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The prequel of the popular Fate/Stay Night gets it's own animation, produced by the infamous ufotable studios, and written by our good fella, Gen Urobuchi!
Each Episode will be available oficially online through here, subbed in various languages, but each episode will be available on the week it's aired. (http://ch.nicovideo.jp/channel/fate-zero)
Right now the first episode, Summoning of the Heroes, is available, so go watch it!
Maybe the Novel isn't that new, but people may be watching this directly. For that reason, Spoilers are in full effect! Now go forth and discuss!
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Glorious first episode :o. My weeks will be full of waiting for the next episodes.
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Do I need to have watched F/SN in order to follow this?
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Considering that it drops big spoilers ever since the very start, Yes. I'm not sure if the anime version of F/SN skips on details that are relevant to this and are touched upon the VN, tho.
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Just gives me another reason to give F/SN a chance.
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I am watching this on nico partly because of how soon it updates, and partly because of the comments. Lots of them are spoilers though.
"THE HOLY GRAIL IS A SPY"
"IN RUSSIA, THE CIRCLE WALKS YOU"
"IF YOU WANT A WISH, ASK KYUBEY"
"Dear Princess Celestia..."
"WHERE'S MY WIIIFFFFEE" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxZrSILng78)
"daijoubu da mondai nai"
E: Finished first episode. I have high hopes for this one.
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Oh man, 47 minutes starter, this was more than I expected. Absolutely glorious start into this series.
And of course they ended on the best possible line.
Also loving the ending song already <3
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As first episodes go, that was pretty darned awful. It just reeks of Nasu and his inability to use ten words when a thousand can be artificially and awkwardly shoehorned in. Christ, nothing significant happened until the last five minutes of the episode. I trust it'll get better eventually, but, for the moment, I'm quite disappointed.
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I dunno what your expectations were, but considering that the original Fate-series needed two full episodes to get to about the same point by comparison
(the summoning)
, Zero actually did well in my eyes in that it at least managed to introduce all major characters and premises for them. Sure it could have been condensed if they had tried to, but I guess that's what you gotta expect with Nasu-stuff.
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I dunno what your expectations were, but considering that the original Fate-series needed two full episodes to get to about the same point by comparison
You're right, of course - Nasu will be Nasu. I think the disappointment came from my memories of the UBW OVA, which used that very pretty art style they've got going to have fighting and explosions almost immediately. That said, UBW went into the opposite direction and told the viewer absolutely nothing, so probably F/Z's is a somewhat healthier start.
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afaik fate/zero is written by gen urobuchi, albeit tried to match FSN's style somewhat
and dont worry, this is just the prologue, it was meant to establish most characters' backgrounds and motives. there should be plenty of good fights and epic battles coming up if thats what you're looking for
think my friends were shocked when they saw sakura and the worms
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I think the disappointment came from my memories of the UBW OVA, which used that very pretty art style they've got going to have fighting and explosions almost immediately. That said, UBW went into the opposite direction and told the viewer absolutely nothing, so probably F/Z's is a somewhat healthier start.
I can definitely agree with that. For people like us who are familiar with F/SN and its setting we could do with skipping all the exposition and just get right to the action, as the UBW-movie did it. For those unfamiliar with it, Zero did a good job setting things up, imo, and it certainly was a good choice to have one giant opening episode rather than spread it all over several episodes, thus why I personally didn't mind.
Now the interesting question is how it continues. I hope we will get lots of nice action next time, but if they do more long-winded exposition it might become grating.
Hoping for the best here.
Does anyone know if the length of the first episode was an exception or if they are planning to make the other episodes that long as well?
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well the first episode is pretty much exactly like how Act 1 was in the novel. so really depends on how faithful the adaption is going to be, it might take another one or two episodes to get things really started
should be worth the wait tho (if we do have to wait a couple of episodes that is). the fights in fate/zero were way better than those in FSN imo
Does anyone know if the length of the first episode was an exception or if they are planning to make the other episodes that long as well?
exception i think. based on what the official site and japanese tv stations said, the first epi was a one-hour special and the rest should be your standard 20~30-min episodes
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exception i think. based on what the official site and japanese tv stations said, the first epi was a one-hour special and the rest should be your standard 20~30-min episodes
That might be a very good idea, actually. Standard episodes mean a faster release rate (the one thing I was unhappy about re: Katanagatari), and an extra-long intro gets everything out of the way relatively quickly. Interesting.
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Considering that it drops big spoilers ever since the very start, Yes. I'm not sure if the anime version of F/SN skips on details that are relevant to this and are touched upon the VN, tho.
I'd say it's Heaven's Feel (3rd game route) that's the most useful "prereq." Though I suppose you'll get the gist of what's going on no matter what but things like Zouken, wormbaths and Illya's background
are completely absent from the anime IIRC.
As someone who stay away from F/Z spoilers I'm glad they took the time to set it up and looking forward to all sorts of battle shenanigans.
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Awesome first episode! A good combination of stuff we already know, and stuff we don't. (Assuming you haven't already read it obviously) Baby Illya and chibi Rin were adorable and as for Sakura...
;_;
It managed to show the personalities and motivations of most of the masters right away, and provides a brilliant starting point, without quite the usual amount of dialogue-wading that comes with the territory of Nasu's stuff.
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Seems alright so far.
Keiri is as boring as ever. Also, the motif of mass murder for mana! strikes again... by caster. I was hoping caster and his master would be more interesting this time, but it seems its just another psycho serial killer.
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Almost everyone I know is going bonkers over Rin's depiction here.
I think my head's going to explode if I have to put up with any more of it :derp:
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I'm more bonkers about Illya on the op :derp:
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'I ask of you, are you my master's father?'
"No Luke, I am your father!"
"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...wait what, hey what is this doofus doing in our filming camp?"
(awkward silence)
Anyway, Ilya's Mom, I'd say is the best MILF this season, god I love them fluffy russian hats.
can't wait till /the most badass/ Berserker shows himself. (the black knight)
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I haven't read the LN and I've been avoiding all the spoilers so far.
Even though we all know how F/Z ends, I have a feeling that it's still going to keep me on the edge of my seat..
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Is that some non-berserked Herakles, and some berserked Cu Chulainn?
Holy shit.
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1. But the UBW movie was horrendously bad
2. I think it's more of a "novel", it's not really that light, but lol semantics
Anyway, I appreciated the long drawn-out nature of most of the episode; I mean, there really is a lot of stuff to go over before diving into this, in my opinion. It took me that long just to get the characters straight in my head...
It did feel like a huge build-up to a really awesome end of the episode, though. But keep in mind that the slow part was pretty much entirely the prologue in the first novel - I'd rather they do it this way than have them fuck it up like the UBW movie.
also i am a huge nerd and appreciate all the background on this
I own the first novel, but it's hard as hell to read so I haven't really gotten anywhere with it. However, Waver's eirei looks like a fuckin' bro, I wonder which one it is?
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I may be wrong but I think the only returning champions between 4th/5th wars are King Arthur and Gil.
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I kinda expect at least one or two returning faces myself
because it's easier.
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By the way, basing on how the novel goes,
I'd say you'd have to wait another episode for another action as there's still some more build up before the epic first fight
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I hope these guys get killed off much more slowly than episode 9.
I thought Rider from FSN had more potential.
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Yeah - in the route they didn't animate :V
Even though HF annoyed the crap out of me I see why it went down the way it did.
F/Z was a more linear novel so we won't have things in this anime like making a big deal out of Caster's Rule Breaker and then doing basically nothing with it
right?
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As a type-lunatic, I'd say this pretty much established the Nasuverse as depressive to the newbies out there.
Damn, the Matou family is as fucked up as always.
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Typemoon always have a incredible setting + story to backbone their productions. This is going to be greattt
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STOP SPOILING SHIT FROM THE VN guys.
and that aside, I am blessed... if this comes on blu-ray, it will be so awesome my TV explodes.
10bit animu all animu, all season.
seriously guys.
my pants, I jizzed in them. The animation quality in Fate Zero especially is just amazing.
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So, um, finally got around to watching the first episode, and... Wow. This looks like it could be pretty darn cool. I mean, even if you don't take into account how cool the novel was, it's still really, really good so far.
...Oh, and I'd forgotten how cute Waver was supposed to be. This is something that I heartily approve of~
I do have to say, though, that the scene with the Worm Pit freaked the hell out of me. Poor, poor Sakura... ;_; God damn it, now I remember all over again why I despise Zouken. >.<
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don't worry, we all feel the same, at least some of us do.
I mean... like EWWW, goddamnit Zouken I hope the worms infest your testicles and rip you inside out repeatedly.
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I hated Sakura as a heroine in the VN. Her only redeeming feat was that she
ate Gilgamesh alive in that one scene, removing him from the war completely.
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1. But the UBW movie was horrendously bad
2. I think it's more of a "novel", it's not really that light, but lol semantics
Anyway, I appreciated the long drawn-out nature of most of the episode; I mean, there really is a lot of stuff to go over before diving into this, in my opinion. It took me that long just to get the characters straight in my head...
It did feel like a huge build-up to a really awesome end of the episode, though. But keep in mind that the slow part was pretty much entirely the prologue in the first novel - I'd rather they do it this way than have them fuck it up like the UBW movie.
Yeah, I sorta agree. UBW was bad in terms of pacing/arrangement. For example during the final fight between archer and shirou with lancer saving rin... they should have showed kirei commanding lancer to kill himself, have kirei step toward rin with the knife, and then blood splatter + sound effect, flash back to archer and shiou, and then flash back to who got stabbed,
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2nd episode. as expected it follows the original novel closely (about more? than half of Act 2), which essentially translates to nothing much happens. false start indeed.
the next episode is probably going to end on saber vs lancer
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Well, so far, so good. It's nice to see that the first episode wasn't a fluke. I really like how it's taking its time with the story and not trying to rush everything. The interactions between Waver and Iskander are hilarious (I always loved those two in the novel, so it's great to see that they've been given justice in the anime), and Caster's entry was pretty much exactly as I always pictured it
Oh, that poor boy...
And I love the end credits. It's really cool to see all the Servants in their native times, especially the bit at the end with Arthur and Mordred.
Oh man, I really can't wait for episode 3~
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The whole thing with Caster pretty much made me shit bricks.
Seriously.
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Holy christ, yes, that was amazing.
High point of the episode was Waver getting punched. It's impressive he didn't die on the spot though!
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Ah yes, Caster was even better than I expected. And that sequence at the end with
Assassin
just looked very well done and badass.
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Holy shit, that boy got wrecked... and while I thought he'd die the entire time... just not quite like that
I can't believe that a servant dies so fast. It's episode 2.. what?
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I don't think Assassin is gone yet, I took a peek in my copy of Fate/zero.
Assassin was definitely the highlight of this episode, though. So fabulous!
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I can't believe that a servant dies so fast. It's episode 2.. what?
GIRUGAMESH, though frankly, I don't think Kirei just seriously suicided his servant. Assassin got wrecked, but Kirei has something in store alright.
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Oh Assassin, I love you so much. It is such an unjust world that you cannot coexist with the other Assassin.
I was briefly hoping that Iskander would actually be Phillip of Macedon, once it became clear he wasn't Herakles and my dreams were crushed ;_; But yes, he's going to be fun.
Also I kept wondering if Gilles de Rais was going to actually be Abdul Alhazred or (more disappointingly) Aleister Crowley. I laughed and laughed when he identified himself as Bluebeard. Never though of Bluebeard as an occult sort, but he did have the murder and pedophilia credit for the role. And he did hang out with a convicted witch!
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Just watched episode 2 and... wow
sadistic Caster, much? And I don't think Assassin is dead already, though, since it's only just begun. Maybe that one's a fake? An illusion or some sort? I dunno... can't wait for next week...
Oh and LOLI(-er) ILYA!
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Oh man, that was quite the episode.
That scene with Caster was goddamn freaky, already looking forward to that guy getting beat up. And chibi-Ilya is adorabubble <3
Also, Kirei is even more of a bastard than I expected, going for betrayal right as the war starts? I'd have thought he'd at least *try* to keep up the facade for a bit, but nope. And yeah, I kinda doubt that's the last we've seen of Assassin. Nice to see True Assassin in animated action for once, too.
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The whole thing with Caster pretty much made me shit bricks.
Seriously.
I was laughing the whole time, though.
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Caster shot to the top of my shitlist faster than Shinji in F/SN, and that's saying something. Wasn't in Fate/Zero when I read through, that's for sure.
Oh, and Caster really is Gilles de Rais, if they are still going by the light novel. He probably called himself Bluebeard because it's more recognizable in the modern era, seeing how he mentioned being called by different names over the years.
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Caster
Cthulhu Fhtagn'd the boy so hard man... oh yes, lovely sadism, this is everything I wanted to see, and more! I just can't wait to his next cruelty...
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If you guys wanna read the translated version of fate/zero novel: http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Fate/Zero:Prologue (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Fate/Zero:Prologue)
(obviously contains spoilers once you get past the first couple acts.)
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Caster Cthulhu Fhtagn'd the boy
I gotta say that I did a flipout when Caster said that indeed.
Also Assassin dancing awwright. Too bad Gilgamesh is a sucky dance partner.
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Thanks, (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBjUvgi46mc) Youtube. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRhLd9Zt5GI) You're the best. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr-MUcmx_i4)
Fucking Caster, man. That's all I can say.
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Trollface Caster? I approve heartily.
Also, MI Assassin was great. Assassin is always great. :V
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HASSAN IN THE HOUSE YO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeayXRhwTu0&feature=related)
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Pfftahahah~ Oh lord, the stuff they're coming out with already... Somehow I feel like they'll all have a field day come the time
Gilgamesh pulls out Vimana.
>.>
...Which reminds me why this is easily one of my most anticipated anime of all time, eheheh~
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the next episode is probably going to end on saber vs lancer
yep. episode 4 is going to be fun
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Clinton is more formidable than Darius III! And once again, Rider and Waver steal the show.
...Oh boy oh boy, can't wait for Saber vs Lancer
next episode~
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The Clinton segment from Rider had me laughing. :V
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Clinton is a worthy adversary.
inb4 Bill Clinton is the master of one of the assassins.
Also that episode felt quite short.
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It is good to see my trust was founded. The pacing is much better, and the exposition nowhere near as stilted as episode 1.
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Dammit! My prediction for action was off by one episode. And barely off.
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Audio MADs on Nico. (http://www.nicovideo.jp/tag/Fate%2FZero%20%E9%9F%B3MAD) Something seems a little too similar about all of them...
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Oh goddamn, it's an
Assassin family meeting. KIREIIIIIIII, you bastard!
Also, Iris is cooler than her daughter ever managed to be already.
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Goddam! Episode 4 was pure concentrated awesomeness.
Especially Rider's grand entrance.
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not bad. looking forward to seeing
gil and berserker
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Rider's entrance and reveal made me :V
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omg f5f5f5f5f5
IT IS HERE!!
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So on this week's episode of The Rider and Waver Show (don't try and kid yourselves, we all know they're the main reason you're watching this)...
Saber is a rocket!
Lancer is the coolest hero you've (probably) never heard of!
"During the Grail War, we Servants must conceal our identities." "FUCK YOU, I'M ISKANDER THE GREAT, BITCHES! BOW BEFORE THE KING!"
...I love this show~ ^_^
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Okay, yes. That was the best way to end the episode.
Everyone's dumbstruck face as Rider rides in and announces everything about him.
Best servant.
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Forget servant, Rider class for best class.
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So on this week's episode of The Rider and Waver Show (don't try and kid yourselves, we all know they're the main reason you're watching this)...
Saber is a rocket!
Lancer is the coolest hero you've (probably) never heard of!
"During the Grail War, we Servants must conceal our identities." "FUCK YOU, I'M ISKANDER THE GREAT, BITCHES! BOW BEFORE THE KING!"
...I love this show~ ^_^
best hero ever.
you said everything I need to say.
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Indeed, Rider is my favorite hero in this entire war. With Lancer and Berserker coming up right after :V
But the Rider class is lame :|
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I actually don't think so, the Rider class provides high mobility (you might notice he has been traveling via Thunderfucking clouds on water buffalos) , the rest is to see whether the character can fight or not, Medea was more assassin type, but Alexander (I prefer this name) is a bad ass in sword, strategy, and ridership, With his sword above his chariot he is king indeed.
It is a bit like driving a car into a sword fight, and the noble phantasm more or less includes turning oneself into a motherfucking bullet-train/tank and ramming everyone like a F-22., you do have an advantage as long as Saber isn't a rocket
Moerin, I think you and I need to discuss who is gayer for Lancer~
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I actually don't think so, the Rider class provides high mobility (you might notice he has been traveling via Thunderfucking clouds on water buffalos) , the rest is to see whether the character can fight or not, Medea was more assassin type, but Alexander (I prefer this name) is a bad ass in sword, strategy, and ridership, With his sword above his chariot he is king indeed.
It is a bit like driving a car into a sword fight, and the noble phantasm more or less includes turning oneself into a motherfucking bullet-train/tank and ramming everyone like a F-22., you do have an advantage as long as Saber isn't a rocket
Moerin, I think you and I need to discuss who is gayer for Lancer~
its the other way around actually. the Rider class itself doesnt necessarily provide high mobility, but rather it demands superior mobility. hence why all the heroic spirits chosen for the class have something that gives them high mobility (Alexander's chariot, Rider's pegasus, and Drake's ships i guess). in terms of speed and power output, Bellerophon and Via Expungnatio are probably evenly matched. but Bellerophon has a larger attack area and the advantage of being airborne. both get pwned by Excalibur anyway
in terms of pure AGI which affects agility and dexterity more than sheer speed, Alexander actually has the lowest AGI out of all three Riders (the same level as F/Z Caster, even the 5th Caster had higher AGI). and i think you meant Medusa, not Medea; Medea is Caster.
F/Z Lancer's alright; two spears can pressure opponents and have the element of surprise, during the first encounter anyway. his story makes him kinda the 4th war equivalent of Medea imo. love hurts. too bad every Lancer has the distinction of having terrible luck. it's like an hidden skill or something, Lancers always have their fights interrupted somehow; always get command spelled into obedience; and always get command spelled into suicide
. FSN Lancer's supposed to be able to hold his own against Gil for half a day man
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Well, given both the Lancers in Stay Night and Zero are
Celtic
, it makes sense that they end up in hard times and getting screwed over. That's what happens to Celtic heroes.
Edit: Also: Rider needs a super mecha.
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I think Rider is a pretty cool guy, he totally doesn't give a shit about the Holy Grail War and doesn't afraid of anything.
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You know, I just realized.
What is -with- Saber and starting wars with getting crippled by Lancers?
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Rider: Servants placed within this class place emphasis upon speed and powerful Noble Phantasms. Their special skill is Riding, which allows them to fully utilize abilities of their mounts (ranging from simple horses, through motorcycles, to divine creatures).
Indeed, it focuses on speed and uber NPs, but I still feel that the Rider class got the short end of the stick out of all the classes (except Assassin lol), considering Saber class has their Riding skill, Lancers are just as fast, if not faster, and Lancers get innate Magic Resistance. And everyone has an uber ass Noble Phantasm here lol
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You know, I just realized.
What is -with- Saber and starting wars with getting crippled by Lancers?
She's English and has political power; she can't help wanting to suppress and dominate the Irish.
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Rider :*
Man it's such a breath of fresh air to not have silly school children running around and cooking half the time.
But since we all know this is a prequel.....
:ohdear:
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Just watched episode 3, and I must say I really like Lancer and his badassery, and Rider too...
But since we all know this is a prequel.....
:ohdear:
Yea, it's really sad we already know 1: two awesome badasses, Rider and Lancer, won't make it out alive, 2: every major character dies except Kiritsugu, Kirei and Gilgamesh and that 3: Kariya fails to save Sakura, oh poor, poor Sakura...
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Rider :*
Man it's such a breath of fresh air to not have silly school children running around and cooking half the time.
But since we all know this is a prequel.....
:ohdear:
Given the conspiracies and shits going on in this one, it really rams home how much of a sham the fifth war was. Many of the masters weren't even proper magicians, let alone really knowing what they were getting into.
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Given the conspiracies and shits going on in this one, it really rams home how much of a sham the fifth war was. Many of the masters weren't even proper magicians, let alone really knowing what they were getting into.
that's why Heaven's Feel was the best
route
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Any chance however to animate the sequel after Fate Stay Night? I think the one where Saber is red or something.
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You mean Fate/Extra? That's a PSP game, that's getting brought over to the states anyways. Oh and there's a sequel in the works, Fate/Extra CCC.
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And besides, the red Saber isn't the same one from FZ/FSN. She's actually
Nero Caesar.
>.>
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She's actually Nero Caesar.
>.>
Nrvy-chan
:V
So the only reason she looks like FSN Saber is fanservice, eh? Well damn, I thought they were above that :P
Edit: Looked at her outfit closely for the first time. Yep, fanservice, definitely fanservice. That skirt :V
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Edit: Looked at her outfit closely for the first time. Yep, fanservice, definitely fanservice. That skirt :V
Now go see her new Fate/Extra CCC outfit (Saber Bride)!
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Yea, it's really sad we already know 1: two awesome badasses, Rider and Lancer, won't make it out alive, 2: every major character dies except Kiritsugu, Kirei and Gilgamesh and that 3: Kariya fails to save Sakura, oh poor, poor Sakura...
Technically we didn't know the second, FSN only confirms Pappy Tohsaka and Irisviel dies. Waver, His Jackass Teacher, Kariya, Kirigitsu's Gunbuddy, Mr. Psycho, and anyone I forgot are all up in the air, as Master killing is not required.
Then again, they all deserve horrible deaths, and none of these guys seem the type to consider letting people live... But that's more implications from the show.
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Berserker where are youuuuuuuuu???
Also, fuckyea Lancer. You're looking to be as badass as FSN Lancer, and that's impressive.
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:V Next episode is going to be awesome. It also personifies why it's much better than the 5th war, and I can summarize it in two words.
TEAM DEATHMATCH
Also, BAASAAKAA is the most badass servant ever.
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Both FSN/Z Lancers are handsome Celtic men.
Perhaps all Celts are handsome
and hence handsome Celts are always Lancers...
let that sink in for a moment...
mmmm... what a great time to exist in.
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If I remember right, a lot of the Fianna were supposed to be very handsome, so you might be onto something there...
And of course C? Chulainn was supposed to be pretty hot too. Well, when he wasn't in R?astrad at least. >.>
Berserker where are youuuuuuuuu???
Always save the best 'till last.
...Well, seeing Rider they're obviously not following that to the letter, but still.
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One thing I'm still confused/curious about:
Where the hell do Lancer's lances come from? The names don't help, G?e dearg and G?e bhu? meaning red and yellow spear respectively. On top of that, Diarmuid isn't known for being a lancer. Or anything very much for that matter, aside from his love spot (Which whenever a more precise location than "His face" is given, it's on his forehead), and being gored to death by a boar. Now I'm sure he would have used spears at some point, since basically every warrior did, but how did they end up as a noble phantasm?
How the hell did he get summoned?
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One thing I'm still confused/curious about:
Where the hell do Lancer's lances come from? The names don't help, G?e dearg and G?e bhu? meaning red and yellow spear respectively. On top of that, Diarmuid isn't known for being a lancer. Or anything very much for that matter, aside from his love spot (Which whenever a more precise location than "His face" is given, it's on his forehead), and being gored to death by a boar. Now I'm sure he would have used spears at some point, since basically every warrior did, but how did they end up as a noble phantasm?
How the hell did he get summoned?
one thing to take into consideration is that Diarmuid's stories differ between sources; i've once read that his beauty spot (ball seirce?) is somewhere on his shoulder. i guess most sources agree that it is somewhere on his forehead and he keeps a cap to cover it (?). here it's near the corner of his eye is probably to symbolize his tragic life; it's called a tear mole iirc.
about the spears. it has actually been stated in stories that Diarmuid has two spears called Gae Dearg and Gae Buidhe, as well as two swords named Moralltach (Great Fury) and Beagalltach (Little Fury). afaik the two spears didn't have any special ability other than to deal wounds that can not be healed. i dunno what Beagalltach does but apparently Moralltach can destroy everything in one hit. maybe he should have been a Saber instead.
it is said that he carries Gae Dearg and Moralltach for greater adventures and Gae Buidhe & Beagalltach for lesser adventures. he didn't listen to his wife before going on the boar hunt and took Gae Buidhe and Beagalltach. he threw Gae Buidhe at the boar and apparently it didnt scratch the boar. so in the end he used Beagalltach to kill the boar (not the blade, apparently the sword broke and Diarmuid smashed the boar's skull with the hilt)...but ofc he died as well
and seeing as how Gil got summoned with the first snake skin. im guessing Kayneth summoned Diarmuid with the boar's fangs
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It seems for sure that servants are summoned via an object that poses significant examples to them, or were of particular affinity to them. The first snake skin was Gil, as with Saber's conceptual weapon Excalibur's sheath, (if I recall she has two swords, one is Caliburn and the real thing being Excalibur). Of course giving this is fiction, I am fairly certain the magical properties concerning the red spear being able to dispel magic, and the yellow being able to deal wounds that didn't heal... (even by magic, certainly that implies the red spear could do a better job no?) are entirely fictional... additions.
Then again... I really have no exact idea how one can summon their future self into the past... when they are NOT even heroes here... so... (Emiya Shirou being summoned by Rin as Archer etc) how exactly does this system work? I for one, think is *~~*I DUNNO LOL*~~*
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Simple.
Summoning a Servant requires a few things: A magic circle, a summoning spell, and a catalyst. The catalyst is completely optional though. If a catalyst is used, then the Grail will summon whatever Heroic Spirit was most affiliated with the catalyst. As such, the first snake skin shed refers to how Gilgamesh lost his potion of immortality to a snake which explains why snakes shed their skin, sheath of Excalibur = Arthur, etc. Rin used the Pendant as a catalyst to summon a spirit, and as a result, she got Archer, because the Pendant was the item that saved his life and thus was most affiliated with him. However, if a catalyst is not used, then the Heroic Spirit that is summoned is the one whose personality is most like that of the summoner. So if you were an asshole, chances are the guy you summon would also be an asshole.
Now let's explain Heroic Spirits. What are Heroic Spirits? They are people, from all periods of time on earth, that accomplished a great achievement during their life time and become an object of worship and lore after their deaths. After being recognized as a Heroic Spirit, they are thrown into an alternate space known as the Throne of Heroes, where they are left isolated until they are called for. Unless the world summons them, they will be left there for all of eternity. The Throne of Heroes exists in a plane that is parallel to time, so they can be summoned at any time, any place. However, the Spirits are not summoned, but a copy of them lacking any soul.
Now, on to Archer. He is not an ordinary Heroic Spirit, but rather he is a Counter Guardian. Counter Guardians make a deal with the world, that in exchange for power to achieve a miracle, they will serve the world forever once they die. These people are summoned throughout time and space, as they are also in the Throne of Heroes, but these people are specifically summoned by the world whenever mankind is threatened. They are not heroes, but ordinary people who gained power through a contract with the world, and are condemned to forever save mankind.
And that concludes our Type-Moon lesson for today. Any questions?
-
If memory serves right,
Rin used one of her jewels (I think) as a catalyst to summon Archer, and if I am not mistaken, it was the same one she had used to save Shirou's life after he had been stabbed by Lancer, so maybe that's the connection?
Big chance what I'm saying here is wrong, though since I never played the VN. So maybe someone who did can correct me there.
Not sure if I should even use spoiler tags there but I'm using them just in case.
EDIT: Nevermind, seems it's already been answered
-
one thing to take into consideration is that Diarmuid's stories differ between sources; i've once read that his beauty spot (ball seirce?) is somewhere on his shoulder. i guess most sources agree that it is somewhere on his forehead and he keeps a cap to cover it (?). here it's near the corner of his eye is probably to symbolize his tragic life; it's called a tear mole iirc.
about the spears. it has actually been stated in stories that Diarmuid has two spears called Gae Dearg and Gae Buidhe, as well as two swords named Moralltach (Great Fury) and Beagalltach (Little Fury). afaik the two spears didn't have any special ability other than to deal wounds that can not be healed. i dunno what Beagalltach does but apparently Moralltach can destroy everything in one hit. maybe he should have been a Saber instead.
it is said that he carries Gae Dearg and Moralltach for greater adventures and Gae Buidhe & Beagalltach for lesser adventures. he didn't listen to his wife before going on the boar hunt and took Gae Buidhe and Beagalltach. he threw Gae Buidhe at the boar and apparently it didnt scratch the boar. so in the end he used Beagalltach to kill the boar (not the blade, apparently the sword broke and Diarmuid smashed the boar's skull with the hilt)...but ofc he died as well
and seeing as how Gil got summoned with the first snake skin. im guessing Kayneth summoned Diarmuid with the boar's fangs
Ah, so that's it. We only learned the lovey dovey side of the story.
(Damn girls schools. Why do you assume that we don't want to hear about heroes and fighting?)
-
Finally caught up with this.
Dat fight. Ufotable does not fail.
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[nsfw]http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/1023733/ahoge-armor-black_hair-blonde_hair-blood-brown_eye[/nsfw](danbo)
-
^
[nsfw]http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3018/33781120668892802111484.jpg[/nsfw]
saber's ultimate attack
-
EX
-TENKO
CALIBUR
-
berserkeeeeer. also dat BGM
-
"Would you like to taste this little girl's blade, King of Conquerors?"
totally needs to become the new "King of Heroes, do you have enough swords?". >.>
Also holy crap now I remember why I always prefered Zero to the original VN. >.>
-
Berserker, why you so badass?
-
Seeing who he is, it'd be an insult if he was anything other than a complete and utter badass.
...And the best is still yet to come, eheheh~
-
Man, Rider completely controlled this episode XD
And it's always nice to see Gilgamesh getting humiliated <3
-
Rider confirmed for best character.
-
Damn I was hoping that Emiya actually pulled the trigger, but seeing Berserker getting ran over by Rider's vehicle is pretty amusing too.
I really feel the urge to peek at the novel to find out what goes on now, please.. someone stop me!
-
Rider confirmed for best character.
This was confirmed in episode 2 already
-
Berserker, why you so badass?
I came 270,000 buckets when he howled, another 50,000 for each time he flips a weapon back at Gil, and 50,000 more each when he attacked Saber.
This IS SUPERIOR BERSERKER, learn something Hercules, you suck at it.
-
Yeah, no offence to Herc, but he has nothing on the Black Knight. Then again, I think that the only F/SN Servant that isn't ultimately inferior to their Zero counterpart is Saber, due to being the same person and all. >.>
...Um... And Archer, I guess. Although Gil is pretty much just classed as "Gilgamesh" in F/SN anyways, so... It still works, I guess.
-
Gil isn't so much as badass as being utterly annoying obnoxious, that his badass party comes only when he wields Enuma Elish.
then again, having Archer class skill Independent Action is really a one way ticket to 'use your badassery when necessary'/
Magic resistance wise, I think Herc still beats the Black Knight.
Dunno if strength is the same though, Hercules has some pretty awesome stats but derp growl growl HULK SMASHHHHHH.
-
A better Rider in every way, that is for sure. Ruining everyone's subterfuge.
I wonder if Bluebeard knows who Sabre is, or if he has just mistaken her for Joan of Arc?
Also fuck alls yalls, Gil is awesome.
-
Saber Alter x Black Knight Hate(berserk) sex
OTP
Gil ain't got nothin, heck, just to spite everyone I am rooting also for Bluebeard because well damn, I like his every bit as psychotic as I dunno, a psycho?
I wonder what can make one summon the Texas Chainsaw Massacre murderer to your aid? I imagine it is possible...
That said, I am fairly surprised by how easily agitated Lancer's master get by a few words from Rider, he is easily humiliated, not a cool head. I like how Lancer, Rider and Saber all have knight like honor feelings, they seem ill-fitted to be fighting each other than honorably working together. (lest of all fighting the Black Knight is clearly necessary for at least one pair... as Berserker class proved in FSN prior is near damn well invincible during 1 vs 1s)
-
@Purvis
The latter, this'll be shown next episode.
Regarding Herc vs Zero/Berserker
This is a rather interesting battle, but I have no clue who will win in the fight WITHOUT OUTSIDE INTERFERENCE due to how Herc's NP works. Regarding stats, Herc does have a higher level of Mad Enhancement, but if they had the same level, he would still out Zero/Berserker in Strength and Mana, and barely lose out on Agility and Luck.
Hmm... Okay, after reading it more closely, Zero/Berserker wins against Hercules. His A strength stat allows him to defeat God Hand even with E Rank Noble Phantasms, and he also has his True Noble Phantasm for overkill.
Regarding Archer vs Gilgamesh
Gil would win without a doubt if he weren't such an arrogant prick. If he were fighting seriously, with a cool head, he would be able to smash EMIYA to pieces, and he his stats are a hell of a lot better.
-
Gil is awesomer in Zero than he was in the original. >.> For one thing, he never used
Vimana
in F/SN. And F/SN Rider was pretty cool, but only in the one route they never animated and so the one route that's not as well known as the other two. Poor, poor F/SN Rider...
I wonder if Bluebeard knows who Sabre is, or if he has just mistaken her for Joan of Arc?
I thought some of his dialogue made it obvious which, really. Although this is coming from someone who has prior knowledge of what's to come, so maybe it just seemed obvious because of that.
Regarding Archer vs Gilgamesh
Gil would win without a doubt if he weren't such an arrogant prick. If he were fighting seriously, with a cool head, he would be able to smash EMIYA to pieces, and he his stats are a hell of a lot better.
EMIYA also lacks Ea and Vimana, which just gives more points in Gil's favour. >.> <.<
-
This episode. Holy shit.
OST Fucking where.
-
Seeing who he is, it'd be an insult if he was anything other than a complete and utter badass.
...And the best is still yet to come, eheheh~
That is true. I can't wait to see the part where Berserker and Archer fight again
A better Rider in every way, that is for sure. Ruining everyone's subterfuge.
I wonder if Bluebeard knows who Sabre is, or if he has just mistaken her for Joan of Arc?
Also fuck alls yalls, Gil is awesome.
Caster refuses to accept that Saber isn't Joan of Arc
I wonder why they didn't show Kariya struggling against the pain while trying to tell Berserker to stop when he went after Saber.
-
This episode. Holy shit.
OST Fucking where.
With BR Box #1, due 2012/03/07.
-
Legitimately impressed with Beserker this episode. Probably my favorite Servant in this war. Then again, I'm a sucker for anyone who teaches Gilgamesh why he's not hot shit.
Remind me to get back to that once F/Z is over because something tells me it's going to do something silly. (and by something I mean Moerin's constant fanboying)
Other than that, Rider needs to stop acting like hes the main character, and again Lancer is pulling too many comparisons to his fellow Lancer from the future. It's making me wonder if I'm going to like him because hes FSN Lancer with a skin change, or a legitimately cool character.
I wonder if Bluebeard knows who Sabre is, or if he has just mistaken her for Joan of Arc?
You know, why the hell does everyone and their mother look like Saber anyway? Seriously.
-
Ya know guys, at this point I think it would help if everyone put in some notion as to whether spoilers you have in your post are for what has already been aired in the anime, or for stuff that you have read in the novel.
Because there's so many people here having to show off that they have read the novel that they spoil everyone else on the stuff to come, and it's impossible to distinguish that kind of spoilers from the spoilers that are simply the discussion of the anime up to date.
-
Ya know guys, at this point I think it would help if everyone put in some notion as to whether spoilers you have in your post are for what has already been aired in the anime, or for stuff that you have read in the novel.
Because there's so many people here having to show off that they have read the novel that they spoil everyone else on the stuff to come, and it's impossible to distinguish that kind of spoilers from the spoilers that are simply the discussion of the anime up to date.
Official declaration: Please mark novel spoilers specifically, or be feemed.
-
Rider needs to stop acting like hes the main character
You mean he's not?
Alexanbro the great 4eva.
-
And in this episode:
Iris has the shiniest car in the universe
Caster pisses off Saber
Lancer's Master's voice continues to grate on my nerves
Kiritsugu blows up an apartment block
Gil raids Kirei's fridge
-
Spinoff series needed:
Racing Queen Iris!
Also Caster confirmed for idiot :V "SHE'S LOST HER MEMORY AND GONE MAD, OH NOES!!!"
-
NOVEL SPOILERS
It's because he's gone completely psycho. There's a skill for that, called Mental Pollution, which means that he can never come to an understanding with anyone unless they have an equal level of it. His is ranked A. :V
-
Spinoff series needed: Racing Queen Iris!
More like Irisviel-D
.
Also, Everybody Hates ChrisCaster
.
Lancer's master is annoying.
-
More like Irisviel-D
.
Fund this. Now.
Kayneth is supposed to come off as dickish, he's your basic pompous upper class character.
-
It was a rational decision for Keyneth to
use his command spell in that given situation
, but nevertheless i still find his face + cocky attitude rather annoying :X
-
I really love how well Caster and his master get along. It's so perversely heartwarming. And Gil continues to be the best, as well he should be.
Also:
<PurvisHasLeftThisTimestreamNWS> *So I totally want Rider to go on a GTA spree*
<PurvisHasLeftThisTimestreamNWS> *"Hmmm. So those vehicles with the flashing lights makes other vehicles get out of the way, eh...?" ::Ganks a fire trunk::*
<PurvisHasLeftThisTimestreamNWS> *And make Waver wear a firefighter's helmet*
-
I dunno why there is no youtube MAD or mashup of
Initial D eurotrash
with the images from that drifting scene
better yet REDZONE IT
-
Oh hoho, Lancer, I see what you did right there.
-
in this episode
Kirigitsu does something amazing and blows everything up.
I'd be kind of amazed if Lancer actually died there. I mean, It's POSSIBLE but...
'No magical barrier could save his ass from that fall'.
It's the explosion he needs to worry about. He has a servant you dumbass.
Also holy shit, Gil being pretty cool. Did no one inform the author he was a spoiled dumbass?
-
Unfortunately, they left out Kiritsugu's internal monologue where he recognizes just how soft he has gotten. In the past, he would have blown up everyone in the building instead of setting it on fire and having everyone evacuate. Yes, this is Kiritsugu going soft.
-
Why did I stay up until 1AM to watch the 6 episodes just now.
I was supposed to marathon this. D:
Not to mention that I have finals.
-
Obviously the solution to everything is to sacrifice more
Orphans! little children!
-
I like how Caster's master just an obvious I don't give a shit as long as someone dies...
-
Some Misc stuff (aka video on nico): Fate/Zero Communication Break Dance (http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16111578)
-
"Might there be a "King of Conquerors, Iskander-san" at home?"
Not even halfway through this weeks episode and already it's awesome~ Ahah, I love this series~ ^_^
EDIT: ...And after watching the second half HOLY CRAP. Just... Just the entirity of the Caster/Saber fight, especially when Lancer suddenly shows up. And Kayneth vs Kirutsugu is even more awesome than I remembered it, ahah~
-
Seems we'll be having more than one kind of
caster.
I've been waiting for him to break that out, ever since it was mentioned in F/SN.
-
Why did they have to end it at that part!? Can't wait for the next episode.
Waver, buy Rider some pants already
:V
-
Studying for finals? Too busy watching Fate/Zero.
Bah I am a terrible person.
-
Waver-kun you are a dick,
let him wear your pants!
TERMINATOR (beast) Kayneth, yes yes yes.
-
That cop got matter hatter's disease =[
-
Dear Kiritsugu,
if you go to the length of straining your body to its limits so that you can hide behind a corner undetected...
Don't freaking call out your opponent's name before you attack, even if you plan on using some super-duper secret weapon anyway.
Stealth does not work that way!
Sincerely, your brain.
-
Well, this episode was glorious.
Kotomine can chop down trees with his bare hands. While tied up. Discuss.
And down goes that jerkwad, Kayneth El-Melloi! His circuits are totally shorted out. That's it, he's gone, we won't be seeing him again! Nope! No siree! He's gone for good!
If only that were true.
Caster sure is insane isn't he? Love will do that to a guy, take it from me.
On another caster-related note, his VA sure does get into it pretty well doesn't he? You can really tell he's enjoying himself.
-
Actually, I'm kinda disappointed in it. Not so much because of what happens as how they chose to show it. For instance, with
Kotohime taking out the tree
, we don't see anything actually happening, he's just standing there. Then the tree falls for some reason
. You'd think, with a visual medium, that they'd want to actually show what happened.
-
I assumed we were supposed to be too entranced by Kotomine's finely toned buttocks to question that. >.>
But, uh, yeah. I had no idea what was going on at that point until I remembered what happened in the novel. Other than that, though, the episode kept up the good standard that's been going so far, so hopefully that's not a sign of things to come, ahah~
-
Kotomine can chop down trees with his bare hands. While tied up. Discuss.
Because he's Nazrin.
On the subject at hand: the tree part made no sense to me at all until I saw some power-ripple things emanating from his hands through the tree trunk. I assume he was channeling mana or something like that, but yeah. No clue.
It was still a great episode, though. And Kiritsugu is a bro, even if he is a douche to Saber sometimes.
-
Because he's Nazrin.
On the subject at hand: the tree part made no sense to me at all until I saw some power-ripple things emanating from his hands through the tree trunk. I assume he was channeling mana or something like that, but yeah. No clue.
It was still a great episode, though. And Kiritsugu is a bro, even if he is a douche to Saber sometimes.
From what I can tell, he was using a form of Tai-chi, my guess was as good, you know in Negima when they put out the theory of if you mix Chi and Magic together, your power is subtly doubled? I imagine him deep breathing and smashing that tree down with his hands tied up was part of that, he was probably channeling his prana into his hands, while at the same time using his kung fu on that shit. (heck, we know he uses Miyako's same style of attack, and it seems as with every anime character ever that knows kung fu this seems to be their choice of superior martial arts: Tai Chi style - Ba Ji Quan (usually notable with the elbow attack he gave Maiya, as no other Shaolin style martial art has that particular move *citation needed))
On another note, I now finally understand why Ciel can never finish using her goddamn swords, so it was those magic sword hilts, the rest is made of magic. Kirei's attack here seems to go against his surrender of the grail wars, isn't he afraid he might break the protection given by the judge to him?
El-useless getting his ass kicked, now that, is one hell of a way to go down, I am most surprised at how easily he was guided into this, I guess you can say he wasn't good at strategies.
-
That Kotomine part was ridiculous :V
First of all, he's got bulletproof clothes apparently, church R&D department been more busy than any military. And the only reason he didn't end with a bullet in his head was because Iris and Maiya were too dumbfounded at the fact that their enemy would not give up just because his hands are tied. Seriously, 20 seconds of staring at the guy until he finally frees himself, instead of, you know, attacking? What were they expecting to happen?
Also, "Driving a car is not the only thing Kiritsugu taught me". Yeah, apparently he also taught her bondage, good going
:V
-
Yeah, I was rather thinking that myself at the time. It's kinda bullshit how guns are useless against everything ever unless they're Outlaw Star-style casters. Like, it'd be alright if he regenerated from the damage afterward, a la Alexander Anderson (whom he pretty much is anyways), but being outright immune is kinda...yeah.
-
'Ey, Illya had to get made somehow, right? It was shown in episode 1 that she was born like a normal person, and not magicked to life like most Homuns.
:V
-
Novel Spoilers
First off, Kotomine's cloak is indeed reinforced, deflecting normal bullets as nothing. Thus, his only weak spot is his head, and he covered that up. Second, Maya had the shit beat out of her, and if you saw a guy destroy a tree with physical power while his hands are tied up against the tree, you'd be stunned and scared as well. And Kotomine is indeed a master of Baji Quan, and he only used physical power to smash the tree, no magic involved. And regarding El-Melloi being lead like a sheep. Kiritsugu has been killing Magi for most of his life. He knows Magi inside and out, and they are generally a proud and very hubris filled group, especially if they come from a higher class. Thus, Kiritsugu knows what the fuck he's doing, and how to deal with them best.
-
Maiya did manage to draw a gun a minute later though, while still in the same position. There was no reason she couldn't have done it when she *needed* to, other than pure plot-convenience on Kirei's side
-
Yeah, I was rather thinking that myself at the time. It's kinda bullshit how guns are useless against everything ever unless they're Outlaw Star-style casters. Like, it'd be alright if he regenerated from the damage afterward, a la Alexander Anderson (whom he pretty much is anyways), but being outright immune is kinda...yeah.
Ciel can't die (though I remember she was so because she was possessed by Roa causing her body to change into that of an immortal) either, if they are capable of that how different is bulletproofing a killer like Kotomine?
He probably has some kinda magic on him, plus, he is apparrently provided for by the Judge. And his servant being 'stealth type' probably gave him ample protection with its existence alone.
Maiya did manage to draw a gun a minute later though, while still in the same position. There was no reason she couldn't have done it when she *needed* to, other than pure plot-convenience on Kirei's side
When you lost that much blood and struck so hard, even trained soldiers find it hard to pull a trigger without double visioning or triple visioning.
Seriously guys.
-
Ciel can't die (though I remember she was so because she was possessed by Roa causing her body to change into that of an immortal) either, if they are capable of that how different is bulletproofing a killer like Kotomine?
He probably has some kinda magic on him, plus, he is apparrently provided for by the Judge. And his servant being 'stealth type' probably gave him ample protection with its existence alone.
This kind of falls apart when you look at it and realize that what Roa did to Ceil was not a thing the church did itself. So no, they aren't actually capable of it. Nor, I imagine, would they want to be, given the heretical nature of magic.
As for Maiya having vision problems, we can discard this because they didn't show it. It would not have been hard to have her draw the gun, try to aim, then cut to a first person view where Maiya's vision is horribly blurred. Or have her squint and clearly have difficulties seeing him from a third person viewpoint. They didn't. They didn't really give any indications she was having any such problems, when it would be pretty easy to do so.
-
Well, I just figured if you are have trigger discipline it would be harder to actually just fire random shots because well, that is what discipline is about, you find the target, take aim and shoot, I reckon in her state it was just well, acceptable an explanation.
then again, likewise, it was not shown.
-
I will never get sick of
of Rider running things over. He needs to GTA a garbage truck already.
Truly the bestest Rider.
-
Did Sola like give kenneth pain numbing shots or something. How could lancer not know she forced him to give up the command seals.
Also didn't Rider kill one assassin (he says two, but he might be bad at maths).
Needs more berserker screen time, although I was pleased to see Rider/Waver actually do something.
-
His Magic Circuits are fucked up, and that also means all his nerves are as well. Not to mention he gave them to her.
Rider said two Assassins are dead: The one he just killed and the one who died in the beginning.
Berserker will have his moment soon... :3
-
I reckon as long as Kayneth stays in sleeping beauty mode Lancer will not notice, but he clearly is aware of his ability to attract the opposite sex, and that's how he has gotten into trouble before, perhaps this time he simply allowed himself to be fooled. (No, I don't read the fucking VN so stop spoiling it). Meanwhile, Rider doubles his awesome by ramming nightmare starfishes, and indeed, like a true seasoned warrior, no amount of spare child guts will put him down, god I love his experienced power. Oh, and that one other Assassin is a bit slow witted isn't he, I thought they are skilled stealth artists, they should be able to hit and run rather efficiently.
-
Rider's eyesight seems to be better than most other servants and is probably equal to that of assassin. Seems like a class trait.
-
Presence Concealment weakens considerably when the Servant prepares to attack, so no super stealth assassinations :V
-
Episode 10 is weird.
Can you say, Rin Tohsaka?
-
All of my nutbladders are exploded after watching this episode.
-
Kariya
to the rescue.
Man, haven't seen him for quite some time.
-
Goddamnit ufotable, we did not need fanservice shot of Rin in the beginning.
This episode had insufficient amounts of Waver. But it's okay, because I enjoy Caster's master, too. It's amusing how few shits he has to give about what's going on.
It's interesting how in both wars, Caster had the least 'fitting' master; as neither was even a magician at all. I would say both were just normal people, but...
-
Caster was attracted by the nature of his master, it seems. Or was it that they mentioned in the beginning that Caster has no one asking for him, so to fill the quota whatever powers that be decided to pull the most maniacal one and deal with it, in this case it was Murderer-kun. (does he even have a name?)
Also this episode: JEDI MASTER AND JEDI APPRENTICE, MIDICHOLRIANS, THE FORCE IS STRONG WITH THIS ONE.
-
Murderer-kun. (does he even have a name?)
Uryuu Ryuunosuke (or, um, Ryuunosuke Uryuu, I'm not sure what order that's supposed to be in >.<).
Y'know, that was actually a pretty nice episode. It's good to see Kariya for the first time in forever, for one thing, and Rin is always great in my books. It was kinda sweet to see her and her father early on. I guess Tokiomi is a pretty good father. Y'know, other than what he did to Sakura.
...Why couldn't he be a good father to both his daughters?
-
Next Episode
EPIC DRINKING CONTEST
SABER GETS HUMILIATED
RIDER BECOMES THE MOST BADASS SERVANT
-
...Why couldn't he be a good father to both his daughters?
Because one of his daughters is better than the other in his eyes. The other is only good as wormfood.
He's still a mage, even if he's capable of being a good father figure. Keep in mind that Rin apparently manages to keep up a guise of being an honor student, pretending to be something or someone else is not something new to mages.
Kariya continues to unimpress me. Good to know you literally unflinchingly implied you were going to kill someone's husband to their face and asked them to pray you do so. I...have a feeling there is a bit more you want than just 'playing in the park' with Mommy Tohsaka there.
I am so hoping Tokiomi kicks his ass. Typical Mage or not, the man at least has class. Kariya has over emotional stupidity and a father who wants to see him die.
-
...Why couldn't he be a good father to both his daughters?
Because "good" is just relative.
In my point of view, he cares for his family in his own way. Nobody knows what would happen if the grail fall into the wrong hands.
He just doesn't have other choice, really.
(though I can understand your point about Sakura, poor girl she is)
-
I sort of like how Tokiomi is portrayed here yes, but it comes to mind why he would subject Sakura to that kind of treatment.
I mean, heck, what did she do to deserve it?
is it because she is not an honors student ?
-
Dear Fate-producers,
Stop trying to use German when all you have is a dictionary and no idea how to use the language.
It makes me want to punch you.
Sincerely, Sakana
Seriously, they should have learned after F/SN, guess not. Be glad you don't understand anything of it, guys, because it's only cringeworthy.
-
From what I saw, some commenter or something dropped a translation.
Considering the context, it makes sense up to the end, where it just gets weird-ish.
-
Oh, the sense is not the point here. The German spells in F/SN made sense as well. That doesn't save them from being an utter butchering of the language.
When you see an English translation of them, it will be with fixed gramma, I assure you.
Not like that doesn't happen with English often as well. You'd think people with the money to create an anime would have the little extra to get a halfway-competent translator too...
-
Eh, I've learned that you can't have everything right.
I think the words were chosen more for the sound than anything else, so it could just be a happy coincidence that they happened to make a modicum of sense.
-
Take it from a native speaker: They definitely had an idea what they wanted to convey with the words, that's not the result you get when you choose for sound alone. They just weren't capable of actually executing the idea properly, or didn't care to, which is kinda sad because it makes destroys the whole atmosphere of the scenes when you are forced to understand the words, as I am.
Imagine the iconic scene with Saber and she went "I asking you. You be my mister?" in English. *That* is how it feels to me when German comes up in Fate-stories.
-
Yeaaah...I can see what you're getting at.
Maybe they should've hired a native speaker to do that.
-
Pretty much, yeah. Or at least someone who had it at school, considering it seems to be a popular language :derp:
Though, as I said, it's not like English gets treated much better in those regards :V
On the rest of the episode: Riiiiiiiiin~ :* So she was destined to be awesome from a young age, good good~
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Yeah, the moment that Grr Man started coming up, my first thought was, "Man, I wonder how Sakana and Iryan and friends are going to respond to that, they had to have futzed it up again..."
Also, remind me, why was Sakura given to the Matou? I recall there was a reason in F/SN, just fuck me if I can remember it. I know she was chosen because magic circuits can't be split up, and Rin was the designated heir, I just don't recall why she got yielded up to the Matou.
Also kinda agreeing with Chaore on Kariya. But at this point, we know his mind is gone. Dude spent a year being tortured, and is living on literal borrowed time. There's no way he's thinking even a fraction as straight as he would have been before all this business.
So yeah, he's probably convinced himself that Ma' Tohsoka actually loves him and all he has to do is deal with all the problems and she'll melt right in his arms. Despite killing the father of her children, whom she presumably doesn't hate.
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Take it from a native speaker: They definitely had an idea what they wanted to convey with the words, that's not the result you get when you choose for sound alone. They just weren't capable of actually executing the idea properly, or didn't care to, which is kinda sad because it makes destroys the whole atmosphere of the scenes when you are forced to understand the words, as I am.
Imagine the iconic scene with Saber and she went "I asking you. You be my mister?" in English. *That* is how it feels to me when German comes up in Fate-stories.
Ok,
How would you say it in native correctness:
Du, wer die Fur geoffnet, wird Freunde sein
Fur die Aussage nimm meine Hand
Wir weden in meinem Zimmer treffen
Sind deine Arme klein, gross, schlank, steif?
Jeder ist gleich
I erm also watch Hong Kong subs, and Hong Kong Saber/Sader actually did say that above line, 'I asking you, How you am master of my?'
lol
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Also, remind me, why was Sakura given to the Matou? I recall there was a reason in F/SN, just fuck me if I can remember it. I know she was chosen because magic circuits can't be split up, and Rin was the designated heir, I just don't recall why she got yielded up to the Matou.
F/SN spoilers, ho! First of all, the Matou bloodline had thinned out to the point that they weren't generating any magi anymore; the only heir they had was Shinji, and the only thing he was good for was making everyone around him look better by comparison. So at first you could assume it was kind of a peace offering between the two big magus families of Fuyuki, with Tohsaka handing over the daughter that they didn't need so that Zouken could... Alter her and make her the heir of Matou. However, Heaven's Feel goes on to say that Tokiomi was in cahoots with Zouken far more than with just that; they devised the plan to turn Sakura into a second Grail together, and he knew exactly what the poor girl was going to go through.
...If I remember right, at least. Knowing me I screwed up somewhere and misinterpreted something, but...
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F/SN spoilers, ho! First of all, the Matou bloodline had thinned out to the point that they weren't generating any magi anymore; the only heir they had was Shinji, and the only thing he was good for was making everyone around him look better by comparison. So at first you could assume it was kind of a peace offering between the two big magus families of Fuyuki, with Tohsaka handing over the daughter that they didn't need so that Zouken could... Alter her and make her the heir of Matou. However, Heaven's Feel goes on to say that Tokiomi was in cahoots with Zouken far more than with just that; they devised the plan to turn Sakura into a second Grail together, and he knew exactly what the poor girl was going to go through.
...If I remember right, at least. Knowing me I screwed up somewhere and misinterpreted something, but...
a bit of novel spoiler along the way but keep in mid that both Rin and Sakura had very rare traits; Rin being able to use all five great elements and Sakura possessing only imaginary numbers. it's bad enough to have more than one children in a mage family because only one can inherit the family's thaumaturgical crest, thus causing fights and other problems among the family; e.g. the Aozaki family (which led to Touko killing her grandfather after he suddenly changed the heiress to Aoko) and the Sophia-Ri family (Sola's brother was chosen as the heir but failed as a mage, and Sola herself pressured into marrying Kayneth). it's worse for Tokiomi because both of his daughters possessed such valuable talents.
in Sakura's case, Tokiomi knew that she would be exploited because of her extraordinary trait (the Association for one would take and keep her in formalin as a rare specimen in the name of "protection"); in other words she wouldn't really have ended up much better than she did. Tokiomi had hoped that Sakura could protect herself by learning the Matou family's magecraft, of course at the same time he was also obsessed with reaching the Root and whatnot like the stereotypical mage that he was. and whether he was fully aware of the extent of the things Zouken would put Sakura through or not is another thing (though he should've known that Sakura's imaginary numbers weren't compatible with Matou's water element; Rin mentioned something like this in HF iirc), but he did try to be a good father to his daughters.
how well that turned out for everyone is a different story. but abnormal ppl cannot expect to have a normal life
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^
ah, typical isn't it, the same with those like Xmen or something...or better put like Shiki (the chick, not the guy since he is living the dream harem.....(in some routes)
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"BEHOLD MY ENDLESS ARMIES!"
Rider is the best Servant. 8)
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ROYAL DRINKING CONTEST!!!
That is all. 8)
Oh, and Saber got schooled in the way of being a true king. Broskander tells it like it is!
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This episode was quite good.
Waver continues to be clueless
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The way he says it like it is, indeed... what is a pitiful view of a king to sacrifice as charity to his men? and not lead them by example? In all kings and all leaders, a very prevalent feature is there: lead the people to victory, and by leading, sometimes people lose, sometimes they win.
In fact, if King Arthur was real and this was how he was I doubt his legend would be as worthy of sing song in today's legends. Think of previous British kings (The Barbarians as so claim by Romans) such as Caratacus. In compared with real queens like Boudica and Cartimandua, indeed, from this aspect Saber seems... pathetic.
An army for charity? Subsequently to fail to learn that some roads lead to dead ends, that in such decisions to carry on... is failure of being King. Even Hughes de Payens who founded the Templars had a better way to lead than that (not that he was actually any better, imo)
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In the matter of ideals, nothing is true or false, good or evil. I wouldn't say Saber's ideal is wrong, but she is just too naive,
to think that her wish will save her country from its fall. Rider made a point there, king is someone who you admire, an exemplary one; King shall grieve, King shall weep, but not regret, that's just insulting those who believe in and admire the king.
Rider, you awesome mofo you.
Also, I love how Gilgamesh stated his own view in regard to the subject; he might be a jerk, but he is still one of the kings and we have to admit it.
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well, ideals should not be bent by one's desire to undo what that ideal led to.
Gil did his usual thing, I guess in essence, his being the oldest, and really: the true ancestry of all kings, traced its origin back to him, so yeah, can't argue with HIS law.
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Gil remains, as always, the best
and unimpressed by reality marbles
. But Rider has proven to be a worthy second yet again.
However, I feel that the point of that dialogue between the two has been missed. Rider talked about the concept of king as embodiment of state; the kind of thing that would generally lead to post-mortem deification. Saber was talking about a leader; that is, someone who actually gets shit down and makes the state work. Rider straight up claimed that he didn't really feel bothered about the future he left behind, Saber most certainly was. The latter is significantly necessary in regards to actually leaving a world worth having after one perishes.
Also, that is especially amusing to me given how much shit Alexander's mother had to give him about leaving an heir to the empire. Nothing says don't care about the future of your autocracy like not even trying to leave someone to inherit it. (Though to be fair, Alexander was also probably gay. But not like that forestalled adoption).
But yeah, I really enjoyed this episode. Reminds me of old books that are designed as a dialogue between famous figures and put all kinds of words in their mouths.
Edit: Also: Yay Bucephalus! I would have been disappointed if Alexander didn't have his iconic horse.
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Personally I thought it this way:
Rider talks about leadership by example, and by clear example, such was his brand of leadership and he would crack heads to get to the top. Think of his as Branson-like empire. His is big, and talks big, and thinks big. His is a forward company, a fetching piece of the stock market that everyone wants to buy, and he shows people what reason should they buy into HIS idea. I think in a way, his would be the sort that says if there are weaklings in your army, you don't abandon them, but you make them die in your battlefield, you step on their dead bodies and you proceed, and smash the enemies with your sheer will. (that does seem pretty Roman to be honest)
Saber was talking about an apologetic type of leadership, the sort that 'if I did this, I would have compensated for that' in a way, many corporations today perform this sort of leadership because as the business environment becomes ever tougher, you have to take parts that compensate other parts, you become what you are, and when you fail, there is much there needed to 'regret' and 'redo' which was what essentially Saber said. (in hindsight, companies tend to 'redo' by firing perhaps the previous CEO, or changing structure etc, do they always regret? that is debatable...think Olympus's latest scandal) Is it a good kind of leadership? It depends, if the right moves are made, empires don't end, but if wrong, empires die. Such factors chronicle on who is making decisions based on what: public opinion vs personal veto. To do the latter, it means to understand it deeper than anyone else... *perhaps the tendency of brutal honesty in order to lead may fare better in the long run, rather than its opposite. Saber however, seem to demonstrate serving the people first, it is a government type of management perhaps, allowing the weak to be saved, rather than abandon.
Gilgamesh talks of an unapologetic empire that spreads and conquers, in corporate giants this would be a massive financial empire that fills and fills, engulfing all that is underneath it. Think the sunglasses giant Luxotica, now imagine that as Gil's speech, he mentioned of everything of treasure belongs to him, if you take essence, he meant as acquiring everything under the sun under his brand of leadership, his was to spread influence, and all under him shall obey the franchiser/head office under no circumstances be allowed to venture beyond its walls of rules and concept. If the head office has worked on formula A and it works, everyone will follow formula A to the letter. In his way, the weak must perish for the strong.
now this is just me of course, I see it in this way.
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Well, the whole flaw with that metaphor is that governments aren't businesses. Governments are not designed to exploit for a profit, they're designed to administer and keep peace. In fact, much of what governments do (maintanence, running courts and such) work at a loss by default, because if they were converted into something profitable, they would be too expensive to use. Governments don't really exist for their own sake for their own sake like corporations do. They exist for the sake of the peoples that they run. So in particular, comparing Saber's position to a corporation doesn't fit.
But, I will acknowledge that Rider's viewpoint IS corporate, because it is essentially selfish. It is also not very sustainable or dependable as time moves on. Once the big man is gone, it falls apart.
As for Gil, I don't feel he was even discussing much. The closest thing he said at all to a governing statement was that he considered everyone under his law, and had no mercy in executing it. He largely sat the whole thing out, mostly because I imagine he found the discussion to be largely academic.
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Gilgamesh has booze in the gate of babylon. This is the only thing in the episode I really give a damn about, holy shit.
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So this episode was more of Gil proving why he is the best, and also "Hey remember this?"
I really should have anticipated the new base. Oh well.
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I must question why when he has booze in his babylon must he drink Tokiomi's clearly insignificant french wines.
I mean, surely those cannot be considered anything above vile brew when compared with something from his babylon.
ok, one more question:
where the fuck is Ilya?
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I must question why when he has booze in his babylon must he drink Tokiomi's clearly insignificant french wines.
I mean, surely those cannot be considered anything above vile brew when compared with something from his babylon.
ok, one more question:
where the fuck is Ilya?
He wants to check out the modern world, to see if it's to his liking
Also, Illya should be in Soviet Russia, no?
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I might have interpreted Kirei's "feelings" and "joy" and "inner desires" assiociated with Kariya entirely differently than what was intended.
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I must question why when he has booze in his babylon must he drink Tokiomi's clearly insignificant french wines.
I mean, surely those cannot be considered anything above vile brew when compared with something from his babylon.
He's doing it ironically, as a way to taunt Tokiomi.
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After the first sip I imagine if he wanted to check out anything he would flung the damn 1980s chateau whateverhaveyoudeaux to the wall to taunt him.
and if he really liked much I expected him to sing karaoke and pick up girls already. Or do the sort of things that overbearing confident young men might do these days lol.
like... driving fast cars and swimming and yachting etc.
sadly, I suppose with the grail war one cannot do much of those without caution.
but heck, not like he has shown much caution already anyway.
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It is ten seconds into the episode and I want to punch somebody now. 'IT IS THE SAME AS GATE OF BABYLON, TOO HIGH TO BE RANKED LOL'.
I'm not even sure where to even start here with the issues Rider is developing with me now. Historical? Magical? FuckyouI'maRabbitical?
Edit: why is gilgamesh essentially making up for everything rider now holy shit?
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Holy shit, I saw a fucking
F-15
in the next episode preview.
AHHHHHHHHH, April can't come soon enough.
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Holy shit, I saw a fucking F-15
in the next episode preview.
Oh, you wait. Just you wait, eheheh~ ^___^
And so an entire season of ever escalating insanity comes to a close with Caster summoning Cthulu.
Long have I waited for this moment, and gaaah the wait for season two is going to kill me. >.<
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Rider's Gordius Wheel is awesome, ride wherever he wants in style :V.
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Okay, so I see
Uryuu's speech to caster about god and shit.
And I just have one thing to say about it.
Shine on you crazy motherfuckin' diamond, shine on.
The man speaks truth!
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and for some reason seeing the state of recent world history, I came to sort of understand his viewpoint and intend to subscribe to his particular brand of faith.
ALL HAIL CASTER
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Until it's said otherwise, I prefer to think
Caster is summoning Dagon
. It's more fun that way. I'm also terribly amused that someone has finally looked up history on their servant.
And as I said, Ryuunosuke and Caster has the best relationship ever. I think caster might be the only servant who really gave enough shits about his master to let himself be swayed by his master. I don't think even Saber respected Emiya that much; rather Emiya and she just happened to agree on a lot of things.
Also I am really going to be interested for them to explain how Emiya and the rest didn't know about Rl'yeh opening up in the middle of the city.
You'd think that this sort of thing would make national news. You'd think that Issei or Taiga would have made some mention of that over dinner, in their usual styles.
Also also: I really hope Taiga cameos somewhere. =[
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saw episode.
went O_o
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something called Fate/Prototype just popped up, apparently about yaoi-Fate Stay Night, female shirou and stuff like that....
lol whut
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...I pointed that out on the general anime thread... >.>
And I'm super-psyched for it, too! Now if only there was a sub of it (that wasn't so godawful it made me quit after less than a minute >.<).