Maidens of the Kaleidoscope

~Hakurei Shrine~ => Touhou Addict Recovery Center => Topic started by: Delfigamer on September 29, 2012, 09:27:43 AM

Title: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Delfigamer on September 29, 2012, 09:27:43 AM
Maybe I'm just slightly slowpoke.
I think, you know that YouTube has a lot of touhou music, there's even specialized channels (e. g. Louchan2, PineappleDisciple) there. Wanting to hear PoFV Yuuka's theme I've searched it, found familiar video from Louchan2, tried to open it, and (what?) found out that it's copyrighted (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44XWB99ts8E).
(http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/6412/110955323.6/0_a7384_d1543789_L.jpg)
Copyright claim by Zun? Sound like something from another universe.

...Ow. (noted that here is "Zun", not usual "ZUN")
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunken?
Post by: Cor on September 29, 2012, 12:31:44 PM
ZUN actually has filed copyright claims for his albums on Youtube before, but that definitely seems like somebody not-ZUN.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunken?
Post by: Kaze_Senshi on September 29, 2012, 12:57:00 PM
I think that sometimes someone creates a fake-account as an enterprise agent and ask to youtube to block the copyrighted-content just for the lulz. I guess that youtube system/staff can notice that the account which requested it is fake and make the video come back again one day. 
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Swiftwater on September 29, 2012, 02:14:24 PM
Are there any others which are also copyrighted?

Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: AnonymousPondScum on September 29, 2012, 11:42:14 PM
Probably some white knight type unless ZUN's gotten considerably more aggressive.

I remember one time before someone flagged a video of Alice's dolls singing the Loco Roco theme despite the video being on Nicodouga legitly. Killjoy. >:(
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Chuckolator on September 29, 2012, 11:45:40 PM
That's pathetic. Hope it gets sorted out soon enough.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Araceli Caralyz on September 30, 2012, 05:51:57 PM
Ah yes, those.

So far this is my favorite so far.

 (http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/1379/copyrightu.jpg)

(One of my community members has suffered this attack)

Also, it seems like this "Fake ZUN" has it out for Yuuka.

On my end, 3 different e-mails was written, one to the "claimant" one to Youtube and one for the counter-defense for the "claim"

So, tips include posting ZUN's Website (http://www16.big.or.jp/~zun/) and ZUN's Terms of Use (http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Touhou_Wiki:Copyrights#Copyright_status.2FTerms_of_Use_of_the_Touhou_Project)

If you know anyone who can provide such material as the one I posted above, do so; we can better denounce any fake ZUN activity.

Condolences to the takedowns!
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: fondue on September 30, 2012, 05:58:39 PM
YukaHeartKazami@gmail.com
SERIOUSLY!?!?
And why would he call himself as Zun with one capital letter?


Dammit I weep for humanity...
e: It's only a matter of time before gameplay videos get flagged...
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: AnonymousPondScum on September 30, 2012, 06:08:43 PM
At least being an annoying troll is very in-character for someone using Yuuka's name. :getdown:
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: fondue on September 30, 2012, 06:09:30 PM
I don't get it...
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: AnonymousPondScum on September 30, 2012, 06:11:08 PM
I don't get it...

Yuuka has a rep as one of the trolliest Touhous, you see...
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: fondue on September 30, 2012, 06:12:45 PM
Yuuka has a rep as one of the trolliest Touhous, you see...
What about Yukari  :getdown:
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: AnonymousPondScum on September 30, 2012, 06:18:16 PM
What about Yukari  :getdown:

Yukari's more of a mess-with-your-head troll whereas Yuuka is a HAHAHA YOU SUCK AND I WILL KICK SAND IN YOUR FACE SOMEDAY troll.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Tengukami on September 30, 2012, 06:20:03 PM
Eh ... it's kind of rich to call someone a white-knighting troll for flagging things that are legitimately breaking ZUN's terms.

The stuff that he considers fair use, though, by all means appeal that.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: AnonymousPondScum on September 30, 2012, 06:22:43 PM
I was calling them a white-knighting troll because they seemed to be singling out Yuuka-centric works for deletion, which means that either A) they're sane and search for/wind up finding a lot of Yuuka vids that shouldn't be there which is a normal response, or B) they're NOT sane and trying to defend actual Yuuka somehow which is NOT a normal response.

'cause I've definitely seen crazy stuff like the latter before.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: fondue on September 30, 2012, 06:24:22 PM
I hope the vidya will get put back up. Great music should never be taken down.
I was calling them a white-knighting troll because they seemed to be singling out Yuuka-centric works for deletion, which means that either A) they're sane and search for/wind up finding a lot of Yuuka vids that shouldn't be there which is a normal response, or B) they're NOT sane and trying to defend actual Yuuka somehow which is NOT a normal response.

'cause I've definitely seen crazy stuff like the latter before.
Why Yuka though?
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Tengukami on September 30, 2012, 06:37:05 PM


Or maybe they just have a desire to get videos taken down by so-called fans who break ZUN's already pretty relaxed TOS, and most of those videos pertain to Yuuka in some way.

They could be "trolling" in the sense that they know this will get a reaction out of people, maybe. But "whiteknighting" kind of implies they're overstepping bounds and ruining peoples' fun for no good reason. To that I'd say, if this person is flagging videos that are totally fair use, yeah, that's a crappy thing to do and appeals to YouTube should be made. But if the stuff being taken down actually is violating copyright, well, doesn't really leave much room to complain, does it?
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: AnonymousPondScum on September 30, 2012, 06:43:58 PM
Or maybe they just have a desire to get videos taken down by so-called fans who break ZUN's already pretty relaxed TOS, and most of those videos pertain to Yuuka in some way.

They could be "trolling" in the sense that they know this will get a reaction out of people, maybe. But "whiteknighting" kind of implies they're overstepping bounds and ruining peoples' fun for no good reason. To that I'd say, if this person is flagging videos that are totally fair use, yeah, that's a crappy thing to do and appeals to YouTube should be made. But if the stuff being taken down actually is violating copyright, well, doesn't really leave much room to complain, does it?

Yeah, that's what I meant.

Also, what I was trying to say was that if they were a crazy-fan that they were white-knighting Yuuka, not ZUN. :v:

I HOPE that makes sense. (At any rate your explanation is the more plausible of the two and I really shouldn't post about copyright issues before breakfast is eaten.)
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Raikaria on September 30, 2012, 07:50:22 PM
I was wondering which video went missing from my playlist.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Nindella on October 01, 2012, 12:49:28 AM
Uh-oh, I've had enough unhappiness in the past with Touhou videos being deleted...   :ohdear:

At least we know it's not the real ZUN... possibly.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: haoreos2 on October 01, 2012, 12:59:15 AM
Might be having a brain fart, but shouldn't it be copyright "Team Shangai Alice" rather than ZUN anyway?
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Tengukami on October 01, 2012, 01:02:07 AM
I think at this point no one actually believes ZUN is clicking through YouTube looking for copyright violations.

But yeah, it would be Team Shanghai Alice; not "Zun".
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: nicholashin on October 01, 2012, 01:21:59 AM
I think at this point no one actually believes ZUN is clicking through YouTube looking for copyright violations.

But yeah, it would be Team Shanghai Alice; not "Zun".
Exactly. The album songs are taken off at the name of Team Shanghai Alice, not "Zun". This is just ridiculous.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: fondue on October 01, 2012, 09:44:41 AM
Might be having a brain fart, but shouldn't it be copyright "Team Shangai Alice" rather than ZUN anyway?
I stognly agree with this. Why would someone for example flag something and give their nickname as who flagged it, instead of the company that person is in?
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Araceli Caralyz on October 01, 2012, 05:53:25 PM
Eh not sure.

I am helping the victim of the attack as best I can.

She does not want to do the counter-claim as it reveals too many details to the fake ZUN.

Any advice guys?

Things like this always upsets me because it it mean-spirited; the two works she put up are remixes which complies with real ZUN's TOS...
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Firestorm29 on October 01, 2012, 06:10:25 PM
Personally, I've wondered about this. In a situation where you know the person is a fake, why not respond with fake info?
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Lepetit89 on October 01, 2012, 07:21:41 PM
Things like this always upsets me because it it mean-spirited; the two works she put up are remixes which complies with real ZUN's TOS...

Are they remixes she made? If not, I don't see why the situation should be much different from ZUN's actual works being uploaded. In the same fashion that ZUN minds his works being uploaded because it's a violation of his ToS, it possibly offends the circles whose remixes wind up on Youtube, so I really wouldn't throw too great a tantrum because of this if they aren't her works.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Kaze_Senshi on October 02, 2012, 01:03:18 PM
YukaHeartKazami@gmail.com
SERIOUSLY!?!?

Yukari's more of a mess-with-your-head troll whereas Yuuka is a HAHAHA YOU SUCK AND I WILL KICK SAND IN YOUR FACE SOMEDAY troll.

Someone must have kicked sand in the face of the youtube guys to them not notice this fake account :P

Eh not sure.

I am helping the victim of the attack as best I can.

She does not want to do the counter-claim as it reveals too many details to the fake ZUN.

Any advice guys?

Things like this always upsets me because it it mean-spirited; the two works she put up are remixes which complies with real ZUN's TOS...

I don't know how to help you, but I am curious about what do you have to reveal to do the counter-claim?
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Gpop on October 02, 2012, 02:29:35 PM
Or maybe Google doesn't know touhou at all and that's why they fell for this? It's not like everyone on the internet knows of the series.

Just counter-claim guys, and the guy won't really have much to say anything about it on the fan-made stuff that's not his official works (ie music).
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Araceli Caralyz on October 02, 2012, 02:53:26 PM
Are they remixes she made? If not, I don't see why the situation should be much different from ZUN's actual works being uploaded. In the same fashion that ZUN minds his works being uploaded because it's a violation of his ToS, it possibly offends the circles whose remixes wind up on Youtube, so I really wouldn't throw too great a tantrum because of this if they aren't her works.

Nope, they are not her remixes.
I find it interesting though that said circles would pose to be ZUN though.
The use of it was to RP on Youtube.
I'd hate to see her get shut down; I submit to you the others should follow then and take down whatever is not theirs, right? :V

Personally, I've wondered about this. In a situation where you know the person is a fake, why not respond with fake info?

I have a sneaky feeling Youtube will not take kindly at that.

Someone must have kicked sand in the face of the youtube guys to them not notice this fake account :P

I don't know how to help you, but I am curious about what do you have to reveal to do the counter-claim?

You must reveal your name, address, phone number, e-mail... and other unplesaent things.
I say unpleasant because Youtube gives this information to the claimant aka Fake Zun

Also

"After we receive your counter notification, we will forward it to the party who submitted the original claim of copyright infringement. Please note that when we forward the counter notification, it includes your personal information. By submitting a counter notification, you consent to having your information revealed in this way. We will not forward the counter notification to any party other than the original claimant.

After we send out the counter-notification, the claimant must then notify us within 10 business days that he or she has filed an action seeking a court order to restrain you from engaging in infringing activity relating to the material on YouTube. If we receive such notification we will be unable to restore the material. If we do not receive such notification, we may reinstate the material."

seems rather eerie to me.

Or maybe Google doesn't know touhou at all and that's why they fell for this? It's not like everyone on the internet knows of the series.

Just counter-claim guys, and the guy won't really have much to say anything about it on the fan-made stuff that's not his official works (ie music).

Yeah... but if it was me, I would hate to have some weirdo I don't even know to have my contact info... It creeps me out thinking about it.

This looks interesting though (http://www.youtube.com/t/retractions)

Thanks for your support guys!


Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Goldom on October 02, 2012, 05:31:49 PM
I may be mistaken, but I believe that as far as YouTube's rules go, the person flagging them is breaking the rules, but there is no real recourse either:

YouTube only wants copyright flags from the actual rights holder - if you just go in there and try to flag something for copyright violation, it will outright ask you if it's YOUR copyright being violated. So the person doing this is not supposed to be at all.

That said, I'm fairly sure a counter-claim has to prove that the material is actually yours - which of course would be impossible since the songs aren't owned by the uploader either.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Lepetit89 on October 02, 2012, 07:04:52 PM
Nope, they are not her remixes.
I find it interesting though that said circles would pose to be ZUN though.
The use of it was to RP on Youtube.
I'd hate to see her get shut down; I submit to you the others should follow then and take down whatever is not theirs, right? :V


You misunderstand, I never meant to imply that the circles themselves would do that. Of course, it's possible, no doubt, but I was mainly referring to third (or fourth?) parties.

I'm not sure what you intend to express with your last sentence, but it's interesting that you'd grab a pitchfork because people are takings things down that aren't theirs when the uploaders are uploading things that aren't theirs either; it goes both ways here, which is also why I don't see what the outrage is about.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Chuckolator on October 03, 2012, 02:32:03 AM
I'm not sure what you intend to express with your last sentence, but it's interesting that you'd grab a pitchfork because people are takings things down that aren't theirs when the uploaders are uploading things that aren't theirs either; it goes both ways here, which is also why I don't see what the outrage is about.
Because the real owners don't care, and that's all that should matter. To take one case, the only person who should decide whether the BGM should stay is ZUN. If he allows it to stay, there's no reason whatsoever to support it being taken down, even if it does technically violate some rule somewhere along the line.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Araceli Caralyz on October 03, 2012, 04:31:52 AM

You misunderstand, I never meant to imply that the circles themselves would do that. Of course, it's possible, no doubt, but I was mainly referring to third (or fourth?) parties.

I'm not sure what you intend to express with your last sentence, but it's interesting that you'd grab a pitchfork because people are takings things down that aren't theirs when the uploaders are uploading things that aren't theirs either; it goes both ways here, which is also why I don't see what the outrage is about.

Course not, I was poking fun at you~
In seriousness though, I find it annoying she is being singled out, but by your own point, it could happen to anyone who has uploaded things that aren't theirs, right?
If this was ZUN, I would have dropped this so fast, it'll make Hina spin (sorry for the bad joke)
But it's the fact that some guy going around doing this is what truly bugs me.

Because the real owners don't care, and that's all that should matter. To take one case, the only person who should decide whether the BGM should stay is ZUN. If he allows it to stay, there's no reason whatsoever to support it being taken down, even if it does technically violate some rule somewhere along the line.

Ditto.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Lepetit89 on October 03, 2012, 05:06:50 AM
Because the real owners don't care, and that's all that should matter. To take one case, the only person who should decide whether the BGM should stay is ZUN. If he allows it to stay, there's no reason whatsoever to support it being taken down, even if it does technically violate some rule somewhere along the line.

As ZUN's case proves, lack of action does not imply that the artist in question does not care. I still find it questionable that the artists themselves should be expected to keep track of where their works are being uploaded when it's the uploaders that are expecting something from them, but that's still just me I suppose.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Tengukami on October 03, 2012, 03:14:27 PM
Because the real owners don't care, and that's all that should matter.

I'm sorry, but you don't know this. A thing being uploaded does not mean that the artist is totally cool with that, and it's kind of absurd to make this assumption.

Second, it's not all that matters. Maybe fans of this artist want to be sure the artist gets all their financial support and doesn't want to see them ripped off.

I'm no angel when it comes to copyright but at least I'm honest about my motivations ...
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Araceli Caralyz on October 03, 2012, 05:24:53 PM
Oops, perhaps I should clarify.
Don't care =\= don't mind with me being in the latter.
I then pose the question, what is a person to do?
Write to these circles and hope they will give an anwser?
It has been in my experience that method does not work.

Well, I know the obvious anwser is "Don't upload", but seems sorta strict, which also raises the question, are such circles able to come up their own TOS?

(I swear I am not trying to derail the topic)
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Tengukami on October 03, 2012, 05:32:52 PM
Not at all, that isn't a derail. Those are legitimate questions.

Well, buying the circle's material, for starters, helps. Let's assume this is already done.

You could conceivably contact the circle and ask for their permission to upload one of their songs onto YouTube with an accompanying image. But then ask, what is your motivation behind wanting to upload the song? To share it with friends, you could literally share it with your friends via email. To share it with the rest of the world, you could post a link to the circle's site (most of them will have audio samples, usually one track of 20-second samples of each song on an album crossfading into each other) on your social network of choice. And of course you could go on and on to anyone who will listen about how awesome Circle X's latest album is. Follow them on Twitter - a lot of them will livestream on Ustream now and then. When this happens, link to it so others can witness them in their live glory.

I mean I get that you want other people to hear how incredible This Song is. I love sharing music that moves me. There's just a lot of different ways to do it that go beyond straight up uploading the whole song to YouTube.
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Araceli Caralyz on October 03, 2012, 05:36:28 PM
Seems legit, I'll pass this along!
I'll let my people know (http://edgeofperspective.net/wiki/Concerns#Crediting).
(I hope the fake Zun thing is taken care off)
Thanks!
Title: Re: WTF, YouTube had drunk?
Post by: Lepetit89 on October 03, 2012, 06:11:18 PM
I just want to say that I was close to shedding a tear just now. No sarcasm, I really am moved right now.

Thank you for improving this evening by roughly 150%, both of you.