Maribel Quest Followthrough - A Z-Machine Adventure

[DracoOmega]

I'm fine with Kilga's post (in addition to the earlier stuff I mentioned)

How about something like this, in addition?

"Renko... I know that you feel like so many of the things you studied and knew are meaningless now. Is... is this about proving that the things you know and the things you can do still mean something here? That you can still accomplish something other people here can't?"

Too strong?

[Kilgamayan]

I'll think about how much of that card we want to play. That has crossed my mind, yes.

>"From what experience are you speaking, here? I've met plenty of people that wanted to talk to me instead of shoot at me. The conflicts I've seen? I'm sure you've heard of Yuuka, right? She didn't shoot at me for invading her air space, she had me plant some flowers, and then she paid me handsomely for it and served me some tea. Kanako and Utsuho were really not fans of each other after whatever happened in Gensokyo Isle between them, but I went to both of them with an idea they could work together on, and both of them seem to have taken to it. Neither shot at me or decided they needed to go off and shoot at the other. Utsuho and Yuugi were the same way; major conflict that was resolved without a fight. When I went to the mansion? Meiling didn't shoot at me, even though I had no business there as far as she knew. When I went to the Moriya Shrine? The tengu guard didn't shoot at me, and let me pass after I explained my business. Hina only shot at me as a test; she was doing it for my benefit."
>"Shizuha shot at me, yes, but she was apparently in a bad mood, and she gave up very quickly anyway. To be honest, most of the random shootings I've experienced today have come from fairies, like when I came back from the Hakurei Shrine, or when Mystia pointed out that their money wasn't actually money. The youkai here don't want to fight as much as you might think. Given all the shops and small businesses I've seen around, I actually think they rather enjoy the peaceful life, wherever they can get it."

[E-Nazrin]

The right idea Draco, but we might as well ask her to say it herself rather than presume things and let her get defensive. More like:

>"Renko, I want to make sure I have this perfectly clear - what is it that you're making work? What are you doing with all this?"

[DracoOmega]

The right idea Draco, but we might as well ask her to say it herself rather than presume things and let her get defensive. More like:

>"Renko, I want to make sure I have this perfectly clear - what is it that you're making work? What are you doing with all this?"

I was just concerned she'd pass it off as something more frivolous unless we confront her with it directly. But I suppose that's something that can wait until we've given her a chance to give an answer that we don't really believe, first. Alternately, it may be that she honestly doesn't yet realize what's really driving her to do this, under it all. There's the obvious external reasons, and then the underlying ones. So it mightn't hurt to give her that to think about.

[Hello Purvis]

>"From what experience are you speaking, here? I've met plenty of people that wanted to talk to me instead of shoot at me. The conflicts I've seen? I'm sure you've heard of Yuuka, right? She didn't shoot at me for invading her air space, she had me plant some flowers, and then she paid me handsomely for it and served me some tea. Kanako and Utsuho were really not fans of each other after whatever happened in Gensokyo Isle between them, but I went to both of them with an idea they could work together on, and both of them seem to have taken to it. Neither shot at me or decided they needed to go off and shoot at the other. Utsuho and Yuugi were the same way; major conflict that was resolved without a fight. When I went to the mansion? Meiling didn't shoot at me, even though I had no business there as far as she knew. When I went to the Moriya Shrine? The tengu guard didn't shoot at me, and let me pass after I explained my business. Hina only shot at me as a test; she was doing it for my benefit."
>"Shizuha shot at me, yes, but she was apparently in a bad mood, and she gave up very quickly anyway. To be honest, most of the random shootings I've experienced today have come from fairies, like when I came back from the Hakurei Shrine, or when Mystia pointed out that their money wasn't actually money. The youkai here don't want to fight as much as you might think. Given all the shops and small businesses I've seen around, I actually think they rather enjoy the peaceful life, wherever they can get it."

>"Yeah, but that's just one day," says Renko, frowning. "And, it's just you. Maybe you were just lucky? Maybe it's because they don't want to get in trouble with that one shrine maiden. Maybe you're just too nice to shoot at. I dunno, I wasn't there for most of that. As for the faeries, of course it's going to happen a bit more. They're all excited. And if you're running all over the place, you're gonna meet more than normal."

>"You could try... attacking the mansion but NOT taking it over if you win, maybe?"

>She says nothing, looking downward a bit.

>"Renko, I want to make sure I have this perfectly clear - what is it that you're making work? What are you doing with all this?"

"I don't even know what you're asking..."

>_

[Kilgamayan]

> "I'm asking...why do you need to do this? Why does it need to work? Why is it so important that no one else has done it?"

[Hello Purvis]

> "I'm asking...why do you need to do this? Why does it need to work? Why is it so important that no one else has done it?"

>She shrugs. "Why was it important when someone sailed around the world?"

>_

[Kilgamayan]

> "So...it's just to show that something can be done? Is there really any pride, any sense of accomplishment in beating an opponent when you outnumber them thirty to one?"

[DracoOmega]

>Don't bring up the outnumber bit. Even Renko knows that the faeries are incredibly wimpy in comparison to the people she's going up against. The pride is just to win with faeries in ANY number.

And frankly, I can see her point in it being an accomplishment, even if they threw literally every fairy in Gensokyo at the SDM. Keeping them together for long enough to do it ALONE is an accomplishment. But that's a bit beside the point

[Kilgamayan]

> She's researched the rules, though, and she's aware of Reimu losing to fairies before. Fairies may be weaker individually, sure, but it's not at all impossible for them to win fights, as they've shown in the past.

Renko's not doing anything that hasn't already been accomplished by Cirno, really. If the point is to mass them and get them moving in a single direction, there are better ends toward which they can work.

[E-Nazrin]

>"Because it was the first person to make an outstanding achievement, I think. But why this?"

[DracoOmega]

Oh, I agree. But I really think presenting that argument to her weakens it, from her point of view. It doesn't matter if WE think it's the accomplishment she thinks it is

[Kilgamayan]

Very well.

> "So...it's just to show that something can be done? Is there really any pride, any sense of accomplishment in beating an opponent when you outnumber them thirty to one?"

> Strike this.

[Kilgamayan]

Well, shit, I have to go to bed, because I need to work tomorrow. I trust you guys to do what needs to be done in this conversation, but I'm going to put my additional thoughts on the table anyway.

At this point I think it's very important to get her to admit what's really important: demonstrating the fact that fairies can be coordinated at all and deserve more respect than they're given, or the fact that she took a bunch of fairies and brought them together into a cohesive unit. If the fairies are more important, point out that her benefactor clearly doesn't care about them, as demonstrated by her desire for "half the loot" (when just the accomplishment is all that's important to Renko) and distaste with the idea of interacting with them instead of her. If her accomplishment is more important, call her on not actually caring about the fairies and ask about all the previous instances where she tried to convince us fairy retribution was the important part, because she was essentially lying to our face.

[Hello Purvis]

>"Because it was the first person to make an outstanding achievement, I think. But why this?"

>"Because I can, Mary," she says. "It'll work! Just...can't you see? It'll work!"

>_

[Kilgamayan]

Also possibly worth consideration is the idea that the benefactor is blackmailing Renko somehow. She's dodged enough questions, including flat-out not answering the "why not just conquer the mansion and then leave it" question, that it's worth considering. We could get away with asking Satori about this ("I don't want to know who it is, but can you tell me if they're threatening or blackmailing Renko at all?") because no one's trust is being broken in that instance, and we could also use it to keep showing Renko that we do care about her.

[Kilgamayan]

Oh, well, that setup works.

> "No, I can see it. It's important because you want to show the world you could do something no one else had done, right? But then, what of the fairies themselves? What about the times you told me it was important because the mansion deserved the retribution for their poor fairy treatment, which neither of us can even say for sure was the case? Did that ever really matter?"

[Hello Purvis]

> "No, I can see it. It's important because you want to show the world you could do something no one else had done, right? But then, what of the fairies themselves? What about the times you told me it was important because the mansion deserved the retribution for their poor fairy treatment, which neither of us can even say for sure was the case? Did that ever really matter?"

>"...Why are you saying that, of course they matter!" says Renko, looking rather upset.

>_

[E-Nazrin]

At this point I think it's very important to get her to admit what's really important: demonstrating the fact that fairies can be coordinated at all and deserve more respect than they're given, or the fact that she took a bunch of fairies and brought them together into a cohesive unit. If the fairies are more important, point out that her benefactor clearly doesn't care about them, as demonstrated by her desire for "half the loot" (when just the accomplishment is all that's important to Renko) and distaste with the idea of interacting with them instead of her.

I don't know if Renko will particularly care about her benefactor not being too fond of fairies - as long as she's helping Renko prove what the fairies can do, Renko might not mind unless she actively attacks or undermines them.

On the other hand, there might be more constructive things that could be done with a mob of fairies, leading back into the part about whether this is the best way to go about proving their value and getting them respect - something that I think Mary might be willing/able to help with, for that matter. I wonder if Byakuren has any constructive projects they might be willing to undertake?

Also, it may be that BOTH are important to her. They're not mutually exclusive. Which I think we just walked into.

---

Suggestions:
"... alright. You DO care. You've been among them a lot more than I have, anyway... I'm sorry for assuming that about your priorities, Renko."
"It's just... I'm not sure that's the best way to go about it, you know? The people in the mansion are already suffering from the extra workload right now. They're getting punished in small ways already. If that's enough to convince them to treat fairies a little better, or stop relying on them as maids, then why would they need to be chased away, and everything in the mansion stolen? I can't guarantee that'd happen, but... it might be worth a shot, before doing something you'd have to be forgiven for."
(repeats of the point about Remi being forgiven after failing)

[Kilgamayan]

Popped back up because I thought of something else, but now I can't remember what it was. Might as well clean up my mess while I'm here, though.

> "I say that because you've been sending me mixed messages. First it was important because the fairies deserve retribution, then it was important because you wanted to show it could be done. I didn't know which it was...I'm sorry for thinking it was just one or the other."
> "Surely there's something more constructive you could do with them, though? Something that would gain them respect, and at the same time, something you could point at and go 'look at what I motivated them to do'? Something less destructive than beating people up and then looting them? I can think of a couple of places where they would be very useful, if you really could wrangle them into a cohesive unit."

[E-Nazrin]

A fairy-constructed jetplane would be so totally fucked up.

Just sayin'.

[Kilgamayan]

That was it, yeah. Renko could work on that jet if she's that worried about a personal accomplishment.

It's not the only option available to us, though. Byakuren comes to mind, as you pointed out, and she'll have Ichirin with her, which is an added bonus.

[Hello Purvis]

> "I say that because you've been sending me mixed messages. First it was important because the fairies deserve retribution, then it was important because you wanted to show it could be done. I didn't know which it was...I'm sorry for thinking it was just one or the other."
> "Surely there's something more constructive you could do with them, though? Something that would gain them respect, and at the same time, something you could point at and go 'look at what I motivated them to do'? Something less destructive than beating people up and then looting them? I can think of a couple of places where they would be very useful, if you really could wrangle them into a cohesive unit."

>"Alright, just...that hurt." She frowns. "It's both things. And...I don't know. The trick is that they have to want to do it. They have to find it fun. That have to be really excited for it, you know, to get that many of them together. What've you got in mind?"

>_

[E-Nazrin]

I actually think rushing the jet could be a bad idea; given Gensokyo's current tech level, a faulty jet is likely without several years' preparation. A faulty jet is likely to fail. A dead Sanae makes no one happy, and magical safety measures to make up for it could ruin the (figurative) magic of it for her. Unless there's a way to set up Sanae's miracles to only kick in if something goes terribly wrong? It might be worth asking Kanako. Not to mention the issues of getting the right materials and having to develop a plan for it before making it, which fairies aren't exactly known for.

Also, it isn't an immediate goal, which would be necessary to divert the SDM invasion plan.

Maybe proving they're better than the SDM by making an even bigger mansion?

[Kilgamayan]

> "Well...I have a few ideas."
> "Number one is that there always seems to be some sort of construction going on at Byakuren's place. A woman named Ichirin is there, and she spent a long time with fairies. She's very sympathetic to them. They'd probably be excited to help out some place that benefits her."
> "Number two...we could ask a rabbit woman named Reisen if she has any ideas. From what Ichirin has told me, she has truly earned their respect somehow. This one's kind of roundabout, though; we'd need the help of a woman named Mokou to even reach her place, but I understand we could use Keine's help to get Mokou's help, and I bet Keine would be willing to help Dai if the ends were constructive enough."
> "Number three is the crazy one. You know the conflict between Utsuho and Kanako I mentioned? Kanako, at least, is willing to put aside their differences to built a jet plane for Sanae, Kanako's shrine maiden, and Utsuho has also shown some interest in that project. Asking fairies to help build a jet is, well...I don't even know if there are words for it. But can you imagine what their reactions would be when they got to see it go flying around, especially when you told them there was no magic involved? We can fly, sure, but we sure don't fly at jet speeds. Granted, this would take some time, and resources may be an issue, but it would be hella fun, if nothing else."

If you want to submit the "even bigger mansion" idea, go ahead.

[Hello Purvis]

> "Well...I have a few ideas."
> "Number one is that there always seems to be some sort of construction going on at Byakuren's place. A woman named Ichirin is there, and she spent a long time with fairies. She's very sympathetic to them. They'd probably be excited to help out some place that benefits her."
> "Number two...we could ask a rabbit woman named Reisen if she has any ideas. From what Ichirin has told me, she has truly earned their respect somehow. This one's kind of roundabout, though; we'd need the help of a woman named Mokou to even reach her place, but I understand we could use Keine's help to get Mokou's help, and I bet Keine would be willing to help Dai if the ends were constructive enough."
> "Number three is the crazy one. You know the conflict between Utsuho and Kanako I mentioned? Kanako, at least, is willing to put aside their differences to built a jet plane for Sanae, Kanako's shrine maiden, and Utsuho has also shown some interest in that project. Asking fairies to help build a jet is, well...I don't even know if there are words for it. But can you imagine what their reactions would be when they got to see it go flying around, especially when you told them there was no magic involved? We can fly, sure, but we sure don't fly at jet speeds. Granted, this would take some time, and resources may be an issue, but it would be hella fun, if nothing else."

>She nods along. then says. "Well, a temple...isn't much. Even if the faeries cared, it's not much of an accomplishment, really. I don't know if it would be safe, either.  And, I guess we could ask this Reisen person, but, I don't think I could hold them together for that. And that third plan, that's ambitious, you might even be able to rile them up for a little while. But, to be honest? I would not want to be anywhere near it when it takes off."

>_

[E-Nazrin]

>Laugh a little.
>"I wouldn't blame you for that, Renko. I'd be pretty careful around it, too. But it might be worth a shot, even if it ends up useless. We'll just want to be careful about whether anyone's actually inside."
>"Another idea - while it's not as interesting, if you want to humble the people in that mansion, too, then making a fairy mansion that's even bigger and fancier than theirs might work."
>"Or... maybe instead of making something, you could arrange some sort of special event for people to enjoy? I'm not sure I have any bright ideas, since I'm not sure what places would be happy about having lots of fairies show up, but... having a day of fairies running around delivering flowers all over the place, or something, could be pleasant for everyone. Or maybe giving out free hugs? Hmm..."

[Kilgamayan]

oh god why am i still here

> "The act of building the temple may not be much, but what it represents would mean a lot. Humans and youkai alike would be in and out of there every day, seeking spiritual advice. Maybe even some fairies too, who knows. Both you and the fairies could point at that and take pride in it. You will all have helped build a place that helps everyone that comes through its doors, regardless of species."
> "Though...I guess I can see why that wouldn't register so high on the "this is what I can do" meter...maybe you could use the temple for garnering respect for the fairies, and help work on the jet yourself? I'll let you know right now, as far as the kappa go, when it comes to reproducing outside-world technology, all of science's rules apply once again. Well, most of them, anyway. I guess there's no defending the ghost-powered air conditioner." Smirk a bit at this. "Still, though, for this jet in particular, as little magical influence as possible is desired."
> "If you don't think construction in general is going to do it, though...what else interests them? They have to have some sort of major hobby."

[Hello Purvis]

>Laugh a little.
>"I wouldn't blame you for that, Renko. I'd be pretty careful around it, too. But it might be worth a shot, even if it ends up useless. We'll just want to be careful about whether anyone's actually inside."
>"Another idea - while it's not as interesting, if you want to humble the people in that mansion, too, then making a fairy mansion that's even bigger and fancier than theirs might work."
>"Or... maybe instead of making something, you could arrange some sort of special event for people to enjoy? I'm not sure I have any bright ideas, since I'm not sure what places would be happy about having lots of fairies show up, but... having a day of fairies running around delivering flowers all over the place, or something, could be pleasant for everyone. Or maybe giving out free hugs? Hmm..."

>"I don't know about a mansion. That'd interest them, but it'd a long time, and I don't think I could keep them together that long. And...it'd have to be their style. Hmmm.  Don't know if it would be as impressive, though."
>"An event isn't much, I don't think. Faeries get together and do things from time to time as it is."

> "The act of building the temple may not be much, but what it represents would mean a lot. Humans and youkai alike would be in and out of there every day, seeking spiritual advice. Maybe even some fairies too, who knows. Both you and the fairies could point at that and take pride in it. You will all have helped build a place that helps everyone that comes through its doors, regardless of species."
> "Though...I guess I can see why that wouldn't register so high on the "this is what I can do" meter...maybe you could use the temple for garnering respect for the fairies, and help work on the jet yourself? I'll let you know right now, as far as the kappa go, when it comes to reproducing outside-world technology, all of science's rules apply once again. Well, most of them, anyway. I guess there's no defending the ghost-powered air conditioner." Smirk a bit at this. "Still, though, for this jet in particular, as little magical influence as possible is desired."
> "If you don't think construction in general is going to do it, though...what else interests them? They have to have some sort of major hobby."

>"If it's not big and flashy, I don't think the faeries themselves would care, outside a couple little groups."
>"You're really into this jet idea? I...wouldn't even trust one anyone, to be honest."
>"Major hobby? That's like asking what humans' major hobby is. In general, though, they like to have fun.

>_

[E-Nazrin]

Okay, I'm tired, I got nothin'. If we can just come up with something to catch her interest...!

Suggestion:
"But how many of them get together for these events? I have no idea how big they might be, but you've assembled quite a big group of fairies. You might be able to pull off something really special."

Flashy, semi-short-term project, fun... preferably lasting and physical results... A really tall tower? A hand-made river? Carving "RENKO WUZ HERE" into the side of Youkai Mountain? Repainting the SDM, with or without permission? Blazing a new trail for people to use? Roadside shelters for travelers of varying degrees of absurdity? Decorated paths in general? The University probably wouldn't work... A radio tower for the kappa...?

What sorts of things could be done with the resources in Gensokyo, and what would be useful for the place while still being fun to make/cause?