Maidens of the Kaleidoscope

~Hakurei Shrine~ => Rika and Nitori's Garage Experiments => Touhou Projects => Topic started by: Tengukami on August 14, 2010, 08:25:37 PM

Title: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on August 14, 2010, 08:25:37 PM
This thread is for the contribution of people who want to work on the English patch, and for eventual beta-testers to post findings.

I understand the manual has already been fully translated, so we're off to a great start already.

So then, who's in?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Just a GBZero on August 14, 2010, 08:53:07 PM
I'm in, but unfortunately all I can really do is beta test the patches
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 14, 2010, 08:56:31 PM
Here you go! (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,197.msg409851.html#msg409851)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: nintendonut888 on August 14, 2010, 09:41:11 PM
So apparently this patch is gonna come out faster than any game before it? Good luck to you guys.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Maav on August 14, 2010, 09:41:58 PM
I'm in for beta testing if needed. ;D
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Lord Phantasm Satori on August 14, 2010, 09:42:39 PM
oh wow, already? man, you guys are awesome.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on August 14, 2010, 11:26:12 PM
oh wow, already? man, you guys are awesome.

No, not already. Drake was just linking to his file extractions; not an actual English patch.

But yeah, we generally like to have a thread like this up shortly after a game is released.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Shizumarashi Mayuzumi on August 15, 2010, 12:09:00 AM
I'd love to pitch in, though I dunno what I could really do - aside from beta-testing which could be pretty much anyone, I think all I can really do is translate, and there's plenty of people around here who are way better at that than I am anyway. :ohdear: I was pitching in on spellcard names off of screenshots in IRC the other night and everyone else typed faster than me. :V
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 15, 2010, 02:54:23 AM
Seeing as I just finished translating the entirety of the dialogue on Touhou Wiki, I figured I should at the very least say I did so here. So maybe I'd be up for helping with the ending translations or something.

I really suck at the game, though, so probably not a great beta tester.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on August 15, 2010, 03:48:47 AM
Looks like everything's already done? Nice work, vgperson!

Just say if there's anything else that needs translating, and I can take care of it.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Lord Phantasm Satori on August 15, 2010, 07:26:29 AM
don't forget the HUD! I really need to know what all those %s are.  :V
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 15, 2010, 07:26:56 AM
Considering the entire game script is translated, the only things left are the in-game images, which I provided.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Lord Phantasm Satori on August 15, 2010, 07:44:56 AM
so... that means you didn't forget them? sweet.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: N-Forza on August 15, 2010, 08:38:40 AM
One I get my Comiket orders sorted out, I'll look it over and make sure it looks good.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Dizzy H. "Muffin" Muffin on August 15, 2010, 05:41:28 PM
I just want to say that various people here are just awesome.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Unassuming Squid on August 15, 2010, 06:21:38 PM
That was fast.

I love you guys.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on August 15, 2010, 08:41:59 PM
For the in-game screen?
The text at the top left is just "Great Fairy War"
The two across the top are "High score" and "Current score"
The ones on the right sidebar are "Bonuses," "Fighting Spirit," "Ice Power," "Perfect Freeze," and then at the bottom "Area Frozen"

The images, from Drake's rip (thanks much, Drake):
loading.png: "Fairies Are Fighting" "Now Loading"
medal00.png: "Victory with no ice!" "Victory with no misses!" "Just barely victory!"
face01/ename.png: "Light of the Shining Sun" "Sunny Milk"
face02/ename.png: "Light of the Peaceful Moon" "Luna Child"
face03/ename.png: "Light of the Falling Star" "Star Sapphire"
face04/ename.png: "The Magician Passing By" "Kirisame Marisa"
routeselect.png: "Where to next?" "Magic Forest" "Misty Lake" "Spring Path"
logo/logo_a1_1.png: "Stage A-1" "The Fun (sounds bad) and Bewitching Grove" "Freeze the enemy bullets with ice barriers!" "(Aimed Firing)[?]" "[same]"
logo/logo_a1_2.png: "Stage A1-2" "Twilight Citadel" "Misty Lake (Evening)" "You can't freeze burning danmaku! Be careful!" "[same]"
logo/logo_a1_3.png: "Stage A1-3" "Great Fairy Showdown" "Spring Path (Night)" "Lasers will break ice. Watch out for shards!" "[same]"
After the stage title, the text is the same for all logos of the same color.
logo/logo_a2_2.png: "Stage A2-2" "Fairy's Flower Arrangement" "Spring Path (Evening)"
logo/logo_a2_3.png: "Stage A2-3" "Starry Sky over the Water" "Misty Lake (Night)"
logo/logo_b1_1.png: "Stage B-1" "Non-negotiable(?) Demands" "Misty Lake"
logo/logo_b1_2.png: "Stage B1-2" "Where did the Light Fairy Go?" "Magic Forest (Evening)"
logo/logo_b1_3.png: "Stage B1-3" "Moonlight under the Midnight Cherries" "Spring Path (Night)"
logo/logo_b2_2.png: "Stage B2-2" "Journey of the Forgetful" "Spring Path (Evening)"
logo/logo_b2_3.png: "Stage B2-3" "Midnight Forest" "Magic Forest (Night)"
logo/logo_c1_1.png: "Stage C-1" "Whirling Cherry Petal Danmaku" "Spring Path"
logo/logo_c1_2.png: "Stage C1-2" "Three Fairies' Citadel" "Magic Forest (Evening)"
logo/logo_c1_3.png: "Stage C1-3" "Battle over the Lake" "Misty Lake (Night)"
logo/logo_c2_2.png: "Stage C2-2" "The Moon Rises on the Lake" "Misty Lake (Evening)"
logo/logo_c2_3.png: "Stage C2-3" "Fairies' Lively Night" "Magic Forest (Night)"
logo/logo_ex.png: "Stage EX" "After the Festival" "Wondrous Path of Midnight Cherries" "Be careful of beams which drain your fighting spirit!" "[same]"
logo/music00.png: "Refrain of the Cute War" "Stake your Life on a Prank" "Year-Round Absorbing Curiosity" "Midnight Fairy Dance" "Great Fairy War ~ Faily[sic] Wars" "Loose Rain/Reign?" "Meigast (??? all I can think of is May+August) Night"

I'll work on the rest later, unless someone else wants to take care of them.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: hs08 on August 15, 2010, 09:40:30 PM
logo/music00.png: "Refrain of the Cute War" "Stake your Life on a Prank" "Year-Round Absorbing Curiosity" "Midnight Fairy Dance" "Great Fairy War ~ Faily[sic] Wars" "Loose Rain/Reign?" "Meigast (??? all I can think of is May+August) Night"

I believe Meigast is supposed to be Magus. In reference to The Witches' Ball ~ Magus, perhaps?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 15, 2010, 09:49:07 PM
Faily Wars was likely put there on purpose, Lose Rain, and Magus Night.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Prime 2.0 on August 15, 2010, 10:50:50 PM
Sure, I could beta-test. Assuming you don't already have people on that or a system to increase the size of the word bubbles, I could also help with the transcription.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 16, 2010, 12:18:40 AM
Okay, I've got the endings translated, unless there's an ending after Extra for some silly reason. Should I PM these to somebody or what?

(Also, I already translated the stage names on the wiki.)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: LinkedFate on August 16, 2010, 01:32:11 AM
Here, have a English config.exe (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1709046/FW_custom_e.zip)

All it took was a simple copy-paste of dialog from the UFO config_e.exe, so credit goes to whoever did the translation of UFO's config.exe
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: N-Forza on August 16, 2010, 03:31:38 AM
"Just barely victory!"
I'm not in translator/editor mode right now but this sounds weird.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 16, 2010, 03:45:45 AM
Yeah, I'd say "Narrow Victory!" And all of them should be in that format rather than "Victory with _": No-Ice Victory, No-Miss Victory.

I guess I'll also note that the in-game difficulty displays for Easy and Lunatic (and Extra, sorta) in front/front00.png aren't exactly those names; Easy is "Simple," Lunatic is "Maddening," and maybe Extra should be "Bonus" or something simply because it's not "ekisutora."
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Dizzy H. "Muffin" Muffin on August 16, 2010, 04:21:42 AM
Yes, but it says "Easy," Lunatic," etc. in English on the difficulty-select screen.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 16, 2010, 04:50:40 AM
I know, it's not like I'm saying the difficulties should be renamed entirely or anything. I'm just pointing out that what it says on the HUD isn't a straight "EASY" "NORMAL" "HARD" "LUNATIC" like in MoF/SA/UFO, mostly because Cirno is Cirno. (Similar deal for "Loading Nau," "Ima Score," and I suppose in a way "Fairies are fighting...") If ZUN meant for them all to be translated as the basic difficulty names, he would've made them "Easy," "Lunatic," and "Extra" in katakana.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: HyperGumba on August 18, 2010, 06:15:13 PM
I see, this thread has progressed faster than I thought it would. Is a beta tester still needed? I've got Vista Home Premium, Service Pack 2 included.  :3
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on August 18, 2010, 07:53:44 PM
@anyone volunteering for beta testing: there isn't a patch yet, as far as I know, so beta testers won't be needed for a while yet?unfortunately, I don't have any experience with that kind of hacking, or I'd see about cooking one up, but as it is, we'll need to wait for one of our wonderful patch-people to put this all together.

Hm. No one felt like taking a crack at those help files? Well, I've finished reading Umineko now, so looks like I'm back on the spot.

help_00.png:
01. Gameplay

? Story
The ice fairy Cirno, restless as always.
One night while she was away, someone destroyed her home.
When she returned, she found a strange flag in the ruins.
It bore a picture of some fairies she remembered...
Enraged, Cirno took the flag and declared war on its owners.
This was the beginning of the Fairy War.
(For more detail, see "The Fairy War" in Touhou Sangessei ~ Strange and Bright Nature Deity volume two.)

? Rules
Using Cirno, defeat the the fairies (Sunny Milk, Luna Child, and Star Sapphire).

Cirno can freeze enemy danmaku.
Use this to establish yourself as the strongest fairy!


help_01.png:
02. Controlling Cirno

? Up/Down/Right/Left -- Move Cirno
? Shoot Key (Z) -- Shoot
Hold down  -- Ice Barrier
*The shooting function is not continuous in this game
? Rapid Key (C or Ctrl) -- Rapid-fire
? Bomb Key (X) -- Perfect Freeze
? Slow Key (Shift) -- Move slowly
* You will move slowly even if you tap the shoot key
? Pause Key (Esc) -- Pause


help_02.png:
03. Reading the screen
? Fighting Spirit
Cirno's mood.
Miss and it will fall by 100%.
Miss with less than 99% and you lose.

? Ice Power
The power required to form ice barriers.
It will normally increase slowly.

? Perfect Freeze
You can't use Perfect Freeze unless it's at 100%.

? Area Frozen
Total area of frozen enemy danmaku.
It is directly connected to the power of your shots.
If you can freeze a lot, your shots will be that much stronger.

? Level Decrease
The level of your shots.
Increase your area frozen, and the level will go up.


help_03.png:
04. Freeze the enemy!
"Don't these enemies have a little bit too much danmaku for fairies?"
That's true.
*Just think of it as what the danmaku looks like to Cirno, a weaker character.

But! Cirno won't lose to that.
She has a secret weapon.
Her "Ice Barrier" charge shots.

Ice attacks will only hit bullets which are very close to you, but they will freeze all of them.
Even if you get hit by frozen bullets, you won't get hurt.
When they ice breaks, the bullets disappear!
Also, frozen bullets will freeze other bullets which get too close.

If you aim your ice attacks at high-concentration areas of bullets, you can cause a chain reaction and completely freeze the enemy's danmaku.

When you get caught in a corner, use your head for Cirno and find effective ways to make patterns out of frozen bullets!


help_04.png:
05. Ice Power!
You can't always release ice barriers at full power. Even idiots get tired.

You can only release them if your Ice Power (which slowly recharges) is above 30%.

If it is near 100%, your ice will last longer.
At 30%, it will only last an instant.

When you release an ice barrier, your Ice Power will drop to 0%.

Recharging your Ice Power:
? It will slowly recharge over time (slow)
? Hit bosses with your shots (hitting bosses is quite fast)
? Defeat small fairies (instantly recharges)
? Graze enemy bullets (difficult, but essential for metagamers[?])
? Continue to save up (faster recharge than normal) (?? really not sure what this means; someone who's played the game please help)


help_05.png:
]06. Watch out for special bullets!
"Don't chain reactions from ice barriers just mean an easy win?"

No, no, your enemies are idiots, too, but they do have countermeasures.
Beware of the attacks listed below!

?Burning bullets
These bullets cannot be frozen. They will pass through ice and come flying at you, so be careful.

? Lasers
They will break through ice!
When the ice breaks, shards will go flying, and if you get hit by these, it will count as a miss.
Make sure not to stand nearby when lasers break through ice!


help_06.png:
07. Ice is an area!
Rather than freezing lots of bullets around Cirno, it is better to freeze bullets spread out over a wide area.

When the game screen is completely covered, the percentage of bullets frozen because a bonus.
Rather than aiming for the instant when the bullets are released, letting them spread out for a while will result in a larger area frozen.

Total area frozen is your total starting from stage one.
If you break your record, your shot level will go up.

When bosses are hard to defeat, just freeze so that you cover the greatest area!


help_07.png:
08. Other things!
Raising your Fighting Spirit:
? freeze enemy bullets
? damage enemies
(Damage from ice will raise your Fighting Spirit more than damage from shots)
Each 100% is like having an extra life. The highest it can be is 1000%.

Raising your Perfect Freeze:
? Freeze enemy bullets
It won't go above 100%, so use it right away!

Perfect Freeze will freeze the entire screen.
It also can freeze flaming danmaku.
Make no mistake, it's perfect!


help_08.png:
09. I don't get it
What's with this game, it's too hard, I can't figure out the controls, the dialogue doesn't make sense, I don't get it.

What kind of walkthrough should I make this?
If it's not working, watch some demo playthroughs.
If you wait at the title screen, it will show demo playthroughs.

You can also see explanations of the controls on the boss screens of replays.

The dialogue doesn't make sense because they are fairies.
Once the war is over, they will probably forget everything they've said.


help_09.png appears to be from Double Spoiler.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: king of the shrooms on August 20, 2010, 01:44:07 AM
the game hasn't been out for a week (i don't think so at least) and you guys already started on an english patch?!?!? 
you guys are the best ever!!!!!!
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on August 20, 2010, 04:37:21 AM
And with this, I believe, all the images will be translated. I think we need someone to edit the English text onto the images? Would be nice if that were done before work on the patch itself starts (which is to say, I don't want to do it myself).

rank00.png: Way easy! I said not to treat me like an idiot.
rank01.png: Pretty easy!
rank02.png: It's hard?but I'm not giving up!
rank03.png: This is crazy! I'll clean this up with ice! (not sure what "gekimuzu" means--maybe some sort of contraction of "撃難しい"? But that doesn't make much sense)
stage00.png: Magic Forest
stage01.png: Misty Lake
stage02.png: Spring Paths
stage03.png: "*fixed difficulty" "Wondrous Path of Midnight Cherries"
stage03b.png: Can't play here yet
title_ed.png: "Good work!" "With that, you've cleared the game! You're the stronges t!" "Portrait art: Hirasaka Makoto" "Game: ZUN"
title_logo.png: "Great Fairy War"
title06.png: [just the titles of the help images, in order]

?and that should be all the images. Off to play Folklore now--hopefully some kind soul will get this all into a patch soon!

edit: oooh, right, forgot to say. I'm not really paying attention to how this stuff sounds in English, so please do copy edit all this to your hearts' content.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 20, 2010, 02:12:29 PM
If nobody else wants to do it, I could do the image editing. I'm good at things like that, even if I've never done it for a translation specifically. I think it would be neat to help out on something like this - I can't do any of the technical work or actual translating, so this is the only thing I could do.

Also: Yay vgperson, your translations are always really good.

Example:
(http://a.imageshack.us/img841/32/logoa12e.png)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on August 20, 2010, 04:02:09 PM
If you're willing, that would be great! That one there looks very good--my one nitpick is that the font for the bottom two lines looks a little too square and the text is a little small, but maybe others think differently, so who knows.

Thank you!
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 20, 2010, 04:10:54 PM
Japanese text uses many less characters than English text, so the translated text has to be small or it won't fit. I also had to pick a font that would be easy to read at that size, and with the flashing effect ZUN uses that switches between those two lines. I could have just made the animation different (less color difference, so the flashing is less harsh), but I want it to keep the overall font/feel/colors that ZUN originally used.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Savory on August 20, 2010, 04:15:32 PM
That explains why I couldn't freeze those weird meteor bullets.

I'd offer to help with testing but I'm not sure if I'd be able to view everything. This game is pretty tough. I only get so far as the final battle and I keep getting blasted by bullets.  Then again, I'd just have to check out most of what I can.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Dizzy H. "Muffin" Muffin on August 20, 2010, 08:17:33 PM
I can offer haxcheats that'll give you infinite lives, bombs, and power, if skill-levels interfere with the testing ... :3
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on August 20, 2010, 08:20:19 PM
Hi. I'm working on the Spell Card pages on the Touhou Wiki, and I am in need of some translations. Some I have taken from T. Solamarle in this forum, and others I have used online resources. If you guys can translate/double-check the following that would be great. This way we'll keep the patch and the wiki as consistent as possible. Thank you.

流星 ("Shooting Star" or "Meteor"?)
星粒 (Stardust?)
日熱 (Sun/Moon/Starblaze?)
協力技 ("Cooperation" or "Cooperative Technique"?)
光精 ("Pure Light" or "Light Fairy"?)
瞬光
降光
光壁 (Light Wall?)
ハイパーインクレクション (Hyper Incorrection? Most Japanese sites I've checked on Google gives me this.)
激光
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 20, 2010, 11:08:16 PM
Unless I'm missing something, nobody has posted translations for the bottom part of front00.png (everything below the numbers and "Failed"), except the difficulty names. Could someone translate those in order for me?

Also, is it okay if I leave the menu options the same, since they all have English subtitles anyway? I'm also leaving other things that already have English equivalents, like the text in the very top-left of the game screen that just says "Fairy Wars."
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on August 21, 2010, 12:13:59 AM
Currently reading over the English translations posted in this thread for errors. There's some minor formatting stuff and word choice. I'll post the total findings when all the English is up.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 21, 2010, 12:22:55 AM
Kiefmaster:
Shooting Star would be more literal, but either one's fine.
星屑 is much more common for "stardust," though I can't think of a good alternative that would distinguish it, so I think you might as well go with that.
Blaze sounds fine.
Team Tech is probably the shortest/nicest way of putting it.
Pretty sure that'd be Light Fairy, given Cirno is sometimes called a 氷精. (If anything, it'd be Light Spirit, not Pure Light.)
Twinkling Light.
Falling Light.
Definitely Light Wall.
I don't know what the card looks like, but it's awfully close to "Inflection," which sounds a bit more sensible. So... I'm not really sure.
Intense/Violent Light. (Also kinda depends on what the card is like.)

Azure:
Pretty sure no previous patches have bothered changing the menu options when they already have English under them.

A number of these are just leftover from previous games, but anyway, the bottom part of front00.png:

Spell Bonus!!
(Challenge Next Stage!)
Perfect Freeze Active ("Available"? "Usable"? It's what shows up when you pass a multiple of 100%)
(Hiscore!)
Extend!
(Item Get Border Line!)

Left of the UFOs:
Simple
Normal (or since it's in hiragana, might be worth intentionally misspelling, like "Normul")
Hard
Maddening
Extra (or "Bonus," as I mentioned earlier)

Above the UFOs:
Attack Clear Time
Actual Time (not sure where these are used, though, so...)

Spell Bonus Failed...
GREAT FAIRY WARS Demo Play
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 21, 2010, 12:30:59 AM
vgperson: Thanks! "Attack clear time" and "Real time" are used after you beat a spellcard. I think it's been like that since TH11.

Tengukami: Don't worry about the stuff like that for the image-related translations (unless it's changing misleading/wrong information), since I have all that covered. I just finished the help files, as well as other small things not worth uploading yet. Can someone read through it to make sure it's all correct? I made some changes from the initial translation so it fits better and makes more sense, but I want to make sure I didn't break anything.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 21, 2010, 12:32:46 AM
In the cases where a previous game already has the applicable image, just use that.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on August 21, 2010, 12:47:03 AM
Some minor stuff from help - corrections emboldenated:

"Don't these enemies fire a few too many bullets?"

"However! Cirno won't lose to that."

"When the ice breaks, the bullets disappear."

"but they do have counter-measures."

That's about all I caught.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on August 21, 2010, 01:06:13 AM
@vgperson

Thank you very much. Time to make some updates.

Edit: Few more checks with some context this time.

障光「ムーンライトウォール」 (Harmful Light? The card itself is Moonlight Wall, and other resources are giving me 'hindering', 'impediment', obstacle' as well, which may be more fitting.)
光星 "Orion Belt/Great Triangle" (Bright Star?)
瞬光 (Twinkling Light) "Fatal Flash". Perhaps there might be a more appropriate synonym? Sunny uses this card.
激光「サンバースト」 (Violent/Intense Light "Sunburst"). Bullets spawn in a circle, then pause for a sec, before speeding up to the player. I guess I'll use Violent.

閉符「ビッグクランチ」 (Terminus? "Big Crunch")
マスタースパークのような懐中電灯 (Master Spark-like Flashlight)
ブレイジングスターのような鬼ごっこ (Blazing Star-like Tag)
妖精尽滅光 (Fairy Destruction Ray)

"Hyper Incorrection" works similarly to "Rutile Flection". Sunny puts up a field that alters the velocity of any bullets passing through it (direction change and speeding up), so Inflection is a possible guess.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 21, 2010, 03:42:13 AM
I'd go with something closer to Harmful (Malicious?), mostly because those other synonyms sorta imply solidity, and I think I would've heard about ZUN making a spellcard with walls. "Meddling" could work too, I guess.
Bright and Light can probably be interchanged in most cases. And in this one, "Light Star" sounds a little redundant, so yeah, that's fine. (Or you could go with "Shining.")
More like ultraviolent light, am I right? (Er, yeah, that's fine.)

Terminus Sign or Terminal Sign sounds okay.
It's either that or "-esque." Or "Master Sparkish." Or "Master Sparky." But, uh, I'd probably go with -esque. (EDIT: Actually, wait, I think "-Style" sounds best.)
Switching it around to Tag With a Blazing Star (or would it be "As" from Marisa's perspective?) sounds better.
That's fine, but maybe make it Annihilation. (I'd say Extermination, but Marisa reserves that exclusively for youkai, I'm sure.)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 21, 2010, 05:22:40 AM
-You obviously haven't played B2. It's a wall. Blocking Light might work.
-Literally, it's Closed Sign. It sounds a bit weird, however. Not sure where "Terminus" came from.
-No. Master Spark-esque, or Master Spark-like.
-No. Blazing Star-esque, or Blazing Star-like. They should use the same wording.
-I wouldn't. Fairy Destruction Ray is fine.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Serela on August 21, 2010, 05:25:47 AM
-Literally, it's Closed Sign. It sounds a bit weird, however. Not sure where "Terminus" came from.
Terminus might have been more accurately as Terminal, like a terminal disease, as it's referring to a form of the universe where it'll blahblahblah. Terminate also would make sense. Closed fits but is a bit weird, yeah, as in literally Closed Universe and Open Universe.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Polaris on August 21, 2010, 07:02:47 PM
I preferred "Cooperation" over "Team Tech" for 協力技, but that's mainly because I've never seen "tech" used as a abbreviation for "technique". But "Cooperation" isn't that accurate either, so maybe just "Team Technique", although would that be too long? :x

For 閉符, "Terminate Sign" seems to make sense over "Terminus", although I wouldn't mind "Closure Sign" either.

For 障光, "Hindering Light" makes sense given the spell card, and is much more accurate than "Harmful Light". "Blocking Light" is accurate, but to me it sounds lame. :P

For 瞬光, maybe "Flickering Light?" If I recall correctly, the spell card imitates flickering more than twinkling, and the latter seems more like it would be for Star anyway.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on August 21, 2010, 11:16:54 PM
Thanks guys, really appreciate the comments.

Between Hindering Light or Blocking Light, I'll use Hindering.
Bright Star is good as is.
Using Flickering Light.
Regarding 閉符, the problem I have with Terminus/Terminal is that it has more to do with 'Ending' rather than 'Closing', thus it could be misinterpreted. There's already an Ending Sign in existence. I am under the impression that Big Crunch is the spiritual opposite of Open Universe as well. So, it's either Closed, Closure, or Closing I guess.
Master Spark-like and Blazing Star good as is.
Fairy Destruction Ray good as is.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 22, 2010, 12:28:21 AM
Progress on the image editing: very close to finishing. Give me a few more days and it should be done.

title/result00 and title/stageft.png doesn't seem to be translated by anyone yet, though. I think I understand most of it (the route names and difficulty and such are obvious, and I think I understand about half of the rest), but I want to make sure. Also, should I make a full English logo in the same style for the big title screen logo, or is it fine to just leave it or overlay text? I think I could do the full logo translation if I tried, but I'm not sure how well it would come out. It's the last thing I'll do in either case, since everyone playing would already know the title of the game, so it's not too important.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 22, 2010, 01:23:09 AM
result00: Route A1 through C2 and EX, Nitori Kawashiro, Easy, Normal, Hard, Lunatic, Extra, Total Play Count, Play Time, Clear Count, and "Confirm Button: Switch between scores/spellcards"...

...Wait, what's Nitori doing there?!

stageft: Difficulty, Route A1 through C2 and EX, Highest Score, Cleared!, (numbers), Easy, Normal, Hard, Lunatic.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Lord Phantasm Satori on August 22, 2010, 02:12:54 AM
Nitori?! there's no nitori in that game!... :ohdear:
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 22, 2010, 02:36:49 AM
It's leftovers from SA. It was present in UFO too.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 22, 2010, 03:54:02 AM
Wooo, image editing done! If anyone has any translation/graphic suggestions or finds a bug (like cut-off text when it's inserted), just tell me. I'm glad to help with this project, since fairies are so awesome! Yay fairies!

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?b572igy614itp9d (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?b572igy614itp9d)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 22, 2010, 05:42:21 AM
(http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/3432/workso.png)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kyaksa on August 22, 2010, 05:46:10 AM
why does cirno has such brushy eyebrows now?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: nintendonut888 on August 22, 2010, 05:52:10 AM
why does cirno has such brushy eyebrows now?

In Lotus Land Story, the stage 2 boss, Kurumi, is unique among bosses in that she fires a single (and uncommonly a double) shot before the dialogue. Thinking that this would give her the edge, Cirno placed two icicle danmaku on her face, keeping them in reserve to damage the bosses. In her rush to fight each fairy though, she forgets to ever use this weapon.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Lord Phantasm Satori on August 22, 2010, 06:07:59 AM
In Lotus Land Story, the stage 2 boss, Kurumi, is unique among bosses in that she fires a single (and uncommonly a double) shot before the dialogue. Thinking that this would give her the edge, Cirno placed two icicle danmaku on her face, keeping them in reserve to damage the bosses. In her rush to fight each fairy though, she forgets to ever use this weapon.

you=win.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: grgspunk on August 22, 2010, 06:32:35 AM
(http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/3432/workso.png)

What about the Japanese text "Rank select"?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 22, 2010, 06:51:54 AM
What about the Japanese text "Rank select"?
(http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/5043/works.png)

Happy now, bitch? :P
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on August 22, 2010, 07:46:23 PM
Looking at the files now:

loading.png
 - I don't see 大/"Great" in the original, so why in the TL?
 - In the original, there is なう (nau) after "loading". I am inclined to think this actually means "Now". So either "Now" should be present, or the original left in.

face03/ename.png
 - I would put an 's' after 'star'. Also because the image shows such.

music00.png
 - See wiki for changes/updates

front00.png
 - Typo (Normal)
 - I think "Extra" can still fit with "omake". Extra does mean "something additional". With regards to Simple/Easy and Maddening/Lunatic, if they are close enough in meaning, then Easy and Lunatic could just take over. But I'll leave that up to the translators to figure out.

help_02.png
- "Miss with less than 99%" implies that getting hit at 99% will not make you lose. Unless this is some special exception, it should be "Miss with 99% or less".

help_09.png
 - Doesn't this need to be translated?

result00.png
 - Aww, Nitori's gone, even though the UFO cast is still in the other page.
 - The fact that ZUN uses hiragana for the stages and katakana for the results is mind-boggling.
 - Spell card is two separate words.

That all I can find right now.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 22, 2010, 08:00:29 PM
loading.png
 - I don't see 大/"Great" in the original, so why in the TL?
 - In the original, there is なう (nau) after "loading". I am inclined to think this actually means "Now". So either "Now" should be present, or the original left in.
- I just thought it looked better and made more sense. If people say otherwise, I'll take it out, though.
 - I couldn't find the font he used for "Loading", so "now" would end up in a different font. I figured that it doesn't lose any meaning just from removing なう, so I took the lazy way that time. (Hey, I just finished re-making some of the images from scratch to get the Japanese text off the background, so cut me some slack.)
face03/ename.png
 - I would put an 's' after 'star'. Also because the image shows such.
Okay, that's simple enough. I was thinking about that too, but wasn't sure if it would make sense or not.
music00.png
 - See wiki for changes/updates

front00.png
 - Typo (Normal)
 - I think "Extra" can still fit with "omake". Extra does mean "something additional". With regards to Simple/Easy and Maddening/Lunatic, if they are close enough in meaning, then Easy and Lunatic could just take over. But I'll leave that up to the translators to figure out.
music00: Okay, I was just going by the translations that were posted here. I didn't know there were updated ones on the wiki.
front00: vgperson said so, and I like his other translations, so I went with it. "Normal" was written in katakana in the original, which implies childishness, so this was close in meaning. "Extra" isn't written the same way there as it is everywhere else, so he suggested using a different word.
help_02.png
- "Miss with less than 99%" implies that getting hit at 99% will not make you lose. Unless this is some special exception, it should be "Miss with 99% or less".
Yeah, bad word choice there. Thanks for pointing it out.
help_09.png
 - Doesn't this need to be translated?
It's from Double Spoiler, and not used in Fairy Wars.
result00.png
 - Aww, Nitori's gone, even though the UFO cast is still in the other page.
 - The fact that ZUN uses hiragana for the stages and katakana for the results is mind-boggling.
 - Spell card is two separate words.
- Yeah, but nobody will notice. Poor Nitori.
 - I agree.
 - Bad habit. I'll fix it.

Thanks for the feedback.

Edit: Version 2
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?j9o1u1p935tethn (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?j9o1u1p935tethn)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 22, 2010, 09:17:07 PM
The loading image says "Fairies are fighting/warring..." in contrast to the usual "Maidens are praying..." Thing is, I don't recall anybody ever bothering to translate the loading image before. Either way, making it the title of the game seems odd.

"Nau" is a silly (and possibly Twitter-inspired) addition in Japanese, but since adding "now" has no such effect in English, I think it's fine to keep it as "Loading." Unless you made it something like "Loadin' on up!", but eh.

"Noma~ru" is in hiragana as opposed to the standard katakana for English words, but yeah. It's sorta like when people have Cirno writing her name in hiragana and she gets the "chi" backwards, thus "Saruno."

Easy and Extra (especially Extra) are close enough in meaning, I suppose, but I dunno, "Maddening" seems a bit further off from "Lunatic." (Technically it implies that you've being driven mad rather than that you're already mad...)

I forgot to mention earlier, but a couple of the ending images (OH MAN)
have romanji words on them.
Someone going to edit those?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on August 22, 2010, 09:23:47 PM
Really don't want to see "Loadin' on up!" please. "Loading" is fine.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 22, 2010, 09:30:05 PM
The loading image says "Fairies are fighting/warring..." in contrast to the usual "Maidens are praying..." Thing is, I don't recall anybody ever bothering to translate the loading image before. Either way, making it the title of the game seems odd.
That's what happens when I do the editing at 1AM. I'll see what I can do, but I'll wait until I know everything else is fine before I make a version 3.

I forgot to mention earlier, but a couple of the ending images (OH MAN)
have romanji words on them.
Someone going to edit those?
I could do those, too.
"Shine!" is already in English, but I could remove the middle dot if it's needed. "DON!" is just a sound effect, but how could it be translated? And what is "Ryokai!"? I know very basic Japanese, but I'd rather have someone better than me doing the actual translating.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 22, 2010, 09:32:12 PM
Ryokai = Yessir / Roger / Got it
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 22, 2010, 09:39:57 PM
No,
Cirno is challenging Aya, so that's "Shine!" not as in what the sun does, but as in "You die!"
The other shows up in the text, and I translated it as "Roger that!", but I've yet to get the ending translations checked by anybody here, so maybe it should wait just in case.

Even in context, I'm not really sure what kind of sound effect that is. Keeping it is probably fine.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on August 22, 2010, 11:26:57 PM
Just leave the 'nau' hiragana in then. English players will just look at 'Loading' and ignore the 'nau', while those able to read Japanese will appreciate the silly 'nau'.

Nomaru might be a bad attempt at a pun by ZUN. No + maru. Turn 'no' sideways -> 9 circle. But that's really stretching it.

Regarding music00.png. The wiki lists the correct titles of the music. In particular, you have now corrected ZUN's amusing Faily typo. I'm not sure if you want to preserve this typo, even in the English version, but just so you know. I'll leave that at your discretion.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 22, 2010, 11:30:10 PM
I still think it was intentional.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 23, 2010, 01:19:59 AM
I find it hard to believe it's intentional given it's Fairy in some places but Faily in others (and both spellings show up at the same time in the music room). Regardless, if somebody played the patch not knowing anything about the matter, I think their first assumption would be that it's the patch's fault rather than ZUN's fault/intent. But, your call.

You could add "[sic]", I suppose, but man would that be weird. The SA patch had a bracketed translator's note about "cat cart" for Be of Good Cheer!, but in a song title...?

(Speaking of nine-ball puns, I don't think I've seen anyone mention that the manual page numbers are preceded by circles, and thus "O9" could actually be read "marukyuu." Oh, ZUN.)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: nintendonut888 on August 23, 2010, 01:56:49 AM
ZUN was the one who started the (9) meme in the PoFV manual, so likely this was meant to be more of a throwback to that rather than capitalize on the status of the meme (though he obviously knows that's how it would go anyway).
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on August 27, 2010, 09:07:13 AM
Okay, since nobody mentioned any other corrections, here's the hopefully-final version of the image replacements. (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?o91czbczqtl3mb5) I tried editing the text on the ending pictures, but I couldn't quite get the style right, so it always stood out - if anyone else wants to take a shot at it, go ahead. I also did a few other minor changes, like the numbers that are presumably used for score items, and outlining the English pause menu text to make it stand out a bit more (I know a friend of mine who was playing the IN translation but didn't even notice there was English text on the menus, so I wanted to fix that for this game).
I was going to replace the pause menu text completely, but I noticed that the English text locations don't match up exactly with the Japanese ones, so I would probably screw it up. If people agree that it would be better with fully-translated menus, just say so and provide a quick translation, and I'll change it.

Also, how is the rest of the progress on this going?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on August 27, 2010, 05:30:50 PM
Well, I'm still under the opinion of leaving nau in since it's not a detriment to English players.

With regards to "Faily", I'm casting my support for preserving the typo. The typo is fairly well known now. Those who haven't played the game yet will learn about ZUN's typo, and even if they think it's the patch's fault will be told otherwise. I would want to avoid a similar "missing Dead parrot" problem.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Maav on August 27, 2010, 08:08:28 PM
With regards to "Faily", I'm casting my support for preserving the typo. The typo is fairly well known now. Those who haven't played the game yet will learn about ZUN's typo, and even if they think it's the patch's fault will be told otherwise. I would want to avoid a similar "missing Dead parrot" problem.
Readme files exist for that. (In that case, saying it's not a typo, but it's the actual name)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: lumber_of_the_beast on August 27, 2010, 08:56:33 PM
What's wrong with including an option to leave the typo in or not, and leave it up to the discretion of the individual player?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Lord Phantasm Satori on August 27, 2010, 09:02:22 PM
yeah, one patch with the typo, and another without. much easier than argueing about it
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 27, 2010, 09:10:55 PM
It seems kind of silly to have an option just for a single letter change, but whatever.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on August 27, 2010, 10:48:18 PM
@lumber_of_the_beast, Lord Phantasm Satori
Yeah, as Drake said, to have an option for a single letter change is silly. I would prefer to have one patch with the correction than two patches with different translations. Having more than one patch/option just complicates things and confuses.

The solution suggested by Maav sounds feasible.

Again, I just want to avoid another "Dead parrot" scenario, and minimize as many "lost in translation"s as possible.

Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on August 27, 2010, 11:12:54 PM
I can live with the README scenario.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on August 27, 2010, 11:54:31 PM
Okay, maybe kinda late on this, but the images have C2-3 as "Fairies' Lovely Night" when Nazerine intended it to be "Fairies' Lively Night." (It's literally "Noisy," but whichever you want.)

"Flower Arrangement" in A2-2 is literally "Flowerpath," and since it isn't referring to floristry but this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanamichi), I think that would be the better translation. (Or maybe it should just stay "hanamichi"? Seems a bit too obscure for that.)

Also, the images keep saying "Magic Forest," but I'm pretty sure "Forest of Magic" is the way it's typically translated.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on August 28, 2010, 02:35:40 AM
I'd go with Hanamichi. I think people know to look this stuff up on Wikipedia if they're stumped, and even failing that, it can go in the above readme.

I can never remember whether it's translated as "Forest of Magic" or "Magic Forest," so you're probably right. That should be changed.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Maav on August 28, 2010, 02:50:44 AM
I can never remember whether it's translated as "Forest of Magic" or "Magic Forest," so you're probably right. That should be changed.
It's Forest of Magic.
Btw, I'm trying to repack the dat. No success yet. ;x
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: lumber_of_the_beast on August 28, 2010, 04:01:45 AM
For the record, if it's gotta be one or the other, I vote in favor of typo correction.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 28, 2010, 04:47:58 AM
Btw, I'm trying to repack the dat. No success yet. ;x
http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,6872.msg418023.html#msg418023
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on August 28, 2010, 04:57:50 AM
I'm guessing Drake would be the guy to go to for packing the .dat file.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Drake on August 28, 2010, 05:12:37 AM
Not for actually making the application to apply the patch, I'm just saying I can pack images to test if needed. Packing the images into anm files is actually much more time-consuming anyways.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Maav on August 28, 2010, 03:56:51 PM
Not for actually making the application to apply the patch, I'm just saying I can pack images to test if needed. Packing the images into anm files is actually much more time-consuming anyways.
I see.
I can pack the .anm's if it's gonna be any help... A LOT of free time
err. I mean, UNUSED time
here.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Neo Aemilius on September 04, 2010, 07:31:59 AM
Who translate in-game text ?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: StrikerX22 on September 09, 2010, 10:42:16 PM
Happy Cirno Day guys, I'm guessing this won't be released today? =P Well if there's anything I can help with, let me know. I have some university education (crappy bachelor's)  and minor translation experience; if possible I'd like a say in making it look natural, which should be a focus sometimes above being entirely accurate. That being said, I'm pretty picky about accuracy usually.

If there's anything in particular I should refer to in this thread, please let me know. I'll read it all if I have to, but I'd rather not wade through the differing opinions and information immediately unless I really need to now. But if there's still any somewhat unresolved translation choices, I'd especially like a look at that.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: N-Forza on September 09, 2010, 11:45:36 PM
To be honest, the final hold-up is all on the technical end. All the translation has been done afaik.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 10, 2010, 12:11:54 AM
Okay, just as a clarification, since I want this to be as high-quality as possible.

1. We're going to leave it "Faily Wars" and leave a note in the readme?

2. Nobody voiced an opinion on translating the menu options (continue, give up and retry, etc) since the English is already on them. I personally think it would be nice if those were fully translated, but I'd need some help since the small text doesn't match up perfectly with the Japanese in some cases. If nobody else shows interest in it though, I'll just leave it, since the other English patches didn't bother with those either.

4. Just leave "Loading なう" as it is, right?

3. Aside from that, the only problems with the images are the ones in vgperson's last post, correct?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Maav on September 10, 2010, 12:38:21 AM
Okay, just as a clarification, since I want this to be as high-quality as possible.

1. We're going to leave it "Faily Wars" and leave a note in the readme?

2. Nobody voiced an opinion on translating the menu options (continue, give up and retry, etc) since the English is already on them. I personally think it would be nice if those were fully translated, but I'd need some help since the small text doesn't match up perfectly with the Japanese in some cases. If nobody else shows interest in it though, I'll just leave it, since the other English patches didn't bother with those either.

4. Just leave "Loading なう" as it is, right?

3. Aside from that, the only problems with the images are the ones in vgperson's last post, correct?
My oppinions:
1. Yeah.
2. No translation would be the best. Maybe fixing the "Yes Yes Yes" in the retry screen.
4. Yeah, too.
3. Nothing else I've noticed.

P.S.:
1. 2. 4. 3.?  :V
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 10, 2010, 12:43:01 AM
1. 2. 4. 3.?  :V
I've had a total of 2 hours of sleep in the past two days, so I apologize.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: StrikerX22 on September 10, 2010, 12:56:37 AM
Good to hear it's coming to a close.

As long as the title screen gets a proper translation it won't be so bad to have a weird "faily" typo, though it's pretty stupid. But in the music room, if you click the song, it actually shows Fairy Wars in the lower description part... it's almost as if it were intentional there. Hard to say, but yeah it's safer to leave it.

I never did know why it said "dead parrot." How do you get that from make-inu? heh.

So the technical issue, does it seem difficult to work with, or is there actually a chance to have this released today-ish?

[Edit: Also, stupid suggestion: nau could be taken as "NAO" to at least translate it funny in a way. If it's possible, you could leave the hiragana behind so that we still know where it came from.]
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on September 10, 2010, 01:47:14 AM
@Azure Lazuline: yeah, my preference would be to leave the menu text as-is--just stick with the tradition. I'd also leave the "Yes Yes Yes" (I think it's funny), but maybe that's just me.

@StrikerX22: what NForza said. Though, I did do the help file translations pretty quickly and without going back to check them over (dialogue should be okay, vgperson did that on the wiki), so if you're really dying to do something???
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on September 10, 2010, 01:57:15 AM
I don't think it's so much a technical "issue" as there's no one who knows HOW to insert the text or make a patching program around at the moment. (Images, though, we've apparently got.) But I don't know how these things have gone down in the past, other than a recollection that some past patches have been severely held up due to a lack of said person.

Regarding "all the translation has been done," does anyone in particular want to edit my ending translations, or should I just send what I've got straight to the aforementioned compiler-person? (I've got screencaps too, if necessary.)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on September 10, 2010, 02:50:46 AM
gensokyo.org's released one already.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on September 10, 2010, 03:11:42 AM
Kudos to them, then. I guess in future I should keep an eye on translation efforts at the wiki, as well as here--the fact that Halbarad et al and I did the same stuff twice irks me.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: vgperson on September 10, 2010, 03:20:00 AM
Huh. Well.

Seeing as the patch program only credits NForza, BrassBird, and me as translators, which one of the other two did the endings? He did translate
the "unbeatable price fairy" pun in Ending 4 (B2)
correctly... right? Because if not, that will be my ONE REGRET.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: nintendonut888 on September 10, 2010, 03:36:12 AM
It changed Faily Wars, it sucks.

...

Just joking, it's awesome. :D Thanks for everyone's hard work, even those who didn't finish. Having a team being beaten in finishing a patch goes to show how much better off we are than back when there was nobody working on the patches.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on September 10, 2010, 03:50:13 AM
My only worry with correcting"Faily Wars" is that it masks a notable error, particularly to those who have never played Fairy Wars yet and are going straight to the patch. But whatever, it's fairly well known anyways, and minor.

They used some alt translations for some SC names, so more work for me.

They also went with Ruse Rain interestingly; I think that may make the most sense actually given the context of the comments.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 10, 2010, 04:23:46 AM
Okay, so since the other translation patch is out, that means that all my image editing work was wasted? I'm still happy the patch is out, it just kind of sucks for me... I'm not too sad, just a bit frustrated, I guess.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on September 10, 2010, 04:34:35 AM
It happens, Azure--I can't tell you how many times I've been asked to translate some manga so someone can do a scanlation release and then had the requester back out on their end of the deal and/or had another group release first.

Which is why I don't translate manga anymore.

Anyway, good work to everybody who worked on that version, and very nice timing indeed!
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: StrikerX22 on September 10, 2010, 05:54:56 AM
Well it's sad that it's for naught now. If it were manga, I'd still think it's worth it to have another release for preference, making a name for yourselves, competing in accuracy over speed etc.; but since it's a game that has to be patched and such, it does make it more complicated when different patches are introduced. You can always look over their work and make suggestions for a future update with the insights you've gained if you like, though.

I suppose with game patches, it's all the more important to look into who might already be involved before investing a lot.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: N-Forza on September 10, 2010, 06:22:54 AM
Oh, so they used the Wiki translations. I thought that's that you guys were doing anyway.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Prime 2.0 on September 10, 2010, 06:39:19 AM
What, you're going to throw in the towel to an incomplete patch?

(http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/2878/gensokyounfinished.png)

You folks give up way too easily, I swear. Gensokyo.org patches also have this annoying tendency to leave out specific translations(like staff roll headers), mess up others(The difficulty settings are NOT "easy normal hard lunatic" in fairy wars), and never come with any sort of documentation; furthermore, if the 12.3 patch is any indication, we cannot expect future releases to be made solely because of errors or editing quibbles... and frankly, you have to do it yourself if you want to get something done right.

You can do better, and I sincerely hope that you don't trash all the effort made towards a quality patch just because somebody else rushed theirs out for Cirno day.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Blumiere on September 10, 2010, 07:10:37 AM
I'd rather an English patch that's actually of good quality and accuracy rather than one rushed with glitches left behind so it could be released on a deadline to meet some stupid meme, so yes, I agree with Prime and hope you guys will still release your own translation patch of this game. No point in just giving up now when you all have basically got everything ready and have a better patch planned out.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 10, 2010, 07:25:29 AM
Honestly, I didn't even check the patch... I was just having a really bad day and overreacted. I was more mad about there not being any communication between the two groups doing patches, and I didn't even know that there was another one in progress. It would have been much better to combine the two groups and work together. Anyway, downloading the patch now to check how everything looks...


Okay, their route selection graphics and boss name pictures are better (only slightly so for the latter, though their translation for the EX boss's title is very weird). I'm not really fond of the fonts that are used in most places though, like the "level intro" cards and the sidebar, though that's just preference. The help screen could go either way, too, though I like the font they used for it in the main menu. As for the actual translation, at least concerning what was my job to edit:
- "True Time" instead of "Real Time" is stupid
- "Times Used" instead of "Times Played" is even more stupid
- "Barely a Victory" sounds weird
- "I'll purify it all in ice" for the Lunatic description doesn't make much sense
- "Motivation" instead of "Fighting Spirit"... not so bad, but I still prefer the latter, especially since "Motiv Down" for the beams is very awkward
- "Ice Area" instead of "Area Frozen" could go either way, I'm not sure about this one

They also just romanized the window name instead of translating it, which seems strange. Also, I did change the on-field score graphics for mine (I think I did, anyway). I'll fix the few remaining things in my images and edit this post when I'm done.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: trancehime on September 10, 2010, 07:25:58 AM
They also went with Ruse Rain interestingly; I think that may make the most sense actually given the context of the comments.

I was actually talking to some people with reference to that. There are far too many ways to interpret ルーズ, from Ruse to Lose to Loose (yes, the Japanese DO use that katakana for the word "loose," especially "loose socks"). It's not easy to pick the most correct translation while being accurate and with flavor at the same time.

Quote
You folks give up way too easily, I swear. Gensokyo.org patches also have this annoying tendency to leave out specific translations(like staff roll headers), mess up others(The difficulty settings are NOT "easy normal hard lunatic" in fairy wars), and never come with any sort of documentation; furthermore, if the 12.3 patch is any indication, we cannot expect future releases to be made solely because of errors or editing quibbles... and frankly, you have to do it yourself if you want to get something done right.

I can see complaining about some parts of untranslated content, but something as trivial as how many points you get for some things when most players in general DON'T PAY ATTENTION to it is a bit much.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: nintendonut888 on September 10, 2010, 07:34:56 AM
Chill out people (no pun intended). Isn't it a little sore to be badmouthing the patch? What inherently makes your translation better than theirs? Even if there's a couple typos here and there (and one point where they forgot a word entirely), I think the translation is very charming and does its job well.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: trancehime on September 10, 2010, 07:40:18 AM
There's also the part that untranslated content is probably untranslated for a reason: Nobody gives a shit whether it's translated or not :3c
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Prime 2.0 on September 10, 2010, 08:04:33 AM
There's also the part that untranslated content is probably untranslated for a reason: Nobody gives a shit whether it's translated or not :3c

I can see complaining about some parts of untranslated content, but something as trivial as how many points you get for some things when most players in general DON'T PAY ATTENTION to it is a bit much.

You didn't pay much attention to the PoFV patch backlash, did you?  :V

Some of the very same points that have been brought up against this patch are re-runs of the complaints against that(including the on-field score), which were promptly addressed under the scrutiny and feedback of the Shrinemaiden community, which isn't something we can expect to happen here.

Also, no thoughts on the point of documentation? I'm not sure how many people this actually occurs to, but restricting the ability to change text and images in the game to only the makers of the English patch runs counter to the entire point of expanding the audience (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=1316.0) that can fully enjoy the game's content. Why should anyone have to reinvent the wheel just to let people play the game in their native language?

Chill out people (no pun intended). Isn't it a little sore to be badmouthing the patch? What inherently makes your translation better than theirs?
Were it only a few errors, or only a lack of documentation, I wouldn't be so hissy about it. But put the two together, and a staunch fact of life comes in to make the whole debacle unacceptable; you can see what I'm referring to in this very topic.

As soon as a patch comes out, it becomes exceptionally harder to find willing people with the specialized skills necessary to do work on an alternative. Because this patch was rushed out, there is an extremely likely chance that a superior, and open patch that otherwise would have happened never will. In the long term, it is a detriment. I see no reason to hold my tongue when referring to something that so violently stagnates improvement in the international Touhou community; good enough is not good enough if it prevents something better.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 10, 2010, 08:07:22 AM
I'm not really badmouthing the patch as a whole. I think it's wonderful. I just think there's a few things that our patch is doing better and a couple very weird translations they used that could use improvement. Instead of fighting like a bunch of stupid fairies, we need to contact the gensokyo.org people and combine the best of both patches!

So here's my contribution, the final version of the image files (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?ak92j5pms8r395w) (and the .psd files are available on request if you like the style but need to fix a translation - feel free to edit them to your liking). I have no idea how to contact anyone at gensokyo.org, so someone else can tell them about this and get a team going. Perhaps take a vote on each of the images for which translation/edit is better?

I don't want to see any work go to waste - either ours or gensokyo.org's - but if they decide to be stubborn, we should just keep going and make this patch better, for the reasons that are being brought up.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: nintendonut888 on September 10, 2010, 08:10:56 AM
And pray tell what is so wrong with the patch? I have played four of the six routes and extra as well, and the single greatest mistake I see is that in Cirno's last line before the 3 fairies fight in A2 she forgets a word, one that can easily be filled in. Sure a version 1.01 to fix these minor mistakes would be appreciated, but what is so horrific and unforgivable again? Cirno's dialogue is delightfully hammy, as I imagine it was meant to be, and the three fairies have nice dialogue as well.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: trancehime on September 10, 2010, 08:24:51 AM
To be honest, I have little reason to care about using translation patches because quite simply - what use do I have for that? I can enjoy the games without needing it. So to address the first point - No, I did not pay attention to that "PoFV patch backlash" simply because I was never around to see it. Forgive me for my "uneducated" opinion, then. The only reason I DID get the PoFV patch was because other people insisted I get it for netplay. Otherwise I would never have used it.

Apparently this entire deal is from a technical standpoint, so I'm going to bow out before I force words into people's mouths. I would only ever complain about a translation of the actual translation itself were of a shitty quality, but from what I see, it's perfectly fine.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Prime 2.0 on September 10, 2010, 08:30:46 AM
Sure a version 1.01 to fix these minor mistakes would be appreciated, but what is so horrific and unforgivable again?
The occasional mistranslation or odd translation in supporting text, untranslated stuff such as the on-field score indications, the lack of documentation(You'll notice I dedicated an entire paragraph to the reason for this one), but mainly that rushing this patch out for Cirno day makes getting help to develop a patch for the game more difficult, which combined with the historical lack of post-release support from gensokyo.org means that nothing will be fixed, or improved. You may have noticed that the latter point was the thesis of my argument.

Look, I just don't want the people working on this patch to give up just because somebody else already made theirs. We shouldn't have a flame war over the semantics of that.

I don't want to see any work go to waste - either ours or gensokyo.org's - but if they decide to be stubborn, we should just keep going and make this patch better, for the reasons that are being brought up.
This sentiment, to me, is ideal.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 10, 2010, 08:31:39 AM
Regardless of whether gensokyo.org's patch was good or bad, I still see no reason why we can't complete our own.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: trancehime on September 10, 2010, 08:36:24 AM
Look, I just don't want the people working on this patch to give up just because somebody else already made theirs. We shouldn't have a flame war over the semantics of that.

I don't think anyone who was already working on it here plans to give up ANYWAY so what exactly is getting your panties in a twist aside from what you've mentioned? DDD:
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on September 10, 2010, 02:56:18 PM
Assuming you guys are still up to finishing the translation, there are some SC translations, which for the sake of consistency b/w the two patches, should be changed. The differences are mostly just using synonyms.

Light Wall "Wall Break" -> Light Barrier "Wall Break"
Sun/Moon/Starblaze -> Sun/Moon/Starfire

Loose Rain -> Ruse Rain (See prev note. Also yeah, there are at least 3 x 2 ways this could be translated [Lose/Loose/Ruse + Rain/Reign]. Prankish indeed ZUN. Though ZUN using 'prank' in the comment does suggest 'Ruse' is more fitting.)


There may be more changes; I'll let you guys know if I see more.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on September 10, 2010, 03:20:44 PM
@Prime 2.0: chill, man, chill. As TranceHime said (and Azure just demonstrated--thanks, Azure!), no one who was already working on this patch has just thrown in the towel and moved on.
The problem being that the one person we need now--someone to actually make the patch--has been missing from the start.

@NForza: oh. I was wondering why you never posted in this topic. I guess that explains it, then.

@Kiefmaster: thanks!

So, basically, we need someone who can build a patch. And then I think we'll want some number of people to test it out and make sure there are no errors whatsoever. And then we want to put together one heck of a README. Otherwise, it'll be no "better" than gensokyo.org's, so it'll just be a source of confusion.
Anybody interested?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 10, 2010, 03:22:38 PM
Maybe I've been out of the loop here, but, where's drywall been?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Maav on September 10, 2010, 04:27:57 PM
I've had a total of 2 hours of sleep in the past two days, so I apologize.
Haha, I see.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on September 10, 2010, 06:10:14 PM
Maybe I've been out of the loop here, but, where's drywall been?
I haven't seen him since the DS patch came out--I assume he's busy with other stuff.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Dizzy H. "Muffin" Muffin on September 10, 2010, 06:17:44 PM
They also put "Who do you think I am, anyway?" instead of "Who the hell do you think I am!? (http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/277485/)" (danbooru warning)
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: StrikerX22 on September 10, 2010, 11:43:42 PM
I'm pretty annoyed with the people telling Prime to chill. I think the posts in question were passionate yes, but tasteful and logical. I agree with his points. But I also think that it's important that you try to get a working relationship with the other team so that you can actually release an update and not an alternative. This is important to the community if you truly wish to expand it, not only in making it not confusing for players and also being high quality so that they're pleased with it (a reason to take out "Faily," out of professionalism over [sic]ing as if it were a sacred but likely inaccurate text), but furthermore to increase the awareness of fellow potential team members for the future. Above all, civility is the only way to do that and to get certain things done your way (if better) if you try to cooperate. That's when simple passion can create problems, but not here.

I do believe you should attempt to finish your patch, if not just to say "look, we actually finished it." Putting accomplishments under your belt is always important and this one is close to being complete, even if it can still be improved here and there. Perfection is a goal now, I'd say, over getting it out quickly, so yeah be careful.

Is there a list of the Japanese and your translations side by side anywhere like the wiki? I'd like to be able to compare translations some time if so. Otherwise it'll be troublesome.
Title: 12.8 english patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 10, 2010, 11:48:44 PM
The issue was that he was strawmanning, i.e. yelling at people for 'giving up' when no one actually had.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: drywall on September 10, 2010, 11:55:43 PM
Maybe I've been out of the loop here, but, where's drywall been?

Been feelin' kinda chubby tired so I didn't step up to the plate this time. Sorta glad I didn't since I would of been royally pissed if I hadn't finished before yesterday, nobody likes having their thunder stolen. It's weird cause those guys used to be pretty active in this forum and I thought they would say something, but I guess gensokyo.org does its own thing now. Anyway, I think the best compromise would be for everyone who's unsatisfied with the patch to bug gensokyo.org to release the source code and scripts. Then anyone could edit the script as they like and create their own personalized patch. However, if that doesn't pan out I could look into making the other patch if there's still demand down the road.
Title: 12.8 english patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 11, 2010, 12:11:08 AM
Seems there's demand alright, as everything's done and we just need someone to pack it up.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: trancehime on September 11, 2010, 12:23:12 AM
Anyway, I think the best compromise would be for everyone who's unsatisfied with the patch to bug gensokyo.org to release the source code and scripts. Then anyone could edit the script as they like and create their own personalized patch. However, if that doesn't pan out I could look into making the other patch if there's still demand down the road.

I really don't see this happening.

At all. Y'all can try but it isn't going to get you anywhere. Given your classy show of making it seem like some of you were complaining and then suddenly asking for tools certainly won't help your case.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Ravenxeo on September 11, 2010, 12:27:17 AM
I really don't see this happening.

At all. Y'all can try but it isn't going to get you anywhere. Given your classy show of making it seem like some of you were complaining and then suddenly asking for tools certainly won't help your case.

Its hardly as if people went storming the gate and screaming at them for shoddy workmanship.
there was some light nitpicking at best.
Hardly enough to have them fold their arms and huff.
and if it IS enough for that...then i dont think we would want their help anyway.

Besides which all this stuff is done right?
why bother asking for their stuff if all you'd do it delete it all and replace it with what you did.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: trancehime on September 11, 2010, 12:29:24 AM
Its hardly as if people went storming the gate and screaming at them for shoddy workmanship.
there was some light nitpicking at best.
Hardly enough to have them fold their arms and huff.
and if it IS enough for that...then i dont think we would want their help anyway.

Besides which all this stuff is done right?
why bother asking for their stuff if all you'd do it delete it all and replace it with what you did.

It's less the actual nitpicking than how they went about doing it. And actually it DID seem like a certain someone was being extremely passive-aggressive about it, even if they weren't really angry per se...

And if everything is done, why would you need to ask for all their tools anyway? What exactly are you going to do with it? Don't you just need to pack up shit?
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 11, 2010, 12:32:21 AM
why bother asking for their stuff if all you'd do it delete it all and replace it with what you did.
I specifically said that we would be combining the best of both, not overwriting all of theirs. We'd be helping both communities AND get a better patch.

And if everything is done, why would you need to ask for all their tools anyway? What exactly are you going to do with it? Don't you just need to pack up shit?
We don't have a way to pack it. That's what we were asking about.

Please stop arguing, everyone. If you're not going to help, go somewhere else. This is the topic about getting the patch done, not the topic about arguing whether or not we should do it.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: trancehime on September 11, 2010, 12:34:00 AM
We don't have a way to pack it. That's what we were asking about.

Oh, well that would make too much sense. D:

It didn't seem clear to me since it seemed like everything was lacking so D:
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 11, 2010, 12:38:38 AM
Oh, well that would make too much sense. D:

It didn't seem clear to me since it seemed like everything was lacking so D:

That's why I'm glad drywall showed up. And if he has the time and the inclination to take what you guys have done, and pack it all up, all the better.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: drywall on September 11, 2010, 01:31:11 AM
Let me just stress that creating another patch to "pack" everything up is not a trivial task, and would probably take me several weeks to hammer out the finer details (figuring out the msg/ecl file formats, getting all the text to fit on the screen, loading fonts, etc...). This in light of the fact that the gensokyo patch already does all this perfectly well is why I think getting the source released is the best option for addressing the translation concerns. Just wanted to put that out there.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 11, 2010, 01:38:13 AM
Alright. It's an option that hadn't occurred to me, seems reasonable enough.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on September 11, 2010, 03:22:17 AM
Yeah, making a new one entirely from scratch seems??silly.

Anyway, for my part, my work here is done and I don't have a strong feeling either way, so if people want to get the source from gensokyo.org and build it, sounds good to me, but otherwise we'll just have one patch and that'll be all.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on September 11, 2010, 09:16:02 PM
Spell cards: Extra stage

SC-like -> SC Style (MS Style; BS Style)

Meteor "Super Perseid" -> Shooting Star (literal)

Now, they stuck with Light Attack for 光撃. I used Light Blast since that was taken from the IN ThWiki entry. I will leave the choice up to you to pick one one you'll adopt. If you choose Light Attack, then that means the IN entry is gonna be changed.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: sadpanda on September 12, 2010, 07:18:15 AM
I registered here just to say that it doesn't matter if you guys weren't the first ones to patch. I have been following your translation efforts ever since the game came out, and you guys are so dedicated to your work and the effort you put out for something you don't even get paid for is astonishing.
Your level of work quality is also phenomenal. Your DS patch was just fantastic.
Please don't let the fact that gensokyo.org got theirs out first discourage you from putting out a perfectly good translation that you have put weeks of effort into. It would truly be a waste. Many good people like me are counting on you for the quality translation release we have come to know you for.
So turn that frown upsidown, and why not finish what you are so close to completing? There's nothing wrong with multiple versions of a translation, and you guys are a very high profile site, so it can only benefit you!
In the words of Zun...
YOU ARE SUPER PLAYER!
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 12, 2010, 07:38:21 AM
I went over to gensokyo.org to ask them to combine our patches, and the general consensus seems to be "no," although there is no official word yet. I'm mostly waiting for the coder, to see if the patching program/method will be open-source, though I'm not too optimistic. If they say no, then we're pretty much sunk, since the only person who would have the ability to make a similar program (drywall) probably wouldn't be too interested in spending weeks coding something that already exists (the problem that Prime 2.0 mentioned: Once a patch already exists, the possibility of an alternate patch that would have existed otherwise might not happen anymore).

Here's the discussion so far (http://www.gensokyo.org/archives/1498), starting about 2/3 down the page with my post, then continuing to a forum topic that is linked near the end. Please, if you're going to contribute to this effort, then be nice about it. We already made a bad enough impression from them reading this thread, and we don't need it worse. If you're not absolutely sure that they won't misinterpret your comment or otherwise get angered by it, don't post.

And to any gensokyo.org people that read this: We are not doing this just because we want our work in your patch. We simply want a higher-quality translation, and the best way to do that is a joint effort. ZUN puts a lot of effort into the little details, so we should too.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: S. Nazerine on September 12, 2010, 02:16:04 PM
Ironically, the people who have been being disrespectful towards the gensokyo.org team all had nothing to do with the MotK patch effort, and only showed up after GS.org released.

I have quite a lot to say about people who treat a translation effort--any translation effort--like that (badmouthing it because it made some small mistakes/didn't translate something open to interpretation the way they had interpreted it/isn't the group they like), but I decided I'd keep my mouth shut on that topic at the start of this discussion here, so I'll continue to do so. Just, you know?chill, folks. Why would you go and hate on a very well-organized piece of rather difficult work just because someone else was trying to do the same thing? At best, you make yourself look like a jerk, and at worst, you kill whatever chance there was that a joint effort could be made (though that's pretty slim from the start--I mean, if I completed a patch or script and someone else came along and said "heeeey could you use my translations?" I do not see myself reacting particularly kindly).
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Docteur Hartmann on September 12, 2010, 02:17:15 PM
Reading the topic, I have the feeling that the main trouble is an horrible misunderstanding.
I don't really get why you want to update the patch (names trouble, etc...), but I have the feeling that something is going wrong. I don't know if it's how you're asking, or if it's how they're understanding it, and I don't want to make any statement.
Besides, since I don't really know the different english-speaking communities, I can't really help, but I wish you good luck.

In fact: here is what I think. Nazerine is right, and even if you are right, I don't think that any of you will change his attitude. And I add that you should concert together BEFORE developping any patch.
Because:
1) Trying to make your own patch, when GS.org is know to make them isn't really sharp.
2) Waiting the release and saying 'there are errors here and here', doesn't matter how you say it, it sounds arrogant.
So I think it's screwed. Even with the best intentions, you won't get anywhere.

(I didn't read the whole topic, I'm just giving you my feelings).
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kiefmaster99 on September 12, 2010, 03:40:41 PM
Perhaps I should more clearly state my stance.

My main goal is to ensure accurate spell card translations for the wiki. I am neutral with regards to whose patch effort I am helping and I am willing to help either one if I find mistakes in either. (The post on the gensokyo.org patch page regarding the typo and TL issue was me by the way; that kind of post is no different from me correcting the MotK graphics package). I commend both efforts for trying to make a patch with the highest quality possible, and must respect whatever decisions either efforts make (gs.org provides a fair rationale to correct the faily typo for instance).

That being said though, I didn't find gensokyo.org's patch effort and found MotK's. This is why I consulted you for SC translations. I more or less contributed to your patch effort, since at that time I thought you were the only guys working on one. Also, working with either patch effort would reduce the amount of TLs on the wiki that would run contrary to a patch.

SC Edit: After some consultation on Touhou Wiki, I am sticking with MS-like and BS-like.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Prime 2.0 on September 12, 2010, 08:11:49 PM
My initial post was made simply for the purpose of galvanizing the patching team, since every single post prior to mine after news of the gs.org patch broke, including ones belonging to actual team members, expressed the sentiment that the shrinemaiden.org patch was dead. So I made a laundry list of what could be improved, and all posts thereafter were in response to being bashed for it, with my focus being clearly on the lack of documentation, and that putting out one patch makes it infinitely harder to make a second one, which would be problematic if support for the gs.org patch mirrored that of their Hisotensoku patch("We'll fix the bug if we have another release" "nobody cares about the credits and we haven't altered them before" "There are no plans to release the tools used"). Though it has since been stated that they do plan to update the patch, I was not aware this at the time... or perhaps they simply hadn't announced that yet.

I'll say it again: the point was never to badmouth the gs.org patch, it was to make it clear that this patch was worth continuing, in the face of the then-current sentiment of "we give up".
Title: English patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 12, 2010, 09:18:32 PM
Galvanizing, eh? That's a pretty self-important way of describing it. Looked more like you came barging in and started yelling at people for giving up, when no one had. And it didn't help.

I'm sure this gang will pull it off eventually. And I'll use their patch when they do.
Title: Re: English patch
Post by: Prime 2.0 on September 12, 2010, 10:47:15 PM
Galvanizing, eh? That's a pretty self-important way of describing it. Looked more like you came barging in and started yelling at people for giving up, when no one had. And it didn't help.

I'm sorry, are you trying to be antagonistic here? I want to put this absurd discussion to rest already. I didn't use the word "Galvanize" to be self important, I used it to describe a course of action that was intended to generate action and moral, as was my intention at the time, and as per the definition of the word.

And for that matter, I can't see the future, nor can I see what you or anyone else is thinking other than what they tell me: and what I saw was
Okay, so since the other translation patch is out, that means that all my image editing work was wasted? I'm still happy the patch is out, it just kind of sucks for me... I'm not too sad, just a bit frustrated, I guess.
It happens, Azure--I can't tell you how many times I've been asked to translate some manga so someone can do a scanlation release and then had the requester back out on their end of the deal and/or had another group release first.

Which is why I don't translate manga anymore.

Anyway, good work to everybody who worked on that version, and very nice timing indeed!
Well it's sad that it's for naught now. If it were manga, I'd still think it's worth it to have another release for preference, making a name for yourselves, competing in accuracy over speed etc.; but since it's a game that has to be patched and such, it does make it more complicated when different patches are introduced. You can always look over their work and make suggestions for a future update with the insights you've gained if you like, though.

I suppose with game patches, it's all the more important to look into who might already be involved before investing a lot.

As I said early on, this is a stupid flamewar over semantics that I'd rather not have any part in. As far as I can see, everyone has made their points along with multiple attempts at clarification, and all that is going on now is that everyone on either side is vying for the last word as though this were something you could "win", and even this post falls under that. If you really, really want it that bad you can have it, because I'm jumping ship from this discussion. There simply isn't any point in participating anymore, there is nothing to gain in it besides a few new enemies, and that's not what I want.
Title: Re: English patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 12, 2010, 10:58:26 PM
I'm sorry, are you trying to be antagonistic here? I want to put this absurd discussion to rest already. ... words ... As I said early on, this is a stupid flamewar over semantics that I'd rather not have any part in.

Wow. Project much? Dude, people got discouraged that someone else released a patch. Which I think is pretty natural, but the sun hadn't officially set on the project, either. If you wanted to "galvanize" people, maybe you should've taken a different vocabulary and tone, because - as numerous responses to you attest - you don't come across so much as someone trying to rally the troops as someone who just came barging in to scold people.

You can accept that or dismiss it, I don't give a toss. But I think it's pretty rich to come back now claiming you were just trying to motivate some people, and it's us who are engaging in flaming.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Ravenxeo on September 12, 2010, 11:05:19 PM
Lets all shut up and decide if we are gonna continue this or not.
I personally dont WANT to use their patch cause i have always gotten mine from here and i like the work you do.
I would very much like to see this finished..
There are more people on the internet who know how to construct a patch so if Dry cant then we could look for someone else to slam it all together into something usable..
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 12, 2010, 11:07:58 PM
Anything I could have contributed - proofreading - I already did. But as I said, I like the passion in this group, and believe they'll put together a great patch, which I look forward to using.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Azure Lazuline on September 12, 2010, 11:32:17 PM
Everyone just needs to shut up about this. Yes, that includes you. Don't try to make the last comment because you think you're exempt from this. I know I don't have any power here, and I apologize if this counts as "backseat moderating" or whatever, but I'm sick of both this thread and the one over at gensokyo.org. I seem to be one of the only people who actually tried to get something done instead of pointless bickering over semantics that nobody cares about.

I don't care about this anymore. I made my contribution and I did all that I could, so I'm out of here. If the code is released, go ahead and make the patch. If the code's not released, decide if it's worth it to make our own and act accordingly. If you're just going to complain about other people's opinions, then just shut up. It's not helping, and you're being no better than the people you think are wrong.

Yes, I realize that I'm being a hypocrite. I just don't care right now.

Thank you, and good night.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Tengukami on September 12, 2010, 11:37:44 PM
Alright. Sorry for sticking up for the team here. Trust me - that will never happen again.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: N-Forza on September 13, 2010, 12:00:15 AM
Touhou 12.8 - Patch Wars
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: Kilgamayan on September 13, 2010, 05:01:39 AM
Just to reinforce the general wind-down direction this thread seems to be going, I must ask that we not turn this into a competition with Halbarad and his team. They are well within their rights to release a 12.8 English patch, and you all are more than welcome to release one of your own. If you spot errors in theirs, please point them out in a respectful manner. They are not above releasing updates to fix errors in previous patches.

Also, for future reference, if you guys want to do an English patch, make sure you do not your project until and unless you have a hacker active and readily willing and available to work on it. I've talked to a few people about the goings-on in this thread as well as the general situation, and pretty much all of them produced that as a noticeable obstacle for you guys. You could avoid a lot of future frustration this way.
Title: Re: Touhou 12.8 The Great Fairy Wars English Patch
Post by: The Greatest Dog on October 12, 2010, 05:06:09 AM
Relevant information?

New patch released on the 15th. Now with arabic numerals and other stuff.

Link. (http://www.gensokyo.org/archives/1518)