Author Topic: Cavalier of the Abyss Mafia [Game Over, Town Wins] (Read 113404 times)

Den-O · « **Reply #390 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:04:14 PM »

Hrm. Actually, before I do that, I'm going to retract what I said about Iffrita. She's a *possible* lynch, but I need to think about if she's the *best* lynch.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #391 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:08:15 PM »

...

Why would the revived UK have quicktopic access? That makes no sense and doesn't mesh with the flavor I received at all. I didn't get a quicktopic with the dead UK that she couldn't post in, so why would the live UK suddenly be able to talk to me?

RE: Book, I still thought it was unnecessary for her to take townie cred she didn't earn. I apologize if I was somewhat abrasive towards Miya, but I am still rather irritated over the was yesterday ended, and the fact that she was trying to say she should be acknowledged as townie for what she did is ughhh.

As for you question, I would prefer to focus on the Just wagon for now, but Yuan bugs me a little because I can't remember anything she has done and I have no idea who she would want to vote outside of role shenanigans. That's not much of a scum read, though, but it's the closest thing I could throw out there.

Cut by UK. Pretty much what I expected.

Ryuki · « **Reply #392 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:13:11 PM »

Why would revived UK have quick topic access?

Do you suddenly UNBECOME a neighbor when you die? No?

Further, UK RECEIVED RESULTS FROM HER ABILITY, DESPITE DYING.

So it would stand to reason that if you were truly a neighborizer, then UK would be informed she is a neighbor, and then that she died.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #393 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:14:07 PM »

Also, Yuan, my hider thing doesn't really work as an effective cop, because I'm not actually told whether or not I became bulletproof or not. The bulletproof only lasts a night, so the only way my target is getting cleared is if I actually draw a kill that night and survive it. It's pretty situational and not really reliable for learning the target's alignment.

I thought using the neighborizer early would be a good idea because town lacks direction at this point and I thought that being able to communicate with Moonin could help organize a Depore lynch, and even if he changed his opinions on Depore suddenly, he felt town enough that I thought discussing things with him in private could still at least be beneficial. I didn't want to use my neighborizer late in the game because I figured out-of-thread communication would be less valuable then due to the lower headcount.

Kiva-la · « **Reply #394 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:15:30 PM »

Iffrita - You claim to have submitted a neighborizor action towards Moonin. What where you informed was the result of this action?

Try to be precise.

Ryuki · « **Reply #395 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:18:31 PM »

Quote from: Empress Iffrita on July 16, 2011, 06:08:15 PM

...

Why would the revived UK have quicktopic access? That makes no sense and doesn't mesh with the flavor I received at all. I didn't get a quicktopic with the dead UK that she couldn't post in, so why would the live UK suddenly be able to talk to me?

RE: Book, I still thought it was unnecessary for her to take townie cred she didn't earn. I apologize if I was somewhat abrasive towards Miya, but I am still rather irritated over the was yesterday ended, and the fact that she was trying to say she should be acknowledged as townie for what she did is ughhh.

As for you question, I would prefer to focus on the Just wagon for now, but Yuan bugs me a little because I can't remember anything she has done and I have no idea who she would want to vote outside of role shenanigans. That's not much of a scum read, though, but it's the closest thing I could throw out there.

Cut by UK. Pretty much what I expected.

The bolded reads like you are trying to find SOMETHING to pin on me, desperately, to save yourself.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #396 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:19:19 PM »

Orwen: The PM said that I lost my bearings and entered UK's room instead by mistake, but she had already been knifed when I entered her room and I wasn't able to contact her (because she was dead).

Cut by Yuan. If I wanted to do that I would be attacking Miya.

Ryuki · « **Reply #397 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:24:10 PM »

@UK: Do you seriously think that you would fail to receive notification that you were neighborized, but you DID receive your action result? (despite DYING)

Bardiche · « **Reply #398 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:24:58 PM »

Votecount the 21th

Depore (1): Iffrita
Mala (2): Orwen, Xix, Book of the Past
Miya (2): One, Book of the Past
Moonin (1): Mala
Iffrita (1): Yuan

Orwen (0): Mikhail

Not Voting: Everyone else!

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
You have about 48 hours until Night 2.
Moonin has narrowly avoided prod.

Ryuki · « **Reply #399 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:25:15 PM »

Quote from: Empress Iffrita on July 16, 2011, 06:19:19 PM

Orwen: The PM said that I lost my bearings and entered UK's room instead by mistake, but she had already been knifed when I entered her room and I wasn't able to contact her (because she was dead).

Cut by Yuan. If I wanted to do that I would be attacking Miya.

@Mod: What kind of action resolution are you using?

OOO · « **Reply #400 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:27:50 PM »

Okay, I know I'm late, but I will catch up quickly. However, there are a few things I can toss out that may help ~~Talk the town in circles some more~~ shed light on what happened last night.

I roleclaim full-time Neighborizer. Last night, I targeted UK, but my role specifically states that I lose connection with the target if they die. The message I received was just a generic sounding "Your action failed." and no quicktopic was made.

Cut by Mod Prodding me: I'm not sure if I should really be forward with this, but I need to send something out now.

Bardiche · « **Reply #401 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:29:37 PM »

Quote from: Yuan on July 16, 2011, 06:25:15 PM

@Mod: What kind of action resolution are you using?

Hi~ mi~ tsu~ ♥

Players, please cease attempting to get role-specific information from me. I will not give you any beyond what you need to know.

@Moonin: Noted. Prod retracted, deadline restored by 3 hours. I will update the votecount accordingly.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #402 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:30:35 PM »

... Well then.

Does anybody in this game have a full-time role similiar to the Hider I mentioned? That could possibly explain a lot. I will be mildly irritated if my role only existed to get me into a claim conflict.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #403 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:32:06 PM »

... On second thought, don't answer that. I'm a derp.

Den-O · « **Reply #404 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:35:52 PM »

Well, start of day Yuan gives me bad vibes. Interestin' you'd argue that Depore wouldn't kill me. I'll note that the mafia tend to be a team, not a sole person, so Depore wouldn't have the sole say. Second, judging by what a damned lurkfest this game became with me dead, I'd think more experienced scum would override Depore if she DID want to keep me alive. I'll also note it's interesting how quickly you want to perpetuate my reads now despite your behavior yesterday regarding my reads. (I will grant I only get a half point on Just)

Sage Orwen: Are you confirming a double voter claim there? Because that was something I desperately wanted to ask. Ending the day like that was kinda scummy!

Xix: Why do you make a case on Depore and vote Mala again? Seems convenient.

Depore: So you basically were just doing what you thought you could get away with? Interestin'! (Oh, right, you replaced out. Hope to see a good post from you)

Orwen: Didn't I do the same thing and flip town, with regards to Just? (Your points on Mala)

Miya's pressure and Iffrita's response implies Tracker claim. Given Just and my own abilities, I find this exceedingly strange. But I find the Iffrita response even MORE strange. It's kind of tough to decide here. I'll also admit Miya's insistence that her vote on Just was as if she votes scum is interesting.

@Iffrita: Proof of role is not proof of alignment. I've busted out D2 scum tracker claims (as a scum tracker) when I thought I caught someone I could frame. That's the beautiful part of tracker. The information is JUST uncertain enough so that you can get someone mislynched on it without getting lynched yourself. I'm curious why you aren't considering this.

@Book: Depore is your top pick for scum. You voted Mala. Why? What makes Mala different from me, given the case revolves around her GUT =D!

One's got a good point on Miya. Honestly, they BOTH look awful in this shenaniganery.

Moonin is town, quit voting town Mala. Why Moonin over Iffrita, who's been handed to you on a silver platter?

Yuan's claim makes things even more interestin'. It doesn't help I've had scum vibes from her since D1 (OH LOOK MY SECRET SUSPECT REVEALED). You all want that case, by the way? I could write one up now, it'd be fairly easy.

@Iffrita: Well, it's really a matter of how the mod handles things. Unless the action is roleblocked, usually you get a QT, because the neighborize resolves first, and then no one to talk in it. The fact that my action resolved heavily implies that your action should have resolved as well. So it doesn't look good.

@Yuan: Been thinkin' about that, really.

Basically, one of Yuan and Iffrita is scum. If Iffrita is town, Miya is likely scum. Don't go woohooing into it but I think there's enough behavioral evidence to make it possible.

...what the hell, am I REALLY that damn popular? Did EVERYONE just target me last night?

Anyway, with Moonin's claim, I feel a lot more comfortable with ##Vote Iffrita. It's less that he's "counterclaiming" her and more the fact that Iffrita should have been informed of the same thing and has not brought that up at all.

Mod Note: Removed deadspacing.

Kiva-la · « **Reply #405 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:39:17 PM »

Iffrita -

1. You lost your bearings
2. You entered UK's room by mistake
3. She was already knifed when you entered
4. You were not able to contact her

That is precisely the facts the content of your PM informed you of? I don't want to get on a bad lynch by mistake, so if there is any part of this that varies from how your night action was resolved, tell us now.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #406 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:42:35 PM »

If Miya was a tracker, wouldn't she have been told that I was redirected? Granted, I don't know how the mod handles redirects with trackers. I had assumed she was an Insane Cop or something. :s

UK, what should I have been informed of? My PM wasn't as generic as Moonin claimed his was, but I don't know how I can actually give off a good idea of how flavorful it was without getting modkilled. Bleh.

Basically it was something like "You got confused and entered UK's room instead. Your action failed because UK is dead."

Cut by Orwen. Half of that was just me flowering up the post. <_< I didn't know I was supposed to paraphrase my PM, just explain what it told me. It was still more flavorful than Moonin's, however.

Den-O · « **Reply #407 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:45:34 PM »

Paraphrase what you think is relevant and run it past the mod. Hrm...

Thinking on it, my role PM is rather flavorful too. I don't generically Gravedig and Weak Track at all. Further, the result has flavor in it as well.

Hrm...Now I'm doubting MOONIN'S claim. But that would mean that scum are throwing themselves at you so you die, and that's weird too given how Border of Life and Death you are at the moment.

Ryuki · « **Reply #408 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:45:54 PM »

UK, I'd LOVE~ to see your case on me.

Further, once you died you were a confirmed townie. Confirmed townies reads may not always be CORRECT, but they can atleast be trusted to be from a town persepective. Given that I respect your reads enough to consider that you can't be 100% wrong (and that you got Just!SK), I don't see why it would be weird for me to give more credence to your reads?

We may have disagreed, but that doesn't I was going to totally ignore your reads. That's what scum does.

Ryuki · « **Reply #409 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:47:03 PM »

Quote from: Empress Iffrita on July 16, 2011, 06:42:35 PM

If Miya was a tracker, wouldn't she have been told that I was redirected? Granted, I don't know how the mod handles redirects with trackers. I had assumed she was an Insane Cop or something. :s

You claim to have visited the person who died last night. Why would you assume this?

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #410 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:47:43 PM »

Moonin's claim supports me more than it hurts me, I would think.

I think he's telling the truth and that Bard's flavor is just somewhat inconsistent. :shrug:

Cut by Yuan: Like I said, I thought she would know that I was redirected if she tracked me. I guess this might not have been the case?

Den-O · « **Reply #411 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:48:18 PM »

Just found it interesting. Considering it was your opening contribution and you didn't really add much beyond that, it was just adding to the fire. Really, my problem with you yesterday is that every one of your scum suspects was pretty obviously derp. You felt like you were easy target hunting FAR more than you were scumhunting. I'll try to get a more detailed case out before the day ends, but I'm not going to be able to get you lynched today, I don't think. It feels a lot like it's down to Iffrita or Miya, both of which have points against them.

OOO · « **Reply #412 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:48:30 PM »

It would make sense from a Modding perspective, that if you were going to make a full-role game, you'd do as much as you could to make the setup obtuse enough that anyone stupid enough to use roleclaims as a measure of alignment would be directly shooting the town in the foot. This is what Serpentarius did with his game a while back. Besides, My role is useless enough that having another one shot neighborizer isn't as broken as it sounds at first. The mysterious redirect, if not a scum ability, would just be another measure of the town not accidentally making themselves super powerful by having Iffrita, Me, and UK suddenly becoming a Mason group/town voting block overnight.

Of course, I'm just throwing flimsy justifications around, but this is all still as valid as everyone calling Just Scum because Town wouldn't have double vote powers. In other words, I'm still holding the town read I had on her yesterday.

Cut: I don't think comparing flavor is going to make this angle any better guys. My flavor implies that I don't have to leave my room when I use my role, therefore, I didn't get told that I stumbled over a corpse with a knifewound.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #413 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:49:19 PM »

... Actually, that makes no sense flavorwise, now that I think about it, so I suppose her being a Tracker makes sense. I'm just used to Trackers seeing through redirects.

Den-O · « **Reply #414 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:51:08 PM »

Yeah, sorry about throwing a flavor argument out there, that was silly. Even the inconsistency is something I've done intentionally as a mod. It just bugs me because Bard seems to REALLY prize his flavor. Still, everything else stands between Miya and Iffrita. Hrm...

Den-O · « **Reply #415 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:52:57 PM »

Oh, Yuan, changed your feelings on whether Depore would let me die or not? Or are you going to disagree with my assessment?

Den-O · « **Reply #416 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:54:55 PM »

Triple posting is town.

I want Miya to explain why she didn't immediately vote Iffrita, and I don't think it'd be unwise for her to fullclaim her role/results at this juncture. The latter I am willing to drop with a convincing argument.

Kick Hopper · « **Reply #417 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:55:10 PM »

Also, why should this day become Miya vs Iffrita? I still feel it's possible for the argument to be town/town. Granted, if Miya really is a tracker then I'd be a lot less unwilling to hang her (the Cop assumption was the reason I was suddenly trusting of her), since scum!Tracker is a genuine possibility.

Ryuki · « **Reply #418 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:56:04 PM »

Quote from: Demon Navarus on July 16, 2011, 06:48:18 PM

Just found it interesting. Considering it was your opening contribution and you didn't really add much beyond that, it was just adding to the fire. Really, my problem with you yesterday is that every one of your scum suspects was pretty obviously derp. You felt like you were easy target hunting FAR more than you were scumhunting. I'll try to get a more detailed case out before the day ends, but I'm not going to be able to get you lynched today, I don't think. It feels a lot like it's down to Iffrita or Miya, both of which have points against them.

Fair Enough UK, and I did realize this. But I also gave reasons for my reads based on intent (besides Depore which was totally gut/Why Me, and I think that scum tell applies to newb scum as much as it does any other kind. Though, I stand by my reasoning that Depore's scum team would not kill you, because you were the only thing seperating him from the gallows.)

It's not really pushing easy targets when these players legitimately HAVE SCUM INTENT.

Ryuki · « **Reply #419 on:** July 16, 2011, 06:58:08 PM »

Quote from: Demon Navarus on July 16, 2011, 06:52:57 PM

Oh, Yuan, changed your feelings on whether Depore would let me die or not? Or are you going to disagree with my assessment?

No, I think that Depore is MORE LIKELY (but not confirmed) town by your death for the reason explained above.

I agree that there are other reasons for killing you, so that might need to be considered.

But Iffrita wasn't getting Depore lynched today. Not after you (as confirmed town) spent all of yesterday basically advocating his towniness.