Maidens of the Kaleidoscope

~Beyond the Border~ => Akyu's Arcade => Topic started by: Ghaleon on June 02, 2009, 03:13:36 am

Title: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 02, 2009, 03:13:36 am
Seems like it's been forever since they made a good TBS game that doesn't have the name "sid meiner' on it...who I'm not as big a fan of as any TBS fan would assume.

Advance wars aside, any relatively new TBS games people might suggest to me? I've tried galciv, but for some reason I just can't get into it. Just feels like a crappier version of master of orion to me, I keep saying I'll give it another go but generally when I do that I'm dissapointed (to this day I've never liked a game after slogging thru it despite not liking it for more than a day or two initially).

My favorites include:
age of wonders... al 3
Master of orion 1 and 2.. 3..umm.. 3 is kinda I don't know lol. I sorta enjoy it kinda.. but I still can't figure out the combat (it never works like it says its supposed to for me), and sometimes I think I'm doing something right, when many turns later it slaps me right in the face saying I'm doing it wrong.. sigh. gamespot says that game has a 1-2 hour learning curve *BULL*.. seriously, hardest game to figure out *EVER*.

homm 1-4.. yeah 4 is different, it's terrible in some ways (especially the graphics imo), but if you pretend it wasn't titled "homm", you can appreciate it for a good game imo... 5 is.. well. They tried to make it in between homm 3 and 4, and managed to capture the worse elements of both. Let's take homm 3, ok, now lets add less races, less units, less spells, less EVERYTHING, like homm 4. great. Ok now let's refuse to add simultanious turns like of age of wonders, and settle for some stupid ghost phase that is for multiplayer only which takes a total of 5 seconds of your time and still results in you sitting around with your thumbs twiddling the whole time it's not your turn. Brilliant. Now people complained bout how heroes work in homm 4, so let's go back to old style heroes, only nerf them so hard that you almost as well just get rid of them altogether, all right.

yeah.. very dissapointed with homm5 >=P.

Warlords (warlords battlecry is a very cool rts too btw.. 3 was as big a letdown to 2 as homm 5 was imo though).

pleaaase, I'm desperate for a good tbs game.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Edible on June 02, 2009, 03:26:28 am
Isn't Sword of the Stars a TBS?  I haven't played it, but I know TSO (among others) sings its praises.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 02, 2009, 04:46:13 am
never heard of it even though it's not very new. thanks a bunch, I'll be sure to give it a try once I get in the mood to play something other than touhou >=p.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: SONIC BHOCOLATE STRIKER on June 02, 2009, 08:56:07 pm
Knights in the nightmare is kinda sorta a strategy rpg. I'm definitley interested in it.

I also love TBS and any posts to this thred would be greatly appreciated by me too. ;)
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Moogy on June 02, 2009, 09:14:15 pm
Knights in the nightmare is kinda sorta a strategy rpg. I'm definitley interested in it.
KitN is literally impossible to play, have fun
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Moerin on June 02, 2009, 09:17:56 pm
I'm just wondering if SRPGs would fit into this...

'Cause if they do, get Disgaea.  I shouldn't need to justify why.  Just get it, and thank me later.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 02, 2009, 09:20:27 pm
I'm just wondering if SRPGs would fit into this...

'Cause if they do, get Disgaea.  I shouldn't need to justify why.  Just get it, and thank me later.

No that doesn't count. and I already have all 3.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: q on June 02, 2009, 10:21:45 pm
I'm not sure if I'm getting my acronyms mixed up, but this topic needs a mention of Fire Emblem if AW was brought up.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 02, 2009, 10:42:38 pm
I'm not sure if I'm getting my acronyms mixed up, but this topic needs a mention of Fire Emblem if AW was brought up.

that's not exactly new either. But you're very right, I should try it. I keep telling myself I will some time or another, but I never get around to it. It's not like I don't want to either. It's just like I keep forgetting when I have time to try a new game. blah.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: q on June 02, 2009, 10:47:40 pm
By "Fire Emblem" I don't just mean the game released in 2003.  Seriously.  FE7, FE9, and FE10 will deliver.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 02, 2009, 10:50:28 pm
By "Fire Emblem" I don't just mean the game released in 2003.  Seriously.  FE7, FE9, and FE10 will deliver.

yeah I'd try a newer one first anyway... wasn't the original released back in NES days though?
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: SONIC BHOCOLATE STRIKER on June 02, 2009, 10:51:25 pm
Not in America. <_<
(just like Nintendo Wars - we didn't get one till Advance Wars, but they were around since Famicom Wars)
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: q on June 02, 2009, 10:55:27 pm
Actually, the original Fire Emblem was just rereleased (with numerous improvements in game design) for the DS.  But most people agree that FE7 (the first one released in America) was the best one, but FE9 and FE10 are worth your time too.

Nintendo Wars, I'm told, was also much improved by the transition to the GBA.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 02, 2009, 11:00:43 pm
While I appreciate all the input, and I like "small" console strategy games like AW.. I am hoping for something larger in scale like civilization or master of orion, or homm.. That sword of the stars looks like a very likely possibility, though I honestly feel like I should try fire emblem.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: helvetica on June 03, 2009, 12:52:38 am
Sword of the fucking Stars.  Probably one of the best 4x games out there.  It's not really "turn" based as much as it's turn based strategy with real time combat.  Basically at the end of each turn, if there's any of your ships in an area with a hostile fleet or planet, then you can choose to either waive combat or fight.  Colonizing, research, fleet movements, that's all turn based, but the combat itself comes at the end of each turn.

When you actually fight it's like a simplified version of Homeworld, where you get 2-3 minutes (depending on how long you set it) to slug it out with either the enemy fleets in the area, or with the planet itself.

Even if you're not particularly interested in RTS combat, give it a shot.  It's a fantastic game and has easily sucked weeks out of my life playing it.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Kanako Yasaka on June 03, 2009, 02:19:41 am
Super Robot Wars.

Super Robot Wars 3 for the SNES just got a translation patch made for it and Original Generation 1 and 2 were actually released in America. The OGs don't have MAZINGER Z or GETTA ROBO or GUNDAMS though.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: SONIC BHOCOLATE STRIKER on June 06, 2009, 12:50:41 am
Namco X Capcom was interesting.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: trancehime on June 06, 2009, 10:45:34 am
Knights in the nightmare is kinda sorta a strategy rpg. I'm definitley interested in it.

Knights in the Nightmare fucking rocks play it

I finished it three times

Actually, the original Fire Emblem was just rereleased (with numerous improvements in game design) for the DS.  But most people agree that FE7 (the first one released in America) was the best one, but FE9 and FE10 are worth your time too.

Huh?????
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: q on June 06, 2009, 12:58:41 pm
Huh?????
Most balanced (there were fewest characters that were unredeemably bad and/or had virtually no playtime), had a slightly better obnoxious Endgame chapter that doesn't let you take anyone you like in, had Hector and Canas in it, etc.

As I said before, though, FE9 comes close IMO.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Elixir on June 06, 2009, 01:02:46 pm
I played Knights in the Nightmare tonight. What a disappointment. The game is visually stunning, and it's really fine tuned. I can tell that a lot of effort has gone into the art direction, cast, and purpose of the game. Except the battle system is overly complicated for no reason.

I mean seriously, this is ridiculous. The bullet hell appeal is neat, but unnecessary, That's not the problem I have with it though: the whole "oh you need to know what x weapons can be attached to x character in order to hit y enemy with y spell providing that y enemy is weak against y spell" thing is confusing. And I'm one of these types that would prefer to use the dpad controls over touchscreen controls if possible, but it's ruled out here.

Granted, I didn't read the entire tutorial (which would have taken an hour) but man. I feel dumb just playing this game.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 06, 2009, 07:43:29 pm
wow that sounds cool, I like really complicated games >=P.

But then again, I also know how you feel, it's how I felt for MOO 3. But then again, I tried to micro absolutely everything instead of letting the AI play portions for me, like you're supposed to do. But still I'm patient and was willing to spend mega-time between turns. Also the stupid AI would undo alot of what I did without telling me so often, despite me hitting the "AI OFF" button multiple times with large heavy devices in frusteration after it became apparent it wasn't working properly.

I tell myself the AI made me suck at that game, but to be honest I'll never really know.. I'd be willing to play it more even if I sucked anyway, but the combat system just failed to listen to me completely, very annoying.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Elixir on June 07, 2009, 04:18:55 pm
I like complicated games too but I want to actually play games, not spend an hour going through 30+ tutorials on how to play them.

Aaaaaaand SRW is not an RTS, guys.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Letty Whiterock on June 07, 2009, 04:26:54 pm
I played Knights in the Nightmare tonight.
...
I feel dumb just playing this game.
Moogy warned you.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: DarkslimeZ on June 07, 2009, 04:32:18 pm
Most balanced (there were fewest characters that were unredeemably bad and/or had virtually no playtime), had a slightly better obnoxious Endgame chapter that doesn't let you take anyone you like in, had Hector and Canas in it, etc.

As I said before, though, FE9 comes close IMO.

Have you... played any of the ones that didn't come out in the US? FE4, FE5, and FE6 are all amazing games as well. That's not to say that FE7 isn't good, but there are enough people that think otherwise for you to be at fault claiming that most people think 7 is the best. ^^;

And I asked for Knights in the Nightmare for my birthday(which is today). If you guys feel dumb playing this game, then I'll probably feel retarded. I still haven't gotten halfway through Rondo of Swords...

Umm, if you're interested, there's this open-source turn-based strategy game called Battle for Wesnoth, that uses all medieval/fantasy-type characters. Best of all, it has online play. I played it for about a week, but after the group of friends I was playing with kinda fell apart I lost it.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: SONIC BHOCOLATE STRIKER on June 07, 2009, 04:57:25 pm
Oh, how'd I forget about Wesnoth? Being a fan of open-source stuff I should've remembered that one.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Elixir on June 07, 2009, 06:26:14 pm
Moogy warned you.

He hasn't even played the game. I like to reserve judgment until I actually play stuff. Some games I've played for 15+ hours and come to the conclusion that I dislike them, but only after analyzing every fucking single tiny bit of the game.

The DS has a legacy of bad RPGs, though.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: q on June 08, 2009, 03:57:17 pm
Have you... played any of the ones that didn't come out in the US? FE4, FE5, and FE6 are all amazing games as well. That's not to say that FE7 isn't good, but there are enough people that think otherwise for you to be at fault claiming that most people think 7 is the best. ^^;
I have some doubt that the emulator crowd makes up most of the FE-playing population.
I've heard good things about FE4, less about FE5, and from the perspective of game design FE6 is inferior to FE7.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Alice Fact on June 09, 2009, 02:09:50 am
Typical titles: try Ring of Red, Nectaris, Nintendo Wars, or a Daisenryaku.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Herasy on June 09, 2009, 01:50:51 pm
I will admit Knights in the Nightmare is pretty complicated, but once you really get into the game all the rules grow on you, I am about half way (I think) through the game myself and I am enjoying it quite alot.

All you really need to know is what classes you have on you, what your enemy is weak to (currently) and just chuck on 4 weapons that suit the classes you have, after that you can just spam the weapons till you win.

Although the game is starting to get a bit repetitive, needs more bosses and less kill the random monsters in town stages.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 09, 2009, 07:38:11 pm
bleh. One thing I hate about the current trend of strategy/rpg games is the overabundance of "enemy weaknesses" to exploit. I remember when rpgs often had mobs or bosses that didn't really have a weakness very often. Nowdays everything is slowly turning into a giant game of rocks paper scissors so your "strategy" is often a no brainer.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Alice Fact on June 12, 2009, 06:00:31 pm
Pretty sure that's been done since at least the end of the 80s.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: linthuslyth on June 13, 2009, 04:06:34 pm
Oh, I'm glad Fire Emblem was mentioned. But then again, it has gained popularity since FE7.(Hmm... used to know what were their subtitles). Since I am dormant fan of the series I think I can draw you a better picture.

Anyway, Fire Emblem was kinda my intro to strategy games back then; meaning I totally sucked at them at the time I was playing  FE3-5. I don't have a GameCube so I missed out on the recent ones and I've played  the three GBA ones. They weren't bad but I really had a heart for the old one; actually, I kinda have a heart for old games. Gameplay was a larger factor than graphic back then... I think. I digress, the new ones were too... linear, except FE8... or 9, I forget. The ones with two heroes, that was sort of fun. I didn't get to replay any of the GBA ones since they seemed dragging for me. I did play FE4 and 5 a couple of times, despite not finishing  5.

Sorry... I don't remember FE3 too well... except that the first half of it was a remake of 1, and the second part was the actually FE3. That one was quite long.... A bit linear, but then again I can't really remember.

FE4 was probably the easiest. But the fact that you can pair up your units and control their offspring in the second half of the game just makes it so damn fun. I wished they bring back the 2 generation system... I liked it.

I liked FE5... sort of. Nintendo probably thought that the previous one was too easy and decided to up the difficulty... a lot. Though FE5 had the best systems in the series. No shop, you'd have to capture an enemy unit and sack their stuff to keep your army geared. And the weapon triangle system there was toned down so much that it could be ignored for the most part; since you do hate weakness systems. It had some branching paths but not very many and some mission involved not just kill all opponents or killing the boss. For me(at that time), there was much to explore in FE5. The game was very enjoyable... too bad I didn't get to finish it. Haha, got stuck then my computer broke along with my saves. I haven't gotten to playing them again but I will someday, I think I'm better at strategy games now.

Although, without guides and/or translation, you'd miss out on a lot and believe me FE has a LOT of missable stuff/characters/etc. I'd say play the GBA ones and if you enjoy them, play the ones in SNES. I can dig into my back ups if you want. I think I have an old translation of FE4.

EDIT: Sorry that thing about NO SHOP in FE5, that was an exaggeration. There were shops, but in every 5 or so chapter so they were very limited.
Title: Re: My fave game genre seems dead. TBS, any advice?
Post by: Ghaleon on June 13, 2009, 07:26:54 pm
Pretty sure that's been done since at least the end of the 80s.

not by an "overabundant" amount as I mentioned imo though.