Author Topic: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)  (Read 430786 times)

Soul Devour

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #240 on: May 29, 2013, 03:20:00 AM »
Alright, I've played around with every character, read up the story for each part and I think I'm ready to say my impressions.

I think, Marisa B bomb abuse aside, this has the makings of a very solid touhou game and could be a high tier one, depending on the later stages. The music is good most of the time and great occasionally so far, the gameplay is pretty tight and enjoyable, and the bosses and their patterns are pretty fun and challenging.

(All of the below are simply my own opinion, based off of my own experiences)

Reimu A: Decent shot type. The focused mode with the auto-homing stick is pretty neat and adds an extra bit of damage to bosses and a good chunk of damage to stage mobs. Unfocused charms are slow but pretty reliable. The bomb is kinda...eh.
Reimu B: Narrow range, but simple. Unfocused seems the same, focused are persuasion needles. I personally don't mind the narrow range and the damage they do is good enough for me. Awesome bomb, you can't beat Fantasy Seal or Heaven, whichever it is.
Marisa A: Love it. Flamethrower has a good range and does good damage. Unfocused lasers go pew pew. Dark Spark is amazing.
Marisa B: (Still) Love it. AoE bombs are a good thing and splash damage never hurts for stage enemies. Not as great for bosses, but eh, whatever. More lasers pew pew. Her bomb is broken, but it's still really a neat concept, like a modified Reimu B bomb from SA to collect power items instead of deal additional damage.
Sakuya A: The best shot type. Why is that? Unfocused damage is kinda blah, but the focused attack shines. Homing knives that slow the damage AND explode for splash damage? Yes please. SA Marisa C bomb cannot be beat, short term invincibility, auto-collection AND you can survive a hit (or get 3 bomb pieces back)? Yes please, it's nearly as broken as Marisa B.
Sakuya B: Eh...doesn't do it for me. The Unfocused damage is still blah and I'm not feeling any power behind the focused attack. Maybe I'm doing it wrong. Bomb is ok (short-term invincibility, an auto-collect and a screen clear) but just feels like a subpar shot type.

Stage 1: Music is great (reminds me of Bad Apple a bit) and the pacing of the stage is fine. Cirno as the S1 midboss pleases me and it's totally in character for her spellcard to just be an amped version of her non-card. Mermaid boss (I'll learn her name eventually) was alright, her 2 non-cards and first spellcard didn't do much for me but her last spellcard is really fun, if a bit easy.

Stage 2: Stage themes are 2 for 2. Once again, the pacing of the stage is good, although it feels a bit easy, even on Lunatic. Sekibsnki's midboss appearance is hit and miss, the non-card is challenging and fun but her spellcard is very, very easy. What's up with that, S1 midboss cards being easier than the S2 midboss cards? Her boss fight is hella enjoyable though. I like the evolution of her non-cards and her spellcards have some nice gimmicks, although the difficulty between them is uneven. Her first card's trick is easy to figure out and capture, her second card isn't much harder, but it's tricky at times to deal damage, and her third is just right.

Stage 3: Oh baby, the best theme yet. This is what a Stage 3 should be, a good level of challenge and holy beep moments but nothing too overboard. There's a decent variety in the enemy types in this stage and a lot of risk vs reward opportunities. Definitely the best stage of the three. The music timings are spot on too, when Kagerou makes her appearance as a midboss and the chorus hits and just...damn. Speaking of the wolfgirl, she's hard. Like, she reminds me of Keine and the buttkicking I usually get from her. She doesn't have an easy spellcard in her deck and while everything of hers is pretty straight forward, non-cards included, she's just tough (ok, non-cards 2 and 3 are very learnable). Maybe I'm out of position on her spellcards but damn, she owns me.

Finally, the plot. I'm not talking about the plot at this time, I'll just join whatever conversation is happening (although it *is* quite interesting to see the differences in each character's behavior with and without their weapon...).

Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #241 on: May 29, 2013, 04:21:13 AM »
Sakuya A gets two autocollects per bomb, along with the amazing shot. I would say she's the best for survival.

Sakuya B is very very much the scoring character, being difficult to use due to low shot damage and no bomb damage, but the bomb can be abused to get incredibly high PIV from cancelling bullets.

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #242 on: May 29, 2013, 06:09:27 AM »
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if during ZUN's visit in North America he will reveal the release date to DDC, if not have the full game ready before that.

Piranha

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #243 on: May 29, 2013, 07:02:19 AM »
It COULD be released during the August Comiket, like with MoF and UFO. Also, both had a second trial version that was released mid July.
Just speculation from looking at the wiki, of course.
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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #244 on: May 29, 2013, 07:57:38 AM »
I must say, Wakasagihime looks quite adorable in that ZUNart.
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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #245 on: May 29, 2013, 08:05:24 AM »
I must say, Wakasagihime looks quite adorable in that ZUNart.
IKR?

I like that design even better than Kagerou or Sekibanki.
There's something about the brush for the hair he's using (also for the PCs) and the designs themselves are also good this time.
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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #246 on: May 29, 2013, 12:02:49 PM »
I have to agree. Wakasagihime has a pretty, pretty outfit and she seems to have been spared from the occasional foibles of ZUNart. I'm not so much a fan of Sekibanki's attire, but her boss fight is oodles of gimmicky goodness. I like Kagerou and all - moreso than the other two - but the name sounds very boyish I guess? It feels a bit weird. Also since she's a werewoof she probably wears a long dress because her legs are too hairy.

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #247 on: May 29, 2013, 12:38:25 PM »
She likes to talk about how hairy she is, too. And with those clothes, you wouldn't really be able to tell anyway, so it's a bit TMI if you ask me.

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #248 on: May 29, 2013, 12:58:22 PM »
I like Kagerou and all - moreso than the other two - but the name sounds very boyish I guess? It feels a bit weird.
Although it's not written the same way and has a different meaning, from what I've seen with a brief search her name is a homophone to a common japanese girl's name, so I wouldn't say it's boyish.
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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #249 on: May 29, 2013, 03:36:22 PM »
Whoa, it only took two new Touhou games for me to come back to these forums :V

I found DDC kind of "meh" the first time I tried it, but now I'm addicted to it.

I'm digging the "back to the basics" approach ZUN has taken with this game.
In my opinion, gathering resources by going over the POC is a simple, yet deep mechanic. Timing the POC rushes correctly requires a bit of planning and a considerable amount of guts, at least if you're trying a no bombs 1cc. Ramming fairies or stray bullets while gathering resources actually feels like a mistake rather than a lost struggle against questionable (or just questionably complicated) game mechanics like in UFO or IN :V
In addition to this, it feels like the game wants you to use and abuse your bombs. The game showers you with resources, but it can and will take them back if you are not actively using them. I'm usually kind of stingy with bomb usage, so I'll have to learn to stop worrying and love the bomb (especially MarisaBroken :getdown:)

I didn't like the new characters at first, but they're growing on me (Wakasagihime in particular has a pretty cute design). The same goes for the music - it isn't subpar as I initially thought. Even though it isn't the best Touhou soundtrack (nothing beats Ten Desires' music in my opinion), it still manages to be nice and catchy.

As for the difficulty, I feel that, on Normal, the game is hard enough to be challenging and not too frustrating.
Stage 1 as a whole is pretty easy (as it should be). The game gets challenging when Sekibanki appears, and then comes Stage 3 with very few clear shots at the POC during the stage portion and its balls-to-the-wall hard boss fight. I can't remember any Stage 3 boss walling the player on Normal like Kagerou, but it's a tense and fun fight nonetheless.

I like the variety of shot types. I don't get what's awesome about ReimuA, though. To me, it feels like a hybrid between Remilia's focused options and Ran from Imperishable Night, with the homing properties and reach of the latter and the low mobility of the former. Her bomb is also unwieldy and doesn't feel powerful at all. I like simpler and direct shots such as ReimuB and SakuyaB better.
Although I'm undecided about SakuyaA's focused shot, I definitely love her bomb. Actually, I love both of Sakuya's bombs.
Marisa is still too fast for my liking, and I've never been a fan of Master Spark, even though I find Dark Spark's graphics pretty cool. Her only saving grace is her clean shot's decent damage output and broken bomb :V

Overall, I think the demo is a lot of fun, and I can see myself playing it obsessively for a long time, at least until the full version is released.
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EthanSilver

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #250 on: May 29, 2013, 07:38:25 PM »
She likes to talk about how hairy she is, too.
She's talking about her wolf-form/whatever that is during her spellcards. The translation patch phrases it as her fur getting matted rather than her getting hairy.

...Well, okay, I'm hoping she's talking about her wolf-form and that the wiki's translation isn't the most accurate of the two. >_>;



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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #251 on: May 29, 2013, 08:37:33 PM »
This is the last mention of hair in this thread.

Carry on.

Kingault

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #252 on: May 29, 2013, 09:01:08 PM »
This is the last mention of hair in this thread.

Carry on.

But... every last inch of her's covered with hair!

Okay, fine.

Anyway, ReimuB is fun. Might try Sakuya A later, even though I don't like using possessed weapons.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2013, 03:37:36 AM by Kingault »

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #253 on: May 30, 2013, 12:06:38 AM »
Now I have this overwhelming urge to photoshop her face onto Gaston.  Damn you all.

Also holy crap that Marisa B bomb.  It takes forever to go away.  I wonder if it is the longest lasting bomb in the series.

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #254 on: May 30, 2013, 12:18:23 AM »
Also holy crap that Marisa B bomb.  It takes forever to go away.  I wonder if it is the longest lasting bomb in the series.
I believe SA's Mari/Nitori's Cherry Bo err... shield takes that title.

EDIT: Just verified, Mari/Nitori's shield last 15 seconds while DDC MarisaB's Bomb goes away after 8.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2013, 12:20:13 AM by Kosachi »
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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #255 on: May 30, 2013, 01:17:10 AM »
Am I the only one that thinks Sekibanki has a lot of similarities with this boss?

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #256 on: May 30, 2013, 01:18:38 AM »
So it turns out my guaranteed 60FPS comes from 640x480, windowed. Which has made playing this game ... interesting. That itty bitty window can help me see total patterns better, which really helps me milk the shit out of the PoC, but I get in some pretty tight spaces.

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #257 on: May 30, 2013, 02:35:02 AM »
I have to agree. Wakasagihime has a pretty, pretty outfit and she seems to have been spared from the occasional foibles of ZUNart. I'm not so much a fan of Sekibanki's attire, but her boss fight is oodles of gimmicky goodness. I like Kagerou and all - moreso than the other two - but the name sounds very boyish I guess? It feels a bit weird. Also since she's a werewoof she probably wears a long dress because her legs are too hairy.

I like Sekibanki's theme, not much about her design, though. Kagerou has her "Waon~" that somehow makes want to come back for more bite :V. Wakasagihime is just cute, but I don't find anything else about her appealing aside from being cute.


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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #258 on: May 30, 2013, 06:11:08 AM »
Am I the only one that thinks Sekibanki has a lot of similarities with this boss?
I was thinking something like this instead.

- - -

Looking at Danbooru, looks like Kagerou is the Belle of the Ball, so to speak.  The number of fanart of her is noticeably outpacing the other three.

Tengukami

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #259 on: May 30, 2013, 09:30:31 AM »
Looking at Danbooru, looks like Kagerou is the Belle of the Ball, so to speak.  The number of fanart of her is noticeably outpacing the other three.
Sometimes the fandom really does know best!

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Kingault

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #260 on: May 30, 2013, 06:49:33 PM »
I was thinking something like this instead.

- - -

Looking at Danbooru, looks like Kagerou is the Belle of the Ball, so to speak.  The number of fanart of her is noticeably outpacing the other three.

I was thinking of Ms. Fortune...
Funny how the way Cirno is drawn on the Touhou Wiki homepage reminds me of Ms. Fortune...

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #261 on: May 30, 2013, 11:04:01 PM »
Marisa Broken is back!

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #262 on: May 30, 2013, 11:21:07 PM »
So anyways, this is technically my first Touhou game and I'm playing it on normal.
And loooooooooooooooooooooool I suck   :getdown:

AnonymousPondScum

Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #263 on: May 31, 2013, 04:26:46 AM »
Quote from: Marisa A, Stage 3
Spoiler:
I'm gonna give you a full-body afro!
--hm.

I don't have to go that far...
Right...?

Well I know which character I'm playing with first in the full version, because WHAT IN THE ACTUAL HELL. :getdown:
« Last Edit: May 31, 2013, 04:36:09 AM by Puppy Puppy Puppy »

Formless God

Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #264 on: May 31, 2013, 05:22:49 AM »
What are the little pellet things that pop up and fly to your character when your shots hit something?
How do I stop crashing with Sakuya A?

Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #265 on: May 31, 2013, 06:50:15 AM »
What are the little pellet things that pop up and fly to your character when your shots hit something?
Those increase item value.


I'd like marisaB to stay the like she is now.

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #266 on: May 31, 2013, 07:03:43 AM »
random lunatic clear on stream with marisaB

i feel dirty using her bomb at all

zun please change so i can play marisaB without incredible guilt

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #267 on: May 31, 2013, 11:30:40 AM »
random lunatic clear on stream with marisaB

i feel dirty using her bomb at all

zun please change so i can play marisaB without incredible guilt
And then ZUN changed DDC's MarisaB to the MarisaB of UFO.

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #268 on: May 31, 2013, 12:18:27 PM »
I have some speculation I would like to share with everyone.

The stage 4 boss gimmick: shot type based?
-if you are using a "corrupted" shot type you will fight one of the heroines in her "sane" version, trying to make you reason;
-if you are using a "sane" shot type you will stumble upon one of the heroines using her "corrupted" weapon and you will fight to stop her.

I had this on my mind and wanted to share it, what do you people expect from the stage 4 boss? Gimmick? Or just a normal fight?
« Last Edit: May 31, 2013, 12:20:18 PM by ★Drizzly Magician★ »

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Re: Touhou 14 - 東方輝針城 ~ Double Dealing Character (Demo)
« Reply #269 on: May 31, 2013, 12:30:47 PM »
zun please change so i can play marisaB without incredible guilt
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I had this on my mind and wanted to share it, what do you people expect from the stage 4 boss? Gimmick? Or just a normal fight?
Has been speculated previously whether we are getting IN-ish stage 4 or not. Nobody knows.