Author Topic: Touhou 14.5: 東方深秘録 ~ Urban Legend in Limbo. is HM sequel, demo at Comiket 87 (Read 807952 times)

SuperVehicle-001 · « **Reply #1020 on:** April 28, 2015, 12:56:03 AM »

Quote from: cuc on April 27, 2015, 02:07:47 PM

When hit by her Occult Attack "Red or Blue, Which Do You Want", the opponent will be forced to choose between red and blue, with red enhancing her melee attacks, and blue enhancing her projectiles.

Wha? So, the opponent is the one who chooses the buff that Miko gets? First time I've heard of such a mechanic, and this is in a fighting game, of all things.

aListers · « **Reply #1021 on:** April 28, 2015, 01:07:12 AM »

I'm kind of disappointed that my country's most famous monster didn't appear in Touhou as an actual youkai (I'll still hope though) but I should really be proud right now. My country has invented many things so I guess it fits. That and it's an invention by Nitori, the first touhou character I ever met in a dream and my main in HM, so when I fight I can be patriotic and proud at the same time. If my country gets mentioned then I'm taking a screenshot.

Nonetheless, I actually enjoyed HM so I'll probably enjoy this. The themes themselves make me excited and I've been watching the dub of Ghost stories for a laugh which has made me even more hyped for this game.

Drake · « **Reply #1022 on:** April 28, 2015, 01:37:31 AM »

Quote from: SuperVehicle-001 on April 28, 2015, 12:56:03 AM

Wha? So, the opponent is the one who chooses the buff that Miko gets? First time I've heard of such a mechanic, and this is in a fighting game, of all things.

I'm torn between thinking it's a really iffy mechanic for a fighting game but an amazingly fitting choice for Miko as a character. "As an extension of my grace, I will let you choose how you would prefer me to beat you", or something of the sort.

mauve · « **Reply #1023 on:** April 28, 2015, 02:43:01 AM »

Actually a mechanic like that is totally fine, but the choice taken would probably skew heavily one way or another. Closest thing I can think of would be "choose a card" type, like Dorothy from AH3 has, except that's more of a guessing game.

Valar · « **Reply #1024 on:** April 28, 2015, 02:51:24 AM »

Quote from: Not Bigode on April 27, 2015, 11:58:54 PM

detailing how these two tracks are nothing alike

Okay, okay, I give up. It was half-joke anyway)

Quote from: aListers on April 28, 2015, 01:07:12 AM

my country's most famous monster

I'm waiting for my country's monsters too. Probably won't happen though, as they are not very famous.

Quote from: Drake on April 28, 2015, 01:37:31 AM

"As an extension of my grace, I will let you choose how you would prefer me to beat you"

And that is how awesome Miko is!

FearNagae · « **Reply #1025 on:** April 28, 2015, 04:27:41 AM »

The tracks has similar instruments, yes.

I think it's quite similar, not in notation, but the feel is there.

Shadowlupus · « **Reply #1026 on:** April 28, 2015, 04:47:26 AM »

Here's what I have something in mind for Miko's Occult.

Suppose that Miko has less health than the (player's) opponent (cuz the computer opponent will likely to instantly select either of it.)

If Miko's (player) opponent decide not to choose either of them and stall until the timer runs low and they win because they have more health, wouldn't it be a little disadvantageous?

monhan · « **Reply #1027 on:** April 28, 2015, 04:52:54 AM »

Quote from: SuperVehicle-001 on April 28, 2015, 12:56:03 AM

Wha? So, the opponent is the one who chooses the buff that Miko gets? First time I've heard of such a mechanic, and this is in a fighting game, of all things.

I also find that gimmick interesting, especially since it's being faithful to the original legend(though you cannot answer any other colors :derp:).
Since both of them are buffs, either one should be a good boost if they're as good as her old Red Mantle. Like mauve said, it may skew things somewhat(depending on which play style the user is comfortable with), but since Miko is pretty well-balanced in general, I think it won't be much of a problem.
I'm actually more worried about how useful it will be though, since the boost duration is very brief. Only 5 seconds in real life, not game timer, and that is very short. Using it to end a combo will make you lose time while the enemy is stunned. And even when it didn't stun the opponent, you need the Fast Declaration Cancel(FDC, ~~heh GG~~) to follow up the wall-slam. The video showcasing it wasn't bad, but I wonder how you can maximize its potential.
Although, that may not be an issue if the duration increases as you gain more occult balls, but we don't know about that yet. Perhaps when you have 3+ balls it'll be more reliable.

Anyway, this gimmick left out the penalty from the last one, so it should level her game and make it more fair now.

Quote from: Kageshirou on April 28, 2015, 04:47:26 AM

Here's what I have something in mind for Miko's Occult.

Suppose that Miko has less health than the (player's) opponent (cuz the computer opponent will likely to instantly select either of it.)

If Miko's (player) opponent decide not to choose either of them and stall until the timer runs low and they win because they have more health, wouldn't it be a little disadvantageous?

I don't think that'll be a problem unless it's in the very last seconds. The default choice is Blue Mantle, and I think you can't exactly confirm it. It will automatically chose the color in around 2 seconds, and I think that's how it'll always be.

In the case you described, the Miko player shouldn't even try to attempt it since going straight-up to combo should be more reliable.

HalfGrand · « **Reply #1028 on:** April 28, 2015, 08:39:55 AM »

I am really pleased with how this game is turning out from what I have seen so far. From my personal experience from the Touhou fighting games, HM was simply a game that I ran through all the characters story mode with, unlocked Kokoro... and haven't really played since. Without any real features that made you want to continue playing (such as arcade mode, unlocking character spell cards etc) I simply lost interest in it and went back to playing Soku since that game had more game replaying value and overall polish to it.

I will send a prayer to the Hakurei god that UliL is more like Soku.

Still, since it's only a matter of time now until UliL is released at this coming Reitasai, I think it's time now to have that important talk that the English speaking touhou community has when a new game is about to be released. Douse anybody here have any plans or intentions to attempted a translation patch of UliL once the full game is released? Lets face it, it's a touhou community tradition to dive into the code of the game and turn the Japanese into English. I personally find myself just as hyped for English translation patches by the community as the actual games themselves.

I want to make a quick shout out to brliron for his great efforts on translating HM and also Gensokyo.org staff for their previous translations from years ago on the older games. My thanks to you is infinite and you truly are Hakurei gods in my eyes!

Clarste · « **Reply #1029 on:** April 28, 2015, 10:13:14 AM »

The "choose how you'll die" bit is the whole point of the red cape, blue cape legend though. If would be odder if the opponent didn't have the choice.

RaiTo · « **Reply #1030 on:** April 28, 2015, 11:35:26 AM »

Just checked out the character drawing styles. THAT mamizou is so cute! And Ichirin looks like Levy from fairy tail!

~Shin Kuroi~ · « **Reply #1031 on:** April 28, 2015, 01:24:12 PM »

Quote from: RaiTo on April 28, 2015, 11:35:26 AM

Just checked out the character drawing styles. THAT mamizou is so cute! And Ichirin looks like Levy from fairy tail!

Ahh now that you mention it she kind of does ^^;

I personally really like Koishi and Kokoro's the best. I think it really brings out their personalities... er, ironically.

cuc · « **Reply #1032 on:** April 28, 2015, 03:08:16 PM »

There is an unverified rumor that the Reitaisai livestream at Super Conference also mentioned Cool & Create's participation in the ULiL soundtrack. If true, this could mean the existence of another returning character as the penultimate boss. I'm still wait for a confirmation from someone who watched the stream.

TresserT · « **Reply #1033 on:** April 28, 2015, 04:03:50 PM »

Quote from: cuc on April 28, 2015, 03:08:16 PM

There is an unverified rumor that the Reitaisai livestream at Super Conference also mentioned Cool & Create's participation in the ULiL soundtrack. If true, this could mean the existence of another returning character as the penultimate boss. I'm still wait for a confirmation from someone who watched the stream.

It's Urban Legend in Limbo- all rumors are true.

Spoiler:

I like this art much much more than any of Alphes's, but from the bits I heard I prefer Hopeless Masquerade's OST to this one. I really want to hear the rest of Kasen's theme if only to find bits of Rumble Temple in it.

Doki-Doki · « **Reply #1034 on:** April 28, 2015, 04:43:24 PM »

Quote from: cuc on April 28, 2015, 03:08:16 PM

There is an unverified rumor that the Reitaisai livestream at Super Conference also mentioned Cool & Create's participation in the ULiL soundtrack. If true, this could mean the existence of another returning character as the penultimate boss. I'm still wait for a confirmation from someone who watched the stream.

Oh lord, hopefully it's true. A penultimate boss would fit very nicely, I can't see it being anyone other than Nue or Seija though since both would fit in with the incident like a charm.

Fumi · « **Reply #1035 on:** April 28, 2015, 05:03:29 PM »

It would be weird to have a roster of 14 so it's very likely there will be a penultimate boss, well I hope, because if ULiL is following SWR then it would make sense. I personally don't know what would be better, a returning character is always welcome on the fighters because it will boost it's popularity, we will see it in action ~~and an official arrangement of her theme~~. But a new character would be apreciated, although it's not always a good thing, from what I see, at least Iku wasn't that popular or Tenshi (Well, Tenshi was somehow popular but I always see negative comments about her :ohdear: but she is still one of my faves)

Quote from: HalfGrand on April 28, 2015, 08:39:55 AM

I am really pleased with how this game is turning out from what I have seen so far. From my personal experience from the Touhou fighting games, HM was simply a game that I ran through all the characters story mode with, unlocked Kokoro... and haven't really played since. Without any real features that made you want to continue playing (such as arcade mode, unlocking character spell cards etc) I simply lost interest in it and went back to playing Soku since that game had more game replaying value and overall polish to it.

I will send a prayer to the Hakurei god that UliL is more like Soku.

I don't think ULiL is following Soku, nor it will become like Soku, being honest Soku was just an expansion of SWR that ended up adding joke characters to the roster, the incident presented and the story were not relevant to the story of Gensokyo (Since ZUN was very vague about it, I think we can't know which story of the 3 characters was canonical), it just added more popular characters, "patched" SWR and added new spell cards. If ULiL will be similar to something, it will be SWR which in my opinion is a better game than Soku (it has less characters but the story, music and setting made it awesome)

Maiden Synnae ミ☆ · « **Reply #1036 on:** April 28, 2015, 05:05:32 PM »

Quote from: cuc on April 28, 2015, 03:08:16 PM

There is an unverified rumor that the Reitaisai livestream at Super Conference also mentioned Cool & Create's participation in the ULiL soundtrack. If true, this could mean the existence of another returning character as the penultimate boss. I'm still wait for a confirmation from someone who watched the stream.

I'd honestly be extremely surprised if there were no penultimate boss on this game. All fighters so far had one, so it makes no sense for only ULiL to be different.

That said, I'm pretty sure it will be either Nue or Seija, But I'm more inclined towards the latter because it'd be really weird for Sukuna to be on the game and not Seija. I mean, she was the mastermind of th14, the one that triggered the incident. And she got her own game recently as well. Sukuna was just tricked by her and... yeah, that's pretty much it.

Validon98 · « **Reply #1037 on:** April 28, 2015, 05:26:09 PM »

With the possible Nue/Seija thing, personally I would lean towards Nue over Seija, because as much as Seija has ties to TH14 and Shinmyonmaru and everything, Nue has a stronger connection to urban legends (one of her spellcards in Double Spoiler was even a reference to Hanako, another a reference to the red paper, blue paper legend), and being, well, a nue, makes her more in line with the whole thematic of the game.

Granted it's just rumors, so to be honest I don't think either character may be in at all, but points for hoping.

FearNagae · « **Reply #1038 on:** April 28, 2015, 05:41:52 PM »

or... or... it could be Flan ! Remember all the stages are night ?!

Quote from: Auraldo on April 28, 2015, 05:03:29 PM

It would be weird to have a roster of 14 so it's very likely there will be a penultimate boss, well I hope, because if ULiL is following SWR then it would make sense. I personally don't know what would be better, a returning character is always welcome on the fighters because it will boost it's popularity, we will see it in action ~~and an official arrangement of her theme~~. But a new character would be apreciated, although it's not always a good thing, from what I see, at least Iku wasn't that popular or Tenshi (Well, Tenshi was somehow popular but I always see negative comments about her :ohdear: but she is still one of my faves)

I don't think ULiL is following Soku, nor it will become like Soku, being honest Soku was just an expansion of SWR that ended up adding joke characters to the roster, the incident presented and the story were not relevant to the story of Gensokyo (Since ZUN was very vague about it, I think we can't know which story of the 3 characters was canonical), it just added more popular characters, "patched" SWR and added new spell cards. If ULiL will be similar to something, it will be SWR which in my opinion is a better game than Soku (it has less characters but the story, music and setting made it awesome)

- Iku is quite popular (not youmu/reisen tier popular, but higher than shou etc IIRC) in the annual votes.
- The characters added in soku aren't joke characters :ohdear: (unless you mean plot-wise)

Though I think a returning character would be cool for now, it will boost game popularity yeah

PK · « **Reply #1039 on:** April 28, 2015, 05:58:17 PM »

I didn't think i'd say this, but i don't like almost any of the tracks for the game. Only Miko's and the one in the demo while fighting Kasen i find good :\
About the penultimate boss: if there's one, Nue would fit very well given her relations to urban legends, and the symbols in the cover are apparently taken from her SC, but maybe she would be too obvious?

I am also eager to see how ULiL is related to LoLK. I'm so hyped :V

Fumi · « **Reply #1040 on:** April 28, 2015, 06:25:44 PM »

Quote from: FearNagae on April 28, 2015, 05:41:52 PM

- Iku is quite popular (not youmu/reisen tier popular, but higher than shou etc IIRC) in the annual votes.
- The characters added in soku aren't joke characters :ohdear: (unless you mean plot-wise)

Though I think a returning character would be cool for now, it will boost game popularity yeah

I have had trouble seeing fans that love Iku, I mean, she is not hated like Tenshi but the fans love other characters more and well, yeah I mean it plotwise, the plot for Soku is anyway a kind of a joke. I think someone said the three characters with a story mode in Soku was mostly for laughs, with Cirno battling Goliath Doll, Meiling dreaming and Sanae battling casually with Suwako after everything was solved.

I think Nue is more likely for our surprise character, it would make sense considering how related she is to the urban legends but seeing now that everyone is using her Spell Cards as their Occult Power, Nue will only be left with her own myth, the Nue, a chimera or something.

Kilgamayan · « **Reply #1041 on:** April 28, 2015, 06:30:09 PM »

On one hand, Nue is the obvious choice. On the other, that would be four Buddhists in the game compared to two Taoists, and I don't know if ZUN would do that. Frankly I'd be more inclined to say "new character" if anything.

(It won't be Seija, or at least, it won't be Seija because of the theme. Seija isn't a 'trickster' because of urban legends, she's a 'trickster' because she's an asshole.)

Validon98 · « **Reply #1042 on:** April 28, 2015, 06:40:29 PM »

Nue's not really a Buddhist, though. She just lives there. Same with Koishi being a laywoman of the temple and Mamizou being there. They don't actually represent the religion like Byakuren or Ichirin do. They just sort of live there.

Doki-Doki · « **Reply #1043 on:** April 28, 2015, 06:47:30 PM »

Quote from: Auraldo on April 28, 2015, 06:25:44 PM

I have had trouble seeing fans that love Iku, I mean, she is not hated like Tenshi but the fans love other characters more and well, yeah I mean it plotwise, the plot for Soku is anyway a kind of a joke. I think someone said the three characters with a story mode in Soku was mostly for laughs, with Cirno battling Goliath Doll, Meiling dreaming and Sanae battling casually with Suwako after everything was solved.

I think Nue is more likely for our surprise character, it would make sense considering how related she is to the urban legends but seeing now that everyone is using her Spell Cards as their Occult Power, Nue will only be left with her own myth, the Nue, a chimera or something.

If anything I think Nue's occult power would be the Jersey Devil, it'd fit her pretty well.

Quote from: Kilgamayan on April 28, 2015, 06:30:09 PM

On one hand, Nue is the obvious choice. On the other, that would be four Buddhists in the game compared to two Taoists, and I don't know if ZUN would do that. Frankly I'd be more inclined to say "new character" if anything.

(It won't be Seija, or at least, it won't be Seija because of the theme. Seija isn't a 'trickster' because of urban legends, she's a 'trickster' because she's an asshole.)

It seems plausible to me for Seija to take up an urban legend to further bolster her being an asshole, plus it seems like a good chance for Sukuna to get her own back against Seija story-wise.

Maiden Synnae ミ☆ · « **Reply #1044 on:** April 28, 2015, 07:31:26 PM »

Quote from: Kilgamayan on April 28, 2015, 06:30:09 PM

Frankly I'd be more inclined to say "new character" if anything.

It could be a new character as well. Iku was a non-veteran penultimate boss after all.

SuperVehicle-001 · « **Reply #1045 on:** April 28, 2015, 07:41:58 PM »

Quote from: ☆ New Age Retro Gamer Synnae ☆ on April 28, 2015, 07:31:26 PM

It could be a new character as well. Iku was a non-veteran penultimate boss after all.

If the rumor is true, then the fifth character will most definitely not be a new character. Each time a new character appeared in one of the fighters, she had a song composed by ZUN. This is true for all the fighting games up to now, and I don't see why it would be any different for ULiL.

Phasm · « **Reply #1046 on:** April 28, 2015, 07:54:55 PM »

Think about this everyone, Seija has a reverse mindset to everyone in Gensokyo, what i mean is:

Everyone wants and is using Urban Legends, that means Seija doesn't want to use Urban Legends in any way.

I am more inclined for Nue, for the same reasons other users have mentione:

1: Her connection to Urban Legends being a Chimera and her spellcards
2: Her relationship with Mamizou
3: She just seems like one to use Urban Legends

On the other hand it would be a complete waste of an opportunity to have Kaguya duke it out with Mokou, maybe at the time of the demo she wasn't in the game's character dat. or is meant to be a secret.

mauve · « **Reply #1047 on:** April 28, 2015, 08:03:03 PM »

I have no idea why anyone liked Alphes's art style in the first place, it's so bland and boring. The linework was nice but the coloring really didn't fit. New art is much better and more fitting to the Touhou feel ZUN gives, though it doesn't match the new sprites as well.

Though, I do sorta buy the "they hired an Alphes imitator" rumor for HM honestly, because the proportions generally just didn't look like his work and there's some really strange errors like Marisa's arm being shorter than her torso in her cutin.

Maiden Synnae ミ☆ · « **Reply #1048 on:** April 28, 2015, 08:25:29 PM »

Quote from: mauve on April 28, 2015, 08:03:03 PM

I have no idea why anyone liked Alphes's art style in the first place, it's so bland and boring. The linework was nice but the coloring really didn't fit. New art is much better and more fitting to the Touhou feel ZUN gives, though it doesn't match the new sprites as well.

^ This. I never really liked his art either, it's pretty boring.

Moe Harukawa's art is much superior. I'd say she is clearly the best official artist so far.

Fumi · « **Reply #1049 on:** April 28, 2015, 08:45:36 PM »

Quote from: mauve on April 28, 2015, 08:03:03 PM

I have no idea why anyone liked Alphes's art style in the first place, it's so bland and boring. The linework was nice but the coloring really didn't fit. New art is much better and more fitting to the Touhou feel ZUN gives, though it doesn't match the new sprites as well.

Though, I do sorta buy the "they hired an Alphes imitator" rumor for HM honestly, because the proportions generally just didn't look like his work and there's some really strange errors like Marisa's arm being shorter than her torso in her cutin.

That's right, I really dislike when everyone uses his art for anything, besides I think it looked refreshing the first time in IaMP but then after that it became too repetitive, I think almost everyone has the same face in HM

Ah yes, if the rumor is true then it will be a veteran, well not to drift too far but... if the game we are getting after this one is related to the moon and ZUN said we will get spoilers for ULiL in LoLK... could it be her chance to enter the fray?