Author Topic: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all  (Read 199590 times)

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #780 on: September 17, 2016, 08:29:07 PM »
Quote
10-7 is grindy, but there's not much trick to it apart from getting the RNG to like you.

Well, I'm trying that one right now. But I find it pretty pretty difficult for now. I haven't tried it much, since I don't have a lot of time these days. And soon I'm going to have even less time  :V

Byakuren's 10-6 was fairly easy though. I captured it in half an hour when I decided to use a subitem  :V

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #781 on: September 18, 2016, 07:04:40 AM »
Soorry for the doublepost, but here I've uploaded a recent replay of Miko's 10-7: http://threplays.appspot.com/replay_files/5714902542974976.

I defeated her after being hit twice o three times with the Substitute Jiz? as main, but it was near the end. I would like to receive advice on how to damage her more. I've seen a video in Youtube where the player finishes her around the second 64. Maybe I'm not making proper use of the doll sub bug? If I'd damaged her more, maybe I'd have captured the spell card already. I'd like to better myself in that regard before attempting it again.

Anyway, DarkPermafrost was right, it's not that difficult. Remilia's 10-4 is far worse  :V
« Last Edit: September 18, 2016, 07:06:16 AM by Yukaris Glove »

Chill Observer

  • Aimless fanatic
  • haHAA
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #782 on: September 18, 2016, 07:30:28 AM »
Soorry for the doublepost, but here I've uploaded a recent replay of Miko's 10-7: http://threplays.appspot.com/replay_files/5714902542974976.

I defeated her after being hit twice o three times with the Substitute Jiz? as main, but it was near the end. I would like to receive advice on how to damage her more. I've seen a video in Youtube where the player finishes her around the second 64. Maybe I'm not making proper use of the doll sub bug? If I'd damaged her more, maybe I'd have captured the spell card already. I'd like to better myself in that regard before attempting it again.

Anyway, DarkPermafrost was right, it's not that difficult. Remilia's 10-4 is far worse  :V
I noticed on like half the waves you aren't sitting on the correct shotgun spot which means you aren't doing the optimal amount of damage. You need to be at that sweet spot distance or else not all the waves will be able to hit. Don't go too far down and collide into the boss though. That's never helpful.
Retired Touhou player. Not involved with anything Touhou anymore.

Lollipop

  • stay woke
  • literally and figuratively dying
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #783 on: September 18, 2016, 09:39:26 PM »
this is a really broad question, but how do you score in DDC? It's my favorite game in the series, but I'm not sure how to get good scores.
Touhou 1CCS:
Hard: LLS, EoSD(NB), PCB(NB), IN, MoF, TD, DDC(NB), LoLK
Lunatic: EoSD, PCB, DDC, LoLK
Extra: LLS, EoSD, PCB(Extra&Phantasm), IN, MoF, SA, DDC, LoLK
Current Focus: 1cc SA Hard, or an Extra

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #784 on: September 18, 2016, 11:42:24 PM »
this is a really broad question, but how do you score in DDC? It's my favorite game in the series, but I'm not sure how to get good scores.

From what I've seen, DDC scoring is essentially maximizing item collection at the PoC and increasing the value of point items by bombing certain spells/nonspells. Sekibanki's nonspells are really good for graze + PIV gain and Stage 4's midboss section also stands out as a good opportunity. MarisaB and SakuyaB are very good scoring choices, although one is laughable broken and the other is pathetically weak.

Karisa

  • Extend!
  • *
  • High scores are meant to be broken.
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #785 on: September 19, 2016, 01:55:05 AM »
this is a really broad question, but how do you score in DDC? It's my favorite game in the series, but I'm not sure how to get good scores.
DDC scoring is primarily a combination of canceling bullets for PIV, item collection bonuses, and spell bonuses.

Point item value is increased almost entirely by canceling bullets-- graze is a minor factor, but not a high priority. (SakuyaB also gains extra PIV by shooting focused.) There are two ways to cancel bullets: finishing off patterns, or bombing stage portion/nonspell bullets. SakuyaB can also bomb-cancel spells for PIV, but other characters can't. Try not to finish off patterns with a bomb, since then you lose the manual cancel at the end.

Items are worth an additional bonus (0.5 at 20+ items to 2.0 at 60+ items) and a bomb part if you auto-collect at least 20 items at once. The best possible bonus is 2.0, from auto-collecting at least 60 items, which also gives a guaranteed life part (you also get a life part every 5th bomb part). So plan out the stages to collect as many 2.0s as you can. Since auto-collecting with a bomb still gives the bonus, it's worth bombing for 2.0s since it gives more score and a life part back.

Spell bonuses are rather high in DDC, so stay under the boss during spells as much as possible. ReimuA and SakuyaA also have advanced ways to improve damage (ReimuA: centering the gohei on the boss is more damaging, and shift-tapping adds slightly more damage on top of that; SakuyaA: if you can safely position yourself directly under the boss and shift-tap, the knife explosions overlap for ridiculously high damage). It's often worth losing some spell bonus to wait for a better PIV cancel, though, especially in the earlier parts of the game.

Also keep in mind that additional enemies spawn if you defeat a midboss (except in stage 6) especially quickly, so sometimes there's a trade-off between PIV farming and additional items (for score/extra resources).

As for the clear bonus, it's mostly relevant in Easy and Extra. In Extra you get 40 million per life and 4m per bomb; in the main game you only get 10m per life and 3m per bomb. On Easy it's worth finishing with 8 lives and as many bombs as possible for the 90m+ bonus, but on higher difficulties it's often more profitable to spend your lives bombing for PIV and 2.0s earlier in the game. (Don't bomb for PIV in stage 6, though, since there aren't enough remaining point items.)

Anyway, I recommend watching some scoring replays to see it in action-- try downloading some from Royalflare/th14 for your preferred difficulty/shot type. I also have videos of the overall Lunatic SakuyaB world record and my old Easy ReimuA 873m, if you'd prefer watching something you can rewind.

If this entire post seems like too much to keep track of, focus on the three goals I listed at the top first. Feel free to ask if you have any additional questions.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2016, 04:53:39 AM by Karisa »

Lollipop

  • stay woke
  • literally and figuratively dying
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #786 on: October 02, 2016, 10:39:58 PM »
How many points does a life give you in MoF easy?
Touhou 1CCS:
Hard: LLS, EoSD(NB), PCB(NB), IN, MoF, TD, DDC(NB), LoLK
Lunatic: EoSD, PCB, DDC, LoLK
Extra: LLS, EoSD, PCB(Extra&Phantasm), IN, MoF, SA, DDC, LoLK
Current Focus: 1cc SA Hard, or an Extra

Chill Observer

  • Aimless fanatic
  • haHAA
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #787 on: October 02, 2016, 10:54:59 PM »
How many points does a life give you in MoF easy?
Quote
Clear Bonus

Unlike previous games in the series, there are no clear bonuses for stages 1-5. At the end of stage 6 or Extra, the player is awarded a sizable score bonus, which is calculated as follows according to the manual:

Easy:    (Lives in Stock * 20 million) + (Power * 200,000) + (Faith * 100) points.
Normal:  (Lives in Stock * 25 million) + (Power * 200,000) + (Faith * 100) points.
Hard:    (Lives in Stock * 35 million) + (Power * 400,000) + (Faith * 100) points.
Lunatic: (Lives in Stock * 40 million) + (Power * 600,000) + (Faith * 100) points.
Extra:   (Lives in Stock * 40 million) + (Power * 800,000) + (Faith * 100) points.

Power uses the first two digits of your power. So if you have 4.25 power, you'll use 42 for the value.
Retired Touhou player. Not involved with anything Touhou anymore.

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #788 on: October 25, 2016, 06:17:42 PM »
Not sure whether this belongs on the Touhou Gameplay Help Thread or not but I'll post it here.

I started playing Touhou about a month ago and still class myself as as a noob. I started with PCB then I had a go of SA and EOSD. I eventually settled with trying to 1cc PCB on normal.

My main struggle is pretty much all of stage 5, especially Youmu

My best run: http://replays.gensokyou.org/download.php?id=41800

This is my first post so I apologize if this isn't the right place.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2016, 06:51:36 PM by DeterminedGamer »

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #789 on: October 27, 2016, 10:38:19 PM »
Your biggest problem is that you aren't getting enough point items. You only just reached the 450 extend, but you should aim to get the 800 and 1000 extends as well, which would give you plenty of resources for Yuyuko. Stage 5 is your weakest stage, so use stage practice and memorise where the enemies come from. If you kill them all quickly, you can stay near the top and keep POCing.

Another place where you missed a lot of point items is the vertically shooting fairies just after Lily White. If you stay just to the side of under them, you can kill them quickly, then POC after every second one.

Start "Phantom Dinning" in the middle so as to damage Lunasa most, then you get her solo spellcard instead of Lyrica's. On Easy and Normal she is the easiest of the three.

Youmu's nonspells can be misdirected by positioning yourself above her during the dialogue, then going down just before she starts firing.

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #790 on: October 30, 2016, 09:11:48 PM »
Thanks for your help mikuru! I've been putting what you said to practice and It's working well, I still make dumb errors but my recent run (which unfortunately ended at the primsriver sisters) had me get to the prismriver sisters with more lives and bombs then usual.

Lunasa is allot easier then then Lyrica, the only reason I went for her was because a video guide said she was the easiest. I still slip up on Lunasa's spellcard but some practice should fix that.

Also, thanks for that tip with Youmu, I didn't know you could misdirect her nonspells. They are so much easier to dodge that way. Reminds me of chen's opening nonspell, the shotgun of green balls, I dodge through it but would it be safer to go around them?

there are still moments in the game I have trouble with, like dodging through things unfocused without a visible hitbox, bullets going in a crisscross pattern and bullets coming in diagonally.

Karisa

  • Extend!
  • *
  • High scores are meant to be broken.
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #791 on: October 31, 2016, 08:00:12 AM »
Lunasa is allot easier then then Lyrica, the only reason I went for her was because a video guide said she was the easiest.
Maybe the video you saw was a higher difficulty? The Prismrivers use different solo spells on Hard/Lunatic; Lyrica's is the easiest of those.

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #792 on: October 31, 2016, 05:40:41 PM »
Maybe the video you saw was a higher difficulty? The Prismrivers use different solo spells on Hard/Lunatic; Lyrica's is the easiest of those.

No, it was definitely a normal run guide, he did bomb through lyrica's spellcard though. he also didn't teach me to misdirect youmu's nonspells. it was a good guide apart from those points, I wouldn't have learned to stream most of stage 4 otherwise.

I do wish I practiced more often, I could have gotten a 1cc by now if I played more regularly.

Chill Observer

  • Aimless fanatic
  • haHAA
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #793 on: November 01, 2016, 12:36:01 AM »
Whichever Prismriver you decide to fight is up to preference, really. I'm weird so I stick with the Prismriver the character starts out with (i.e. if I play Sakuya, I always damage Merlin the most).

Generally, however, you want to go after Lunasa in E/N and Lyrica in H/L. Although, I would say Lunasa is still the easiest on Hard if you know how to cheese her spellcard; just stand right in front of her and avoid a few rings of bullets.
Retired Touhou player. Not involved with anything Touhou anymore.

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #794 on: November 13, 2016, 10:11:51 AM »
This might sound like a stupid question but I heard from a friend that if you don't play 14.3 for a few days or something you can unlock days without having to beat levels from the previous day. Is that true?

RB

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #795 on: November 13, 2016, 03:02:44 PM »
This might sound like a stupid question but I heard from a friend that if you don't play 14.3 for a few days or something you can unlock days without having to beat levels from the previous day. Is that true?
No it isn't.
You have to clear 4 scenes on the previous day to unlock the next one.

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #796 on: November 13, 2016, 07:19:16 PM »
I'm stuck at 5-1 of 14.3. I just can't avoid those bullets at such high speed even if I have 3 extra lives. The invinicbility time is way too short. The furthest I could get was 1/3rth of raiko's health. I tried about 25 times and I'm afraid I can't advance into the game anymore. Any strategies? The wiki doesn't have a description for most spellcards from day 4 or 5 onwards

Edit: nvm, I beat it after 100 or so tries :D
« Last Edit: November 14, 2016, 02:46:01 PM by Superteletubbies64 »

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #797 on: December 14, 2016, 07:58:44 PM »
Any advice for handling Kagerou's midboss spellcard, or her last spellcard as a boss? I'm using MarisaB on Lunatic, my strategy for both boils down to "bomb the shit out of her and hope she dies before you do, then mine Stage 4 for all the lives you just lost."
« Last Edit: December 14, 2016, 08:46:28 PM by Sen »

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #798 on: December 15, 2016, 12:58:52 AM »
Any advice for handling Kagerou's midboss spellcard, or her last spellcard as a boss? I'm using MarisaB on Lunatic, my strategy for both boils down to "bomb the shit out of her and hope she dies before you do, then mine Stage 4 for all the lives you just lost."
You have to misdirect the first wave to a top corner then misdirect the second to the other side, and then have them go side>center>other side>etc. You have a little bit of time before a wave reaches you when Kagerou howls another wave at you, so you can sort of misdirect every two waves.

For her final, there's not much you can do other than just force yourself to stay below her, you can stay on the right side of the screen when she does her dashes and then take advantage of her deleting the red fireballs to rush below her, and dodge the purple rings as they cross, if you manage to follow her all the time, it should go down in two waves at full power. You can also dodge the red fireballs at the top of the screen and dodge the purple rings individually, I find it a lot safer, but as MariB you won't get to damage Kagerou much.

Things I've done (and maybe will improve):
SA L6MNB | SA Lunatic 3b Scorerun | MoF LNB | PCB LNB |DDC LNB

Karisa

  • Extend!
  • *
  • High scores are meant to be broken.
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #799 on: December 15, 2016, 09:11:30 AM »
I can't help with capturing the spell, but for survival, unless you're doing a no-bombs run (or full spell capture or similar), you should probably be bombing the midboss spell anyway-- there are so many enemies immediately after that you make up for it with extra 2.0 bonuses.

Onion

  • Classic era Marisa-like entity
  • Failing at Touhou since 2000-something
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #800 on: December 18, 2016, 06:37:02 AM »
Ok. This is going to sound really, really embarrassing. How do I dodge this:
Embodiment of Scarlet Devil. Marisa B. Normal. Ice Sign [Icicle Fall].
Yep. I can sometimes get through it, by crazily moving across the entire screen, left and right and back again, but never consistently.
Also, for her big ol' yellow bullets, I know they're aimed, but when are they aimed? I feel that if I knew their exact timing, I could just stand right in front of her.
Please wait warmly. Girls are intentionally leaving this space blank.

Since everybody has these: 1CC PoDD ez, 1CC(?) EoSD ez, PD LoLK, something something HM ULiL

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #801 on: December 18, 2016, 03:49:28 PM »
I'm sure there are different ways to do it. What I do is stay in the middle, go up through two waves of yellow bullets, then to the side through the blue wave, then over the top of the blue wave and get back to the middle again.

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #802 on: January 02, 2017, 08:34:03 PM »
Hey there, at first, hello everyone on this forum
, just found today while searching for how to play pofv with friend but...meh, some tutorial on wikis aren't really useful and any new way are just unknown to me.

Also just some question: I just unlocked Mystia(OPOP) and Cirno though...struggling with character like Youmu or Sakuya (when playing them)
« Last Edit: January 02, 2017, 08:36:16 PM by N3komare »

I see this thread has not been touched in months... I hope there is no problem posting on it, knowing its nature.

Thing is I'm trying to clear LoLK's extra. And damn, how much I miss spell practice! Even so, everything would be ok if not for Hecatia's Moon "Lunatic Impact", the one where she launches three moons chasing after you. I always lose like six bombs and two lifes there. I'm a bit desperate, since I would have probably beaten the stage by now if not for it  :ohdear:

Do any of you have any advice for me on it? Thanks in advance!

RB

I don't really have any routes or strategies for Lunatic Impact myself (although you could ask Zigzagwolf or Yatsuzume on how to deal with it) as usually I just try to dodge by instinct although I can link you a thread where you can download a spell practice patch for LoLK.

v1.00a download in case v1.00b doesn't work
« Last Edit: May 29, 2017, 04:21:08 PM by RB »

Well, thanks, I suppose I've to try the patch if I want to clear it faster  :(

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #806 on: June 10, 2017, 11:41:09 PM »
Any advice on getting the Eternal Meek safespot (lunatic)? Or should I not bother?

Lollipop

  • stay woke
  • literally and figuratively dying
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #807 on: June 11, 2017, 03:10:31 AM »
Any advice on getting the Eternal Meek safespot (lunatic)? Or should I not bother?

If you use the original japanese version of the game, if you stand in-between the opening bracket and the thing that looks like an i, that's where you need to be horizontally. As for the vertical positon, just move to the middle of sakuya's sprite.

If you're running it on english tough beans
Touhou 1CCS:
Hard: LLS, EoSD(NB), PCB(NB), IN, MoF, TD, DDC(NB), LoLK
Lunatic: EoSD, PCB, DDC, LoLK
Extra: LLS, EoSD, PCB(Extra&Phantasm), IN, MoF, SA, DDC, LoLK
Current Focus: 1cc SA Hard, or an Extra

Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #808 on: August 14, 2017, 10:04:12 PM »
So if you stop holding z with the winter sub-options, all but one of the options stop shooting. But I noticed that the one option seems to get brighter, and sometimes instead of a spinning diamond it turns into a spinning star. I can't tell if it's just my imagination or not. Do you actually do less damage that way?
My name is Tres. It sounds like "Tray". Tressert is "Tray-zurt"; like Tres dessert.
I've cleared every touhou game on Lunatic, and beaten every extra except SoEW.
NMNB: MoF Hard, SA Extra, UFO Extra

ふねん1

  • Scientific editor
  • If you're alive, you can always keep moving.
Re: Touhou Gameplay Help Thread #7 - Not just for spell card help after all
« Reply #809 on: August 15, 2017, 12:15:36 AM »
So if you stop holding z with the winter sub-options, all but one of the options stop shooting. But I noticed that the one option seems to get brighter, and sometimes instead of a spinning diamond it turns into a spinning star. I can't tell if it's just my imagination or not. Do you actually do less damage that way?
This was discovered back in the demo too. People used to think that "all but one of the subs stops shooting" was a bug, but recently Riri confirmed we've had it backwards the whole time - it's actually "more than one of the subs is firing" that's the bug. You do indeed do less damage, but to be fair, having only one laser fire was the intended thing to begin with.
"Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of thinking." - Carl Sagan

NEW AND IMPROVED YOUTUBE, now with 60 fps Touhou videos! Latest video update: WBaWC Lunatic/Extra no-miss no-bomb no-Roars no-Spirit-Strikes compilation.