Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3  (Read 178260 times)

MysTeariousYukari

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #420 on: February 24, 2010, 11:21:00 PM »
Ok, calm down please :) Are their stats fine, or have those dropped? if only level dropped, you could still beat enemies and (hopefully) level up. You could also load up your last save... assumeing your last save was before the level plumet happened

Maiden Synnae ミ☆

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #421 on: February 24, 2010, 11:38:31 PM »
Ok, calm down please :) Are their stats fine, or have those dropped? if only level dropped, you could still beat enemies and (hopefully) level up. You could also load up your last save... assumeing your last save was before the level plumet happened

No! No... no! Their stats are not fine at all! >.>   <.<    >.<!

Take a look: http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/2798/level0a.png

Anyways... I will have to load my last save... aaaaaaaaaw!!

Sweetness and love~ ♥

Barrakketh

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #422 on: February 24, 2010, 11:55:57 PM »
No! No... no! Their stats are not fine at all! >.>   <.<    >.<!

Take a look: http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/2798/level0a.png

Anyways... I will have to load my last save... aaaaaaaaaw!!
How on earth can you use that font without your eyes bleeding?
Cheating? I cannot even wrap my head around the point of it. Wouldn't you know you had cheated? How on Earth could you maintain crisp certainty of your superiority to all others? And if you're unable to do that, what's the point of anything?

MysTeariousYukari

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #423 on: February 25, 2010, 12:00:08 AM »
Barra, please note that the font shouldn't be involved with the actual problem... I hope...

Barrakketh

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #424 on: February 25, 2010, 12:22:48 AM »
Barra, please note that the font shouldn't be involved with the actual problem... I hope...
I know.  I'd say that font is a different problem...I personally found the default one to be unreadable at times when I first started playing (every so often it would cause me to misread a character's health and not heal them).  Not so much of a problem at higher levels since it's more obvious when you go from four to 3 digits (or lower), but meh.  I've seen quite a few people not knowing about the alternative font.

I think I'm going to be a little more paranoid about backing up saves periodically from now on, though.  I already use the extra save slots for that to some extent.  At least it should be obvious since all their characters had that happen...it would suck if it just picked a few that you hadn't been using and later on you discovered that you've had broken characters for who knows how long.
Cheating? I cannot even wrap my head around the point of it. Wouldn't you know you had cheated? How on Earth could you maintain crisp certainty of your superiority to all others? And if you're unable to do that, what's the point of anything?

Pesco

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #425 on: February 25, 2010, 07:11:44 AM »
No! No... no! Their stats are not fine at all! >.>   <.<    >.<!

Take a look: http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/2798/level0a.png

Anyways... I will have to load my last save... aaaaaaaaaw!!

What was the last thing you did?
Were you using any cheat tools?
Were you moving any game folders around?
Run a virus scan?

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #426 on: February 25, 2010, 03:17:35 PM »
No! No... no! Their stats are not fine at all! >.>   <.<    >.<!

Take a look: http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/2798/level0a.png

Anyways... I will have to load my last save... aaaaaaaaaw!!
Hey... if their affinities are 0, wouldn't that cause them to take zero damage from any elemental attack?

Of course, that's useless when you have 0 HP because you'd die even if you took 0 damage. And you have no ATK or MAG or SP to deal damage with. But still.
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Ghaleon

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #427 on: February 25, 2010, 03:41:03 PM »
I imagine 0 affinities crashes the game or something since affinities provide a division relationship to elemental spells.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #428 on: February 25, 2010, 07:32:19 PM »
I think there may be a discrepancy between the game and the wiki. Marisa's Asteroid Belt spell says that it pierces enemy mind, but the wiki gives a damage formula that's contradictory to that claim. Considering that I read about a different character's buffs displaying an incorrect percentage in-game, I'm not sure which is wrong.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #429 on: February 25, 2010, 07:55:24 PM »
I think there may be a discrepancy between the game and the wiki. Marisa's Asteroid Belt spell says that it pierces enemy mind, but the wiki gives a damage formula that's contradictory to that claim. Considering that I read about a different character's buffs displaying an incorrect percentage in-game, I'm not sure which is wrong.
There is a difference between "Pierces Enemy Mind" and "Ignores Enemy Mind". Piercing attacks simply have a high number in (-stat- x -number-). I think the game sometimes also refers to this as "High -stat- Influence".

When the game says "High Damage Multiplier" this refers to the number outside of the brackets that multiplies the final damage number.

Also, I think the Japanese Wiki might be incorrect and Kaguya's Dragon Necklace actually does ignore MND. I haven't tested it much though because the other attacks are usually better anyway (better multipliers and can hit weaknesses)
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Ghaleon

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #430 on: February 25, 2010, 08:35:46 PM »
I think there may be a discrepancy between the game and the wiki. Marisa's Asteroid Belt spell says that it pierces enemy mind, but the wiki gives a damage formula that's contradictory to that claim. Considering that I read about a different character's buffs displaying an incorrect percentage in-game, I'm not sure which is wrong.

It pierces MND better than her other spells (save master spark, which doesn't really count).

Quote
Also, I think the Japanese Wiki might be incorrect and Kaguya's Dragon Necklace actually does ignore MND. I haven't tested it much though because the other attacks are usually better anyway (better multipliers and can hit weaknesses)

No, use it on enemies that typically take 0 damage from non mnd-ignore attacks..They'll still take 0 damage from dragon necklace. It's completely impossible for a spell to do 0 damage if it ignores defenses.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #431 on: February 25, 2010, 10:25:10 PM »
There is a difference between "Pierces Enemy Mind" and "Ignores Enemy Mind". Piercing attacks simply have a high number in (-stat- x -number-). I think the game sometimes also refers to this as "High -stat- Influence".

When the game says "High Damage Multiplier" this refers to the number outside of the brackets that multiplies the final damage number.

I see. The reason I asked is because a friend of mine claims that during the Alice battle, he was able to do just over 1000 damage with Asteroid Belt to Healing Light immediately after the 100% Mind buff. That claim made me skeptical since my Magic Missile didn't do anything when I tried.

So, his claim can just be chalked up to Asteroid Belt having high Magic influence?

Barrakketh

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #432 on: February 25, 2010, 10:55:30 PM »
It pierces MND better than her other spells (save master spark, which doesn't really count).
It might do more damage, but I don't really care for the description.  I prefer "high stat influence", since it doesn't matter where the big numbers come from (multiplied directly against the stat or not), so long as the damage was the same so would the end result when taking enemy defenses into consideration.

Mountain Breaker would be more apt for piercing defenses (T.DEF / 4), as would Flashing Cherry Blossoms, Minoriko's offensive spells, Scarlet Gold Sword, and Knockout In Three Steps (T.DEF * 0.4).

Ignoring defenses would be attacks like Dark Side of the Moon, Hourai Barrage, Swallow's Cowrie Shell, and Final Judgement.
Cheating? I cannot even wrap my head around the point of it. Wouldn't you know you had cheated? How on Earth could you maintain crisp certainty of your superiority to all others? And if you're unable to do that, what's the point of anything?

Ghaleon

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #433 on: February 26, 2010, 01:31:50 AM »
It might do more damage, but I don't really care for the description.  I prefer "high stat influence", since it doesn't matter where the big numbers come from (multiplied directly against the stat or not), so long as the damage was the same so would the end result when taking enemy defenses into consideration.

Mountain Breaker would be more apt for piercing defenses (T.DEF / 4), as would Flashing Cherry Blossoms, Minoriko's offensive spells, Scarlet Gold Sword, and Knockout In Three Steps (T.DEF * 0.4).

Ignoring defenses would be attacks like Dark Side of the Moon, Hourai Barrage, Swallow's Cowrie Shell, and Final Judgement.

Those definately could be considered more literal in the sense of piercing defenses. But damage formulas are often like

X * [(Y X M) - (0.5XenemyMnd)]

so pretending you have 100 mag and  the e nemy has 200 mnd.

2* ( 1 X 100) - (0.5X 200)

would give you 0 damage..
1 * (2 X 100) - (0.5X200) would do 100 damage.. Even though the second formula doesn't do more damage than the first exactly, it "pierces" the defenses better

Asteroid belt says it pierces defense because it DOES indeed pierce defenses better than magic missle and earthlight ray in the sense that it has a bigger number to combat the enemy's defense.

Earthlight ray I believe actually has beter potential damage than asteroid belt too IIRC.

MysTeariousYukari

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #434 on: February 26, 2010, 02:36:29 AM »
If I am correct, the defensive portion of Asteroid Belt is sumthin like (T.MND/4) while Magic Missle has (T.MND/2). This means Asteroid Belt uses 25% of the targets MND stat while Magic Missle uses 50%.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #435 on: February 26, 2010, 03:53:44 AM »
If I am correct, the defensive portion of Asteroid Belt is sumthin like (T.MND/4) while Magic Missle has (T.MND/2). This means Asteroid Belt uses 25% of the targets MND stat while Magic Missle uses 50%.
You are not correct :3
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #436 on: February 26, 2010, 04:05:17 AM »
I think there may be a discrepancy between the game and the wiki. Marisa's Asteroid Belt spell says that it pierces enemy mind, but the wiki gives a damage formula that's contradictory to that claim. Considering that I read about a different character's buffs displaying an incorrect percentage in-game, I'm not sure which is wrong.

There's a few discrepencies between the game's text and what actually occurs in game - and these generally aren't actually mistranslations.

Rikter

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #437 on: February 26, 2010, 08:46:36 PM »
Well I did the massive Failsafe lock Puzzle today and I killed most of the Butterfly's for the 10F boss. just how powerful is the 10F enemy?

Pesco

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #438 on: February 26, 2010, 08:48:34 PM »
Not very. She didn't attack much when I fought her since she put herself in a buff repetition lock.

Axel Ryman

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #439 on: February 26, 2010, 09:00:09 PM »
Do go in prepared though , cause she wiped me out in 1 turn on a few attempts in the past.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2010, 09:19:07 PM by Axel Ryman »

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #440 on: February 26, 2010, 09:48:22 PM »
Well I did the massive Failsafe lock Puzzle today and I killed most of the Butterfly's for the 10F boss. just how powerful is the 10F enemy?

Fairly hard.  The main thing is that you want to try to keep her in SPD Down/PAR so she gets few turns, because unlike when you actually get her, she can do a lot of damage to you.  Just keep one tank out, try to keep her debuffed (DEF/MND also helps to debuff so you do more damage) and try to tear through her quickly, if I remember right.

If you've made it to the point where the F12 boss is available, you should be strong enough to defeat her.  And with her help, the F12 bosses are made notably easier.

Rikter

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #441 on: February 26, 2010, 10:02:54 PM »
Am I correct in assuming
Spoiler:
"Violent Motherland"
is what they use whrn close to death? Reimu is at level 44 Would
Spoiler:
Ran's
buff's be useful or would it take to much investment in SKP to make her Viable?

Ghaleon

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #442 on: February 26, 2010, 10:04:45 PM »
Am I correct in assuming
Spoiler:
"Violent Motherland"
is what they use whrn close to death? Reimu is at level 44 Would
Spoiler:
Ran's
buff's be useful or would it take to much investment in SKP to make her Viable?

I've only done her 1st version fight once so I'm not 100% sure, but I believe her casting it does NOT neccesarily mean near-death.

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #443 on: February 26, 2010, 10:18:10 PM »
Am I correct in assuming
Spoiler:
"Violent Motherland"
is what they use whrn close to death? Reimu is at level 44 Would
Spoiler:
Ran's
buff's be useful or would it take to much investment in SKP to make her Viable?

It's not a 'near death' thing, it just gets used every couple of turns.

Like I said, for her, you just want to beat her down fast and debuff her as much as possible so she can't do as much to you in the meantime.

Rikter

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #444 on: February 26, 2010, 10:53:38 PM »
Spoiler:
Violent Motherland
causes alot of problems. As in it manages to OHKO my tanks even with Buffs.

Guess I need to move items around and Boost my NTR Afin

Ghaleon

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #445 on: February 26, 2010, 11:13:21 PM »
Spoiler:
Violent Motherland
causes alot of problems. As in it manages to OHKO my tanks even with Buffs.

Guess I need to move items around and Boost my NTR Afin

It was a real nasty spell. I got lucky and beat her anyway somehow. but yeah, it pretty much OHKO everyone who wasn't a tank with 80% def/mnd buffs.

Maiden Synnae ミ☆

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #446 on: February 27, 2010, 12:09:41 AM »
Can someone reccomend me a stat to increase as level bonus in sanae?

Besides, how come I'm dealing 0 damage to bloody papa with silent serene, if it ignores mind!?

Sweetness and love~ ♥

Jelly Belly

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #447 on: February 27, 2010, 12:15:06 AM »
Can someone reccomend me a stat to increase as level bonus in sanae?

Besides, how come I'm dealing 0 damage to bloody papa with silent serene, if it ignores mind!?
Because it doesn't ignore mind (2 x ((MAG x 2.5) - (T.MND / 2))) and he has a lot of mind I think.

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #448 on: February 27, 2010, 12:23:15 AM »
Can someone reccomend me a stat to increase as level bonus in sanae?

Besides, how come I'm dealing 0 damage to bloody papa with silent serene, if it ignores mind!?

For Sanae, Magic, Speed, or Mind.  Up to you.  Magic for boosting her healing effectiveness and damage, Speed to help overcome her higher delay, or Mind for her survivability.

Rikter

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou Discussion #3
« Reply #449 on: February 27, 2010, 12:25:53 AM »
Remember Spoiler tags because some people actually care even though its a Touhou character appearing in A Touhou game.

So I took a look at the Trio i'll have to fight soon. I must say that
Spoiler:
Kaguya
has by far the best portrait so far.

EDIT: I go move all of my equipment and boost NTR Afin and I get through due to
Spoiler:
Suwako, Komachi
and Yuugi giving her near constant Par. She didn't get a Chance to use
Spoiler:
Violent Motherland.
Marisa got a 20K damage Master Spark in as the last attack and I kept Buffs up (Even though she only attacked like 3 times)
« Last Edit: February 27, 2010, 01:03:37 AM by Riktieiki Yamaxanadu »