
Remilia... She's definitively Red. Her recklessness and childish wonder to the world is her most defining trait. Not too sure if she could be green, due to her reference to pure strength, or just mono-red. Sakuya would be White and Blue, but it's in such a way to complement her master's Red, kinda like a background colours. Patchouli would be Blue, but it's also look like it's been dye with Red over time, as she's also display the same curiosity and reckless as Remilia. Hong Meiling would be White-Green, kinda like a garden of white flower. Flandre would be Red too, but it's like blood red compare to her sister's brilliant Crimson.... though surprisingly, I see tint of Blue.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2016, 02:29:15 PM by andykhang »

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2016, 04:13:34 PM »
Your evil five-sided color sphere cannot contain Alice's seven-color cubic wisdom.

FIVE COLOR IS WORD EVIL!

Five Colors cannot express the perfect synchronous cubic nature of reality! It is an evil lie and falls short by 1.4 dimensions and plunges into singularity!

EDUCATORS ARE GUILTY OF SPREADING FIVE COLOR WORD EVIL! THEY ARE EVIL WORD BASTARDS!

Not a single goddamn person alive can deny the wisdom of Harmonic Seven-Color Cubic Wisdom. No one has been able to successfully debate me on this issue and claim the $10,000 prize for disproving it. It is impossible

EVERY SINGLE WIZARD OF THE COAST IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE STATE OF THIS WORLD BY TEACHING FIVE COLOR LIES. NO HELL BURNS HOT ENOUGH FOR THEM AND NO FATE CAN DELIVER THEM THERE SOON ENOUGH. -PURVIS RAY THE WISEST HUMAN

The Fortune Teller denied Seven Color Harmony Wisdom. Perhaps he deserved his extermination.

FIVE COLOR ALICE IS A FALSEHOOD. THERE ARE SEVEN COLORS IN ALICE AND SEVEN HARMONIOUS CUBIC CYCLES. YOU HAVE BEEN EDUCATED STUPID BY DUELING ACADEMIES AND DENY 1.4 DIMENSIONS. YOU CANNOT CREATE WITH 5 COLOR SINGULARITY EVIL. ONLY SEVEN COLOR WISDOM CAN ENCAPSULATE THE TRUE NATURE OF THE UNIVERSE YOU PIGS.

« Last Edit: July 20, 2016, 05:28:37 PM by Purji Costavis »

commandercool

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2016, 05:06:20 PM »
Seven colors? Preposterous. Everyone knows there's only five colors. Colorless isn't a color. Gold isn't a color.

The Time Cube is safely confined to the Time Vault and the Wizards rules team has finally cracked its arcane Oracle text. TIME CUBE HOLDS NO POWER HERE!
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2016, 08:26:42 PM »
So what you're saying is, Alice is a Phyrexian and needs to be purged?  Can't argue with that.   ;)

Good points on Yukari.  I agree that red is absolutely not part of her makeup at all.  I'm not too sure on white myself, I'd guess it depends on how active a protector she is and where you think her onmyoudo abilities lie.  But yeah, heavily, heavily blue.

On Reimu, I'm going back and forth between pure white and white with a splash of red.  I'm weighting her laziness and tsundereness towards red here.  Though the point about natural ability can be used to argue green as well.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2016, 10:54:39 PM »
So what you're saying is, Alice is a Phyrexian and needs to be purged?  Can't argue with that.   ;)

Good points on Yukari.  I agree that red is absolutely not part of her makeup at all.  I'm not too sure on white myself, I'd guess it depends on how active a protector she is and where you think her onmyoudo abilities lie.  But yeah, heavily, heavily blue.
Given that Yukari pretty much created Gensokyo's structure with the formation of the barrier I can see her pretty solidly as part-white.

Where would Yuyuko fall? I've been wanting to put her as green/white/black because I find that utterly hilarious for flavor reasons but I'm not sure if that would actually work

Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2016, 10:57:28 PM »
Where would Yuyuko fall? I've been wanting to put her as green/white/black because I find that utterly hilarious for flavor reasons but I'm not sure if that would actually work
I would add black....because she's a ghost.
Edit: Oops, you already had black there. Never mind.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2016, 01:12:05 AM by the old guy »
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commandercool

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2016, 11:21:21 PM »
I think Yuyuko is black/green for sure. She's definitely black and probably green, white is also not impossible.

I'll do everybody by game for the first few game. Early-game minor characters will lean toward superficial choices because their personalities aren't that well-defined.

EoSD:
Reimu-White/Red/Green
Marisa-Blue/Red
Rumia-Black
Daiyousie-Blue
Cirno-Blue
Hong Meiling-Green
Koakuma-Black
Patchouli-Blue
Sakuya-White/Blue*
Remilia-Black/Red
Flandre-Black/Red**

PCB:
Letty-Blue
Chen-Green
Alice-Blue/Black
Lily White-White/Green
Various Prismrivers-White/Black
Youmu-White/Black
Yuyuko-Black/Green
Ran-Blue
Yukari-White/Blue/Black


So out of the first two games that's six white, nine blue, nine black, four red, and five green including some overlap. Not what I would have guessed at all. Judging by these, if Gensokyo was a land it might tap for black and/or blue. Red is the big loser, notably with zero red characters in PCB.

*Initially had her as Blue/Red. Her mindless loyalty could be interpreted as red or white, and time stop could be interpreted as extra combat phases and/or double strike (red), or tapping things and preventing them from untapping (white). I think she might conceivably be all three.

**I briefly had her being Blue/Red as kind of a gimmicky choice with blue to represent Four Of A Kind, but red can make copies as well, temporary ones, which seems more fitting.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2016, 11:25:14 PM »
Yuyuko is definitely green and black at the least, because of their association with the cycle of life and death, and her cavalier attitude towards pretty much everything.  I'm not really seeing the white though, because while she's nominally in charge of the Netherworld, it's a pretty lax and hands-off place.  Youmu would be a better fit for green-black-white IMO, and for her, heavy on the white.

Yuuka is certainly red-green, no?

And cut by a list of stuff.  I like the earlier idea of Meiling having some white to her, but other than that, these seem pretty solid.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2016, 12:40:57 AM »
Wouldn't Cirno and Dai (and all fairies for that matter) be Green instead of Blue? Fairies are the embodiment of nature in Touhou.

commandercool

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2016, 12:46:41 AM »
Yuuka is certainly red-green, no?

Mmmmaybe? She definitely has green, but I could see her bleeding into red, blue, and/or black. Red is probably the best fit.

And cut by a list of stuff.  I like the earlier idea of Meiling having some white to her, but other than that, these seem pretty solid.

Yeah, that makes sense. She probably has Defender and that does lean white.

Wouldn't Cirno and Dai (and all fairies for that matter) be Green instead of Blue? Fairies are the embodiment of nature in Touhou.

Conceivably, but keep in mind that the natural world isn't owned exclusively by green. They're small fliers, which is absolutely not green, and Cirno is themed around ice and water, which is definitely blue. Daiyousei could be green maybe, but the fact that she's a small flying creature who lives in a lake means that feels pretty wrong to me.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2016, 06:14:40 AM »
Wait a second...
That doesn't fully explain her weird cruel streak though. Her casual willingness to blow up and otherwise mutilate her dolls doesn't really seem blue. At first I was thinking it may be red, since it does usually take the form of a fiery explosion, but red's self-destruction is more a matter of recklessness and Alice seems more calculated than that to me, and not at all reckless. So I guess that makes it a black willingness to use any means to justify her ends or possibly even a deliberate act of cruelty.
I don't really agree, yes Alice is a little cruel to her dolls, but....their just dolls, who cares about them?
If she was cruel to other people, i would agree, but as far as i can tell her cruelty just extends to nonliving dolls.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2016, 06:40:26 AM »
She's used curse dolls on people before, although I'd agree it comes less from a position of straight cruelty, and more from a position of mad science.  Which is still a little black, but definitely more blue.
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commandercool

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2016, 06:42:10 AM »
Wait a second...I don't really agree, yes Alice is a little cruel to her dolls, but....their just dolls, who cares about them?
If she was cruel to other people, i would agree, but as far as i can tell her cruelty just extends to nonliving dolls.

Her Last Word is "Phantom of the Grand Guignol". At the very least that's a nasty macabre streak, but I don't think it's unreasonable to draw the conclusion that it says something about her attitude overall. Dolls have the form of people for a reason, they're meant to represent people in some way. Marisa and Patchouli seem to get along fine without acting out violence against people in their magic, so it's not like you need to do that. Alice is choosing to do it, and there's something sadistic about that for sure. That's not to say it makes her a terrible person or anything, as far as we know she doesn't really act out that way against living people, but it seems to be a small part of her character and a big part of her magic.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2016, 12:30:45 PM »
Hey there, wanted to stop by and give my thoughts.

First off, I think there might be too much of a focus on Black being defined by acts of cruelty, sadism or willful malice. New Phyrexia I think does a good job about showing this with some of the abilities that the Praetors present, like the white praetor empowering some and degrading others, instead of empowering the whole group.  Alot of what makes Black what it is, is simply about self-concern over others. Getting power is a part of that, and it can include using tactics like sacrificing and degrading others, but it doesn't mean said cruelty has to be enjoyed. Unless your someone like Rakdos (Black-Red), then it's about fun. There's even Sorin, whose been a bit of a hero at times in the MtG storyline and been black since the very beginning. Granted this is probably due to him being a vampire, but he does go White/Black in Innistrad, probably to represent him trying to restore order in his home plane.

I think adding Black to Alice would be about less of a concern about what her experiments have on others, but she doesn't quite have that desire for power that black usually goes for... the more I think about it, the less I'm having a hard time justifying Alice having that much black influence.

Yukari on the other hand, I think Black/White/Blue fits her really, really well. The Black/White is how she's maintaining order, but for her own gain over concern over others, and the Blue/White is more about how boundries require order, understanding and rules to create that separation that her power requires . Kinda ironic that a youkai would need structure, but I guess that's Yukari being that Youkai-like youkai for you. :/

Black also, while having death and weakening, doesn't mean that it's simply the realm of ghosts. Innistrad sets have spirits and ghost white colored, The Kamigawa block has
spirits of all colors. I think in this case, it might be better to look at characters like the Prismriver sisters more at who they are and what their powers do. Since Lunasa's music tends to bring down those who listen to her music to a calm attitude, but if too much can make them depressed, which would be black. Merlin's happy go lucky nature along with how her music tends to make people want to spontaneously dance is a bit red, and Lyrica's notes being illusionary along with her being a bit sly with her words makes her a bit more blue-ish. These were kinda hard to pull out, and Lunasa's is a reaaallllyy big stretch.

I could see Youmu being White/Green due to her guardian nature and being a gardener.

Chen maybe Red due to her childness and how he attacked the protags on a bit of an emotional impulse?

Faeries are kinda weird... they used to be green a long time ago, but are mostly Blue now, with some black. I think that's because of the way the faeries control the board most the time. Plus, most the mischief stuff that faeries love in Touhou happens in red, not blue. I think Cirno would be blue due to how she can freeze stuff, which could be like "Tap X permanents. They do not untap until thier owner's next untap step". Dai could be blue since she's smart for a fairy or even red due to the fact she like to play tricks sometimes. Yup, very weird.

Also, Tenshi's definitely White/Red in my book. But I think that's because I'm reading her being more acting on emotion rather than self-centeredness. Black would work too since she's spoiled enough, but my guess is what's motivating her for the second color.

Here's what I'm using as a guiade, btw: mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/Color_Wheel. Found it to be a bit better of a guide for the color stuff since it condenses lots of article for this topic.

Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2016, 04:56:58 PM »
Yuyuko is black by ability, but not as blatant as Yukari in personality. Personally, I could see that Black and Blue hide inside Green and Red (So Yellow? That's kinda fit her everyday life). Reimu normally would have White/Red/Green, but in my opinion, she would be colorless when she's in Fantasy Nature, to showed her phantasm being.

Now for the Eientei team:

Eirin, for best describe, would have the color of the Sea, in many level: On the surface, she is the colour of the clear blue sea of White and Blue, showing her duty to protect the princess and unbound intelligent. Dive deep down though, you would meet an oppresive Black/Blue that would choke , squeeze and crush you alive, that's her merciless and arrogant side as a former Lunarian and tactican.

Kaguya... She's a bit hard to describe: She's Red, only in the sense that she have her childish side, and White, only in the sense that she's standing at the top of society. She's also Blue by default of the cunning Lunarian's royal. Mixing that together, and you kinda get a pink-ish pearl found only in rare place, like the Hourai Mountain or something.

Reisen: Again, like Yuyuko, she's Black in ability, but not Black in personality. In fact, the Black would have a really fake look into it, kinda like a computer's generated one, compare to the Black that give an insidious vibe you found in evil being. It's as if you could peel that open to reveal the subtle Blue and the subserviant White.

Tewi: Unlike Reisen, she would be Black Red and Blue in general, purely for her childish and mischieviously cunning side. Though, sometimes she's showed White to her kin and surbordinate, and Green by nature. If I have to describe, it's exactly like seeing a White Rabbit in the middle of the forest, only for it to lead you inside a twisted belly of a shark.

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2016, 07:13:12 PM »
My, I don't really know anything about Magic: The Gathering, but I do know this thread has the potential for basically endless iterations. What would be Touhou character X's statistics in Fallout's SPECIAL system? What type of Pokemon would they be? Which Ultima virtue would fit them best? Or which Dungeons and Dragons alignment? Where would they lie on the Hertzsprung-Russell diagram? Well, maybe not that last one, but still, the possibilities are limitless.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #22 on: July 21, 2016, 11:38:41 PM »
First off, I think there might be too much of a focus on Black being defined by acts of cruelt, sadism or willful malice. New Phyrexia I think does a good job about showing this with some of the abilities that the Praetors present, like the white praetor empowering some and degrading others, instead of empowering the whole group.  Alot of what makes Black what it is, is simply about self-concern over others. Getting power is a part of that, and it can include using tactics like sacrificing and degrading others, but it doesn't mean said cruelty has to be enjoyed. Unless your someone like Rakdos (Black-Red), then it's about fun. There's even Sorin, whose been a bit of a hero at times in the MtG storyline and been black since the very beginning. Granted this is probably due to him being a vampire, but he does go White/Black in Innistrad, probably to represent him trying to restore order in his home plane.

That's definitely fair, although Touhou doesn't really seem to be loaded with power-hungry characters. A lot of them are selfish, but I think it's more of a red selfishness. A lot of the black I'm seeing is mechanical honestly.

I think in this case, it might be better to look at characters like the Prismriver sisters more at who they are and what their powers do. Since Lunasa's music tends to bring down those who listen to her music to a calm attitude, but if too much can make them depressed, which would be black. Merlin's happy go lucky nature along with how her music tends to make people want to spontaneously dance is a bit red, and Lyrica's notes being illusionary along with her being a bit sly with her words makes her a bit more blue-ish. These were kinda hard to pull out, and Lunasa's is a reaaallllyy big stretch.

I'll be honest and say I have no idea what the differences between the Prismrivers are. They're probably my least favorite individual characters in the modern franchise even though their stage is great.

I could see Youmu being White/Green due to her guardian nature and being a gardener.

I really like the idea of Youmu having an enemy color pair to highlight the duality of her nature. White makes a lot of sense for her though.

Chen maybe Red due to her childness and how he attacked the protags on a bit of an emotional impulse?

Yeah, that's fair.

Here's what I'm using as a guiade, btw: mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/Color_Wheel. Found it to be a bit better of a guide for the color stuff since it condenses lots of article for this topic.

I tried to pick one that was as concise as possibly, since I figured anyone not already familiar with the system might be put off by something wordy. There's definitely a lot of nuance to be lost in trying to be concise about Magic color though.

My, I don't really know anything about Magic: The Gathering, but I do know this thread has the potential for basically endless iterations. What would be Touhou character X's statistics in Fallout's SPECIAL system? What type of Pokemon would they be? Which Ultima virtue would fit them best? Or which Dungeons and Dragons alignment? Where would they lie on the Hertzsprung-Russell diagram? Well, maybe not that last one, but still, the possibilities are limitless.

Certainly true, but I kind of feel like Magic's colors have a robustness that a lot of other systems of classification don't necessarily.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #23 on: July 22, 2016, 12:12:45 AM »
I can hardly see any white in Eirin, personally. The only people Eirin cares about are Lunarians. She's willing to murder rabbits (in the back story) and manipulate earthlings into extremely dangerous situations (in LoLK) without a second thought. She takes advantage anything "below" her to get what she wants, even when she doesn't have to. I see that as black, personally.
Yeah Sakuya is similar, but Sakuya only does it when she has to. Sakuya kills without a thought when the mistress requires it. Eirin fucks with any non-lunarians because she only sees non-lunarians as tools.

As for Kaguya, I don't know what she would be but I can't see her as red. She does what Eirin tells her and rarely ever acts on her own, from what I've seen. Eirin's always the mastermind, Kaguya's just a pretty face with strong power. Maybe pure blue, since she has her curiosity?
Granted I haven't read CiLR, so that might change my opinions on her.

Mokou would be red, I think. She more or less does what she wants and that's it. An argument could be made for black, but the only time she exhibits that kind of behavior is around Kaguya. Even around Eientei rabbits she's pretty chill.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #24 on: July 22, 2016, 12:35:45 AM »
As for Kaguya, I don't know what she would be but I can't see her as red. She does what Eirin tells her and rarely ever acts on her own
This is incorrect, there are like, 2 chapters in Inaba And Inaba where she does things that have to do with going out side the house on her own. And its EIRIN who follows Kaguya's orders, not the other way around. But for the most part its really Eirin's fault that Kaguya doesn't go out much. Up until after the moon incident, she was very paranoid for her safety, and so disallowed her from leaving the house.

But your right about Eirin. She's probably one of the most "evil" characters in all of Touhou Project, she's not really different from Seiga or Sejia, TBH.

I mean, just look at her relationship with reisen! It's extremely abusive, it's way too much like an abusive relationship for it to NOT be intentional. She beats her for the littlest of things.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2016, 12:49:37 AM by the old guy »
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #25 on: July 22, 2016, 01:31:06 AM »
Err, I didn't mean it so much that Kaguya follows Eirin's orders. It's more like Kaguya doesn't give many orders, Eirin is mostly acting independently for Kaguya's sake and Kaguya goes along with Eirin's plans because it's Eirin. For example- unless I'm misremembering, the IN incident was Eirin's plan for protecting Kaguya. Kaguya didn't decide for that to happen, but didn't go against it either. Then, as you said, Kaguya didn't leave the house for a long time because Eirin said she shouldn't (even though she wanted to).
Even though Kaguya technically has the last say, she's very passive and mostly lets Eirin run things. Because of that, saying she's red due to her childish nature seems wrong to me. She follows the rules too much. At least, that's what it seems like to me. I could be wrong.
Then again, she doesn't strictly adhere to the rules due to her morals or anything like that. She just goes along with what Eirin says. So calling her white doesn't seem right either.

I don't remember the Inaba comics too well hahaha I must have forgotten that part. Goes back to reread.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2016, 01:43:56 AM by TresserT »
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2016, 05:27:44 AM »
Like I said, Kaguya is White only in the sense that she's a princess. It's kinda of like a naturally white hue. She isn't much white in anything else. Still enough white to earn enough respect of the Earth Rabbit though.

For me though, someone dedicated to protect someone else is a White. Eirin is no exception.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2016, 05:33:03 AM by andykhang »

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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2016, 08:12:10 AM »
There are dark sides to White like with any other color.  White heals, protects, and has tradition and honor, but can also be oppressive, reactionary, and arrogant.  One of the villains in Magic was a white human lord who, in attempting to bring peace to his plane, stole power and immortality from a giant hydra god with Yukari powers, then went maximum Hitler.

So to me, Eirin as white/blue makes tons of sense if you consider the evil side of white, and the Lunarians as a whole probably tend white as well.

Kaguya is confusing to me as well.  The only thing I can say for sure is that she's got a bit of the artificer in her, since she casts from her Impossible Request items.
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Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #28 on: July 22, 2016, 12:58:53 PM »
Yeah, when you put it like that, Eirin probably don't have as much Black as I thought she would be.

Re: Touhou and Magic: The Gathering's five colors
« Reply #29 on: July 23, 2016, 02:52:20 PM »
Now for the Former Hell resident:

Koishi would have been colorless, in my opinion. No matter how many Red she painted on herself, in the end she's just an empty shell of a closed up mind, and the Red wouldn't stick in. She does applied alot of Red though.

Satori would be... Well, she does have many animal, and want to live in peace, so Green would be appropriate. But that's also could be because she's cynical after listening to many minds, so she would be Black in a way.

Utsuho is definitively Red, since she's mostly a birdbrain, and prone to impulse. Though, she's Blue in her own expertise. So I guess the best guess would be the sky in a sunny day.

Parsee is truly the Green/Red-eyed jealoucy. Due to her behavior not only is chaotic, but actually came from her just doing what she must naturally do.

Others character i don't have enough opinion, so i'll leave it to you guy.