Pokemon Sun and Moon are out! Alola, MoTK!

[Failure McFailFace]

No. Unless they changed it. You're better off DK + Everstone or DK + Power Item.

So I wasted hours on the Battle Tree for nothing?

welp time to farm 16 more bp then

[The Greatest Dog]

by the by for anything that doesn't use Attack, 0 Attack IVs is preferred for the occasional Foul Play users out there.

Not that we have a means of decreasing IVs, yet...

[commandercool]

Minimum attack also matters for confusion and now Strength Sap I think?

And it's so niche it will never happen, but minimum special attack teeechnically matters when like, switching in on a Power Split from a special attacker.

[commandercool]

So this is a weird question, but does anyone have a

Spoiler:

Cosmeon

on hand they can trade me for just a minute? It's the last thing I need to complete my Pokedex and I don't want to evolve my

Spoiler:

Cosmog

because I like having it around and petting it.

I think I'm gonna need to acquire and play through a copy of Moon to get a Type: Null, Lunala, and the above Pokemon since I like having all of the Pokemon in Pokedex order in my PC and those slots will be empty otherwise.

[MewMewHeart]

Eevee hunting was a pain yesterday, especially when I had to abuse the SOS system for Espeon I still need to hunt for Umbreon since I have Moon it won't be hard unless I end up getting shitty luck like I did yesterday.

[Fulisha of Light]

So this is a weird question, but does anyone have a

Spoiler:

Cosmeon

on hand they can trade me for just a minute? It's the last thing I need to complete my Pokedex and I don't want to evolve my

Spoiler:

Cosmog

because I like having it around and petting it.

I think I'm gonna need to acquire and play through a copy of Moon to get a Type: Null, Lunala, and the above Pokemon since I like having all of the Pokemon in Pokedex order in my PC and those slots will be empty otherwise.

You could get a Kommo-o or Weavile and ask for a Cosmoem on the GTS. I did some hunting for the Dex and got about 3-4 Cosmogs now because I had leftover rare mons to spare.

[commandercool]

Oh really? Huh... I think I have an extra Kommo-o. Weavile might not even be THAT hard to get more of since I stopped taking internet's advice about using Compoundeyes and just used a Mimikyu (immune to all attacks wild Jangmo-o and pals can have) with Thief in an SOS battle.

Thanks for the tip. Should be able to get myself a Lunala that way too I would think if I just evolve a spare Cosmog into a Solgaleo and trade that.

Edit: Just got home from work to check the GTS, and yup, someone gave me a Cosmog for a Weavile. Gotts take advantage while this lasts, go get two more Weaviles and see if I can get another Cosmog and a Type: Null (which may be a stretch).

Edit edit: Lolwut I threw a spare Kommo-o up asking for a Type: Null just to see what would happen and I got one. Color me surprised. Kommo-o isn't even that hard to get... So in total I got two spare Cosmogs (one to evolve into Cosmeom and one to evolve into Solgaleo to trade for Lunala) and a Type: Null for basically nothing. And I even have enough Razor Claws to make another Weavile for myself. So I need to evolve a Dragonite to complete my Pokedex and do some minor cleanup and I'll have a complete Pokedex AND a copy of every single available Pokemon. And just in time to beat the Pokebank, too!

[Fulisha of Light]

Not Sun and Moon related exactly, but...

Spoiler:

Might as well attempt to get the Battle Maison ribbons in XY/ORAS before the Bank comes out so my beloved Delcatty has at least one of the ribbons.
Get a perfect (shiny event) Gengar, its Mega can pull me through pretty well. Have a Talonflame and Dragonite because they're one of the few mons I got from trades that are well trained for this. Give Delcatty Fake Out so I can set up.

Think to myself, "Doubles can't be that hard! I just need a win streak of 20 to get one of the ribbons!" and "What's the worst that could happen?"  :V

Never have I been so wrong. Lost on a win streak of 15 to Blizzard. Then a Girafarig killed Delcatty in one go. That god damn A.I. caught on to me quick

I never realized how much I suck at competitive battling.    If I can't even get a streak of 20 in XY/ORAS, there's no way I can beat the Battle Tree Doubles with only 3 good mons and a Delcatty. I can't even begin to imagine the hell I'm gonna go through all for the sake of a ribbon (much worse if I want both). Got at least 3 Golden Bottlecaps and I bet that won't make my Delcatty any better, even with the new 90 base speed.

On a positive note, I hatched a shiny Minior the other day, completing my Minior color collection :'D

[commandercool]

Doubles are their own weird thing. What works in singles doesn't necessarily work in doubles, but I kind of think doubles is a weaker format overall because it can be real matchup-specific. Like sometimes just picking the wrong two things to lead fucks you so badly that there's no coming back, and that's rare in singles. That said, there are some pairings that can really goof up the AI, you just gotta feel out what they are.

Dang, shiny Minior! Nice! What color is it?

[Bio]

If you pick the wrong lead in singles you suffer a pretty big momentum loss as well, and you instantly have to play riskier.

[Fulisha of Light]

Doubles are their own weird thing. What works in singles doesn't necessarily work in doubles, but I kind of think doubles is a weaker format overall because it can be real matchup-specific. Like sometimes just picking the wrong two things to lead fucks you so badly that there's no coming back, and that's rare in singles. That said, there are some pairings that can really goof up the AI, you just gotta feel out what they are.

Dang, shiny Minior! Nice! What color is it?

It probably wasn't a good idea for me to lead with M-Gengar and Delcatty then, or bring both Talonflame and Dragonite, considering I have didn't have anything to counter their weaknesses and they have the wrong abilities. And maybe Delcatty's EVs weren't the best (HP and Speed). The A.I. started throwing ghosts, normals, grass, and dark types along with mid-evos and 1 stage strong mons at me, and I feel like it's gonna stick with that now since when I started another streak it got better at attempting to kill me on the first go.

I prefer Doubles because I like my battles like that and I heard it was easy (I'd go for Singles, but it'd leave me with only 2 good mons). I heard that Mega Kangaskhan is a better mega option that can sweep everything, but it'd take me forever to breed a perfect one. And I'm not sure what'd be the perfect party exactly. As far as I know, Delcatty's Fake Out is good for help setting up, but it can't help damage anything (due to my EV spread). I'd go for ORAS' multi and see if Steven/whoever could drag me up to get at least the 1st ribbon, but I don't think I can support much.  :ohdear: I'd be satisfied with at least getting the Skillful Battler Ribbon, it'd be a dream to also get the Expert Battler Ribbon (which looks nicer).



Shiny Minior is black with rainbow confetti-triangles (I used a jap. red core for breeding, so its party sprite is red core):

[Bio]

Talonflame without Gale Wings is absolutely useless, (and now with Gale Wings nerfed it's pretty bad even with it).
Fake out is good for setting up, with only one attack incoming (usually not super effective) this gives your partner an easy opportunity to boost, introduce trick room or tailwind, spore or paralyze or taunt a treat etc.
If you need decently IV pokemon you can always ask for them and I'll see if I have some lying around.

[commandercool]

It probably wasn't a good idea for me to lead with M-Gengar and Delcatty then, or bring both Talonflame and Dragonite, considering I have didn't have anything to counter their weaknesses and they have the wrong abilities. And maybe Delcatty's EVs weren't the best (HP and Speed). The A.I. started throwing ghosts, normals, grass, and dark types along with mid-evos and 1 stage strong mons at me, and I feel like it's gonna stick with that now since when I started another streak it got better at attempting to kill me on the first go.

Dragonite and Talonflame are both great options for doubles, but you have to support them right since they both have quad weaknesses to common attack types. Gengar is generally fantastic but may need a specialized moveset. Delcatty... I have no idea. There might be some support moves that make it worth running in doubles. I know it's not used commonly so there are probably better options, but it may not be useless. And kind of isn't optional if the point is to get it the ribbon.

As far as I know, Delcatty's Fake Out is good for help setting up, but it can't help damage anything (due to my EV spread).

I don't the the EV spread is the only thing standing in the way of Delcatty's damage output. Even max attack banded won't be hitting hard enough to justify using it over something else. Support is your best choice I think, and you've got the right EVs for that.

Shiny Minior is black with rainbow confetti-triangles (I used a jap. red core for breeding, so its party sprite is red core):

Ooooooh! That is GORGEOUS! What a cool shiny!

[Kilgamayan]

I hate everything about everything but at least this is done now and the reward was worth it

[Drake]

Idol style best style

[PX]

I hate everything about everything but at least this is done now and the reward was worth it

Hilariously enough I just went in with my perfected Trick Room team and cleared them all in 1 try, Milotic OP

In other news I killed a Dragonite I was chaining for Marvel Scale and I hate everything

[Fulisha of Light]

Talonflame without Gale Wings is absolutely useless, (and now with Gale Wings nerfed it's pretty bad even with it).

I figured it was, but I attempted to go without it anyways and got punished for it ^^;

If you need decently IV pokemon you can always ask for them and I'll see if I have some lying around.

I'd like that, but I don't know exactly what I'd need (or what to offer in return).

Dragonite and Talonflame are both great options for doubles, but you have to support them right since they both have quad weaknesses to common attack types. Gengar is generally fantastic but may need a specialized moveset. Delcatty... I have no idea. There might be some support moves that make it worth running in doubles. I know it's not used commonly so there are probably better options, but it may not be useless. And kind of isn't optional if the point is to get it the ribbon.

I don't the the EV spread is the only thing standing in the way of Delcatty's damage output. Even max attack banded won't be hitting hard enough to justify using it over something else. Support is your best choice I think, and you've got the right EVs for that.

Well that's good to know I did something right. I hope it'll be better once it gets transported to Sun and Moon and gets the Golden Bottlecap for the Battle Tree (and maybe Royale)
I could replace them (Dragonite and Talonflame, since without their hidden abilities they're not the best they could be) and find better mons if I knew what'd be perfect.

My Delcatty's moveset has:
Covet
Feint Attack
Iron Tail
Fake Out

Held Item: Focus Sash (which at my ended streak I stupidly replaced with a Brightpowder and got one-shotted; never again)

I thought of teaching it Thunder Wave and replacing Iron Tail so I can spread paralysis, and maybe changing the ability to Normalize (since I got 21 Ability Capsules from the Global Link  :V) so it can paralyze anything, but then the A.I. might start throwing more ghosts to prevent that (which Gengar could take out, but it could also die quickly to them). I'd have a better set obviously if I got rid of the first 2 moves, but (personal preferences) I don't want to remove them and I might not get them again.  :ohdear: _{the pain of having an old mon...}

Gengar has its mega stone with this moveset:
Shadow Ball
Sludge Bomb (because Sludge Wave kept hitting my partner hard and the A.I. started throwing grass to force me to use it so it dies)
Protect
Destiny Bond (last resort option since Shadow Tag forces them to stay in)

EVs are max Sp. Attk and Speed.

Ooooooh! That is GORGEOUS! What a cool shiny!

Ikr? it was _{worth the 807 eggs :'D}

[commandercool]

I could replace them (Dragonite and Talonflame, since without their hidden abilities they're not the best they could be) and find better mons if I knew what'd be perfect.

Actually Inner Focus isn't a terrible ability for Dragonite in doubles. Since Fake Out spam is everywhere it can get you some surprise opportunities to really fuck up your opponent. Dragonite will always be either very weak to Fake Out or very strong against it depending on its ability.

My Delcatty's moveset has:
Covet
Feint Attack
Iron Tail
Fake Out

Held Item: Focus Sash (which at my ended streak I stupidly replaced with a Brightpowder and got one-shotted; never again)

So first of all it seems like you know this, but never use Brightpowder. It's an awful item and is a total waste of a slot. Focus Sash, Sitrus Berry, Metal Herb, and even the much-maligned-in-doubles Leftovers are much better options. Same with Quick Claw, just don't waste your time with extremely low-RNG stuff like that.

That moveset seems... Not great. The Fake Out is good, you probably want that for sure. Covet only works if you item is gone, and Iron Tail and Feint Attack are just super weak. Other viable moves (not including egg moves) include:

-Icy Wind (more for the speed drop than the damage, depends on your teammates as to whether this is worth it, but probably preferable over Thunder Wave if you do)
-Helping Hand (amazing in doubles, especially for allies with moves that hit both opponents)
-Heal Bell or Safeguard (kind of niche, but can be a godsend in some situations)
-Toxic (probably too slow for doubles, but at least cripples stall sets that aren't immune to it)
-Assist (only on some VERY specific gimmick teams)
-Charm (not ideal, but a fast way to cripple physical attackers isn't nothing)
-Protect or Substitute (pretty much always a decent option on anything in doubles)

So that being the case I would probably run something like Fake Out, Icy Wind, Helping Hand, Charm. There are almost certainly other Pokemon that can pull off this basic role better, but if you are going to use Delcatty I think that set with a Focus Sash or maybe Sitrus Berry would be non-useless.

Gengar has its mega stone with this moveset:
Shadow Ball
Sludge Bomb (because Sludge Wave kept hitting my partner hard and the A.I. started throwing grass to force me to use it so it dies)
Protect
Destiny Bond (last resort option since Shadow Tag forces them to stay in)

EVs are max Sp. Attk and Speed.
Ikr? it was _{worth the 807 eggs :'D}

Yeah, that's probably the most standard Gengar set in doubles. That should do a lot of work if you're careful with it.

[Bio]

I'd like that, but I don't know exactly what I'd need (or what to offer in return).

If you're looking for HA Dragonites and Talonflame I can provide you with at least a decent one. You don't need to offer anything in return, there's nothing I need anyway.

Yeah, that's probably the most standard Gengar set in doubles. That should do a lot of work if you're careful with it.

The most standard Gengar set maybe. In doubles most [M]Gengar sets are a lot more supportive, with Taunt, Will-o-Wisp, Substitute, Perish Song etc.
I'd think Perish Trapping would work well against AI. It'd probably be the best if you''re leading Mega Gengar + Delcatty.

Delcatty @ Focus Sash
- Thunder Wave
- Fake Out
- Protect
- Heal Bell

Gengar @ Gengarite
- Shadow Ball
- Perish Song
- Substitute
- Protect

Thunder Wave for speed control, then have some power in the back like Swords Dance Scizor or Banded Dragonite.

[Fulisha of Light]

So first of all it seems like you know this, but never use Brightpowder. It's an awful item and is a total waste of a slot. Focus Sash, Sitrus Berry, Metal Herb, and even the much-maligned-in-doubles Leftovers are much better options. Same with Quick Claw, just don't waste your time with extremely low-RNG stuff like that.

That moveset seems... Not great. The Fake Out is good, you probably want that for sure. Covet only works if you item is gone, and Iron Tail and Feint Attack are just super weak. Other viable moves (not including egg moves) include:

-Icy Wind (more for the speed drop than the damage, depends on your teammates as to whether this is worth it, but probably preferable over Thunder Wave if you do)
-Helping Hand (amazing in doubles, especially for allies with moves that hit both opponents)
-Heal Bell or Safeguard (kind of niche, but can be a godsend in some situations)
-Toxic (probably too slow for doubles, but at least cripples stall sets that aren't immune to it)
-Assist (only on some VERY specific gimmick teams)
-Charm (not ideal, but a fast way to cripple physical attackers isn't nothing)
-Protect or Substitute (pretty much always a decent option on anything in doubles)

So that being the case I would probably run something like Fake Out, Icy Wind, Helping Hand, Charm. There are almost certainly other Pokemon that can pull off this basic role better, but if you are going to use Delcatty I think that set with a Focus Sash or maybe Sitrus Berry would be non-useless.

Yeah, lesson learned since it screwed me over. OTL

Only moves I can't use on your list is Charm and Assist because this mon is unfortunately very old (from the good old days of Sapphire when I was a kid; this explains the want for the ribbons) and move relearner doesn't have them show up. Everything else I have enough BP for though.
_{I can apparently get back Covet via ORAS move tutor if I wanted to, huh. Not a total loss. But Feint Attack is, ugh. I'm so antsy about it...}

If you're looking for HA Dragonites and Talonflame I can provide you with at least a decent one. You don't need to offer anything in return, there's nothing I need anyway.

In doubles most [M]Gengar sets are a lot more supportive, with Taunt, Will-o-Wisp, Substitute, Perish Song etc.
I'd think Perish Trapping would work well against the A.I. It'd probably be the best if you're leading Mega Gengar + Delcatty.

Delcatty @ Focus Sash
- Thunder Wave
- Fake Out
- Protect
- Heal Bell

Gengar @ Gengarite
- Shadow Ball
- Perish Song
- Substitute
- Protect

Thunder Wave for speed control, then have some power in the back like Swords Dance Scizor or Banded Dragonite.

Such a devious set, but unfortunately my Gengar doesn't know/can't relearn Perish Song (it's an event shiny I got via code that got the right nature and IV spread). Could breed it, but god knows how long it'd take for the egg to get good IVs (then Super Training yet again).

Scizor sounds like a better option than Talonflame tbh. Wouldn't have to deal with Blizzard like last time.



Question now is, should Delcatty's ability be Normalize or not? I have no access to Wonder Skin since it's an old mon.

[Bio]

If you are doing XY/ORAS you shouldn't need to use Super Training? Horde EV training is super efficient and is something I miss.

As for Cute Charm vs Normalize, I don't think I have a strong opinion either way. Honestly paralysing both Ground and Ghost types is useful. Depends if you have a resist to either of these types to warrant running the control.

[Fulisha of Light]

If you are doing XY/ORAS you shouldn't need to use Super Training? Horde EV training is super efficient and is something I miss.

As for Cute Charm vs Normalize, I don't think I have a strong opinion either way. Honestly paralysing both Ground and Ghost types is useful. Depends if you have a resist to either of these types to warrant running the control.

I like Super Training more since it helps me keep better track of the EV spread (even if it gets slightly tedious).

Made another attempt at the Maison, swapped the items around this time and keeping the same party just to see if that helps. I got up to 10 before I ended up screwing myself over (Choice Band Dragonite, mis-clicked on Dragon Dance and got locked into it after all my other mons died to a Grumpig). Talonflame isn't putting in much work, so yeah I think Scizor's gonna work better (might need a better Gengar since I feel like mine's slightly weaker than it should be).

I did little better and noticed the A.I. started focusing more on taking out Delcatty and bringing in a lot of ground types to attempt to trap me into using M-Gengar and EQing it (which confirms that Normalize is much more important than Cute Charm, even if it means Delcatty can't hit ghosts). I'm getting more convinced I need to keep Feint Attack because it started throwing Minimize spammers (and some Cheri Berry holders) towards the end (Delcatty can do a nice chunk of damage thanks to a small 4 Attk EV, better when I give it Normalize). Dragonite ain't having many issues other than my mistake, so I don't think I need a better one.

If you got a good Scizor and Gengar (with Perish Song, cuz I'd like to surprise the A.I. with that as a last resort rather than Destiny Bond), I'd like to trade (don't need their hold items items since I got plenty of BP from the Bank to get them) 

[commandercool]

It took many hours (about 800 chains I think) but I FINALLY got a shiny Ditto.

It's not Impostor unfortunately, but it has four perfect IVs so that's nice. Not useful for battling, but useful for seeing every shiny form for my Pokedex if I want to (if you didn't know, shiny Ditto turns into the shiny form of whatever it transforms into).

[Jq1790]

Oh right I forgot if I ever posted in here since Christmas when I got the game but I just beat the game, did the postgame mission things, and caught the post-postgame legendary thing.  Was a fun experience. 
Incredibly miffed that they

Spoiler:

put Lillie on a boat

even if it's justified as to why.

[commandercool]

Apparently today is the day of finally getting things I've been trying to get forever, because I also FINALLY got a Salac berry after like 100+ attempts (including many resets, which may or may not help because some people claim the trees pull from a set list each day).

Can you wonder trade Pokemon holding items? Everything I send out from now on comes with a Salac berry.

Edit: Jesus, Salac berries take 72 hours to grow. Well, I guess I have a lot of excuses to use beans now. I'll build up a healthy supply of them and then start sending them out.

[Jq1790]

Time to perform an experiment then!
...
...
You can!

[commandercool]

Alright, I've got one hundred of Salac Berries now. If anybody wants one let me know, they're free to a good home (not that I wouldn't accept other rare berries in exchange for them...).

[Jq1790]

Oh right, ccool, did you want that foreign Fomantis still?  If so, come into the IRC and we can arrange that.

[commandercool]

Yeah, next time I see you on IRC we can work something out.

Edit: Okay, nevermind. Just got one in a Wonder Trade. Well, you're free to take anything of mine you want if there's anything that's interesting to you, but turns out I don't need a Fomantis after all.

[Jq1790]

Nah I'm good, but glad it worked out for you! 

Guess this one's gonna go fill the void your new one left or something.  *shrug*