So what am I waking up to? Oh, votes on me, yikes, who are they from?
...I actually feel much less pressured that I normally would, probably because the vibes I am getting feel more like people expressing their frustration at my playstyle and flippant attitude instead of genuinely seeing problem in my content (or in Zakeri/Murrin's case, lashing out at someone to save their own skin), its a clever attempt to try to divert attention to me, but I too understand firsthand how aggravating mafia could be, especially when you need to confront someone whom seemingly has an impenetrable thick skull. And I do have a long history of flipping out regardless of my alignment when I am tired, so I personally wouldn't call that one indicative, but yeah, that's my opinion, feel free to pass divine vengeance on me all you want. It's the part of my playstyle I am trying to improve.
Anyway, sentimental stuff aside, if you still insist for punishing my gameplay instead of actually drawing attention to scumhunting, well, obviously I will still object, but that wouldn't change Shalako does deserve an apology change for that fiasco, so, sorry.
Right, now let's actually get back to the arguments targetting myself, and the one thing you all love and hate. Walls!
I can't even parse all of this bullshit and I'm not even going to pretend I can read through all of this at once.
Murrin seems to be the biggest wagon so let's just investigate that.
Re: Shadoweh's targeting post
Yeah I agree it's suspicious that Murrin brings up a suspicion against Serela while defending all of his actions. His vote for Raitaki follows in that he things Rai is worse, but it also feels like his suspicsion of Serela is forced. He doesn't want to be caught not mentioning Serela but also doesn't want to pursue Serela. this doesn't mean Serela is scum though.
I don't see anything I could argue about in Conq's reasoning.
also I guess Dormio has a point in that Murrin defended Raitaki's vote and then ignored his own defense. Making both of his suspicions forced.
Thats interesting, because in here, Zakeri doesn't even try to object to the arguments on Murrin, so he's essentially just parroting arguments and stating his stance, which makes such a big part of his post, after reading through and lurking for the majority of the day, nearly devoid of content. That shouldn't really happen, because when you lurk as town, you need to compensate for the downtime by offering insights, I see zero offered here, and based on Zak's playstyle, this seems to be only excusable when he's scum. So nope, opinions not improved at all, what's next?
...which makes me think the whole wagon is bunk now all at once. I mean, i could just go an accept the reasoning that his suspicions are forced, but if I did that I would be forcing my own suspicions on him, and I certainly am feeling the pressure to move my vote from Conqueror onto Murrin's wagon. This probably sounds paradoxical, but as town I don't want to force my suspicions and so I'm forgiving Murrin for forcing his suspicions.
The only other thing I read was Shakalaka and DNA, and while I think their interactions and bickering befit a town/town argument, I don't really like DNA's vote on Shamalamadingdong for not having a vote down despite all the effort he's trying to put in.
This is the actual part of Zak's argument, by 'actual part' I mean the part bolded only, he's calling me voting Shalako when he's inputting effort scummy, but Zak,
you of all people were playing with me since the dawn of time! We were even in the very same game last time when we both played as scum, and you know fully well I input effort regardless of the alignment I am in. For you of all people, it feels like a very, very forced move, especially when you didn't really offer any reasoning for how in Shalako's case in particular effort should be a town clear on him. He's a new player, he doesn't have a history of his playstyle, and for all WIFOM is worth he could be the same kind of player as me when I started off, simply trying to fit in by frantically posting because everyone else are posting these long scary walls. Which is a motivation he would have regardless of alignment, in any case, your argument proposed here is a very weak slippery slope, and requires assuming 'effort equates townclear', which is most certainly not true.
The part not bolded, however, is where Zak offered an excuse for not actually voting the relevant wagon of which he agrees with every single argument on because 'it feels forced to force my suspicions on him when hes accused of the same thing', but what's that supposed to mean? It is paradoxical and wrong, but stating it to be paradoxical doesn't change anything about your motivations. It seems like a fine example of Poe's law here to me, and a particularly scummy tell for me, do pardon my bias, but Zak and me are in the same scumteam last game, and right now it seems you are just reusing your strategy which is a combination of lurking, sudden intermission post, back to lurking and hope things are swept under the rug tomorrow. I would strongly advise you to pick up on the slack and actually substantiate for your motivation.
Right, let's move on to Raitaki;
Hmm, Shalako's actual content still feels somewhat diluted, but then again he did make a lot of them, so he's putting in real effort. And all the anecdotes about his playing style in between that I glossed over before don't seem to be what scum would do on their first time playing at a new community, since they're giving up information about themselves.
Re Shalako on me vs Murrin: Me asking him whether you were scummy for agreeing with something I said was rhetoric. Similiar to Dorian's "am I suspicious for not seeing problems with Raitaki's content" at the beginning of page 3 of the thread. I didn't really expect Murrin to seriously respond to it, and if they seriously answered "yes" I would have gone after their ass.
This isn't an argument on me, but still relevant as I would like to make clear Murrin and Shalako obviously are unfamiliar with the mafia meta, or at least our mafia meta. So allow me to elaborate this more, there's a fundamental logical flaw with associating "effort = town", players showing effort means they have enthusiasm for the game. And the reason why enthusiastic players can be lynched later is because if they show a disrespectancy in effort later on, that's a clear scumtell to avoid drawing attention to themselves. Me "townclearing" you for effort thereby follows the same logic, the later the game piles on, the clearer a trend I can observe with your behavior, and I can much more easily spot any inconsistencies. Which is why scum wants to kill off the productive players over the obvtown ones sometimes, in order so that they themselves can manipulate the conversation.
And with that said, indeed, my vote on Shalako was impulsive due to my state of mind more than anything, and partially because I was genuinely trying to wring better logic out of him, and that's went on to be a bit too aggressive, so
##Unvote. But we went over that before..
Murrin is...hm. Low productivity, defended his somewhat miniscule case against me for a rather long time, but then admitted said case he spent at least 50% of his time defending was bullshit. I'm starting to doubt this is newbscum in action, his scumbuddy had plenty of time to tell him to abandon it and go after something else, and admitting his prior and only case was bullshit when about half the player base has either voted or spoken out against him seemed suicidal for scum imo, new or not. Don't feel like he's scum atm. It'd be good if he starts to read each player based on their overall behaviour though, instead of only judging them sentence-by-sentence (see also: defending Serela and calling her suspicious in the same post).
I'm kind of confused by Zak's reasoning on why he's forgiving Murrin ; v; His "I don't see anything I could argue about in Conq's reasoning" is also odd and seemingly came out of nowhere. I'd like to hear his explanation on why he mentioned that.
DNA's content has had a significant drop in quality ever since we dropped our argument. Now he's just mainly voting Shalako for his lack of vote and apparently Shalako failing to meet his standards for making a case. Him townclearing me for ~*~effort~*~ seemed kind of odd too, considering all I did between dropping my RP posting style and now was questioning Murrin on his suspicions and voting Shalako.
Reminder that SB poofed from the radar.
And now ##Target: Darkninjaabc.
You are much more productive right now that when you are donning the silly RP, although I disagree your train of thought, I am pleased to see there's one at all, and because of the effort argument I raised before, which is the reason why I am willing to overlook yours, and by extension, Murrin's wagon at the moment unless you both have something overwhelmingly incriminating. MotK town has a bad habit of forgetting about lurkers and letting our mindsets reset after each night phase, so if we want to lynch lurkers, the time is now.
Besides, for Zakeri and Serela's cases (thanks for the reminder Bard), they seem more like actively avoiding providing content more than anything, and seeing Murrin's reponse, although as irritating as ever, can still be a non-indicative tell based on his inexperience, I believe my vote is better to pressure Zak to give actual insight at the moment.
##Vote Zakericut by 1
