Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F  (Read 243262 times)

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #30 on: January 06, 2013, 11:22:13 PM »
I can give it a shot though grinding for WINNER may very well kill me. I may record the boss fights as well but none of the exploring junk (already have a Let's Play with all that).


Edit: Or I would be interested if my New Game+ would stop bugging out on me. For some reason, it gives some of the later characters a bunch of starting Exp.

Edit Edit: Ok repatching seems to work, reapplying the english patch. It is such a weird bug. It actually fixed itself towards the end of my Let's Play but then today it did it again. Oh well
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 12:38:59 AM by Kanoe »

Parallaxal

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #31 on: January 07, 2013, 01:36:49 AM »
I believe drafting helped me learn more about the game. I found that I would draft based on archetypes (sort of like how I draft in MtG). I do prefer a more heavy nuking and switching strategy, but it really depends on what enablers I get (like Kaguya, Yukari, Keine, etc.). That's why I prioritize enablers ahead of damage dealers, since you can always just fill in with whatever damage dealers are left behind. Most of them are kinda interchangeable to a point.

I wrote a big post on my own draft strategy in the previous thread.

When we last did the draft, our bans were Meiling, Iku, Nitori, and Renko. I picked Renko for our last ban not because she's totally OP, but because she's too binary - either she makes a boss battle trivially easy, or contributes next to nothing. The other 3 are totally OP, though.

Btw, don't be afraid to use Keine, Sakuya, or Wriggle as your slot 1 tank! I found them effective enough for the main game at the very least, especially if you can pick up a buffer like Minoriko.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #32 on: January 07, 2013, 01:59:40 AM »
Sounds fun. I'm for it if there is room.  :blush:

There are still 18 characters I have not beaten WINNER with. XD

Tangrelle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #33 on: January 07, 2013, 04:55:38 AM »
I'd be good for it, as well, provided it hasn't been picked up already. I have a lot of free time for the next couple weeks and this would probably give me incentive to actually get through the darn game, anyway :'D

Just gotta dig out some art for my poor portraits <3

Raikaria

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #34 on: January 07, 2013, 08:41:33 AM »
I'll be able to sort this out when you're both online then. We can probobly do the draft in this chatroom:

http://webchat.ppirc.net/?channels=MotKTown

Although I don't know how to work the bot which me, Para and Pesco used, I can just use a word document to keep track of stuff.

Failing that I can make a quicktopic or something, which would obviously take longer to sort something out, but if timezones are an issue...

On a side note; has anyone tried combining Mystia's Mysterious Song with Utusho's Uncontained Nuclear Reaction? Turning the debuffs Utusho inflicts on herself into Defense Buffs seems useful. I guess if you throw someone like Aya in so Utusho can ramp up faster, Utusho suddenly isn't as horrible as she's usually made out to be.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 11:38:32 AM by Raikaria »


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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #35 on: January 07, 2013, 12:58:45 PM »
It is still my winter break and I just woke up today so I will try to be on all day.

As for Mystia and Utsuho, the buff would help but probably not enough to make her endure much more damage than usual.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #36 on: January 07, 2013, 02:15:27 PM »
By the time you have Utsuho, you're probably spamming the hell out of party-wide DEF/MND buffs in bosses anyway, so it doesn't end up making a difference. You would normally have the def/mnd buff already anyway.

In a NG+ it'd work out better since early on you definitely can't spam those, but on the other hand, Utsuho's spells are REALLY GODDAMN EXPENSIVE in ng+.
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RegalStar

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #37 on: January 07, 2013, 03:45:32 PM »
I kind of wanted to join too but I guess I'm already too late  :ohdear:

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #38 on: January 07, 2013, 03:53:07 PM »
Well, hopefully everyone can meet. *nods nods*

Or you can join us and play as the four banned characters.  :3

Raikaria

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #39 on: January 07, 2013, 04:02:46 PM »
Well, hopefully everyone can meet. *nods nods*

Or you can join us and play as the four banned characters.  :3

There is nothing stopping you from playing with one of the three character sets we make, or attempting to arrange your own draft with some other people.


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I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Raikaria

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #40 on: January 07, 2013, 06:48:46 PM »
Here's how the Draft went:

We agreed to ban Meiling, before we rolled.

Tang got the highest score, then me, then Kanoe. We banned Nitori, Iku and Rinnosuke in that order

Bans: Meiling, Nitori, Iku, Rinnosuke

The pick order was then Tang -> Me -> Kan x2 -> Tang, repeat

Our parties ended up like this; in the order of being picked:

Tangrelle: Keine, Sanae, Remi, Wriggle, Mystia, Chen, Sukia, Alice, Mokou, Marisa, Maribel, Utusho

Me: Tenshi, Reimu, Aya, Reisen, Renko, Komachi, Kaguya, Rin, Youmu, Rumia, Eirin, Kanako

Kanoe: Minoriko, Yukari, Ran, Sakuya, Shikieiki, Yuugi, Patchouli, Yuuka, Suwako, Yuyuko, Flandre, Cirno

===

When it came to me, my gameplan was to secure heals, and tanking ability, with a focus on debuffing as well. Admittedly I wanted Keine first for the flexibility, but didn't get her. However, between Reisen and Renko, I have great control and debuffs. Aya allows for high DPS with Youmu, or speeding up someone else.

I'm probobly going to be running an more offensive Komachi, since I have Tenshi, and tankier Eirin. Between Aya and Youmu, I should have the capability of dealing high DPS, although I lack fast offensive buffing, this is counteracted by fast debuffing with Renko/Reisen.

I also have a lack of real nukes, my strongest nuke being Hourai Barrage. I'm almost certainly going to be using Kaguya with a full MAG build.

Between Reimu, Eirin and Rumia, my team has real staying power. Shame I couldn't get PSN inflicter to win over time better, but whatever.

i picked up Youmu/Aya for a very specific reason. I'll be building Youmu with a fair about of durability, so she can be a slot 2/3 character, while dealing solid DPS, and using her high focus regeneration if she runs out. Aya can speed-boost Youmu quickly, to let her tear apart her foes. I can pull off a similar move with Komachi as well, giving me two tanky characters who can deal decent DPS, while Tenshi sits in slot 1.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 07:21:06 PM by Raikaria »


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RegalStar

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #41 on: January 07, 2013, 07:08:32 PM »
Well, unless a couple more people shows interest in drafting with me in the next few hours, I'll just steal Tang's team and go through with it.

I don't know what the original game plan of the team is, but I will likely try to play it DPS like, since the attackers all have their share of low to medium delay moves. Lack of healing is a concern, though, since I don't think Sanae can keep up all by herself like Minoriko can, since I can't work on her healing prowess, durability and speed all at once. The team certainly isn't lacking in durability though, so I might be able to get away with making use of switching to heal as well. I'm not really familiar with 12 party member clears either so I'll have to get used to that as well. Tang's team doesn't look to be the easiest to work with, but the strategies I'd use for both Kanoe's team (stall and buff with Ran, then burst) or Rai's team (control the field with status while attacking at leisure) are both something I already tried, so I want to do something different this time.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 07:15:44 PM by RegalStar »

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #42 on: January 07, 2013, 07:10:59 PM »
You made a few mistake sin my list Rai. Two people are listed with Alice and Utsuho. XD

And the order was Tang -> Rai -> Kanoe x2 -> Rai then repeat to avoid any confusion.

Here are mine in order...

Minoriko
Yukari
Ran
Sakuya
Shikieiki
Yuugi
Patchouli
Yuuka
Suwako
Yuyuko
Flandre
Cirno

As for strategy... Umm... I hate Rinnosuke so he got banned. I wanted to try and get characters I never used or at least beaten the game all the way through with before.

Despite this, I picked Minoriko as I know with her healing I would be able to pull something off. Then I went straight for reliable buffs (along with some instant turns from Yukari). By then, all the usual tanks had been taken so I kept going towards buffs before grabbing some DPS I never used before.

Though I tried to avoid taking people I used before, Rai and Tang seemed to the same characters for some reason (Suwako and Flandre). The rest was just characters I never done a full playthrough with and ensuring I get Patch for some elemental variety.

So this is what I have. A nice healer with great buffers (or at least great once I get SP) and some decent Magic, Physical, and piercing DPS with a pinch of status effects and speed buff and debuff. My biggest weakness is a lack of proper tank which will be left to Sakuya and Yuugi most likely.

Tangrelle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #43 on: January 07, 2013, 07:28:22 PM »
Tangrelle: Keine, Sanae, Remi, Wriggle, Mystia, Chen, Sukia, Alice, Mokou, Marisa, Maribel, Utusho
So this is me guys hi!

After the bans, I know I wanted Keine because I have the art where she is the little thing and it is so cute and eeeheehee <3 Although seriously, I find her solid and really like her. After that I had to go with Sanae or else I'd be left with no heals at all since the rest were taken by the time they rolled around. Since she can heal status and whatnot, I figured I may as well grab Remi while I'm at it, who can serve as a veritable tank.

After that I also grabbed Wriggle because I figured I'd need her poison and taking ability, and also took Mystia because of her paralysis and general amazingness overall!

Chen was next with Suika. I took Chen because I needed someone fast and Aya was already gone, so I didn't want to risk lacking a quick character for nasty speedy trash. Suika was in a similar vein, for her self buff and the speed debuff. At this point I pretty much took away almost all status healing options from Rai and Kanoe, incidentally.

At that point I went with Alice and Mokou next for a mix of debuffs and magic damage. Nothing too special, I just like them. Then Marisa and Maribel would round out my magical roster along with debuffs.

And then I was saddled with Utsuho.

My team essentially looks like a bunch of self-buff characters who are tankier than most. I have one healer, so I'm going to need it! Utsuho, at the least, I can use to tank Flowing Hellfires or something. I'm only annoyed at her existence because I already picked two prominent fire mages beforehand, so she's just kind of there! She can clear trash or something, I figure! The team together has a couple nifty tricks like Mystia's debuffswitch along with Suika's selfbuff that'll make her faster with Mystia, and Sanae can finish up Maribel's selfbuff as well!

It'll be tricky, but I'll try to keep you posted!

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #44 on: January 07, 2013, 07:35:13 PM »
Oh yeah... I don't think I have any way to remove status effects. Oops...  :ohdear:

RegalStar

  • Envoy of Balance
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #45 on: January 07, 2013, 07:44:56 PM »
Oh yeah... I don't think I have any way to remove status effects. Oops...  :ohdear:

Well Yuuka can halve them for what it's worth.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #46 on: January 07, 2013, 07:48:33 PM »
I will probably end up farming the Wriggle bugs for the Para rings at the very least.

Looking through the stats, most have pretty decent resistance right out the gate which is good at least. With the rings, I will just have to worry about some Silence during some of the boss fights.

Parallaxal

  • Moon Sign "Theft of Dreams"
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2013, 09:32:46 PM »
I've never really felt a huge need for status removal spells. On any run, I pretty much always end up with enough resistance rings dropped by random enemies. And there are enough good random items that tangentially provide resistance as well, especially against PAR.

Raikaria

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #48 on: January 07, 2013, 09:49:15 PM »
I did my favorite trick, forgetting where the Chen boss fight spawned and running headfirst into it with a squad of Lv 2's and 3's.

Luckily, I had Komachi who just DTH'ed her.

Here's hoping I don't have the item/SP reset bug I had when I did this thing before. I'll be able to find out when I reach Youmu.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 09:54:17 PM by Raikaria »


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I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #49 on: January 07, 2013, 09:59:05 PM »
Yeah, status effects is more just a beginning of the game issue.

Yeah, I recorded showing off all three draft groups then went and beat up Chen and Meiling at level 1-2. Yuyuko took care of them both.

But, I wanted the Unwavering Will and forgot to save so I ended up fighting both bosses again and got both their drops. Ball of Lightning is nothing special but better than nothing and Unwavering Will.. well i need all the HP, Def, Mind I can get. *nods nods*

Not sure when to fight the secret boss in Floor 1 but I can come back there later.

Hanzo K.

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #50 on: January 07, 2013, 10:02:57 PM »
You probably already know this, but you definitely want good SPI Resist for that guy. Mind too.
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Raikaria

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #51 on: January 07, 2013, 10:15:23 PM »
I went and fought Meiling at Lv 4~5, this time not using Komachi at all.

The fight was actually surprisingly long. Not hard at all, just long, because I couldn't nuke Meiling down enough before she healed herself. [Kanako fell just short, Meiling healed about 1980], so I basically had to kill Meiling twice.

Still, my team was equally immovable, and Eirin actually got the killing blow.

Also the only debuff that stuck the whole fight was a MND drop from Discarder.

Also, I've not actually spent any SP yet, since I recall a bug where when I recruited Cirno when I already had her before, any items she held were removed and lost, and all her SP levels were reset.

Obviously that's pretty painful for, say, Kaguya, if I invest a lot of SP...
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 10:45:38 PM by Raikaria »


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #52 on: January 07, 2013, 11:02:03 PM »
Well I don't spend skillpoints until I absolutely have to in the beginning.

I can test if there is a bug by giving Cirno an Eva item and see what happens. Should be taking her out soon enough.

Did have a weird bug in my save though. Two items in the Plus Disc are listed in my item list. It shows I have zero amounts of the two items but they are still showing on my list for some reason instead of as ???.

Since it shows I don't actually have the items, it should be fine.

RegalStar

  • Envoy of Balance
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #53 on: January 07, 2013, 11:13:53 PM »
You guys should use the BP-preset save in the first post =P Unless you want to change BP yourself.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #54 on: January 07, 2013, 11:26:47 PM »
I forgot about BP.

I was going just grind it anyway (kill level one monsters or something). It doesn't take too long. Or is that not allowed?  :blush:

Raikaria

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #55 on: January 08, 2013, 12:03:43 AM »
I used the pre-BP save, it was apparently an error with patching to 3.01.

Anyway, no bugs this game, gave Youmu a few SP and she didn't lose them on re-recruitment.

Speaking of, Youmu put up a fight, probobly because I hadn't really spent SP, and partially because she managed to snipe down Reisen early on, using her two big moves in tandem, making keeping the debuffs I applied early on her difficult. I was only Reimu Lv 11 at the time too.

I just wound up using Narrow Confines in a hope to debuff some more, and it procced death on both halves <_< You'd think a half-ghost would resist death. I dislike cheesing fights,

Also, despite going full MAG, Kaguya isn't hitting all that hard right now, especially compared to others. Maybe that's just because I don't have the SP for Barrage yet, however.


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #56 on: January 08, 2013, 12:11:00 AM »
Yeah, mine is not a pre-BP. I will just grind the BP later on to avoid overgrinding.

And with Cirno, I equiped her with a Eva item and when I recruited her, she lost it (completely gone from inventory as well). So maybe it is just with Cirno and not anyone else?

Right now, Ran and Yukari actually do pretty good damage since not having any Skillpoints is not an issue.


Edit: Ok so I just picked up Minoriko after I got Cirno and she did not get reset. So it may just be Cirno with the bug. Cirno lost all her gear and her level was reset back to 1.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2013, 12:50:56 AM by Kanoe »

RegalStar

  • Envoy of Balance
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #57 on: January 08, 2013, 12:58:07 AM »
Yeah, I keep on running into this problem with her too, but not anyone else.

Edit: OK, got past the first two floors with Tang's team. Meiling and Chen didn't give me any problems. I had some pretty good luck with status against the 2F floors; Alice laughed at Cirno's 15 debuff resistance and landed three ATK downs in a row, which really helped. Against Youmu, I landed a lot of ATK debuffs too through her 8 debuff resistnace (though Suika had sigifnicantly less luck trying to land SPD debuffs), which helped a LOT. Mystia landing PAR every time also helped, since it gave Mari, and Chen time to safely switch in and do their stuff. I also didn't see Karmic Wind even once in phase 2, which helped too.

I'm not really looking forward to Alice fight though. Aside from Throwing Atlas, I don't really see anything that might be sufficiently powerful to break through Healing Light's defenses (and I may have to use Suika's SP to debuff SPD instead, to minimize the turns magical Light can get). I might also have some problem taking and recovering from Little Legion since I only got Sanae, so I might just have to hope for PAR or for she to just not use Little Legion a lot or something.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2013, 04:42:27 AM by RegalStar »

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #58 on: January 08, 2013, 08:55:44 AM »
Some of these teams look rough.

Komachi and Eirin are in the same team, but not planning to go HP Komachi?

Yuuka could be a pretty good tank. Her damage is kind of lack luster, so she could be used as a support/tank.

Utsuho just looks bad on paper, but hey, see how that goes.

Raikaria

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 9F
« Reply #59 on: January 08, 2013, 09:17:44 AM »
Some of these teams look rough.

Komachi and Eirin are in the same team, but not planning to go HP Komachi?

Yuuka could be a pretty good tank. Her damage is kind of lack luster, so she could be used as a support/tank.

Utsuho just looks bad on paper, but hey, see how that goes.

HP/Atk hybrid. I need some extra DPS, due to all the support characters I have, but likewise, I don't need pure HP because I have Tenshi, and most defense ignoring attacks have no issue being eaten by Komachi even without investment in her HP.

It's like I'm going to invest in Youmu's HP and DEF somewhat, because I want her able to stick around in slot 2. Kanako is probobly going to get a fair amount of bulk too.

I'm not really looking forward to Alice fight though. Aside from Throwing Atlas, I don't really see anything that might be sufficiently powerful to break through Healing Light's defenses (and I may have to use Suika's SP to debuff SPD instead, to minimize the turns magical Light can get). I might also have some problem taking and recovering from Little Legion since I only got Sanae, so I might just have to hope for PAR or for she to just not use Little Legion a lot or something.

Wriggle can inflict PSN on all parts of the Alice fight, if I recall correctly, which overloads Healing Light [She can't heal all four], and also whittles down Alice herself.

Remi, even if you're going tank, does good damage with Gungir spam throughout this fight.

Between those two it shouldn't take too long to kill Healing Light.

---

Rumia was easy, but annoying. I actually fought her early, Reimu Lv 14 [The wiki suggests 25+!], before I had fully explored F3. The only loss was when she decided to snipe Reisen with a Moonlight Ray. I could tell when it was nearing the end, because she jst started spaming Demarkation every. single. turn. And getting hge debuffs on everyone. Luckily I had Rumia to remove them.

Also Youmu hit over 3k with a single blow, albeit, with Rumia debuffed by Renko, and herself buffed by Stone Bowl.

I also got the Ring of Faith drop from her.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2013, 10:03:36 AM by Raikaria »


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.