Author Topic: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2  (Read 4728 times)

Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« on: June 27, 2014, 12:15:05 PM »
Previous topic here...

Keep sharing your guesses on the gameplay mechanics / characters / plot for Touhou 15.
Mine, on gameplay, is as follows:

Instead of fighting random bosses, then forgetting about them and going on, now we have the starting characters (Reimu, Marisa, or someone else) RECRUIT these (mid) bosses to help them fight the stage 6 boss / extra boss instead, fully connecting the characters in one game rather than linking them loosely to one incident.

For example,
  • After the stage 3 boss is defeated by Reimu, she decides to tag along and give advice (then the game enters partner mode as seen in IN), and contributes a few of her own spell cards to defeat the stage 4 boss.
  • Then the stage 4 boss also comes playing along in stage 5, but mainly in dialogue as she recovers, while Reimu and the stage 3 boss combine effort to defeat the stage 5 boss.
  • Finally, as Reimu confronts the powerful mastermind and her underling (stage 6 boss & midboss), all three previous bosses that tagged along contributes some of their attacks and help Reimu defeat them.
  • Then again, we can also have some helpful little stage 2 midboss around to help defeat the stage 2 boss (assume different), just as a (ahem) small favor for Reimu.

In this game, unfocused mode is always the starting character. From stage 4 onwards (or stage 2, if desired), the [C] key switches between the starting character and recruited characters in the focused mode, as well as showing a sprite beside the starting character when in unfocused mode. There will also be a new point system (like MoF, UFO) but based on alliance / trust between the starting character and her allies / sidekicks.

If this happens, I'm hoping for two of the three recruited characters (in my example) to be popular regulars (already introduced in Touhou), one from PC-98 and another from the print / music works. The last one can be an original.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2014, 12:17:31 PM by Dragomir7 »

ItsCalledBorrowingZe

  • Lemme borrow that book Patchy!
  • Alright then... MASTA SPAAAAAAKU!
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2014, 01:14:57 PM »
You know what I'm guessing TH15 will be about?

I'm guessing TH15 will be something about a Revolution once more. Since the themes of the Touhou games tend to follow, well, a theme.

PC98: Hell.
Windows 1: Mysterious occurrences that have a new person showing up.
Windows 2: The many facets of religion in middle Eastern culture.
Windows 3: Revolutionary occurrences so far that are new to Gensokyo (the first occurrence of impossible to dodge spellcards, the occurrence of the weak becoming strong enough to fight on par with the strong).

Failure McFailFace

  • I'm h...a...p...p...y...
  • Impor
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2014, 02:45:02 PM »
I'm thinking that 14.5/14.7 is going to be a continuation of the Seija arc, as she appeared in two games in a row.

Also, in b4 2hu 15 is phantsmagoia
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

Justin

  • Grand High Poobah
  • what is life
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2014, 04:03:13 AM »
Youkai, using some mystery item, have managed to breach the Hakurei Barrier; they are wreaking havoc in the area outside of Gensokyo. Reimu and Co. must travel far from Gensokyo in order to find these troublesome Youkai.
Possible game mechanic to go along with this: Reimu doesn't want any evidence of Gensokyo to be left behind, so killing more enemies increases a multiplier for point items, but if one enemy leaves the screen, the value resets to one.
Current Goals (BC I guess this is a thing):
1CC all 2hu on normal: All clear!
1CC all 2hu on hard: LLS, EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF
Clear all extras: EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF, SA
SA Hard Mode is kicking my butt ;-;

Failure McFailFace

  • I'm h...a...p...p...y...
  • Impor
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2014, 10:35:27 PM »
killing more enemies increases a multiplier for point items, but if one enemy leaves the screen, the value resets to one.
Well then, people who do pacifist runs will probably get a very low score with this, then.
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

Abraham Lincoln

  • Mendelssohn for President 2016
  • Make Bach Great Again!
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2014, 10:30:26 AM »
I forsee more Seija and rioting fun. Mainly more riots caused by the one named in DDC. I also expect a character named Fusou to appear, too.

Failure McFailFace

  • I'm h...a...p...p...y...
  • Impor
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2014, 11:46:09 PM »
Posted in Lincoln's "Original Touhou Game Ideas" thread, might be more fitting here:
My idea:

Touhou 15 is a phantasmagoria, with some characters from MoF and newer are playable.

Story: Continuation of ISC. The protagonists realize that impossible spell cards are not enough to stop Seija. They start to directly fight her with danmaku.

Seija:
Level 1: Combo of Imitation Miracle Mallet (with no charge needed) main and Bomb sub. Has larger range with higher levels.
Level 2: Spell card: Deceit Sign "Reverse Needle Attack." Red and blue waves of alternating ovals spread from behind. Right underneath the opponent.
Level 3: Spell card: Reverse Bow "Dream Bow of Heaven & Earth." Same as DDC card, center 1/3 of screen.
Level 4: Boss card: Turnabout "Reverse Hierarchy." Same as DDC card.
Scope: Inverse of Reimu's scope.                        Ability: Bullets in the empty potion of the scope are reflected back                         Shot: Same as Doll sub

Shinmyoumaru
Level 1: Danmaku Bowl. About 3x the width of sprite and 2x sprites tall. Any bullets that touch the bowl are shot back as a very weak homing shot (10 bullets for 1 sunflower fairy kill). It grows larger with higher levels. Max is The width of the screen.
Level 2: Spell Card: "You Grow Bigger!" Opponent's hitbox grows to 5x in size.
Level 3: Spell Card: "Grow Bigger!" All bullets on screen grow 2x their size for 5 seconds.
Level 4: Boss Card: "Get Smaller!" All bullets are multiplied by 10 when Shinmyoumaru is on screen. All bullets are made smaller by 5x. The smallest bullet (snowball) is reduced to 4 pixels.
Scope: Growing/shrinking circle.                             Ability: Snowball bullets have no affect
Shot: A bouncing laser similar to Shinmyoumaru's non-spell's laser. 3 lasers, slight spread. Bounces once.
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2014, 09:04:46 PM »
If Ten Desires was (as ZUN has suggested previously) about reconciling windows trilogy 1 with windows trilogy in terms of character and setting, then I think Double Dealing Character can be looked at as trying to reconcile them in terms of gameplay - the system is essentially UFO without the actual UFOs, instead using the existing bomb and POC mechanics to deal with the item collection game. I'm not sure it's possible to speculate on gameplay from this though, except to say that he seems interested in item collection mechanics at the moment, and has been for a while.

As for ridiculous plot & character theories, well... TD reintroduced characters and stages from Perfect Cherry Blossom (Youmu, Yuyuko and a netherworld stage), while DDC reintroduced characters and stages from EoSD (Sakuya, Cirno and mist lake). So I'm going to go ahead and bet on some Imperishable Night throwbacks this time around, which would mean playable Reisen, an Eientei stage and Tewi as a mid-boss. Well, that's unless he keeps working backwards to Mystic Square...

Actually my only real prediction is that TH15 is going to be some way off, given that there's going to be at least one other Touhou game released beforehand and there's a good possibility that it's another collaboration, which is likely to be slower going. Plus, y'know, baby.

Abraham Lincoln

  • Mendelssohn for President 2016
  • Make Bach Great Again!
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2014, 10:32:53 PM »
All I know is that Mima will not appear. End of debate.

Szayelaporro Granz

  • You can't use spellcards within my range
  • since I've already analyzed and sealed them all
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2014, 08:26:10 PM »
^This guy gets it. Sorry, Mima lovers!
Normal 1cc: LLS, MS, EoSD, PCB, IN, PoFV, MoF, UFO, TD, DDC / Hard 1cc: EoSD, PCB, IN, PoFV, MoF*, TD / Lunatic 1cc: PoFV / Extra 1cc: EoSD, PCB (+P), IN, PoFV, MoF, DDC
*Bug abuse.
Feel free to watch my crappy replays and twitch channel
My favorite touhou music

Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2014, 05:15:54 PM »
OP's guess seems a bit fangamey, rather than something ZUN would actually do. He doesn't really approach design through mechanics like that, it's more like there's a theme (with a sub-theme) and the characters/gameplay features follow.

So going for a strictly "realistic" prediction, I'd go with a game that's about rebelling against destiny, with star-/astrology-related visuals and character designs. The incident would be about some sort of impending prophecy. Various bad omens and unnatural displays of bad luck in Gensokyo drive the characters to ward off all that.

Some research material:
http://japanese.about.com/od/japanesecultur1/a/100498.htm Zodiac animals with well-defined personalities. ZUN would have a field day with these.
http://www.seiyaku.com/reference/hinoe-uma.html A personification of this as the final boss, anyone? Someone who just wants to be loved and understood, but a curse makes her hurt everyone, driving them away... Until she rebels against that destiny and unleashes her curse to the world just so others can feel what she feels.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Pillars_of_Destiny

Plenty of ways to work "bad luck/good luck" stuff into gameplay mechanics too.

It's also reasonable to assume Seija would be playable now that she's getting elevated to important character status. A friendly Seija wouldn't fit into the storyline, especially after ISC, so I guess in this hypothetical example her motivation would be to recruit the source of the bad omens. Or to discover a way to flip people's bad luck to good luck and vice versa.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2014, 05:20:47 PM by not ZUNs wife »
check http://vsoft.life/ for runs & creations
latest stream: Hollow Song of Birds Hard 1cc (OrangeReimu) @ https://youtu.be/eDFd4FHEjXg

Failure McFailFace

  • I'm h...a...p...p...y...
  • Impor
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2014, 07:33:03 PM »
Moar TH15 phantasmagoria player characters!

From the "Unfair Things in Touhou" thread:
What, her ability is to devour the "history" of the bullets?

When pressing focus, any bullets that hit the scope (triangle outline) have their trajectories followed in reverse until its spawn point.
To expand:

Keine
Level 1: Portable full moon. A device made by the kappa and cursed by the Miracle Mallet, it allows Keine to transform at will. She shoots two horns in addition to her main shot. The horns have a large hitbox, and explode at the edges of the screen. Is based on your movement (i.e. SA ReimuC)
Level 2: Spiritual Birth "First Pyramid". Same as her IN card, but only the lasers spawn.
Level 3: Reincarnation "Returning-Bridge Ichijo". Same as the IN card, but only 3 waves of bullets come, and the rice is half-changed to snowballs.
Level 4: "Great Fire in Yamato Kingdom". A mash-up of her final StB and ISC cards. The blue kunai in "Yamato Kingdom" is replaced with "Great Fire" triangle bullets.
Scope: Triangle outline                                      Ability: Any bullets hitting the scope reverse their trajectories to their spawn, but they then move about in random directions.
Shot: Mini-horns.                                                 Opponent Effects: Horns, that when they hit the edge of the screen, reverse the trajectories of all bullets around it


Now for playable characters
Reimu
Level 1: Her ReimuA bomb in DDC. Is initially 2 by 1 sprites in size. At level 4, the gohei fills half the screen in front of Reimu.
Level 2: Spirit Sign "Cursed Yin-Yang". Same as "Ying-Yang" in PoFV, but less bullets.
Level 3: Spirit Sign "Fantasy Seal". Same as PoFV.
Level 4: Spirit Tool "Cursed Gohei". Reimu follows the player around the screen. She swings her gohei (same as her level 2 attack) which spawns snowballs.
Scope: Circle (Same as PoFV)                         Ability: Smallest hitbox                                  Shot: Prayer Slips (same as PoFV)
Opponent Effects: Bouncing Ying-Yang Orbs (Same as PoFV)

Marisa
Level 1: Her MarisaA focused shot, but only the first half of the screen. Gets longer and more spread out with each level.
Level 2: Magic Sign "Stardust Reverie". Same as EoSD bomb. Large stars slowly drift out of the center of the screen.
Level 3: Astronomical Instrument "Solar System of Comets". Similar to DS's card. Harmless familiars come out of the center of the screen, forms a large circle around the player, and shoots thick lasers outwards. Small stars from "Oort Cloud" spiral into the center of the circle, and then disappear.
Level 4: Magicannon "Final Dark Spark". Similar to DDC's MarisaA's bomb. A black Master Spark is aimed at the player, and slowly trails behind the player. The Spark then spawns stars around it.
Scope: Straight forward (same as PoFV)            Ability: Fastest Gauge charge               Shot: Green Magic Missiles (same as PoFV)
Opponent Effects: Lasers from behind (same as PoFV)

Sakuya
Level 1: Sakuya's DDC unfocused shot. Level 1 =1.00 power, Level 2 = 2.00 Power, etc.
Level 2: "Indiscriminate". Same effect as PCB bomb, but slower and less bullets
Level 3: Illusion Ghost "Jack the Ludo Bile". Same as EoSD, but less bullets.
Level 4: Time Sign "Time Stopper Sakuya". Half the kunai are snowballs.
Scope: Fan (same as PoFV)                           Ability: Any bullet or enemy that hit the scope freeze, then explode/die.             Shot: Knives (same as PoFV/DDC)
Opponent Effects: Knife stream (sme as PoFV)

and a modification:
My idea:

Touhou 15 is a phantasmagoria, with some characters from MoF and newer are playable.

Story: Continuation of ISC. The protagonists realize that impossible spell cards are not enough to stop Seija. They start to directly fight her with danmaku.

Seija:
Level 1: Combo of Imitation Miracle Mallet (with no charge needed) main and Bomb sub. Has larger range with higher levels.
Level 2: Spell card: Deceit Sign "Reverse Needle Attack." Red and blue waves of alternating ovals spread from behind. Right underneath the opponent.
Level 3: Spell card: Reverse Bow "Dream Bow of Heaven & Earth." Same as DDC card, center 1/3 of screen.
Level 4: Boss card: Turnabout "Reverse Hierarchy." Same as DDC card.
Scope: Inverse of Reimu's scope.                        Ability: Bullets in the empty potion of the scope are reflected back                         Shot: Same as Doll sub
Opponent Affects: Bullets reverse velocities, then reverse again

Shinmyoumaru
Level 1: Danmaku Bowl. About 3x the width of sprite and 2x sprites tall. Any bullets that touch the bowl are shot back as a very weak homing shot (10 bullets for 1 sunflower fairy kill). It grows larger with higher levels. Max is The width of the screen.
Level 2: Spell Card: "You Grow Bigger!" Opponent's hitbox grows to 5x in size.
Level 3: Spell Card: "Grow Bigger!" All bullets on screen grow 2x their size for 5 seconds.
Level 4: Boss Card: "Get Smaller!" All bullets are multiplied by 10 when Shinmyoumaru is on screen. All bullets are made smaller by 5x. The smallest bullet (snowball) is reduced to 4 pixels.
Scope: Growing/shrinking circle.                             Ability: Snowball bullets have no affect
Shot: A bouncing laser similar to Shinmyoumaru's non-spell's laser. 3 lasers, slight spread. Bounces once.
Opponent Affects: A bowl follows the opponent around and blocks their shots
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

Koog

  • I live to protect those dear to me,
  • as a good friend would.
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2014, 09:32:22 PM »
I think Seija should be playable in the next game, a good reason it's that she would look for someone to help her in the rebellion.
Then, the other two are obviously going to be Reimu and Marisa.
Mwahahahahha!

Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2014, 04:44:30 AM »
I believe it will be something which Zun would want to play, and possibly influenced by the recent cons he went to.

There for, I predict an American-Western setting with a Desert and Cowboys... Err, Cowgirls... Possibly a boss who rides on a horse?

Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2014, 12:04:38 PM »
I doubt that Seija would be playable in the main games considering every playable character so far has been human or at least half human (partner characters don't count).  Unless it's a pofv type of game again.

Abraham Lincoln

  • Mendelssohn for President 2016
  • Make Bach Great Again!
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2014, 06:51:01 AM »
Perhaps we'll get more Western-themed characters. Or warships, if Kancolle was actually of interest to him...Hagikaze is a pretty name.

Lt Colonel Summers

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • Do not mess with a soldier
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #16 on: August 05, 2014, 12:56:31 AM »
My idea:

Something is turning the Zombie Fairies into actual undeads, and it is spreading to other fairies, turning them as well.
Soon, a zombie apocalypse begins in Gensokyo and it's up to Reimu, Marisa, Sakuya, Youmu and Sanae to find and terminate the origins of the zombification before Gensokyo is overrun by them.

New gameplay features:
Melee attacks: knock away Fairy Zombies if they get too close to you.
Shake off: Some enemies can latch themselves onto you, and hurt you as long as they are latched. Hit all the movement keys rapidly to shake them off.
Status aliments: Fire deals damage over time; poison reverses left and right; water makes you fire only one shot at a time; Electricity makes you take more damage; and Ice halves your speed.
New enemies: Fairy Zombies, real undeads and not cosplay. Watch out for the incredibly resilient Sunflower Fairy Zombies!
Enemy abilities: There are Fetid, stronger versions of each enemy types, such as a Fetid Fairy Zombie. These enemies have a chance to spawn with passive abilities such as Damage Resistance, Poisonous Fangs, Fiery Talons, Super Speed, Chilling Bones, Lightning Discharge, Rain Attractor, Life Drain, and more.

What do you guys think?
There's nothing inscribed on the dog tag...

Abraham Lincoln

  • Mendelssohn for President 2016
  • Make Bach Great Again!
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #17 on: August 06, 2014, 12:17:07 PM »
*sunk via depth charges*
Personally I think this one should go in the Original Game idea thread. To me, it doesn't sound like what one would likely predict of the next Touhou game to come.

Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #18 on: December 24, 2014, 05:57:19 AM »
"So Touhou 15: Phantasmagoria of Myriad Age.

Another vs type danmaku  game with the return of the partner system seen in Imperishable Night except instead of human and youkai, the pairs are related characters with strength differences between their past and present selves. An incident causes Gensokyo to become unstable, alternatively swapping between the present and past. Younger residents are weakened due to time being prior to development or just being nonexistent, while older residents or those with related powers are resistant the change or revert to a stronger form. Those involved with the incident include anyone that has time/space manipulation, crossed worlds, lived an extended life, or had a major change in their past.

Bombing no longer automatically switches between the two like in Imperishable Night but focusing for a long enough period of time does as well as defeating enemies/collecting power ups. The two characters are not bound to focused and unfocused and swap depending on which side the meter is favoring with the favored character being the unfocsed. Generally, one side's character gains power in the past while one in the present in the form of attack speed etc.

Playable characters include: Reimu/Yukari, Sakuya/Remilia, Youmu/Yuyuko, Sanae/Kanako, Reisen/Eirin, Komachi/Shiki, Koishi/Satori, Ichirin/Byakuren, Futo/Miko, Benben/Raiko.

Seems likely they'll also include: Cirno/Letty, Chen/Ran, Mokou/Keine, Suika/Yuugi, Utsuho/Rin, Nazrin/Shou, Nue/Mamizou, Yoshika/Seiga.

Other characters could also be included but either don't pair with anyone, or lack the interest/connection like Yuka, Aya, Seija, Tenshi, Kaguya, Suwako, Tewi. The lack of Marisa, Alice, and Kasen might hint the return of Mima or Shinki, or introduction of a new relation on top of any new character pairs."

I heard about this from an online chat but haven't heard anything else about TH15 yet. This just a rumor?
« Last Edit: December 24, 2014, 06:06:51 AM by NKKS »

Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #19 on: December 24, 2014, 07:32:12 AM »
Completely made up.

Raikaria

  • Do Tank Girls Dream...
  • *
  • Of Floating Eyeballs?
Re: Touhou 15 Predictions, part 2
« Reply #20 on: December 28, 2014, 10:10:46 PM »
You know what I'm guessing TH15 will be about?

I'm guessing TH15 will be something about a Revolution once more. Since the themes of the Touhou games tend to follow, well, a theme.

PC98: Hell.
Windows 1: Mysterious occurrences that have a new person showing up.
Windows 2: The many facets of religion in middle Eastern culture.
Windows 3: Revolutionary occurrences so far that are new to Gensokyo (the first occurrence of impossible to dodge spellcards, the occurrence of the weak becoming strong enough to fight on par with the strong).

That isn't revolutionary. That was the entire reason for the Spellcard rules.

Also you could argue being using impossible-to-dodge danmaku is legal if Seiga is cheating anyway. After all, that makes the 'Impossible' spellcards 'Possible'. You don't see people using those spellcards on Reimu. Even if more is at stake.

Also PC-98 only directly has Hell in 1 game; HrtP's Hell Route. Makai; while SIMILAR to Hell; is not Hell, because they are distinct routes in HrtP. Makai is the 'Demon Realm'.

The Dream World appears in 2 games [SoEW/LLS]; and a third is called Phantasmagoria of Dim.Dream. Makai is in 2 games as well, although the Makai route of HrtP is non-canon due to Mima not fighting Reimu, thus making Touhou 2's plot make no sense.

PC-98's theme is about DIMENSIONS. All 5 games have an alternate dimension as a major plot point or location:
HrtP: Hell/Makai
SoEW: Reimaiden [Part of the Dream World]
PoDD: Yumemi/Chiyuri are from another dimension
LLS: Yuuka's Dream World; Gengetsu's Dream World
MS: Makai

Compare to Windows. Unless one counts the Netherworld and Higan as alternate dimensions [The former is not as much as a reach as the latter; which is the end of the River Styx]; the only game where an alternate dimension is traveled to is UFO. Which is Makai. Again.

Also there are exceptions to the others too. Yuyuko is not a 'new person'; she's been around for years. Same with Kaguya/Eirin, they were just hidden. 6 and 7 were building up to 8; and 8 built up to 9, as the characters came back from various games in the era for both of those games.

And SA has nothing to do with religion, but is huge in plot terms for the 10-> 13.5 era. [The overarching theme of that era is Religion but it's very important to remember that SA has nothing to do with religion at all aside from Kanako being Kanako.]
« Last Edit: December 28, 2014, 10:23:26 PM by Raikaria »


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.