My Interpretation of a Touhou Song Title - Faith is for Transient People

[macblo]

I've noticed a recurring thing about a lot of Touhou songs. They have really poetic titles. I don't know much about poetry, but I do know that one way or another, ZUN has quite a way with words. I read the titles of some of this songs and begin to think "What goes through ZUN's head when he's writing these song titles. I've decide to take a crack at try to interpret the mean of "Faith is for Transient People," one of the first Touhou songs I've ever heard.

Faith is for Transient People

When I first heard this song, I was playing Touhoumon: Another World. Since it was a GBA emulator, I had been play almost the entire game with the speed up button. But one time, I entered a trainer battle without the speed up button and I heard this song for the first time. I was blown away by how good this song was. I went to search for the song almost immediately, and it didn?t take me long to figure out that this song was called ?Faith is for Transient People.? I had no idea what to think of the song title when I first read it, mostly because I had no idea what ?Transient? meant at the time.
I soon found out what transient meant. It means ?Lasting only for a short time.? I didn?t know what to make of the title for a while, until I began to think of ?Transient? as another word for death. Death is an inevitable for all human. At some point in the future, you?re going to die. I think that the song is say that in order to enjoy life, you need to have faith in the things you believe in. If you have faith is something, you?ll do your best to protect it. It gives you meaning and a purpose in life, however small or unimportant it may seem. Who knows if this wild, wild existence we call life has any true meaning. I just know that if you have faith in what you love, it makes this transient thing we call life just a bit more bearable. 

I hope you guys enjoyed it!

[Clarste]

I've always read the title as "faith is for the mortals, not for the gods". As in, faith is for you and no one else. Believe whatever makes you a better person. This is mostly notable in contrast to the events of the game.

Another song title I like is "Solar Sect of Mystic Wisdom ~ Nuclear Fusion". The implication being that the holy grail of controllable fusion is a kind of scientific cult of the sun. In the end we're just trying to recapture our awe of the original god.

[ElizabethK]

I think both your interpretions are spot on!    I always saw it as meaning "take faith while you can" or "worship while you can" as 'transient' means "lasting only for a short time". I'm probably wrong. xD

[cuc]

Honestly, everything considered, "Faith is for the Short-lived Humans" is probably a better translation.

[haoreos2]

I imagine the name Necrophantasia is a sort of nod towards the purpose of Gensokyo; a haven for Youkai, beings who can't exist if nobody fears or believes in them (not unlike a phantasm), who have been forgotten by the outside world (and thus are "dead illusions").

No idea what "Captain Murasa" refers to though

Honestly, everything considered, "Faith is for the Short-lived Humans" is probably a better translation.

Even if so, the current version sounds much better imo.

[cuc]

Nice. I haven't considered that about Necro-Fantasy/Necro-Fantasia.

Even if so, the current version sounds much better imo.

IMHO fancier words are not always better. Simpler words are more direct and powerful. Also there's no need to make the translation harder to comprehend than it was in the original language.

Also I didn't just say it's "more accurate". I said it's "better" when "everything considered". I was expressing a subjective opinion.

I've always read the title as "faith is for the mortals, not for the gods". As in, faith is for you and no one else. Believe whatever makes you a better person. This is mostly notable in contrast to the events of the game.

I always like to see it as "faith exists because humans are mortal". I like to think that both readings are intended. Of course they are not very far away from each other.

[LeadPal]

Unfortunately, "transient" can also mean "homeless." The current translation tries to be poetic, but ends up sounding almost like a binbou miko joke.

[haoreos2]

I dunno, I think it sounds like one of the better titles. Constructs like "short-lived" sound a bit cumbersome; more esoteric words aren't necessarily better, but I'd argue that without specific terms language would sound very artificial, in the same way as speech lacking contractions. Heck, "transient" basically works as a contraction in this case; you're just using a different word to replace several instead of squishing them together and slurring them.

I've never actually heard transient used to mean homeless (in the process of moving, perhaps), but I don't really think that's a problem in any case. You could use the same logic to say that the word dead in "Septette for the dead princess" could be read as absolute. Technically it's valid, but unless you have a contextual reason for it or that's the only definition of the word you're aware of, I doubt there would be any confusion. It isn't as if it's one of those words that has two opposite meanings that can't be eliminated through context half the time, like "peruse".


Besides, at least you can get a reasonable meaning just by reading the name here. There are plenty of other titles that sound like some random words thrown together. "Shanghai Alice of Meiji 17", "strawberry crisis", "Hiroari Shoots a Strange Bird ~ Till When?"; I wouldn't know if they make total sense in Japanese and just can't really be translated well or what, but a lot of the names either sound awkward in English or sound fine but are gibberish.


Opinions, wheeee

[TresserT]

I don't remember when it was or who did it, but there was a guy (or maybe a girl) who posted a thread of his interpertations of every song through UFO. It was really insightful, especially with some of the stranger titles like "Hiroari shoots the Strange Bird". I'll post a link if I can find it.

Just kidding~

It's stickied to this board.

Juuuust kidding again. While Fightest's thread is very good and very relevant, it's actually not the one I was thinking of.

[Clarste]

I've never actually heard transient used to mean homeless (in the process of moving, perhaps), but I don't really think that's a problem in any case. You could use the same logic to say that the word dead in "Septette for the dead princess" could be read as absolute. Technically it's valid, but unless you have a contextual reason for it or that's the only definition of the word you're aware of, I doubt there would be any confusion. It isn't as if it's one of those words that has two opposite meanings that can't be eliminated through context half the time, like "peruse".

"Transient" is used as a more formal way to talk about homelessness. You'll see it in newspapers or speeches or, I dunno, law review articles. No one uses it in casual conversation, ever. Unfortunately, here the context is "transient people" which makes it sound even more like it's referring to homelessness. So, by eliminating definitions through context, we eliminate the "ephemeral" definition since that's rarely applied to people.

[haoreos2]

Whelp, I've heard it used in the ephemeral sense enough that I got the title immediately, but then I read novels, papers and the like more than newspapers and public interest pieces, so perhaps its used differently in other circles. Though, considering the etymology of the word and the fact that a quick Google search comes up exclusively with the temporary definition, I'd argue that anyone who was unsure of it would be able to figure it out easily enough.

It's true that it's not a word that gets much use in casual conversation, but then we're talking about the name of a song, so that's not really much of an issue; Septette and Centennial and Phantasia all sound just as pretentious in casual conversation.

As for the context eliminating the ephemeral definition: you could perhaps argue that if you walked up to someone on the street and asked them to interpret the phrase, but when you consider the setting as part of the context, you suddenly have long lived Youkai (people) to compare to the mayfly-like humans (also people). Of course nobody would apply modifier like transient to a population if there wasn't another more long-lived one to compare it to. Plus, since homeless people probably wouldn't be homeless for very long in a community-oriented culture like a small village (also feudal in flavour and surrounded by spooky monsters), I'd argue that when one takes the setting into context the "homeless" definition (which incidentally according to Wikipedia is indeed reserved for those that are in transit, which would make it more of a euphemism considering a backpacker could be labelled as such) is the one that would get eliminated.
Of course, that isn't even taking into account the full title. Once we bring the idea of faith and to which group it is useful for into the picture, surely the meaning becomes inarguable? It's easy to imagine why relatively powerless, death-fearing, distinctly mortal humans would feel the need for belief and trust in a higher power while more independent, self-assured and long lived beings wouldn't. If you take transient in the vagrant sense, then how do you justify the title as a whole? It's not like a shrine is going to get sufficient faith exclusively from the (presumably few, what with the humans living in a community-oriented culture like a village) homeless, or bar other would-be worshipers because they possess houses; plus, its a pretty bleak issue to bring up in an otherwise cheery game.

[Tengukami]

"Transient" to mean "homeless" is pretty outdated, and on par with "itinerant". I rather see these words used to refer to nomads, travelers, and other folks who by choice keep moving from place to place, rather than people who have fallen through the cracks of everyday society. I think anyone who sincerely reads the "transient" in this song title to mean "homeless" either isn't a native English speaker or is living in the 19th century.

[LeadPal]

"Transient" to mean "homeless" is pretty outdated, and on par with "itinerant". I rather see these words used to refer to nomads, travelers, and other folks who by choice keep moving from place to place, rather than people who have fallen through the cracks of everyday society. I think anyone who sincerely reads the "transient" in this song title to mean "homeless" either isn't a native English speaker or is living in the 19th century.

It's a euphemism; it's normal for them to sound quaint. More to the point, however, is that a more generous, non-euphemistic reading of the translation would be "Faith is for the Nomadic People," which is still wrong. Getting "Short-Lived People" from "Transient People" requires unnatural contortion. That is not how those two words are used together.

[Tengukami]

I don't think it's unnatural, least of all in the context of "faith", the game story, Shinto in general, and so forth. Those two words devoid of context may be puzzling, but fortunately there's context, precluding the need to deliberately overthink this.

[XxYakogoro]

Just to state, isn't "transient people" a more effective word in the title, since there are really more than just short living human beings, but also long living and immortal beings in Gensokyo?

Faiths is for the homeless, pfft, more like "faith is for the hobos" :V

[LeadPal]

Context? To draw the intended meaning, the reader has to actively overlook the correct definition of the word "transient" as it is used in the context of people. Because in that context, it means "staying in one place only briefly."

The current translation is bad. It doesn't just ignore connotation, it ignores denotation. And there's really no reason for it: "ephemeral" is a much better word that actually does mean short-lived in this context.

[Tengukami]

I think you might be overstating your argument a bit. Given the fact that "transient" and "ephemeral" are synonyms, it sounds like you're vehemently arguing the difference between two ways of saying the same thing. I think "ephemeral" sounds like a word someone would use to sound poetic or smart, but really I think we're talking about matters of taste anyway.

[haoreos2]

Context? To draw the intended meaning, the reader has to actively overlook the correct definition of the word "transient" as it is used in the context of people. Because in that context, it means "staying in one place only briefly."

The current translation is bad. It doesn't just ignore connotation, it ignores denotation. And there's really no reason for it: "ephemeral" is a much better word that actually does mean short-lived in this context.

You're applying real-world context to a pair of words here to create a meaning that, for the real world, makes sense. Transient's current primary definition: short lived, momentary. Applying context: humans (at least in a developed society) tend to have similar expected lifespans; certainly not enough deviance to justify calling a given population short-lived. Therefore that interpretation is dropped, and we check alternate meanings; the nomadic sense of transient ("to go across") works, therefore that is the probable meaning, given the context given.

This is fine. That's how language works. There are two problems in this case though.
Firstly, the real-world context is invalid, because Gensokyo, not 21st century [nation X], is the relevant setting. In the context of Gensokyo, we may or may not have the homeless, but there's one thing we sure do have: super long lived people to compare the general population to. Therefore the "short lived people" interpretation is entirely valid in the context of the setting in which the games take place in.
Secondly, you need to look at the sentence as a whole to infer context accurately. If you only look at individual fragments of a sentence, you get garden path issues. If we do look at the whole thing, we need to choose a meaning for "transient people" that makes sense as a population for which faith is intended. Faith is for the homeless? Not a whole lot of sense, in this world or otherwise. Faith is for people who aren't practically immortal? Much more reasonable.

The thing about context is you need to identify the relevant one, or it's like trying to apply colour harmony to quarks.

[Mеа]

Well if we wanted direct translations, it would be "Faith is for the transient humans". For a surface reading, "Faith is for humans, who are transient" would be clearer, but the former captures the idea/vagueness better.
This page speculates that:
1) Humans are transient since they need the blessings of gods even continue to exist, eg: bountiful harvest, rain, etc, and
2) gods cannot give blessings if they don't receive faith (which was a the point in MoF, I think).
This page quotes the above page, and combines the above two ideas into:
o) Without faith, the transient humans would perish.
It then looks at this combined idea from the other side, obtaining:
o) Faith is for the transient humans.

(The second page also speculates that the title could be referring to Sanae herself, as she is herself a living god but is also a physical, and hence transient, human that serves the gods (Kanako and Suwako) as their priestess.)

And I'm not grabbing these just to set, like, 'the' interpretation, I'm just gathering different sources' ideas to add more ideas for the sake of interest and variety. Sharing interpretations is infinitely more fun than trying to or having one set in stone.

I suggest an alternate reading can also be obtained:
o) Faith is for the sake of transient humans.
Whether the 'for the sake of' implies: for the benefit of, or in the interest of, or in the favor of, or beneficial to, etc etc, is a personal reading.
In other words, because faith exists, gods can bless humans and they can continue to live, exist, and reap the joys and sorrows that come with them.

I think it fits well with her image, as the phrase 'as fleeting as the wind' is exactly the idea of transience. I'd imagine some people from various countries wouldn't be able to attest to the wind being described as fleeting though.

[Clarste]

Just to state, isn't "transient people" a more effective word in the title, since there are really more than just short living human beings, but also long living and immortal beings in Gensokyo?

Faiths is for the homeless, pfft, more like "faith is for the hobos" :V

Now that you mention it, the title uses the word 'humans' rather specifically. We just translated it as 'people' since saying 'human' all the time gets awkward. The fact that you misread it means it's another point of failure, I guess?

Faith is for humans, but only the dying ones. Sorry Mokou.