Topic: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)  (Read 5953 times)

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rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« on: November 06, 2013, 07:45:05 am »
Based on Mefidex's TH07-TH11 + TH13 Shot/Bomb Analysis and Japanese Wiki.Adding researches from Chinese STGers.
Corrected some mistakes in the two pages.

shot power should be calculated by the player.I will mark the expected damage.

Shot data in the tables refer to damage per second.(margin of error is -5~5)
Bomb data refer to damage in total(without shooting)
Invincibility time is measured in frame(1 second=60 frame)
Hp values of the cards are obtained from the game program.
Movement speed  is measured in pixel per frame.

My English is not so good.Thanks for correcting the mistakes in grammar or vocabulary.
I will post the shot/bomb analysis first.Translation of the whole article may be delayed.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2013, 05:57:52 am by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2013, 07:48:12 am »
the Embodiment of Scarlet Devil

notes:
(1)All chars except RB (dream sign) have a damage penalty.
When 2 options hit an enemy together,the total damage equals to 1.5 times as one option.
(2)All chars except MB(love sign) can shoot during a bomb but the damage will be halved.
However,the laser of MB will not disappear at once.Thus makes about 200 damage at most.

HP value of bosses:

Stage 1

500:900 800

Stage 2
1500   1400(E)/1800(NHL)    1400

Stage 3
1300:1900 1400 1400 2000

Stage 4
nonspell1:17000 
nonspell2:16000
spellcards: 1600 to 1800 (24 spellcards,too many)

Stage 5
710:1400 1400 1700

Stage 6
Sakuya:750(RA)/1000(RB)/1100(MA/MB)

Remi:1200   1600   1600   1300   4700(N)/5300(HL)

EXTRA
1800 1450 1100

1800 1200 1900 2400 1400 2200 1520 1800 [1000] 6000
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 01:00:58 pm by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2013, 07:50:16 am »
Perfect Cherry Blossom


notes:
(1):Sub weapons may not totally hit enemies when unfocused.
(2):Bomb power relates to distance between the char and boss.
Yuyuko's fan will not be hit by bombs.About 2/3s of the damage dealt to Yuyuko's fan is also dealt to her.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 11:09:53 am by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2013, 07:52:07 am »
Imperishable Night


Movespeed:
Unfocused: 4 stars: 4.0px/f     6 stars: 5.0px/f
Focused: 1star: 2.0px/f   2stars: 2.2px/f   3stars: 2.3px/f

notes:
(1)When a familiar takes damage, the owner of the familiar also takes half of that damage.
However,familiars will share bomb damage (when unfocused).Owners will not gain more damage from bombs hitting familiars.
Thus in fact,the bombs and deathbombs  of Sakuya will do little damage to the owners.
Especially in stage 4,Sakuya can hardly bomb up cards and noncards of Reimu. Even the fairies with familiars.
(2)Youmu's  Myon will do half damage when hitting enemy's bodies together with her main shot.
(3)When the slot in the bottom left get 80%-100%,characters do more damage but can be hardly noticed.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 11:10:08 am by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2013, 07:52:49 am »
Mountain of Faith


(Raimu=>Reimu)

notes:
(1)focus,all shots hitting. Reimu C have only 1 way main shot at L1 and L2.

(2)bomb will hit full screen when boss appears.Otherwise it will only damage units inside.
Bomb invincibility for all characters are all 270 frames.
When you use a deathbomb, the invincible time will reduce for 60 frames(1 second).

(3)shot damage will not decrease when using bomb since MoF.
Deathbomb constraining time is 8 frames since MoF. Applying to all characters.
Movement speed of Marisa is 5.0(unfocused),2.0(focused).For Reimu and other characters,it's 4.5/2.0. Applying to all games since MoF.

(4)bug for Marisa B:When unfocused,the right-handed main shot will do about 500 dps at L3. Vsyncpatch can correct the bug,but the replay can only be played for corrected players.



Maybe option damage for RB is 18 per needle (30 per option for MB), also influenced by damage penality.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2014, 05:02:09 am by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2013, 07:53:27 am »
Subterranean Animism



notes:
(1)Measured in "main + sub | highest dps in general".Main shot power at L0 is 88 to all characters.
(2)Alice's doll has 35 dps each.Changing between focused and unfocused can let 8 dolls shoot together,having little relevance.
(3)Damage penalty:When main and sub shot are both hitting an enemy.
For the majority of characters, only the main shot and one option can do full damage.Other options do half instead.
For Patch Earth and Alice,all options do half damage. If main shot does not hit,one option can do full damage and others do half.
For Patch Wood,every option do 50 dps(regardless of the main shot).But at L4,all options do half damage when 3 or more hitting an enemy together with the main shoot.
(4)Nitory's options do 25% more damage when the shield lasts,however the total dps increases less than 10%.
(5)Aya's skill will double the movement speed(9.0 pixels per frame).

Edit:
For Stage 6's final card.
You may only deal 15% damage to the boss (compared with normal shoot and bomb damage) when you use bombs.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 11:23:28 am by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2013, 07:54:06 am »
Undefined Fantastic Object



Notes:
(1)UFOs have 320 hp.(maybe not for Houjuu Nue)
(2)Damage penalty:
When main shot and sub shot both hitting an enemy.Only the main shot and one option can do full damage,other options do half.
Applying to all characters except Sanae B
(3)Sanae B's frogs have 3 parts of damage:crashing, small explode,big explode.
When unfocused, all shots have no damage penalty. Shotting ontop of the enemy will do about 260 dps at L3. Generally,L4 sub shots cannot completely hit.
When focused,main shot power is halved. It will only do 120/120/120/135 dps at a far range(L1/L2/L3/L4).When you get closer, the damage will increase a little.
This cannot be explained by  the damage penalty theory.
However,when you are close to the enemy at L4,the 2 diagonal frogs have no penalty.Thus Sanae B do 200~225 dps in total.
To get most damage when using a bomb, you should shoot ontop of the boss at L1 to L3,and close to the boss at L4(except for Hiziri,shoot ontop will do more damage).
Sanae B's bomb can deal about 2000 damage at most (shot included).
Residual frogs do much damage in nonboss parts(when unfocused).
If you want to kill big fairies quickly,you should use unfocused shot because it's constant.
(4)Hiziri has a bigger hitbox than other bosses.This will add a fair bit to the damage for Marisa A,Marisa B and Sanae B.


Hp values of bosses:
Stage 1:
1300: 1500   1200(ENH)/1000(L)
Stage 2:
1350:1100 1700 1900
Stage 3:
1700:1700 2000 2500
Stage 4:
1800 2100 2100 [1]
Stage 5:
2000: 2000 2000   1900(E)/1300(NHL)  3100
Stage 6:
2200 2400 2500 5000   3000(N)/2200(H)/1800(L)  7000
Extra
2000 2000 2800
2300 1300 2700 1700 3600 2700 2200 2200 [3100] 6500

Stage 6's 4th card (|Devil's Recitation") may have 7 forms at most.It changes forms at 4000 3000 2000 and 1000 hp. If the timer reaches 25s, it will  change to a special form. If the timer reaches 15s, it will  burst out unreasonable bullets.


Bomb will only deal about 15% damage to the 5th card ("Byakuren Hijiri").  When you are invincible, you only deal about 20% shoot damage to the card.

Hiziri's last spell ("Legendary Flying Saucer")  changes forms at 4900/3850/2800/2100 . When the timer reaches 30, it will  change to a special form.
When you use a bomb ,its area of bullet erasing  will be reduced.
 (RA and MA: erase bullets near the character.
MB and SA: erase all bullets on the screen.
SB: erase bullets near the bomb.
RB: erase little bullets...
)
When you miss, you only deal about 15% shoot damage to the card in the invincibility (about 4 seconds).

Extra's final card  changes forms at 4600, 3000,  and 1500 hp.If the timer reaches 30s, it will automatically change to a special final form (stronger than the 1500hp form).
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 01:04:48 pm by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #7 on: November 06, 2013, 07:54:47 am »
Ten Desires



Notes:
(1)Damage penalty still exists. Dps for one option is 20/25/30(Reimu/Marisa/Youmu,unfocused).
(2)Shoot of Marisa and Sanae can hardly be separated.The data of Sanae is in a range.


Hp values of bosses:
Shoot and bomb will deal 7x damage to nonspells.

Stage 1
1500 1500 2500 2500
Stage 2
2000:2700 2200 2500
Stage 3
2000:2200 2600 2800
Stage 4
2000:1700 1700 2200 (Yoshika has 12000 hp in Seiga's nonspells and 4000hp in spellcards. Herself gains damage as a nonspell (7x) )
Stage 5
2100:2100 2500 2300 4500
Stage 6
2300 2500 3100 2800 2700 4000 6800
Extra
2400 2400 2400
1900 2600 2400 2600 2700 2400 3000 3000 [3000] 5300

Futo's boat has a large hitbox. You can get 50% more souls by hitting the boat closely and using bombs.
For bombs and Youmu slashes, both hitting the boat and boss will not deal more damage than usual.
However, for Marisa focused without bomb, she will deal less damage to Foto when shot closely than faraway.

For Miko's last spell:
The lesser its hp gets , the more bullets drop. All bullets will aim at the character for every 500f (8.33s) before its last form.
It gains damage as usual  before its hp reaches 1650. Then it gets its last form.
In this form, when you get invincible (bomb/trance/miss), you will only deal 25% damage  to the spellcard.
 
For Mamizou's last spell:
The lesser its hp gets , the lesser interval it has.If the timer reaches 24s, it will automatically change to a special final form.
 
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 01:07:43 pm by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re:TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2013, 07:55:38 am »
Double Dealing Character



Notes:
(1)Damage of Sakuya A focused means damage per explode .If you stay focused,there will be about 1 explode every 4 seconds .
There is a way to increase much damage(Sakuya Cannon).

(2)Damage penalty:
When main and sub shot both hitting an enemy,main shot and one option will do full damage.Other options do half.
Except for Reimu A focused,Marisa A focused and Sakuya unfocused.
(ie. Reimu B,L4,6-way needles hitting.85+15x2+15x0.5x4=145. At L3,the middle option has only one way needle but do 30 damage in fact.
Stage 4,5,6 boss have a bigger hitbox so that Reimu B can hit 7-way needles).

(3)ALL of the damage dealt to Shinmyoumaru's bowl is also dealt to her. Damage dealt directly to her will be doubled(only when she has a bowl).
When hitting the bowl and her at the same time(Reimu A and Sakuya A's subshot,Marisa's bombs), it  will not do triple damage.



The following may be a boring or silly inference.
For the 3rd card of stage 6(4000hp).
Reimu A's bomb hits the boss and her bowl but not "at the same time" so it deals triple damage.
Marisa's bombs do double damage at most for they hit the bowl and the boss together.
Maybe it can be explained like this.
For Sakuya A,as player's position changes, the explosion damage will be 500(all knives hitting the boss),250(only bowl)and 600~700(half knives body,others bowl).
It may explain as "same position and same time will cause damage penalty".
This may be why Sakuya A cannon users moves around the bowl.
One of our players has found a way to capture the 3rd spell of stage 6 in 4 secs.


Hp values of bosses:

Stage 1
1300:1500 1900
Stage 2
1900:1400 1900 2100
Stage 3
1900:1600 2100 1800
Stage 4A(Benben)
2300 2300 2800
Stage 4B(Yatsuhashi)
2300 2300 2500
Stage 5
2200:2600 2100 3000 2700
Stage 6
3000 2800 4000 [1] 3000 8000
Extra
2400 2400
2100 3000 2300 3500 3300 3000 3500 3500 [4000] 8000

For Shinmyoumaru's last spell:
Adds yellow bullets aiming at character at 6500.Adds static white bullets at 3300.When the timer reaches 30s, it will  change to a special form.
It has no armor  when you miss (different from Hiziri).For different character , bombs deal different damage.
ReimuA: almost no resistance, 1300dmg (close).
ReimuB: 400 (far)/ 200 (close). Will explode at once when you are ontop of the bowl. Shooting will deal 15% damage when bomb lasts.
MarisaA: 850
MarisaB: about 40 per sec. Shooting will deal 15% damage when bomb lasts.
SakuyaA:when the shield is starting or exploding, shooting will deal 30% damage (lasts about 1 sec).
SakuyaB:Shooting will deal 30% damage when bomb lasts.

For Raiko's last spell:
It changes forms at 6200,4400 and 2600hp. Will add blue rests at 800hp.
If the timer reaches 30s, it will  change to a special form
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 01:21:25 pm by rsy_type1 »

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2013, 05:56:48 am »
The analysis will be edited in a certain time because of my poor English.

Failure McFailFace

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Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2013, 01:36:38 pm »
This seems rather nice.

Even though the format is rather confusing,it's still very thorough.
1cc Easy: DDC (all) | 1cc Normal: UFO (SanA autobomb),  DDC (ReiA, SakA) , LoLK (Sanae PD)| EX clears: DDC (MarB Ultra) | Puzzle Games: StB: 10-X, DS: Hatate unlock, ISC: All clear

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2013, 08:34:59 am »
This seems rather nice.

Even though the format is rather confusing,it's still very thorough.

Sorry for confusing.But I want to know what makes you confused.

Byronyello

  • "The Western Non-Otaku That Respects and Likes Touhou"
  • I guess that'd be my title in a Touhou game...
  • Nickname: Byron~
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2013, 10:28:00 pm »
This is really cool. Admittedly, it's quite useless to me but that's probably me not realising what it could be used for. What I want to know, though, is how you got all this information. Was it done by reverse-engineering the game or something fancy like that? Or are all those data points in the form of arbitrary units?
9g
(Strike-through indicates a clear)
Hard Clears: EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF, SA, UFO, TD, DDC.
Lunatic Clears: Someday, perhaps.
Extra Clears: EoSD, PCB, PCB Phantasm, IN, MoF, SA, UFO, TD, DDC.

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2013, 01:17:15 am »
What I want to know, though, is how you got all this information. Was it done by reverse-engineering the game or something fancy like that? Or are all those data points in the form of arbitrary units?
As I wrote in #1,HP values of spellcards are written in the game programs directly.What I have done is recording the clear time and calculate the dps.

This is really cool. Admittedly, it's quite useless to me but that's probably me not realising what it could be used for.

This article has several parts in fact,not only the data.
It contains data,analysis and suggestions.Technical articles quoted as well.
However it may cost much time for me to translate the article all by myself.
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2013, 01:51:25 pm »
Very interesting read, with lots of discoveries for me. I guess I'll hold my comments until it's fully finished. Really look forward to what else you've found.
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2013, 03:07:54 am »
Hmm, this data sure is interesting, I didn't know there was a thing such as damage penalty, it really explains the damage offsets of some shottypes (also, I guess Needle Reimu wasn't nerfed for DDC after all, since she has the same damage output from TD, it's just that every other character happens to be stronger)

Looking forward to the finished work

Subterranean Animism

notes:
(2)Alice's doll has 35 dps each.Changing between focused and unfocused can let 8 dolls shoot together,having little relevance.

I suppose this is mostly language, but what do you mean by "little relevance"? do you mean it makes little difference to have all 8, as opposed to 6-7 dolls hitting?

Things I've done (and maybe will improve):
SA L6MNB | SA Lunatic 3b Scorerun | MoF LNB | PCB LNB |DDC LNB

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2013, 03:23:09 pm »
I suppose this is mostly language, but what do you mean by "little relevance"? do you mean it makes little difference to have all 8, as opposed to 6-7 dolls hitting?

yes,like the Malice in IN ,you pay much attention changing between focused and unfocused.
however  it only do 15-30 dps more.
for Marisa A you have little time shooting ontop of the boss at L8

above all
it is not so "useful".

rsy_type1

  • Nickname: rainsky
Re: TH06-TH14 Character Analysis(shot/bomb data completed)
« Reply #17 on: March 24, 2014, 01:24:38 pm »
Updated at  March 24.
Add hp values.
Fix some mistakes in EoSD. 
 

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