Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou 7F (Read 201879 times)

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #630 on:** July 21, 2011, 12:43:03 AM »

Bloody. Hell.
I was told Tenshi hit hard, but I never expected 'er to hit this hard.
I know using poison isn't a good way of facing her, but it's a side-effect of my primary debuffer, Komachi.
I got her to her second plateau, having forced her to skip the first one. But I didn't have enough SP to keep hitting her hard enough.
Remi needs more SP it seems, I'll have to do more grinding. Since if I can't beat her, then there's no way I'll stand a chance against the Eientei Trio.

Athrel · « **Reply #631 on:** July 21, 2011, 12:52:35 AM »

Quote from: Hanzo K. on July 21, 2011, 12:43:03 AM

Bloody. Hell.
I was told Tenshi hit hard, but I never expected 'er to hit this hard.
I know using poison isn't a good way of facing her, but it's a side-effect of my primary debuffer, Komachi.
I got her to her second plateau, having forced her to skip the first one. But I didn't have enough SP to keep hitting her hard enough.
Remi needs more SP it seems, I'll have to do more grinding. Since if I can't beat her, then there's no way I'll stand a chance against the Eientei Trio.

Do you have a character that can tank the violent motherlands so that you don't have to make Tenshi skip her phases?
My strategy was just to debuff her widdle down her HP with lesser damaging magic attacks. When she got to the violent motherland phase, I switched out all of my characters save for Meiling (my main tank) and then switched in my heavy hitting damage dealers between them making sure to switch them back out before the next violent motherland.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #632 on:** July 21, 2011, 01:02:49 AM »

China might be able to, I just gotta get her to the right levels.
I assume it's Nature Affinity right? If that's the case, then I just need to pile that on.

Are these good enough? Or do I need more?

Athrel · « **Reply #633 on:** July 21, 2011, 01:04:56 AM »

That seems about right. If you have green dreams, than those are useful to equip.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #634 on:** July 21, 2011, 01:07:35 AM »

I have.....One.
Is there any way I can get more before Eientei Trio, short of cheat engine?

Parallaxal · « **Reply #635 on:** July 21, 2011, 01:26:24 AM »

Don't think so. Green Dreams are dropped by enemies on the 13th, 16th, and 19th floor, if memory serves.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #636 on:** July 21, 2011, 02:58:40 AM »

Well, this is gonna be a pain, it looks like I'll have to make do with one, and some...Straw Prayer Rings?
And maybe sink a good bit of SKP into NTR affinity too.
How much would you guys say would be good enough to neuter her nuke?
Both in DEF/MND, and Affinity.

Pesco · « **Reply #637 on:** July 21, 2011, 05:04:42 PM »

In my game I somehow managed to hit her hard enough that she kept using focus.

RegalStar · « **Reply #638 on:** July 21, 2011, 06:13:43 PM »

Quote from: Hanzo K. on July 21, 2011, 02:58:40 AM

Well, this is gonna be a pain, it looks like I'll have to make do with one, and some...Straw Prayer Rings?
And maybe sink a good bit of SKP into NTR affinity too.
How much would you guys say would be good enough to neuter her nuke?
Both in DEF/MND, and Affinity.

Tenshi's ATK is 1800, and the formula for Vile Motherland is (ATK * 4.5 - DEF * 1.5) / NTR affinity * 100, and damage variance in this game is 10% on both sides. Use it as a guideline

Also, keep in mind that Tenshi's debuff RES is crap. Alice's Return Inanimate while not particularly damaging against Tenshi, will prove to be invaluable due to the ATK debuff.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #639 on:** July 21, 2011, 08:45:22 PM »

Yeah, I noticed she's pretty weak to varying effects.
More than once did she get PAR, and PSN, and a whole slew of the other debuffs when I Avici-spammed her.
See, for a while she was moving slower than even China, who I've not put much speed into.

So....at least 2.8k or more DEF, and at least 400 or so NTR affinity should be enough right? Buffs notwithstanding though.

EDIT: Hahaha....AHAHAHA! Finally....I finally nailed down that pesky Celestial! AHAHAHA! Meiling tanked her nuke like a pro!
After just one buff from Reimu, Violent Motherland dealt only 98x damage to Meiling. Remi tanked it slightly worse, and Reimu and Alice went down completely.
But they did their job! Who knew that those Hirami Lemons would be so useful?

Jq1790 · « **Reply #640 on:** July 22, 2011, 12:18:19 AM »

Quote from: Hanzo K. on July 21, 2011, 08:45:22 PM

Yeah, I noticed she's pretty weak to varying effects.
More than once did she get PAR, and PSN, and a whole slew of the other debuffs when I Avici-spammed her.
See, for a while she was moving slower than even China, who I've not put much speed into.

So....at least 2.8k or more DEF, and at least 400 or so NTR affinity should be enough right? Buffs notwithstanding though.

EDIT: Hahaha....AHAHAHA! Finally....I finally nailed down that pesky Celestial! AHAHAHA! Meiling tanked her nuke like a pro!
After just one buff from Reimu, Violent Motherland dealt only 98x damage to Meiling. Remi tanked it slightly worse, and Reimu and Alice went down completely.
But they did their job! Who knew that those Hirami Lemons would be so useful?

Well, the Hirami Lemons are supposed to control an evil god's power or something, right? Haha.

Anyway, congrats on nabbing Tenshi. She'd been a little bit of a pain for me, too.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #641 on:** July 22, 2011, 12:31:14 AM »

So far though, I'm quite impressed with her defensive abilities. with just 10k SKP, and up to LV 48 with 24 in DEF and 24 in MND, shes already got 2.1k in both defensive scores.
If it wasn't for her dismal HP, she'd get more use right off, by completely zeroing enemy attacks.
She's like the Yuugi for Defensive Stats.

Esoterica · « **Reply #642 on:** July 22, 2011, 04:54:45 AM »

Tenshi's been my sole tanking character ever since I got her. Love those def/mnd stats~

Then again, I was too lazy to go any further than 21f, so she might not stay that effective forever.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #643 on:** July 22, 2011, 05:02:44 AM »

She needs a bit more SKP to be truly good though, I'll have to farm more once I reach 13F....if i can ever find Failsafe Lock #3.
Seriously, the barricade has slots #1, #2, and #4 listed as open, #3 is still listed as closed.
If I can find this last lock, I can get ready for the Eientei Trio, and use their floor as a new training ground.

Jq1790 · « **Reply #644 on:** July 22, 2011, 02:13:04 PM »

Quote from: Hanzo K. on July 22, 2011, 05:02:44 AM

She needs a bit more SKP to be truly good though, I'll have to farm more once I reach 13F....if i can ever find Failsafe Lock #3.
Seriously, the barricade has slots #1, #2, and #4 listed as open, #3 is still listed as closed.
If I can find this last lock, I can get ready for the Eientei Trio, and use their floor as a new training ground.

Have you done the gauntlet of switches yet?

Also, doesn't everywhere in 12F have the same enemies or something? You don't get anything special by fighting right where eientei themselves are, do you? I don't remember anything like that, but I usually didn't stick around that segment of 12F to notice for sure...

Athrel · « **Reply #645 on:** July 22, 2011, 02:31:38 PM »

Quote from: Hanzo K. on July 22, 2011, 05:02:44 AM

If I can find this last lock, I can get ready for the Eientei Trio, and use their floor as a new training ground.

If you have version 3.01 you can press M while in the labyrinth to up you encounter rate to 200% which pretty much makes sure that your next step will be a battle. That should speed up grinding by quite a bit.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #646 on:** July 22, 2011, 06:57:37 PM »

For all I know, I may have done it on accident.

Wait, the M key makes sure next step's a fight?! Did not know that.
I think we can all guess why, eh?

EDIT: Nope, apparently I've yet to do that one. Good thing I have that tutorial Para made. I just need to figure out the no encounters code...that'd make it a lot more bearable.

zephyredx · « **Reply #647 on:** July 22, 2011, 08:49:11 PM »

YESSSS I JUST BEAT THIS GAME!!! Winner was hard, but fortunately he didn't use Time Stop so it wasn't too bad. Yukari and Ran were almost out of SP by the end, so it was a close fight.

Jq1790 · « **Reply #648 on:** July 22, 2011, 10:35:58 PM »

Quote from: Hanzo K. on July 22, 2011, 06:57:37 PM

For all I know, I may have done it on accident.

Wait, the M key makes sure next step's a fight?! Did not know that.
I think we can all guess why, eh?

EDIT: Nope, apparently I've yet to do that one. Good thing I have that tutorial Para made. I just need to figure out the no encounters code...that'd make it a lot more bearable.

You probably shouldn't turn off the encounters, unless your level's really high. You'll probably want the experience.
Ignore the above if you're ~Reimu lv55 or higher.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #649 on:** July 22, 2011, 10:40:53 PM »

My intention is to only disable them long enough to make getting the last failsafe lock tolerable. once I have the lock, I'll go back to gensokyo and then re-enable encounters.
I can train later, when I don't have an annoying floor being an obstacle.

Jq1790 · « **Reply #650 on:** July 22, 2011, 10:58:10 PM »

Quote from: Hanzo K. on July 22, 2011, 10:40:53 PM

My intention is to only disable them long enough to make getting the last failsafe lock tolerable. once I have the lock, I'll go back to gensokyo and then re-enable encounters.
I can train later, when I don't have an annoying floor being an obstacle.

Ah, I gotcha. Though if you have training to do, why not do it while you're going about flipping switchesa anyway? If you're not strong enough to do the run the way it's originally designed, you'll probably be curbstomped anyway, so it'd be a good test, if nothing else.

Not trying to force you to do something, btw, I'm just offering another thought on it. Figured may as well kill two fairies with one bullet, right?

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #651 on:** July 22, 2011, 11:27:54 PM »

Well, that's one way of doing things, I just wanted one annoyance out of the way so I could focus on another.
And as it turns out, I didn't even need to disable the encounters, thanks to Parallax's tutorial vids.

Only one task now lies before me...Can I beat the IN endgame bosses all at once?
Surely they can't be much stronger than Tenshi was can they? And plus, unlike my woefully poor Green Dream situation, I have two zodiac stones, which should make for plenty of SPI resist.
...They DO use those right? I'm figuring that since Eirin has the higher threshold before focus, I should take her out first. Her being the Healer also affects that. Take out their healer before they take out mine.
I have since then switched out Minoriko for Sanae, who performs quite admirably on both fronts, healing AND attacking.
Current Levels as of right before the Eientei Trio...

Chen: 60
Cirno: 54
Sakuya: 51
Marisa: 51
Wriggle: 53
Youmu: 51
Minoriko: 53
Rumia: 54
Ran: 48
Tenshi: 49
Meiling: 54
Remilia: 48
Komachi: 49
Patchy: 48
Iku: 52
Aya: 52
Alice: 50
Sanae: 50
Suwako(kerokero): 47
Nitori: 52
Reimu: 55
Yuugi: 50

So, should I level up more? I would think that going in with everyone at 55+ would be a safe idea right?

Sophilia · « **Reply #652 on:** July 23, 2011, 12:21:21 AM »

They cover lots of elements, actually. Eirin has cold, mystic, and physical, Kaguya has spirit and fire, and Reisen uses mystic and nature. True, the big attacks from Kaguya and Eirin are spirit, but they also ignore defenses so unless you've got out Komachi or a Meiling with both zodiac stones you aren't surviving anyway. Not that killing during focus is going to be hard; these three don't have the kinds of defense that Tenshi had. The tricky part is doing it in such a way that when one dies, the other doesn't get a chance to kill you into the ground by spamming their nuke.

Your levels do seem to be up to the task, though. Take a shot or two and see if you can do it before you go grindin'.

Serela · « **Reply #653 on:** July 23, 2011, 12:29:21 AM »

Quote from: Sophilia on July 23, 2011, 12:21:21 AM

True, the big attacks from Kaguya and Eirin are spirit, but they also ignore defenses so unless you've got out Komachi or a Meiling with both zodiac stones you aren't surviving anyway.

actually they don't ignore defenses, but they're still party-wipers unless you've like, got high DEF/MND buffs up and have their MAG stat fully debuffed (Which isn't likely as Kaggy uses Bhudda's Stone Bowl if they have a total of 3 debuffs among them. PAR doesn't count as a debuff and Reisen has 0 PAR resistance, by the way)
edit:Oops, they actually do. But debuffing their MAG still makes it survivable.

That's actually a viable strategy since they're really vulnerable to debuffs; knock out Kaggy quickly and then debuff their MAG and SPD. But honestly, I find it easiest to just spam multitargets on them (Royal Flare is great and even takes out Eirin/Kaggy at about the same time if you keep Patch alive that long)

Iku, Minoriko, Reimu, and Patch are noticably tanky in this fight due to their high MND stats, as Galaxy In A Pot I think is the only physical you've got to worry about. Meiling is still useful as always for tanking, though.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #654 on:** July 23, 2011, 12:49:24 AM »

So patchy's the most useful here huh? I'll give it a go, she's already got around...3085 MAG, and MND is around...3044.
Good enough? Her equips are...
Forbidden Tablet X2
Ball of Lightning

I'm thinking maybe give her the spare getitup v, and a few other items.

With an alternate setup meant for MND tanking, the setup is...
Floppy Rabbit-ear Headband
Cloak of The Bat
Getitup V
Mag Stat: 2802
MND Stat: 3663

I'm thinking about using that second one, and grinding some SKP to get her MAG back up to around 3k.

Sophilia · « **Reply #655 on:** July 23, 2011, 01:05:49 AM »

I personally think Reimu's the most useful character in this fight. She has Evil Sealing Circle to paralyze Reisen, and using her Great Hakurei Barrier to buff up your magic tanks can make them nearly impossible to kill short of Galaxy in a Pot and the two oh shit attacks. Offensively, Royal Flare is definitely good. Hits Eirin right in the fire weakness. Knockout in Three Steps is even better at that, but good luck getting that off more than once without getting Yuugi killed.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #656 on:** July 23, 2011, 01:28:53 AM »

Yeah, I noticed that this goaround.
Nitori also hits her in the weakness with her Railgun, and can take about one or two hits without going down, thanks to opticamo.
Eirin went down first, and for a while patchy was soloing kaggy and reisen, up until Kaggy decided to be all "Fuck this noise." and bust out Hourai Barrage, hitting the lone patch-patch for around 4.8k.

...Maybe if I can funnel enough SKP into HP? Or maybe by going in with a metric fuckton of MND.
All's I know is that while I did get close, I'm gonna need a bit more training to cut the mustard.

I mean really, patch-patch was seeing 0 after 0 once Eirin fell, even with Reisen spamming Mind Starmine and Grand Elixir.
Even with Buffs, Reisen was doing 0. And I had several DEBUFFS, and still 0 damage was popping up. I think I should swap Komachi out this fight, maybe someone who can buff real fast...Like Ran!

Athrel · « **Reply #657 on:** July 23, 2011, 02:12:52 AM »

I've found that having at least two characters that can cause paralysis in the field helps quite a bit for that fight.

Hanzo K. · « **Reply #658 on:** July 23, 2011, 03:07:13 AM »

Like Suwako and Reimu right?
Komachi's not that useful due to her widespread debuffing.
I should probably bring Reimu's MND closer to Patchy's level so I can be safer, that way I shouldn't have too much to fear.
I can just stock up on SKP, the enemies seem to drop those polymer liquid items quite often, and they sell quite nicely.

Athrel · « **Reply #659 on:** July 23, 2011, 03:11:49 AM »

Cirno can also be useful with diamond blizzard. Just keep in mind that anything that isn't mercury sea will most likely kill her.