Topic: Touhou Project 16.5 「Secret Sealing Nightmare Diary ~ Violet Detector」  (Read 24703 times)

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Suspicious person

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(...) I can see this being used in future score runs strategies.
Actually, scratch that. After doing some more testing in the Marisa scene where teleport gets introduced and doing a few comparisons, some involving ACTUALLY using my eyes to read the score, it turns out that the score you get is from  the best picture you take in a scene. Can't believe it took me so long to notice ... Quite embarrassing  :X

So, uh, yeah. Let's pretend I didn't suggest anything there, a'ight ? Scoring just isn't my thing, and I don't generally attempt to run for score to properly familiarise myself with their ins and outs.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2018, 07:01:33 pm by Suspicious person »

Gesh86

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Game finally has a Steam storepage now: https://store.steampowered.com/app/924650/__Violet_Detector/

Not yet for sale though. Sometime in September is when we'll have it available more easily.

Drake

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Came here to post this. Will likely be available very early September (if not the 1st) as the game is released in stores on 8/31.

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Helepolis

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Seeing Touhou titles appearing on Steam after a release at a major event is, in my opinion, doing ZUN and Touhou good.
Thinking about it, as much as some (yours truly included) might not like how the Nightmare week is designed, one gotta admit it works as a nice marketing move. Say, someone only played official Touhou games from Steam. They'll see characters from HSiFS, nice to see them again. They'll see characters from LoLK, no idea who they are but fine. And then they get to the "WHO ARE ALL THESE PEOPLE AND WHY THEY HATE ME SO MUCH" part, and if that's not a good push to dig into the series to discover older games then I don't know what is.

Fluury

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Thinking about it, as much as some (yours truly included) might not like how the Nightmare week is designed, one gotta admit it works as a nice marketing move. Say, someone only played official Touhou games from Steam. They'll see characters from HSiFS, nice to see them again. They'll see characters from LoLK, no idea who they are but fine. And then they get to the "WHO ARE ALL THESE PEOPLE AND WHY THEY HATE ME SO MUCH" part, and if that's not a good push to dig into the series to discover older games then I don't know what is.

I seriously doubt this "marketing move" is intentional given if ZUN really wanted to cash in hiring some goons which would probably do it for free to translate the game would help him way more

either way, the page mentions controls: any chance the teleportation garbanzo was changed?

Failure McFailFace

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I seriously doubt this "marketing move" is intentional given if ZUN really wanted to cash in hiring some goons which would probably do it for free to translate the game would help him way more

either way, the page mentions controls: any chance the teleportation garbanzo was changed?

Seems like it's still the double-tap focus teleportation.
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

Fluury

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Seems like it's still the double-tap focus teleportation.

shit

guess there our hopes go of a patch, shame

Drake

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I mean that was never a bug and is clearly the intention, dunno why there would be a patch. It's a couple of other things that need patching like the R to restart bug, if anything.

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Fluury

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I mean that was never a bug and is clearly the intention, dunno why there would be a patch. It's a couple of other things that need patching like the R to restart bug, if anything.

I'd assume that everyone and their mother would be complaining about the input which might move ZUN to change it.
I'd assume that everyone and their mother would be complaining about the input which might move ZUN to change it.

You must be new to the series. Welcome aboard.

Suspicious person

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I'd assume that everyone and their mother would be complaining about the input which might move ZUN to change it.
Previous ZUN patches generally address game-breaking bugs and issues. The issue with VD's input thing really is about convenience, so I wouldn't bet on that ; it's highly unlikely considering previous examples.
The double-tap-to-teleport strikes me as an intentional game balance decision, in a similar vein as special move inputs in fighting games. Double-tap forces players to sit still before the teleport, meaning they have to preemptively set up the teleport instead of being able to teleport instantly on reaction.

Imo a better implementation would be holding C+direction for a few frames to teleport. This preserves the delay before the teleport, and removes the frustration of the teleport not working due to moving during the double-tap.

The C-key teleport mod lets you teleport instantly without any delay, so imo the C-key mod is cheating. Holding C+direction results in stupidly fast teleporting. It's a cool mod though.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2018, 02:53:20 am by shockdude »
Playing Touhou since 18 March 2012. Playing video games since 19XX.
Normal 1CC: EoSD, PCB, IN, PoFV, MoF, SA, UFO, TD, DDC, HSiFS, CtC.
Extra 1CC: EoSD, PCB+Phantasm, IN, PoFV (K&S), MoF, SA, TD, HSiFS, CtC+Phantasm.
Hard 1CC: EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF, TD, CtC.
Lunatic 1CC: EoSD

ZoomyTsugumi

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Yeah the slight delay in teleporting is imo pretty important to the balancing of the mechanic. The issue for me comes in the fact that it's 3-4 entire inputs, each apparently with their own weird frame data that needs to be accounted for, so in the few spells that pretty much require speedy, accurate usage of teleporting it becomes soooo finicky and hard to use. Reducing it to 2-3 inputs with C + direction but keeping the slight delay seems like a much better alternative. Plus there's the fact that double tapping shift is both awkward to do intentionally to utilise a mechanic but also something that I and many others do during just regular dodging, leading to awful situations where a teleport just happens in the middle of dodging because of fast alternation between unfocused and focused speeds. Binding it to C removes pretty much all of the issues I have with it's current implementation.

Drake

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I'm the one that broke down the frame data and I don't think the data itself is that weird. Most of it is to make sure you aren't accidentally teleporting; the only real strange part is how you have to hold your direction without any indication, which as explained earlier is just a sketchy implementation choice. I definitely double-tap shift a lot during movement too, but it won't teleport while moving so that typically isn't a problem either.

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CrestedPeak9

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I don't really think that whether he'd change the teleport is even up for debate, there's no way he'll do that.

My bigger problem is that given ZUN didn't fix any of the bugs in HSiFS, I'm deeply concerned over Esc-R continuing to be broken in the Steam release, not to mention the game crash/respawn glitches possible thanks to the broken R hotkey.
Hard 1cc: LLS, EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF, SA, UFO, TD, DDC
Lunatic 1cc: EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF, TD, DDC, LoLK, HSiFS
Easy Perfect: EoSD, MoF, TD, HSiFS
Working on WNSP Normal NMNB for a video project.

ZoomyTsugumi

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I'm the one that broke down the frame data and I don't think the data itself is that weird. Most of it is to make sure you aren't accidentally teleporting; the only real strange part is how you have to hold your direction without any indication, which as explained earlier is just a sketchy implementation choice. I definitely double-tap shift a lot during movement too, but it won't teleport while moving so that typically isn't a problem either.
It was most definitely a problem for me at some points, most notably in Hecatia's first scene (I think) which featured a lot of relatively speedy left/right movement. there were many times there that I got teleported just trying to switch directions.

Fluury

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You must be new to the series. Welcome aboard.

Have been with the game since 8. I know that ZUN generally doesn't do that stuff but there are always first times, right? :(

(I'd also very much consider the C-Mod not cheating, just because I have no interest in getting carpal tunnel...?)
« Last Edit: August 17, 2018, 05:13:09 am by Fluury »

Helepolis

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Good morning, afternoon, evening or w/e time zone you live in :V

Spoiler mode is hereby over. You may freely discuss / post about the game as long as you don't openly post endings or ending dialogues. Cheers.
Hooray, spoiler mode is over!  Now we can openly talk about how it's strange Sumireko's glasses' lenses don't have a bridge connecting them! \o/

Also, I took a pic of Junko and Hecatia and I got a #GetARoomYouTwoLOL bonus.  10/10

Failure McFailFace

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So I find it strange that the hashtags are fully English-translated in the THCRAP patch, but I can't find the strings anywhere. Makes me wonder where those came from, and if there's a list of hashtags and what they do on score.
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

PK

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So I find it strange that the hashtags are fully English-translated in the THCRAP patch, but I can't find the strings anywhere. Makes me wonder where those came from, and if there's a list of hashtags and what they do on score.
You mean this? It's the only thing i could find in their site. I don't know if it exists in non-image format.
So I find it strange that the hashtags are fully English-translated in the THCRAP patch, but I can't find the strings anywhere. Makes me wonder where those came from, and if there's a list of hashtags and what they do on score.
The original Japanese hashtags are transcribed here, for reference.
Playing Touhou since 18 March 2012. Playing video games since 19XX.
Normal 1CC: EoSD, PCB, IN, PoFV, MoF, SA, UFO, TD, DDC, HSiFS, CtC.
Extra 1CC: EoSD, PCB+Phantasm, IN, PoFV (K&S), MoF, SA, TD, HSiFS, CtC+Phantasm.
Hard 1CC: EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF, TD, CtC.
Lunatic 1CC: EoSD

Failure McFailFace

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I just minimally grinded my way to Nightmare Sunday, and have 100 attempts on Dream 1 (Rem/Flan) currently.

My ring finger hurts from mashing shift so much. I'm still not done.

Yeah, I very much agree that the teleport key combo is super janky. Sometimes I mis-input and go in the opposite direction I want, and sometimes I need to teleport and I somehow press the direction for less than 5 frames, leading to a failed teleport.

also how are you supposed to do the 2nd phase once you kill remilia it's isc day 10 all over again

edit: i'm at 155 attempts i'm going to bed
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 03:52:17 am by Failure McFailFace »
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

Drake

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personally I find saving remi for last is easier usually but I guess it's a matter of what your'e comfortable dodging

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7TC7

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My ring finger hurts from mashing shift so much. I'm still not done.

What are you teleporting for in Nightmare Sunday? I am pretty sure Junko is the only one in the Nightmare Week requiring teleports.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qb929DrtZnw <<< my completion of it.

I agree its one of the hardest Nightmare Spells however. Sure sets the mood for something that's sadly not to come.

---

And while I'm here, guess I'll give my opinion on the game.
This is probably my favorite of the Shoot The Bullet style games, and that's solely on the strength of Wrong Week.
I have forgotten everything that happens in the First Week and have shelved that as simply being a tutorial.
Nightmare Week is a very interesting concept and has some gems in it (Remi/Flan, Everything involving Junko), but overall it felt far too easy.

By saying "Everything involving Junko", it's probably obvious I really love the teleport mechanic. At first it was incredibly hard to get it down but I quickly got the hang of it and started really enjoying it. I don't think there is anything wrong with it aside from it maybe needing some more easy stages that require it before throwing you into the fire.

The two mechanical complaints I have about the game are:
1. that Double KOs happen far too often. Only Nightmare Bosses seem to care about properly cleaning up their bullets when they die and I have died during a boss explosion many many times.
2. the sudden speed change after you fully charge your camera. It's just really hard to react to that and then you shoot off into some bullet you thought you already avoided.

Failure McFailFace

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What are you teleporting for in Nightmare Sunday? I am pretty sure Junko is the only one in the Nightmare Week requiring teleports.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qb929DrtZnw <<< my completion of it.

Your video's broke.

I was teleporting in Dream 1, with Remi/Flan, to get into the ring from Flandre's bubble bullets to prepare for Remilia's next wave.
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

7TC7

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Your video's broke.

I was teleporting in Dream 1, with Remi/Flan, to get into the ring from Flandre's bubble bullets to prepare for Remilia's next wave.

Sorry, had it on private instead of unlisted. Should work now.

The main trick to me seems to delete as much of Flandre's bubbles before they can hit the wall as possible.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 03:36:52 pm by 7TC7 »

N-Forza

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There was a Touhou Station broadcast on Nicovideo last night to commemorate the release. They showed off the game a bit and ZUN mentioned a few interesting tidbits.

It takes him around three hours (interspersed with drinking) to draw a character, but a month or two to fully flesh out their backgrounds.

He thought the Sealing Club fandom was "bothersome" when he heard they were grateful for the new game but didn't want too much backstory on that subset of characters.

He would never want to attend Comiket not as a circle and doesn't seem all that interested in fan works.

The next Foreign Creators magazine will feature not a special CD but a separate booklet with "surprising" contents. He'll reveal more during his next Youtube broadcast on the 29th.

Drake

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crap I thought it was tonight

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- original art by Aiけん | ウサホリ -
 

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