Author Topic: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)  (Read 173838 times)

Forte Blackadder

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #60 on: February 15, 2011, 08:54:48 PM »
Reimu can be a "creation" of some powerful being, like Yukari. She has the role of "protect the balance of Gensokyo" and talents compared to a genius'. If we look deep in biology, making human is possible with such powers like boundaries manipulating. And Reimu also has similar power to Yukari (travel to other dimension, intuition on what happening to the borders). I'd not be surprised if Reimu was created by Yukari to do her job before she went to hibernation until PCB.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #61 on: February 16, 2011, 01:38:54 AM »
She's been sleeping ever since she was defeated in the lunar invasion, and possibly even before that. Maintaining her powers and all the active boundaries is likely quite stressful.

But yeah more generally, the Hakurei Clan might have been a creation by Yukari so that they can always keep track of boundaries without her influence.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #62 on: February 16, 2011, 02:06:08 AM »
So...Yukari could be Reimu's platonic mama?  :derp:
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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #63 on: February 16, 2011, 02:08:50 AM »
Completely pointless speculation, etc.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #64 on: February 16, 2011, 03:32:07 AM »
I stated all this before, but I forget where.  Apologies if you've read this theory already.


Rinnosuke actually visits what's probably (but not definitively) the Hakurei Shrine of the outside world in CoLA.  Sadly, he doesn't get to actually SEE anything besides the fact that it's a shrine.

It should be noted that while he was there, he actually heard a lot of noise, as if the place was occupied.  At that moment, Yukari kicked him out and booted him back to Gensokyo, and proceeded to make up some lies (blaming everything on the IPod and telling Rinnosuke it was all just a dream) in order to get Rinnosuke to forget about it (it works).

It should be noted that Akyu states "It is said on that the Hakurei Shrine on the outside is abandoned and desolate" or something like that.  The fact that Akyu starts the sentence with "it is said" indicates there's a good chance that whoever is telling her this information (likely Yukari, since Yukari is the main suspect with the power to actually VISIT the outside in the first place) could possibly be lying.

My own personal guess from these tidbits is that the Hakurei clan is alive and well on the outside world, and that Yukari takes a new one at a young age (baby?  Child?  An age too young to remember anything, probably) into Gensokyo whenever they need a new maiden there.  And for whatever reason, she doesn't want anyone to know this, and thus lies to everyone that the Hakurei Shrine on the outside world is actually abandoned and desolate.

(of note in PCB is that Yukari indicates that while this was the first time Reimu may have seen her, she has clearly been aware of Reimu since long before then)

If the above is true, then Yukari might be getting tired of always having to spirit away a new maiden, seeing as how she actually tries to trick Reimu into becoming immortal in IN's extra stage by consumming the elixir.  Either that or she just likes Reimu a lot compared to previous maidens.  Or maybe both.

Another side tidbit:  ZUN often times refers to himself in Touhou works as Kinnosuke Hakurei, which means "Head of the Hakurei Clan" or "Chief Priest of the Hakurei Clan" or something like that.  He describes himself as a composer in BoiJR, in character.  It's possible that the racket Rinnosuke heard was him trying to test his compositions (although if that's the case, the testing must have been going pretty badly since the sound was pretty horrible)
« Last Edit: February 16, 2011, 03:35:16 AM by Tiamat »

capt. h

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #65 on: February 16, 2011, 05:11:55 AM »
A lot of people say that Mokou can't visit the netherworld because she's immortal.

That would make perfect sense in certain canon. But seeing as in touhou, the Netherworld is a place with a gate just about anyone can fly over, I have to ask why not?

As in, what's going to stop her if she does fly to Hakugyokurou like Reimu, Sakuya, and Marisa did?

Zengar Zombolt

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #66 on: February 16, 2011, 05:35:16 AM »
As in, what's going to stop her if she does fly to Hakugyokurou like Reimu, Sakuya, and Marisa did?
Nothing. In fact I see no reason for her not to be able to get in there.

Pesco

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #67 on: February 16, 2011, 07:10:49 AM »
Mokou likely can't fly without exerting a lot of :effort:

Whatthe

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #68 on: February 16, 2011, 07:35:55 AM »
Mokou likely can't fly without exerting a lot of :effort:
She could get catapulted :V

Smok, destroyer of thoughts

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #69 on: February 16, 2011, 08:32:56 AM »
Mokou cannot die. To the Netherworld can get only people who can die.

I always imagined it like an extra strong barrier against immortals  :V for example:

Reimu: Let's fly to the Netherworld, Mokou
Mokou: K.
Reimu flies safely
Mokou crashes into an invisible wall.
Mokou: Sorry, babe. I'm immortal.

But that's just my own speculation, might be a miscalculation by ZUN.


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capt. h

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #70 on: February 16, 2011, 09:36:25 AM »
Mokou cannot die. To the Netherworld can get only people who can die.

I always imagined it like an extra strong barrier against immortals  :V for example:

Reimu: Let's fly to the Netherworld, Mokou
Mokou: K.
Reimu flies safely
Mokou crashes into an invisible wall.
Mokou: Sorry, babe. I'm immortal.

But that's just my own speculation, might be a miscalculation by ZUN.

Well, the thing is that there IS a super strong waist-high barrier around the Netherworld. But everyone just flies over it and bypasses it completely. There would need to be another barrier on top of the barrier.

Besides, if being in the Netherworld was the same as being dead, that would make Marisa, Reimu, and Sakuya ghosts. Whereas ghosts on earth in touhou are dead ghosts - being outside of the Netherworld doesn't seem to make them alive again. In other words, if being in the Netherworld = dead, and coming from the Netherworld = dead, that would mean the main characters are still dead from PCB, I think?

Smok, destroyer of thoughts

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #71 on: February 16, 2011, 09:39:18 AM »
Reimu, Marisa and Sakuya are ZOMBIES  :getdown:


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Forte Blackadder

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #72 on: February 16, 2011, 11:27:12 AM »
Ok new question: Do you think the girls are really virgins?
Except from Reimu, Marisa, Sanae (too young), the fairies (too childish), Shikieiki, Komachi (Death and Yama), Byakuren (be a monk since very young), Kaguya (the highest princess ever known) it's impossible for me to think they didn't love and make love. Of course, Yuyuko maybe different cos touching her equivalent to death. But Yukari, Yuuka, Suika, Yuugi? Nah.

A youkai is a living creature, they also have the urge to reproduce. We knew many stories about youkai kidnapped human to satisfy their lust, especially the Oni, which race is known for living with fights, wine and sex. If they became strong and restrain it, they would still find someone worthy to love during their lives (minimum hundreds years). There are a lot of stories about this kind of romance too.
There are also stories about beautiful youkai, got hunted by human and ravished. But I really don't wanna think about that with Touhou characters.
Spoiler:
Mokou...

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #73 on: February 16, 2011, 11:56:01 AM »
Well, the thing is that there IS a super strong waist-high barrier around the Netherworld. But everyone just flies over it and bypasses it completely. There would need to be another barrier on top of the barrier.

Well, except Reimu.  She just erases the boundary completely.

Ok new question: Do you think the girls are really virgins?
Except from Reimu, Marisa, Sanae (too young), the fairies (too childish), Shikieiki, Komachi (Death and Yama), Byakuren (be a monk since very young), Kaguya (the highest princess ever known) it's impossible for me to think they didn't love and make love. Of course, Yuyuko maybe different cos touching her equivalent to death. But Yukari, Yuuka, Suika, Yuugi? Nah.

Somehow, I don't think wild late-night orgies are what Suika thinks of when she instigates feasts. 

Although they share some superficial similarities, youkai are fundamentally different creatures from humans, particularly given how extremely varied they are.  Personally, I prefer to think of Touhou characters as largely asexual, with the majority not particularly interested in that sort of thing.  In my opinion, Touhou really has no need for such things.  Of course, I'm not saying it doesn't happen.  Suwako, for instance, has obvious given birth before. But honestly, it's none of my business.  All Touhou characters need to do is fly around, beat each other up and drink tea.

Forte Blackadder

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #74 on: February 16, 2011, 12:37:34 PM »
Well I personally think of Touhou as a "world", not a "game" so my point maybe stupid for most of people.
But I think they're no longer interested in sex because they've already passed that "period". Like Yuuka, now she's dangerous, but calm, collected and even behave kinda refined, however I always think she had a rough past, rebellious and uncaring. After all those years, many things happened and she became like what she is now.

Smok, destroyer of thoughts

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #75 on: February 16, 2011, 03:57:53 PM »
The sexual life of all Touhou characters will forever remain a mystery and doujin material. We can't know this. it's impossible. Only Suwako is a sure person.


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Whatthe

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #76 on: February 16, 2011, 05:17:53 PM »
The sexual life of all Touhou characters will forever remain a mystery and doujin material. We can't know this. it's impossible. Only Suwako is a sure person.
Suwako too is of debatable virginity, but there is one character who definitely isn't a virgin:
Spoiler:
Mr. Kirisame (well, unless Marisa was adopted)
.

OkashiiKisei

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #77 on: February 16, 2011, 06:32:25 PM »
A lot of people say that Mokou can't visit the netherworld because she's immortal.

That would make perfect sense in certain canon. But seeing as in touhou, the Netherworld is a place with a gate just about anyone can fly over, I have to ask why not?

As in, what's going to stop her if she does fly to Hakugyokurou like Reimu, Sakuya, and Marisa did?

I think I read this before, but I can't remember where. From where is this tidbit actually from? Perfect Memento hardly says anything about immortality in both Mokou and Kaguya's pages, as if Akyu doesn't even know what the Hourai Elixir is.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #78 on: February 16, 2011, 08:04:32 PM »
A youkai is a living creature, they also have the urge to reproduce. We knew many stories about youkai kidnapped human to satisfy their lust, especially the Oni, which race is known for living with fights, wine and sex. If they became strong and restrain it, they would still find someone worthy to love during their lives (minimum hundreds years). There are a lot of stories about this kind of romance too.
There are also stories about beautiful youkai, got hunted by human and ravished. But I really don't wanna think about that with Touhou characters.
Spoiler:
Mokou...
Actually, I'd assume the complete opposite. Since objects and animals randomly become Youkai and their lifespans are incredibly long, I don't really see any reason why they would have an urge to reproduce.

I wouldn't even be surprised if most of the Youkai are actually genderless and they just appear as cute girls because they want to eat trick unsuspecting humans outsiders (this is actually referenced in Perfect Memento) or because they just like looking like that.


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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #80 on: February 16, 2011, 08:24:59 PM »
No, that isn't necessarily true. There aren't any articles on the mansion besides what's mentioned with the Prismrivers, and it was never explicitly mentioned whether it was outside or in.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #81 on: February 16, 2011, 08:29:08 PM »
(this is actually referenced in Perfect Memento)

>1: Lately, a sport called "soccer" has become popular. Like that, Gensokyo is halfway infected with the outside world.

uhhh why does this sound familiar

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #82 on: February 16, 2011, 09:17:36 PM »
>1: Lately, a sport called "soccer" has become popular. Like that, Gensokyo is halfway infected with the outside world.

uhhh why does this sound familiar
Okay I'm confused now. What do you mean? Is PMiSS considered fanon?

capt. h

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #83 on: February 16, 2011, 10:15:34 PM »
About the Netherworld...

If Reimu went there, and was thus technically dead (if that's how it works), should the Hakurei barrier have fallen or something?

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #84 on: February 16, 2011, 10:22:59 PM »
Okay I'm confused now. What do you mean? Is PMiSS considered fanon?
No, ZUN was just snidely referencing a popular fangame.

Smok, destroyer of thoughts

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #85 on: February 16, 2011, 11:38:25 PM »
Question here: We got through the stages of death in Gensokyo, nice. But what would happen if Marisa died? Couldn't she just beat whoever shows up? I mean, defeat death with raw power? Blast death and live ?


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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #86 on: February 16, 2011, 11:47:15 PM »
After the Yama judges you as guiltless, you show up in the Netherworld without your corporeal form and you wait there until you reincarnate or whatever (some people just stay there forever). The living are still free to enter and exit as long as they can pass over/across/etc the barrier, but as the Netherworld barrier is so shitty ghosts will actually leave easily enough. The living are living and the dead are dead; where they happen to be doesn't affect them at all.

Question here: We got through the stages of death in Gensokyo, nice. But what would happen if Marisa died? Couldn't she just beat whoever shows up? I mean, defeat death with raw power? Blast death and live ?
You can't "stop" death once it happens. She could beat up Komachi, she could attempt to beat up Shikieiki; but it wouldn't change the fact that she's dead. Going against the Yama is likely an extraordinarily grave offense and Marisa would be sent to Hell or something if that happened. Who knows if she would actually keep any abilities after death though, or even as a ghost or something. It's hard to say.

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #87 on: February 17, 2011, 01:06:18 AM »
You can't "stop" death once it happens. She could beat up Komachi, she could attempt to beat up Shikieiki; but it wouldn't change the fact that she's dead. Going against the Yama is likely an extraordinarily grave offense and Marisa would be sent to Hell or something if that happened. Who knows if she would actually keep any abilities after death though, or even as a ghost or something. It's hard to say.

I think what Smoku means here is what Komachi pointed out to Marisa herself in SWR. If you beat up the shinigami that comes pick you up when your time comes, then you're allowed to live a little longer. It's essentially how Celestials and Hermits have their long lives. They beat the shinigami that comes reap their soul.
"I'm not sure about this anymore...Are you sure this is safe?"

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Smok, destroyer of thoughts

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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #88 on: February 17, 2011, 01:36:38 AM »
Precisely.
... And with Marisa's power that might imply she doesn't need to become a youkai to live oh so really really long.


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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Thread 2 (Please look here before anywhere else)
« Reply #89 on: February 17, 2011, 01:40:05 AM »
Oh ok. Problem here is that Marisa is a human and when she finally does die (presumably of old age) she'll still be an old mess. Kinda hard to fight as an old human.

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