Topic: Seihou; Touhou and Redesigns  (Read 245 times)

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Raikaria

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Seihou; Touhou and Redesigns
« on: October 12, 2018, 10:44:01 pm »
So, it's pretty common knowledge that Reimu underwent a pretty major redesign between Touhou 5 and Touhou 6.

Out of sheer curiosity; I decided to watch a video on Seihou Project's Cameo of Reimu and Marisa, and noticed a few things. I knew nothing about Seihou beat in mind except the name of VIVIT.

The graphics looked rather old.

Then Marisa showed up. First thing, she sports a pair of angelic wings instead of her broom in this incarnation.



Combined with the use of the Orellies Stars [Something she wouldn't do in a danmaku game until GFW since], I put this down to the fact that this game must have come out during the PC-98 era. It's hardly Marisa's first redesign in that era... or the first time in PC-98 she's been depicted with wings. [She has Daemonic wings in her PoDD spellcards]



Also Marisa has the ability to split into two. Combined with the designs of her wings, and suddenly it looks like Flandre might have been inspired somewhat from this version of Marisa... or maybe she stole Yuuka's duplication from Lotus Land Story.

So; let's assume this is PC-98 Marisa going through one of her wing phases.

And then the game progressed onto Reimu's part.



Wait a second. This is CLEARLY Windows Reimu.

It's worth noting this Reimu teleports; has attacks where she flies around rapidly firing; and even has a survival phase where she becomes a ball of light. Perhaps an early version of Fantasy Heaven?



[You can see VIVIT's shots passing through Orb-Reimu and her homing missiles ignoreing her]

OK then, so when was this game released?

Trial: August, 2000 (Comiket 58)
Full: December, 2000

OK, so where does this fall in the Touhou timeline?

Mystic Square:
Trial: November 21, 1998
Full: December 30, 1998

Emobidment of Scarlet Devil:

Trial: June 10, 2002
Full: August 11, 2002

Right in the middle of Mystic Square and EoSD? So this makes Seihou the first appearance of Windows-Era Reimu, pre-dateng EoSD by almost 2 years?

What's more; Seihou was on Windows. Not PC-98.

So Reimu's redesign was intended, and completed, for at least 2 years before EoSD.

But let's dig the rabbit hole just a little bit deeper...



The 2nd Seihou game was a vs danmaku shooter; with Yuuka as a guest character. And Yuuka is somewhere between Windows and PC-98. She has trousers like PC-98 Yuuka; but her hair is shorter than PC-98 but longer than Windows.

And then there's her special cut-in...



Wings again. Interesting. Yuuka has never been depicted with wings in Touhou.



Yuuka retains her doppleganger however. Also she seems to have 6 wings on her sprite. Also worth mentioning in this game she's slow and has a wide shot... sound familiar?

So we have Windows Reimu; a Yuuka who seems somewhere inbetween, and a Different winged Marisa.

And this all occurs between the 1998-2002 gap in Touhou. Between the PC-98 and Windows bridge.

I find this rather fascinating information regarding what directions ZUN was thinking about for Touhou between Mystic Square and Embodiment of Scarlet Devil. The fact Windows Reimu didn't originate in EoSD is a particularly interesting thing. Marisa in particular wasn't so ordinary, even at the time that Windows Reimu existed.

It's also worth mentioning the only characters from PC-98 to return in Windows were Reimu; Marisa; Yuuka and Alice. And three of them appeared in Seihou in the gap between 1998 and 2001. And the fourth; Alice... well... it's Team Shanghai Alice. Bit of a co-incidence, that the survivors of PC-98 all had some sort of connection outside of the Touhou games themselves.

I'm curious as to what you guys make of all of this. Or even how widly known all of this was. I don't see this topic brought up much; or this time period in Touhou.


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Re: Seihou; Touhou and Redesigns
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2018, 11:21:57 am »
I think ZUN was drunk and younger

I'm just kidding, a bit
But yea, it's like a transition thing, experimenting and new idea, human are just like that with their creation.
But i just decide not to overthinking stuff for ZUN designs, couldn't comprehend

Even absolute cool beauty like Kazami-san used to have such a chuuni one eye covered hairstyle, whatever it's actually called

Naudiz

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Re: Seihou; Touhou and Redesigns
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2018, 12:01:16 am »
Pretty deep stuff. I actually never knew about Marisa having wings in Seihou.

Maybe ZUN had some loose concepts down for the Windows era during SSG's development, so the characters who appeared there had experimental designs? Who knows.

Though, Yuukass... he'll never live that down.
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