Topic: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread  (Read 3548 times)

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Shadowlupus

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Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« on: December 10, 2016, 09:51:32 am »
Hello guys, Kageshirou’s here!

To give a context, for the past three years, I have been (once again) checking Touhou Wiki’s translation with my native Touhou (Thai) wiki, everything from main games to songs, ZUN's comments, profile, endings, CDs and books. Unsurprisingly, I have found several discrepancies between those two.  However, I have to give the latter wiki’s admin (and translator) credit and the benefit of doubt despite him talking trash about our wiki in the past, since he is an expert in Japanese so I believe that his translations will help improve our own wiki translation.

I don't start this thread just to "win" his "argument" but to really to improve the wiki's quality. After all, more people who understands Japanese is better, isn't it?

However, the catches are first, the stuffs on the Thai wiki are, of course, in Thai so I’m sure that some of you cannot read that so that is the reason why I’m gathering the info.

Second, I cannot read Japanese so I cannot ascertain whether my re-translation is correct. I have done so on my own last year and I’ve got some warnings that while I have standardizing stuffs like Ghost/Phantom mess sprawling all over the wiki, I have also replaced some good translations with less accurate translations.

And finally, even though I major in English and therefore understands how English grammar and stuffs work, I’m still a non-native speaker so there’s bound to be stuff like “awkward wording or sentences” because of “Recursive Translation” (from TV Tropes.)  That is another reason why I think I cannot edit the wiki alone.

For all of these reasons, I started the thread here to basically post the “re-translations” and ask for any of you who understand Japanese to check them.  This is completely voluntary and non-urgent so you don’t have to feel pressured or anything. Just do it whenever you feel like it. So, all help and effort is greatly appreciated.

Oh, by the way, even though I've found a lot of discrepancies, some of them were trivial matters, like different wording but not completely different in meaning so I will not post those. I will also post some extra info like historical information or references to other works that I have found and are not in our wiki. Some of these are really obscure so you can just ignore it if you don't get the picture.


I don’t know if it is okay to do this or where this thread should be in so I’ll wait for you guys’ reply first.

Cheers,
« Last Edit: December 10, 2016, 09:57:20 am by Kageshirou »

N-Forza

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2016, 02:07:46 pm »
I will admit there's probably a lot of loose ends on the wiki at the moment, but I'll only find them by stumbling around older articles (sometimes stuff I did years ago when I was starting out).

If you have any questions about a particular choice, I can try to explain them and/or fix them, but off the top of my head I'm fairly satisfied with how things are at the moment on the whole (except for the choice of "inchling" but that only won was because I couldn't put together a convincing enough argument for "gnome").

Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2016, 04:34:59 pm »
Thanks for replying!

Yeah, the translations on the whole are all right, but there are some discrepancies between the wikis that I want to share and make sure that ours is right.

I think I'll begin with the recent game, LoLK first since I don't think there is too many differences. To be honest, most of these discrepancies come from a single different word choice.

My comment or Thai translator's comment is in bold


LoLK Spell Card:

弾符「鷹は撃ち抜いた」Bullet Sign "The Eagle Has Been Shot"
He said that by grammar rules, it should be "The Eagle Has Shot" (something down), not been shot


夢符「藍色の愁夢」Dream Sign "Indigo Dream of Sorrow"
In Thai wiki, it is “Indigo Dream of Anxiety”


夢符「刈安色の迷夢」Ochre Delusion
In Thai wiki, it is “Ochre Confusion”


獄符「ヘルエクリプス」Prison Sign "Hell Eclipse"
In Thai wiki, it is “Hell sign” so I believe the Thai wiki is mistaken, yes?


That's all for the spell card. I will leave out the references I find because those will just be in the way and I can simply ask their legitimacy in the misc thread or even a new one instead.

EDIT: I think next time, I'll replace "in Thai wiki" with "Lit:" since the wiki translator insists on translating literally.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2016, 05:03:27 pm by Kageshirou »
Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2016, 01:04:18 am »
Hi, I'm the one who did those translations in the first place and: you're completely right for all of 'em & I edited the wiki accordingly (σ* ゚ー゚)σ Thank u v.much for the input

Drake

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2016, 02:33:11 am »
This reminds me that I've seen some edits you've done that have been a bit objectionable, but haven't had the time to correct them. I still don't so I can't remember what they are but maybe I'll come back to it now that this is here.

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Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2016, 03:10:24 am »
@gilde Thanks for the reply and edits!

Next up is the prologue and player characters' route.


Prologue:

早苗 「どうしても気になることがあるのよ。あの形、偶然とは思ぇない」
"This is definitely interesting. I can't imagine that its appearance is just a coincidence."
Lit: “Even then, I’m still anxious about it. I can’t...”

永琳 「彼奴が動くと言う事は、人聞達では到底太刀打ち出来ないでしょう。
     しかし、我々が手を出してしまっては相手の思うつぼです。
     ましてや地上の妖怪では干渉すら出来ないでしょう」
"If they're making a move, no human will possibly be
able to compete with them. (missing) Moreover, the youkai of
Earth likely can't even interfere to begin with."

The middle paragraph is missing. It is "If we do it by ourselves, we’ll fall right into enemies’ plan."

永遠の春夢 Eternal Spring Dream
Eternal Spring Night Dream


Reimu:

とんだご都合主義ね
That's some double standard you have there.
That's some opportunism you have there.


Sanae:

地上人は浄化の過程において
非常に良い働きをしてくれた
Despite being under purification, earthlings are doing a surprisingly good job.
Earthlings are doing a good job helping in the process of purification.

月の狂夢(ルナティックドリーム)
と呼ばれる悪夢です

今ならまだ『目が覚めたら夢だった』
って事にできますが……
それでも進みますか?
It is worthy of being called a 'lunatic dream'.
(missing)
Will you still proceed, despite that?

The missing part is "You can still “wake up and find out it was only a dream”, you know."

これを見ると、あながち都市伝説と
言えなくも無いかもなぁ
Seeing this, I guess it's not really an urban legend any more, huh...?
Seeing this, I can’t help but speaking of the urban legends.

いざ尋常に勝負せーい!
Come, let us do battle!
Come, let us do battle fair and square!


Reisen
地上の環境は過酷だけど
変化があってまあまあ楽しめるわよ
まあ、住めば都ってね

Earth's environment is harsh, but
there's never a dull moment, so it's pretty fun.
Well, your home capital is what you make it, right?

Earth's environment is harsh, but
there is change so I can enjoy it.
But, if I can choose, I will live in the Lunar Capital.


……月の民の上司はいつもそう
隠蔽に隠蔽でもう嫌になっちゃう
...I really can't stand the way the lunar authorities
always hide things just for the sake of hiding them.
...I really can't stand the way the lunar authorities
always hide things to the point that I hate them.


強制的に
By hook or by crook.
Forcibly

いや、穢れその物といってもいい
レベルだわ
No, you could say they are impurity itself.
No, the impurity itself is really high in level.

That's all. I'll then do the Extra route and song comments.
Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #6 on: December 11, 2016, 06:18:41 am »
This reminds me that I've seen some edits you've done that have been a bit objectionable, but haven't had the time to correct them. I still don't so I can't remember what they are but maybe I'll come back to it now that this is here.
d-d-do you mean me or kageshirou (。。;)


These ones aren't mine (at least judging by the edit history), but I'm sure the original translator would appreciate the corrections too.
Quote
  • どうしても気になることがあるのよ --> "There's something (about it) that I can't help but be concerned by." ("Even then, I'm still anxious" would be, like, そうだとしても気になる or some such, not どうしても. still tho, thanks for pointing this one out)
  • Missing Eirin line --> Oh, goodness. Thank you for the heads-up.
  • Eternal Spring (Night) Dream --> Same difference, imo? Most dreaming does tend to be done at night.
  • Opportunism --> Thanks for this one too
  • Process of purification --> Thanks likewise (thumbs up emoji)
  • Missing Doremy line --> Arigatou gozaimasu
  • Battle fair and square! --> Arigat's
  • "Seeing this, I can’t help but speak of the urban legends." --> ??? Not sure where this one's coming from. I edited the line for clarity anyway.
  • まあ、住めば都ってね --> This one's an idiom. (Weblio link) She's not literally saying she'd rather live in the Lunar Capital; all of Reisen's stuff in recent works has been about how she's a dyed-in-the-wool Earth rabbit by now.
  • Lunar officials hiding things --> "嫌になっちゃう" is already present in the English sentence as "I really can't stand". "To the point where I hate them" is basically the same thing, just phrased more stiffly.
  • "By hook or by crook" already means "forcibly". This one's fine, in my opinion?
  • いや、穢れその物といってもいいレベルだわ --> "No, at this level you could say they basically are impurity." (similar sentence, to demonstrate: このレベルだと、「(妖精は)穢れその物」と言っても良い)

Drake

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #7 on: December 11, 2016, 07:18:42 am »
I meant Kageshirou lol. There are quite a few edits that I check when I see them pop up, notice something to correct, and never get around to it because it might require an explanation or whatever.

For this list:
  • I agree with Gilde on どうしてもbla
  • I can't believe I didn't notice this when this line has always bothered me. Should probably be more like "However, if we ourselves end up getting involved,"
  • I don't agree with adding Night explicitly. I'm not sure if it's on the wiki as a note, but this song title is actually a play on one meaning of 春夢, which is that it's a metaphor for the transiency of things. Hence, "eternal transience". This is important for understanding why it's titled this, since it's about Doremy who lives in a world full of these transient dreams.
  • I think both meanings of "opportunistic" and "double standard" work here, but it might be more "hypocritical" than double standard, so I don't mind the change.
  • It's certainly "the earthlings have done an extraordinarily good job regarding the process of purification", but I don't particularly think "surprisingly" is what to use, and it isn't clear to me that the phrase is about them "helping" along the process. In what way? As far as I can tell, Ringo's talking about how the humans haven't really done anything to get in their way so far. (For that matter, the previous lines 敵では無い、味方ですら無い should be "We're not enemies, but not allies either" since the subject is Ringo and co., not Sanae.
  • Should also be "It is a nightmare worthy of being called bla"
  • That definitely isn't right, but the newly clarified line is a lot better.
  • See Gilde
  • 隠蔽に隠蔽でもう嫌になっちゃう is more like "concealing for concealment's sake to the point where I've gotten sick of it". I agree the line is fine as-is; the suggestion sounds completely unnatural.
  • Using an idiom here flows much better than saying "Forcibly" because she's talking about how Sagume's words will affect reality regardless of willingness. "If she says it, that's how it'll be; forcibly" doesn't sound right. "Whether I like it or not" would be another way to phrase it.
  • Actually wrong; "No, it's at the level that you could say it's kegare itself" would be my lazy literal translation.


On the flip side, I'd suggest changing the Thai wiki to reflect some of the counter-suggestions.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 07:26:42 am by Drake »

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Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2016, 08:00:42 am »
EDIT: Okay, done writing.

@glide, Drake Thank you for the suggestion/edit once again. Also, Drake, yeah, I will bring those edits up when I got there.

I worded it kinda wrongly, lol. What I meant to say that the Thai translator/admin isn't the one suggesting the changes and has nothing to do with this whole thread. I basically secretly "borrow" their already done translations and post them here for your suggestion to edit our wiki. Also, the words in bold are actually my interpretation of the translations from Thai to English. The translator opt to translate everything literally. That's why some sentences sound really unnatural both in Thai and English. But some suggestions like "meaning the same" is my own fault for not realizing the redundancy, lol.

About the Thai wiki, I doubt he would even care. That admin has grown some kind of superiority complex that he never trusts westerners again after being in some arguments with them about wiki editing. For instance, in one of his posts;

Thai admin: I tell them to do this and that and all I got is "It's a wiki. Go ahead and change it as you please." Fine! I'll let the mistakes exist there forever. I don't care, lololol. Their translation sucks but ours is all right anyway.

Annnd.... their translations mostly remain unchanged even today. What I have seen so far is some wiki members correcting single alphabet mistake. However, I have found several glaring mistakes sprawling throughout their wiki. I label those in my notepad as "Hypocrite/Mistake"

The Thai admin basically create the wiki because in the past, he saw several mistakes in our wiki (Well, he is true at that time at least since it is still Wikia) in terms of mistranslating the original, lost in translation or pun, inappropriate uses of tone Ex. adding ! where it is not there originally, turning some normal conversations or teasing into a quarrel or shouting. AND the point that he often bring ups and says as if we had no idea what we were doing, we translating Maryberry as Maribel. He creates his own wiki to help bring Touhou info on the right track (and also help Thais who can't read English. Seriously, Thai people sucks at English but never try to learn it!) At one point, he says that westerners are like that. Even if they are criticized for their mistakes, they refuse to comply with the suggestion so he'll let them be and forever drown in the mistakes and understanding wrong info about Touhou.

He also claims himself to be a "rebel" by posting endings in there, saying that otherwise, Thais cannot find info anywhere else. But I seriously think that as an act of boosting his pride of his wiki instead as if it was unique in the whole universe.

That's all for the rambling. I do these secretly because I want them to still drown in their delusion that our wiki is still sucks while in actuality closer to the right track while theirs forever have glaring mistakes, a "hypocrite." I once thought they could be absolute right and knowledgeable in what they are doing but this thread had proved me otherwise. Despite this, that admin has clearly done some researches in references and notes so I'll give them a credit for that.

However, that is not the main reason I do this. Instead, I want to make Touhou wiki a reliable source of infomation for others once again.

Thank you for reading all of these long nonsenses. Cheers,

P.S. Oh, I'll do the next one tomorrow. Feeling kinda exhausted right now. I'll also be more careful in transcribing sentences.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 09:34:56 am by Kageshirou »

Drake

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2016, 12:02:54 pm »
Well, don't worry, I know what you meant :V

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Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2016, 02:58:30 pm »
The last one for LoLK are Extra routes and music comments.


Marisa:
ほう……ガチの復讐って話だったのか
Huh. So it's dictionary-definition revenge, then?
Huh. So it's deep-seated revenge, then?


地獄がやってくる、だなんてぞっとしないな
Really don't like idea of you raisin' hell over there.
I hope you don’t do scary stuffs like raisin' hell over there.


Aside from that, at one point I replaced "Master’s friend" with "honorable friend" with the idea coming from the comments here. http://danbooru.donmai.us/posts/2136253


Music comment:


展開の早さに不穩さを覚えつつ、曲も後半でもおかしくない
感じになりました。
Making us feel uneasy with the changing situation, this song became one that wouldn't feel out-of-place in the latter half of the game.
This song makes us feel uneasy with the quick pacing of the plot while the latter half of this song isn’t really unusual.


強敵である上に、戦う事が本当に正しいのか迷っているような
感じの曲です。
On top of being a powerful opponent, this song depicts her doubts as to whether or not
fighting is really the right thing to do.
This is a song that makes you feel as if you were hesitating whether fighting an opponent this powerful is really a good idea.


宇宙に見えて、実は精神世界という、ある種夢オチ。
あそこにいる妖精や幽霊は、それぞれの夢なんですね。
夢のなかでも弾幕はっちゃうお茶目な輩です。
It looks like space, but it's actually the mental world. So it is an 'all just a dream' twist, in a sense. The fairies and phantoms wandering around are the dreams of said creatures in reality. It's mischievous of them to spread barrages of danmaku even in dreams.
It looks like space, but it's actually the dream of mental world. The fairies and phantoms wandering around are the dreams of said creatures in reality. Even in dreams, they like to spread barrages of danmaku.


世の中にはピエロ恐怖症ってあるみたいですね。
The fear of clowns is pretty widespread these days.
The fear of clowns seems to exist in this world.


本当はメタルっぽいものを考えてましたが、自分がそっちの造詣が
深くないし、世界感に合わなさそうなので結果こんな感じに。
I actually thought about making a metal song, but I'm not well-versed in that area and it felt like it wouldn't fit the setting, so I made it like this in the end.
I actually thought about making this piece a metal song, but I'm not well-versed in that area and it might not appeal to everyone, so I made it like this in the end.


Next is Impossible Spell Card, skipping spin-offs for now cuz those were a pain to do.

Mikuru

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2016, 06:02:18 pm »
Hi, I'm the one who did those translations in the first place and: you're completely right for all of 'em & I edited the wiki accordingly (σ* ゚ー゚)σ Thank u v.much for the input
I have to say, I don't agree with all of them. 愁 could be translated as sorrow, distress, or anxiety; I would prefer to keep "sorrow". 迷夢 does mean "delusion", not "confusion".

Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2017, 06:23:41 am »
Hello, everyone. It’s been a long while since the last re-translation. Sorry for necrobumping, but since I am studying in a university, I do not have a consistent amount of time to post stuffs regularly. I also figure that multiple threads of these would really clog up the board, considering that I might post once per one or two months depending on my free time.

Once again, I will be posting every discrepancy between Thai wiki and our Touhou wiki in every Touhou official work. I will leave no stone unturned, no matter how small the difference, if it does give a completely different meaning, I will point it out. I will do EoSD next since this is the one that has the most discrepancies.

Before that, I would like to ask two questions;

Question 1: Should we add “,ze” or any character's catchphrase to every single dialogue that has the word in Japanese script?
Question 2: In the past, I have deleted most of the “!” symbol that isn’t in the original Japanese script, and adds ~ or – to match with the Japanese script but I was told that it was wrong. Therefore, what should we do about these symbols?


Then, I’ll start main story first. Then, extra story, prologue, miscellaneous stuffs. Things that I have edited in the past will also be included along the way.

Note: In case you forgot, the word in bold is Thai wiki’s translation or my suggestion for editing. Since the admin prefers literal translation, there’s bound to be a case of awkward sentences.  Of course, if you have any question regarding these, feel free to ask.



Reimu

https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/The_Embodiment_of_Scarlet_Devil/Story/Reimu%27s_Scenario


そうなのよね~
お化けも出るし、たまんないわ
Yeah, it sure is~Ghosts come out too, so it's simply wonderful.[2]
Ghosts ---> Obake/Monsters

道に迷うは、妖精の所為なの
When you lose your way, it's because of the fairies.
This sentence has a pun between “sei” meaning fault/doings with “yousei”


あんた、ちったぁ驚きなさいよ
目の前に強敵がいるのよ?
You've got a formidable enemy right in front of you!
Don't you see a formidable enemy right in front of you?
(Yes, it differs only by a fraction but I figure that I should mention this too, considering that I have edited several cases like this in the past.)



私は巫女をしている普通の人よ
I'm a perfectly normal shrine maiden.
I'm a normal human who works as a shrine maiden.


うちは年中無休で参拝客が無いわよ
My shrine rarely has any visitors in the middle of the year.
My shrine doesn’t have any visitors for the whole year.


まぁその程度の価値しか無いんだよ
Oh. Then I suppose they're not worth much.
Oh. Then I suppose they're not worth that little.


家には空間をいじるのが好きな人が
いるのよ
There is someone in the mansion who likes to mess with time and space.
---> ... mess with space. (The original doesn't mention anything about time.)



日光が邪魔だからよ お嬢様、冥い好きだし
Daylight bothers my mistress. She prefers darkness.
Daylight is bothersome. Moreover, my mistress prefers dark places.
Thai translation implies that Sakuya also hates daylight.



さぁ、会わせてくれるかしら
Now you'll let me meet with the mistress, right?
---> Now I wonder if you'll let me meet with the mistress.
(Once again, back then I change the translation to match with the Thai wiki.)



・・・
なかなか出来るわね
...So you're strong, then.
But you did a very good job.



Marisa

https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/The_Embodiment_of_Scarlet_Devil/Story/Marisa%27s_Scenario


人類以外は
指は十本じゃないのかしら
She's not human. I wonder if she even has ten fingers.
Don’t other species beside humans also have ten fingers?


寒い奴
Gee, that was a cool pun.
How cold of you.


それはなにか違う・・・
No, I didn't mean...
I feel there is something wrong with that...


いっぱいいっぱいなんだろ?
That's the best you can do, isn't it?
Isn’t that totally wrong?


早く、お茶でも出してくれるお屋敷
探そう、っと
I should find a place that serves tea soon
---> I should find a mansion that serves tea soon


後で、さっくり貰っていこ
I'll just quietly take a few later.
I’ll take lots of them later. (Yes, these just differ between “quietly” and “a few” but there are several cases like this throughout the wiki so I want to check every single one of these.)


えぇーと、目の前の黒いのを
消極的にやっつけるには・・・
Let's see... How do I beat the black thing in front of me...
---> Let's see... How do I slowly beat the black thing in front of me.../Let's see... How to take out the black thing in front of me without having to do anything...

(Note: the translation after the / is the one that is edited by someone else.)



えぇーと、簡単に素材のアクを
取り除く調理法は・・・
Let's see... What's a way to easily remove unneeded portions of food...
Question: Does the Japanese script mentions the word “soup?” Because it was translated in Thai as
Let’s see...how to easily remove the unneeded particles/impurities in the soup used for cooking.
(Yes, I know, it is extremely awkward to read.)




あなたもこの館に雇われたの
かしら?
So? Were you also hired to work here?
So? Did you want to be hired to work here?



何だよそれ
小学校でもあるまいし
That's silly. We're not in elementary school anymore.
What’s that? I don’t think there is any of that stuff even in an elementary school.


さて、早速仕事に取りかかって
貰おうかしら
Well then, I'll have you start working immediately.
Well then, I'll start working immediately. (Due to Thai and Japanese grammar that allows omitting a subject, I’m not sure who is working.)


あ、結構普通なんだな
そういうことって
Ah, that's a pretty average amount in the first place, though.
Ah, what a normal thing for you to say.


あなたみたいな人も珍しいわね
こっちには何もないわよ?
We don't see people like you around here often. There's nothing here, okay?
You are really a strange person. There’s nothing here, okay?


いるいる
悪寒が走るわ、この妖気
There's someone here! This strange feeling is giving me the chills.
---> It's really here. The chillness of this strange energy is floating everywhere.


何で強力な奴ほど隠れるんだ?
Why do the strong ones always hide?
---> Why doesn't it hides like the strong ones?


・・・食べても、いいのよ
...I could eat a bit more.
---> ...You can eat me./...Help yourself, then.


That's all for the main story. Once again, this is in no rush and voluntary. So, thank you everyone in advance for your contributions.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017, 06:58:18 am by Kageshirou »

N-Forza

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2017, 08:12:15 am »
Before that, I would like to ask two questions;

Question 1: Should we add “,ze” or any character's catchphrase to every single dialogue that has the word in Japanese script?
Question 2: In the past, I have deleted most of the “!” symbol that isn’t in the original Japanese script, and adds ~ or – to match with the Japanese script but I was told that it was wrong. Therefore, what should we do about these symbols?


1. If you want to sound like an amateur with no sense for what sounds natural in the target language, absolutely. I mean, maybe they use "ze" like that in other languages but I can't think of any.
2. Adding punctuation is on a case-by-case basis. Normally I wouldn't though. I only use "-" to indicate when there is an interruption (and phrase the sentence accordingly to make it obvious) and I'll take out tildes to elongate vowels instead.

Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2017, 08:24:53 am »
1: I thought as much so that's why I didn't do that. English is really unfortunate when it comes to stuff like these. In Thai, we translate "ze" by using "wa" or "woi" at the end to indicate Marisa's rather casual but not rude way of talking.

2: Well then, I'll revert those changes I've made (! -  ~) and adjust the latter two according to your suggestion.

Mеа

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2017, 01:38:54 pm »
Didn't see this. I'll offer my two cents and maybe someone like Drake can double check.

Eosd Reimu
  • Don't know what the currently used convention for obake is, but considering that ghosts are an actual species in gensokyo, it's probably best that 'monsters' is used to avoid miscommunication.
  • Seems too shallow to be a pun.
  • No comment.
  • Sounds good.
  • I would use something playful like 'My shrine enjoys a yearlong lack of visitors.' because of her spitefully longwinded way of saying it, but that would be personal preference.
  • [teido-ing intensifies]. Jokes aside, 'not... much' works better than 'not... little' here, since it wouldn't make sense to attribute lots of worth to books just compared to Reimu's lack of offerings.
  • Sounds right.
  • I think 'sunlight' is used more often than 'daylight', though that may simply be what the thai best translated into first. 冥い好き
     is a ZUN original (although 暗い好き exists) meaning 'darkness enthusiast', 'darkness nut', etc. Doesn't change much to omit it though and keep it like it is. The nuance I'm getting from the usage of 冥い over 暗い is that not only does Remilia like dark places, she also has interest in all things gloomy or macabre. You are correct that Sakuya doesn't imply any of her thoughts on the matter, although your 'moreover' is also implying that. So: 'The sunlight is a bother. My mistress, she likes things gloomy.' works, remembering to answer Reimu's question.
  • Preference.
  • Reimu is confirming her suspicions of Remilia's strength. It's the follow up to her previous question of 'Are you strong?' So it's good as is.

Eosd Marisa
  • Original is way off. Yours works better. 'Do non-humans not have ten digits/fingers?' Digit vs fingers is preference based on the earlier line of conversation.
  • Either I'm not catching the joke, or Marisa isn't actually responding to anything Cirno says here. My take was that Marisa uses the other dull/lame meaning of the word for the hell of it to insult a fairy. So "You're so cool." would deliver the spontaneity and cutting sarcasm of the line, leading to:
  • 'That sounds like an insult...'
  • I'll admit I don't know what exactly Marisa means here in the original, but continuing along, "Just stuffed full of coolness aren't ya?" should work.
  • Yours works. 'I should go find a mansion that serves tea or something.' reflects her whimsical thought process better.
  • The line should reflect casual, lighthearted theft. Something like: "I'll take some on my way out later."
  • "Let's see, in order to defeat this black thing in front of me passive-aggressively..." Not quite accurate given the connotation of passive-aggressive, but works if you take it more literally. The former rather fits her spiteful personality anyway.
  • No mentions of soup in the original, only of ingredients. "Let's see, in order to easily remove the impurities from my ingredients..."
  • The original is correct
  • The original is correct
  • The original is correct. If we wanted Sakuya to be asking for permission to get to work, it would be さて、早速仕事に取り掛からせて貰おうかしら, but that would imply that she wasn't already working so it wouldn't work here anyway.
  • "Ah, so it wasn't an original idea." is closer to the original line. Alternatively, "You seem to get that a lot." works in a similar vein.
  • Your first half is better, the latter half of the original is correct however. "There's definitely something here. This eerie atmosphere is giving me the chills."
  • The original is correct.
  • I like that last one.

My two cents.
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Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2017, 02:05:43 pm »
Thank you very much for your two cents. At the very least, I can now perfectly sure that the self-proclaimed 100% correct Thai wiki isn't as invincible now considering some of their awkward or plainly wrong translations.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017, 02:10:10 pm by Kageshirou »

Drake

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #17 on: May 04, 2017, 07:52:31 am »
Ghosts ---> Obake/Monsters
Monsters, really, but the use of 悪霊 and お化け at all is really just leftover pre-worldbuilding language. There aren't any actual connections with any modern terms so "evil spirits" and "monsters" are probably the best bet.

This sentence has a pun between “sei” meaning fault/doings with “yousei”
toho-motoneta makes note of it and refers to a similar pun from the obscure Angelic Concert (2001) but it's a bit reaching and I personally wouldn't bother pointing it out.

Don't you see a formidable enemy right in front of you?
(Yes, it differs only by a fraction but I figure that I should mention this too, considering that I have edited several cases like this in the past.)

You've already put that up there. But sure. The sentence structure doesn't particularly lean towards making a question or a statement (it's just an implied intonation) so both are fine.

I'm a normal human who works as a shrine maiden.
I mean this is obviously part of the whole conversation. It would be best to make everything here the same, so
"Er, just an ordinary person"
"Um, that was just an ordinary attack"
"I'm just an ordinary person that works as a shrine maiden"

My shrine doesn’t have any visitors for the whole year.
"My shrine gets no visitors all year round"

Oh. Then I suppose they're not worth much.
Oh. Then I suppose they're not worth that little.
First is correct, it's just a joke. 価値しか無い, not 価値じゃ無い. Similarly "Oh, well I guess they're only worth that much then."

There is someone in the mansion who likes to mess with time and space.
---> ... mess with space. (The original doesn't mention anything about time.)

You already did that, yup.

Daylight is bothersome. Moreover, my mistress prefers dark places.
Thai translation implies that Sakuya also hates daylight.

I would agree with just "daylight is bothersome" but would absolutely disagree with it suggesting that Sakuya dislikes daylight. Sakuya is just saying Remilia dislikes it, and that's why it's bothersome. Which is in turn why they release the mist.
"Daylight is bothersome. The mistress prefers the dark." (the mistress to match the rest of the conversation, and "the dark" leaves room to suggest more than just dark places)

---> Now I wonder if you'll let me meet with the mistress.
(Once again, back then I change the translation to match with the Thai wiki.)

"Then, will you now let me meet with the mistress?"
While it uses かしら it is clearly an implied demand.

...So you're strong, then.
But you did a very good job.
Not at all. The first is correct (although they should be on different lines).
Remilia goes "ok well I guess we're gonna fight". Reimu suggests that Remilia hired Sakuya as protection; Remilia retorts that Sakuya is just the maid, implying that she's stronger. Reimu asks if Remilia is strong. Remilia goes "who knows? I rarely go outside so I can't compare myself", which is a thinly-veiled flaunt. なかなか出来る is a phrase that I couldn't translate directly to English at all, but it's essentially just saying "well you fit, then".
« Last Edit: May 04, 2017, 07:57:21 am by Drake »

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Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #18 on: May 19, 2017, 07:22:47 am »
I’m back! With EoSD prologue, two Extra stories and musics!

I figure that it would be pretty annoying to move back and forth between the wiki and this page so I do this to make it easier for you to compare between the two. Of course, I’ll comment here if I want to clarify something.


https://en.touhouwiki.net/index.php?title=The_Embodiment_of_Scarlet_Devil%2FStory%2FPrologue&type=revision&diff=356532&oldid=307102


謎の来訪者に、夏の亡霊も戸惑ってるかの様に見えた。
A mysterious visitor would have thought that even the ghosts of summertime were in a state of bewilderment.
---> Any mysterious visitor would be confused with a ghost of summertime. I'm not sure which is correct. Visitor is confused for ghost or the ghost is confused?

中心地には島があり、そこには人気を嫌った、とてもじゃないけど人間の
 住めないようなところに、窓の少ない洋館が存在した。
In the very center of it all is an island, rejected by mankind simply because they could not live there. On that island is a mansion; one of few windows.
So, what is being rejected, island or mansion?


Extra story for Reimu and Marisa

https://en.touhouwiki.net/index.php?title=The_Embodiment_of_Scarlet_Devil%2FStory%2FReimu%27s_Extra&type=revision&diff=356575&oldid=307103
https://en.touhouwiki.net/index.php?title=The_Embodiment_of_Scarlet_Devil%2FStory%2FMarisa%27s_Extra&type=revision&diff=370440&oldid=307100

Music

https://en.touhouwiki.net/index.php?title=The_Embodiment_of_Scarlet_Devil%2FMusic&type=revision&diff=356546&oldid=341959


Question: How should Cirno’s theme be translated? It is currently, Tomboyish Girl in Love, which is okay but in PoFV, it is Adventure of the Lovestruck Tomboy, in which “Lovestruck” is the same as in “in Love” So the main thing is, for the sake of consistency, Lovestruck or in Love?

EDIT: More question. How should 妖気 be translated? In Thai, it is translated something along the line of youkai energy/chi but for our wiki, it is all over the place. I'm currently going with "strange energy"


And there you go! EoSD is completed! Of course, not 100% completed since there are profiles and observation stuffs left but that will be for a separate occasions.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 07:48:08 am by Kageshirou »

Kiefmaster99

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #19 on: May 19, 2017, 02:45:41 pm »
Is there a particular reason why 東方紅魔狂 was changed to Touhou Scarlet Devil Lunatic? I understand that it's a direct pun off the title, but to my knowledge, even in our translations of the Japanese title to English, we use "Eastern", unless there was a change in style I'm unaware of.
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Shadowlupus

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2017, 02:53:25 pm »
At first, I was confused too myself cuz I don't remember that I did edit those today.

Turns out that I accidentally saved the old translation over a new one when I was correcting the "what're" so that's why. Sorry about that. :p I'll get it done a sec.

EDIT: Done!
« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 02:57:02 pm by Kageshirou »

Prime32

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Re: Touhou Wiki's Re-Translation Thread
« Reply #21 on: May 23, 2017, 01:20:46 am »
家には空間をいじるのが好きな人が
いるのよ
There is someone in the mansion who likes to mess with time and space.
---> ... mess with space. (The original doesn't mention anything about time.)

Was looking through old interviews and came across this:
Q.「紅魔郷」パチュリーが言う「空間をいじるのが好きな人」は誰?
Q: In EoSD, who is the person Patchouli called "the person who likes to play around with time and space"?

A.それはもちろん咲夜の事です。
咲夜の操る時は、時間のことであり、時刻ではありません。
時間というものは、空間と分けて考える事は出来ないのです。
その為、時間を操れるものは空間も操れます。逆も然りです。
A: That is of course referring to Sakuya.
Sakuya controls duration of time, not single moments of time.
In the former case of "duration of time", you can't separate it from space.
Because of that, manipulating time also means manipulating space, and vice-versa.
 

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