Topic: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery  (Read 21379 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Prime32

  • Munch-Munch Demon
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #60 on: June 01, 2017, 03:40:00 pm »
I could have sworn the spelling "Yuka" used to be more common, and there was an effort to correct it to "Yuuka". Partly because of the need to distinguish between "Yukarin" and "Yuukarin". :V

Things get weirder with Miko. As far as I know, "Toyosatomimi" isn't even a family or clan name. It's a title, meaning something like "great ears".

So "Toyosatomimi no Miko" means "Miko the Great-Eared".

Even more complicated, "Miko" can also be taken as a title meaning "God's Child" instead of a name. So "Toyosatomimi no Miko" as a whole can be translated as "The Great-eared God Child".

In conclusion, ancient Japanese names and titles suck.
"Miko the All-Hearing"

And if they do WaHH: "The Rose Sage", or "Rosy" for short. :V Always refer to her in blurbs as "Kasen Ibaraki, the Rose Sage". In the character intros, put stuff like "Ibara means rose, which is the origin of her pseudonym" and "Incidentally, there was a famous one-armed oni by the name of Ibaraki-douji...".
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #61 on: June 01, 2017, 04:37:38 pm »
Things get weirder with Miko. As far as I know, "Toyosatomimi" isn't even a family or clan name. It's a title, meaning something like "great ears".

So "Toyosatomimi no Miko" means "Miko the Great-Eared".

Even more complicated, "Miko" can also be taken as a title meaning "God's Child" instead of a name. So "Toyosatomimi no Miko" as a whole can be translated as "The Great-eared God Child".

In conclusion, ancient Japanese names and titles suck.

Newsflash: ALL names actually mean something. And it's stupid to translate names, no matter if they come from family or are self-given or whatever.

This isn't a case of "changing someone's name," because they're still Kokoro Hata, Miko Toyosatomimi, and Akyuu Hieda, the important parts (the first and last name) are still all there. This is removing something that's already a minor detail in the source detail. As for why something like "von" tends to be kept - it's a question of it still being in use (and thus, being an actually relevant part of the name, unlike no which hasn't been used in ages), and perhaps more importantly, having been included in the western canon enough times that most people who've read at least a few books or watched a few shows with german influences get what the heck's up with a name with "von" in it.  That's the most important distinction here - von has context in western literature. No (at least, as a part of a name) does not, and thus is axed because it has no sense and no meaning as it has not been used in ages and was never used in the western canon, and thus has no context.

tl;dr using a popular naming convention is fine because it's popular, but it's better to change an unpopular convention because it's unpopular. Instead of, you know, keeping it in to spread the knowledge that it's a thing (and is relevant for historical texts, at least, which is kinda important for understanding Miko's origins, you know). Some circular logic right there, chap.

the old guy

  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: ganpapa
  • Gender: Male, boring i know.
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #62 on: June 01, 2017, 06:19:40 pm »
Well, fuck.

Clarste has given up on translating Forbidden Scrollery, out of "respect" for Yen Press.

So, when the next chapter comes out that reveals what happens to poor Suzu', all you'll have is maybe someone who can read Japanese giving you a summary of the plot that won't have the same emotional effect as actually seeing the events unfold on screen. And the first part of the Yen Press translation wont even come out until November, and the second part until February. Going by those dates, we probably won't actually see the ending until late 2019 at the earliest, mid 2020 at the latest. How convenient.
My old avatars: Old ass turtle, Unzan - Second and Current Avatar by the talented Aoshi-shi

Clarste

  • Nickname: Ixi
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #63 on: June 01, 2017, 06:31:47 pm »
I just decided that, morally speaking, there's no reason for me to continue.

I suppose it's also worth noting that I've already been contacted by people who want to pick up where I left off. Which... I don't really know how to feel about, but okay.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2017, 06:34:56 pm by Clarste »

nyttyn

  • Drill baby drill!
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #64 on: June 01, 2017, 06:38:51 pm »
tl;dr using a popular naming convention is fine because it's popular, but it's better to change an unpopular convention because it's unpopular. Instead of, you know, keeping it in to spread the knowledge that it's a thing (and is relevant for historical texts, at least, which is kinda important for understanding Miko's origins, you know). Some circular logic right there, chap.

You can send a email to yen press if you feel that strongly, I'm just some dude on the Internet speculating that they'll probably take the liberal route since this is a comic and not a historical text.


And let's not be too upset here re translation, it can't be helped. I fully intend to support the official release too, and it bites that worst case scenario this means we won't see the next bit for up to two and a half years, but oh well. At least i hace a direct and official way to financially suport the print works without having to deal with the nightmare that is international ordering. I thank clarste for his work and hope someone else starts translating in the mean time.

Suwako Moriya

  • Hey you with the pretty face
  • *
  • Welcome to the human race!
  • Staff
  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: Kilgamayan
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #65 on: June 01, 2017, 06:44:02 pm »
(snip)

This and other similar reactions are not a great way to encourage translators to continue doing their thing for this fandom.
The only thing this dimension does well is show its ass. We might as well applaud it! - Albert Burneko

Well, this game happened.

aListers

  • Vocaloid for the win!
  • Gensokyo forever!
  • LOOK AT ME
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #66 on: June 01, 2017, 06:47:05 pm »
I just decided that, morally speaking, there's no reason for me to continue.

I suppose it's also worth noting that I've already been contacted by people who want to pick up where I left off. Which... I don't really know how to feel about, but okay.

This is unfortunate but inevitable I guess. It's a shame. It's not like before where I've seen translators struggle to keep up with release. You translated consistently and well. Thank you for your service - it was appreciated. I hope your successor is as skilled as you were. I just wish that you didn't leave us on a cliffhanger. I'm thankful that you're still translating WaHH and VFiS though. I wish you the best of luck in the future.
???-2004?=dark ages, 2005?=atomic betty era, 2006=red dwarf era, 2007-2009=newgrounds era, 2009-2014= anime era.

If you're going to add me on skype then please tell me who you are when sending the friend request.
  • Newgrounds

Spotty Len

  • The Spottiest Len Around
  • *
  • Yuuka Master Race
  • Nickname: Market Gardening Youkai
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #67 on: June 01, 2017, 06:50:04 pm »
So I guess Europe will be stuck with importing all the books, neat.

Clarste

  • Nickname: Ixi
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #68 on: June 01, 2017, 06:52:49 pm »
They have digital versions too, and while I'm not sure exactly how their region-locking works, it shouldn't be too much trouble to work around it.

The ⑨th Zentillion

  • ⑨th Zent
  • Infinite Baka
  • LOOK AT ME
  • Nickname: Zent
  • Gender: Male
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #69 on: June 01, 2017, 07:47:11 pm »
Sad. Well, it's your decision, Clarste, and while unfortunate, it's rather noble, too. Sorry you had to get so much self-entitled bullshit thrown your way, though; but in fandom, it's inevitable, inescapable.

If someone decides to pick up where you left off, well,  sometimes the entitled can have their uses...
Did you bring a light?
...No...


Smash the Fash; The far right belongs in the TRASH.
  • Zentillion's Tumblr

Drake

  • *
  • LOOK AT ME
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #70 on: June 01, 2017, 08:29:02 pm »
This and other similar reactions are not a great way to encourage translators to continue doing their thing for this fandom.
cyberangel seriously


s e r i o u s l y

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
- original art by Aiけん | ウサホリ -
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #71 on: June 01, 2017, 09:03:09 pm »
I'm highly amused by the people who failed to see a cheesy, overly dramatic joke as a cheesy, overly dramatic joke. Thanks for reminding me not to take you seriously.

I mean, I do find his reason to stop translating FS incredibly silly, but that's just my opinion. What, I can't freely express it even in my personal corner of the Intrenet now?

Clarste

  • Nickname: Ixi
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #72 on: June 01, 2017, 09:34:19 pm »
As far as I could tell from the responses on tumblr, no one realized you were joking. Perhaps you are bad at telling jokes. On the other, if you find amusement from people misunderstanding you, then I suppose you're very successful at being misunderstood?
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #73 on: June 01, 2017, 09:50:20 pm »
Let's not turn this thread into a psychology session that I never asked for. I'm not the only one upset, you know.

Plubio

  • 宇宙少年
  • Nickname: capsule
  • Gender: Male
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #74 on: June 01, 2017, 10:00:08 pm »
Let's not turn this thread into a psychology session that I never asked for. I'm not the only one upset, you know.

And why are you people upset, if I can ask?

Honestly the way some people treat fan-translators really grind my gears. And as a translator myself I kinda feel a bit angry about this.
Nobody ask fan-translators to do their stuff. They do it. For free.

I don't really understand why someone would be upset about someone stopping a translation. A translation you've never paid for (and never will). That's stupidly selfish to be quite honest.
Heck, Clarste even said he really didn't want to stop but he wanted to support ZUN and Harukawa. So he has a reason to do so.

I know this stuff is something pretty common when it comes to fan-translated stuff but I still can't find a reason, a solid reason about why someone has the rights to be mad at a translator for stopping their translations.
  • Suzunaan

Flandre5carlet

  • Sister of the Devil
  • "So all I have to do is 'kyuu', and..."
  • LOOK AT ME
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #75 on: June 01, 2017, 10:04:54 pm »
Personally I'm just disappointed I may have to wait quite a while to find out what happens next if no other fan translation picks up where Clarste left off.
I'm not gonna, like, rant about Clarste's decision or such, and I'm certainly going to support the official release (which I would do whether there was a fan translation or not), but if I have to wait until that time to actually find out the rest of the story, well rip.
  • flan.moe

mauve

  • Nickname: mauve'
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #76 on: June 01, 2017, 10:15:51 pm »
bitter fans make me glad i got out of the fan tl thing tbh

nobody needs to deal with attempts at being guilt tripped out of their own decisions by people who just want stuff for themselves

edit: honestly, one of the things most offputting things to happen w/ western TH fandom was when people started doing things For The Fans(in other words, for the exposure and recognition they would get for it) rather than for the promotion of the creators or their own self-improvement. i get that the people who ask the most or who are the most disappointed are often the ones without the relevant skill sets needed, but it rubs me the wrong way when fan translations are An Expectation To Be Served rather than something people do because they want to.

edit edit: signed, the one who still gets asked to mod netplay into games he doesn't care about years later and can't convince anyone to play the one game he actually liked doing it for
« Last Edit: June 01, 2017, 10:41:04 pm by mauve »

Spotty Len

  • The Spottiest Len Around
  • *
  • Yuuka Master Race
  • Nickname: Market Gardening Youkai
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #77 on: June 01, 2017, 10:21:54 pm »
Actually Clarste, thank you for translating FS up to now. We wouldn't even be talking about it right now if not for your efforts.

I'm sad, but it's not like the manga suddenly stopped either, there will be other stuff to read until then. And I guess that's a good occasion to practice my Japanese.
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #78 on: June 01, 2017, 10:34:58 pm »
And why are you people upset, if I can ask?

Honestly the way some people treat fan-translators really grind my gears. And as a translator myself I kinda feel a bit angry about this.
Nobody ask fan-translators to do their stuff. They do it. For free.

I don't really understand why someone would be upset about someone stopping a translation. A translation you've never paid for (and never will). That's stupidly selfish to be quite honest.
Heck, Clarste even said he really didn't want to stop but he wanted to support ZUN and Harukawa. So he has a reason to do so.

I know this stuff is something pretty common when it comes to fan-translated stuff but I still can't find a reason, a solid reason about why someone has the rights to be mad at a translator for stopping their translations.

"You become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."

...Okay, personally, I'm not THAT extreme. I don't think worse about Clarste. It was his decision that he can make or reverse anytime for whatever reason he desires. Doesn't mean I can't be bitter for some time about it. Expressing negativity isn't always a bad thing, you know.

So why don't you people stop policing what other fans can or can't say? It's kind of quite hypocritial in this case.

nyttyn

  • Drill baby drill!
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #79 on: June 01, 2017, 10:39:01 pm »
"You become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."

...Okay, personally, I'm not THAT extreme. I don't think worse about Clarste. It was his decision that he can make or reverse anytime for whatever reason he desires. Doesn't mean I can't be bitter for some time about it. Expressing negativity isn't always a bad thing, you know.

So why don't you people stop policing what other fans can or can't say? It's kind of quite hypocritial in this case.

Nobody's policing you, you're still free to say what you want.

We're also free to think and comment that what you're saying is pretty stupid.

Lebon14

  • 椛ちゃん、助けてぇぇぇぇぇ!
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #80 on: June 01, 2017, 11:26:05 pm »
Personally I'm just disappointed I may have to wait quite a while to find out what happens next if no other fan translation picks up where Clarste left off.
I'm not gonna, like, rant about Clarste's decision or such, and I'm certainly going to support the official release (which I would do whether there was a fan translation or not), but if I have to wait until that time to actually find out the rest of the story, well rip.

Add me to that boat.
Except, I'm just extremely sad. If Clarste would have dropped it 10 chapters ago, I would have shrugged it off. But right now? It's just break my heart that I'll have to wait 2 years to get the follow-up to this important part of the manga. Again, it's not like I don't want to buy the Yen Press books (I just have reservations like everybody here), I just want to know the end of that ark of the story. And, Clarste, please, consider at least finishing this ark. Then, I won't give a flying kite if you leave then.

*goes back to crying a river*

TresserT

  • Idiot Princess
  • *
  • Nickname: Tres
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #81 on: June 01, 2017, 11:31:30 pm »
I think there's a line between being disappointed and being angry. If ZUN's kid got sick and he had to stop making touhou I'd be disappointed that "no new touhou", but I'd understand why and I wouldn't be angry at him for it. Like, getting upset for something like that would be totally ridiculous. Likewise, I'm disappointed that I won't get to see the ending of this FS arc for a while, especially since we're so close, but I understand why Clarste feels the way they do and it's kind of silly to be angry at them for it.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 12:17:00 am by TresserT »
My name is Tres. It sounds like "Tray". Tressert is "Tray-zurt"; like Tres dessert.
I've cleared every touhou game on Lunatic, and beaten every extra except SoEW.
NMNB: MoF Hard, SA Extra, UFO Extra

Lt Colonel Summers

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • Do not mess with a soldier
  • Nickname: LT
  • Gender: Male
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #82 on: June 02, 2017, 12:42:30 am »
Fair enough, I still can't get over the fact about the lack of exposure of Japanese/Asian culture tho. I will always blame 4kids for pioneering the trend of denying Japan/Asia's existence in localization.

Yeah, I too blame 4Kids and their "Eff yeah! America!" mindset for the US' lack of knowledge on Asian cultures (even though I'm not from the US). Its a good thing those anti-Asia racists went bankrupt.

Quote
On another topic, I'm interested in how they are going to handle stuffs like;

- Marisa's way of talking

Since Marisa looks like a westerner and has a western-sounding name, perhaps they're going to give her an American accent? Though I would be surprised if they gave her a Dutch (or any western) accent instead...

EDIT: Oh, damn. I guess we won't be seeing the resolution to Demon Kosuzu and Reimu vs Yukari anytime soon... :(
« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 12:48:19 am by Lt Colonel Summers »
There's nothing inscribed on the dog tag...

Nyxnyx

  • Nickname: Sea
  • Gender: Guy
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #83 on: June 02, 2017, 01:02:45 am »
The FS manga has a furigana on every single kanji, even the simplest ones if memory serves. So in the mean time just try to translate it with google trans or something lol. At least you get some extremely rough ideas. With basic hiragana knowledge you can get what that kanji reads and translate them along with some words bar particles to get the roughest ideas. I say roughest since grammar is a pretty big deal and yeah, that's some of the reason why japanese is hard.

And I think self-entitled fans or whoever that demand what they're getting for free at the expense of other's time is pretty stupid. Clarste does it because he wants to and he stops since he does't want to, simple as that. (Well in this case i know he doesn't really "want" to, but i think you get what I mean.) Instead of being thankful of what they get, people tends to take things for granted. Try studying Japanese and know how much work he has to go through before he can start translating for you guys.

Ah well, in my place there're even more whining fans when fan-translation for various types of non-localized work slows down or something, so yeah it feels really annoying whenever I see one and I don't want it to happen here. Why can people never be grateful for what they have even when they did not put in the work to get it.

So yeah, thanks Clarste for all you've done so far. Pretty sure you're not discouraged but you deserve gratitude anyway. Now, I hope Kosuzu turns into demon, ghost or something, since it's more amusing that way. Not everything has to make sense all the time, right? :D

PS. Hope Yen press publish the manga fast since in my country we have FS localization but the publisher just leave it volumn 1 for years and counting for some reason. Whatever the reason is, as a fan, I'm really sad waiting something that'll never come. *rant*


Shadowlupus

  • Crimson Blade Hidden Amidst the Darkness
  • Nickname: Kage
  • Gender: Male
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #84 on: June 02, 2017, 01:15:17 am »
Welp, I just woke up this morning and saw this. Yeah, I was shocked to see this news too. It is inevitable that something like this will come but I respect Clarste's decision.

I hope that Yen Press will continue to publish FS until the series' end. Over here, Thai publishers stop doing it for ages and thus SSiB, Three Fairies, WaHH and FS is left half-completed. The translator/admin is left stalemate due to copyrights. He can't post manga translations anymore. I hope the western community doesn't suffer from the same fate.


However, if we can just read the spoilers/observation, then I'll translate and post them for you guys. In Thai Facebook, folks there will post spoilers or their own observation whenever the chapter comes up. I'll be translating those. Just don't expect a professional translation, esp with a terminology/proper noun.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 01:28:54 am by Kageshirou »

Lebon14

  • 椛ちゃん、助けてぇぇぇぇぇ!
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #85 on: June 02, 2017, 02:40:18 am »
Has Yen Press a good reputation anyway? Do they release every volume of every manga they license? /random-question

Zelinko

  • The Wandering Mind
  • LOOK AT ME
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #86 on: June 02, 2017, 03:16:21 am »
I'm supposed to be the negative one but this thread has really put a lot of worries in me. 

Guess I'll have to manually archive the last chapters  and burn to disc for my archives.

I was actually kinda excited but now I'm spooked especially about translation.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 03:18:31 am by Zelinko »
This Space For Rent
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #87 on: June 02, 2017, 05:27:31 am »
So I guess Europe will be stuck with importing all the books, neat.
You can always buy the Kindle edition! You don't even need a Kindle device, the app works on Android, iPhone, iPad, and even computers! Even though I'm in the US I pre-ordered the Kindle edition because I travel between home and university a lot. In that case I prefer having the manga to read on my phone or computer.

Re: Clarste and fan-translations: I think it's perfectly reasonable, especially since there is now an official channel to very easily get the manga at affordable prices. It's time we show the responsible parties that they have our support by purchasing the content we enjoy.

N-Forza

  • Information Superhighway Robbery
  • *
  • I said it was a steal, but not for whom
  • LOOK AT ME
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #88 on: June 02, 2017, 06:08:21 am »
Yeah, to be honest, as long as they don't have any glaring mistranslations or inconsistencies, I would urge everyone to buy the official release if only to help show there is a demand for Touhou in general. Reactions to the games have been mixed since they are fanmade or untranslated (as in DDC on Playism).

Drake

  • *
  • LOOK AT ME
Re: Yen Press licenses Touhou Suzunaan ~ Forbidden Scrollery
« Reply #89 on: June 02, 2017, 07:03:43 am »
To note, I'm not sure if anyone complaining about why Clarste had to stop now of all times rather than earlier is really thinking about that line. It isn't like Forbidden Scrollery only exists when it is being translated, obviously, so for people expressing that it's a shame that they won't get to know what happens for the chapters going into the future, they should probably consider that if Clarste had stopped even earlier, these chapters would y'know still exist, and people would be just as upset not knowing what was happening. In the same vein, because we don't know how the book will continue into the future, you can't really say that you would be okay if Clarste just stopped at the end of this arc, people are just picking this point because it's pretty likely there's nothing "important" immediately afterwards. Meanwhile if important stuff did happen people would be mad again.

Personally I'm still a bit struck that the biggest reaction to an official english licensing of a Touhou manga is "shit now I can't read the manga anymore".

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
- original art by Aiけん | ウサホリ -
 

SMF 2.0.15 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines
Theme based on ModernDark64 design by BlocWeb
Page created in 0.09 seconds with 40 queries.