Topic: Touhou 16 「東方天空璋 ~ Hidden Star in Four Seasons」 Report Completed!  (Read 20882 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Interesting!  And is the Ex boss really the Last few bosses together?

Drake

  • *
  • LOOK AT ME
No, it's just Okina. Mai and Satono are a duo as midboss

Woahhhhh the EX final card is cool as heck
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 04:13:29 am by Drake »

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
- original art by あかがし -

BernkastelWitch

  • Nickname: Bern
  • Gender: Female
Won't be general spoilers but people who do have it, how difficult is the entire game compared to its predecessors? Like would you consider it an easier or more difficult game in the series despite just being out?
The guy who was posting screenshots for the 2ch thread I'm reading continued posting them with imgur links and im Very Excited For This

LMAO OKINA'S FINAL CARD IS YOUR OWN SUBWEAPON, SHE STEALS IT and text pops up on the screen saying 'face the strongest enemy of all...thy own sub-season!!!' it's so cheesy??

I'm inferring that the game's regular ending is basically 'you can't beat her using regular seasons!! she's invincible!! retreat!!' and then you fight her with season #5 in the extra stage, i'm so twelve years old for this

edit: WAIT SHE STEALS ALL YOUR POWER ITEMS TOO. I FINALLY GET WHAT ZUN MEANT BY 'YOU'LL FEEL BAD AT THE END OF IT' LMAO

the final boss pulls your cool subweapon out from under you and you have to use a really weird one for the extra stage, and even if you get the good ending you haven't beaten the final boss in-universe until you clear said extra stage.... oh my god.... no wonder lmao
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 04:40:18 am by gilde »

Drake

  • *
  • LOOK AT ME
Once again confirming Eternity's name has been fixed. Meanwhile, Narumi's lifebar text says "Naruko" instead lmao


oh my god this music is good
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 04:22:25 am by Drake »

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
- original art by あかがし -
oh my god, the extra stage isn't an extra stage it's a:

REVENGING STAGE

I love this, I love this, this is so needlessly chunibyou dramatic by touhou standards, im so twelve for this

edit: i retract an earlier statement about the Doyō subweapon being weird, it is weird (shoots exclusively behind you) but apparently most of the enemies in the extra stage come from behind you, so
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 04:42:39 am by gilde »

☆ Kana ☆

  • Vanishing Dream
  • Lost Dream
  • Nickname: Misfortune's Wheel
  • Gender: no gender we die like
Cause of death: Laughing way too much at R E V E N G I N G  S T A G E
  • lololololo tungle
Videos are up on Nicoooooooooooo

The 'thing in common' that the stage 1~4 bosses have is that they're all usually 'hidden'. A totally unremarkable fairy, a mountain hermit, a shrine guardian who normally tries to work unseen, and a jizo statue who lives alone in the forest. (Some JP people also theorized that they have "symbols of divine worlds and/or the afterlife" in common as foreshadowing for Matarajin's whole 'world beyond' thing, which a jizo character fits in with quite nicely.)

They also literally have doors on their backs. Like, stuck on there. Ew. Mai forgets to close the one on Narumi's back when making her exit and Reimu just jumps on in there

The 'thing in common' that the stage 1~4 bosses have is that they're all usually 'hidden'. A totally unremarkable fairy, a mountain hermit, a shrine guardian who normally tries to work unseen, and a jizo statue who lives alone in the forest. (Some JP people also theorized that they have "symbols of divine worlds and/or the afterlife" in common as foreshadowing for Matarajin's whole 'world beyond' thing, which a jizo character fits in with quite nicely.)


Oh hey my theory was actually right!  Cool!

Railgun

  • Aimless fanatic
  • haHAA
  • Nickname: Martin
  • Gender: A cute lad
Wait, what? Am I correct in assuming there is no new extra character this time around? Damn...

Also any news on spell practice? Last words, etc?
Retired Touhou player. Not involved with anything Touhou anymore.

Aeteas

  • Nonsensical
  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: Aettaa
I haven't watch any videos, but from the descriptions and images, the flavor for this game is right down my alley. The ability to create doors to back of anything, a door dimension with nothing but ominous floating doors, and "REVENGING STAGE". This is genius.
Lmaooooo the final boss's final card is basically a scripted unwinnable fight, you're stripped of all your options and have to use only your regular lil' forward shot so unless you're a super player you'll either time the thing out or run the clock down to 10 seconds or so. No wonder ZUN said the game's aftertaste was gonna be grooooooooosss, hahahahaaaaa

edit: to clarify, I Actually Do Love This

Lt Colonel Summers

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • Do not mess with a soldier
  • Nickname: LT
  • Gender: Male
Anyone noticed how the entire plot of Touhou Tenkuushou ~ Hidden Star in Four Seasons is basically a Whole Plot Reference to Len'en Mugenri ~ Evanescent Existence?

I was just joking around when I said in the original topic:

Quote
That said, I wonder if ZUN is aware of JynX and the Len'En series?


After the revel of the full version, I guess ZUN really is aware of JynX and Len'En, after all
There's nothing inscribed on the dog tag...

Drake

  • *
  • LOOK AT ME
It really isn't. I don't really know how you're making that connection.



Anyways the final card differences are pretty interesting:

Spring: Walls and large bullets possibly meant to mimic Reimu's walls and yinyangs?
Summer: Haven't seen because nobody uses Summer lmao
Fall: Aya's bouncing patterns such as in StB's Cleansed Crystal Judgement and her cards in DS lmao
Winter: Straight lasers firing down while she moves across the screen like an old STG

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
- original art by あかがし -

TresserT

  • Idiot Princess
  • *
  • Nickname: Tres
Summer is giant icicle eternal meek, but she moves around the screen in a circle. Think Byakuren's last non, but she doesn't go quite so far down. The last phase adds aimed bullets.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 07:21:22 am by TresserT »
My name is Tres. It sounds like "Tray". Tressert is "Tray-zurt"; like Tres dessert.
I've cleared every touhou game on Lunatic, and beaten every extra except SoEW.
NMNB: MoF Hard, SA Extra, UFO Extra

The ⑨th Zentillion

  • ⑨th Zent
  • Infinite Baka
  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: Zent
  • Gender: Male
It's just Summers being Summers, Drake. Nothing to see here.

Anyway, the new characters and all of the plot details are pretty sweet, I think HSiFS might just be a step up from LoLK in a couple places.

Also, the final boss joining the likes of Vile, Ramirez, Jetstream Sam and every other famous at-first-hopeless boss battle with that last card, is going to be quite the talk of the town for a good while.

...Speaking of Okina and her powers, also looking forward to the possible mixture of jokesters who will make probable fan art/animations involving parodies the Scooby-Doo Door Gag.... maybe. If it doesn't happen, well, sometimes these things aren't meant to be, y'know?
Did you bring a light?
...No...


Smash the Fash; The far right belongs in the TRASH.
  • Zentillion's Tumblr
I'm so, so glad that cuc already did all the heavy lifting with Matarajin research for us, because I'd be taking waaay longer to translate otherwise. Thank you so so so much, cuc.

Cirno's scenario is hilarious because Satono's like "mai wtf why did you bring a rando fairy in here" and instead of passing their test, Cirno straight-up fails it, and they just leave her there while they go get scolded by Okina, and Cirno just sits there for a minute before deciding to wreck the place. I can't wait to see Cirno's EX dialogue just to see Okina being flabbergasted at the rando fairy somehow barging in again with the perfect counterattack for her season-door gimmick lmao

edit: Marisa's dialogue with Narumi is adorable. "You're that magic jizo girl, aren'tcha?" "And you're the magic human girl, aren't you?" ...Uh, but her name's written as Naruko in Marisa's dialogue, too. With furigana and everything. Either it's a nickname for her, or ZUN made a huuuuge oversight.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 08:11:30 am by gilde »

Drake

  • *
  • LOOK AT ME
Wait, you're saying there are two different graphics? Or that her name is written 成美^なるこ in dialogue? The latter could be an error in not changing her in-development name but the former would have implications
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 08:28:05 am by Drake »

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
- original art by あかがし -
Wait, you're saying there are two different graphics? Or that her name is written 成美^なるこ in dialogue? The latter could be an error in not changing her in-development name but the former would have implications

See here. It's the latter, so it's probably an in-development name yeah

Lt Colonel Summers

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • Do not mess with a soldier
  • Nickname: LT
  • Gender: Male
It really isn't. I don't really know how you're making that connection.

Len'en Mugenri ~ Evanescent Existence plot: Senri Tsurubami warps the entire cast member into Mugenri, and have them fight each other to see who's the most suitable to replace him(?) while he's away on a vacation. Basically a very violent job interview that none of the main cast are even aware of, and held without their permission.
Touhou Tenkuushou ~ Hidden Star in Four Seasons plot: Matara sets up the game's incident to see who's going to try and solve it (in this case the heroines), and see if they are worthy of working for her. A violent job interview held without the heroine's permission, and they aren't even aware of it until they meet her in person.

See the similarity? Both games had their main culprit basically hold a very violent job interview to see if the protagonists are worthy of a job with them. Both "interviews" are held without the protagonists permission and their being aware of it.
There's nothing inscribed on the dog tag...

ZM

  • Overly Eager
  • Sanae~
  • Nickname: The Archer
  • Gender: Male
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTWBcoKiTWQ
gg 1cc!

Also Aunn is cute in Reimu's ending.

Tengukami

  • Breaking news. Any season.
  • *
  • I said, with a posed look.
  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: Amaterasu
  • Gender: Androgyne
See the similarity?

That is a really, really tenuous similarity. If anything, ZUN has clearly lifted Drake's Black Squares of Death.

Fan Fiction
 Tumblr
"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."
Quick question, but what's the race of the stage 5 bosses?  Thanks in advance!

7TC7

  • In best company
  • Nickname: Black-Cat/7TC7
Quick question, but what's the race of the stage 5 bosses?  Thanks in advance!

Species: Human (?)
question mark included

HistoryoftheMoon

  • Normal Modo
  • "Whoa, what?!? I actually beat the game?!"
  • Nickname: Skies
Sweet, I already found a glitch.

In Spell Practice, for Stage 5 - Spellcard 4, on Normal difficulty (possibly others), killing the boss (pink one- Satono, I think) will not result in the card ending, though bullets will stop spawning. I think that this is because of the green one showing up at the beginning, and then running off-screen. After the pink one is dead, homing bullets head towards the upper right corner where the green one went. There's no way to kill the green one, so it is impossible to capture this card in spell bonus. I'm not sure how this plays in the real game, since I failed to capture it then, but I'll go into stage practice and see if it does.
EDIT: The spell works perfectly fine in spell practice. Killing the boss ends the card. In hindsight, capturing it has nothing to do with it- you just need to kill the boss. Still though, ZUN, fix yo game. This seems like an amateur mistake, especially considering that it works fine for at least spellcard 1 in stage practice. (I haven't unlocked 2/3 yet, okay? I do like how you pick your spellcards based on who you shoot down, though.)


Also, about the Len'en EE comparisons:

The "winter" spell card for the final boss is very similar to a card from the Stage 1 boss of EE. Large black bullets swarm the whole screen, but they regain their color and shrink a bit when they get close to you.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 03:35:26 pm by HistoryoftheMoon »
Normal Clears (in order of completion): IN, MoF, PCB, LoLK, DDC, and now TD!
Extra Clears: Nope
Lunatic Clears: Haha, very funny.
Speaking of comparisons Part of the melody of the Ex boss theme really reminded me of Heavenly Gathering of Clouds' Ex Boss theme too.  Quite a coincidence!

cuc

  • BunBunMaru Staff
  • *
  • Probably won't respond 'til this mess is sorted o
  • LOOK AT ME
Now that people are playing the game, a quick 'n dirty update on background info. Continuing from the last thread. UPDATE: Slightly edited, spoiler markers removed.

Jizō:
You can find info on Jizō statues everywhere, so let's focus on the writing on Narumi's scarf: 畢竟成佛 (JP: hikkyō jōbutsu), "ultimate attainment of Buddhahood", the last of the 28 benefits of worshipping Jizō.

What does the writings on her hat mean? Sorry, no one has yet to figure out. See the wiki.

Narumi's surname, Yatadera is a temple that houses Japan's oldest Jizō statue, famous for its hydrangea flowers.

Tokoyo Kami:
常世 Tokoyo, "the World of Constancy" is a basic concept in Shintoism, forming a dichtomy with Utsutsuyo - the reality, the waking world. It is the land of immortality beyond the sea where the gods (and/or the deceased) live, unlike the mortal island the ancient Japanese inhabited. It can also be interpreted darkly as 常夜 "Forever Night", which would be the same thing as Yomi, the dreary land of the dead.

(Also, the English wikipedia page of Tokoyo is about a story of highly questionable reliability from a 1900 English book. Ignore it.)

20 years after the death of Prince Shoutoku, our old friend Hata no Kawakatsu, the legendary inventor of noh, discovered a cult that worshipped a swallowtail caterpillar as "Tokoyo Kami". He killed the founder, putting an end to this cult.

Yep, should've written about this earlier, but it hadn't come up once in the years since Kokoro's debut, so I never expected the script to directly call it out.

Matara-jin:
First of all, I forgot to explain that "ushirodo" literally means "back entrance" (of the hall of worship), though the word is only used in the specific temple architecture context: a place where the temple's "real founding patron", rather than the god open to public worship, is located.

Okina:
The Hata clan worships Matara-jin as an 翁面 okina-men, an old man's mask in noh theater, claiming it to be a manifestation of Hata no Kawakatsu.

However, our character's name is written 隠岐奈, sharing two kanji with Oki Islands, a place for exiles. The key kanji here is 隠 "hidden", probably as Touhou's traditional name drop, where one or more kanji from the game title appears in character names, except this time the name drop occurs with the English subtitle. Of course, there are many hidden things relevant to the story, such as the idol of Matara-jin, or the paradise of Gensokyo.

God of sericulture:
The most important thing about the Hata clan isn't that they supposedly invented noh, or they called themselves descedants of China's first emperor Qin Shi Huang, who migrated into Japan in 3rd century CE. It's that they were said to have brought sericulture and silk-weaving into Japan. Referenced by Okina's 3rd Extra Stage spell card, 秘儀「弾幕の玉繭」 Secret Ritual "Danmaku Double Cocoon". 玉繭 tamamayu ("jade cocoon"? "globular cocoon"?) refers to a double cocoon, which is formed by two silkworms.

宿神 shuku-jin, or god of discriminated peoples:
In the character profile, ZUN used the word 被差別民 (hisabetsu-min), which is essentially a Japanese translation of "discriminated people", a politically correct term. A word you more likely see in English reportage is "buraku-min". These words refer to the many outcast groups in Japan, who still suffer from discrimination to the modern day. In the Middle Ages, they lived by working in occupations considered unclean to normal peasants: butchery, leatherworking, street cleaning, and nomadic performers - see the connection?

Shuku, written 夙 or 宿 ("shelter"), was a medieval term for outcasts. Their patron gods are known as "shuku-jin", which were a jumble of many strands of faiths.

Earth mother:
Coming back to the topic of Tantric weirdness, etymologically, the name of "Matara" should have come from the Sanskrit mātaraḥ, which is the plural of matar "mother[/i]. This gives rise to the theory that Matara-jin is actually female, and her true identity is similar to motherly demon-goddesses like Hariti (read the story; it's a popular one among Buddhists). Also, academics argued his two servants represent sexual intercourse?

God of hindrance:
As a demon, Matara-jin can also be a harmful source of spiritual "hindrance" that keeps people from wisdom, i.e. the kleshas we touched on before. This aspect seems to equate him with the tantric god Vinayaka, better known as Ganesha (however, Ganesha is often said to be a destroyer of hindrance). Black magic. The nomadic outcasts were probably going to need it?

EDIT: Also see this post.

Bacchanalian festival:
In Kyoto, the Hata has a clan temple founded by Kawakatsu, the Kōryu-ji. The temple's "Cow Festival", considered among "the Three Strange Festivals of Kyoto", held in Matara-jin's name, has always amazed scholars with its unusual rituals, from dances that seem to imitate sex, to the farcial "Tengu Intimidation" 天狗怖し (Tengu Odoshi) that's said to drive away obnoxious tengu.

無縁 muen:
Originally a Buddhist term meaning "without (karmic) connection", and referring to the dead strangers who has no local social ties in Gensokyo's "Muenzuka", this word has been adopted by modern historians to describe historic groups who were outside the normal hierarchical structures, which include the outcasts and nomadic performers. The word appears in Okina's 8th Extra Stage spell card, 秘儀「無縁の芸能者」 Secret Ritual "Performers Without Social Ties".


Conclusion:
Over time, any gods, monsters, and historical figures whose popularity has lived on would inevitably pick up a ton of miscellaneous lore. The Japanese aristocracy was also a small place where everyone was related to everyone. All that means is if you want to see connection between them, you can always find one. But like any writer, when creating Touhou, ZUN only chooses some of the most important lore about a figure, the core that makes the legend what it is, to base his character on.

However, the mystery of Matara-jin is that the god has no such core - he/she is nothing but a collection of these mythical flotsam. And this very chaotic nature becomes the feature of HSiFS's story.

I actually think ZUN has chosen a core identity to focus on - the shuku-jin role of Matara-jin, making her a patron of Gensokyo's outcasts. But there is still no emotionally moving backstory like we had with most main entries, and he soldiered ahead with the absence of one.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2017, 08:31:49 am by cuc »
Touhou Fantasy News: twitter

Tengukami

  • Breaking news. Any season.
  • *
  • I said, with a posed look.
  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: Amaterasu
  • Gender: Androgyne
Also, about the Len'en EE comparisons:

The "winter" spell card for the final boss is very similar to a card from the Stage 1 boss of EE. Large black bullets swarm the whole screen, but they regain their color and shrink a bit when they get close to you.

And again, how do we know Len'en didn't steal this from Drake, hm? Drake was first to do this.

Nothing further, your honor.

Fan Fiction
 Tumblr
"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."

HistoryoftheMoon

  • Normal Modo
  • "Whoa, what?!? I actually beat the game?!"
  • Nickname: Skies
Also, yet ANOTHER potential EE connection:

One of the Extra stage boss cards resemble Disguised Tsurubami's spinning-around card from Stage 3. Two cards from Okina? This is getting out of hand.

EDIT: Also, another glitch!

In Stage 5, Spellcard 6 (tested on Normal Spell Practice), if you shoot down the pink one, she'll just vanish and the card will continue. If you shoot down the green one, the card will end.

I would test this with Spellcard 5 as well, but I'm not good enough to capture that one, so...
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 04:15:56 pm by HistoryoftheMoon »
Normal Clears (in order of completion): IN, MoF, PCB, LoLK, DDC, and now TD!
Extra Clears: Nope
Lunatic Clears: Haha, very funny.

Mikuru

  • Nickname: Michael S. Repton
Just finished watching the game on Youtube. Really looking forward to playing this one, it looks great. Stage 5 and 6 boss themes are really good, but the Extra stage and boss themes blow everything else in the game out of the water. The late-game backgrounds are really good, as well -- fantastically creepy with the theme of doors / windows opening onto everywhere
 

SMF 2.0.15 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines
Theme based on ModernDark64 design by BlocWeb
Page created in 0.07 seconds with 22 queries.