Author Topic: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.  (Read 239360 times)

FlareDragon

  • Gensokyo's Infernal Hellstorm
  • When will you come to Gensokyo, Satsuki Rin?
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #420 on: May 10, 2015, 07:49:22 PM »
Can I just call out the fact that Doremy/Doremi's 1st and 2nd boss spells are amazing? Seriously; they look like a bunch of bullet spam, but it has a really graceful(?) pattern once you figure out how to dodge it (and even then, Jaimers' playthrough shows just how brutal they can still be). Also, her theme keeps making me think of Alice's PCB theme.
Normal 1CC's: SoEW, LLS, MS, EoSD, PCB, IN, PoFV, MoF, SA, UFO, GFW, TD, HM, DDC, ULiL, LoLK(PD), CtC |IaMP|
Hard 1CC's: EoSD, PCB, MoF, IN(B), TD, LoLK(PD), |???|
Lunatic 1CC's: None
Extra 1CC's: SoEW, MS, EoSD, PCB, IN, PoFV, MoF(NB), SA, UFO, GFW, TD, DDC, CtC, LoLK, |???|

WodofGar

  • Virtual Cartographer
  • Double Spoiler was my birthday present.
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #421 on: May 10, 2015, 07:52:47 PM »
I already find Doremi horribly difficult on normal. Those graceful and deadly bullet clouds combined with danmaku that basically surrounds you makes for one of the hardest stage 3 bosses in the series. Seriously, can't wait to get wailed on by the Stage 4 boss when this game comes out.



Tengukami

  • Breaking news. Any season.
  • *
  • I said, with a posed look.
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #422 on: May 10, 2015, 07:58:23 PM »
I am fine with the score = lives return, especially given the assist that Graze Freeze gives. Plus it'll encourage me to git gud.

Can I just call out the fact that Doremy/Doremi's 1st and 2nd boss spells are amazing?

Totally in keeping with the boss of a stage that looks like you just stepped into a nightclub from 1983.

"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #423 on: May 10, 2015, 08:06:52 PM »
Depends, aren't the random bullets different every time ?
If the bullet trajectories are psuedorandom saving the seed should be enough. If they're truly random then it can't be done feasibly.

Tengukami

  • Breaking news. Any season.
  • *
  • I said, with a posed look.
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #424 on: May 10, 2015, 08:22:28 PM »
Well we got some scenario translations up, and I don't mean to be an alarmist, but
Spoiler:
Ringo mentions the effects of some "madman" in the Lunarian Capital
.

Is this an accurate translation, and if so, is it gender neutral? Would be quite the change of pace if it means exactly what it says.

"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #425 on: May 10, 2015, 08:26:00 PM »
I have a feeling Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom will be one of the best releases in the series. At first I was a bit skeptical of how the 'gameplay changes' will turn out, but I do like the concept of the Pointdevice mode.

I really like the music of this game so far; it's interesting to see ZUN experimenting with a more technoey kind of sound. I think he must have revisited his PC-98 tracks and took some inspiration from them because there is a very PC-98-esque composition style to several of the pieces.

The character designs are really quirky and colourful. Doremy has quite an interesting, childish design. For some reason, she reminds me of Noddy (it's probably the hat), and her name made me think of the third season of Ojamajo Doremi where the witch apprentices were all patissiers. Probably because that anime was pretty much my favourite thing in my childhood. :3

I just hope the full version lives up to my expectations.

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #426 on: May 10, 2015, 08:26:38 PM »
Well we got some scenario translations up, and I don't mean to be an alarmist, but
Spoiler:
Ringo mentions the effects of some "madman" in the Lunarian Capital
.

Is this an accurate translation, and if so, is it gender neutral? Would be quite the change of pace if it means exactly what it says.

Well both
Spoiler:
madman and madwoman exist
so while I'm not sure I guess it'd be gender specific. It might be the translation though, I don't know if Japanese would distinguish them even if English does.

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #427 on: May 10, 2015, 08:29:54 PM »
Well we got some scenario translations up, and I don't mean to be an alarmist, but
Spoiler:
Ringo mentions the effects of some "madman" in the Lunarian Capital
.

Is this an accurate translation, and if so, is it gender neutral? Would be quite the change of pace if it means exactly what it says.

Spoiler:
Wasn't Chang'e supposed to be imprisoned in the moon?  Maybe she broke free and is the one Ringo talked about. 


commandercool

  • alter cool
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #429 on: May 10, 2015, 08:53:46 PM »
Gameplay seems rock solid. Pointdevice is a cool idea that sounded a little dubious on paper, but in practice I think it does its job very well. I like it.

Not feeling the character designs at all yet though. Ringo and Doremi are a mess. Maybe I'll warm up to them.
I made a PADHerder. It's probably out of date though.

Kaizaki

  • Pillager
  • I'm feeling lucky
    • GitHub
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #430 on: May 10, 2015, 09:05:58 PM »
Well we got some scenario translations up, and I don't mean to be an alarmist, but
Spoiler:
Ringo mentions the effects of some "madman" in the Lunarian Capital
.

Is this an accurate translation, and if so, is it gender neutral? Would be quite the change of pace if it means exactly what it says.
I'll give it a shot:
Spoiler:
the Kanji used for "madman" is 狂人, from "madness" 狂気 and "people/person" 人
. Nothing in the sentence specifies gender, ergo it's gender neutral. (Of course, I could be wrong, so corrections are very much welcome!)
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 09:09:54 PM by Kaizaki »

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #431 on: May 10, 2015, 09:49:47 PM »
Pretty impressed with this one, really :)


The game was a fair challenge on Normal. It actually put a fight without begin overkill-  Its more like the proper "Normal" should be (And not like the others who were relatively easy even the first time I did them...).


One question though... is Reisen?s hitbox bigger when using her bombs? I keep getting hit by bullets that, pretty sure should only have grazed... multiple times... but I only noticed it happened when I had the "shield" her bomb provides...strange...might be just me thought. I cant check because the replays are broken :/ (Is there a way to fix the replays?)

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #432 on: May 10, 2015, 09:54:49 PM »
So, this game's a thing.
Lunatic is no joke this time around. Resources-wise I thinks it's okay, given how you get both lives and bombs, it seems you have to try to score even for basic survival, so as Tengukami said, it encourages you to get good.

I'm iffy about Pointdevice mode right now, it's like a double-edge mechanic. On a full run, it seems a brute force way to get into patterns (as bombs are pretty scarce), and that can get exhausting rather quickly. However, it may very well be just perfect for practice mode, you can basically retry single sections/nonspells/Spells individually however many times you want.

The protags are kind of just there imo. Reimu and Marisa are just, well, Reimu and Marisa, after two games having the exact same thing, I find them pretty boring. Reisen is not as interesting as I thought she would be, but her bomb looks like it would be broken in Pointdevice mode in capable enough hands (but really, Reisen's waves pierce but Marisa's lasers still don't?  :wat:). Sanae on the other hand will probably be the girl I go with for this game, she has nice power, both focused and unfocused, and her bomb is not only stupid powerful, it lets you graze, so yeah, I believe she is this game's best shot.

Things I've done (and maybe will improve):
SA L6MNB | SA Lunatic 3b Scorerun | MoF LNB | PCB LNB |DDC LNB

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #433 on: May 10, 2015, 10:06:22 PM »
No kidding, this game is one of the hardest Touhou games of all time... heck even normal mode can qualify as hard in other games

I just tried hard mode, with waypoint, mind you, i didn't continue past stage 1, Seiren's last spell... i had no bombs ( yet somehow i beat it ) , i got powned like 20-30 times...

Lunatic in stage 1 is well close to ex stage difficulty, and i can't even imagine the section in stage 3 where the heroine is being bombarded by star danmaku from kedama's...

Also about Yorihime and Toyohime, appearing, it's likely because of the way Eirin's medicine behaves, Zun previously stated that the Watatsuki Sisters were too powerful for anyone in Gensokyo to even come close to handling, however, that may be possible with Eirin's medicine, which i am speculating if they appear, they would be in the 5th or EX stage, probably the latter.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 10:09:52 PM by UnidentifiedPhantasm »
1CC Easy: UFO , MOF, PCB, DDC, GFW, POFV, TD, IN, SA, 1CC Normal: MOF, DDC, IN, POFV, PCB, TD, EOSD, HSIFS
Extra Mode: Ran Yakumo, Okina Matara

Kaizaki

  • Pillager
  • I'm feeling lucky
    • GitHub
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #434 on: May 10, 2015, 10:11:08 PM »
Spoiler:
Wasn't Chang'e supposed to be imprisoned in the moon?  Maybe she broke free and is the one Ringo talked about. 
There is a tenuous connection actually. And this started from reading about ULiL.

Spoiler:
1. Merry and Renko share the theme "Strange Bird of the Moon, Illusion of Mysterious Cat."
2. The first three LoLK bosses are linked to birds: Seiran -> eagle, Ringo -> eagle, Doremy -> crane. (If anyone's wondering where I got "crane", look closely at her stage background.)
3. Doremy indicates that she was given the job (by whom?) to stop Reisen (presumably the protagonist, in general).
4. Cranes are associated with immortality in Chinese mythology.
5. The Chinese mythical figure Chang'e, as a drinker of the Elixir, is immortal. (Well, all Lunarians are considered immortals, but that's mostly due to purity than the inability to die.)

Off-topic: Doremy creeps me out. It feels like I've seen a similar character before that had the same effect on me... *shudders*
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 10:16:23 PM by Kaizaki »

An Odd Sea Slug

  • Not here, but not really there.
  • Only the best.
    • You can save the world by clicking this link!
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #435 on: May 10, 2015, 10:20:40 PM »
I feel like this should be playing everytime I die on Pointdevice mode.

That said, I was actually doing unusually well (probably all the practice I put into arcade shmups -especially Darius Gaiden- since February) until I got to Ringo and started jobbing rather hard to her nonspells; patterns like that really fuck with my eyes. Then again, this genre in general seems bad for my eyes. Then again, I've needed a prescription update for years.

I've actually spent more time in Legacy mode, as I find that pointdevice gets mind-numbing pretty quickly, not helped by the awesomely high difficulty spike this game represents. I may actually have to play easy mode, which I haven't done since SA. I started with normal, and ended up caught a bit off guard.

Aside from stage 1, Seirans theme and -maybe- the title screen, I'm also liking the music as well. Has that melodic feeling from old game soundtracks that the series had been missing for quite awhile. Also, +1 to the earlier comment about ZUN stepping up his mixing game. Ringo and Doremy's designs do nothing for me. Maybe fanart will fix that? And ever being the contrarian, I'm not enjoying the artwork at all.

If only the game would acknowledge my control pad. I'm not really liking playing on an analog stick; might have to break out my old Hori fightpad.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 10:31:03 PM by An Odd Sea Slug »

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #436 on: May 10, 2015, 10:26:09 PM »

Spoiler:
2. The first three LoLK bosses are linked to birds: Seiran -> eagle, Ringo -> eagle, Doremy -> crane. (If anyone's wondering where I got "crane", look closely at her stage background.)
3. Doremy indicates that she was given the job to stop Reisen (presumably the protagonist, in general).

Spoiler:
2.1 Doremy is a Baku, and Baku is a  tapir.
2.2 In these kind of connections, different characters should be linked to different creatures.
3. Doremy indicates that her job is just to guard the passageway from anyone, not specifically Reisen. A job she half-asses anyway. I think our enemy knew that she is against Eirin, and Eirin can send anyone (well, she sent everyone).

Sage Ω (Ultima)

  • CEO at Team Eternal Desire
  • ??? X
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #437 on: May 10, 2015, 10:27:49 PM »
No Darklord Reimu memes yet?

microfolk

  • I'ts absolutely
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #438 on: May 10, 2015, 10:28:05 PM »
Am I the only one who's puzzled by this section of the manual?

Quote
-Legacy Mode
Since the medicine seems to have some side effects, you can play without using it too.
You have the same old stock of lives as ever.
Can you shoot for a no-death clear with only your own strength?!

The last isn't implying we'll get some kind of reward if we'll manage to no-miss legacy mode... Right?

WodofGar

  • Virtual Cartographer
  • Double Spoiler was my birthday present.
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #439 on: May 10, 2015, 10:34:17 PM »
I feel like this should be playing everytime I die on Pointdevice mode.

One day, somebody is going to make a mod for it. That is the way of the weeabooWestern Fandom.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 10:35:55 PM by WodofGar »



Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #440 on: May 10, 2015, 10:37:48 PM »
Since when and where did it say that Reisen became a human all of a sudden? She is a pretty strange looking human with those bunny ears on her head and not to mention that she did come from the moon, making her still an alien.

Spoiler:
Reisen's species is listed as human in Legacy in Lunatic Kingdom. It could be an error, but that is not very likely.

Kaizaki

  • Pillager
  • I'm feeling lucky
    • GitHub
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #441 on: May 10, 2015, 10:38:51 PM »
Spoiler:
2.1 Doremy is a Baku, and Baku is a  tapir.
2.2 In these kind of connections, different characters should be linked to different creatures.
Spoiler:
I didn't mean that Doremy is a bird. It's just that there are crane motifs in her stage.

Spoiler:
3. Doremy indicates that her job is just to guard the passageway from anyone, not specifically Reisen. A job she half-asses anyway. I think our enemy knew that she is against Eirin, and Eirin can send anyone (well, she sent everyone).
Spoiler:
Nor did I say that it's just Reisen, hence why I added "(presumably the protagonist, in general)."
The only reason why explicitly mentioned Reisen is because Doremy mentions it in her scenario. It's not clear in Reimu's, and Marisa's and Sanae's are not translated yet. :P

But like what I said at the start, it's just a weak connection.

Tengukami

  • Breaking news. Any season.
  • *
  • I said, with a posed look.
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #442 on: May 10, 2015, 10:41:43 PM »
Pointdevice is balanced surprisingly well, in my opinion. There are many, many checkpoints (though once or twice I was like "aaarrrrrgh not this non-spell again!") and that helps you not immediately repeat that thing you did that got you killed last time, as it's a lot fresher in your mind.

But for me I'm mostly in Legacy Mode. Having to pay attention to things like grazing and points is a nice change of pace, though I'm relieved my beloved PoC whoring is still here.

Some people mentioned pointdevice as being like a practice run, and while I agree, Practice Start opening up will render that function obsolete. So I'm wonder how the endings for Pointdevice and Legacy will differ. While we're at it, what a good ending from Pointdevice will require.

I don't get the complaints about the character designs, which to me are wonderful. Especial Doremy. What I am really struggling with are those backgrounds, though, especially during Ringo. I literally leaned in inches from the screen with my eyes stuck to the hotbox at times (speaking of which, I love how the little eye shields around Reisen blink).

Musically, Ringo's theme is pretty great. It sounds like some European folk song, almost Slavic. Given the name, I was expecting it to be a little heavy on the drums.

Speaking of music: Seirin's theme is "The Rabbit Has Landed". This not only reference's Neil Armstrong's famous words upon landing on the Moon ("the eagle has landed" is what he said though, and Seirin is the Eagle Rabbit), but also, the exact phrase "the rabbit has landed" was used by lazy journalists around the world as a headline for news that China's own lunar probe - Chang'e 3 - landed on the Moon in December 2013.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2015, 02:40:16 AM by Tengukami »

"Human history and growth are both linked closely to strife. Without conflict, humanity would have no impetus for growth. When humans are satisfied with their present condition, they may as well give up on life."

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #443 on: May 10, 2015, 10:51:26 PM »
Ohh yeah, managed to clear Reisen's Pointdevice on Hard. It really was hard, as it should be. Heck, Normal was kind of hard already.

I think I've got the hang of Doremy's attacks now. Most of them had some kind of a gimmick that's almost necessary to beat them. I'm hoping for this puzzle aspect to be explored further in the upcoming stages, it's only good design in a game like this. (Though I can hear the Legacy players cringing far away.)

In general, Pointdevice is a great incentive to keep replaying cards and find possible tweaks in them, much like Spell Practice. In the older games, there were a few bits where I'd always just bomb my way through, even in the final 1ccs. Then again, saving bombs was part of the strategy. Here, bombs are less useful in a long-term sense, but they do have their place for something like Doremy's final attack. Reisen's bomb especially is made for Pointdevice.
check http://vsoft.life/ for runs & creations
latest stream: Hollow Song of Birds Hard 1cc (OrangeReimu) @ https://youtu.be/eDFd4FHEjXg

Failure McFailFace

  • I'm h...a...p...p...y...
  • Impor
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #444 on: May 10, 2015, 11:00:16 PM »
About the graze gimmick and points-for-lives:

WELCOME TO SUBTERRANEAN ANIMISM, IN SPACE!!!

Seriously, there's entire waves of enemies that only shoot homing bullets. If the Communication Meter was here, it would be giving Reimu and Co. a live 4k video feed through a Ying-Yang orb.
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #445 on: May 10, 2015, 11:21:00 PM »
Also, has anyone come across a certain glitch for Marisa, where the Master Spark graphic kinda just glitches and floats around the screen? (I'll get a screenshot up if I can replicate it)
Actually, I had a lot of random glitches, like visible hitbox on the boss or white flashes. Nothing really annoying, though.
I'm getting a ton of graphic glitches with other characters as well. Spooky red flames floating in midair, entire screen flashing red, etc.
and Ringo stole my hitbox graphic once wat
so is reimu's bomb supposed to form a big ball that occasionally explodes in your screen like a flashbang from COD and makes it impossible to see for a few seconds.
What I do see a lot of is "Chapter Finish" appearing, in different parts of the screen and in different font sizes. It's actually pretty hilarious, and doesn't really get in the way, but I anticipate this is one of the bugs that will be worked out on the journey from 0.01a to 1.0.

Seconding most of these, plus my hitbox leaping fifty feet across the screen one time. Most of the weird effects start happening around Stage 2, but only on Pointdevice Mode, and they seem to go away after restarting to a waypoint. The in-game description for Legacy Mode does mention that Eirin's medicine has "side effects", so... unless ZUN just messed up the coding in an absolutely unprecedented way, I think the weird graphical effects start happening if you go too long without using a waypoint?

edit:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ax_MKil_R_8 ok perhaps not 'unprecedented', but.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 11:25:14 PM by gilde »

Drake

  • *
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #446 on: May 10, 2015, 11:22:26 PM »
Spoiler:
狂人 is definitely gender-neutral. In fact, if there even were gender-specific terms, ZUN would probably go out of his way to switch to something gender-neutral anyways.

Re: Reisen being "human": As I mentioned on a previous page (and on the wiki), this is very likely a reference to the Eientei crew wanting to "be human" and integrate into human society by doing human-like things like working, which was elaborated on quite a bit in CiLR and is part of the reason SSiB even happened (see: Yukari wanting to get a "residential tax" from the Lunarians, along with the whole motivation to strike fear of the unknown into Eirin). Eirin and Reisen both do this (although Eirin has been referred to as Human since PMiSS), and I honestly didn't think about how clever this was until people started mentioning the "Species: Human" thing.


Also ha, I knew I had seen the background of stage 2 before. It's the Youkai Mountain lake BG from MoF stage 6. Looking at the dialogue now confirms this choice.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 11:47:36 PM by Drake »

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
- original art by Aiけん | ウサホリ -

CyberAngel

  • Retired
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #447 on: May 10, 2015, 11:40:58 PM »
Wait a sec. Is it just me or does that piano solo in stage 3 theme sound like... Moonlight Sonata?

Maiden Synnae ミ☆

  • Wizard Maiden
  • ★☆★☆★☆★☆★☆★☆
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #448 on: May 10, 2015, 11:43:39 PM »
Okay, so I just played it. Here are my impressions:

>Game is harder than any other danmaku title. Even UFO and SA's difficulty pales in comparison.
>Graphics are amazing. I pretty much exploded when I saw Stage 3's visuals because it looked like we were on Space to me, but it's just a Dream World. :/ (still really good)
>...those. effin. Doremy's nonspells. I found them on Easy to be harder even than Futo's nonspells on HARD. I may be failing to see a pattern there but I dunno.
>Didn't understand Reisen's bombs at all.

Oh well, this game is indeed hard. I managed to get an Easy 1cc on it but that's all I can do atm. I could get one on Normal if I practice more but don't feel like it right now.  Maybe a Normal 1cc is the most I will be able to achieve on the Full version.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2015, 11:55:49 PM by Maiden Synnae ミ☆ »

Sweetness and love~ ♥

ExPorygon

  • Veteran Danmakufu Scripter
  • Currently working on a full Touhou fangame!
    • Ephemeral Entertainment
Re: 東方Project 15 東方紺珠伝 ~ Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom.
« Reply #449 on: May 10, 2015, 11:46:29 PM »
>Didn't understand Reisen's bombs at all.
Reisen's bombs give you several free hits but make your hitbox considerably larger while its active.